Former top commander in Iraq calls for withdrawal.
Former top commander in Iraq calls for withdrawal.
In the Democratic Radio Address to be aired this Saturday, retired Army Lt. Gen. Ricardo Sanchez, the top U.S. commander in Iraq from June 2003 to June 2004, put his support behind legislation calling for combat operations in Iraq to be over by Dec. 15, 2008. Sanchez, who has been criticized over his handling of the Abu Ghraib scandal, said that the lack of political progress has not “matched” the “courage and blood of our troops” and that there is “no evidence” that reconciliation is possible:
“The improvements in security produced by the courage and blood of our troops have not been matched by a willingness on the part of Iraqi leaders to make the hard choices necessary to bring peace to their country,” Sanchez said in remarks to be aired Saturday for the weekly Democratic radio address.
“There is no evidence that the Iraqis will choose to do so in the near future or that we have an ability to force that result,” he said.
Sanchez added that the House bill “makes the proper preparation of our deploying troops a priority and requires the type of shift in their mission that will allow their numbers to be reduced substantially.”
In October, Sanchez said that in Iraq the United States is “living a nightmare with no end in sight.”
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Guess if you disagree with bushco’s ILLEGAL OCCUPATION will earn you a pink slip….
F-U-C-K–Y-O-U–B-U-S-H-!
happy thanksgiving to all you non-traitors.
November 22nd, 2007 at 4:58 pm#3 – are you having trouble finding the recruiters office or are you just junk?
you know the military has LOWERED its standards for even traitors like yourself…..
so, what’s the story USA_TRAITOR?
November 22nd, 2007 at 5:10 pm>>put his support behind legislation calling for troops to begin withdrawing from Iraq on Dec. 15, 2008.
Begin withdrawing 12/8 or be GONE by 12/8?
November 22nd, 2007 at 5:11 pmWhy do the troops hate the troops?
/sarcasm off
November 22nd, 2007 at 5:13 pmI hope it doesn’t become necessary to explain to the trolls that General Sanchez’s mission was far different than General Petraeus’. Gen Sanchez was expected to take down the regime and maintain stability throughout the country with less than half the troops he needed to have a chance at being successful. Gen Petraeus had only to quell the violence temporarily to give the Iraqi parliament the time they said tehy meeded to reconcile their differences. They accepted our offer and took the month of August off, just like your president. And Gen Petraeus hasn’t succeeded, either. That’s just another right-wing myth.
Happy Thanksgiving.
November 22nd, 2007 at 5:14 pmIt looks like the RNC has sent in their 10th string trolls. All the rest are too drunk to be here posting or have been banned from TP .
November 22nd, 2007 at 5:17 pmIt’s almost funny how a four-letter word offends the trolls’ good taste and sensibilities.
Such are the rules in Wingnutia:
Four-letter words: Disgusting, and frowned upon.
Military invasions and occupations that kill, maim, disfigure thousands in a war that did not need to be: Perfectly ok.
November 22nd, 2007 at 5:18 pmOn top of it all, our latest troll is sarcasm-challenged.
Same room temperature IQ, though.
(I suspect a sockpuppet, btw)
November 22nd, 2007 at 5:20 pmViolence is down in Iraq, because our troops are doing what they should have done five years ago……grant defacto amnesty to the Sunnis, hire them , and use their knowlege of the situation to find and attack Al Qaeda. This reverses the idiotic policy of debathification and disbanding of the Iraqi Army conceived by Bremmers ideologically blinded amateurs.
And violence is also down in BAsra by 90%…where the British WITHDREW their troops. No Taregets…No violence.
And in the NY Times today…60% of the foreign fighters in Iraq are from our allies Saudi Arabia and Lybia. None from Iran.
November 22nd, 2007 at 5:34 pmPlease stop giving the ignorant troll the recognition he so dearly craves. Just flag him for abuse and move on. This one is particularly dumb and not worth bothering with.
November 22nd, 2007 at 5:35 pmOf course ThinkProgress agrees with a general whose strategy in Iraq failed, while calling General Petraeus, who is succeeding in Iraq, a traitor and a liar.
Comment by USA_Patriot — November 22, 2007 @ 5:04 pm
Have you always thought that Sanchez’s strategy in Iraq was a failure? Or did that only occur to you when he started calling Iraq a nightmare?
November 22nd, 2007 at 5:35 pmTypical right-wing troll – never answer a question directly.
November 22nd, 2007 at 5:44 pmMy my. Our favorite little troll is spamming all over the place. And still hasn’t managed a single rational thought.
DISCREDITED. NEXT ALIASS PLEASE!
November 22nd, 2007 at 5:46 pmThe troll(s) have seemed exceptionally desperate yesterday and today. Their vitriol is off the charts. I can sense the pressure they are under to explain why their President isn’t a traitor. I can picture them at their keyboards slobbering and spitting bile like snarling hyenas. All the old talking points are dead, many of the other trolls have given up and moved on, the isolation is closing in on them.
November 22nd, 2007 at 5:52 pmAs a case in point, I am copying a post I made on the Plame thread below. Notice how USA_Patriot is taking on the same tone here as ConTroll did last night and this morning.
Oh, and by the way, Arn Gunnutes you need so serious professional help. Your delusional.
Comment by Con10tious — November 22, 2007 @ 12:06 am
Plame and Wilson are pigs.
Comment by Con10tious — November 22, 2007 @ 12:12 am
Simply can’t refrain from name calling here, huh?
Comment by Con10tious — November 22, 2007 @ 12:19 am
tsk, tsk, all the name calling.
Comment by Con10tious — November 22, 2007 @ 12:41 am
Baffbe, may I suggest professional counseling? You really do need some assistance with your delusional rants.
Comment by Con10tious — November 22, 2007 @
tsk tsk tsk, what a bozo.
Do you feel justified in your name calling now?
Does your pathetic microscopic ego feel better now that I called you a name.
Comment by Con10tious — November 22, 2007 @ 12:57 am
No you delusional twit,
Comment by Con10tious — November 22, 2007 @ 12:59 am
Man, having to explain the facts to those that ride the small bus …
Comment by Con10tious — November 22, 2007 @ 1:18 am
You are obviously beyond stupid
Comment by Con10tious — November 22, 2007 @ 1:30 am
You are a foul mouthed twit whose hatred has overtaken everybit of reasoning power you might have ever had.
Comment by Con10tious — November 22, 2007 @ 1:43 am
Ok, you narrow minded little pukes win.
Comment by Con10tious — November 22, 2007 @ 1:51 am
249 – Nice, if you can’t win with intellect and logic flail away with insults and denigration.
Comment by Con10tious — November 22, 2007 @ 8:32 am
Anybody else see a pattern here?
Comment by VerbalKint — November 22, 2007 @ 8:57 am
November 22nd, 2007 at 5:56 pmComment by VerbalKint — November 22, 2007 @ 5:52 pm
I think it also has something to do with the “moderators” being unavailable on nights and weekends. The trolls keep getting banned, when adults are in the room, so they save up on the bile. Pathetic, empty, little lives they lead. But hey! At least they aren’t out defacing walls and breaking windows like old fashioned vandals.
November 22nd, 2007 at 5:58 pmI suggest we provoke the troll rather than ignore it. Keep poking it and watch it frenzy until it exhausts itself.
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:00 pmI suggest we provoke the troll rather than ignore it. Keep poking it and watch it frenzy until it exhausts itself.
Comment by VerbalKint — November 22, 2007 @ 6:00 pm
This one does it to itself without poking. No self control at all. I think impotent rage is it’s only, remotely, human quality.
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:02 pmThere are failures and setbacks in every war. What matters is that the strategy is working now. Yet the Democrats keep spouting the same talking points as a year ago, trying to undermine the success.
Comment by USA_Patriot — November 22, 2007 @ 5:38 pm
2007 being the deadliest year for MY Soldiers is not what I would call a success.
And for what may I add are WE being killed. wounded, maimed for?
RIP
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:06 pmSGT Stephen R. Sherman
C CO 1-5 IN (STRYKER)
KIA 3 Feb 2005
Mosul, Iraq
Comment by republicans hate facts — November 22, 2007 @ 6:08 pm
They certainly have raised the bar on “lowering the bar”.
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:09 pmFor a long time the trolls have found a way to tread water, but I get the sense now that the S.S. Bush is sinking too fast for them to keep their heads up much longer.
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:11 pmIs there a moderator on duty? Did the troll choke on it’s lies? Did it hurt it’s widdle fingers with all the angry pounding? Or, did Uncledaddy call it back to bed?
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:19 pm#39 I’ve noticed that when we talk ABOUT them, rather than TO them, they tend to leave.
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:22 pmComment by VerbalKint — November 22, 2007 @ 6:22 pm
Yep, it’s a strange phenomenon. They also disappear when we directly answer their inane questions, pose questions they can’t answer, or expose them to sunlight.
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:26 pmVerbalKint, etc. – You’re absolutely right. When you speak of them obliquely, they can’t tolerate it. I recognize that everyone has their own style of dealing with troll detritus – mine is to simply talk over their heads…..or whatever blob of amorphous fascia and cranium they have between their ears.
Happy Thanksgiving to all! I see we’ve had our “resident turkey” here on the threads spreading fecal matter all over it. And he calls himself “USA Patriot” no less – of all things! Isn’t that the epitome of contradiction?
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:29 pmVerbalKint: Your comment #37 is accurate. The troll activity of late is dwindling due to lack of anything even remotely successful or non-criminal they can boast about THEIR administration and corrupt party being involved in. When it’s a total week of scandals being outed and not a day goes by when there’s not multiple news events for the country to be embarrassed about, thanks to the thugs in our government, how can a troll make a living? Most of our old trolls are probably on employment lines right now! The rest are just psychiatrically challenged and brain dead lockstep zombie morons…..too stupid to come in out of the rain. So what’s left – Answer: Only moronic sycophants without a life of their own.
(everyone hear why Fatass Denny left so quickly? Involved in a turkish narcotics scheme – what a total pervert fraud that man is! )
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:33 pmI am now just short of 8 years too old to be recalled to active duty, though it is conceivable—given the ‘progress’ we are making in Iraq—that I and others who inhabit the dark halls of the Individual Ready Reserve might yet see more time in uniform. Great.
I saw 5 years of active duty in the Vietnam era, followed by another 10 years of active reserve component duty in the US Army Reserve and Hawaii National Guard. I was adamantly opposed to the Vietnam war, and was completely opposed to the intervention in Iraq before it started, and remain so. As an Army officer with substantial experience in both the Military Police and Military Intelligence career fields, I can tell you that reports of ‘progress’ are a myth. While I am no fan of LTG Sanchez, I welcome his realization of how fruitless our efforts have been to date, and how this mission was doomed to failure before it even began.
I tell you that, USA_Patriot—and any of your trolling companions—to explain why, despite my high regard for informed debate and a wide variety of expressions, I find no reason to listen to your silly diatribes. I’ll put my 15 years of experience up against your 15 minutes—or, whatever it’s been for you—anytime.
Rallying around a failed leader and cheering on the war effort does not count as national service. Unlike you, I served. And, unlike you, I would return to active duty if called, because I have an obligation to do so. Apparently, so that ass-hats like you can hide behind your keyboard and continue to rally those back home in support of this clearly doomed and failed adventure.
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:33 pmDenny’s fatass will soon be sitting in an orange jumpsuit in prison along with other corrupt buds like Abramoff and Dukie Cunningham.
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:34 pm#44 – I salute you for your service and your candor – not to mention how handily you “thumped” Mr. USA Patriot! Bravo!
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:36 pm@40
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:36 pmI think you hit it dead on, these trolls seem to crave being the center of attention. They thrive on the abuse and wear the wounds like a badge of honor. When they’re marginalized, you’ve taken away their sole reason for being on this site.
The cowardly thugs of the crime family wants endless war to expand the authority of the chief thug to pull off crimes and to destroy the constitution. Sorry warmongering cowards who never served….love war.
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:40 pmTAKE THE PLEDGE TO TRIM BUSH FROM OUR HISTORY!
Interesting read – http://smirkingchimp.com/thread/11181
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:41 pmWell said M Lafferty.
November 22nd, 2007 at 6:42 pmBetrayus will also be tried for his crimes.
November 22nd, 2007 at 7:24 pmI welcome Army Lt. Gen. Ricardo Sanchez 2 cents worth.
On Thanksgiving he believes in ThinkGettin’ Out!!!
November 22nd, 2007 at 7:56 pmGraet link Veritas ! I’m there ……………………..but on a darker note
HR155 ,
> The Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism Prevention Act , which
November 22nd, 2007 at 7:57 pm> passed the house by a vote of 400 to 6 last month , seen by critics as allowing the designation of terrorist to be applied to citizens and groups within the US .The bill currently resides in the Senates Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs .
The make up of this committee is striking in that it is chaired by an independent not a democrat ,one Joseph Lieberman, and is otherwise split evenly between Republicans and Democrats.
Why did this bill ever get past the house leadership ?( loved your speech nancy ).How is it lieberman chairs this committee?
What game is Harmon playing at here ?Reads like something in nazi Germany after chrystal nacht and drafted by a jew ? SHAME
Why do I get the feeling that this is the going to end up on the floor of the senate soon ?
Am I reading this wrong ?
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h110-1955
This is the last throes of the old political man ,his swan song .
November 22nd, 2007 at 8:40 pmThis is the advent of the birth of the new man ,who places truth, love and beauty above materialism, race and the failed concept of the nation state which has littered our collective histories since the before written language .
Birth is a messy process , but only the opening act ,and is forgotten in a heart beat .
#2 USA_Idiot
Of course ThinkProgress agrees with a general whose strategy in Iraq failed, while calling General Petraeus, who is succeeding in Iraq, a traitor and a liar.
The stated purpose of the surge (from Bush himself) was to give the Iraqi government room for political reconciliation. Therefore, the surge is a failure. The reconciliation hasn’t occurred. The Iraqi government has actually moved farther away from it.
If, as you and Bush want us to believe, the reason for the surge was to reduce the number of U.S. troop casualties in Iraq, it’s done that. You know what would reduce that number right down to zero? If we pulled the troops out of there altogether.
If the surge were intended to reduce the number of civilian casualties in Iraq, it’s failed miserably there, too.
Gee, if just saying “The surge is working” actually makes it work, how about we all just start saying “We’ve won the war against terrorism. All the troops can come home now.”
C’mon Idiot, chant along with me now.
November 22nd, 2007 at 8:57 pmSo now everything that failed in Iraq was Sanchez’s fault??? What incredible spin! The commander-in-chief and the Sec of Defense have nothing to do with tactics??? It was all Sanchez??? Give me a break. Everything that Bush has wanted to happen since Jan. 2001 has happened!! But if anything bad happens, it’s all the Dems fault???
The reason there is less violence today is that we are now working with the “insurgent evil-doers”. The White House could have done this in 2003 if they wished. It wasn’t the Dems or Sanchez’s fault!
BTW, we have lost more troops in the past 10+ months than any previous year. We have killed 1,100,000 Iraqi civilians and made 4.5 million refugees. One in eight Iraqi children die before the age of five. One in four in Afghanistan. It will cost us $2-3 Trillion that we aint got. According to our intelligence agencies, it has made us less safe.
November 22nd, 2007 at 9:08 pmWhenever you advise a ruler in the way of tao,
counsel him not to use force to conquer the universe,
for this would only cause resisitance.
Thorn bushes spring up wherever an army has passed .
Lean years follow in the wake of a great war.
Force is followed by loss of strength.
November 22nd, 2007 at 9:15 pmThis is not the way of tao
That which goes against the tao
Comes to an early end .
tao te ching
If, as you and Bush want us to believe, the reason for the surge was to reduce the number of U.S. troop casualties in Iraq, it’s done that.
Comment by chimpeach — November 22, 2007 @ 8:57 pm
Only if you trust the numbers from these corrupt facists.
I use to believe and saw that some information from the RePugniScums could be true. With GW Botch, NEVER AGAIN!! LIES, LIES, LIES!!
RePunugniScums WILL HAVE TO PROVE THEY ARE NOT LIARS TO THE CORE FOR DECADES TO COME. THEY CAN START WITH SHUTTING DOWN THE F-WORD (fhUcks-us nOoze) NETWORK!!!!!!
November 22nd, 2007 at 9:20 pmAwwww now Sanchie won’t get the speaking circuit which pays $60,000 per speech. Awww, that will teach him to speak the truth.
Fortunately, there are many patriotic generals who will gladly sacrifice more troops’ lives to make Israel safe in the Middle East, and will keep their mouth shut to get the big payoff after they retire from the military.
We should all learn from these patriotic generals and keep our mouth shut!
November 22nd, 2007 at 9:46 pmwhy does Sanchez hare freedom?
November 22nd, 2007 at 10:16 pmhate, even?
November 22nd, 2007 at 10:16 pmAnybody else see a pattern here?
Comment by VerbalKint
Yes, instantly saw the pattern and flagged him right away.
What a loser.
Buck Fush
November 22nd, 2007 at 11:15 pm.
November 23rd, 2007 at 12:45 am> while calling General Petraeus, who is succeeding in Iraq, a traitor and a >liar.
if by succeeding, you mean, making millionaires out of sunni chieftans with american blood on their hands, then yes, we are succeeding.
do you think we should we bribing the taliban not to attack us in afghantistan? if not, please explain how the sunni chieftans we are paying off, who formerly gave aide and comfort to al-queda in iraq are dissimilar from the Taliban, who gave aide and comfort to al-queda. do you deny american taxpayer money is being paid to those who fornerly supported al-queda in iraq, or do you just not care as long as there is less violence?
can you tell us about ANY political progress being made? can you point to anyone who ever described the “surge” as doing anything but buying time for political progress? im not talking about your idiot “jeffersonian democracy” soundbite, im asking about ANY politicical progress at all..
November 23rd, 2007 at 3:42 amThe White House will not listen to this general.
November 23rd, 2007 at 7:33 am>al Qaeda, formed around 1988, didn’t exist when Reagan was president.
Right..and everyone involved was such a nice person before they starting using that name, right?
November 23rd, 2007 at 7:55 amal Qaeda, formed around 1988, didn’t exist when Reagan was president. Gregor is clearly ignorant.
Comment by USA_Patriot — November 22, 2007 @ 5:45 pm
Yes they did. At the time, they were a very loose coalition of different Islamist groups in Afghanistan, including Usama bin Laden’s Maktab al-Khadamat and Afghan Mujaheddin groups supported by the CIA. They just began using the name al-Qa’ida in 1988 to refer either to a physical training camp or a database of mujaheddin members.
November 23rd, 2007 at 11:09 ammaybe my maths isnt as good as karls, but wasnt reagan president around 1988 anyway?
November 23rd, 2007 at 11:46 ammaybe my maths isnt as good as karls, but wasnt reagan president around 1988 anyway?
Comment by Chocolate Jesus — November 23, 2007 @ 11:46 am
Technically, yes. Or at least his astrologer was.
November 23rd, 2007 at 12:12 pmwithdrawal? No way! This war must go on forever. War profiteers Bush, Cheney & Co. are making a fortune out of this war! Besides this war is also helping them fulfill their main goal : to crash the economy and subdue this nation to the point where it is no longer self-sustaining – dependent on other nations for its survival. Time is running out for democracy in the US. Just like those planes that were hijacked on 9/11, neo-cons have hijacked America and its economy. Their goal is to crash against a building or the ground or whatever is in the way. So buckle up and enjoy the ride, it will be over before we know. Our future, our economy spilled and drained down the sewers of Baghdad!
November 23rd, 2007 at 1:22 pmI really hate when these criminals are collectively referred to as “America.” That’s how they GET AWAY WITH IT.
Please stop.
We’ll be REALLY impressed when you mass your troops around the White House and frog-march this toxic cabal of war criminals to waiting transports in restraints.
* The Secret Service should be afforded the courtesy of ten minutes to review their oath, then either join with the troops or accompany their charges to the hoosegow in bracelets themselves.
To the neo-fascists who make “so damn much money” from the Business of War, lighting World War III is a great way to toast their marshmallows.
But Gen. Ulysses S. Grant said it best when he observed that “Generals don’t start wars .. Politicians do.”
In this case, they happily promote and start wars for their own financial enrichment, over-and-above the hundreds of thousands of dollars in bribes that they receive each and every day.
Meanwhile, the Commanders on the Ground have to actually deal with the situation that these politicians have created.
In the end, it’s going to be the American people themselves … and ordinary people throughout the rest of this world … that are going to have to effect political change. The kind of political change that will actually enable the Commanders to deal with only winnable military situations.
Our troops deserve no less.
November 23rd, 2007 at 2:00 pmhttp://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/forum.cgi?read=112270
“WELL, WHAT THE HELL CAN I DO?”
(excerpt from “Message to Mr. and Mrs. America)
J. Croft
freedomguide.blogspot.com
I know your frustration. Struggling against a entire society going “wheee” as it’s flushed down the toilet is a daunting challenge, and from what you’ve been taught in those public schools and the TV you’ve gotten “their” message that the only thing to do is to go with the flow. Those are lies.
It’s also a lie there isn’t a thing you can do about it. There’s EVERYTHING you can do, you’ve never been shown a concrete plan of resistance and victory. Read on, if you truly desire Freedom.
—-
WAKE UP OTHERS TO WIN YOUR FREEDOM
November 23rd, 2007 at 2:02 pmSilly Bush-loving troll: “No reasonable observer is now denying the obvious progress.”
The point of the surge, as explained by Bush, was to give the Iraqis room to come to political solutions and agreements. Can you point to any success in this area? Are the Iraqis closer to a political “solution?”
November 23rd, 2007 at 3:01 pmAnybody else finds it odd that when things go wrong, there’s is a Gonzalez, Powell , Sanchez at the end of it all?
How come the Libbys of this world get to go Scott free?
Any asnwers?
November 24th, 2007 at 8:10 am