Bush warns of World War III with Iran.
By on Oct 17th, 2007 at 4:20 pm
Bush warns of World War III with Iran.
Asked about Iran’s nuclear ambitions at his press conference today, President Bush warned for the first time in public of the risk of “World War III” if Iran gets nuclear weapons. “I’ve told people that if you’re interested in avoiding World War III,” said the President. “It seems like you ought to be interested in preventing them from have the knowledge necessary to make a nuclear weapon.” TPM has the video and Matthew Yglesias parses Bush’s words.
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uh-oh!
October 17th, 2007 at 4:21 pmhe's trying to be relevant again.
this time, you beat me to it
October 17th, 2007 at 4:23 pmThe best way to avoid WWIII would be to impeach this moron and get his finger as far away from 'the button' as possible. The rest of the world must think we are all INSANE!
October 17th, 2007 at 4:24 pm.....she said with a gleam in her eye
October 17th, 2007 at 4:25 pmWell since Palosi has "assumed the position for bush" we are screwed....Any doubt.?...Blessings
October 17th, 2007 at 4:27 pmBush’s remarks today continue the White House’s propaganda campaign for military action against Iran, a campaign that dates back almost six years—to Bush’s 2002 State of the Union address in which he designated Iran as a founding member of the “axis of evil.†Now, with the Bush administration approaching its final year in office, a renewed push and a shorter fuse are increasingly evident. My 3-minute YouTube video entitled “Forewarned Is Forearmed: Bush On Iran†is available HERE. It offers a very brief but troubling chronicle of the president’s public warmongering and demonization of Iran. As has been said before, “the hour is getting late.â€
October 17th, 2007 at 4:29 pmPresident Bush warned for the first time in public of the risk of “World War III†if Iran gets nuclear weapons. “I’ve told people that if you’re interested in avoiding World War III,†said the President. “It seems like you ought to be interested in preventing them from have the knowledge necessary to make a nuclear weapon.â€
Well , based upon all the overwhelming successess in both Iraq and Afghanistan , and you being proven so astute and accurate about everything you claimed Iraq/Saddam possessed or were up to , I'd have to say ..................................
Shut the hell up , you retarded simian .......................
October 17th, 2007 at 4:30 pmI was surprised when I saw the title on this TP item -- I thought Bush was warning about starting WWIII if we invaded Iran. And that would have shocked me if he had said anything that insightful.
But no -- it's just the SOS. He wants us to believe that if Iran gets nuclear (pardon me -- nukewlar) weapons, we are all dead.
Russia has nukes, China has nukes, France has nukes, India and Pakistan have nukes, Israel has nukes, North Korea has nukes -- why isn't WWIII starting as a result of any of these countries having nukes?
Even if Iran does get a nuclear weapon, how could they possibly use it? No matter who they fire it at, they will be toast shortly thereafter, and surely they're smart enough to know that.
It's just more of the "be very afraid" crapola we always get. It's just turned into a faint buzzing sound -- which is not good, since if there's ever a REAL threat to our country, we probably won't be paying attention.
October 17th, 2007 at 4:30 pmSo to avoid WWIII we should start it.
It's just dumb enough to work.
October 17th, 2007 at 4:34 pmWe all just better assume we're going to war with Iran and plan accordingly. If we don't, then it will be a pleasant surprise, but I doubt we're going to get that lucky.
October 17th, 2007 at 4:34 pmWell WWIII was a clash of major global powers pitted against each other. What first world power would side up against us if this were to happen? This comparison is just stupid! Bush must be on the sauce and drugs again, his comments are getting more and more insane by the day!
October 17th, 2007 at 4:36 pmrepublicans hate facts
Well WWIII was a clash of major global powers pitted against each other. What first world power would side up against us if this were to happen?
As far as major powers go, potentially Russia and China. However 'First world' generally relates to America and it's allies in the cold war, most of which I assume would stay neutral, at least for the start of it.
October 17th, 2007 at 4:38 pmI suspect that Randi Rhodes was attacked by minorities and was paid hush money to say that she “fell downâ€.
October 17th, 2007 at 4:38 pmSo to avoid WWIII we should start it.
It’s just dumb enough to work.
Comment by Squegeeboo — October 17, 2007 @ 4:34 pm
Like Iraq ?
October 17th, 2007 at 4:38 pmAs far as major powers go, potentially Russia and China. However ‘First world’ generally relates to America and it’s allies in the cold war, most of which I assume would stay neutral, at least for the start of it. Comment by Squegeeboo — October 17, 2007 @ 4:38 pm
If Iran uses Nuclear weapons, do you really believe that Russia and China would leap to their defense? You people are insane!
October 17th, 2007 at 4:39 pmnow it's the "knowledge" that we must fight and kill over.
October 17th, 2007 at 4:40 pmreally? i hate to say it i believe iran over terrorist bush
October 17th, 2007 at 4:41 pmrepublicans hate facts
If Iran uses Nuclear weapons
Wait, 'uses'? I thought this was if Iran 'has' nuclear weapons, or potentially, if we decide to invade to stop them from getting to the 'has' stage.
You people are insane!
I prefer eccentric.
MCMetal
Like Iraq ?
Exactly. It's worked so well, why not go for it again.
October 17th, 2007 at 4:43 pmMissMolly:
You neglected to mention one particular country with the most unstable, incompetent, warmongering leadership in the world, who has in the last 4 1/2 years, invaded two countries, threatened many more with invasion and/or anihillation, has destabilized an entire region of the world, one critical to the energy needs of the world, is threating a resurgent Russia, etc., etc., etc. I'm of course referring to the good ol' Newnited States of Amurika, led by that paragon of Crusader Christian fervence, G.W. Bush. A real mensch! Thoughtful and judicious in his every decision..... NOT!
October 17th, 2007 at 4:45 pmThis ignorant, arrogent, drunk, druggie maniac is going to drive us all as insane as he is before we get his sorry ass and his evil handler out of office......Thank's for nothing Palosi.....Make her listen, do what I do, write her every day and demand impeachment be put back on the table...Even putting up with her for a few month's would be better than this...Once these guy's get out of office we can't touch them, they have written into the patriot act provision's that protect them from being prosacuted...Blessings
October 17th, 2007 at 4:46 pmPutin was in Tehran shaking hands with Ahmedinejad. The Russian president warned America to not attack Iran.
Remember Einstein's famous quote.." I don't know what weapons the next World War will be fought with, but the one after that will be fought with sticks and stones."
October 17th, 2007 at 4:47 pmThis guy is terrifying. Are there ANY rational, perpendicular adults in the White House?
October 17th, 2007 at 4:47 pmMCMetal
Like Iraq ?
Exactly. It’s worked so well, why not go for it again.
Comment by Squegeeboo — October 17, 2007 @ 4:43 pm
Because it hasn't worked on any level ............Regardless of what the White House , the horseshit GOP , and the imbecilic 24%'ers claim.
October 17th, 2007 at 4:49 pmIf we're interesting in preventing World War III, deep-six this administration right now. These people, and the neocons behind them who drive the whole Pax Americana idea, are far more dangerous to the American people right now than any foreign leader...including those who actually CAN reach us with nuclear-tipped missiles right now...Russia and China.
October 17th, 2007 at 4:49 pmI'll tell you who isn't relevant anymore, even if they were at one time: Condi Rice.
October 17th, 2007 at 4:49 pm'... so, in his newest policy initiative, Bush today announced his new 'War on Knowlegde'. Pundits counter that it is inaccurate to say this is a actually a new initiative. His supporters said he was uniquely qualified for this campaign, having shown himself utterly immune ...'
/sarc off
October 17th, 2007 at 4:50 pmAnd this is helping us catch the guys behind 9/11........how?
October 17th, 2007 at 4:50 pmI'd hate to think that we waited for a 'smoking gun' to prove this idiot is a warmonger and insane...
Weren't we into WW4 at this point? or was it 5? I keep getting confused by the historical revisionism...
October 17th, 2007 at 4:52 pmSo this chickenhawk is talking of WWIII while he and his family will be living in an underground bunker while it all goes down.
October 17th, 2007 at 4:52 pmMCMetal
Because it hasn’t worked on any level …………Regardless of what the White House , the horseshit GOP , and the imbecilic 24%’ers claim.
But they're attacking us over there instead of over here. That means it is working. Or at least that's how Boortz explained it to me, and he's never steered me wrong before.
October 17th, 2007 at 4:53 pmRemember Einstein’s famous quote..†I don’t know what weapons the next World War will be fought with, but the one after that will be fought with sticks and stones.â€
Comment by Badger — October 17, 2007 @ 4:47 pm
Here is another famous quote, one we seem to have forgot...
"Naturally the common people don't want war; neither in Russia, nor in England, nor in America, nor in Germany. That is understood. But after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine policy, and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. ...Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country." -- Hermann Goring
They who do not learn from the past..........
October 17th, 2007 at 4:54 pm"I'm looking forward to the next 15 months." g.bush
October 17th, 2007 at 4:56 pm"I'm looking forward to the 16th month." The American People
Even if Iran does get a nuclear weapon, how could they possibly use it? No matter who they fire it at, they will be toast shortly thereafter, and surely they’re smart enough to know that.
Ding Ding Ding, We have a winner!!!! MissMolly wins a prize to be named later and a chance to be swift boated by the right wing pundits who aren't capable of thinking this through.
I have said this for a long time. Any country, at this point in geopolitical time, would be signing their death warrant if they used a nuke on any other country. Do the war mongering right wingers believe the rest of the world would just sit and watch as Iran nuked the US? That's as idiotic as believing that "They" will come over "Here" if the US leaves Iraq. AAAAARRRRRRGGGGG
October 17th, 2007 at 4:57 pmDid he know that Putin's been palling around with the president of Iran and making plans to change the direction of the oil pipeline? Does Bush remember that Russia has nuclear weapons and now has a financial interest in Iran? As someone said in a previous comment, Bush is trying to sound relevant.
October 17th, 2007 at 4:59 pmIf you are interested in avoiding World War III ...
you freaking IMPEACH cheney&bush!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
October 17th, 2007 at 5:04 pmPutin and A'jad are united against the bully. This should be enough to tamp down his war drumbeat substantially; that is, if we were dealing with anyone but someone with a death wish. Unfortunately, this bully has to learn every lesson in life the hard way.
Putin will rally the rest of the world around this alliance and we will find ourselves "odd man out" soon, thanks to the "great divider" personified.
And if americans fail to see how toxic Bush has become to this country and will succeed in taking it down with him before he leaves office, then so be it.
Impeachment (immediately) is the ONLY card left in the hand of the people. He's destroyed the constitution and our rule of law, hijacked the democracy, and would win the contest for being "the most reviled man in this country" right now.
And we worried about senile Reagan with his hand on the trigger?? How about a sociopath whose finger's on that same trigger.
Boy, was this country shortchanged and totally duped by the Grand Ole' Perverts!
October 17th, 2007 at 5:06 pmThe GOP "deserves" to become the Third Party!
October 17th, 2007 at 5:08 pmNature Rules: If every superpower had nukes, it would become the "instant equalizer"! That's fact.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:09 pmIt is more likely that Bush will start WWIII by invading or bombing Iran. Most of our military know what the end result of that kind of action will be and I'm betting that they will commit insubordination if they are asked to start a bombing mission on Iran. Several Generals have already said that they would refuse to obey orders if they were asked to drop a nuclear bomb on Iran.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:09 pmInteresting. I thought WWIII already started.
(05-06-06) Bush likens 'war on terror' to WWIII: US President George W Bush has referred to the "war on terror" as "World War III" during a television interview. Mr Bush told the CNBC television network the revolt of passengers on the hijacked flight 93 on September 11, 2001, was the "first counter-attack to World War III". He said he agreed with the description by David Beamer, whose son Todd died in the crash, in a Wall Street Journal commentary last month the act was "our first successful counter-attack in our homeland in this new global war - World War III". Mr Bush said: "I believe that. I believe that it was the first counter-attack to World War III. Continued here...
October 17th, 2007 at 5:10 pmMCMetal
Because it hasn’t worked on any level …………Regardless of what the White House , the horseshit GOP , and the imbecilic 24%’ers claim.
But they’re attacking us over there instead of over here. That means it is working. Or at least that’s how Boortz explained it to me, and he’s never steered me wrong before.
Comment by Squegeeboo — October 17, 2007 @ 4:53 pm
So it's acceptable that Americans are attacked overseas as long as it's not over here (where you and Boortz-head can't see it)....
If a strategy was truly working , it would be no Americans getting attacked anywhere ; so obviously , it's not working and Boortz is wrong (no surprise there , except maybe from you , and no one gives damn there)
BTW Neil Boortz is an intellectually devoid , pompous and arrogant nitwit .........I wish I could buy him for what he's really worth , and then sell him for what he believes he's worth.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:12 pmThe GOP “deserves†to become the Third Party!
Comment by Veritas — October 17, 2007 @
The GOP deserves to no longer exist. Republicans have proved that they do no know how to govern.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:12 pmNOBODY will "destroy" Israel. NOBODY.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:13 pmGOD HIMSELF W-I-L-L intervene if someone tries. Look at Ezekiel 38 for more info...
Strange how no other country is allowed nuclear power except America. I suppose Bush will go after Britain now that lapdog Blair is gone. Yes, just America with Bush as the dictator, oh President.
Good Lord can we take up a collection to get Monica back once more? Here is my money.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:15 pmThank’s for nothing Palosi…..Make her listen, do what I do, write her every day and demand impeachment be put back on the table…Even putting up with her for a few month’s would be better than this…
I so agree. I do this every morning when I have my first Latte. It's strangely exhilarating.
http://www.speaker.gov/
Bookmark it. Every day when you sign on to your computer, make e-mailing Pelosi the first thing you do. Try it, you'll like it.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:15 pmThis guy is terrifying. Are there ANY rational, perpendicular adults in the White House?
Comment by john o. — October 17, 2007 @ 4:47 pm
No. Where have you been?
October 17th, 2007 at 5:15 pmThe reason that the USSR, now Russia, was smuggled the information about how to create a nuclear weapon was to keep the US from being the only nation with 'the bomb'. A nation with nuclear weapons will not be attacked with nuclear weapons. Busholini and his cabal want to keep nukes out of the hands of the Iranians because once Iran has 'the bomb', we will not be able to invade the country like we did Iraq. The US has not attacked North Korea, another member of the "Axis of Evil".
October 17th, 2007 at 5:17 pmWait a minute wasn't Putin the one Bush looked into his eyes and saw a good heart? Perhaps Putin is deciding which devil to pal up with.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:17 pmYathink we could chop off all his fingers, so he couldn't push the button?
October 17th, 2007 at 5:18 pmWW III, and that giant mushroom cloud if we didn't invade/occupy Iraq.
The only doom on the horizon is that we'll experience if the moron realizes his retarded ambitions.
Check out Walter Reed. Yeah, dubya. We see terror and we see tragedy . . . every time Americans bend over in fear of your paranoid, "God spoke to me" delusions.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:18 pmreally? i hate to say it i believe iran over terrorist bush
Comment by Fan of Man
So do I.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:19 pmAnd we worried about senile Reagan with his hand on the trigger?? How about a sociopath whose finger’s on that same trigger.
Boy, was this country shortchanged and totally duped by the Grand Ole’ Perverts!
Comment by Veritas
Good point. I worried about ole Ronnie, but I knew that Nancy was running the show and she seemed to have a pretty good head on her shoulders.
With the Sociopath Bush at the helm I go to bed every night not knowing if I will wake up to a true dictatorship or a still somewhat free America that is creeping closer and closer to a dictatorship every day.
Frankly I'm more worried we may nuke someone than I am worried that Iran may have a nuclear bomb in 10 years.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:20 pmThe Irony is... the single biggest factor pushing Iran to develop a nuclear weapon is the BUSH FOREIGN POLICY!!
October 17th, 2007 at 5:21 pm"Walk softly and carry a big stick."
Wise words.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:21 pmSo how in the world do WE THE PEOPLE get this impeachment going. Seriously, it has to happen now. Another year+ of Bush/Cheney is way too much. I have written my reps many, many times and each one says impeachment is not the way to go for the good of our country. I completely disagree. Since we can't get our elected "leaders" to solve this problem, how do we the citizens of this great country (no matter what Bush has done to us, the U.S. is still a great country) stop this insanity? It must be stopped right away. Bush/Cheney have put us in grave danger, and they continue to do so every day.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:21 pmNOBODY will “destroy†Israel. NOBODY.
GOD HIMSELF W-I-L-L intervene if someone tries. Look at Ezekiel 38 for more info…
Comment by KansasLiberal — October 17, 2007 @ 5:13 pmâ€
Why would the supposed superior being in the entire universe give a shit about land that is nothing more than sand and people who wear over-sized beanies on their heads that are missing their propellers while arrogantly referring to themselves as "God's chosen people" ?
Would "God's" actual "chosen people" really behave so arrogantly if they were his specifically selected ones ?
Better yet ; wouldn't "God's chosen people" be sent a damn map or a bird to follow to get the hell out of wandering around the desert in a circle for half a damn century ???????????
October 17th, 2007 at 5:26 pmSqueegee - WE attacked THEM first. Remember that?
The Iraqis had absolutely NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with 9/11 - no matter how many times the Busheviks repeat the lie.
Perhaps if our Dear Leader and his handlers weren't such a bunch of warmongering nincompoops, we wouldn't even have to discuss freaking WWIII.
Your buddy Boortz and all the rest of them are steering you - and the rest of us - right off a cliff. You'd do better to stop listening to them.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:27 pm“Walk softly and carry a big stick.â€
Wise words.
Comment by rockyroad
But you are only allowed to have the "big stick" if you are the USA or one of it's pre-approved allies. But since we no longer have any allies, I guess the only one that can have nukes is us.
If I was the President of Iran, I sure as hell would want something to protect me from Israel. The two top terrorist nations are 1) the USA and 2) Israel.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:28 pm“Walk softly and carry a big stick.â€
Wise words.
Comment by rockyroad — October 17, 2007 @ 5:21 pm
Too bad Shrub has 'refined' that saying to :
Walk awkwardly and carry a big stink ..........
October 17th, 2007 at 5:28 pmIf Bush was wiretapping American citizens before Sept. 11th without a warrant or an ok from the fisa court...that is a CRIME. The remedy for high CRIMES and misdemeanors is Impeachment.
Prove that that's what Bush was doing, and congress will have to bring impeachment charges.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:30 pmYour buddy Boortz and all the rest of them are steering you - and the rest of us - right off a cliff. You’d do better to stop listening to them.
Comment by Leftside Annie
It can't stop listening to people like Boortz. It needs someone to tell It what to think and how to act. It never developed a full sense of self so It is incapable of independent intelligent thought. There really is nothing gained by trying to reason with It because It's mind slams shut the minute conflicting data comes in contact with It.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:31 pmThank you, RemoveBush. I'm writing my state's AG today. Everyone should. This nonsense has to stop. Bush/Cheney have gone out of their way to make the people feel powerless. Let's regain our power now. This isn't about politicians, this is about the people and we owe not just our fellow countrymen, but we owe the world a concerted attempt by the people to get Bush/Cheney out of office. We must do our best. And we must do it NOW.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:35 pmIf Bush was wiretapping American citizens before Sept. 11th without a warrant or an ok from the fisa court…that is a CRIME. The remedy for high CRIMES and misdemeanors is Impeachment.
Prove that that’s what Bush was doing, and congress will have to bring impeachment charges.
Comment by Badger — October 17, 2007 @ 5:30 pm
It's not that simple when everyone involved is saying "Duh.. I dunno... I wasn't at that meeting... I don't recall."
Nobody can PROOVE anything with three or four underlings willing to fall on their swords for Bush (or marched off the plank by Cheney)
To quote someone who's name escapes me: What we know and what we can prove are two seperate things. The Reps are masters at misdirection and red herrings and generally mucking up the search for real truth.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:36 pmYathink we could chop off all his fingers, so he couldn’t push the button?
RUCerious, I like the way you're thinking!!
But we also need to keep the Chimp from opening his damn mouth. Either put Gannon's dck back in it, or duct tape a sock for the next 15 months
October 17th, 2007 at 5:39 pmThank you, RemoveBush. I’m writing my state’s AG today. Everyone should. This nonsense has to stop. Bush/Cheney have gone out of their way to make the people feel powerless. Let’s regain our power now. This isn’t about politicians, this is about the people and we owe not just our fellow countrymen, but we owe the world a concerted attempt by the people to get Bush/Cheney out of office. We must do our best. And we must do it NOW.
Comment by Tender Chicken — October 17, 2007 @ 5:35 pm
Except that in at least one state (VT) the representatives are afraid of impeaching Bush because they think he'll declare martial law and postpone the elections (and derail any investigation of him and his people) until they can hide the evidence... or as long as they can. Insta-Bush. It either needs to come from the Senate or he has to do something so blatantly illegal that the FBI can walk into the Whitehouse and arrest him.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:40 pmFrankly,
While I hardly support American policy towards Israel, Israel does a fairly good job, not domestically, but in its international defense of "walking softly and carrying a big stick."
It is answerable to no one, not even the US, its biggest funder. It has collected information that it shared with no one and discreetly set into motion targeted strikes that knocked out nuclear power facilities in both Iraq and Syria . . . little fan fare, no bloviating . . . just eliminate the problem and get out. . . . found no need to invade and occupy . . . just eliminate the harm and get out. 'Nuf said.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:42 pmCongress needs to give immunity to the telecoms for actions that took place before Sept. 11th. Bush has threatened to veto any Fisa bill without immunity for the telecoms....for national security reasons. There WERE no national security reasons before Sept. 11th...Bush knows it and fears immunity. Hopefully congress will have the spine to press this issue.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:43 pmFrankly,
While I hardly support American policy towards Israel, Israel does a fairly good job, not domestically, but in its international defense of “walking softly and carrying a big stick.â€
It is answerable to no one, not even the US, its biggest funder. It has collected information that it shared with no one and discreetly set into motion targeted strikes that knocked out nuclear power facilities in both Iraq and Syria . . . little fan fare, no bloviating . . . just eliminate the problem and get out. . . . found no need to invade and occupy . . . just eliminate the harm and get out. ‘Nuf said.
Comment by rockyroad — October 17, 2007 @ 5:42 pm
Without the US , Israel would be housing millions of dead Jewish bodies ; don't try and kid yourself otherwise of that...........
October 17th, 2007 at 5:46 pmHence , there is the biggest reason of Muslim animosity towards the US.
Without the US, Isreal wouldn't be housing anything. It wouldn't exist.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:50 pmWrong.
If we invade Iraq it could trigger WWIII, but that has nothing to do with any nuclear weaponry.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:50 pmBadger,
Eh? "Congress needs to give immunity to the telecoms"?
You're either out of your mind or on the wrong website.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:51 pmIke,
We ALREADY invaded Iraq and it had everything to do with alleged "nuclear weaponry."
October 17th, 2007 at 5:53 pmWe invaded Iraq??? Holy shit, when did this happen???
I meant Iran. Not sure why I said Iraq. This story is about Iran.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:56 pmCongress needs to give immunity to the telecoms for actions that took place before Sept. 11th. Bush has threatened to veto any Fisa bill without immunity for the telecoms….for national security reasons. There WERE no national security reasons before Sept. 11th…Bush knows it and fears immunity. Hopefully congress will have the spine to press this issue.
Comment by Badger — October 17, 2007 @ 5:43 pm
That makes no sense. Bush threatens to veto any FISA bill without immunity for the telcos. That part you got right. Why would he be fearing immunity if he wants congress to give him a bill with immunity in it? Why would we want to give immunity to the telco's; companies that SHOULD have known better than to trust the government on what is legal and what is illegal? Why should Bush care if the telco's get off or not? He wants to spy on American citizens... period. The issue of telco immunity just gives him a reason to veto the bill besides "I want to keep spying on you."
October 17th, 2007 at 5:57 pmIf the telecoms aided in an illegal wiretap, they are criminally liable too. Wouldn't granting them immunity allow them to testify without incriminating themselves??
I may be mixed up with this immunity thing..I'm obviously not a lawyer...but whatever allows the telecoms to testify about Bush Administration requests for data without a warrant that occured before Sept. 11th should be allowed in court.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:58 pmIf Bush was wiretapping American citizens before Sept. 11th without a warrant or an ok from the fisa court…that is a CRIME. The remedy for high CRIMES and misdemeanors is Impeachment.
Prove that that’s what Bush was doing, and congress will have to bring impeachment charges.
Comment by Badger — October 17, 2007 @ 5:30 pm
And this is precisely why immunity should NOT be given to telecoms because it will completely stop the pending lawsuits that have been filed against AT&T and others for this survellience. Without those lawsuits, we will never get the evidence that is needed.
October 17th, 2007 at 5:59 pmGranting immunity to the telcos is exactly like granting the fox immunity - when you can see chicken feathers around his mouth.
ITMFA!!!
October 17th, 2007 at 6:03 pmIf the telecoms aided in an illegal wiretap, they are criminally liable too. Wouldn’t granting them immunity allow them to testify without incriminating themselves??
I may be mixed up with this immunity thing..I’m obviously not a lawyer…but whatever allows the telecoms to testify about Bush Administration requests for data without a warrant that occured before Sept. 11th should be allowed in court.
Comment by Badger — October 17, 2007 @ 5:58 pm
The telco's can't give us anything if the Whitehouse waves "National Security" in our faces. Only Congress can override that with the courts. Besides, Bush has made no secret about wanting immunity for AT&T and the others, so he obviously thinks they can't hurt him, and I certainly don't want to send a message to other companies saying "Just comply and then IF the program blows up in your face say "I didn't know it was illegal"" Remember, the point of this wiretapping thing was so that no one would know about it. It took people in AT&T to come forward before it started to come down.
I'm not for letting anyone off the hook for anything.
October 17th, 2007 at 6:05 pmIf the telecoms aided in an illegal wiretap, they are criminally liable too. Wouldn’t granting them immunity allow them to testify without incriminating themselves??
I may be mixed up with this immunity thing..I’m obviously not a lawyer…but whatever allows the telecoms to testify about Bush Administration requests for data without a warrant that occured before Sept. 11th should be allowed in court.
Comment by Badger — October 17, 2007 @ 5:58 pm
But Badger...what makes you think they would testify at any time anyway? The whole immunity issue is to STOP the lawsuits, where the damn truth might actually come out!
October 17th, 2007 at 6:05 pmQuestion is . . . who does he really want to spy on? Not terrorists . . . American citizens are not presumptively terrorists . . . the Constitution provides that we are presumptively innocent until proven guilty . . . with all the shennagins going on in the DoJ and government agencies that Bush has universally gutted . . . one must wonder if he just wants to have the pulse of opposition . . . and the financial activities of all who are not "Rangers."
Subversity at its finest. May sound a bit paranoid, but knowing what we know . . .
October 17th, 2007 at 6:06 pmIf Bush was wiretapping American citizens before Sept. 11th without a warrant or an ok from the fisa court…that is a CRIME. The remedy for high CRIMES and misdemeanors is Impeachment.
And Badger, please note that wiretapping American citizens AFTER Sept. 11th WITHOUT a warrant is just as illegal. FISA violation. The pre-Sept. angle is this administration illegally spying on people without the justification that they have ALWAYS used, which is 9/11.
October 17th, 2007 at 6:11 pmUnder this Administration, we need those Constitutional protections more than ever.
It's like our forefathers saw Bush coming and armed us with a defense. Pelosi and the Congress are just too whipped to grasp the concept.
October 17th, 2007 at 6:14 pmSubversity at its finest. May sound a bit paranoid, but knowing what we know . . .
Comment by rockyroad — October 17, 2007 @ 6:06 pm
Not paranoia at all, based on the history of this administration's treatment of the Constitution and rule of law. Their basic argument of the "Unitary Executive" theory makes Bush able to do whatever he wants, no other branch of government can impede him.
October 17th, 2007 at 6:14 pmIn the interests of what world peace remains, will somebody PLEASE frag the self-appointed "decider" and his truly evil backup.
October 17th, 2007 at 6:18 pmcomment by rockyroad @ 6:06 pm
In his own words, and I quote "the Constitution is just a God damned piece of paper"
October 17th, 2007 at 6:32 pmBillyHill, you shouldn't have had that last hit of meth, you are about as funny as genital warts, and about as useful!
October 17th, 2007 at 6:35 pmWow Billy, you seem a little angry.
On the wierd note, ABC News posted a clip of the Iran hostage crisis and unless my eyes deceive, that's Ahmadinajihad front and center.
October 17th, 2007 at 6:36 pmFor those of you too young:
Iran hostage crisis was a diplomatic crisis between Iran and the US, triggered by a group of militant university students who took over the U.S. diplomatic mission in Tehran on November 4, 1979. The students were supported by Iran's post-revolutionary regime that was in the midst of solidifying power. . . . They held 63 U.S. diplomats and three other U.S. citizens hostage until January 20, 1981. Of those captured, 52 were held hostage until the conclusion of the crisis 444 days later(Note: Ross Perot successfully extricated all of his employees - a feat the US was unable to accomplish) These actions are often considered a violation of the long-standing principle of international law that diplomats are immune from arrest.
The crisis ended with the signing of the Algiers Accords in Algeria on January 19, 1981. The hostages were formally released into United States custody the following day. The release took place just minutes after Ronald Reagan was officially sworn in as Carter's successor.
October 17th, 2007 at 6:52 pmI think Bush has a hard-on to be the Republican FDR or alternatively bring about the Rapture.
October 17th, 2007 at 6:56 pmBush's Orwellian logic: If you're interested in avoiding World War III, then start World War III.
Oy!
- Tom
October 17th, 2007 at 7:05 pmSo, in order to ensure he will remain 'relevant', the wannabe fuehrer will attack Iran with nuclear weapons.
start building the guillotines RIGHT NOW!
October 17th, 2007 at 7:19 pmGeorge W. Bush personifies the most malevolent, irredeemable and unholy aspects of mankind. Not only is he wantonly destructive, purposefully dishonest and shamelessly unremorseful, he disgracefully defends his catastrophic decisions by hiding and perpetuating the devastating impact they have on the lives of defenseless human beings. Hundreds of thousands of innocent children, women and men, who have not harbored a harmful thought toward another human being, have been murdered, eviscerated and maimed as a direct result of George W. Bush being the president of the United States of America. And yet, his overriding priority is to prolong the inhuman carnage he has instigated, not to end it. George W. Bush is an indelibly chilling example of what man is capable of doing to his fellow man......the worst example imaginable.
IMPEACHMENT is the only means we have of stopping the destructive consequences of the outright IGNORANCE, ARROGANCE, INCOMPETENCE, DISHONESTIES, INSECURITIES, HOSTILE TEMPERAMENT, VINDICTIVENESS and PRONOUNCED PSYCHOLOGICAL PROBLEMS of George W. Bush. He is an intellectually and emotionally mean-spirited immature child who is destroying America's honor and integrity single-handedly. And we are standing by watching as he dismantles our Constitution and creates an all powerful and self-ruling single branch form of government.
October 17th, 2007 at 7:19 pmBush is a product of alcohol, drugs and inbreeding.
October 17th, 2007 at 7:25 pmNow we know why Bush is so stupid and brain dead.
Daddy should have paid more attention to who he had children with. But I guess that's what Christian Religious Family Moral Values means in the Republican Party.
Comment by Billy Hill — October 17, 2007 @ 6:26 pm
wow, bh, you've finally figured it out! good points, and right on the money, ecept for this one:
I believe GW Bush should be impeached, water boarded, made to tell the truth about everything, tried in The Hague and imprisoned for the rest of his life.
Bush should be hanged, publicly, as a lesson in Republican treason. All your other points are very well placed, however. All good humor comes from the truth, and you, finally, are closer to the truth than you have ever been. You're starting to sound patriotic and like a real American. it's about time.
October 17th, 2007 at 7:36 pmThis is just George's wishful thinking for his Christmas present. Somebody please buy him some toy soldiers and little tanks and get him the hell away from the red button. How about a lovely padded room and leave the shoe laces and belt for him. Maybe he will get the idea.
October 17th, 2007 at 7:43 pmRapture Capture
Capture insecure citizens and promise them that they will be flown to heaven on angels' wings if only the world is destroyed.
Sounds like the crap about 27 virgins that the 9-11 bombers cleaned themselves up for before being eaten up by rocket fuel.
Brilliant. Perhaps Darwin's theory at work.
and you don't believe in evolution.
October 17th, 2007 at 7:47 pm#94 I have read where Bush feels the end of the world is very near, so what has he got to lose. Except maybe the rest of us DON'T agree with that idea. Barbara Boxer made a verbal slip tonight and said Bush sounded off balance with his terror tactics again. Matthews quickly grabbed the comment but Boxer backed away and corrected herself.
October 17th, 2007 at 7:48 pmWhere is the logic in Bush's World War III comment.
Why would Iran be any different than China or the Soviet Union for the last 55 years. There was only one close call in all of those years (the Cuban Missile Crisis) and that was readily defused by diplomacy.
It just makes your head spin. Besides, it just grates the way Bush talks down to his audience, the American people. Insulting my intelligence is not the way to get me to change my mind. Is there any wonder Bush is such a dud at diplomacy?
October 17th, 2007 at 8:06 pmDallasNE:
Yes, ever since dubya was elected, the little head's been spinning . . . round and round . . . kind of like the Exorcist. Please, stop the madness ! ! !
October 17th, 2007 at 8:42 pmSeriously,
Bush is a dud at diplomacy because he's never had cause to be a diplomat. He's a Bush.
Didn't have to serve . . . if there was ever a "phony army reserves man, it would be Bush . . . he didn't get accepted to UT so he went to Harvard (Harvard must be so proud) got DUIs, but got out, was told that he must get married and within three months, did so. This is not a man, certainly not a leader, he's a charactecture of a human bean (yes, bean) that was elected through the stupidity of many Americans and the idiosyncracinies of the ballot box (easily manipulated).
God bless Al Gore.
October 17th, 2007 at 8:48 pmSorry for all the typos, but you get the point.
October 17th, 2007 at 8:50 pmwwIII??? - yeah right!! - what makes bush think that he'll get any support from the rest of the world? - it'll be him vs iran and that's about it - no coalition of the willing this time,except maybe for israel
October 17th, 2007 at 11:05 pmI'm a helluva lot more scared of George Bush than I am of Iran.
October 18th, 2007 at 1:02 amThese are the words that a President who wants to delay elections would utter.
Bush's utterances:
(Paraphrased) America is such an outstanding example of democracy that despite 9-11, we were able to carry on presidential elections.
Victory over Iraq.
"We're also talking to different finance ministers about how we can send a message to the Iranian government that the free world is not going to tolerate the development of know-how in how to build a weapon, or at least gain the ability to make a weapon." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Sept. 20, 2007
I just sleep so snuggly at night. . .
October 18th, 2007 at 1:59 amIf you've been given the know-how, you've certainly gained the ability . . .
Maybe not in George's world, but . . . you know . . . for the rest of us . . .
October 18th, 2007 at 2:04 amComment by Billy Hill — October 17, 2007 @ 6:26 pm
As a wingnut Republican, I believe the USA has been designated by God to lead the entire world. I believe that Ahmadinajihad is the biggest threat to the planet today and he and his country should be leveled to the ground immediately. I believe Valerie Plame was a secretary at the CIA made to play the part of a covert agent, then "outed" by evil Democrats who blamed the leak on innocent patriots Libby and Cheney. I believe Dick Cheney is a true hero and only he is keeping terrorists out of our bedrooms at night. I believe that Whitewater was just the tip of the iceberg of Bill and Hillary's crimes, and the fact that they weren't charged with anything proves that they have the power to buy off everybody in the legal profession. I believe the Bush Administration is doing the right thing by ignoring subpoenas from the treasonous Congress -- they should be trusted, and no true patriot would ever want to see their e-mails or any other public records. I believe that the telecom companies claiming that they were approached about warrantless surveillance before 9/11 is a lie invented by Democrats to discredit the best administration in United States history. I believe Gonzales was the best AG we have ever had, and he was railroaded by racists. I believe that Saddam Hussein instigated the tragedy of 9/11 and anybody who says otherwise is a filthy traitor. I believe that Monica was a bigger threat to our country than Adolph Hitler. I believe that ALL rich Republicans should have the government confiscate ALL money from the poor and give it to them, then the poor should be imprisoned or shot and left in the desert. I believe in freedom of speech by right-wing radio talk shows when it is used to hurt Democrats, but not Liberal speech. Republicans should be allowed to say anything and the FBI should shut down NPR, Air America, all progressive pundits and blog sites and put Keith Olbermann in jail for the rest of his life. I believe ALL registered Democrat men should be castrated and all Democrat women should be forced to have their ovaries removed and all pregnant Democrat women should be forced to have abortions so that these scum sucking, warmongering, killer heathens can be wiped of the face of the earth forever. I believe GW Bush should be made dictator for life, so we can enjoy Republican rule forever.
There! Fixed it for you!
October 18th, 2007 at 8:59 amBush/Cheney- the world's biggest terrorists.
October 18th, 2007 at 9:19 amBoy Missmolly,
You have a comprehensive summation of the entire Bush fiasco.
The whole nightmare in one (long) paragraph.
October 18th, 2007 at 4:22 pmAhmadinajihad has said he believes he is supposed to end the world. He also denies the Holocaust. If we let him get nukes, he will start a nuke war with the nearest country, probably Iraq, wait a few years, and then deny Iraq ever existed. That would be if we were really lucky. More realistically, however, if Ahmadinajihad gets his hands on nukes, he will pick a fight with pretty much any non-radical extremist Muslim, which is pretty much all of the world. He would destabilize the Middle East by nuking all of the non-extremist Islamic countries, and of course Israel. Then he would destabilize the world by picking a fight with the U.S. A nuclear war with Iran would be very short. In a day, we could wipe them off the map, but the cost would be tremendous. They might get a few nukes of and do some minor damage, but the real damage would be done to world stability. Once the nukes start flying everything goes to Hell. The crazy SOB Kim Jun Il would probably get in on it, and then what's stopping China. Iran getting nukes would not be that bad as long as it didn't escalate, but it would. The nuke war Iran would start could very easily lead us down the path to Armageddon. So, let's stop Iran before that nut job decides to kill us all.
October 20th, 2007 at 12:23 amrockyroad you are right on that last comment.
Billy Hill, you should be shot, as should Mr Bush and the rest of the republicans. Sorry I come across so extreme but that's just me.
Also what does any1 reckon would have happened to the world if Litvenenko didnt get killed? Obviously he had some good info on some1 otherwise he would have mysteriously died?
October 23rd, 2007 at 5:03 pmSorry, when I said rockyroad is right, I meant Patriot, I just read the site wrong
October 23rd, 2007 at 5:04 pmAs a German, we always had great respect for the USA. We considered the USA the savior of the world especially after they rescued us from our selves after we believed the rants and ravings of Hitler. What happened??? I never seen a country (USA) go down hill so badly with the election of one man (bush). We see similar parallels to Hitler (Not death camps) but 9/11 to the Reichstag Fire, the patriot act that followed 9/11 and the enabling act that followed the Reichstag fire.Bush like Hitler is a delusional loser. Hitler claimed to save Germany from the Communist threat, every where a communist. Bush will save the USA from terrorism, every where there is a terrorist. Bush like Hitler wants absolute obedience else you are a traitor or un patriotic, or lest be labeled a terrorist sympathizer. Also like Hitler, Bush ignores the advice of Military Generals and replaces them Generals who believe as he does. We in Germany, are curious to see what happens next. We are amazed that your country went as far and launched impeachment proceedings against Clinton, and yet the government is paralyzed by stupidity to impeach Bush!! It is sad, my parents told me as a lid how great USA was, and I believed it, until Bush. Now with this war, rendition. Gitmo, Iraq. and maybe Iran, I feel that the greater threat to world peace is the USA. I never thought I would ever utter those words. Hopefully the American people will rise up and do what is right, and rescue their country which will rescue the world, then I am sure we will work together and rid the world of the Armindinijads and the like. Else, It may be The world that may have to save the Americans from themselves, and then hold bush and his criminal regime for war crimes, and have the American version of the Nuremberg trials.
October 26th, 2007 at 11:02 pm