Review finds CIA withheld tapes from 9/11 Commission.
Review finds CIA withheld tapes from 9/11 Commission.
The New York Times reports that a “review of classified documents by former members of the Sept. 11 commission shows that the panel made repeated and detailed requests to the Central Intelligence Agency in 2003 and 2004 for documents and other information about” the interrogation of terrorist suspects:
In interviews this week, the two chairmen of the commission, Lee H. Hamilton and Thomas H. Kean, said their reading of the report had convinced them that the agency had made a conscious decision to impede the Sept. 11 commission’s inquiry. [...]
Mr. Kean, a Republican and a former governor of New Jersey, said of the agency’s decision not to disclose the existence of the videotapes, “I don’t know whether that’s illegal or not, but it’s certainly wrong.” Mr. Hamilton, a former Democratic congressman from Indiana, said that the C.I.A. “clearly obstructed” the commission’s investigation.
On Wednesday, the Times revealed that at least four top White House lawyers, including Harriet Miers and Alberto Gonzales, had discussed with the CIA whether or not to destroy the tapes.
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CIA TortureTapeGate- the scandal gift that just keeps on giving…
December 22nd, 2007 at 8:38 amGee, what a surprise that there’s more to the story of 9-11. But if we question it, we’re labeled “kooks.”
Welcome to the nuthouse, America….
December 22nd, 2007 at 8:46 amGuess it’s time to reopen the 911 commission and hold hearings on this – among other things – many other inconsistencies in the “official story”. This is the can of worms dreaded by the Bush Cabal – no doubt about it!
December 22nd, 2007 at 9:12 amThey’ll claim national security… which allows them to do whatever th f*** they want.
December 22nd, 2007 at 9:15 amThe extensive synergy of those who disbelieved the 911 official story will flow into this investigation like a tsunami. It may begin as CIA-TortureGate but will end with some rather sinister findings about whom may have been directly/indirectly involved in 911. These findings will shake the foundation of this democracy like no other. This is the convergence of facts and the confluence of many aspects of the 911 story which still don’t add up.
THIS IS THE TRUTH VEHICLE WE’VE BEEN WAITING FOR!
December 22nd, 2007 at 9:15 amjpv: If Congress reads the constitution clearly, the claim of national security as a cover up for criminal activities doesn’t apply.
December 22nd, 2007 at 9:16 amBut, of course, the real truth will not be garnered for prosecutorial purposes until Bush &Co. are out of office. We know that. However, in order for a lesson to be learned, one has to find the root problem – dissect it thoroughly and recognize past errors. This is critical in order to progress as a nation and really move forward.
December 22nd, 2007 at 9:17 amAs long as there are GOPhers/Obstructionists in Congress protecting this administration and their own “complicit a$$es” for aiding and abetting the administration toward a criminal end, things will get stymied. This is why we’d better be watching our ballot boxes right now – it’s a matter of prison or freedom for many congressmen and administration officials should a Democrat take back the White House and prosecute all of them.
Ohio has dumped their Diebold DRE’s in favor of paper ballots – every state in this country needs to do so before 08.
December 22nd, 2007 at 9:19 amHmmm. I wonder if any of the interrogatees happened to spill the beans about Saudi and Pakistani involvement of 9/11, on tape…
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/gerald-posner/the-cias-destroyed-inter_b_75850.html
December 22nd, 2007 at 9:20 am
We’re talking “Federal crimes” “War crimes” and “Crimes Against Humanity” here – this is no child’s play. The stakes are the highest possible so expect the frantic, desperate Rethugs to pull out all stops in stealing yet another election.
December 22nd, 2007 at 9:20 amJPV: No doubt about it. The evidence was incriminating and may connect some 911 dots this administration would rather the public not know.
December 22nd, 2007 at 9:21 amRICO these treasonous thugs.
If anything, the lawyers were there to serve as a CYA for a criminal enterprise.
We needs us some good gibbets.
December 22nd, 2007 at 9:29 amThere is no defense for crimes committed (and in this case, commissioned) under the color of law.
December 22nd, 2007 at 9:31 amAnother opportunity for the Democrats to demonstrate they are as corrupt as the Republicans by sitting on their hands. When will a leader emerge? Go Chris Dodd.
December 22nd, 2007 at 9:39 amIt’s also essential that future would-be traitors and criminals be able to look to the bleached bones of the last people who tried to pull this crap for guidance as to the exact fate that will, assuredly, befall them, should their enterprise fail.
Nixon and his henchmen should have been jailed (burglary). Reagan his henchmen should have been jailed (arms for hostages). Bush and his henchmen should be jailed or executed (war crimes, crimes against humanity, fraud, treason, crimes committed under the color of law, embezzlement, cronyism, and subversion of the Constitution of the US).
It’s good that they believe in the deterrent power of severe punishment of crime so wholeheartedly – their bloated corpses will serve as excellent examples for future “politicians”.
December 22nd, 2007 at 9:40 am“I don’t know whether that’s illegal or not, but it’s certainly wrong.†Mr. Hamilton, a former Democratic congressman from Indiana,
Heck, even if ti was illegal nothing would be done about it except some ink would hit some paper and someone would receive a letter.
December 22nd, 2007 at 9:41 amIs this the part where we stand back in amazement at the reality they created? And learn from them? lol
Bushco opens totrture prisons all over the world and think they’ll keep it on the downlow…
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:00 amWe are in a very critical situation. I think of the millions who have died over the past two centuries. For ideals. For rule of law. And it has eroded since the end of WW 2 because of a tacit agreement that a shadow government is good. Prescott Bush, the Dulles Brothers, Nixon’s gang, Reagan’s gang, HW, Clinton’s cowardly acquiesence all set the stage for this unitary Presidency. George W. Bush, yes, but especially Dick Cheney could give a rat’s ass about our Constitution and they shat on all those who died defending it. “The dream has ended.” Unless a true leader steps forward.
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:22 amSINS OF OMISSION = LYING TO COVER UP ILLEGAL ACTS.
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:27 amjpv: If Congress reads the constitution clearly, the claim of national security as a cover up for criminal activities doesn’t apply.
Comment by Veritas — December 22, 2007 @ 9:16 am
That is sound reasoning, Veritas, except that it depends on Congress reading the constitution.
Not something that this Congress appears willing to attempt.
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:27 amI’m sune Dennis Kucinich has a few copies laying around that he’d be more than happy to share…
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:28 amsune=sure
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:29 amd’oh!
Dick would kill tens of thousands in order to NOT let the cat out of the bag that the Saudi link to 9/11 also has ties to SOMEONE here in the USA.
You want to improve our National Security, then through the entire Bushco in the clink.
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:29 amthrough = throw
:-0
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:30 amWhat I find hardest to believe is that Bush didn’t know about the tapes and didn’t have a say in what to do with them. Since four lawyers close to Bush knew about them and were giving advice on them, isn’t it a bit of a stretch to believe that none of them told Bush about the tapes or consulted with him as to what to do with them?
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:33 amCIA TortureTapeGate- the scandal gift that just keeps on giving…
Comment by And Yet.
How about just plain TortureGate. It’s all part of the same ugly picture coming out about the Bush Crime Family.
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:35 amjpv: If Congress reads the constitution clearly, the claim of national security as a cover up for criminal activities doesn’t apply.
Comment by Veritas
Neither does Executive Privilege, but they will play that card anyway. And why do they keep playing that card? Because they are allowed to do it.
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:36 amTwo words to remember in 2008…..Plausible Deniability.
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:43 amAnd when did Keaton and Hamilton know about it…?
They both have been silent about this for a while? !!
Bush does not have much time left in his presidency.
If the Congress needs to act, then the Speaker and Democrats need to ‘hurry up’.
But Pelosi and Democrats are looking to gain more seats,and they look at any investigation of Bush & Cheney at this time as a distraction from their goal of winnings 2008 elections.
Next year it will be a year full of events..from winning primaries to the 2008 Olympics ,to elections in November. So one should not expect too much from Pelosi and Reid. Both are nothing but talk. They don’t have the teeth that can bite…
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:45 amWhat I find hardest to believe is that Bush didn’t know about the tapes and didn’t have a say in what to do with them. Since four lawyers close to Bush knew about them and were giving advice on them, isn’t it a bit of a stretch to believe that none of them told Bush about the tapes or consulted with him as to what to do with them?
Comment by bilbobaggins — December 22, 2007 @ 10:33 am
That’s the evil genius of Bush’s cultivated reputation as a dunderhead. If one accepts the concept of a shadow Cheney presidency using bush as front, it becomes entirely plausible that no one told Bush anything important, ever.
I don’t buy it, but it would certainly explain a lot.
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:48 amSo would it be mean spirited to suggest that some water-boarding of the people involved would help get to the bottom of this problem?
-GSD
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:51 amRICO these treasonous thugs.
Comment by Marcus Aurelius — December 22, 2007 @ 9:29 am
Lemme correct that fer ya, Marcus…
RICO these murderous, incompetent, delusional, treasonous thugs.
There, makes more sense now, no?
According to my understanding of the RICO statute, yes the RNC and the Bush Admin, meet the standards for prosecution.
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:51 am“… some water-boarding of the people involved…”
Comment by GSD — December 22, 2007 @ 10:51 am
Instead of “Bed Time For Bonzo”, howzabout “Board Time For Gonzo”?
At the very least we could strip them naked, leave them in an ice cold cell with extremely loud rock music playing. According to our trolls, that’s not even torture. Which one do you think would break down crying first, and sell the others out totally? (I’m betting on Gonzo!)
December 22nd, 2007 at 10:55 amTwo words to remember in 2008…..Plausible Deniability.
Comment by Lescoeurs — December 22, 2007 @ 10:43 am]
Here’s a couple of more words fer ya…
Undeniable Stupidity…
December 22nd, 2007 at 11:00 amUndeniable Stupidity…
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity
Or maybe, unfathomable incompetence.
December 22nd, 2007 at 11:05 amComment by DieNowForPeace — December 22, 2007 @ 11:05 am
Unmitigated gall?
December 22nd, 2007 at 11:06 amNever before has a President and Vice President deserved to be impeached more than these.
Yet our Speaker of the House of Representatives, Nancy Pelosi, is working behind the scenes with House Democrats, not to build a consensus for impeachment, but to do just the opposite: to keep others from succeeding in their effort to hold this president accountable by means of impeachment.
With the FISA bill still looming in the Senate, and a new war funding bill passed with no structure in place to Bring our Troops Home, we have to show the leaders of the House and Senate that this is still our country.
Please read the petition to replace Pelosi with a Democratic Representative who will bring impeachment proceedings to the floor. A Question of Privilege under House Rules IX can declare the Speaker seat vacant.
It can be done, it must be done. We have waited long enough.
http://www.petitiononline.com/everyman/petition.html
December 22nd, 2007 at 11:24 amMarcus Aurelius – Republic of Stupidity,
Katherine Yurica agrees.
December 22nd, 2007 at 11:36 am#37…Willyloman,
Someone should run against Pelosi in her district in 2008 elections.She needs to retire..
December 22nd, 2007 at 11:36 amShe is too diplomatic and political in a job that requires toughness from the Speaker of The House.
You folks just gave me 1 reason to waterboard….bushco. They’ll lie of coruse,but just one slip of the tongue may lead to the truth.
December 22nd, 2007 at 11:46 am‘course’….opps
December 22nd, 2007 at 11:47 amUnmitigated gall?
Comment by The Republic of Stupidity — December 22, 2007 @ 11:06 am
Unprecedented arrogance?
December 22nd, 2007 at 12:00 pmSince the intel on Iraq was cherry picked… fixed around policy… meaning make the intel justify the war, and it was Cheney who did that, both Bush and Cheney are guilty of mass murder.
Bigger to me than obstruction of justice.
So what gives here?
December 22nd, 2007 at 12:31 pmTo destroy the CIA torture tapes or not to destroy the CIA torture tapes, that is the Bush crime family’s question…
December 22nd, 2007 at 1:06 pmThe mere fact that they were indicting and incriminating enough to destroy them tells it all right there. No need to even use one’s imagination as to the rationale for “destruction of evidence”. These were serious war crimes and the Hague isn’t going to be any too easy on George W. Bush when he leaves office. They’ll also be calling into question everyone involved in the torture act itself along with the cover up, destruction of evidence.
It’s always been said that the destruction of evidence (obstruction of justice) penalty can be worse than the crime itself and it’s concomittant penalty.
Bring it on to this administration!
December 22nd, 2007 at 1:48 pmIf these tapes did not prove “enhanced torture techniques”, they’d still be intact.
December 22nd, 2007 at 1:49 pmI can’t keep track of all of Bush’s lies and misdeeds, war crimes, crimes against humanity, rape of our environment, and on and on and on until one’s head is spinning. Why this man still sits in the White House is way beyond my logical and spiritual comprehension.
December 22nd, 2007 at 1:50 pmKeane and Hamilton met with George Tenet privately and requested ANY and ALL INFORMATION the CIA had on interrogation of prisoners. George Tenet never mentioned the existence of the tapes during this meeting.
Methinks that Mr. Tenet has a lot of ’splainin’ to do right now. It’s time for him to be subpoenaed and interrogated. It appears that he (and others) intentionally misled Congress as to the existence of these highly incriminating tapes.
Since George Tenet’s favorite line in public has been “WE DON’T TORTURE, WE DON’T TORTURE” – plagiarized directly from Bushco’s playbook of the same, it’s clear that he was trying to prepare the way for precisely the goods we now have on him right here.
December 22nd, 2007 at 1:56 pm9/11 was an inside job. Preventing investigations and other witnesses from the evidence of TORTURE containing in the tapes would make the “confession on envolvment on the plot of 9/11″ look like one of the Bush’s speachs… no depth, no credibility.
December 22nd, 2007 at 2:48 pmI can’t keep track of all of Bush’s lies and misdeeds, war crimes, crimes against humanity, rape of our environment, and on and on and on until one’s head is spinning. Why this man still sits in the White House is way beyond my logical and spiritual comprehension.
Comment by Veritas
December 22nd, 2007 at 2:51 pmI’M WITH YOU! TIME TO IMPEACH, INDICT AND IMPRISON IS LONG OVERDUE!
9/11 was an inside job. Preventing investigations and other witnesses from the evidence of TORTURE containing in the tapes would make the “confession on envolvment on the plot of 9/11″ look like one of the Bush’s speachs… no depth, no credibility.
I really meat speaches!!!! Bush’s speaches have no depth or credibility… amogst its people or amogst the international community. Typing too quickly a second language sometimes makes me blush! Speaches! Speaches!
December 22nd, 2007 at 2:54 pmComment by Frank M — December 22, 2007 @ 3:04 pm
so 7000 American deaths caused by this government isn’t a big enough number for you, frank? How many would make such an America-hater as you happy? A couple of destroyed tapes is indeed the “smoking gun” of a conspiracy, by definition. It’s your side’s line “if you haven’t done anything wrong, you have nothing to worry about”. so, there’s the proof of a conspiracy, by your own measure. You’re just as low as spit in a gutter, but you’re too stupid to know it.
December 22nd, 2007 at 3:19 pmComment by sacopenapa — December 22, 2007 @ 2:54 pm
It’s O.K. Even trolls (most of them anyway) don’t seriously think typos render one’s thoughts invalid. If one ever does make such a claim, refer them to the linguistic skills of Herr Dubbya.
BACK ON TOPIC:
One could read “tapegate” as an encouraging sign. The very fact it became a story suggests that there are elements in the intelligence community who are willing to turn on Bushco. Much like the “loose nukes” story suggests the “Commander in Chief” is being thwarted by principled members of the military. I think it has to do with a desire to continue their careers and, hopefully, stay out of prison. And, hopefully, the desire to do the right thing.
As for the reason those tapes were destroyed? I think it far more likely they were destroyed to quash the answers provided than to protect the interrogators. Bushco doesn’t go out of their way to protect underlings so long as the “top dawgs” can operate at will.
December 22nd, 2007 at 3:26 pmI wonder how you manage to get any sleep at night when the government itself is after your little insignificant lives.
Comment by Frank M — December 22, 2007 @ 3:04 pm
Cool Jingle Ballsâ„¢, Frank. You’ve in hangin’ out wit’ Li’l Fooite ‘n Hendler too much. ‘N that flashing red Rudolph nose is jes’ perfert this time o’ year. Somebody, git a picture ‘o Frankie before he sobers up.
December 22nd, 2007 at 3:37 pmThree dead Saudi princes. One died of Liposuction??? One died of Thirst???? One died in a car wreck on the way to the other one’s funeral???
One dead Pakistani Air Force general, dead in a Plane Crash????
All implicated by Abu Zubayda. None of this info turned over to the 911 commission, even though such material was requested.???
Oh well…there’s probably an entirely innocent explanation for all this. Nothing to see here.
December 22nd, 2007 at 3:49 pmDestroy a couple “random” tapes, no big deal.
December 22nd, 2007 at 5:20 pmTorture a couple of random “insurgents”, no big deal.
Randomly rap on the constitution, no big deal.
Rig a couple of random elections, no big deal.
Ignore a couple of random briefings mentioning specific terrorist threats, no big deal.
Go to war under false pretenses, no big deal.
Issue over 1000 signing random statements that ignore the very law just signed, no big deal.
Bilbo, Ralph the Wonder Llama, etc. on Plausible Deniability:
First I would cite that Shrub is the “Captain of the Ship”
But beyond that, the current administration has been marked by the most severe secrecy and obsessive control of any administration in my memory. Workers in govt agencies can’t talk to the local flower club without getting high level clearance. NIH officials can’t speak on healthcare without high level clearance.
December 22nd, 2007 at 9:09 pmComment by Kilo — December 22, 2007 @ 7:34 pm
Web sites are an outlet for frustration and rage. And, it is regrettable if real conservatives suffer the abuse directed at the Reich-wing fringe. The fact of the matter is that there’s nothing conservative about Bushco. They are reckless radicals, have exposed themselves as such, and have turned “GOP” into a curse.
As for “absolving” Bin Laden and AQ, I don’t see it. I very much want those guilty for the 9/11 attacks brought to justice and that wish is expressed widely here at TP. I especially want to know what part, if any, our “good friends”, Saudi Arabia and Pakistan, played.
Mr. Bush, however, appears not to feel the same. After all, he did say: “I don’t know where [Bin Laden] is..You know, I just don’t spend that much time on him, Kelly, to be honest with you. …I’ll repeat what I said. I truly am not that concerned about him.” Not to mention invading Iraq before the guilty parties were brought to justice.
Speaking only for myself, Bushco’s failure to catch, or kill, Bin Laden earns them a share of the blame even if there was nothing they could do to prevent the attacks. And I place all the blame for the carnage in Iraq squarely on their shoulders. Even if they believed they were doing the right thing, and there were no intentional misdeeds, unnecessarily invading a sovereign nation is about the worst thing a country can do. If our dark suspicions prove true? Bushco should pay the ultimate price.
December 22nd, 2007 at 9:40 pmYet here you’re happy to take a declared enemy of the US who’s dedicated themselves to killing your fellow citizens for 20 years, absolve them of the mass murder they designed, developed, funded, staffed, carried out, claimed and celebrated and blame this instead on your fellow citizens. With all the same evidence and credibility as you’d have claiming Pearl Harbour was bombed by the Boston Red Sox.
And yet you haven’t a scintilla of proof for any of your above statements either. And our “fellow citizens” are hardly that, they are in the pockets of those very same funders, planners, etc. It is inconceivable that the sheer volume of screwups that had to happen on 9/11 didn’t have some help, active or passive, from the highest officials, our “fellow citizens”.
December 22nd, 2007 at 11:59 pm“And pray tell what would happen if everyone got out of your way in America ? What response would we have seen you cheer after 9/11 if the evil neocons weren’t in power ? Fired some cruise missiles at Texas and call it a day would we ?”
Well, considering 90% of the US was supportive of the Afghanistan invasion I would think you could figure it out yourself. But I give you WAY too much credit.
December 23rd, 2007 at 3:57 am