CA Guard Warned Of ‘Less Effective Response’ To Fires Due To Equipment Shortages Caused By Iraq
CA Guard Warned Of ‘Less Effective Response’ To Fires Due To Equipment Shortages Caused By Iraq
The San Francisco Chronicle reported last May that the California National Guard had been depleted and warned that severe “equipment shortages could hinder the guard’s response to a large-scale disaster,” such as a “major fire”:
In California, half of the equipment the National Guard needs is not in the state, either because it is deployed in Iraq or other parts of the world or because it hasn’t been funded, according to Lt. Col. John Siepmann. While the Guard is in good shape to handle small-scale incidents, “our concern is a catastrophic event,” he said.
“You would see a less effective response (to a major incident),” he said.
At a press conference five months ago, Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger (R-CA) echoed these concerns, stating, “A lot of equipment has gone to Iraq, and it doesn’t come back when the troops come back.” The Chronicle reported that the California National Guard was missing about $1 billion worth of equipment.
Now, as 14 major wildfires rage across the state, those earlier warnings are materializing. While California currently has approximately 1,500 Guardsmen serving in Iraq, the strains on the disaster response teams are compounded by the missing personnel and equipment.
Sen. Barbara Boxer (D-CA) said, “Right now we are down 50 percent in terms of our National Guard equipment because they’re all in Iraq. The equipment — half of the equipment, so we really will need help.” California Lieutenant Gov. John Garamendi (D) said on Harball yesterday, “What we really need are those firefighters, we need the equipment, we need, frankly, we need those troops back from Iraq.”
When asked about California’s concerns of depleted equipment caused by the Iraq war, White House spokesman Dana Perino said yesterday, “I haven’t heard that specifically.”
(HT: Oliver Willis)
Topic Cloud
ArchivesBlog Roll
more great planning by dumbfukistan republicans.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:08 amI can’t believe the Chimp allowed another picture like that to be taken.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:11 amImpotence R Us!
Feel like the whole world’s on fire? Feeling blue?
Letting the man get you down?
Maybe it’s time to join the insurgency.
http://www.tshirtinsurgency.com
October 24th, 2007 at 11:13 amZooey – the guy in the pic kind of looks like Arnold to me.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:13 amDana, with your hands over your ears it is hard to hear.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:14 amThe pix is of the other Chimp…Arnold.
And Republicans lack of gov’t response isn’t so funny when it happens to white folks is it?
October 24th, 2007 at 11:14 amI wonder if the Guvahnator gets the same response from the current regime that the Kansas Governor got after raising the same concerns when those tornados wiped out that town.
And I’m just waiting for “No one could have planned for the wildfires growing this fast.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:14 amCaption:
October 24th, 2007 at 11:17 amI dont want to set the world on fire…
I just want to start a flame in your heart…
Don’t complain about Bush and the Repugs on this one. Look, it is not the role of the federal government to help the state out of its disasters. What do you think that the National Guard is for?
October 24th, 2007 at 11:17 amWhat do you think that the National Guard is for?
Comment by JMOHR — October 24, 2007 @ 11:17 am
Apparently it’s for fighting inane wars in Iraq.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:18 amWe fight the unseen boogey man over there so we don’t have the ability to fight fires here.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:19 amJMHOR, do you read the subject matter at all? If you did you would have been made aware of the depleted National Guard in CA. You are right, that is what the National Guard is for. Unfortunately Bush thinks they are more useful being patrolmen with targets on their backs halfway around the world instead of fighting a real National disaster.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:23 amZooey – the guy in the pic kind of looks like Arnold to me.
Comment by mary — October 24, 2007 @ 11:13 am
I think you’re right, Mary.
Ha!
October 24th, 2007 at 11:23 amDana P: “I haven’t heard that specifically.”
Translation: “nananananana I am not listenting to you nananana…!”
October 24th, 2007 at 11:25 amClean up on post #9……Some dumb shit posted for more bull shit bush propaganda….Guess he isn’t keeping his troll’s informed that most of our troop’s fighting the bush war are national guard..Steel from the state’s. steal from the people, kill for fun and profit bush has way to much time on his hand’s and way to many handler’s for one pupett to manage…..Blessings
October 24th, 2007 at 11:25 amGovernors and other state officials in many states have been protesting the use of National Guard units and equipment in Iraq, saying “if there’s an emergency here, we won’t have the resources to take care of it!”
And they’re right.
This happened with Katrina. And now it’s happening with the California wildfires. It’s not like nobody thought of this. It’s just that people aren’t being listened to by this blockheaded administration.
Put the National Guard units back where they belong. Get rid of Blackwater and any other high-priced mercenaries. Let the regular Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marine Corps fight our wars. Oh, we don’t have enough combat units? Reinstate the draft. I’m sure that any patriotic American would be glad to take up arms in true defense of our country.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:27 amZ – I’m sure we’ll have a lovely “look how concerned Bush is” photo op to look forward to when he visits – tomorrow I believe. He might even tear up! But that might be from the smoke…
October 24th, 2007 at 11:27 amBlessings
Comment by Witch1 — October 24, 2007 @ 11:25 am
Uh, Witch1? I think #9 is supposed to be taken as sarcasm… just guessing.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:28 amJMOHR sez “What do you think that the National Guard is for?”
umm… guarding the nation! How can they do that when they’re deployed elsewhere?
think before you type you dolt.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:28 amAnd Republicans lack of gov’t response isn’t so funny when it happens to white folks is it?
Comment by rat618 — October 24, 2007 @ 11:14 am
This is uncalled for… who said it was funny when it happened to other folks?
October 24th, 2007 at 11:29 amWould hope TROS, but didn’t see any sarc/off or on….Blessings
October 24th, 2007 at 11:30 amGotta jump into the fray re: JMOHR. Not sure where this poster was coming from but poster is cool.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:30 amFeel like the whole world’s on fire? Feeling blue?
Letting the man get you down?
Maybe it’s time to join the insurgency.
http://www.tshirtinsurgency.com
Comment by desaparecido — October 24, 2007 @ 11:13 am
Are you involved with this website?
October 24th, 2007 at 11:30 amShame that photo of Arnold is cropped– he is sitting on the throne of skulls.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:31 amShame that photo of Arnold is cropped– he is sitting on the throne of skulls.
Comment by Yamara — October 24, 2007 @ 11:31 am
was that from Krull? Or was it Conan?
October 24th, 2007 at 11:32 amHe might even tear up! But that might be from the smoke…
Comment by mary — October 24, 2007 @ 11:27 am
I know I tear up every time the Chimp shows up on the tee vee. No smoke needed….
Later, all. :-)
Hey, whitey!
October 24th, 2007 at 11:32 amJMHOR, do you read the subject matter at all?
Comment by hellinabucket — October 24, 2007 @ 11:23 am
Clean up on post #9……
Comment by Witch1 — October 24, 2007 @ 11:25 am
Apparently, you folks aren’t familiar with JMHOR’s particular brand of snark. This post was a sarcastic one, and you’ve been had.
I fell for it once not too long ago on another thread when JMHOR did a beautifully crafted rant about how all the problems in this country could be solved if we all just turned to God. It sounded exactly like it came from a bible-belt evangelist.
I believe JMHOR is making the obvious point — the National Guard has been torn away from its intended purpose — with his usual snark.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:34 amHYOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!
(qwick, who am I?)
:)
October 24th, 2007 at 11:35 amWhazzup my POPStar(TM)!?!?!!?
everyone jumping on #9. I thought it was hilarious. The fact that people thought he was serious speaks volumes to the dumbassery of the troll.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:37 amWhen asked about California’s concerns of depleted equipment caused by the Iraq war, White House spokesman Dana Perino said yesterday, “I haven’t heard that specifically.â€
——————————-
For a press secretary, Perino doesn’t pay attention to what’s going on much, does she? Or perhaps she just suffers from the same la-la-la-I-can’t-hear-you malady that affects so many others in the Bush administration?
October 24th, 2007 at 11:37 amWhazzup my POPStar(TM)!?!?!!?
Comment by whiteyfresh — October 24, 2007 @ 11:35 am
Don’t give me flashbacks like that! :D
I’m currently being driven insane by my school schedule. Hope things are going great for you. Gotta catch a bus!
October 24th, 2007 at 11:39 ampeace! don’t miss the bus!
October 24th, 2007 at 11:41 amI’m currently being driven insane by my school schedule. Hope things are going great for you. Gotta catch a bus!
Comment by Zooey — October 24, 2007 @ 11:39 am
Always good exercise! Just don’t bite the tires.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:43 amall it would take is for the president to get on tv and ask for every third firestation on the west coast to drive a firetruck and a crew down to the fires in the next three days, offer vouchers for gas needed and food and then have the police make sure they get there.
How much help would that be? a lot.
has chimpy done it? nope
October 24th, 2007 at 11:43 am#27 well JMHOR is pretty damn good. that was a perfect troll impression.
you got me J! :)
October 24th, 2007 at 11:44 amFor a press secretary, Perino doesn’t pay attention to what’s going on much, does she? Or perhaps she just suffers from the same la-la-la-I-can’t-hear-you malady that affects so many others in the Bush administration?
Comment by missmolly — October 24, 2007 @ 11:37 am
I think that’s her version of “no comment”. It might be useful down the road when “they never really told me anything” is a good defense.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:44 amGW666 response – Privatize it, give no-bid contract to Blackwater or Haliburton and then demand a percentage be paid back in political contributions. That way it is a win-win for them and the Repukian Party of Corruption and Cronyisim.
Of course the American people get a lose-lose out of the public coffers for this, but who cares, they are the little people anyway.
Buck Fush
October 24th, 2007 at 11:46 amDon’t complain about Bush and the Repugs on this one. Look, it is not the role of the federal government to help the state out of its disasters.
Comment by JMOHR — October 24, 2007 @ 11:17 am
you are a class a idiot buddy. what else is the roleofthe fed govt ifnotto PROTECT THE PEOPLE MORON!
October 24th, 2007 at 11:46 amAnd Republicans lack of gov’t response isn’t so funny when it happens to white folks is it?
Comment by rat618 — October 24, 2007 @ 11:14 am
This is uncalled for… who said it was funny when it happened to other folks?
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — October 24, 2007 @ 11:29 am
I don’t think anybody actually said it was “funny” that the victims of Katrina in NO were treated with everything from indifference to contempt when what they needed was help. I think rat618 used the term “funny” in the sense of “trivial”, “unimportant”, “fodder for entertainment more than real concern”, etc.
I think the point raised by rat618 is a valid one. I’m interested to see how our federal government responds to a disaster affecting rich white people in a state where National Guard resources have been depleted — versus a disaster affecting less rich non-white people in a state where National Guard resources have been depleted.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:46 amFor a press secretary, Perino doesn’t pay attention to what’s going on much, does she? Or perhaps she just suffers from the same la-la-la-I-can’t-hear-you malady that affects so many others in the Bush administration?
Comment by missmolly — October 24, 2007 @ 11:37 am
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plausible_deniability
October 24th, 2007 at 11:46 amThanks Bush, your war in Iraq has been a great success you bumbling idiot!! Thanks for all your concern as I live about 5 miles from the nearest fire in Santiago Canyon. Stay out of California, us liberal progressives here don’t want to see you in our state.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:47 amOk, so now we have New Orleans, Kansas (this year due to flooding) and California struggeling because Bush has sent our equiptment and men to Iraq. How many states will flood, burn or just have weather crisis before people are fed up this bunch?
Along with cutting the fund that helps poor people heat their homes this year so his war budget will get its money.
How is this administration any different than North Korea letting its people eat grass? Will that be our next choice?
October 24th, 2007 at 11:49 amyou are a class a idiot buddy. what else is the roleofthe fed govt ifnotto PROTECT THE PEOPLE MORON!
Comment by bob h — October 24, 2007 @ 11:46 am
See my post #27 — if it’s JMOHR saying something outrageous, it’s snark. And he does it so well, it sounds exactly like something a rather idiotic troll would say.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:50 amComment by rat618
Although I’m saddened at the loss of anyone’s house, I can’t help ironically noting that a majority of the back-country folk in San Diego County are George Bush supporters, and of the war in Iraq. Perhaps the fire (and the lack of needed equipment) has finally given them something to sacrifice for that war.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:50 amDuncan Hunter is saving the day!
October 24th, 2007 at 11:52 amComment by toasterhead — October 24, 2007 @ 11:46 am
I didn’t even know there was a wiki article on plausible deniability. Thanks for the link!
October 24th, 2007 at 11:53 amBtw, this is why rich people pay more taxes. The government protects their property, and they have a disproportionally large amount of it.
Of course at this point they’re SOL too, because the National Guard is in Iraq… not Guarding our Nation.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:53 amDuncan Hunter is saving the day!
Comment by Che
He lives in the affected area; he’s saving his own ass.
October 24th, 2007 at 11:53 amA fire burning on this scale is probably out of human control. It will most likely take a lucky break – geography or weather or both to stop it.
All those folks are Sh*t outta luck.
On the other hand, it’ll be a great excuse to step up logging in national forests. Who needs all those stupid great sequoias anyways?
October 24th, 2007 at 12:03 pm#51 ~ the Sequoias are in NoCal, not SoCal. SoCal is burning.
October 24th, 2007 at 12:12 pmA fire burning on this scale is probably out of human control. It will most likely take a lucky break – geography or weather or both to stop it.
All those folks are Sh*t outta luck.
On the other hand, it’ll be a great excuse to step up logging in national forests. Who needs all those stupid great sequoias anyways?
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — October 24, 2007 @ 12:03 pm
The entire region is designed by Nature to burn on a regular basis; it’s a perfectly natural process up until you plant houses all over the landscape. Incredibly dry air, high winds, and a highly flammable fuel source — it doesn’t take Al Qaeda or even more than one nut and a bunch of normal accidents to create disaster.
But, seriously, this is the other end of the state from the Sequoias in an entirely different ecosystem.
October 24th, 2007 at 12:12 pmI thought San Diego was on the O’Reilly hit list for NOT being a Bush war supporter. That would give Rush and Beck lots of comments that fire hits the “phoney taxpayers”.
But really you have to give Schwartznegger (msp) credit for being prepared, I am impressed.
October 24th, 2007 at 12:13 pmDon’t complain about Bush and the Repugs on this one. Look, it is not the role of the federal government to help the state out of its disasters. What do you think that the National Guard is for?
Comment by JMOHR — October 24, 2007 @ 11:17 am
That is your opinion, and it isn’t shared by many Americans.
October 24th, 2007 at 12:14 pmI see that there is a consensus that JMOHR is spoofing a troll. It is a very good spoof, because this is exactly the line that Libertarian nutcases at the right wing think tanks were pushing in the aftermath of Katrina, until they saw that Bush was taking a hard beating for the failed response to the disaster.
October 24th, 2007 at 12:17 pmTell me again…why is it called the “National” Guard?
Anybody?
October 24th, 2007 at 12:20 pmHey Whiteyfresh.
Just some dudes I know. I think the site’s kinda funny.
I like the Gitmo shirt and the “Your Mom Hates Freedom” shirt.
They make me chuckle..
October 24th, 2007 at 12:31 pmComment by rjmadrid05 — October 24, 2007 @ 11:47 am
When he comes to town, looking for his Jefferson Square photo op with his his sleeves rolled up, I’d like to ask him why he can ask for so much money for Iraq and veto S-CHIP. Where is the compassionate part of his conservatism? I know, a liberal progressive question……
October 24th, 2007 at 12:32 pm#51 ~ the Sequoias are in NoCal, not SoCal. SoCal is burning.
Comment by Bush is a four letter word — October 24, 2007 @ 12:12 pm
Sequoia Nat Park is in Tulare County, which is the southern half of the state as far as I’m concerned, and yes, far from the fires. (See map at Wiki…)
The comment was meant to be sarcasm…
Problem: Fires in San Diego?
Obvious Solution: Cut trees in an national park nowhere near the place!
YOU WATCH! The WH will make that statement in no time flat!!!!
“We must thin our forests!”
October 24th, 2007 at 12:39 pmIt will also be used as an excuse to bash environmentalists.
October 24th, 2007 at 12:40 pmIt will also be used as an excuse to bash environmentalists.
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — October 24, 2007 @ 12:40 pm
“If they just let us pour more concrete, none of this would happen!”
October 24th, 2007 at 12:43 pm#60
All major players in the fight with the fires claim there is NOTHING a national guard could have done. All that equipment in Iraq would have made no impact on the fires. Again, politicians blaming someone or something else for the problem. Always finding a way to bring Iraq and global warming into the fray. And not even praising the men and women on the ground fighting the fires. They are simply not good enough. The same politicians that thinned the military and national guard over the years are crying and begging for them now.
Maybe if you close your eye and click your heel you will be in Kansas again.
No national guard or military could stop the winds. What are they to do but blow hard the other direction.
What you see is individuals helping individuals with some local government involvement to help organize it.
Maybe if you let the landowners and developers clear deadwood from nearby their would less chance of home and businesses getting burned to the ground. It is just common sense. I know that is hard to understand. It is just a tinder box! I know we have to save some animal. Human life and people’s livlihood comes second or really last to something else.
October 24th, 2007 at 12:53 pm#39 Like Hillary with the Chinese…give them the technology to send a missile to hit the western United States and a stay in the Lincoln bedroom for monies to win the reelection and her election chance next year.
I know she gave it all back…YEAH RIGHT!
October 24th, 2007 at 12:58 pmYes, this is exactly what happened in Katrina. Two years later and we are worse off- more resources caught in Iraq instead of domestically, and yet again it is the community who steps up the the plate to respond. And this comparison is all too clear to me after having just seen Desert Bayou, a film focusing on 600 Katrina evacuees flown to Utah, where the local and national government fail but the community succeeds in providing them a new home. There will be a Blog Talk Radio Show on the film with director Alex LeMay and producer Master P at 1pm on Monday, October 29th. The call in number is: (646) 595-3863. I’m thinking of calling in to hear their take on how disaster relief has gotten even worse since Katrina, and what this newest natural disaster says about our national response system.
October 24th, 2007 at 12:58 pmBLAME BUSH! He was having a cigar with his neocon cronies and threw it out the window while talking about that one time in NO when he bet Cheney that he could stir up a massive hurricane and have it cause massive destruction. He would then hide some dynamite along the damns to make it even more destructive because he loved the way the Towers fell in New York City and it was used to get us into Iraq.
He just loves it when a plan comes together.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:02 pm#65
It is great when the community helps it neighbors. They have that face to face understanding and communication. It is how it should be. I hope it continues to prosper and be successful. The number provided above does it take donation that really go to those in need or it is just a call in number to talk.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:05 pmGotta catch a bus!
Comment by Zooey — October 24, 2007 @ 11:39 am
Always good exercise! Just don’t bite the tires.
Comment by gummitch — October 24, 2007 @ 11:43 am
I just choked on my water Gummitch. I hop[e you’re happy young man!
October 24th, 2007 at 1:07 pmComment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 12:53 pm
“All major players in the fight with the fires claim there is NOTHING a national guard could have done.”
– All major players in the fight with the fires claim the fires cannot or should not be fought?
“All that equipment in Iraq would have made no impact on the fires.”
– Trucks and radios wouldn’t help? Oh, right — if there’s no point in fighting the fire, no equipment would be needed. See above.
“And not even praising the men and women on the ground fighting the fires.”
– Ah! So somebody IS fighting these fires? Why are these men and women fighting the fires having an effect, but National Guard units would have no effect?
Your rant basically says “the National Guard is ineffective doing the job its trained for.” Nice dissing of the soldiers.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:08 pmHow can Perino and Tony Snow live with themselves?
October 24th, 2007 at 1:18 pmYour rant basically says “the National Guard is ineffective doing the job its trained for.†Nice dissing of the soldiers.
Comment by missmolly — October 24, 2007 @ 1:08 pm
All that one has to do is the read the news coverage on how exhausted the firefighters are — they’ve been at it since Sunday. There’s no question that using the National Guard to relieve them would have a huge impact, and as you say: equipment. More equipment and more firefighters obviously means a more effective ability to get fires under control.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:18 pm#69
Just like a liberal politician spinning words! Do you know what the definition of is is?
In translation, everything that is being done is being done. The national guard, you, me, the whole of Air America, Congress or even Harry Reid,”global warming is the cause of the fires”, himself could not have made any more impact to stopping or slowing down or maintaining the fires then what has already been done by those doing so right now.
I think that is pretty clear. I could draw a picture if that would help! Because I know that you need clarification instead of checking it out yourself.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:18 pmMaybe if you let the landowners and developers clear deadwood from nearby their would less chance of home and businesses getting burned to the ground. It is just common sense. I know that is hard to understand. It is just a tinder box! I know we have to save some animal. Human life and people’s livlihood comes second or really last to something else.
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 12:53 pm
I guess you’ve never been to California. When fires are generally fought in the air and half your equipment is gone, that doesn’t exactly help get things under control. You build your house in the middle of a forest and then want to clear the forest all around you that isn’t yours. Did it occur to you that people move to these areas because they like the wildlife around them. There are plenty of cleared more urban areas in California
October 24th, 2007 at 1:19 pm#71
IT IS THE WINDS! WHAT CAN ANYONE DO TO STOP THE SAHARA WINDS!?
October 24th, 2007 at 1:19 pmcaption:
“Why oh why did I say “I’ll be baaaack?”
October 24th, 2007 at 1:19 pmBLAME BUSH! He was having a cigar with his neocon cronies and threw it out the window while talking about that one time in NO when he bet Cheney that he could stir up a massive hurricane and have it cause massive destruction. He would then hide some dynamite along the damns to make it even more destructive because he loved the way the Towers fell in New York City and it was used to get us into Iraq.
He just loves it when a plan comes together.
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 1:02 pm
Strawmen are extremely flammable. I’d be careful with that one if I were you.
dum bass
October 24th, 2007 at 1:20 pm#73
Did it occur to you that those people that even own the land are not allowed to clear it because of enviromental regulations stopping them from providing protection of their homes?
October 24th, 2007 at 1:21 pm#76
I am not looking for the Wizard of Oz! No strawman here! And be sensitive to bass, not all are dum. You may hurt their little feelings and be charged with a hate crime. Don’t want one of your socialist liberty taking away laws to bite you back.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:24 pmComment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 1:18 pm
And you know the extra equipment and extra manpower would have made no difference, how. Because Rush told you so. The governor complained about the equipment being gone, see above, but now that the president is coming he’s saying that the extra troops would have made no difference. Why? Can’t upset the Fuhrer or no help will come. And Bush in his usual level of efficiency will show up on THURSDAY. How many days of fires has he missed?
October 24th, 2007 at 1:24 pmDid it occur to you that those people that even own the land are not allowed to clear it because of enviromental regulations stopping them from providing protection of their homes?
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 1:21 pm
Ah, so now we blame environmentalists, because bush screwed up the Guard. Typical extremist wingnuts.
Comment by republicans hate facts — October 24, 2007 @ 1:23 pm
TROS predicted this nearly an hour ago:
It will also be used as an excuse to bash environmentalists.
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — October 24, 2007 @ 12:40 pm
October 24th, 2007 at 1:24 pmDumbledore Rumsfeld’s vision strikes again and again!
October 24th, 2007 at 1:26 pmDid it occur to you that those people that even own the land are not allowed to clear it because of enviromental regulations stopping them from providing protection of their homes?
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 1:21 pm
You got a link to prove this or is this just some other piece of crap you’re making up. Show me where it says you can’t clear you’re own property unless there’s a homeowners association that says you can’t.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:27 pmIT IS THE WINDS! WHAT CAN ANYONE DO TO STOP THE SAHARA WINDS!?
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 1:19 pm
And they’re Santa Ana winds NUMBNUTZ.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:28 pm#79
You blame Bush because he started the fires.
Most of the people in San Diego are taking care of themselves. More power to them!
When rebuilding happens I am sure I will have to take my wallet out to help. If I say no, the gun comes out and I have to fork out my money without choice. Such great individualism. We are such victims to everything.
No murders, rapes or chaos at the shelters or coliseums. That is what happens when your organize and get out when told to.
typical liberal blind ambition wacko.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:29 pmMost of the people in San Diego are taking care of themselves. More power to them!
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007
And something else you didn’t hear about was the Marines from Camp Pendleton helping. It’s easier for you to make your argument when you only know half the facts, isn’t it?
October 24th, 2007 at 1:32 pm#85
SO YOU DO KNOW ABOUT THE WINDS and you still blame Bush!
By the way they are not numb I have healthcare and I pay for it myself with my meager income. But I do so because it is a priority to my welfare…not the government’s welfare. Therefore, you don’t have to pay for me.
That should put a smile on your face. And individual minded American taking care of himself. What a novelty!
October 24th, 2007 at 1:33 pmDid it occur to you that those people that even own the land are not allowed to clear it because of enviromental regulations stopping them from providing protection of their homes?
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil
You are addressing very localized issues, and with regard to the current fires in SoCal, you pretty much have your head up your ass.
Only in urban interfaces with larger trees and significant water resource issues will you have the prohibitions against clearing around structures. Even in these areas there is protocol for keeping fuels away from structures.
The looping subdivisions built in the canyons and on the hillsides of coastal California are surrounded by relatively low trees and shrubs which burn furiously even when green.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:33 pmThey can’t be cleared, or the rains will wash the works into the ocean.
You blame Bush because he started the fires.
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 1:29 pm
And WHO blamed Bush for starting the fires, Scarecrow?
October 24th, 2007 at 1:33 pm#87
Do they live in the San Diego area? I THINK THEY DO! Now we have the whole truth! Located 38 miles north of downtown San Diego!
October 24th, 2007 at 1:35 pmThat should put a smile on your face. And individual minded American taking care of himself. What a novelty!
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 1:33 pm
And I pay for healthcare for all my employees, you want a medal or a chest to pin it on you self righteous twit.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:35 pmDo they live in the San Diego area? I THINK THEY DO! Now we have the whole truth! Located 38 miles north of downtown San Diego!
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 1:35 pm
Is that even the point. The point was they were helping in San Diego, and that is BECAUSE they live there. Lord knows the President hasn’t sent anybody there.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:38 pmAnecessaryevil: “Did it occur to you that those people that even own the land are not allowed to clear it because of enviromental regulations stopping them from providing protection of their homes?”
On the contrary, homeowners in most counties in California are required by law to clear firebreaks around their homes if they border on open space. Conservatives have complained about this as an unnecessary imposition on landowners, so I wouldn’t press this inane non-argument if I were you.
And, your pathetic strawman about “Bush starting the fires” is just as absurd. The argument is that California lacks disaster equipment it could have used because of deployments to Iraq. So, and you might have to read this over a few times because it’s clear you’re a moron, Bush’s policies have hurt the situation there even if he didn’t personally start the fire.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:41 pmWhat a difference in CA from NOLA.
Neighbors helping neighbors, not shooting each other.
Residents sharing food and water with others not raping them.
Businesses opening their doors to lead a hand rather than boarding them up to prevent looting.
Comment by jdc — October 24, 2007 @ 1:37 pm
You ignorant a-holes don’t understand that the poor can’t stockpile food and water, don’t have anyplace to keep it, and don’t have money to evacuate to hotels somewhere like many of the people are doing in California. Lots of the people staying at the shelters now is because they’re pets aren’t allowed at family’s houses or hotels. And why aren’t you holding the shop owners who didn’t help the community by distributing goods that were later destroyed responsible for not sharing. Because sharing is something you nitwits only suggest other people do, charitably. Anything so it doesn’t come out of your pocket personally.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:42 pm#92
“Self”…I do not need your medal. Such hate. The liberals are so open minded and loving to anyone that agrees with them. I think you need a hug. Therefore you make good money. More than I and guess what I am not even having wealth envy or want any of your money. You know, redistribute from the wealthy to the able body welfare recipient.
You also get tax breaks for providing that healthcare but the individual, like myself, doesn’t because liberal politicians don’t want to allow that tax break because they want us to run into their arms of shackles. Do you give your employees that tax break?
October 24th, 2007 at 1:43 pmUnNecessary Evil, can you tell us what takes the President five days to get to a natural disaster to see if he can give help or suppor. Five freakin’ days. Why even bother.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:45 pmThe state has to ask otherwise the federal government can invade any state it wishes.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:47 pmYou also get tax breaks for providing that healthcare but the individual, like myself, doesn’t because liberal politicians don’t want to allow that tax break because they want us to run into their arms of shackles. Do you give your employees that tax break?
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 1:43 pm
Sorry bud but you most certainly would get tax breaks for providing your own health insurance if you actually purchased it. It is combined with other healthcare costs and is deductible when it exceeds a certain percentage of your income. I guess you don’t know that because you don’t really purchase your own insurance.
October 24th, 2007 at 1:48 pmDo you give your employees that tax break?
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 1:43 pm
I pay $300 per week per employee for their entire healthcare and pension. And what tax break exactly am I able to give them on that? I barely can stay in business providing this amount, I am insurance poor. You think I get all that money back on tax breaks?
October 24th, 2007 at 1:51 pmThe state has to ask otherwise the federal government can invade any state it wishes.
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 1:47 pm
Ask for the President to visit?
October 24th, 2007 at 1:51 pmGee, great point, Bush cultists! Disaster hits a ghetto already drowning in poverty and people don’t seem to cooperate as well as they do when a disaster hits some well-off, suburban neighborhoods. That’s quite an observation! Very illuminating!
October 24th, 2007 at 1:56 pmDon’t complain about Bush and the Repugs on this one. Look, it is not the role of the federal government to help the state out of its disasters. What do you think that the National Guard is for?
Comment by JMOHR — October 24, 2007 @ 11:17 am
And where do you think is half of California’s National Guards and most of their equipment? Would you guess Iraq.
October 24th, 2007 at 2:09 pmAnd who sent them there to fight an illegal war instead of taking care of the people back home? Would you guess Bush?
So, are Bush and the Repugs to blame? Most certainly yes!
I guess you don’t know that because you don’t really purchase your own insurance.
Comment by Shayne — October 24, 2007 @ 1:48 pm
I thought it was worth repeating, and suspect it is the case for most Bush loyalists who chest-thump about purchasing/paying their own insurance.
In their own words, they “leech” or “mooch” off their employers.
So much for the “I am a rugged individualist” crowd.
October 24th, 2007 at 2:09 pm“It is an absolute fact: Had we had more air resources, we would have been able to control this fire,†Orange County Fire Chief Chip Prather
Sorry AnUNNecessaryEvil, but you wingnuts are responsible for YET ANOTHER DISASTER! Doing great Brownie!
Comment by republicans hate facts — October 24, 2007 @ 2:14 pm
But, but . . . “All major players in the fight with the fires claim there is NOTHING a national guard could have done.”
You trying to say that a fire chief knows more about this than one of our trolls? What are you, a commie?
October 24th, 2007 at 2:18 pmTake care of yourself at home, without electricity, water or any other GOVERNMENT AID – and then you won’t be a hypocrite – loser boy!
Comment by republicans hate facts — October 24, 2007 @ 2:13 pm
And don’t send our soldiers off to fight some lame war for oil because you’re afraid of terrorists at home. Just thought we should add that one rhf.
October 24th, 2007 at 2:23 pmI’m surprised that all the “personal responsibility” wingnuts haven’t blamed the Californians who have lost their homes on their choice to live in a fire hazard area.
You know, the same people who claim that the Katrina victims deserved what they got because of the choice they made to live in New Orleans, who claim that retirees who have lost their pensions because of incredibly bad fiscal management on the part of their employers deserved what they got because they “didn’t prepare adequately” for that eventuality, who claim that families who face catastrophic medical bills for their children and can’t get insurance shouldn’t have had children at all, etc. etc.
Oh. Right. REPUBLICANS are losing their homes. That’s different.
October 24th, 2007 at 2:23 pmIf all major players in the fight claim there is nothing the National Guard could have done then please explain this:
http://www.ngb.army.mil/news/archives/2007/10/102307-NC_airguard.aspx
October 24th, 2007 at 2:24 pmIt is an absolute fact: Had we had more air resources, we would have been able to control this fire,†Orange County Fire Chief Chip Prather
Sorry AnUNNecessaryEvil, but you wingnuts are responsible for YET ANOTHER DISASTER! Doing great Brownie!
Comment by republicans hate facts — October 24, 2007 @ 2:14 pm
What happen to UnNecessary Tool, did he run off with his tail between his legs?
October 24th, 2007 at 2:24 pmWhat happen to UnNecessary Tool, did he run off with his tail between his legs?
Comment by Shayne — October 24, 2007 @ 2:24 pm
Time for a diaper change.
October 24th, 2007 at 2:32 pmWell at least he’s not leaving his mess on the floor any more Walt. Our little Evil is growing up.
October 24th, 2007 at 2:33 pmSpeaking of tail between legs, where is our other troll to tell us it is not the duty of the National Guard to assist in relief effort or disaster recovery?
He seems to know more about the National Guard than California’s own governor does. Or maybe he has spent too much time talking to either Chertoff or “heckuva job” Brown.
October 24th, 2007 at 2:56 pm#109
Great response. Typical liberal I need my baby’s daddy, the government to save the day!
I pay for electricity. Not you! I pay for the roads to get done! Not you! I pay for those items for me to use. Not for you to use! Get a new slogan!
Che used a similar slogan before he killed thousands because they disagreed! And it was mostly those poor peasants he was the HERO slanted history tells us!
Now, if you take from me to give to an individual that has none by choice. And yes, Miss Molly, there have been fires in that area for decades and floods in NO. I mean, miles below sea level…DUH! You prepare for the chance of it happening and you PAY the consequences of your choices. Not big daddy government!
You made the choice. You know decision making is still a choice in this country until lovable, sweet government RIPS it from our hands.
I know, the former USSR was great and so is living in France and Canada and Italy and Cuba. With all those GREAT GOVERNMENT ENTITLEMENTS as you wait in line to get toilet paper to wipe…I know you are the ones still in Uncle Sam’s diapers.
Never motivated to be more of an individual. Because everyone is awesome and wonderful and great and deserve it all.
Nope…just the opportunity!
Oh, no, Mother Nature’s winds have slowed. How about that?
October 24th, 2007 at 3:06 pmAs the firestorms raged into the evening, Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger asked President George W. Bush to upgrade California’s wildfires to a “major disaster,” which would trigger federal help.
Bush already issued a declaration of emergency early Tuesday. But Schwarzenegger told him in a new letter that “this disaster is of such severity and magnitude that effective response is beyond the capability of the state and local governments.”
October 24th, 2007 at 3:10 pm#112
Criticism came today from Orange County Fire Authority Chief Chip Prather. He says there aren’t enough resources to go around, and that the state failed to provide flying tankers and other air support, along with the equipment necessary to battle the blazes in his area.
The key is the state failed…where is it said the federal government failed…outside of your great liberal politician(s).
October 24th, 2007 at 3:14 pmYou’re starting to ramble incoherently, ANE, is your blood sugar a little low?
October 24th, 2007 at 3:18 pmMaybe you should take a nap and start fresh in the evening…
The key is the state failed…
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 3:14 pm
Exactly what the thread is about. Why did the state government have such a hard time responding to the wildfires? Because the resources the National Guard are not locally available, because Pres Bush compromised the response the Guard can provide by using it as an occupying force in Iraq.
That is what the thread is about. Don’t drink and blog.
October 24th, 2007 at 3:22 pm81 – Aw, c’mon, Shayne!!
The Chimperor couldn’t get here before Thursday, because his fireman costume with the Presidential Seal on it wasn’t ready yet!!
October 24th, 2007 at 3:31 pmOh. Right. REPUBLICANS are losing their homes. That’s different.
Comment by missmolly — October 24, 2007 @ 2:23 pm
Missmolly – it’s also fairly wealthy people; us po’ folk are all huddled together on the valley floors and thus out of danger. (I’m in the San Fernando Valley in Los Angeles – I should know.)
These new neighborhoods up in the hills are made up of “McMansions” – it’s some very expensive real estate — and of course, the Republican response is going to be different!
These aren’t poor black Democrats – they’re rich white Republicans.
October 24th, 2007 at 3:36 pm#123
Oh yeah! The fires and the ability to stop them are GOP faults. Not the winds and not the possible arsonist. It always manages to fall back on the GOP. Wow! Do you play connec the dots alot?
Makes you feel better. All warm and cozy! Sorry, did not mean to say warm. Enron was run by GOP too. Pass that one onto the GOP too.
It simply is government! All of it!
SO you want more government involved, yet, not really, because of all the MISMANagment!
And it runs so smooth under liberals…YEAH…SMOKE ANOTHER ONE! You need to calm down or go out there and help.
October 24th, 2007 at 3:41 pm#124
And those rich, white folks are going to be smart enough to leave, organize locally and make sure they have backup supplies unlike that great liberal local government in NO. You know, providing that the damns are up to par, enough buses to get people out, make sure people are leaving and there are adequate supplies for a massive flood SINCE YOU ARE MILES BELOW SEA LEVEL and live in a know hurricane location. But that is okay we will squander that money on my own bank accounts perhaps…I don’t know. But I do need that gas guzzling hummer to get to my house and get some much needed “supplies” while leaving my constituents wading, swimming and sunbathing on roofs.- William Jefferson
Liberals are all about open minded kindness with other peoples’ money but when the hit hits the shan they run and leave their fellow liberals behind.
October 24th, 2007 at 3:57 pmI pay for electricity. Not you! I pay for the roads to get done! Not you! I pay for those items for me to use. Not for you to use! Get a new slogan!
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 3:06 pm
Wow — nothing but toll roads where you live? And your utility companies receive no government subsidies whatsoever? Is there any law enforcement where you live? Fire protection? Public education? Public libraries? (oh wait — you probably wouldn’t use those)
Unless you are a hermit living on top of a mountain, you are probably benefitting from some kind of government funding.
October 24th, 2007 at 3:59 pmAnybody taking bets on how long before Perino quits? Guarantee you she’s gone before Bush leaves office.
beauty lies
October 24th, 2007 at 4:11 pmThese new neighborhoods up in the hills are made up of “McMansions†– it’s some very expensive real estate — and of course, the Republican response is going to be different!
These aren’t poor black Democrats – they’re rich white Republicans.
Comment by Leftside Annie — October 24, 2007 @ 3:36 pm
I figured most of the homes in the fire paths are above the median. I used to live in Orange County, and I’m familiar with the price of real estate there. And you’re right — the poor (well, middlle class, actually) are in well-developed urban areas far away from the fire areas, and it’s the fancy homes that are in the outlying areas, vulnerable to fire.
However, even though I know it’s mostly the wealthy that are getting burned to a crisp, I’d like to go on record as saying that NOBODY deserves to have what is probably their single biggest investment burned to ashes. It doesn’t matter if they are rich or poor, black or white, Democrat or Republican. I don’t subscribe to the same brand of “they deserved it” hypocrisy the right is famous for.
Yes, insurance will pay for the bulk of the monetary loss. But the people who lose their homes lose more than studs, joists, stucco, and roof tiles. They lose all their belongings as well — including photos, family heirlooms, and other irreplaceable items. They also lose a sense of security — replaced by a feeling of vulnerability that can haunt them for a long time.
October 24th, 2007 at 4:13 pm“Don’t complain about Bush and the Repugs on this one. Look, it is not the role of the federal government to help the state out of its disasters. What do you think that the National Guard is for?”
What version of reality have you been living in? Of course that’s what the National Guard is for. Except California’s National Guard isn’t in California, it’s in Iraq. Along with most of their equipment. Even when the Guard personnel rotate out of Iraq, their equipment doesn’t.
When the federal government takes away a state’s resources for dealing with disasters, it becomes the federal government’s responsibility to deal with it.
And don’t start with the “but who could have known…?” argument. It’s called “fire season” for a reason.
October 24th, 2007 at 4:37 pmYes, insurance will pay for the bulk of the monetary loss. But the people who lose their homes lose more than studs, joists, stucco, and roof tiles. They lose all their belongings as well — including photos, family heirlooms, and other irreplaceable items. They also lose a sense of security — replaced by a feeling of vulnerability that can haunt them for a long time.
Comment by missmolly — October 24, 2007 @ 4:13 pm
While I understand your feelings about people losing their himes and memories, we must realize that those rich fatcats were encroaching on nature and destroying habitat for one reason: to get away from the rest of us. They need to feel special, and their sick materialism is the main reason they’re in such dire straits right now. So, while it is unfortunate, it was easily avoided, and easily foreseen. Now all of our insurance rates will rise, as we are assessed to pay for their lousy value system.
October 24th, 2007 at 4:38 pmthere are adequate supplies for a massive flood SINCE YOU ARE MILES BELOW SEA LEVEL and live in a know hurricane location.
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 3:57 pm
I am puzzled by this mythical place ANE keeps babbling about that is “miles” below sea level.
It couldn’t be New Orleans. Its lowest sections are about 10-15feet below sea level.
October 24th, 2007 at 4:45 pmMissmolly – that wasn’t even implied in my comment.
I agree with you: nobody deserves to lose their whole world to a fire (well, except maybe Glenn Beck, but that’s beside the point).
I also imagine there’s going to be a vast difference in how these (rich white) people are treated by their insurance companies – with fawning respect and much pious “are you in good hands?” advertising.
I have friends who live in NOLA – who were treated like crap by their insurance companies – who claimed it was wind- or flood-damage and thus, not covered. My friend was offered only $7,000 for her ENTIRE house by her insurance company…and I definitely don’t see that this kind of outright fraud is going to be perpetrated on the mostly wealthy, mostly white victims of the wildfires…
October 24th, 2007 at 6:48 pmI know we have to save some animal. Human life and people’s livlihood comes second or really last to something else.
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 12:53 pm
You are either too stupid to understand what I said or just determined to distort to make yourself look right.
HAH… yer a fraud, tough guy.
Back under the double wide for you.
October 24th, 2007 at 7:20 pmAnd it runs so smooth under liberals…YEAH…SMOKE ANOTHER ONE! You need to calm down or go out there and help.
Comment by ANeccessaryEvil — October 24, 2007 @ 3:41 pm
I have to say, it’s hard to hear your mutterings when you have your head so far up yer own…
October 24th, 2007 at 7:21 pmTo provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;
What would happen I Arnold refused to appoint Officers?
October 25th, 2007 at 2:04 amTo provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;
If…………..if Arnold?
October 25th, 2007 at 2:05 amI’m sorry, but both Barbara Boxer AND Gov. Schwarzenegger are LYING if they say “there were not enough supplies”. Those who have a BRAIN know that. Unfortunately, they are on their own agenda wanting to blame the wildfires on Iraq. I’m sorry, but the war in Iraq did NOT cause the fires, nor did they contribute to its spread. Hello!! It’s called a WILDFIRE for that very reason!! Apparently the school system didn’t work very well for Barbara Boxer because she didn’t LEARN that it’s the Santa Ana winds that caused the fires to spread. And what’s more? Do you know that the whole thing COULD have been ARSON? Yeah, they won’t say that on CNN and other news channels on the cable networks….they don’t want to tell the TRUTH.
Well, we can’t really blame this on Iraq…so let’s blame this on “Global Warming”. That’s even more idiotic than blaming the wildfires on Iraq!! Do Democrats actually have a BRAIN? Did they all barely get their GEDs? They’re certainly NOT smarter than a 5th grader (pun intended)!!
TRUTH: 500,000 people evacuated because they THOUGHT FOR THEMSELVES and didn’t let the government think for them. What’s more is that they HELPED EACH OTHER to evacuate.
TRUTH: Wildfire spread because of the Santa Ana winds…..NOT global warming.
TRUTH: Wildfire was NOT caused BY global warming.
TRUTH: California’s supplies and equipment were NOT depleted by war in Iraq. In fact they had MORE THAN ENOUGH equipment.
They won’t tell you the TRUTH on the cable network news stations. Barbara Boxer and the Democrats LIED….as they do quite often. The flare up of violence along the Turkey/Iraq border was caused by the DEMOCRATS…..that’s the TRUTH!! Ask Barbara Boxer about it….and she won’t be able to defend herself….she might blame it on global warming or something!!
October 26th, 2007 at 10:09 pmI guess you fight fires with the army you have, not the army you wish you had.
October 26th, 2007 at 11:12 pm