3,000 and growing:
By on Sep 26th, 2007 at 3:11 pm
3,000 and growing:
The number of students and faculty at Stanford University “protesting plans to bring former Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld to the Hoover Institution next year as a distinguished visiting fellow.”
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They’ll have to escort him on and off campus in an armored limo.
September 26th, 2007 at 3:16 pmThis protest should grow exponentially as plans continue for Rummy’s appearance. After all, once again it will be our children who will admonish us and show us the evil of our ways. We, for all intents and purposes, became “them” – the very imperialistic war-mongers whom we repudiated during the Vietnam era. It will be our youth who will show us the way now and bring some honesty back into the equation.
September 26th, 2007 at 3:18 pmJust give ‘em what they want. Bring in Ahmadinejad.;)
September 26th, 2007 at 3:19 pmRather than being feted, Rumsfield should be “held accountable” for the lies leading up to this illegal occupation since he was spewing them daily. No doubt he’ll be hung in effigy many times over before this scheduled appearance.
Who today would want to see the likes of this disgraced politician anyway?
September 26th, 2007 at 3:20 pmLooks like members of the bush administration are having a hard time making it in the world outside of right wing think tanks. Perhaps AEI has room for Rummy?
September 26th, 2007 at 3:24 pmVendetta
Whats the problem? You would have invited hitler and did invite achmud.
One is a guy visiting for a single lecture, the other is giving him a place in the faculty.
Orange, meet apple. Apple, meet orange.
FTA:
September 26th, 2007 at 3:29 pmHowever, those who oppose Rumsfeld’s appointment claim that the issue isn’t free speech. They said they would welcome Rumsfeld to make a speech on campus, but oppose his being associated as a member of the Stanford University community.
A Must Read for all “Proud Liberals.”
September 26th, 2007 at 3:30 pmhttp://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07269/820479-109.stm
This is puzzling. Stanford isn’t exactly a hotbed of neo-conservatism — why are they giving Rummy a distinguished visiting fellowship in the first place? Some fatcat contributor wants him there?
September 26th, 2007 at 3:33 pmOur far left schools protesting a conservative. Big suprise!
September 26th, 2007 at 3:34 pmIs Rumsfailed going to lecture on “known knowns”, “know unknowns” or “unknown unknowns”?
September 26th, 2007 at 3:36 pmI can just hear Rummy now:
HI: Do you remember what you said yesterday about the Iraq conflict?
DR: “I believe what I said yesterday. I don’t know what I said, but I know what I think, and, well, I assume it’s what I said.”
HI: You Misremember?
DR: “I would not say that the future is necessarily less predictable than the past. I think the past was not predictable when it started.”
HI: Of course, yesterday was the past, but what did you say?
DR: “Needless to say, the President is correct. Whatever it was he said.”
HI: No, no, no, what YOU, not the President, said.
DR: “If I said yes, that would then suggest that that might be the only place where it might be done which would not be accurate, necessarily accurate. It might also not be inaccurate, but I’m disinclined to mislead anyone.”
HI: Jeebus H. Christ in a sweatshop, will you answer the question? Please.
DR: “There’s another way to phrase that and that is that the absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence. It is basically saying the same thing in a different way. Simply because you do not have evidence that something does exist does not mean that you have evidence that it doesn’t exist.”
HI: Next fellow, please!
DR: “Now, settle down, settle down. Hell, I’m an old man, it’s early in the morning and I’m gathering my thoughts here.”
HI: Okay, then answer the question, please.
DR: “If I know the answer I’ll tell you the answer, and if I don’t, I’ll just respond, cleverly.”
HI: Dear God, who let this guy into the club?
September 26th, 2007 at 3:37 pmDR: “Well, um, you know, something’s neither good nor bad but thinking makes it so, I suppose, as Shakespeare said.”
tom
Is Rumsfailed going to lecture on “known knownsâ€, “know unknowns†or “unknown unknownsâ€?
I believe his first lecture will be on “Known Gnomes” with a highlight on David the Gnome.
September 26th, 2007 at 3:37 pmThe Hoover Institution should be an appropriate place for Rumsfeld, since he SUCKS.
September 26th, 2007 at 3:40 pmCommon liberal attempt to convince people that they really aren’t guilty of hypocrisy:
Cue trolls caliming “libs want censorship†in 3, 2, 1…
Comment by spit take — September 26, 2007 @ 3:25 pm
September 26th, 2007 at 3:41 pmComment by upright left — September 26, 2007 @ 3:41 pm
#
I don’t think Stanford would have an issue with allowing Rummy to speak or lecture at the facility, they just don’t want to give him an official position there.
September 26th, 2007 at 3:44 pmOur far left schools protesting a conservative. Big suprise!
Comment by Roger_Roger
I dont think this has much to do with being conservative [whatever that is] as you have been trained to believe.
September 26th, 2007 at 3:45 pmApparently, it’s censorship when it’s conservatives not wanting a liberal for a position. It’s not censorship when the lib and conservative roles are reversed. It’s not hypocrisy either. ;)
September 26th, 2007 at 3:47 pmLOL @ Upright left. Nice try. Look at everything Rumsfeld has ever said, hes like the Don Quixote of Hypocrisy.
September 26th, 2007 at 3:48 pmWould the US Military Academy at West Point bring Michael Moore in as a distinguished visiting fellow? How about the Naval Academy giving an official position to Noam Chomsky? On both sides of the ideological divide there is this same hesitation towards the other sides’ main political figures. If Stanford does not want him there, he can go where he is wanted.
September 26th, 2007 at 3:49 pmLOL @ Upright left. Nice try. Look at everything Rumsfeld has ever said, hes like the Don Quixote of Hypocrisy.
Comment by Xisithrus — September 26, 2007 @ 3:48 pm
So his hypocrisy justifies libs hypocrisy? ;)
September 26th, 2007 at 3:49 pmVendetta
Not really an apple vs orange thing more like a Sweet vs Navel difference.
Though you’d like for them to be different to justify your position you’re really just splitting hairs.
No, wrong, fail.
One is a guest speaker, who shows up once, just to speak, and with no affiliation with the college.
The other is actually(or will be, once he gets his fellowship) a member of the college.
For you to think I am splitting hairs, means your either really confused, or trying that hard to ignore a chasm of difference, or just being an idiot for fun, like I do more often than not.
September 26th, 2007 at 3:50 pmVendetta sez:
Bullsh!t. If you can’t (or won’t) see the difference between offering a person the opportunity for one speaking engagement, and offering a person a position at the University, you’re not worth addressing.
September 26th, 2007 at 3:51 pmHow is it censorship? Last time I checked the faculty and students of Stanford had the right to protest. Rummy has the right to lie to the public all he wants. It looks like he may not be able to do with a 6 figure salary from some supported think tank.
September 26th, 2007 at 3:52 pmApparently, it’s censorship when it’s conservatives not wanting a liberal for a position. -Upright bin Laden
You mean like when FOX cuts off peoples mic’s?
September 26th, 2007 at 3:53 pmThe Prison cell is the proper venue for Donald Rumsfeld.
September 26th, 2007 at 3:54 pmspit take
Thus revealed the wingnut standard for their own — until they’re convicted of a crime, they’re all good.
…
Nice standards you guys have.
I think innocent until proven guilty is a great standard.
September 26th, 2007 at 3:55 pmWhat are these 3,000 students afraid of?
Comment by Michael — September 26, 2007 @ 3:54 pm
Ah, look what the cat dragged in?
They’re not “afraid”, Michael? they just don’t like him?
You should know the feeling?
September 26th, 2007 at 3:56 pmConvict him of a crime libs then you’ll have a case.
Comment by Vendetta
All political ideology aside, the man cannot make a coherent answer and helped design a really, really bad strategy.
September 26th, 2007 at 3:57 pmWhat lie are you referring to?
Comment by Michael
Why should I answer a question you know the answer to?
September 26th, 2007 at 3:58 pmAnd BTW michael I think you mean ‘which’ not what lie.
September 26th, 2007 at 3:58 pmI think innocent until proven guilty is a great standard.
Comment by Squegeeboo — September 26, 2007 @ 3:55 pm
#
Or in the case of Larry Craig, even after pleading guilty, going back and trying to undo that.
September 26th, 2007 at 3:58 pmIn Both cases he would
A) be paid
B) speak his meesage
C) influence young minds
D) be a reflection of the school
Differences
A) Number of times he speaks.
Comment by Vendetta — September 26, 2007 @ 3:56 pm
Just like Ward Churchill, huh? Or all the “far left liberal professors” the Right is always whining about?
September 26th, 2007 at 3:59 pmWould the US Military Academy at West Point bring Michael Moore in as a distinguished visiting fellow? How about the Naval Academy giving an official position to Noam Chomsky? On both sides of the ideological divide there is this same hesitation towards the other sides’ main political figures. If Stanford does not want him there, he can go where he is wanted.
Comment by Chris L — September 26, 2007 @ 3:49 pm
I don’t think he will have any difficulty finding a position. But, you see, libs have used “academic freedom” as an excuse to gradually get rid of conservatives in universities and as cover for having people like Ahmadinejad speak. Now that they have control of many universities, “academic freedom” seems to be falling by the wayside. No need for a variety of opinions anymore. As for West Point and the Naval Academy, it would never work to have a lib there because they would require that all the guns be removed before they would enter the campus. ;)
September 26th, 2007 at 3:59 pmSo, if I understand the right-wing position correctly, even if the students/faculty of Stanford don’t want him there, he should be given a position at the college anyway? When does Michael Moore get a position at West Point?
September 26th, 2007 at 4:01 pmI don’t think he will have any difficulty finding a position. But, you see, libs have used “academic freedom†as an excuse to gradually get rid of conservatives in universities and as cover for having people like Ahmadinejad speak. Now that they have control of many universities, “academic freedom†seems to be falling by the wayside. No need for a variety of opinions anymore. As for West Point and the Naval Academy, it would never work to have a lib there because they would require that all the guns be removed before they would enter the campus. ;)
Comment by upright left — September 26, 2007 @ 3:59 pm
Balls. Conservatives don’t work in universities because the jobs don’t pay enough.
It is true, however, that liberals actually believe in the notion of Free Speech. On that, you’re correct. Blind squirrel.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:01 pmSo his hypocrisy justifies libs hypocrisy? ;)
Comment by upright left
Rumsfeld was a terrible war planner. I dont think thats hypocrisy at all.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:03 pmConservatives don’t work in universities because the jobs don’t pay enough.
It is true, however, that liberals actually believe in the notion of Free Speech. On that, you’re correct. Blind squirrel.
Comment by gummitch — September 26, 2007 @ 4:01 pm
Better check your own vision, gummy. ;)
September 26th, 2007 at 4:03 pmHmmm, Condi is a distinguished alumni of Stanford.
Anyone want to bet she doesn’t want him there, either?
This isn’t about Liberalism vs Conservatism; it’s about a man who singlehandedly totally mismanaged an invasion. If he was in the private sector he would have been fired in ‘03.
WTF makes anyone think he deserves fellowship at an University?
September 26th, 2007 at 4:03 pmOk, I’ll play. Cite them for me?
Comment by Michael — September 26, 2007
That would be like me telling you the words to a tune you already know, wouldn’t it?
September 26th, 2007 at 4:04 pmApparently, it’s censorship when it’s conservatives not wanting a liberal for a position. -Upright left
You mean like when FOX cuts off peoples mic’s?
Comment by Xisithrus — September 26, 2007 @ 3:53 pm
So it’s Fox cutting off mikes that makes lib censorship ok then? Just trying to figure out where you stand. ;)
September 26th, 2007 at 4:06 pmWhen is Michael Moore going to do something constructive for his country? Comment by Michael — September 26, 2007
When is Limbaugh going to do deport himself? As he said drug addicts should be?
September 26th, 2007 at 4:06 pmspit take
CONTINUING ASSOCIATION WITH A COMMUNITY OF HIGHER LEARNING.
To expand on this so people like Vendetta may finally get it. For Columbia to allow a world leader to speak on campus as part of their ongoing political science lectures of world leaders speaking, makes perfect sense. Because he is a world leader, speaking as part of a world leader lecture series.
For Stanford to give a position to Rummy in spite of massive student/staff protests, is an insult to the entire University because it’s showing the administration isn’t willing to listen to what it’s own campus wants.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:06 pmComment by Vendetta — September 26, 2007 @ 3:56 pm
I have a dog who can speak – does that make her as smart as Rummy? Both expect a reward and neither one really understands why it is coming.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:07 pm64, We agree again, Squeege.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:07 pmSo it’s Fox cutting off mikes that makes lib censorship ok then?
Comment by upright left
Nobody has censored Rumsfeld. Hello.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:07 pmMissmolly, the Hoover Institution is a well-known right-wing think tank, founded by Herbert Hoover (possibly the most disastrous president until GWB) at Stanford, his alma mater. It looks like another high-profile case of Wingnut Welfare.
Comment by spit take — September 26, 2007 @ 3:37 pm
Sorry — I have no excuse for missing that except I must have had a major brain fart while reading it. You’re right, of course, and it makes sense now.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:07 pmThat bloody-handed old SOB needs to be arrested and tried for war crimes.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:07 pmWTF makes anyone think he deserves fellowship at an University?
Comment by Zimzone — September 26, 2007 @ 4:03 pm
Maybe you missed the tittle
US SEC of DEFENSE
You remember the US most powerful nation on earth.
Methinks you miss the tittle, too. Feeding time!
September 26th, 2007 at 4:08 pmWhy do I get the feeling that you are skirting the issue? Can’t answer, can you? Comment by Michael
Why dont you know the words to the tune? You heard the same song and dance that I did, right?
September 26th, 2007 at 4:09 pmZimzone
We agree again, Squeege.
Darn it, back to my normal status then. Enough of this well thought out position stuff.
Stanford shouldn’t allow him to get a position, because the standard abbreviation of his name (rummy) appears to support alcohol and it’s close cousin alcoholism. And thats not a message we want to give to todays youth.
Is that better?
September 26th, 2007 at 4:10 pmNobody has censored Rumsfeld. Hello.
Comment by Xisithrus — September 26, 2007 @ 4:07 pm
Keep up, bud. Read the whole thread. ;)
September 26th, 2007 at 4:11 pmMaybe you missed the tittle
US SEC of DEFENSE
A tittle, lmao.
Respect is earned it is not given and this debacle Rumsfeld helped to create is hardly respectable and that goes from the time he shook Saddams hand.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:12 pmIt’s about time this generation stood up for themselves. I have been wholly unimpressed so far.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:12 pmKeep up, bud. Read the whole thread. ;)
Comment by upright left
I have read it, what people post here does not censor what Rummy says.
Give me an example where Rumsfeld has been censored by congress or the media.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:14 pmThere are no words as much as you pretend there are.
Comment by Michael — September 26, 2007
Pull your fingers out of your ears and stop saying ‘laa laaa laaa la la’
“We know where they are. They’re in the area around Tikrit and Baghdad and east, west, south and north somewhat.”
September 26th, 2007 at 4:17 pmJust like Ward Churchill, huh? Or all the “far left liberal professors†the Right is always whining about?
Comment by gummitch — September 26, 2007 @ 3:59 pm
You mean the Churchill that has been dogged by allegations of plagairism and research misconduct and called the victims of 9/11 “little Eichmanns” and was finally fired for “repeated and deliberate” infractions of scholarship rules?” ;)
September 26th, 2007 at 4:17 pmSpeaking of nutty professors, what about that leo strauss?
September 26th, 2007 at 4:20 pmI have read it, what people post here does not censor what Rummy says.
Give me an example where Rumsfeld has been censored by congress or the media.
Comment by Xisithrus — September 26, 2007 @ 4:14 pm
Well, read it again, because I didn’t say people here, congress or the media censored anybody. ;)
September 26th, 2007 at 4:21 pmVendetta
And their definition of “association†is?
If we take the top definition of association:
1. The act of associating or the state of being associated.
Then, if we do another one on associating, it drops it to associate and if we take the top definition of associate:
1.To join as a partner, ally, or friend.
So if a large part of who you are (a plurality of your students and staff) are protesting your choice of partner, ally, or friend, maybe it’s something you shouldn’t be doing. Especially because there is no outside pressure forcing you into this association, as compared to military or economic associations where sometimes a bad choice is still necessary.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:21 pmThose are lies?
Comment by Michael
Are they truths?
September 26th, 2007 at 4:25 pmVendetta = Vlad the Impaler
Troll crosstalk has been proven to grow hair on one’s palms.
Careful, TPers.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:25 pmIt’s not a lie if they believed the weapons were there. -michael
Nice try. Weasel words.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:31 pmAnd ignoring us is an admission of ignorance! -michael
Why? Because you believe it is? LOL.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:32 pmXisithrus,
Applause! I think you just came up with an appropriate moniker for this troll.
Weasel Words. I like it. It kind of slides off the tongue, much like Rudi does with 9/11.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:33 pmWould a liberal know the difference?
Comment by Michael
“Would you?”
September 26th, 2007 at 4:33 pmspit take,
Never lead a Troll to a bathroom.
1. They smell worse than the bathroom.
2. They make themselves at home there.
3. They like tap dancing.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:36 pmUsing the search term “rumsfeld lies” in google, including quotes. You will get over 9,000 hits.
Here is the first article. do you want the rest Micheal?
http://www.counterpunch.org/whitney06282005.html
September 26th, 2007 at 4:36 pmApplause! I think you just came up with an appropriate moniker for this troll. -ZZ
=)
Thats all he does is use Weasel Words and the question mark??? If Rummy lied its because he didn’t mean too! [proffers michael] But we should believe hom because hes the S.O.D!
weasel logic requires weasel words.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:36 pmAnd we are back to the lefts double standard.
Comment by Vendetta — September 26, 2007
Now your calling Condi Rice a double standardist?
September 26th, 2007 at 4:37 pmLOL @ vendetta, listening to them mushroom cloud words of the lefty double standardist Condi.
Your a Genius!
September 26th, 2007 at 4:40 pm[[And according to michael I'm not lying about that, but maybe I am]]
Works for me, Spit Take
September 26th, 2007 at 4:41 pmAnd how many are blogs or comments on blogs?
Comment by Vendetta — September 26, 2007 @ 4:40 pm
No idea, why don’t you take the time to read each one, and find out. =P
September 26th, 2007 at 4:43 pm“We know†could very much have been what he thought he knew. It would then not qualify as a lie -Vendetta
So then we can just do away with all those CIA agents and those sattelites, the NSA and all that other stuff, like the FBI?
September 26th, 2007 at 4:43 pmWhy Vendetta we can get rid of courtrooms all across the country!!
No one ever lies because they believed they were telling the truth!
September 26th, 2007 at 4:44 pmWhat is is Vendetta?
September 26th, 2007 at 4:45 pmC’mon, people, have you ever had to shave your hands?
September 26th, 2007 at 4:46 pmYou are right but instead he is a certified idiot instead of a certified liar.
Comment by Vendetta
Okay, now were back to the topic at hand. Rumsfeld, according to Vendetta logic, is an idiot.
Thanks Vendetta!!
September 26th, 2007 at 4:48 pmVendetta
Since your reply does not specify so then the above mentioned general dfinition leaves plenty of room for Rummy to qualify.
Plenty of wriggle room for Rummy, or for you? I can’t believe all you can argue on are semantics when you said earlier:
Though you’d like for them to be different to justify your position you’re really just splitting hairs.
Additionally, here is the overview of the Hoover Insitutes fellowship program (Which is part of Stanford, and the part that is granting Rummy is fellowship, just so you know the relationship and why I’m linking to them and not Stanford, before you try and wriggle even more)
The strength of Hoover’s research program lies in recruiting scholars of exceptional ability from the disciplines of economics, history, law, political science, and sociology. They work together, melding their individual expertise in an effort to understand interdisciplinary issues and shed light on important policy dilemmas of our time.
Now, the Iranian President came on campus once, for a speech, followed by 1 session of Q and A (thats questions and answers)
In comparison, using the info above, Rummy is expected to ‘work together’ and ‘meld’ his ‘individual expertise’ with other people in the institute. His fellowship is 1 year long. Thats longer than the few hours the Iranian president was on campus for, by quite a wide margin actually.
Where did I get one year from? In case you choose to argue that?
Mr. Rumsfeld had accepted the appointment, which would last one year.
Now I know it’s the NYT, a liberal rag, but I doubt they bothered to lie on that.
Now, is there anything else you choose to ignore or otherwise obfuscate to try and help your cause? I prob. won’t be able to get to it, due to leaving the computer for the night soon. But there are other people here who I am sure would love to help you out.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:49 pmNot if you can prove they knew otherwise.
Comment by Vendetta — September 26, 2007
Im quite done helping you make a fool of your own posts.
Thanks for playing.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:53 pmVendetta
If the others will not work with him it is they then who are not qualified.
I’ve never argued anything about his qualifications. Send that line to someone who cares. All I’ve done is point out how flawed your comparison to people protesting Rummy getting a fellowship and Ahmadinejad being allowed to speak is.
He prob. is more than qualified for the fellowship, but the Hoover Institute, and Stanford have sparked a large staff/student protest by choosing such a polarized figure, and should prob. reconsider before they alienate at least a plurality of their community.
September 26th, 2007 at 4:57 pmspit take
By the way, nice work on the thread, Squeege. Very measured and clear.
Thanks, you have no idea how much that goes against my nature. But sometimes even I have to stop screwing around and explain words and things.
September 26th, 2007 at 5:05 pmVendetta
I am only one libertarian in a sea of libs.
Dude, I’m a registered R.
Admins Job is a tough one he/she/they has to way the free speech rights and possible conservative alienation vs alienation of the left.
They picked a polarized figure, if they hadn’t picked one, there would be no alienation issues at all. If I remeber correctly there have been similar issues with quite a few other Bush’s other close friends and administration officials, they should have seen this coming, so odds are they did see it coming and choose to do it anyways.
anyways, I’m out for the night. Have a great night everyone!
September 26th, 2007 at 5:13 pmI don’t think anyone credible in the Defense/Foreign Policy world ever really respected or took Rummy seriously anyway. His quasi-nepotistic appointment to SecDef has to be the biggest feather in his cv cap, and prior to that he was just another washed-up Nixon-era cold war flack, that happened to share a few closet-skeletons and delusions of grandeur in common with Darth Cheney.
One could say that Rumsfeld was/is as important in that world as Fred Thompson is in the world of acting/entertainment, and that, truly, ain’t sayin’ much for either one.
September 26th, 2007 at 5:47 pmDistinguished?! Are you kidding? Do I have to remind you… ? “This war will take only days, weeks, I doubt months.” Hang this man, he’s caused the death of so many men so much better than him…. Screw Donny.
September 27th, 2007 at 7:20 amCurious. There exists more students protesting Rumsfeld than Ahmedinejad. Guess who is less loved?
September 27th, 2007 at 7:31 am