Comments on: Petraeus adviser: Violence reduction due to ‘luck.’ http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/ Thu, 26 Nov 2009 02:32:08 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: Lefty Patriot http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4158304 Lefty Patriot Fri, 16 Nov 2007 16:36:45 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4158304 Whatever you people have to do to keep your thoughts away from the fact that things are getting better in Iraq. Comment by DreamCrusher — November 16, 2007 @ 11:05 am Whatever you have to grab onto to realize that any improvement in Iraq has nothing to do with USer tactics, surges, or any other bullshit the idiots in charge are trying to sell. You're so easy, they saw you coming from miles away. without unthinking morons like you they wouldn't have had a prayer at raping the treasury, murdering millions of innocents or shredding the Constitution. You may not think there's a "shred" of evidence for ethnic cleansing, but that's because you're another keyboard commando, a chickenhawk without the balls to go find out for yourself. What a lousy excuse for an American you are. Whatever you people have to do to keep your thoughts away from the fact that things are getting better in Iraq.

Comment by DreamCrusher — November 16, 2007 @ 11:05 am

Whatever you have to grab onto to realize that any improvement in Iraq has nothing to do with USer tactics, surges, or any other bullshit the idiots in charge are trying to sell. You’re so easy, they saw you coming from miles away. without unthinking morons like you they wouldn’t have had a prayer at raping the treasury, murdering millions of innocents or shredding the Constitution. You may not think there’s a “shred” of evidence for ethnic cleansing, but that’s because you’re another keyboard commando, a chickenhawk without the balls to go find out for yourself. What a lousy excuse for an American you are.

]]> By: Daddy-O http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4158256 Daddy-O Fri, 16 Nov 2007 15:52:33 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4158256 It sure was 'lucky' that those pilgrims were slaughtered, and al-Sadr declared a cease-fire in the ongoing sectarian civil war in Iraq. Pure luck that al-Sadr was so disgusted and shocked at the deaths of religious pilgrims, when he was less so by the skulls drilled and the body counts of secular Iraqis in the Baghdad morgue every day. Pure luck that al-Sadr finally decided that enough dedicated MUSLIM Iraqis had died for this conflict. How fortunate for Bush, Rush and FOX News, as well. A Hague trial and a firing squad is too good for these criminals. It sure was ‘lucky’ that those pilgrims were slaughtered, and al-Sadr declared a cease-fire in the ongoing sectarian civil war in Iraq.

Pure luck that al-Sadr was so disgusted and shocked at the deaths of religious pilgrims, when he was less so by the skulls drilled and the body counts of secular Iraqis in the Baghdad morgue every day. Pure luck that al-Sadr finally decided that enough dedicated MUSLIM Iraqis had died for this conflict.

How fortunate for Bush, Rush and FOX News, as well.

A Hague trial and a firing squad is too good for these criminals.

]]> By: Chocolate Jesus http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4158151 Chocolate Jesus Fri, 16 Nov 2007 11:26:19 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4158151 another factor ya'all are forgetting the whole $$$ "surge".. we are making the equivalent of what, in america, would be a billionaire, out of sunni chieftans left and right. we're paying for peace. like i said, i have no doubt that if we paid mob bosses in america billions of dollars not to engage in criminal activity, we'd see a dramatic reduction in organized crime. the fact betrayus is cozying up to chalabi the fraudster and serial briber is further evidence of this. I laugh every time I hear the united states claim "we don't negotiate with terrorists".. heck.. not only are they negotiating with them, but their paying them off also... we're arming sunnis, who are still hostile to the central government, which is a further recipe for distaster. whats going on now in iraq is the equivlanent of a painkiller to treat cancer.. it may address some of the symptoms but no progress whatsoever is being made on the underlying problem.. another factor ya’all are forgetting the whole $$$ “surge”.. we are making the equivalent of what, in america, would be a billionaire, out of sunni chieftans left and right. we’re paying for peace. like i said, i have no doubt that if we paid mob bosses in america billions of dollars not to engage in criminal activity, we’d see a dramatic reduction in organized crime. the fact betrayus is cozying up to chalabi the fraudster and serial briber is further evidence of this. I laugh every time I hear the united states claim “we don’t negotiate with terrorists”.. heck.. not only are they negotiating with them, but their paying them off also… we’re arming sunnis, who are still hostile to the central government, which is a further recipe for distaster. whats going on now in iraq is the equivlanent of a painkiller to treat cancer.. it may address some of the symptoms but no progress whatsoever is being made on the underlying problem..

]]> By: Keltoi at Night http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4158049 Keltoi at Night Fri, 16 Nov 2007 04:18:02 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4158049 Well, I do rather like both my Senators, and my Rep isn’t too smarmy. It’s just too bad my, former, party has been taken over by muscle-headed tank-brains; on the national level. Comment by pete — November 15, 2007 @ 11:14 pm I feel ya....whole world is a mess. If I ever found myself believing in something that happened on a National level I'd pinch myself. Shalom, Pete. Well, I do rather like both my Senators, and my Rep isn’t too smarmy. It’s just too bad my, former, party has been taken over by muscle-headed tank-brains; on the national level.

Comment by pete — November 15, 2007 @ 11:14 pm

I feel ya….whole world is a mess. If I ever found myself believing in something that happened on a National level I’d pinch myself.

Shalom, Pete.

]]> By: pete http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4158046 pete Fri, 16 Nov 2007 04:14:27 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4158046 Comment by Keltoi at Night — November 15, 2007 @ 10:58 pm Well, I do rather like both my Senators, and my Rep isn't too smarmy. It's just too bad my, former, party has been taken over by muscle-headed tank-brains; on the national level. Comment by Keltoi at Night — November 15, 2007 @ 10:58 pm

Well, I do rather like both my Senators, and my Rep isn’t too smarmy. It’s just too bad my, former, party has been taken over by muscle-headed tank-brains; on the national level.

]]> By: Keltoi at Night http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4158033 Keltoi at Night Fri, 16 Nov 2007 03:58:59 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4158033 If the Dems don’t stay focused they can still lose. Frankly, I have no illusions. Comment by pete — November 15, 2007 @ 10:47 pm Neither should you. But as a sole to Crown conservative, there are no good choices out there... If the Dems don’t stay focused they can still lose. Frankly, I have no illusions.
Comment by pete — November 15, 2007 @ 10:47 pm

Neither should you. But as a sole to Crown conservative, there are no good choices out there…

]]> By: Gregor Samsa http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4158032 Gregor Samsa Fri, 16 Nov 2007 03:57:36 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4158032 Well, so much for the "the surge strategy is working thanks to our Glorious Leader's magnificent strategic vision" babble that the Bush cultists like to come spew at ThinkProgress... Well, so much for the “the surge strategy is working thanks to our Glorious Leader’s magnificent strategic vision” babble that the Bush cultists like to come spew at ThinkProgress…

]]> By: pete http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4158028 pete Fri, 16 Nov 2007 03:47:47 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4158028 Comment by republicans hate facts — November 15, 2007 @ 10:31 pm Actually, that's what he said. The Reps. are trying to maneuver in such a way that they can move some of the blame and the "sheeple" are dumb enough to buy it. If the Dems don't stay focused they can still lose. Frankly, I have no illusions. It's still a volatile situation and volatile situations can produce unexpected results.After all, the Republicriminals still manage to frame every debate. BTW, I think it's rude to interrupt a civil exchange of ides, even if I agree with your position. I would appreciate it if you save the insults for the idiots. Comment by republicans hate facts — November 15, 2007 @ 10:31 pm

Actually, that’s what he said. The Reps. are trying to maneuver in such a way that they can move some of the blame and the “sheeple” are dumb enough to buy it. If the Dems don’t stay focused they can still lose. Frankly, I have no illusions. It’s still a volatile situation and volatile situations can produce unexpected results.After all, the Republicriminals still manage to frame every debate.

BTW, I think it’s rude to interrupt a civil exchange of ides, even if I agree with your position. I would appreciate it if you save the insults for the idiots.

]]> By: pete http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4158015 pete Fri, 16 Nov 2007 03:28:37 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4158015 Comment by Jay Randal — November 15, 2007 @ 10:18 pm There's also soom evidence to suggest that non-Iraqis are moving to Afghanistan, to participate in the "winter offensive", while others are staying in, or moving to, Pakistan. It's really going to be a revealing "Friedman". Comment by Jay Randal — November 15, 2007 @ 10:18 pm

There’s also soom evidence to suggest that non-Iraqis are moving to Afghanistan, to participate in the “winter offensive”, while others are staying in, or moving to, Pakistan. It’s really going to be a revealing “Friedman”.

]]> By: Jay Randal http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4158011 Jay Randal Fri, 16 Nov 2007 03:18:45 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4158011 Luck? Nope the Iraqis are just busy killing each other at the moment, but they will eventually concentrate on US troops again. Luck? Nope the Iraqis are just busy killing each other at the moment, but they will eventually concentrate on US troops again.

]]> By: Keltoi at Night http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4158006 Keltoi at Night Fri, 16 Nov 2007 03:13:31 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4158006 You may be right on that one. I think both parties are trying to get the other to “take the blame”. The Dems want Bushco to admit they effed up while the Reps only hope is to be “forced” to draw down and PRAY things blow up. It’s about enough to make a guy puke. Comment by pete — November 15, 2007 @ 10:06 pm Big time. And y'know the weirdest thing? I feel like the same dynamic is at work in Iraq vis the Sunni insurgents and Shiite militias. It's like we had to get to a place where both sides would say, "I didn't lose this thing", but both sides got sick of the fighting, albeit both sides did this for different reasons and in the end they really won...it is their country though. I hope they are happy with each other once we are gone. They will both blame us and miss us, and they will be right to do both. 'Nuff to make you puke, indeed. You may be right on that one. I think both parties are trying to get the other to “take the blame”. The Dems want Bushco to admit they effed up while the Reps only hope is to be “forced” to draw down and PRAY things blow up. It’s about enough to make a guy puke.

Comment by pete — November 15, 2007 @ 10:06 pm

Big time. And y’know the weirdest thing? I feel like the same dynamic is at work in Iraq vis the Sunni insurgents and Shiite militias. It’s like we had to get to a place where both sides would say, “I didn’t lose this thing”, but both sides got sick of the fighting, albeit both sides did this for different reasons and in the end they really won…it is their country though. I hope they are happy with each other once we are gone. They will both blame us and miss us, and they will be right to do both. ‘Nuff to make you puke, indeed.

]]> By: pete http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4157999 pete Fri, 16 Nov 2007 03:06:35 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4157999 <em>Unfortunately, I think the latest showdown on Capitol Hill that emerged today is going to make it harder, not easier to get out.</em> Comment by Keltoi at Night — November 15, 2007 @ 9:59 pm You may be right on that one. I think both parties are trying to get the other to "take the blame". The Dems want Bushco to admit they effed up while the Reps only hope is to be "forced" to draw down and PRAY things blow up. It's about enough to make a guy puke. Unfortunately, I think the latest showdown on Capitol Hill that emerged today is going to make it harder, not easier to get out.

Comment by Keltoi at Night — November 15, 2007 @ 9:59 pm

You may be right on that one. I think both parties are trying to get the other to “take the blame”. The Dems want Bushco to admit they effed up while the Reps only hope is to be “forced” to draw down and PRAY things blow up. It’s about enough to make a guy puke.

]]> By: Keltoi at Night http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4157991 Keltoi at Night Fri, 16 Nov 2007 02:59:21 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4157991 From the article: WATERTOWN, New York, Oct 24 (IPS) - Iraq war veterans now stationed at a base here say that morale among U.S. soldiers in the country is so poor, many are simply parking their Humvees and pretending to be on patrol, a practice dubbed “search and avoid” missions. [. . .]” Comment by barfly — November 15, 2007 @ 9:20 pm For what it is worth, it IS time to start drawing down and get the Hell out of there. We have done all we can do. If the Iraqis still can't provide their own security after this long...no one can say we didn't try to help them transition from our removing Saddam. Unfortunately, I think the latest showdown on Capitol Hill that emerged today is going to make it harder, not easier to get out. From the article: WATERTOWN, New York, Oct 24 (IPS) – Iraq war veterans now stationed at a base here say that morale among U.S. soldiers in the country is so poor, many are simply parking their Humvees and pretending to be on patrol, a practice dubbed “search and avoid” missions. [. . .]”

Comment by barfly — November 15, 2007 @ 9:20 pm

For what it is worth, it IS time to start drawing down and get the Hell out of there. We have done all we can do. If the Iraqis still can’t provide their own security after this long…no one can say we didn’t try to help them transition from our removing Saddam. Unfortunately, I think the latest showdown on Capitol Hill that emerged today is going to make it harder, not easier to get out.

]]> By: Doc Rock http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4157983 Doc Rock Fri, 16 Nov 2007 02:43:11 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4157983 Luck AKA "ethnic cleansing" Luck AKA “ethnic cleansing”

]]> By: barfly http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4157976 barfly Fri, 16 Nov 2007 02:20:33 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4157976 From the article: <i>WATERTOWN, New York, Oct 24 (IPS) - Iraq war veterans now stationed at a base here say that morale among U.S. soldiers in the country is so poor, many are simply parking their Humvees and pretending to be on patrol, a practice dubbed "search and avoid" missions. [. . .]" </i> From the article: WATERTOWN, New York, Oct 24 (IPS) – Iraq war veterans now stationed at a base here say that morale among U.S. soldiers in the country is so poor, many are simply parking their Humvees and pretending to be on patrol, a practice dubbed “search and avoid” missions. [. . .]”

]]> By: corsair http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4157974 corsair Fri, 16 Nov 2007 02:17:46 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4157974 The reason the Iraqi military won't defend itself is not because of cowardice or lack of training. A person in the USA becomes a Marine after only 8 weeks of boot camp. The reason Iraqi "troops" won't defend themselves is because half the Iraqi "military" are insurgents. Sgt. Kevin O'Flarity, a squad leader in Iraq, said "Half of the Iraqi security forces are insurgents." See link... http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/05/27/news/delta.php?page=2 The reason the Iraqi military won’t defend itself is not because of cowardice or lack of training. A person in the USA becomes a Marine after only 8 weeks of boot camp. The reason Iraqi “troops” won’t defend themselves is because half the Iraqi “military” are insurgents. Sgt. Kevin O’Flarity, a squad leader in Iraq, said “Half of the Iraqi security forces are insurgents.” See link…

http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/05/27/news/delta.php?page=2

]]> By: barfly http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4157973 barfly Fri, 16 Nov 2007 02:17:41 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4157973 "I have heard a few people on TP suggest the soldiers are faking going on patrol - this is the only place I have heard that, but it was firsthand from a military mom, so I accept it at face value. " Read Dahr Jamail: http://www.dahrjamailiraq.com/hard_news/archives/iraq/000668.php “I have heard a few people on TP suggest the soldiers are faking going on patrol – this is the only place I have heard that, but it was firsthand from a military mom, so I accept it at face value. ”

Read Dahr Jamail:

http://www.dahrjamailiraq.com/hard_news/archives/iraq/000668.php

]]> By: Keltoi at Night http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4157969 Keltoi at Night Fri, 16 Nov 2007 02:12:19 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4157969 There was a reduction in violence after all surges, but it was a TEMPORARY reduction. Remember when the violence subsided after Saddam’s capture, the two elections, Bremer’s handover of control to the Iraqs. etc. etc. etc. Comment by corsair — November 15, 2007 @ 9:05 pm This is true, but what I hope and pray is that the difference this time around is that the Iraqi military finally, finally may be trained and experienced enough to hold the line. It takes years and years to train a good NCO, and to the extent there were any good NCO's in Saddams army we cashiered them, like idiots. It is just possible that with the developements I mentioned in 21 and an actual Iraqi security force in existence, this reduction in violence might, MIGHT stick. If we are Lucky. There was a reduction in violence after all surges, but it was a TEMPORARY reduction. Remember when the violence subsided after Saddam’s capture, the two elections, Bremer’s handover of control to the Iraqs. etc. etc. etc.
Comment by corsair — November 15, 2007 @ 9:05 pm

This is true, but what I hope and pray is that the difference this time around is that the Iraqi military finally, finally may be trained and experienced enough to hold the line. It takes years and years to train a good NCO, and to the extent there were any good NCO’s in Saddams army we cashiered them, like idiots. It is just possible that with the developements I mentioned in 21 and an actual Iraqi security force in existence, this reduction in violence might, MIGHT stick.

If we are Lucky.

]]> By: corsair http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4157961 corsair Fri, 16 Nov 2007 02:05:02 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4157961 There was a reduction in violence after all surges, but it was a TEMPORARY reduction. Remember when the violence subsided after Saddam's capture, the two elections, Bremer's handover of control to the Iraqs. etc. etc. etc. It's best to look at the oil output and the continuing failure to meet those benchmarks. Those two failures tell me violence is NOT subsiding substantially, if at all. Americans are (again) being played for fools by our military. There was a reduction in violence after all surges, but it was a TEMPORARY reduction. Remember when the violence subsided after Saddam’s capture, the two elections, Bremer’s handover of control to the Iraqs. etc. etc. etc. It’s best to look at the oil output and the continuing failure to meet those benchmarks. Those two failures tell me violence is NOT subsiding substantially, if at all. Americans are (again) being played for fools by our military.

]]> By: Keltoi at Night http://thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/comment-page-1/#comment-4157952 Keltoi at Night Fri, 16 Nov 2007 01:58:39 +0000 http://edit.thinkprogress.org/2007/11/15/petraeus-adviser-violence-reduction-due-to-luck/#comment-4157952 Sorry to trample your story, but according to the OED: “A fillet, band, or ribbon, for confining the hair; latterly, in Scotland (and the north of England), the distinctive hair-band worn by young unmarried women. More recently, a fashionable bag-like or closed woman’s hairnet, usu. worn at the back of the head.” So, a turkey’s “snood” was undoubtedly named for its resemblance to the hair-band. Comment by gummitch — November 15, 2007 @ 8:50 pm Okay, confess it Gummitch, are you in the SCA? Sorry to trample your story, but according to the OED: “A fillet, band, or ribbon, for confining the hair; latterly, in Scotland (and the north of England), the distinctive hair-band worn by young unmarried women. More recently, a fashionable bag-like or closed woman’s hairnet, usu. worn at the back of the head.”

So, a turkey’s “snood” was undoubtedly named for its resemblance to the hair-band.

Comment by gummitch — November 15, 2007 @ 8:50 pm

Okay, confess it Gummitch, are you in the SCA?

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