Podhoretz: ‘I Believe Bush Is Going To Order Airstrikes On Iran Before He Leaves Office’
Podhoretz: ‘I Believe Bush Is Going To Order Airstrikes On Iran Before He Leaves Office’
Norman Podhoretz, widely reputed as the “godfather” of neoconservatism, has released a new book entitled World War IV: The Long Struggle Against Islamofacism, a strident call for continuing the Bush strategy of preemptive wars.
Podhoretz, who was awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom by Bush in 2004, met privately with the President for 45 minutes recently. During the course of the meeting, Bush listened diligently as Podhoretz laid out the “the case for bombing Iran.” Podhoretz seems to have come away convinced that he made the case.
In a C-Span interview that aired this weekend, Podhoretz states his fervent belief that Bush will attack Iran before he leaves office:
I believe President Bush is going to order airstrikes [on Iran] before he leaves office. Because he has several times said — at least twice to my knowledge — that if we allow Iranians to acquire nuclear capabilities, 50 years from now, people will look back at us the way we look back at Munich and say ‘how could they have let this happen?’
Watch it:
Podhoretz is echoing a view that has been sounded by many conservative voices close to President Bush:
Richard Perle: “Would this president do it? I think that until the day he leaves office, this is a president that, if he is told, ‘Mr. President, you are at the point of no return,’ I have very little doubt that this president would order the necessary military action.” [Link]
A well-placed source in Washington said: “Bush is not going to leave office with Iran still in limbo.” [Link]
Bill Kristol: “We could be in a military confrontation with Iran much sooner than people expect.” [Link]
Podhoretz has said he “prays” we will bomb Iran, despite also acknowledging that it could “unleash a wave of anti-Americanism all over the world that will make the anti-Americanism we’ve experienced so far look like a lovefest.”
Topic Cloud
ArchivesBlog Roll
sad old podh — the only time he gets an erection is when he thinks of all those dead iranians…
October 1st, 2007 at 11:26 amThey’re all fanatics – they’re redoubling their efforts long after they’ve lost sight of their goals. They no longer know why they have to attack Iran, only that they must attack.
This is just insane.
October 1st, 2007 at 11:27 amA well-placed source in Washington said: “Bush is not going to leave office with Iran still in limbo.â€
George:
October 1st, 2007 at 11:31 am“Limbo?
Afghanistan? Sure, Iraq? No problem.
Darfur? Hell we don’t care.
And America? Heh, heh, if they can’t afford health care, retirement, housing, well, that’s the the way the cookie crumbles… heh heh…
But I got me a sh!tload of missiles and a big red button, and by golly I’m gonna push it!”
Isn’t this the guy \/\/ and Rove laughed at recently?
October 1st, 2007 at 11:32 amUnless the republicans believe marshal law they had better think long and hard about allowing this president to launch an attack against Iran. This will destroy the republican party and mark the beginning of WWIII. Bush is already the worst president in history. Let’s not make him the last president as well.
October 1st, 2007 at 11:33 amWhy do these neocon war mongers hate Americans? They don’t care if Americans die. They only want to protect Isreal so my guess is that these neocons are really Isreali spies sent here to drum up war. An alternative thought is that they are really “Rapture” believers and want Isreal to be destroyed so that the “Rapture” can happen.
October 1st, 2007 at 11:34 amShame on CSPAN for airing this venom.
October 1st, 2007 at 11:35 amMaybe somebody 90 years old shouldn’t be giving advice on what’s good for the future of the country.
October 1st, 2007 at 11:38 amPod, if you’re into leather and big Nazi jewelry, there’s a love match waiting for you, just a couple of threads down.
October 1st, 2007 at 11:39 amA certain Jewish Cabal has inordinate influence.
October 1st, 2007 at 11:41 amIf that happens it will be WW3 as other countries come to the aide of Iran who was illegally attacked and the US will have no support. Yes Cuba will help as they are friends of Iran. Other countries that Iran has made friends with will help but don’t look for Bush’s old friends the Saudis to help the US. Yes we have already threaten to bomb countries if they didn’t join in the illegal invasion of Iraq. The UN will have to call a meeting for all the countries to meet and stop the United States of America. That will be a History making moment as one the Great Leader of the Free World falls. You thought the Stock Market is low now you haven’t seen anything yet if the idiot attacks Iran.
October 1st, 2007 at 11:42 amOK maybe he only looks 90, but should people who have interest that involve other countries’ welfare more then the US be giving advice to the President. And when somebody does give advice that’s counterproductive to the welfare of this country to meet their own agenda isn’t that treason?
October 1st, 2007 at 11:42 amLooks like Dr. Strangelove all over again.
October 1st, 2007 at 11:42 amif Bush does this, he’ll also issue an executive order stating that due to the war he must remain in office indefinitely… that’s next up in the power grab… he’ll say the war authorization gives him the power to do this, just the same way it allowed him attack uninvolved countries, torture and spy on people…
October 1st, 2007 at 11:46 amMaybe we can get Norman the Pud to ride down on the first bomb like Slim Whitman in Dr. Strangelove.
Warmongering asshat.
-GSD
October 1st, 2007 at 11:47 amI meant Slim Pickens. Slim Whitman would have yodeled all the way down.
-GSD
October 1st, 2007 at 11:48 amWarmongering asshat.
-GSD
Comment by GSD — October 1, 2007 @ 11:47 am
NSL!!!!
(no such luck…)
October 1st, 2007 at 11:48 amSlim Whitman would have yodeled all the way down.
-GSD
And Podhoretz’s head would have exploded.
October 1st, 2007 at 11:53 amAnd Podhoretz’s head would have exploded.
Comment by Nevar — October 1, 2007 @ 11:53 am
yeah, but the explosion would have been contained and the sound dampened by his *ss cheeks…
October 1st, 2007 at 11:54 amYeah, other people hate US for the freedoms…yeah.
October 1st, 2007 at 11:54 am“unleash a wave of anti-americanism”??? Would that mean more than we’ve already unleashed? Let’s see how many more countries will unite against us, shall we?
October 1st, 2007 at 11:56 amJuan C: I hope that was sarcasm because we’ve already traded ALL of our so called “freedoms” for the total illusion of “safety”. They’re all gone at this point which begs the question: How can we still call this a democracy? Obviously, it is not.
October 1st, 2007 at 11:57 amLet’s see how many more countries will unite against us, shall we?
Comment by Veritas — October 1, 2007 @ 11:56 am
This could well be more of a problem over the next few years than many care to admit.
October 1st, 2007 at 11:58 amThe rest of the world doesn’t hate us for our freedoms (because we have few left); they hate us for our imperialism and heinous unlawful murder of innocent citizens of a sovereign nation (Iraq). At least, they have a moral compass and a conscience….something this country has traded in for a swastica.
October 1st, 2007 at 11:59 amIsn’t ANYBODY paying attention to who these guys are and WTF their diobolical plan is? Geesh. Just Google PNAC. Richard Perle has a hard-on for continual war and death.
October 1st, 2007 at 11:59 amGod help us.
TRoS: From the rumblings I’m hearing, the rest of the world is already taking sides and will squash this little bug we call the US if we’re not careful.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:00 pm“… and will squash this little bug we call the US if we’re not careful.”
Comment by Veritas — October 1, 2007 @ 12:00 pm
I find the situation we’re in terrifying.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:00 pmDharma: Yes, Google PNAC. And then google Leo Strauss….and then google “Irving Kristol” Grandfather of demented William Kristol who has been dubbed the “GRANDFATHER OF THE NEO-FASCIST MOVEMENT”. Many people already know about their diabolical plan and their false flag operation to get us into this blood for oil war. It’s all very dark, necrotic, and sick!
October 1st, 2007 at 12:01 pmTRoS: It should be terrifying. When people wake up and realize that we’ve become fascist overnight and no longer have a voice in our government, they will simultaneously realize that our imperialistic bullying is bound to result in this country becoming a third world country in our lifetimes if we do not stop this neo-fascist machine in it’s tracks.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:02 pmIsn’t ANYBODY paying attention to who these guys are and WTF their diobolical plan is? Geesh. Just Google PNAC. Richard Perle has a hard-on for continual war and death.
God help us.
Kind of makes me think of Carthage and it’s eternal war. Now, we can’t even find Carthage on the map. Will the US become what some native American tribes refer to as the “giant mud turtle”?
October 1st, 2007 at 12:02 pmBush did turn out to be a uniter after all. The entire world is on its way to hating the US!
October 1st, 2007 at 12:02 pmI’d say that economically as well as militarily we’ve reached a nadir now….which means that we are “ripe for the picking”.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:03 pmTRoS: Truer words were never spoken! Only HE knew what he meant by the term “uniter”. It meant that he will unite the rest of the world AGAINST us. This is coming to fruition and rapidly.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:04 pmVeritas…of course.
Reading this complete delusional, frustrated and bitter man speaking about how the plans for killing more innocent people are going smoothly, and taking pride for it, it is really easy to disregard the obvious idiocy of the argument that people all around the world, “the bad guys” hate US for McDonalds and the shopping malls.
However, it is really good to read this guy, cuz he wont hold anything. This is the true face of US national extremists, the Straussian school of politics. They tell the truth.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:04 pmCoffins: Someone wrote a great piece at Smirking Chimp last week regarding how the Germans may have a “gut feeling” that something was amiss as Hitler marshalled his forces but as long as their little lives were still intact (going to work, eating, sleeping), they were lulled into complacency when they should have been “up in arms”. There is a very clear parallel right now to the people of this country and the tactics of this dictator. If we don’t wake up soon, there will be nothing left to wake up to. He’s taking this country down the tubes.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:06 pmThis is coming to fruition and rapidly.
Comment by Veritas — October 1, 2007 @ 12:04 pm
You what they say in the fruits and vegetables business…
Once yer ripe, the next day, ya start ta rot…
October 1st, 2007 at 12:06 pmThis absolutely crazy and what is even crazier and scary is the trend in public opinion. They keep saying this crap and after they have said it enough and you get 34% of the population to agree with you, that is when it is possible to go to war….
October 1st, 2007 at 12:06 pmTake a look at the statistics from a recent poll via the link below. The trend is at 29% already…….
http://www.pollingreport.com/iran.htm
And while we slide down the abyss into darkness, Emperor Nero Bush will be fiddling……with the grin of a pure madman on his face.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:06 pmIsn’t ANYBODY paying attention to who these guys are and WTF their diobolical plan is? Geesh. Just Google PNAC. Richard Perle has a hard-on for continual war and death.
God help us.
Comment by Dharma — October 1, 2007 @ 11:59 am
I’ve been saying this since the PNAC website went up in 1997.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:07 pmTheir plan all along has been to create a “Pan Americana Empire”
TRoS: We’re reaching the rotting stage….totally necrotic at every turn.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:07 pmPan American Empire, ’tis Wayne! Soon coming to a town near you!
October 1st, 2007 at 12:08 pmBush will attack Iran at the very moment the Republicans can benefit politically the most, sometime close to the 2008 election.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:10 pmTRoS: We’re reaching the rotting stage….totally necrotic at every turn.
Comment by Veritas — October 1, 2007 @ 12:07 pm
Uh… yeah, unfortunately.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:10 pmVeritas sez:
Veritas, I believe you’re referring to this piece. I’m reposting the link because it needs to be read by as many people as possible.
A good related piece is Milton Mayer’s They Thought They Were Free. The parallels are chilling.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:14 pmOMG, this guy seems to think that starting WW IV is a good thing. This man is bat-shit insane.
If only we had Democrats in Congress who would represent the will of the people. But, it appears that we no longer count.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:14 pmThese NeoCons are simply addicted to killing. I don’t understand how “Christians” got in bed with this Death Cult.
If you are frightened by William the Bloody or Podhoretz, try tuning in Christian TeeVee. The broadcast evangelicals like John Hagee are far more crazy and far more frightening. They’re doing what they can to bring about World War III. They are big fans of the destruction of mankind as being a very good thing.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:15 pmI, for one, wait with bated breath to see how quickly Bush is fragged after we start bombing Iran and the nukes fly. It’ll be interesting to watch as long as were not killed here at home but who can guarantee that? Nobody.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:16 pmComment by OxyCon — October 1, 2007 @ 12:10 pm
He’s certainly positioning himself to be ready to act if it might help the repulbicans.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:17 pmPAX Americana!
October 1st, 2007 at 12:18 pmPodhoretz should be arrested, tried and convicted as a foreign agent, then put into prison for the rest of his life. This would be a warning to other Neocons to flee to Israel.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:19 pmIf only we had Democrats in Congress who would represent the will of the people. But, it appears that we no longer count.
Comment by bilbobaggins — October 1, 2007 @ 12:14 pm
Didn’t get the memo?
Pelosi changed the name of the Democratic Party to “Lapdogs for Bush”
October 1st, 2007 at 12:20 pmAnd Podhoretz’s head would have exploded.
Comment by Nevar — October 1, 2007 @ 11:53 am
Is that a bad thing?
October 1st, 2007 at 12:22 pmTell us, what freedoms have you lost?
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 12:22 pm
Nice to know the delusional are still amongst us.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:23 pmKind of makes me think of Carthage and it’s eternal war. Now, we can’t even find Carthage on the map. Will the US become what some native American tribes refer to as the “giant mud turtle�
Comment by Coffins Draped with a Flag — October 1, 2007 @ 12:02 pm
Hmmm….interesting comparison. Who do you see as Rome in this scenario?
October 1st, 2007 at 12:24 pmHabeas Corpus.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:25 pmTRoS: It should be terrifying. When people wake up and realize that we’ve become fascist overnight and no longer have a voice in our government, they will simultaneously realize that our imperialistic bullying is bound to result in this country becoming a third world country in our lifetimes if we do not stop this neo-fascist machine in it’s tracks.
Comment by Veritas — October 1, 2007 @ 12:02 pm
… and then they’ll change the channel. There’s important Britney updates to watch!
October 1st, 2007 at 12:26 pmI don’t understand why this administration is stuck with such extreme idealogy of these people like Podhoretz ,and leave many ideas that could have solved our problems in the area peacefully long time ago;
voices of more moderate ideas and ones that can bring results.
What are these ideas of Neocons producing?
October 1st, 2007 at 12:26 pmThousands of dead people, billions of spent dollars,hate among nations,instability ,
and yes these people want Israel’s enemies destroyed..
but this is America and America should look for its own interests..and I can’t see how bombing Iran after occupying another 2 other Moslem countries can solve our problems..
It is getting us deeper and deeper in the hot sands of Arabia,and bringing us the anger of the Moslem world,which America needs and cannot do without.
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 12:22 pm
Fresh batch of “Stupid Pills” came in for you this morning, I see.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:26 pmComment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 12:22 pm
What freedoms have we gained since Bush came to office?
Do you think it’s necessary that we attack Iran? Will there be ground forces involved? What do you think the world’s reaction would be?
October 1st, 2007 at 12:29 pm!
question:
DO WE THE PEOPLE HAVE ANY SAY IN THIS?
HOW DO WE STOP THIS?
(ok … 2 questions… )
October 1st, 2007 at 12:29 pm.
Tell us, what freedoms have you lost?
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 12:22 pm
Hard to see and loss of freedom when your head is shoved so far up your ass. Nobody was talking to you Bigfool.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:29 pm… and then they’ll change the channel. There’s important Britney updates to watch!
Comment by toasterhead — October 1, 2007 @ 12:26 pm
Another pantie-less car exit?
October 1st, 2007 at 12:29 pmmust. switch. channels…….
Tell us, what freedoms have you lost?
Comment by O. Bigfoot
Delusional, yes. Pathetically unAmerican? yes. Scared of independent thought? yes. Monarchy driven? yes. Woefully uninformed? yes. Fox news watcher? yes. All the things which are wrong in America right now can be summed up with this one out of touch water carrier.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:31 pmHOW DO WE STOP THIS?
Comment by katy
The French way. Guillotines.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:31 pmWe have lost NO freedoms, Veritas. We have more freedoms now than the day George W. took office.
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 12:22 pm
Name 10. And back them up with proof.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:31 pmIts obvious that that the US is being run by old geezers with fossilized brain matter. They are sounding more and more like insane lunatics who should be fitted for straight jackets and ball gags then locked away in mental institutions before they start WWIII.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:32 pmWe have lost NO freedoms, Veritas. We have more freedoms now than the day George W. took office.
Tell us, what freedoms have you lost?
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 12:22 pm
I can’t speak for Veritas, but I know I have lost the freedom afforded to me by the fourth amendment, I have lost the freedom to protest against the president anywhere near him (I have to go to a “free speech zone”), I have lost the assurance of Habeus Corpus if I am ever labeled an “enemy combatant”, and I have lost the freedom of taking my shampoo with me when I fly, among other things.
Pray tell, what are these “MORE freedoms” I have since Dubya took office?
October 1st, 2007 at 12:34 pmAnd the Democrats STILL don’t get the idea that there’s a problem!
Since the Democrats are so wonderful at passing non-binding resolutions, how about one along these lines.
Should the President order a pre-emptive strike on Iran, the Senate (House) recommends that the President and Vice President be IMMEDIATELY imprisoned and impeachment proceeding begun immediately.
Nothing short of this is acceptable.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:35 pmHere are freedoms we have lost:
FREEDOM OF ASSOCIATION: Government may monitor religious and political institutions without suspecting criminal activity to assist terror investigations.
FREEDOM OF INFORMATION: Government has closed once-public immigration hearings, has secretly detained hundreds of people without charges, and has encouraged bureaucrats to resist public records questions.
FREEDOM OF SPEECH: Government may prosecute librarians or keepers of any other records if they tell anyone that the government subpoenaed information related to a terror investigation.
RIGHT TO LEGAL REPRESENTATION: Government may monitor federal prison jailhouse conversations between attorneys and clients, and deny lawyers to Americans accused of crimes.
FREEDOM FROM UNREASONABLE SEARCHES: Government may search and seize Americans’ papers and effects without probable cause to assist terror investigation.
RIGHT TO A SPEEDY AND PUBLIC TRIAL: Government may jail Americans indefinitely without a trial.
RIGHT TO LIBERTY: Americans may be jailed without being charged or being able to confront witnesses against them.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:36 pmMy previous post was taken from:
http://baltimorechronicle.com/020105ChuckBaldwin.shtml
October 1st, 2007 at 12:37 pmO. Bigfoot can’t even tell us why he thinks the issues raised by the MoveOn ad are related to supposedly accusing Petraeus of treason.
O. Bigfoot conveniently ignores the 5 other definitions of the word “betray” which have everything to do with the specific issues MoveOn raises in their ad.
I don’t expect much from this hack.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:37 pmThis latest neocon fearmongering is so phony I don’t even know where to begin.
If they believed for a nanosecond that Iran was the Next World Threat, they not only would have left Saddam in place, they’d've helped him rebuild his army.
If a neocon says the sky is blue, don’t bother to stick your head outside. It’s orange.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:39 pmI just read a post about Naomi Klein in which she s quoted as saying Richard Perle is first and foremost an munitions dealer.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:42 pmBad Eye sez:
Hell…name ONE, Littlefoot. Name one “freedom” we possess now that we didn’t before 9/11.
(Not that I’m actually expecting an answer, little hit-n-run troll, but it would be a refreshing change to see you back up your pernicious bullsh!t for once in your sad little career.)
October 1st, 2007 at 12:45 pmIf they believed for a nanosecond that Iran was the Next World Threat, they not only would have left Saddam in place, they’d’ve helped him rebuild his army.
If a neocon says the sky is blue, don’t bother to stick your head outside. It’s orange.
Comment by jonny — October 1, 2007 @ 12:39 pm
We have been helping him rebuild his army. It’s just that his army split into about 20 different factions and we’re arming them either directly or indirectly through black-market dealers and AK-47s that “fell off the back of the truck” and they’re too busy fighting each other and us to care about Iran
October 1st, 2007 at 12:48 pmYou know, whenever I hear or read the term “Islamofascism” I think of Saudi Arabia.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:56 pmJesus H. Christ – why don’t we bomb HIM???
October 1st, 2007 at 12:57 pmWe have lost NO freedoms, Veritas. We have more freedoms now than the day George W. took office.
The only reason I could see for you stating you have lost YOUR freedoms is if you are posting on this website from a prison library somewhere, which I don’t think is the case.
Tell us, what freedoms have you lost?
Comment by O. Bigfoot
Right Wing Loon OBigFootInMouth shows up once again to prove how stupid he is. He will continue to contend that we have lost no freedoms until the day that he is snatched and sent to be rendered in a black-site prison in Europe. That day couldn’t come soon enough.
October 1st, 2007 at 12:58 pmAre we to learn nothing from history?
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 12:56 pm
Since you are such a history buff, list all the countries Iran has invaded inthe last 2000 years.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:00 pmIran chose sides when it decided to arm our terrorist enemies with munitions that are killing our military men and women.
Are we to learn nothing from history?
Comment by O. Bigfoot
Right Wing Loon OBigFootInMouth – would you care to provide us with proof that Iran is arming our terrorist enemies with munitions that are killing our military men and women? What, you can’t? You take the word of Bully Boy Bush as proof. Well, that just shows how few critical thinking skills you have.
And you are correct. It doesn’t appear we have learned much from history because we are repeating the mistakes we made on the lead-up to the war in Iraq. And that mistake was believing anything that came out of the mouth of Bully Boy Bush.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:02 pmIran is Germany
I am confused, I thought Iraq under Saddam was Nazi Germany in 1936. Or is Iran similar to Germany of 2007?
October 1st, 2007 at 1:03 pmPresident George W. Bush’s stated goal has been to secure America for the future. He stated plainly that this meant heading off future threats now, while they can be dealt with relatively easily, rather than wait until the threat is much more difficult.
Comment by O. Bigfoot
All your words do not mean anything. You simply are repeating the same tired – and incorrect – right wing assertions. The same BS convinced bush to invade and occupy a soverign nation who played a role as balance to iran’s influence and ambitions. Bush removed a huge problem for iran by invading iraq. No comment from you about that mistake, I suppose?
Also, Bush took an oath to uphold the Constitution. You know what the Constitution is don’t you? It was in all the history books at one time.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:05 pmSorry Bigfoot, but the US with Fuhrer Bush is the new fascistic Germany. Iraq is his Poland and Iran will be his Stalingrad/Russia.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:06 pm#71 Comment by hellinabucket — October 1, 2007
Kudos!
October 1st, 2007 at 1:07 pmWe have more freedoms now than the day George W. took office.
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 12:22 pm
Someone’s certainly free of the ravages of intelligence.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:07 pmcome on, O. Bigfoot-in-Mouth, list all the countries Iran has invaded in the last 2000 years…….
Its not a big list at all.
The amount of countries in the list? Zero, none, nada, zilch.
And you compare them to Germany?
October 1st, 2007 at 1:08 pmHilarious.
After the initial strike of missles, what do we do? How many troops will be needed to stem the flood into Iraq? Afghanistan? How will George Bush decide to pay for this new conflict? What sacrifices will the amercian people be asked to bear? How many tax cuts will be removed to help pay for this new conflict? Will Bush attempt to call this the extended war on terror to bypass congress? Or will he look to get approval?
Bush needs to first find his ducks, then put them in order before he jumps into a conflict with Iran.
Mr. Bigfoot, fools rush in where wisemen fear to tread. We have already witnessed where this fool rushes. I want to hear the sane arguments for and against this before allowing this fake cowboy to jump into Iran.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:09 pmA well-placed source in Washington said: “Bush is not going to leave office with Iran still in limbo.â€
This could be interpreted to mean that Bush does not intend to leave office, period. He can keep Iran in limbo forever and when it comes time for an election he will call a National Emergency because of the threat Iran poses to us and cancel the election.
Iran DOES NOT pose a threat to the USA. The only way they will ever pose a threat to us is if we invade their country. And, “surgical strikes” are the same as invading their country. The day we cross their border in order to do harm to them, we have, in fact, invaded their country.
I feel like our government (including Congress) is suffering from some strange kind of insanity right now. And it scares the hell out of me.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:09 pmO. Bigfoot – Just get ready for $20.00 per gallon gasoline and the bankrupting of our treasury. Also be prepared for the draft, because it will come. I presume you will be one of the first to enlist, right? Or maybe you can talk your own children into fighting Bush’s wars.
Bush has been incorrect about everything surrounding this debacle. Why on heaven and earth would you think he will get this one right? The same group of losers are still pulling the levers of power. They were all wrong (last throes, anyone?) then, and history will prove them wrong again. How can you continue to embrace this administration’s policies?
October 1st, 2007 at 1:11 pmI’m still standing. ( in the pile of sh!t I am trying to feed you )
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 1:07 pm
fixed it for you.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:13 pmI don’t think it’s insanity bilbobaggins, I believe they are being controlled.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:14 pmI really can’t think of any other reason for what we’ve seen since the last election. Or for that matter, what’s taken place since bush was installed.
Including 911.
I’m still standing.
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 1:07 pm
Good for you Bigfool. Standing and yapping the same lies that only you 18 percenters are dumb enough to believe, glad you’re so proud of yourself for being dumb enough not only to listen to the BS but repeat it here.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:14 pmMr. Bigfoot, you haven’t provided a list of the freedoms we have gained since Bush took office. If you stand by this statement then provide the evidence to support it. If not, apologize for the error.
If you do neither and ignore this then you aren’t worthy of actual debate.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:14 pmIf Iran is, indeed, such a heinous threat, why not let Israel do their own damned bombing? Why do we have to do it for them? We bought’em the bombs ….
October 1st, 2007 at 1:15 pmSorry, but you are incorrect there. My words do mean something, because these are the words which explain the information our government is utilizing while Democrat and Republican alike authorize the use of military strikes against Iran, our enemy.
Comment by O. Bigfoot
And like any good water carrier, you have no words to explain the fact that Iraq was a counter balance to Iran. Your naive view of a black and white world is juvenile. Geo-political situations require a good amount of nuance. And we all know Bush does not do nuance.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:16 pmStill waiting for an answer, Littlefoot…
October 1st, 2007 at 1:16 pmMr. Bigfoot, why haven’t you answered my questions? You have time to argue but don’t address the questions I’ve posed to you at #90 and #97. Your avoidance of the serious issues exposes you to be hollow.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:20 pmGeo-political situations require a good amount of nuance. And we all know Bush does not do nuance.
Comment by StratRat — October 1, 2007 @ 1:16 pm
But he can sub-contract it out. Is there a division of Blackwater that can handle nuance?
October 1st, 2007 at 1:21 pmMy words do mean something, because these are the words which explain the information our government is utilizing while Democrat and Republican alike authorize the use of military strikes against Iran, our enemy.
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 1:11 pm
Interesting… let’s see…
Iran chose sides when it decided to arm our terrorist enemies with munitions that are killing our military men and women.
The US provided munitions to Iraq which killed Iranian military forces and Iranian civilian populations. So, by your logic, the US chose sides before Iran ever did. Don’t be whining about evil terrorists now.
Iran is the greatest supporter of state-sponsored terrorism in the world.
Proof? Numbers? Or is it just another talking point?
Are we to learn nothing from history?
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 12:56 pm
Jeez, I dunno. Iraq, 2003? Have you learned anything from that little adventure?
October 1st, 2007 at 1:22 pmSuppose I could use my Christmas Card from the Bush family as a “Get out of Jail Free†card?
Comment by O. Bigfoot
OBigFootInMouth seems to be forgetting that the Democratic President who takes office in January 2009 will have all the “unitary” privileges that Bush has awarded himself, including the ability to snatch people off the street and render them. That means that your being on Bush’s Christmas card list will guarantee you a seat on the black-site plane to a rendition site. It’s a nice thought.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:22 pmMr. Bigfoot, why haven’t you answered my questions?
Comment by hellinabucket — October 1, 2007 @ 1:20 pm
Because the answers were not in the talking points.
O. Bigfoot-in-Mouth doesn’t think he needs to show any proof of the crap he pulls out of his a$$, other than waving his stinky hand in the air.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:25 pmLittlefoot sez:
And you’re actually going to try to hold those up as “freedoms”, next to the very real freedom of Habeas Corpus (which you have lost, along with everyone else, regardless of whether or not you’re bright enough to understand the depth of your loss), and crow about a “net freedom gain”?
I just can’t tell the real trolls from the parody variety any longer…
October 1st, 2007 at 1:26 pmAdd that to the freedoms we, as American citizens. already have (and we have lost none, regardless of what some assert), and the sum total is a net two increase in specific freedoms.
Comment by O. Bigfoot
OBigFootInMouth loses his ability to read when his points are being challenged. I do believe post #71 succinctly lists all the freedoms we have lost. And, since when is keeping more of your money a “freedom”. OBigFootInMouth gets to keep an extra $100 a year of his taxes and he thinks he won the lottery.
Answer this question, OBigFootInMouth, if you can. Who do you think is going to pay for all the money that Bush has borrowed, off the books, from China, or do you care.
I don’t expect an answer because OBigFootInMouth is like Jake the Flake, he throws out stupid Right Wing Loon talking points and when he is asked to prove what he says, he either goes off an another tangent or throws out a strawman. Never do either of these Right Wing Loons ever prove what they are saying.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:27 pmThe US provided munitions to Iraq which killed Iranian military forces and Iranian civilian populations. So, by your logic, the US chose sides before Iran ever did. Don’t be whining about evil terrorists now.
Comment by Luis M — October 1, 2007 @ 1:22 pm
And don’t forget – we also provided munitions to Iran in exchange for hostages to fund a proxy war in Nicaragua. We didn’t just choose sides, we chose BOTH sides…
October 1st, 2007 at 1:28 pmI, alone, choose what I find important to respond to, and what I ignore, just as you do.
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 1:25 pm
Simpler O.Bigfoot-in-Mouth: “I can’t back up a damn thing I say. Look over there, something shiny!”.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:29 pmGood dictators show no personal preference, Bigfoot, but you could use the Christmas card to wipe your a$$. After all, people your age used to use the Sears catalog in the outhouse, didn’t they?
October 1st, 2007 at 1:29 pmWhat would we do without a moronic inbred to festive up our threads with some comic relief?
October 1st, 2007 at 1:30 pmSuppose I could use my Christmas Card from the Bush family as a “Get out of Jail Free†card?
Comment by O. Bigfoot
Not going to be much help when W is sitting in the cell next to yours. It is too funny though that you think carrying water for these guys has earned you some kind of loyalty. These are people who show no loyalty to this country or its constitution but you think they’ll remember you. Earning your name againg, Bigfool.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:31 pmTPers…..the linguist in me has found little Jake the Snake residing within our village idiot sasquach by the use of the word “ignore” in post #107. Okay Jake/Bigfoot – you’ve finally outed yourself.
ROTFLMAO
October 1st, 2007 at 1:32 pmOnly the site monitors know for sure but I’d put big money on it myself.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:32 pmThere’s no guarantee that a Democrat will be elected, and if one is, it will be Billary..and things will pretty much stay the same as they are now.
I’m sure we’ll all be here to chat about it in January, 2009.
Comment by O. Bigfoot
So, if our next president is Hillary, and things will stay the same as they are now, she will be snatching the Right Wing Loons and having them rendered, just like Bush is doing today. You better start thinking about finding a place to hide OBigFootInMouth, because some they they will be coming for you.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:32 pmI agree with this quote, except I would be referring to “how could they elect George Bush and allow him to do such insanity?”
October 1st, 2007 at 1:35 pmTPers…..the linguist in me has found little Jake the Snake residing within our village idiot sasquach by the use of the word “ignore†in post #107. Okay Jake/Bigfoot – you’ve finally outed yourself.
ROTFLMAO
Comment by Veritas
You may be right. Don’t you find it odd that there is rarely more than one Right Wing Loon per thread?
But, only TP knows for sure. I wonder why they didn’t base their registration on IP address. It is just as easy as basing it on an e-mail address and is a lot more effective in getting rid of Right Wing Loons. Maybe TP wasn’t want to get rid of them after all.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:36 pmNow I am hollow because I don’t subscribe to your world view? You liberals sure are impatient.
I, alone, choose what I find important to respond to, and what I ignore, just as you do.
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 1:25 pm
Yes you are hollow. Not because of your strawman “world view” BS, but because you ignore serious questions that need to be addressed if military action is to be considered against Iran.
You are for attacking yet another country but don’t contemplate the logistics of being successful. You play with other peoples lives just to thump your chest.
Mr. Bigfoot, you will leave a small footprint in this world.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:36 pmA great question to ask your elected democrats.
Comment by Vendetta — October 1, 2007 @ 1:31 pm
Once we get a new president, the lapdogs will roll over to a new master.
You have a point?
October 1st, 2007 at 1:38 pmYeapers….look for those gas prices to start spiking once again.
Don’t believe the hype, Bush is stupid but not THAT stupid
October 1st, 2007 at 1:41 pmNo offense intended to the simple minded. The USA has no reason to bomb IRAN. The rest of the world is well on its way to doing it without us. And to those of you that think Iran ever liked the USA. Are you really that ignorant. I’m sure somewhere on the internet you can find a tape of the Iranian parliament chanting “Death to the USA” in unison. Nothing about Bush , just the USA.
I’m not really worried about Iran and the rest of the terrorist states, I live in the midwest. When they get the Bomb if they haven’t already got it I’m sure it will probabley be San Fransico or L.A. that they’ll use it on. I just hope I don’t get hit with the fallout.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:42 pmNow Iran is going to be lumped into the “Victory” BS.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:43 pmIf there was a dollar value on stupidity, you’d be the Rupert Murdoch of the moron set…
October 1st, 2007 at 1:45 pmI don’t put a dollar value on victory.
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 1:36 pm
But can you give us a definition of victory? Because I’m still kinda fuzzy on what you war hawks think it means.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:45 pmpodhoretz, that old whinger, is such a pussy. i heard him on talk of the nation (or was it on point) last wednesday and he refused to be on at the same time as general odom. he would have been shredded to bits.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:48 pmAm I a threat to you?
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 1:44 pm
Threat? bwahahahahaha
October 1st, 2007 at 1:48 pmYou are just a lame troll who cannot backup anything you say.
A really lame troll.
bigfoot: “I, alone, choose what I find important to respond to, and what I ignore, just as you do.”
Let me paraphrase that: You are too cowardly to respond to certain questions so you ignore them. Again, if you’re going to compare Iran to Nazi Germany, you need to be more specific. What exactly has Iran accomplished to this point which would cause you to compare it to Nazi Germany? Countries annexed? World-leading industry? Popular support? What?
October 1st, 2007 at 1:49 pmNo offense intended to the simple minded. The USA has no reason to bomb IRAN. The rest of the world is well on its way to doing it without us. And to those of you that think Iran ever liked the USA. Are you really that ignorant. I’m sure somewhere on the internet you can find a tape of the Iranian parliament chanting “Death to the USA†in unison. Nothing about Bush , just the USA.
I’m not really worried about Iran and the rest of the terrorist states, I live in the midwest. When they get the Bomb if they haven’t already got it I’m sure it will probabley be San Fransico or L.A. that they’ll use it on. I just hope I don’t get hit with the fallout.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:49 pmHey, Veritas…isn’t it interesting how Littlefoot will never dare to address me directly? Rather reminds me of another cowardly little troll we all know and loathe… ;)
October 1st, 2007 at 1:50 pmQUOTE: “if we allow Iranians to acquire nuclear capabilities, 50 years from now, people will look back at us the way we look back at Munich and say ‘how could they have let this happen?’”
If we allow Bush to selectivity invade Iran ( versus the other countries who have nukes, NK, Paki, India) 50 years from now the world will look at us and ask us “how could we let this happen?”
Americans are watching the implosion of its own empire. And we are responsible because not enough people are willing to get involved to make a difference. It’s that simple.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:50 pmBigfoot: “Am I a threat to you?”
What a self-righteous fool. You’re an annoyance, nothing more.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:53 pmWhy do the neoconjobbers still seem to think of the fantasy that attacking a country will make them stand down??????
They don’t, rather they become emboldened.
Bomb Iraq? That is nuts.
That will increase any kind of support of the insurgency in Iraq (if they really are) and Iranian troops would possibly cross borders.
I guess Pud-hurts forgot about the ten year Iran/Iraq (we backed Saadam then) war or is it just senility.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:56 pmEvery dollar I get to keep of my own hard earned pay is freedom won. You may not care, and in that event, feel free to send your extra tax refund back to the IRS. What dollar value do you place on your freedom, bilbo?
Unlike you, I won’t put a dollar value on freedom. But it is something I will work very hard too keep. And I don’t believe that killing millions of people in the middle east ensures my freedom.
I didn’t get enough of a break on my taxes to really notice, as I expect is the same with you. On the other hand, I do expect a “kicker” refund on my taxes in Oregon and I plan on signing that check over to the local elementary school. Oregon is stupid in that instead of saving for a rainy day, they kick back a percentage of taxes to their citizens. That means we rarely have enough money to do the things we need to do to keep our state functioning well in lean times.
And as for the loans from China? I honestly don’t care. The United States has been in debt before, it will be in debt again. China cannot afford to call in the loans prematurely, as their economy is nearly entirely dependent upon ours. We will pay the loans back, just as we always have. What price is your freedom worth, bilbo? I don’t put a dollar value on victory.
If you don’t care about our loans to China then I expect that you have no children or grandchildren because they are the ones who will inherit this great debt. And don’t be too confident about China not calling in our debts. Having us owing them the amount we do gives China the ability to dictate to our government. I wouldn’t be surprised if that doesn’t start happening soon.
OBigFootInMouth – you are truly the most stupid, evil and immoral individual that posts to this blog. Well…maybe you are in a tie with Jake the Flake, but since you are probably both persona’s, you can keep the prize.
October 1st, 2007 at 1:56 pmLittlefoot sez:
Rather reminds me of that great line from Casablanca:
October 1st, 2007 at 1:59 pm
Bigfoot is a typical member of the dwindling group of authoritarian personalities (or cultists) who simply repeat talking points offered to them by their ideological masters. He says something like Iran = Germany, 2007, but can’t really back the statement up with a cogent argument because he hasn’t really thought through the argument. He’s simply repeating something he heard on FOX or saw in a conservative blog. It’s very similar to the “Saddam is Hitler” nonsense we heard a few years ago. At a time when many of us are watching “The War” by Ken Burns, these arguments are even more absurd. Bigfoot has obviously never really studied WWII. He has no respect for the sacrifice Americans and their allies made to fight the Nazis and the Imperial Japanese because he denegrates their achievement by comparing their foe to a small-time, emerging nation with no real industrial or military power. I’ve known quite a few family members and friends who fought in WWII in my life and not one of them would even be able to fathom the idea that somebody could compare Iraq or Iran to Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan. They would think you were crazy if you tried to make the comparison.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:02 pmNo offense intended to the simple minded. The USA has no reason to bomb IRAN. The rest of the world is well on its way to doing it without us. And to those of you that think Iran ever liked the USA. Are you really that ignorant. I’m sure somewhere on the internet you can find a tape of the Iranian parliament chanting “Death to the USA†in unison. Nothing about Bush , just the USA. Comment by chriswyse
No, but I clearly remember footage of the citizens of Iran lighting candles and holding vigils in support of the USA after 911. Did you forget that? But, that was before Bush decided to include Iran in his “axis of evil”. Any good will they felt towards our country is rapidly dwindling because of the saber rattling being done by the Bush Crime Family.
For the life of me I can’t figure out what Bush hopes to gain by bombing Iran. Does he really think that they will sit idly by and watch us bomb their country. Does he really think that after he bombs them they will say “ok master, I learned my lesson and now I will do what you want me to do”? The only thing he will do by bombing Iran is to start World War III and quite likely get a lot more Americans killed, all in the name of what? For what?
October 1st, 2007 at 2:04 pmI’m just a guy with a different opinion than yours…nothing more, nothing less.
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 2:00 pm
You are just a lame troll who tries to pass off crap as fact, then refuses to back up any statement you make.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:04 pmNothing more, nothing less.
Having faith in the military is one thing. Having faith in the leaders that direct the military is another.
Mr. Bigfoot, you’ve found solice in your ignorance. The questions I asked are the ones that this president needs to answer. You can’t face them because they go against the mantra you’ve been fed. Your answer means nothing. I didn’t expect you to man up and address them.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:05 pmI’m just a guy with a different opinion than yours…nothing more, nothing less.
Or, I could be Karl Rove.
Comment by O. Bigfoot
No, you are simply a stupid, evil and immoral fool. And there’s no way you are Karl Rove, you aren’t near smart enough. You are a right wing tool with a basket full of Right Wing Loon talking points, no more and no less.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:07 pmBigfoot: “I’m just a guy with a different opinion than yours…nothing more, nothing less.”
Right. Your opinion is that Iran today is like Nazi Germany in the ’30s. I’m saying that is an uninformed, ignorant and non-defensible position. I’m saying you are simply repeating something you heard from someone like Podhoretz and you really don’t know anything about WWII or Nazi Germany in the 30’s.
Now, it’s up to you to expand on your meta-argument. If you are right, you should be able to point to countries Iran has attacked and annexed. You should be able to show threatening industrial and military power similar to the threat Germany showed the world in the 30’s. That’s how it works, Bigfoot. You make a blanket statement. Someone asks you to back it up with facts or a cogent argument. If you can’t do that, then your original statement was just a bunch of gas. LET’S HAVE IT! EXPLAIN TO ALL OF US WHY YOU THINK IRAN TODAY IS LIKE GERMANY IN THE 30′S!
October 1st, 2007 at 2:10 pmBelieve it or not, I was once a liberal. Then I got a job and had to pay bills. Comment by O. Bigfoot
Liberal has nothing to do with working, it has to do with freedom. I think you got a AM radio and started listening to Limbaughs idiocy.
But, Hrrrr, wtf? You got a job and now your for perpetual pre-emptive war? WOW, I have had a lot of jobs and never was that a deciding factor on war.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:11 pmBigfoot: “I’m just a guy with a different opinion than yours…nothing more, nothing less.†Big (o)
Well, when you start parroting the pundit talking points and throwing the word liberal around, like a drug addicted pundit, I have to wonder.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:13 pmBut, Hrrrr, wtf? You got a job and now your for perpetual pre-emptive war? WOW, I have had a lot of jobs and never was that a deciding factor on war.
Comment by Xisithrus — October 1, 2007 @ 2:11 pm
Maybe he now works at Halliburton…
October 1st, 2007 at 2:14 pmbilbo: “For the life of me I can’t figure out what Bush hopes to gain by bombing Iran.”
As with everything this guy does, it’s domestic politics and domestic political power. A war with Iran is the only way he and his political handlers see that can possibly avert a Democratic landslide next year that puts his party out to pasture for a generation.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:14 pmMr. Bigfoot has no statement of fact. He has no verifiable evidence of anything. I’m done with the little footprint.
Now with the subject of this thread. None of the supporters of Bush mentioned above offer any insight to the “evidence” needed to justly attack Iran. None of them detail the logistics needed to properly execute such an undertaking.
They are simply pushing fear.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:15 pmOr, I could be Karl Rove.
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 2:00 pm
And you think that’s scary. The only thing Rove is a threat to is the facts, but you don’t seem concerned with those anyway..
October 1st, 2007 at 2:15 pmComment by Ret. Col. Jack Ripper — October 1, 2007 @ 2:14 pm
Bingo! Bush is playing politics with yet another country and countless lives on all sides.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:16 pmThe fact that you ignore or refuse to accept the points I make, and refuse to acknowledge the “back up†I do provide, is your right, and your problem. It does not automatically negate what I choose to believe, however.
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 2:10 pm
Your “backup” must have been in that secret invisible post you made. Gotten from that invisible history book you have been reading.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:17 pmBigfoot: “The fact that you ignore or refuse to accept the points I make, and refuse to acknowledge the “back up†I do provide, is your right, and your problem.”
This from a guy who refuses to explain why and on what basis he compares Iran to ’30s Germany. Where is this “back up” you speak of. All I see so far is bullshite.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:17 pmThe fact that you ignore or refuse to accept the points I make, and refuse to acknowledge the “back up†I do provide, is your right, and your problem. It does not automatically negate what I choose to believe, however.
Don’t worry so much about lil’ ole’ me.
Comment by O. Bigfoot
We ignore the points you make because they are nothing more than Right Wing Loon talking points. And please point out anywhere that you back up your contentions. Your “backup” is just another stupid remark coming out of your ass. If you can backup what you are saying, you should be able to link to a reputable news source (no right wing talking head sites or Faux Noise). Thus far, I have never seen you back up anything you have said. And why is that? Because you can’t.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:19 pmNo, I find solace in the fact that we are basically a moral nation, and do things for noble purposes.
hahahahahaha. LMAO!!!!
Yeah, countries are moral agents…
Comedy gold!!
October 1st, 2007 at 2:21 pmNo, I find solace in the fact that we are basically a moral nation, and do things for noble purposes. We are by no means perfect. We make mistakes, and then do our best to correct them.
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 2:17 pm
Ah, the nobility of using white phosphorus to incinerate blocks and blocks of iraqis. And the morality of getting rid of Habeas Corpus whenever the President feels like it.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:21 pmThis from a guy who refuses to explain why and on what basis he compares Iran to ’30s Germany. -RCJR
It goes back to a guy named Al Banna who founded the Muslim brotherhood, but he was Egyptian, not Iranian, but supposedly sided with Hitler and became an intelligence arm for the Germans back then.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:23 pmBigfoot: “No, I find solace in the fact that we are basically a moral nation, and do things for noble purposes.”
OK, there’s another blanket statement. Can you give us some examples of how we are “basically a moral nation?” What do you mean by that statement? Native Americans might disagree. African Americans, the desendants of former slaves, might disagree. Southeast Asians might disagree. Mexicans might disagree. Americans stuck in poverty with no health insurance or access to affordable healthcare might disagree. Residents of Nagasaki and Hiroshima might disagree that we are a “moral nation.”
Go ahead. You made the statement. Provide your “back up.”
October 1st, 2007 at 2:24 pmif only you guys were as POd and aggressive towards the dems who empower bush as you are towards bigfoot things might be different.
Comment by Vendetta — October 1, 2007 @ 2:22 pm
See post #50 and try again, Lamer
October 1st, 2007 at 2:24 pmNo, but I clearly remember footage of the citizens of Iran lighting candles and holding vigils in support of the USA after 911. Did you forget that?
Comment by bilbobaggins
But even if it wasnt the case, it doesnt matter!!!
You cant kill people just because they supposedly danced on the streets rejoicing on your pain!!!
MY god, where have we gone?
October 1st, 2007 at 2:25 pmNo, I find solace in the fact that we are basically a moral nation, and do things for noble purposes. -Big (O)
Noble lies are still lies. Calling them noble doesn’t make them moral.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:25 pmNo, but I clearly remember footage of the citizens of Iran lighting candles and holding vigils in support of the USA after 911. Did you forget that?
Comment by bilbobaggins
Sadly, we had the world on our side, against Al Qaeda, and Bush squandered it when he invaded Iraq over lies.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:28 pmand do things for noble purposes
Oh, Im still laughing with this one.
Yeah, you took Cuba in 1898 from Spain to help Cubans…yep.
You took Hawaii to help Hawaiians.
You took Puerto Rico to help Puerto Ricans.
You took Panama to help Panamanians.
You killed thousands of peasants in Nicaragua to help Nicaraguans.
You killed thousands of Guatemalans to help Guatemalans (huh?)
You killed millions of Vietnamese to help them.
You supported Taliban against Russians to help Afghanese people. (Although the orders were: kill all soviets!)
You supported Fatah to help Palestinians and when they democratically elected Hamas, you just dont like it. Hehehehe.
Yeah, so noble… I bet Queen Victory was saying the same thing when she was the greatest drug dealer of all times killing and enslaving millions of Chinese.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:30 pmbilbo: “For the life of me I can’t figure out what Bush hopes to gain by bombing Iran.â€
As with everything this guy does, it’s domestic politics and domestic political power. A war with Iran is the only way he and his political handlers see that can possibly avert a Democratic landslide next year that puts his party out to pasture for a generation.
Comment by Ret. Col. Jack Ripper — October 1, 2007 @ 2:14 pm
I am intrigued by this comment, Colonel. Could you explain your thinking?
I must point out that Hillary, the presumptimve Dem nominee, signed Kyl-Lieberman last week….
October 1st, 2007 at 2:30 pmVendetta: “What good is having a dem majority if they give Bush everything the republicans would anyway?”
Firstly, they don’t give him everything he wants. He certainly hasn’t wanted these investigations into his lawless unconstitutional behavior. He didn’t agree with their putting the 9-11 commission suggestions into law. And, he has vetoed or threatened to veto many other legislative actions they’ve taken or will take.
Secondly, I would think that for those of us who missed civics class, this has been instructive. A simple majority will not get it done in the Senate if the minority party will not cooperate in any way and is intent on obstruction.
Here’s a promise from a life-long Democrat who has taken great pains around here to defend Democrats: if Dems get supermajorities in both houses and a Dem president next year and then DON’T push though a broad range of new progressive policies, I will, after 40 years, quit the party.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:31 pmWhy not just be even SMARTER than the neocons… lets kill ALL non-Americans… after all … 1000 years from now our future Americans might look back and say, “See! The world eventually ganged up against us… We should have killed them all before they could fight back!”
Don’t we have enough nukes to make this happen? For the children of tomarrow?
October 1st, 2007 at 2:32 pmHere’s a promise from a life-long Democrat who has taken great pains around here to defend Democrats: if Dems get supermajorities in both houses and a Dem president next year and then DON’T push though a broad range of new progressive policies, I will, after 40 years, quit the party.
Comment by Ret. Col. Jack Ripper — October 1, 2007 @ 2:31 pm
First they must repeal the laws that have crapped on the Constitution and get us out of Iraq.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:35 pm“Could you explain your thinking?”
Sure. I suspect that Republicans feel that the more fear they can spread in the voting population, the better chances are that people will vote for Republicans. War has a way of dumbing the population down with fear. It worked for them in the 2002 and 04 elections and they think maybe they can throw a “hail Mary” with an attack on Iran for the 08 election.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:36 pmI, alone, choose what I find important to respond to, and what I ignore, just as you do.
Comment by O. Bigfoot — October 1, 2007 @ 1:25 pm
Translation: I can’t handle good ol’ honest debate.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:41 pmIt worked for them in the 2002 and 04 elections and they think maybe they can throw a “hail Mary†with an attack on Iran for the 08 election.
Comment by Ret. Col. Jack Ripper — October 1, 2007 @ 2:36 pm
I kinda figured that was your drift. Who knows, you could be right. I guess it all depends on what you think really goes on in Bush’s head. Everyone wants to paint him as a total idiot, and I think that is not accurate. They also want to paint him as Steaming Evil, which I also think is a mischaracterization.
But more to my point, since 25+ Democrats and Hillary voted for Kyl-Lieberman, how does bombing Iran solely benefit the Repubs? At least half your Senatorial delegation is on board, apparently. Are they just cynically going along to reap the benefits of a fear stricken populace – as you say Bush is – or are they true believers?
October 1st, 2007 at 2:44 pmFor the life of me I can’t figure out what Bush hopes to gain by bombing Iran.
Comment by bilbobaggins — October 1, 2007 @ 2:04 pm
Why, he wants to submit thousands of Iraqis and Americans to their deaths now, so that we don’t have to go through it in the future.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:44 pmOh, and your two big freedoms are a joke. The first one affects an extremely small percentage of Americans. Besides, how does it improve their lives on a daily basis? Or do you deem this question “not important” and thus refuse to answer it?
October 1st, 2007 at 2:48 pmbigfoot? bigfoot from B4B? what are you doing over here playing with rational adults?
October 1st, 2007 at 2:49 pmYou were right, hellinabucket…it is not worth it.
October 1st, 2007 at 2:56 pmBigfoot: “Easy. Both Germany and Japan were not considered world powers in 1930.”
God, that is so weasily. We’re not talking about 1930. By the mid-30’s, they had a world-class manufacturing industry. By ‘38, when conservatives were still arguing AGAINST doing anything, they had annexed a number of European countries. And they made no secret about preparing for war as you claim. Their invasion of Poland was in all the papers. Everyone knew what they were doing in Europe. His book was widely published. And, you’re completely wrong about Japan. They had the most formidable Navy in the world. They had already taken over most of Asia by force years before they attacked us. I don’t know what history books you’ve been reading. My suggestion is simply to watch Ken Burns’ “The War.”
October 1st, 2007 at 3:00 pmBigfoot is typical of the right wingers endlessly flinging their talking points as if they had some basis in reality with out the proof necessary to back them up. Sadly he and his cohorts are ramping up their justification for bombing yet another country posing no threat to the US. They ramp it up with no acknowledgement of the true nature of the powers that the president of Iran truly has. Pretty much his rhetoric is all he has, that and the support of the people. Outside of that the power in Iran lays with the Clerics, they and they alone have the power in the country. Of course one would not expect the 29% die hard club to understand this, as 7 years ago they marketed a man with zero real governing experience to be president. I say zero real governing experience because most people don’t know that the governor of Texas has about as much real power as the head of the DMV does. He has no power to appoint people to positions, no power to introduce legislation etc… yet they touted him as a big-state governor, when Texas is probably the only state he could have governed. Now we have them using this lack of knowledge of the powers of the president of Iran in a similar manner…i.e. they promote his powers far beyond what they really are and in this case they sell him as a danger to us all.
Bog foot also forgot some of the new freedoms introduced…the freedom to invade any country we please under the guise of 911. The freedom to ignore treaties and long standing legal traditions (Scalito has actually said that he did not believe in following prior precedent). The freedom to torture. The freedom to rob others of their rights while shamelessly claiming that no rights were removed.
If the Neocons are eventually called on the carpet and made to pay for their crimes, where will they flee to? The Germans fled to Brazil and Argentina, one would assume that the neo’s would go to Israel, but that is a little too close to real death and danger. My guess would be hidden on the ranch, after all who doesn’t like an invite to the ranch?
October 1st, 2007 at 3:06 pmWe’re not talking about 1930. By the mid-30’s, they had a world-class manufacturing industry.
Ret. Col: Maybe Bigfoot is right. Stukas and MGs were given by aliens to those 10th century sword-waving peasants and Germanic tribes.
October 1st, 2007 at 3:10 pmI’m all for the Col.’s debate with the largehoof. I don’t have the knowledge base that Col. Jack Ripper has. I learn so much more when there are posters like him.
I’m sure I’ll address bigfoot again. Another thread, another day. He brings nothing to this one.
October 1st, 2007 at 3:10 pmYep – the propaganda effort is in full swing. After I watched this special segment on FOX News over the weekend I pretty much knew that we will/are going to war with Iran. Pretty F*cking Frightening if you ask me…
Preview – Iran: The Ticking Bomb
http://beta.redlasso.com/Community/ClipPlayer.aspx?i=d339823c-4fb8-4dbb-bb0d-24377bbf2a61
Iran: The Ticking Bomb pt 1
http://beta.redlasso.com/Community/ClipPlayer.aspx?i=95a410d3-da38-4a84-9aeb-25cc9977d5ec
Iran: The Ticking Bomb pt 2
http://beta.redlasso.com/Community/ClipPlayer.aspx?i=9b9a26b1-b316-4c1a-955c-48a1b3af47a9
Iran: The Ticking Bomb pt 3
http://beta.redlasso.com/Community/ClipPlayer.aspx?i=702cf5a5-9945-41b5-a6ca-89fb1a49a21a
Iran: The Ticking Bomb pt 4
October 1st, 2007 at 3:22 pmhttp://beta.redlasso.com/Community/ClipPlayer.aspx?i=292c6dbd-4e2c-4dfd-8a5d-fe80c19eb6fd
Wow, Mr. Bigmouth, I thought neanderthals died out ages ago. You are proof that idiots still live amoung us, for you are the enemy, with your disimformation and propaganda. Sure glad you don’t live next to me. You’re insane.
Buck Fush
October 1st, 2007 at 3:31 pmAha! Swing shift at McDonald’s starts at 4:00 p.m.
October 1st, 2007 at 4:24 pmGimme some more of that Kool-Aide please!!!
Yippee…I have an image of the farmhard – no ranch hand – no brush-clearing-IQ-less-than-a-handball cowpoke riding the A-bomb down as in Dr. No….
Here we go fellars……YeeHaa…..
October 1st, 2007 at 5:26 pmOK, Bigfoot, all you are doing is providing links of varying degree of authenticity which make claims about Iran’s military capability.
From your Milnet link: “”Iran is now the only regional military power that poses a significant conventional military threat to Gulf stability.”
From your Abu Dubae link: “Iran has made big strides in building a military missile capability and is in the process of producing a long-range rocket that could fly as far as 5,000km.”
This in no way answers my basic question to you about your comparison of Iran to Nazi Germany. In addition, even if I were to accept the information in these links carte blanche, your basic premise is that because they have capability, we should attack them.
His is an historically indefensible argument. We went for over 40 years with the Soviet Union having thousands of ICBM’s pointed at our own cities. One of their premiers said “we will bury you.”
We didn’t attack the Soviet Union. The cold war ended through economic pressure and diplomacy.
October 1st, 2007 at 6:52 pmBush will do it, its a done deal. They’ve already figured out that they will go down in flames, so why not leave the worst possible situation for whatever administration comes in and has to clean up their mess?
It very well may be WWIII and, in a way, I hope so because it is the only way that the revolution that must take place in order for the USA to survive will ever take place.
I left America 10 years ago because I could not bear the loss of freedom that had already taken place at that time. I’m sure that now it is 10x worse.
Don’t blame it on me, I saw it coming and I have NEVER voted for anybody that won. Hell, I’d vote for the Communists if that was the only remaining choice!
See y’all after the war!
October 1st, 2007 at 8:45 pmComment by Ret. Col. Jack Ripper — October 1, 2007 @ 6:52 pm
I’ve asked him and others to equate the issues raised by the MoveOn ad to calling Patraeus a traitor, and O.B. (hey…isn’t that a brand of tampon?) has declined every time. Good luck.
October 1st, 2007 at 11:25 pmI seldom comment at this site, but I have to say I’m amazed at the time and effort expended in replying to O.hoofin mouth. This entity can’t spell, has no sense of English language syntax or proper sentence constuction , yet you folks spend hours trying to argue with someone whose (lack of) mind is already made up.
Like arguing with drying paint.
October 2nd, 2007 at 3:58 amHe likes commas, though.
October 2nd, 2007 at 4:00 amBigfoot, by your “logic”, why arent we attacking North Korea? They almost certainly actually have nukes. Arent they the more “imminent” threat?
Shouldnt we go after them first? The smoking gun is already a mushroom cloud you know?
You can ramble on about mistranslated statements from Iranian figureheads all you want, the fact remains, we’ve seen much more bellicose stuff come out of North Korea who is actually a equally, if not more potent force. Yet you seem to have focused in on Iran just like your heroes are.
You dont seem to mind Saudi Arabia arming Iraqi insurgents…..in fact… we’re not only not bombing saudi arabia, but we’re selling them weapons.. doesnt seem like a very consistent thing to do, seems to me like we’re rewarding the fact SA is funding terrorists and throwing government sanctioned telethons for the terrorists in Palestine as well. Oh let me guess.. they like us and sell us oil, so we turn a blind eye to their terrorists transgressions, right?.
And do you understand that Nuclear weapons have changed the balance of everyting? Do you understand that the Iranian government does not want to bring about a nuclear holocaust by trying to “wipe israel off the map”… do you have any evidence that these guys running the show in Iran have suicidal ambitions?
Do you understand that Iran has never expressed any interest or intent on invading anyone? Do you have any evidence that Iran has ever expressed interest in invading anyone? Do you know that Iran has more jews than ANY middle eastern country other than Turkey? Do you understand that Zionism (which Iranians dont like) is not the equivalent of Judaism?
Christ, why am I even wasting my time.
You dont know the difference between “accoutant” and “accountability”.
You make knee jerk arguments based on not knowing the difference .
You show us articles claiming abramhoff is “directing” money to dems but then refuse to back it up with a single specific number going from Abramhoff to a dem.
Please explain, for us dullards,
1) exactly what distinguises Iran from other regimes that dont like us ,
(and please please dont use the “wiped off the map thing”, because is a mistranslation, and if you dispute that, please tell the words he spoke, in his brown man language and translate into “wiped off the map” for us)
2) which militaries you think are inferior to Iran? the UNited States? Israels?
3) How you think Iran could develop a military that could conceivable ever threaten us?
4) How to distinguish Iran as a unique threat that should be dealt with while others should not. I havent seen you beating your chest for us to bomb North Korea, even though they’ve been thumbiing thier nose at us and developing nukes under our nose. Strange coincidence, you hero dumya aint either. Please explain why Iran is comparable to Germany, but North Korea is not. North Korea is a dictatorship, with a history of invading its neighbors and run by a singul omnipotent despot, much like Germany was. Iran has NEVER since the birth of christ invaded its neighbors, its not run by a dictator (but we dont expect idiots who dont understand the difference between accoutant and accountability to be able to fathom than the short little man talking smack at the UN isnt the one calling the shots in Iran), and its military is nothing compared to either americas or to the nuclear capacity of Israel.
Can you please give us some more of your brilliant articles comparing and contrasting WW II Germany with both Iran and North Korea, that explain why North Korea is not like Germany but Iran is?
5) If democracy in the middle east is such a good thing, please explain why we initiated hositilities with iran years ago by overthrowing their democratically elected government and installing a dictator? I thought dictators were bad..
6) What, exactly, do you propose we do with Iran after we bomb it? Give it “democracy” like in IRaq? And if Syria tries to get involved in the Iranians “democratic” process, we bomb them to, right?
October 2nd, 2007 at 8:14 amComment by Chocolate Jesus — October 2, 2007 @ 8:14 am
Good post…I gave it a “recommend.”
October 2nd, 2007 at 10:50 am