U.S. officials ignored Iraqi complaints on Blackwater.
Senior Iraqi officials “repeatedly complained to U.S. officials about Blackwater USA’s alleged involvement in the deaths of numerous Iraqis, but the Americans took little action to regulate the private security firm until 11 Iraqis were shot dead last Sunday.” Iraqi officials note that the complaints go beyond security, to Iraqis’ dignity:
[Deputy Interior Minister Lt. Gen. Hussein] Kamal said addressing Blackwater’s alleged actions was also a matter of preserving Iraq’s dignity and honor. Seated in his spacious office, he recalled an incident two months ago when Blackwater guards threw a water bottle at a traffic policeman. The officer was so furious that he submitted his resignation, but his superiors turned it down, Kamal said.
“This is a flagrant violation of the law,” Kamal said. “This guy is an officer with a rank of a brigadier general. He was standing in the street doing his job, regulating traffic. He represents the state and the law, and yet this happened.”
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The Bush administration: Always doing its utmost to win hearts and minds in Iraq.
“He represents the state and the law”. Well, if there was any doubt, this is what these Blackwater soldiers of fortune really think about Iraq’s state and law: It’s not even worth a symbolic gesture of respect
Now, someone please pass me a water bottle. I think I just saw an Iraqi walk by….
September 23rd, 2007 at 3:22 pmsure - let’s pretend no one knew those guys were going to go over there and act as ruthless killers, beholden to none.
no one could have known they’d hijack planes
no one could have known the levees would breach
no one could have known Iraq wouldn’t take 6 months and pay for itself.
There’s are big differences between naive, stupid, and wantonly corrupt - it’s only as difficult as telling “M”’s from “W”’s.
September 23rd, 2007 at 3:23 pmAnd they will continue to ignore Iraqi complaints about Blackwater.
September 23rd, 2007 at 3:23 pmWait a minute, wait a minute!
“This guy is an officer with a rank of a brigadier general. He was standing in the street doing his job, regulating traffic.”
Is that what a brigadier general in their army does? I hate to see what kind of crappy job the lowly privates have to do!
September 23rd, 2007 at 3:27 pmAnd when the next terrorist attack occurs on US soil, we’ll be shocked, outraged and looking for vengeance. And we’ll still wonder why the world hates us.
September 23rd, 2007 at 3:28 pmSuch arrogant disregard for Iraq’s sovereignty is typical of the Bush administration’s total disregard for the will of the people and the rights of anyone not in their Coven!
September 23rd, 2007 at 3:29 pmWho do the Iraqi people think they are, anyway? Don’t the Iraqis know they are only allowed to still live in Iraq as guests of BushCo? The Ingrates!
September 23rd, 2007 at 3:31 pmThey ignored the long-documented problems with the New Orleans levees. They ignored the warnings about 9/11. They ignored the problems with the hedge fund industry and in fact refused to regulate it, prefering to let it regulate itself. I think I see a bit of a consistent trend, here.
September 23rd, 2007 at 3:38 pmAhh, Blackwater. Can’t you just feel the love?
If you think our soldiers have a tough time readjusting to life back in the States, what about these poor guys? I mean, really. They spend months, perhaps years, living in a land where they are totally free from any accountability. They can rape, murder, torture, plunder, and are immune from prosecution by the local authorities. They’re even insulated from prosecution under US laws, and can’t even be held accountable in a civil suit!
Now, they come back home, and wham! everything they used to do suddenly becomes illegal! How would you like it if you were told you can no longer fire indiscriminately into a crowd of civilians every time you feel the slightest bit threatened?
And what good it is having a Mercenary Force that is above the rule of law, if you have to answer to every little complaint? These are hired killers. They should be allowed to do their job without petty distractions.
/sarcasm
September 23rd, 2007 at 3:58 pm10 - what made the islam militant?
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:01 pmam not a fanatical christian but am at least a cultual christian as I recognize that religion is in many ways a collective conscious of humanity.
Comment by Vendetta — September 23, 2007 @ 3:57 pm
Hold on there! That’s twisted logic using some vague understanding of the “collective conscious of humanity” based on your quite possibly superstious (sp?) views of Jebus/Christianistas.
Religion is to philosophy what astrology is to astronomy! It’s easy to know that religion is useless. Why fight it? DON’T FIGHT THE TRUTH!! THE TRUTH WILL SET YOU FREEEEEE!!!!!
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:13 pmCall Congress. Write and email Congress. Demand that Blackwater’s mercenary thugs be removed from Iraq immediately.
Fund the troops, with a withdrawal date — Defund Blackwater!
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:17 pmVendetta,
This quote, “The first century Christians” proves you know little to nothing about the history of the writings of the New Testament relating to the first 100 years after Jebus death. Hell, the New Testament didn’t exist at that time and so there could have been NO PH^CKING WAY your comments about “love thy neighbor” could be the law or general behaviour in that time frame and location on this Earth! Get your ph^cking history straight before you rant around here!!! And BTW, STFU!!
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:21 pmComment by Vendetta — September 23, 2007 @ 3:57 pm
More claptrap from yet another Islamophobe.
“Free humanity from the chains of Islam”? WTF? How about freeing humanity from the opium that religion is?
“it is obvious that the result of the present conflict is that either they will conquer the non muslim world or the non muslim world must destroy its ability to theaten us.”
What is obvious from the present conflict in Iraq, is that the US invaded a nation that posed no threat.
Have you forgotten who invaded and is occupying whom? What nation has the largest military in the world? Which one has the largest nuclear arsenal in the planet?
Try hard as you might, there is no way to symmetrise this conflict; the US is the aggressor, not the other way around.
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:21 pmFor that is all life is if no God exists, meaningless.
Comment by Vendetta — September 23, 2007 @ 4:26 pm
More off-topic, ignorant claptrap.
What is with these so-called “philosophy students” who cannot find their rear-ends, if their life depended on it?
You are responsible for giving your life some meaning. Stating that god must exist or else, is an appeal to consequences, and as such, a logical fallacy.
Now get on topic, or leave.
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:31 pmIt is unbelieveable how the Iraq debacle just keeps right on rolling. Again, so little is even known (and why, exactly, is that?) about these private contractors who are being paid exorbitant salaries (by us, the U.S. taxpayers) for their work in Iraq.
Comment by comity — September 23, 2007 @ 4:24 pm
Because the MSM is owned by the war mongering elite and they are getting super rich as this countries financial stability drops like a rock!
Until the Democrats insist on taking back thier voice in the media and insisting that balance must occur on the public (all public) airways then the Democrats are doomed!!!
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:32 pmMore claptrap from a deiphobe who is an Americaphobe to boot.
Comment by Vendetta — September 23, 2007 @ 4:31 pm
What an asinine, unoriginal retort.
Yeah, anyone who criticises Bush’s policies must be an “Americaphobe”. Or maybe that is true, in oyur little corner of the world. In the rest of the world leader does not equal country.
And I don’t “hate” god. I cannot hate what does not exist.
Get a clue. And get your terms right, “philosophy student”.
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:34 pmBartlebee,
By all means. Fell free to trash the “philosophy degree” troll.
I am gonna make myself some popcorn…
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:37 pmTry throwing a water bottle at a cop anywhere in the good ol’ US of A, like say Crawford, Texas, and see what happens. Would we have looked the other way if the Jena demonstrators would have bounced a water bottle off a cop? More duplicitous cr@p from Bushco.
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:39 pmBut I ask, free to what? Have a meaningless existence? For that is all life is if no God exists, meaningless.
Comment by Vendetta — September 23, 2007 @ 4:26 pm
Free to expand the knowledge of the collective humanity we all share (i.e. science) to make sure future generations benifit, regardless of their stupid, supertitious beliefs that you promote, from the medical advances that saves lives, advanced learning methods that impart knowledge faster in each coming generation, etc.
And most importantly, we will all free ourselves from your stupid, overbearing belief system that is so failed (and so are all the others) that prevents this great country from moving forward in a way that supports all citizens, regardless of their useless supertitious beliefs!!!
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:43 pmI see that the troll is doing its job of dragging the entire thread off-topic. Much easier to distract people with irrelevant tosh about Christianity than to address the real issue under discussion: mercenary troops out of control in Iraq.
It is interesting to see that, in this instance, the Iraqis are not backing down. In fact, their resolve to deal with Blackwater seems to increase daily.
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:45 pmSecurity Company Faces Iraqi Criminal Charges
Apparently, those cereal box philosophy degrees aren’t worth the paper they are printed on.
What a surprise…
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:45 pmI don’t have a degree in religion or philosophy, but I always heard that “money is the root of all evil” as well as, “religion is the opiate of the people.” Seems entirely true especially where our policy in Iraq is concerned…. Afghanistan, now they have the original true opiate.
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:47 pmThanks Gregor.
Unfortunately for this troll, he’s already exposed.
Forget a Theology degree. Any first year Theology STUDENT would have answered the simple question of what Jesus did for a living.
This guys off googling it now. It will take him time to read the stuff, so I give him at least 5 more minutes. Its been over 5 now, and he still can’t answer.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — September 23, 2007 @ 4:41 pm
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:51 pmIt is interesting to see that, in this instance, the Iraqis are not backing down. In fact, their resolve to deal with Blackwater seems to increase daily.
Security Company Faces Iraqi Criminal Charges
Comment by gummitch — September 23, 2007 @ 4:45 p
Killers are killers, no matter what country they do their murdering in. To quote the reich wing, “you do the crime, you do the time”. We really don’t want this bunch of lawless thugs roaming free back here in the States.
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:53 pm13 - sorry vendetta, that’s incorrect, and you probably know that.
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:54 pmSorry guys, went off topic for a minute, but in doing so, I drove out another lying right wing troll.
Give ‘em Hell, Bart.
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:57 pmAhem. Attention everyone. This topic link has nothing to do with your interpretation of any religious faith, so please knock it off. Look and the title of the news story here.
US Officials Ignored Iraqi Complaints about Blackwater
You can see this is a serious issue that demands serious action. We, the US taxpayers, are funding a band of mercenaries, who do as they please in Iraq, without regard to the rule of law.
Will we take action to immediately ring Blackwater USA under control, or are we the stupidest most arrogant people who ever lived?
September 23rd, 2007 at 4:57 pmBARTLEBEE,
You think he’ll think of plumber or wood worker or something?
Of course, we all know his post “first job” thing was annoying people in the temple. Asking questions about money corrupting sh!t and all.
He was a gawd-damn hippie phreak!!
Sh!t!! Da%mn! Hell, he gave away food for free!! And seafood no less! You know how much more expensive fishes and loaves are than Happy Meals!! There’s no way Jebus was a Repusgniscum!!! No Repugniscum would spend money of the hungry and poor like that!! NO WAY!!
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:00 pmWill we take action to immediately ring Blackwater USA under control, or are we the stupidest most arrogant people who ever lived?
Comment by Ditch Mitch KY — September 23, 2007 @ 4:57 pm
We as a people are rotting from the head (Bush) down. This war will come home and it won’t be any fun.
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:02 pmWe as a people are rotting from the head (Bush) down. This war will come home and it won’t be any fun.
Comment by jb — September 23, 2007 @ 5:02 pm
We need to make sure that these thugs from Blackwater be controlled when they return, and any violence they cause, will be put at the feet of Darth and BushCo.
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:06 pmBlackwater was deployed in NOLA after Katrina and I remember reading report of them confiscating guns from people trying to protect their property. Personally, I believe the GOP is more like to take away our guns than any gun control measures put forward by libruls. Seems like the NRA is more interested in trashing Dems than protecting the right to bear arms.
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:11 pmHe wasn’t exactly a hippy freak, but he was a leftist, and opposed to conservative authoritarian dominance.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — September 23, 2007 @ 5:05 pm
I use the term “hippie freak” to disarm the Repugniscums and make them thing about your point that “he was a leftist, and opposed to conservative authoritarian dominance.”
I guess I should have turned on my sarsasm flag. Also, his appearance in most paintings in most Jebus huts would get him shot on site at most traffic stops south of the Mason-Jar (sic) Line!! Long hair, sandles, robe, beard!!
/sarcasm on
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:13 pmWTF? He must be caring drugs!! Taser the bastard!!! Fast!!! Shut that Jebus phuck up!!!
We will make the correct choice Bismillah.
Comment by Vendetta — September 23, 2007 @ 3:57 pm
And, in the name of Allah, you can be sure that some people who share other beliefs will oppose any persecution of you.
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:16 pmnext time a katrina-grade disaster strikes somewhere, the local chamber of commerce chapter will receive discounts from blackwater to provide members security, and when we try to get our hands on drinking water to mix baby formula, they will harm or imprison us with impunity. hurray for the free market.
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:17 pmWhat are the odds that Blackwater is 95% white?
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:17 pmThe NRA only wants White People to have guns.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — September 23, 2007 @ 5:13 pm
You got that right! Otherwise the NRA would have sued NYC many decades ago to protect the gun rights (2nd ammendment) of NYC citizens!!
They did not and it’s due to racism!! Plain and simple!!!
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:18 pmWell done, Bartlebee!
jb, did you see Mike Huckabee on Hardball the other night, advocating the idea that if more people carried handguns, violence would go down? His premise was that an armed robber would think twice if he thought that his intended victim was armed. Yeah, that’d work in, say, NYC! Even Chris Matthews said that he couldn’t believe what he was hearing.
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:21 pmWe already have plenty of guns….seems like it should be enough to stop a lot of armed robbery, according to Huck’s reasoning.
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:25 pmOf course they wouldn’t respond - “Genocide” is not something very moral or savory to be accused of regardless of how true it might turn out to be.
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:26 pmHi Jane! Tumbs up! Guess he’s advocating an “Armed Madhouse” as Greg Palast did in his book?
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:27 pmFollowing Huck’s line of reasoning, Iraq should be the safest place on earth. When those arms start coming home, one can only imagine what we will have on our hands.
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:28 pmHis premise was that an armed robber would think twice if he thought that his intended victim was armed. Yeah, that’d work in, say, NYC! Even Chris Matthews said that he couldn’t believe what he was hearing.
Comment by Jane E. Schneider — September 23, 2007 @ 5:21 pm
And Huckabee is supposedly an ex-Baptist minister!
I find the GOP candidates to be the most laughable bunch of flip-floppers and liars since the ‘04 elections. None of them could run a lemonade stand, let alone this country, especially after all the cleanup that will be needed after BushCo.
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:29 pmJust like the Bush Cabal deciding who was to be saved in Katrina, the NRA wants to play “god” to determine which americans should have guns. If this isn’t the height of bigotry, egomania, and discrimination, I don’t know what is.
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:29 pmHi, veritas! Boy, that “Armed Madhouse” sure has gotten some air tiem recently, hasn’t it?
All that I could think of while listening to Huckabee was a couple of incidents with NY baseball fans, once with the Yankees and once with the Mets, where the ballpark’s giveaway of the day ended up as ammo for disappointed fans, who threw the giveaways (miniature baseball bats, I think, for the Yankee fans, seat cushions for the Mets’ fans) out on to the field. The moral that should have been learned from those two incidents was: “Never deliberately arm New Yorkers.” ;-)
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:34 pmand they couldn’t even tell me what the Basilica is, or the pertinence of the spear to the side on the cross with regards to the Torah.
Are you beating up on poor little souls? How about playing with the big boys? Come on!
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:36 pmNot holding Blackwater accountable not only allows murders to go unpunished and return home, it also undermines the very Iraq Government we are trying to stand up. Turn all participants in the shoot out over to Iraqi authorities….now that would give the Iraq Government some credibility with the Iraqi people.
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:40 pmBut I do expect a guy claiming to have a degree in Theology to know something about him. Although I should’nt. I’ve debated guys online from Falwell U (Messiah U) in another little blog I frequent, and they couldn’t even tell me what the Basilica is, or the pertinence of the spear to the side on the cross with regards to the Torah.
Its fun to debate them. But they seldom come out to play anymore.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — September 23, 2007 @ 5:20 pm
That comment is right on point!!
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:44 pm“…now that would give the Iraq Government some credibility with the Iraqi people.”
Comment by jb — September 23, 2007 @ 5:40 pm
And would restore just a tiny bit to our government, too. Not enough, but a start.
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:47 pmespecially after all the cleanup that will be needed after BushCo.
Comment by upside99 — September 23, 2007 @ 5:29 pm
That’s true and we need someone that can lead this country away from the corporate, pig-ditched phucks that run both political parties in this country!!
This includes the Democratic front runners like Hillarious and bIraq Obama!!!!
This sh!t has to end!!!
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:51 pmTherefore, Bush is clearly guilty of violating his own executive order, in working to undermine the peace and stability of the GOVERMENT OF IRAQ.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — September 23, 2007 @ 5:55 pm
Time to confiscate the “ranch” in Crawford and turn it into a rest and recovery home for our weary PTSD soldiers.
September 23rd, 2007 at 5:57 pmComment by BARTLEBEE — September 23, 2007 @ 5:55 pm
No sarcasm. I agree with you…you comment is right on point!! Correct. Good to go! Hook ‘er up! Get ‘er dun…
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:00 pmHell he doesn’t even need an education to know that. Any good western movie on television could have taught him that.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — September 23, 2007 @ 5:30 pm
Hell, I don’t even know what he is talking about. It’s the general thrust of someone thinking that he knows better than the rest of us that bothers me.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:00 pmTime to confiscate the “ranch†in Crawford and turn it into a rest and recovery home for our weary PTSD soldiers.
Comment by jb — September 23, 2007 @ 5:57 pm
Or a landfill.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — September 23, 2007 @ 6:00 pm
And then we build the GW Botch Prezidental (sic) Lieberry (sic) on top of it!!
Just don’t drink the water!!!
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:04 pmOr a landfill.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — September 23, 2007 @ 6:00 pm
May already be permanently tainted.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:04 pmjb, did you see Mike Huckabee on Hardball the other night, advocating the idea that if more people carried handguns, violence would go down? His premise was that an armed robber would think twice if he thought that his intended victim was armed. Yeah, that’d work in, say, NYC! Even Chris Matthews said that he couldn’t believe what he was hearing.
Comment by Jane E. Schneider — September 23, 2007 @ 5:21 pm
Let’s not give Huckabee credit for originality.
Heinlein also suggested bringing back the stocks for punishment, believing that the discomfort and humiliation suffered in the stocks was universal, regardless of social standing. I actually kind of like that idea.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:08 pmBlackwater killers deserve worse than time in stocks.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:10 pmAlthough, I might enjoy watching Bush and Cheney being urinated on while locked in the stocks.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:11 pmFartleebe is just another Democrat Zionazi like Hillary, Joe Lieberman, Lantos, and Dianne Feinstein. When will you learn?
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:16 pmBlackwater is the gustapo of the thugs of the crime family.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:20 pmI’ve met several of the Blackwater contractors over there. They each have a nickname they go by similar to how it went in the movie “Top Gun”. These people are all prior special ops and all that I knew personally had top secret security clearances. They escorted CIA and State Department personnel around. They were basically given the same job as the Secret Service in that they are to protect their subjects at all costs and if they are approached, they repel the person/people in question. These missions are taking place in the worst places you can imagine. There’s no gang ridden slum in the US or elsewhere for that matter, that even comes remotely close to the extremes of that place. As for the people killed in this particular incident, I’ll bet that they fired upon the convoy. Blackwater will bump vehicles in their way to get them out of the way, they will fire upon vehicle engines to stop cars too close to the convoy. It’s bad stuff, to be sure, but they aren’t killing people without justification. Each one of them knows that police uniforms are NO GUARANTEE of authenticity nor are they to be trusted. If you see a high ranking individual out directing traffic - would you believe that person? Imagine General Petraeus out directing traffic! You would KNOW that something is seriously off with that.
I’ve personally seen weapons gathering after fire fights. I know for a fact that it happens. What they don’t do (and ought to) is show you whether or not these “innocent civilians” have powder burns in their hands - making them not so innocent. I’m betting that the truth is closer to the middle than at either extreme. I’ll bet that Blackwater over reacted in this incident, and I’ll also bet that most those innocent civilians were anything but.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:27 pmIn related news, the US military is having so much trouble recruiting people, that they have to come up with “creative solutions”:
The Senate will debate a proposal this week billed by some as a creative solution to two of the nation’s hot-button issues — immigration and the Iraq war.
If passed, the Development, Relief, and Education for Alien Minors Act promises a path to citizenship for illegal immigrants who volunteer for military service.
Enlisting Could Be Fast Track to Citizenship
Only this Orwellian administration would call this idea a “solution”, since it doesn’t address the actual problems: Ending the occupation of Iraq or curtailing illegal immigration.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:28 pmIt wasn’t original to him or Heinlein. As I clearly pointed out earlier, that experiment has already been tried, and FAILED, in the 19th Century American West.
Once people figured out that it was the guns killing everyone, they outlawed them in the cities and towns and suddenly civilization came to the American west.
People who suggest that should really open a good American history book.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — September 23, 2007 @ 6:22 pm
I think you’re the one who has read too many Zane Grey novels, Bartlebee. Or do you really think that “Deadwood” is an accurate portrayal of all Western towns in the 19th century?
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:38 pmComment by bpg131313 — September 23, 2007 @ 6:27 pm
Your post aounds like you are an apologist for Blackwater and that they can use “any means necessary” which puts them outside of even the rules of engagement our military follows. And that is a very disgusting position to take, making us no better than a Police State.
Having served in Vietnam, I know that no real US soldier and citizen would want that kind of behavior.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:38 pmI’ve personally seen weapons gathering after fire fights. I know for a fact that it happens. What they don’t do (and ought to) is show you whether or not these “innocent civilians†have powder burns in their hands - making them not so innocent.
Have you thought of the fact that you should’t have even been there? Who died and gave you the right to be in Iraq ordering people as to how they should govern their own lives? Get the f***k out of Iraq. That’s the message you should be listening to!
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:40 pmupside 99. Why is blackwater guarding our State Dept. diplomats in Iraq, and not our military.?? One reason could be that our Military can be held accountable for their actions.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:42 pmBadger,
Exactly! And we are finding out that the BushCo Cabal wants no accountability in any area of their despicable behavior.
Anyone but the 28%ers would call all this activity War Crimes. But now they are just a bunch of Fascists.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:47 pmThe fact that you grabbed onto the latter part of my comment, the “joke†part, shows what a backwards troll twit you really are.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — September 23, 2007 @ 6:45 pm
Coming from you, Bartlebee, that borders on high praise. You’re operating on a level of maturity that is eerily reminiscent of one of our least-favorite trolls . . . the one in a Virginia basement.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:52 pmThe fact that you grabbed onto the latter part of my comment, the “joke†part, shows what a backwards troll twit you really are.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — September 23, 2007 @ 6:45 pm
FARTLEBBE cannot stand criticism, proof that he’s not a real liberal like he says he is. He’s a Lieberman, Greenspan Democrat Zionazi posing as an open minded American.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:56 pmTACT: The art of making a point without making an enemy.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:57 pmTACT: The art of making a point without making an enemy.
Comment by Badger — September 23, 2007 @ 6:57 pm
Excellent point, Badger.
September 23rd, 2007 at 6:59 pmNext time stupid, don’t open your mouth if you don’t want the response.
Dumbass.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — September 23, 2007 @ 6:55 pm
Actually, you were the first to respond, rudely and ignorantly, to my quotation of Heinlein and his comments on weapons and punishment. It’s not me who has been cranking out the juvenile name-calling, Bartlebee. It’s you.
I’d suggest that you grow up, and grow a somewhat thicker skin in the process, but I’m pretty sure that would be a waste of time.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:02 pmWho needs Blackwater when we have all of you? You can all kindly retrieve your knives from my back now. Explaining a situation never transfers to apologist. Someone explaining Hitler’s motivations in WWII doesn’t make them an apologist.
None of us have the power to change what’s going on. America elected a Democrat Congress because we were told that they would get our troops out of Iraq and Afghanistan. They failed us. The entire government does what it chooses rather than listen to the will of the people. Given that, no a single person out to be surprised when we have everything turning out the way it is.
You want an apology? Here’s one. I apologize to everyone that’ll listen that my vote in the last election wasn’t enough to change all of this. I apologize that all of the letters, faxes, and calls I’ve made to my elected officials telling them that I want our forces out of the Middle East fell upon deaf ears. I apologize for having spent several years of my life in the Middle East trying to make a difference because I believe that there’s still a possibility for good to come out of all of this.
Sadly, we all have voices and are being ignored by the people we need to hear us most.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:02 pmBart,
Just because gummitch does not agree with you, doesn’t mean he’s a troll. Personally, I think you’re going a bit overboard.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:03 pmAnd how much of the war’s dollar cost goes to these contractors like Blackwater and others? …probably a big dollar bill !!.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:04 pmBush is now asking for another 200 billion dollars going to this war in Iraq. A new industry is born..
I’ll also bet that most those innocent civilians were anything but.
Comment by bpg131313 — September 23, 2007 @ 6:27 pm
OK, Let them stand trial in Iraq….certain to receive as fair a trial as Saddam or the Jena 6.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:04 pmJust stating my own opinion, Bart.
You guys are in charge of your behavior.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:10 pmI’ll also bet that most those innocent civilians were anything but.
Comment by bpg131313 — September 23, 2007 @ 6:27 pm
From what I read,, some of the victims were cars full of kids, mother and child incinerated in a burning car….
There could well have been an insurgent involved in this incident…but It’s not hard to see why the iraqi’s are upset.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:15 pmWar is hell…collateral damage…. Still
Gummitch and Nimrod there were already my enemies.
Empty heads with big egos and even bigger mouths, and nothing to back them up with.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — September 23, 2007 @ 7:00 pm
Do you have any more enemies? Do you listen to their voices in your head? Does the TV speak to you? If you need help, we’re here for you.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:15 pmEast is East and West is West. What should be done with Blackwater and its employees? We’ve created a monster….now what?
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:15 pmI’d suggest that you grow up, and grow a somewhat thicker skin in the process, but I’m pretty sure that would be a waste of time.
Comment by gummitch
Ukemi, my friend. Ukemi.
Let it pass.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:16 pmBart,
To whom are directing your comment at #123?
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:16 pmBut you were wrong about the Wild West, and you haven’t even bothered to admit it.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — September 23, 2007 @ 7:11 pm
What I wrote was that the “wild west” was scarcely a model in disproving Heinlein’s argument, largely because it was carried out in what were clearly uncivilized locations. There are plenty of other examples of armed societies which bolster his argument, but those are civilized societies (or relatively civilized), not the anarchy of the frontier.
So, no, I’m not going to admit to being wrong and if you think that makes me a troll, fine. I honestly am not looking for your approval. You’ve clearly expressed your hostility and your own desire to pick a fight. Online. I’ve got gumbo simmering and an apartment to clean, and I’m not planning on wasting my time giving you the opportunity to rant at me.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:18 pmComment by Juan C. — September 23, 2007 @ 7:16 pm
Good point, Juan. And there is gumbo in my future.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:19 pmYum, gumbo….
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:20 pmI chose not to answer you because you are tiresomely pugnacious.
Comment by Vendetta — September 23, 2007 @ 7:21 pm
That’s why we like him.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:22 pmI’m glad you guys are doin’ yur fightin’ with words and not guns.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:26 pmBlackwater thugs might shoot first and argue later.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:27 pmSo on one hand half the fighting force in Iraq consists of privateers/mercenaries and soon the other half will be foreigners.
http://online.wsj.com/ article/ SB119034142441734839.html
…citizenship after serving in the military for 2 years.
How many will jump at the chance? I’ll bet there will be more than 100,000. Most immigrants are more into making some money and sending it back home and then returning when their local economy picks up (if ever). But there are plenty who would go for this.
I’m not too into it. It gives the war party too many warm bodies to throw into a fight with people who have not threatened us.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:31 pmChili and cornbread for me.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:33 pmI’m not too into it. It gives the war party too many warm bodies to throw into a fight with people who have not threatened us.
Comment by Alejandro — September 23, 2007 @ 7:31 pm
From the linked article: “The military has seemed receptive, but some Hispanic groups have expressed concern that the bill is a ploy to pull young Latin Americans into combat situations for which they wouldn’t otherwise have volunteered.”
Ya think?
A creepy strategy: “Y’all’s family can stay in this country if you just pick up that gun and ship out to Iraq/Afghanistan/Iran/ Syria/Colombia . . .”
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:34 pmChili and cornbread for me.
Comment by Lefty Patriot — September 23, 2007 @ 7:33 pm
I love cornbread, especially the Southern-style with no wheat flour in it, done in a buttered cast iron skillet. Mmmmmmm. Good eating.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:36 pmEast is East and West is West. What should be done with Blackwater and its employees? We’ve created a monster….now what?
Comment by jb — September 23, 2007 @ 7:15 pm
Getting them out of Iraq is easier said than done but, one way to go about it would be, in my opinion, to recognize when US imperialist (oil) motives moves us to wage the next (Iran) war. Think about what Hillary said: we are” fighting the wrong war” when we should be thinking about the “next war”.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:44 pmI believe many of the Blackwater employees in Iraq are police officers who were lured to Iraq for the big bucks. If Blackwater gets kicked out of Iraq, I guess they’ll have to go back to being peace officers.
September 23rd, 2007 at 7:52 pmI guess they’ll have to go back to being peace officers.
Comment by Badger — September 23, 2007 @ 7:52 pm
Will we be allowed to chuck water bottles at them with impunity? Or will they just shoot any bottle chuckers? These are not good guys for community policing. I doubt they will do any better here than they have done there.
September 23rd, 2007 at 8:10 pmI am not familiar with any gate being named that, but if you are tyring to imply that that is the “eye of the needle†that Jesus was referring to, then I’d ask for my money back on that theology degree.
Comment by BARTLEBEE — September 23, 2007 @ 7:51 pm
Yes, you’re right. Your theology dregree is worthlesss!
September 23rd, 2007 at 8:21 pmThe Bush Crime Family ignores all laws, all requests for oversight, all truth and all reality…they are there to defend the wealth of the elite and the profits of the military industrial complex. They do no appreciate anything resembling law because it would hamper their criminal acts.
September 23rd, 2007 at 8:48 pmVendetta = Jake
Give it up, Shakey.
September 23rd, 2007 at 8:54 pmI understood the gate to be Babel or Bab-ilu [BAB= gate and EL= God]
#10 said: But have since rejected absolute pacifism primarily because I believe that we have a moral right to defend ourselves and a duty to protect those innocents who can not defend themselves against an unjust agressor.
Read up on Calvinism….
September 23rd, 2007 at 10:49 pmhttp://en.wikibooks.org/ wiki/ Religion_in_Political_Theory#On_Civil_Government
U.S. officials ignored Iraqi complaints on Blackwater
September 24th, 2007 at 12:05 amAs actions speak louder than words it is obvious the Bush crime family cares nothing about the Iraqi people or their complaints. We have Shocked and Awed them over known lies and for years we have left the Iraqi people in such desperate conditions, conditions that is unlawful for ones pet animal to survive in.
What gate? What the hell are you talking about?
Comment by BARTLEBEE
The gate of course =)
September 24th, 2007 at 12:08 amIraq tempers call for US firm’s dismissal
Los Angeles Times - 1 hour ago
Expelling the private security company, accused of killing 11 civilians, would leave a vacuum, an Iraqi official says. The American guards are said to aggressively disregard Iraqi lives, an accusation By Alexandra Zavis, Los Angeles Times Staff Writer …
what gates???
September 24th, 2007 at 12:20 amwhat does it matter???
.
(Gen 1:1-2:4a) “The Holy One, Blessed be He, said to those, You want to know my name [tetragramon thing]? I am called according to my actions. When I judge the creatures I am Elohim [EL], and when I have mercy with My world, I am named YHVH†[YHWH] (Ex R. 3:6).
What gates? Why does it matter?
Camels EYES!!! =p
Kidding..to show our resident trolls that we DO know about religious things?
September 24th, 2007 at 12:29 amWow, how to kill a thread. Get two idiots debating religion.
September 24th, 2007 at 12:35 ama matter of preserving Iraq’s dignity and honor
Oh, come on now. A little bit like four and a half years late for that???
September 24th, 2007 at 1:10 amYou get this from a story about a thrown water bottle? Worse things happen daily in inner-city schools right here in the United States.
Comment by O. Bigfoot — September 24, 2007 @ 2:22 am
The killing of 11 civilians is “like a daily event in an inner-city school”? WTF does that mean? Typical Repug response to the real issue: Attack something from the side and ignore what is really important here.
September 24th, 2007 at 9:00 amno wonder he’s called bigfoot - you’d have to live pretty deep in the woods to believe that’s what life is like in any city in the US.
Idaho White Power militiaman is my guess.
September 24th, 2007 at 3:05 pm