Cheney emails missing from day leak probe started.
Last week, House Oversight Chairman Henry Waxman (D-CA) revealed that the White House failed to preserve emails for at least 473 separate days. Waxman’s report said “Vice President Cheney’s office showed no electronic messages on 16 occasions from September 2003 to May 2005.” Among the sixteen days for which email are missing from Vice President Cheney’s office “is Sept. 30, 2003, the same day the day the Justice Department and the Federal Bureau of Investigation announced they were investigating who outed former CIA officer Valerie Plame Wilson.”
UPDATE: CREW has produced a report analyzing the major national news events that were going on around the dates of the missing White House emails.
UPDATE II: Marcy Wheeler has more.
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140 Responses to “Cheney emails missing from day leak probe started.”
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Ironically, Cheney’s office is missing emails from the very day President Bush told reporters he’d “take care of” whatever staff member had actually leaked the CIA agent’s name.
“Ironically” ????????????????
More like INTENTIONALLY …………..
January 21st, 2008 at 12:33 pmCheney impeachment is long overdue.
January 21st, 2008 at 12:38 pmSorry for the off-topic, but since today doesn’t exists a Think Fast thread, and I’ve found two articles closely related referring to the “inexistent” crisis:
Banks of China are in deep doo doo thanks to subprime crisis (meaning that they’ll sell cheap the subprime mortages they own to avoid more money losing?)
http://news.yahoo.com/ s/ ap/ 20080121/ ap_on_bi_ge/ china_banks;_ylt=AiEtVLHm4vDA4fYtYRgKlgis0NUE
Investors dumped shares because they were skeptical that an economic stimulus plan President Bush announced Friday would shore up the economy that has been battered by problems in its housing and credit markets. The plan, which requires approval by Congress, calls for about $145 billion worth of tax relief to encourage consumer spending.
Generalized plunge in world stocks:
http://news.yahoo.com/ s/ ap/ 20080121/ ap_on_bi_ge/ world_markets;_ylt=AjNKVfqcz3sn4NmRijtcdj2s0NUE
“It’s another horrible day,” said Francis Lun, a general manager at Fulbright Securities in Hong Kong. “Today it’s because of disappointment that the U.S. stimulus (package) is too little, too late and investors feel it won’t help the economy recover.”
January 21st, 2008 at 12:39 pmI’m suddenly overcome by a powerful desire for yellow cake.
January 21st, 2008 at 12:39 pmhttp://www.tshirtinsurgency.com
damn plunger….can’t you just say what you think…..what do you think?
gimme a link.
January 21st, 2008 at 12:39 pmWill they ever be held responsible? Thanks Harry and Nancy, you are doing a heckuva job.
January 21st, 2008 at 12:42 pmOh dear, some more MIAs, but this go-round the GOPers are not up in arms about them…
On a side note, since the Diebolding of Obama’s victory by persons unknown in the New Hampshire Primary Election, Bill and Hill have got their sliming and smearing of Obama down pat; the only thing missing is the smirk…
January 21st, 2008 at 12:42 pmdamn plunger….can’t you just say what you think…..what do you think?
gimme a link.
Comment by Fred — January 21, 2008 @ 12:39 pm
Really man! Ever thought about paraphrasing?
January 21st, 2008 at 12:43 pmWhat is a few lost emails between friends when we’ve already abandoned the rule of law?
January 21st, 2008 at 12:44 pmMy first thought when I entered this thread was “Oh God, plunger is here.”
January 21st, 2008 at 12:45 pmLooks like it’s a plunger thread. I’m outta here.
January 21st, 2008 at 12:45 pmAlways remember the WH reasoning on phone and email tapping:
You only have something to hide if you are a guilty terrorist!
So by the WH’s own logic - Cheney is guilty and maybe more.
Long past time to start impeachment proceedings!
January 21st, 2008 at 12:48 pmI like plunger’s posts. Lots of info. I think it’s pretty obvious what he thinks.
He ventures into tricky territory and isn’t afraid.
January 21st, 2008 at 12:49 pmI’d rather get the long posts than nothing at all.
I suggest skipping them if they bother you. Just like I skip over Big-foot-in-mouth posts for example.
January 21st, 2008 at 12:52 pmI like plunger’s posts. Lots of info. I think it’s pretty obvious what he thinks.
He ventures into tricky territory and isn’t afraid.
Comment by mary
honey, this is a discussion forum….where is he interacting with anyone? He is publishing his book. And I think he is plaguerizing other people while he is doing it. It is troll behavior. It derails any disscussion and it alienates people who actuall want to discuss the issue……
January 21st, 2008 at 12:53 pmI can’t wait for the day Cheney & Bush are missing…
January 21st, 2008 at 12:56 pmThe dog ate my homework for a year and four months, Honest!
January 21st, 2008 at 12:57 pmhoney, this is a discussion forum
Comment by Fred — January 21, 2008 @ 12:53 pm
I agree with Fred. This is like someone delivering uninvited five minute soliloquys at a dinner party.
I do skip over plunger’s posts. But even this is tiring, when these posts take up 90% of the thread. It becomes difficult to even find the next non-plunger post.
And like Fred, I’m sure that plunger must be plagiarizing other people.
January 21st, 2008 at 12:59 pmIt’s been pretty obvious from day one that no incriminating emails would ever be presented by this administration. There is no rule these guys won’t break and they don’t know the meaning of doing the right thing.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:00 pmI’d rather get the long posts than nothing at all.
I suggest skipping them if they bother you. Just like I skip over Big-foot-in-mouth posts for example.
Comment by mary — January 21, 2008 @ 12:52 pm
Have to agree with Fred on this one. Plunger could paraphrase and then provide links to support his contentions. Such a format would be much more conducive for blogging.
then again, i’m just a dim wit……
January 21st, 2008 at 1:01 pmhoney? I ain’t your honey Fred.
I didn’t know that there was a rule that you had to interact with other posters to be allowed to post.
Like I said, ignore them, skip them, whatever. I, for one, do not feel alientated by his posts. They’re a helluva lot less alienating than some of the real trolls that come here and attack and insult people.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:02 pmAnother off-topic, but closely related with the subprime crisis: Where are the dollar bills?
http://news.yahoo.com/ s/ usatoday/ 20080121/ cm_usatoday/ ourviewonsovereignwealthfundswhennationsamassdollarsthefaultliesinourselves;_ylt=AnSQpHyEiWRdnLhO_ILxJLOs0NUE
January 21st, 2008 at 1:05 pmthen again, i’m just a dim wit……
Comment by dim wit — January 21, 2008 @ 1:01 pm
Yeah, but you’re OUR dim wit!
January 21st, 2008 at 1:05 pmWell see y’all later then. I sure wish you’d all be as critical of some of the real thread derailers that come here. Those jerks make real discussions impossible and make me skeddadle out of here pronto.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:07 pmLike I said, ignore them, skip them, whatever.
Comment by mary — January 21, 2008 @ 1:02 pm
Does “whatever” include include commenting on the boring length and repetitive nature of the posts?
January 21st, 2008 at 1:07 pmSo…..when does cheney go to jail?……anybody…speak right up.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:07 pmIf I’m not mistaken, he got booted before for this same behavior back when he went by “ace”
January 21st, 2008 at 1:07 pmhoney? I ain’t your honey Fred.
I didn’t know that there was a rule that you had to interact with other posters to be allowed to post.
Like I said, ignore them, skip them, whatever. I, for one, do not feel alientated by his posts. They’re a helluva lot less alienating than some of the real trolls that come here and attack and insult people.
Comment by mary
ok mary, I was out of line with the condecention of using honey…I apologize for that…..I stand by my opinion that if plunger wants to be taken seriously that he should discuss his opinions rather than quote books here….links are so easy these days and almost anyone can do it.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:08 pmDeath and deception ooze black blood from the ground.
Corrupt corporate cronies hubristically abound.
Hubristically????
January 21st, 2008 at 1:12 pmEvil Spaniard, your links about the market…#6 and #31 are terrifying…..when markets around the world are all dropping from 5 to 7 percent in one day I would think that we may have a serious problem.
My wife and I were talking about this and we couldn’t help but remember that when bush was appointed that we knew right then that it was just a matter of time before this happened…it always does with repulicans….they are able to prop it up and cover it up for a while but it always happens.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:13 pmIf I’m not mistaken, he got booted before for this same behavior back when he went by “aceâ€
Comment by Wilco — January 21, 2008 @ 1:07 pm
Yep he did
I like the links but the long posts multiple are irritating, personally.
And messy editing in his cut and paste, for example.
“Ann in AZ | 08.29.06 - 11:36 pm |”
Would also be nice if he actually discussed rather than spam and run.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:18 pmAs it is, I usually just skip them when the posts are spammed like that.
Ari Fliescher and a pack of multi billionaire warmongers are going to spend 250 million on pro-Bush ads.
So as America spirals down the toilet we are going to be exposed to thousands of slickly produced ads telling us how wonderful everything in the world is as a result of Bush’s policies.
That should be enough to cause a revolt among the people.
-GSD
January 21st, 2008 at 1:19 pmAmong the sixteen days for which email are missing from Vice President Cheney’s office “is Sept. 30, 2003, the same day the day the Justice Department and the Federal Bureau of Investigation announced they were investigating who outed former CIA officer Valerie Plame Wilson.â€
That’s just a coincidence. There’s nothing here folks…move along.
Really, though, why in the hell aren’t these people being held accountable for all the laws they have broken. They are required, by law, to retain all communications, including e-mails. So, if they set up a system where their backups were written over with new data (something I really doubt happened), they purposely broke the law. Come on Democrats, DO SOMETHING!
January 21st, 2008 at 1:21 pmPlunger is taken seriously by some.
And he does include links.
Why should anyone conform to your preferred method of posting? What about those of us who prefer the original language over paraphrasing? Who would rather not follow links?
What is your goal in criticizing Plunger - to change his/her style of posting, or to drive him/her off this site? If it’s the former, you should realize by now the futility of your efforts. If it’s the later, you would deprive us all of valuable information.
Perhaps you merely like to pick on people who don’t conform to your wishes? Or perhaps you’re just venting your pet peeve in a public forum. Whatever. I suggest you treat Plunger’s posts the same way you would like others to treat your posts. Nothing more, nothing less.
Peace.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:21 pmComment by plunger — January 21, 2008 @ 12:38 pm
Would you give it a rest. Your multi-page posts are becoming more irritating than the troll posts. Why don’t you do what everyone else does, provide a synopsis of an article and then link to the article. You are the world’s biggest plagiarist since you rarely link to the articles you use for your cut-and-paste operations.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:23 pmWould also be nice if he actually discussed rather than spam and run.
As it is, I usually just skip them when the posts are spammed like that.
Comment by Wayne — January 21, 2008 @ 1:18 pm
It would be nice if Ace/Plunger listened to the rest of us, but he never has. He’s doing god’s work, or something. My opinion is that he should start his own blog and blogwhore like everyone else, but that would require actually writing content instead of plagiarizing everyone else’s.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:23 pmI can hear the new GOP-er mantra:
How dare anyone attack the president while the nation is in a financial crisis!
-GSD
January 21st, 2008 at 1:24 pmThat should be enough to cause a revolt among the people.
Comment by GSD — January 21, 2008 @ 1:19 pm
The average person who only gets their news from the corporate filtered evening news does not even know anything is wrong.
These video zombies won’t revolt, unless Starbucks quits serving them lattes.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:25 pmI like plunger’s posts. Lots of info. I think it’s pretty obvious what he thinks.
He ventures into tricky territory and isn’t afraid.
Comment by mary
His posts are nothing more than plagiarized information from sources he doesn’t credit. Most people don’t even read them.
plunger - if you really want people to pay attention to you, stop spamming threads with your cut-and-paste plagiarized posts. Just post your opinion and if you want, then post a link.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:26 pmFrankly, I’m surprised plunger isn’t blaming this on Israel.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:28 pmIt would be nice if Ace/Plunger listened to the rest of us, but he never has. He’s doing god’s work, or something. My opinion is that he should start his own blog and blogwhore like everyone else, but that would require actually writing content instead of plagiarizing everyone else’s.
Comment by gummitch — January 21, 2008 @ 1:23 pm
Yep.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:28 pmWhat about those of us who prefer the original language over paraphrasing? Who would rather not follow links?
Comment by Briseadh na Faire
Then read a book……..I would rather follow links.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:29 pmTreason! Treason! We have a traitor in our midst! The Vice-President of our country is a traitor! We must act, or all is lost.
I post this in all seriousness.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:30 pmFrankly, I’m surprised plunger isn’t blaming this on Israel.
Comment by Wilco — January 21, 2008 @ 1:28 pm
A Tweety “Hah!” to you, Wilco!
Yeah, my favorite moment in plungerdom is when he concluded one of his rants with the assertion that the Mossad heard everything everywhere always, including your what your vet was saying. No kidding.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:31 pmExactly, Fred.
As I think, it’s a tainted spirit of “grab the money and run”. Corporations are allowed to engineer schemes to create a giantic purse of money, made of junk lending (lending without a solid base), by bending the laws, and specially common sense. Then, the ones inventing the scheme, grab the money, and when the market falls, because no one can support so much indebting and interests, the main generators of the crisis have reaped their benefits, and the ones too slow or too greedy, receive the impact of the money loss. Is yet again the crack of 1929, the Enron crisis, or the DOT COM one.
And well, the debt of the USA is a trade mark of that type of thinking, the idea that lending will solve everything. Unfortunely, these financial schemes end badly, when they are enough far of the day by day reality of people and money earning. Money can’t be invented, or simply printed, with nothing to back it. Greed is the main problem.
And well, on thread again: I work for a consulting company, and if I we had lost as many top importance documents, we’ll be out of the bussiness since some years ago.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:31 pmOk, so now we “know” that which we already knew or strongly suspected. The question now becomes, that which it always has been — what are you going to do about it?!?! WHAT? WHAT!
The bar is pretty low as nothing is expected from the current slate of Dem leaders in both the House and Senate. So, most anything you do could be a plus; provided, of course, you want to get your hands dirty and make whatever that might be binding or have some teeth or actually do something other than state the obvious. Just saying.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:32 pmThese video zombies won’t revolt, unless Starbucks quits serving them lattes.
Comment by Wayne
judging by the links by evil spaniard….especially in post #6 that day is not far away for us.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:32 pmComment by Briseadh na Faire — January 21, 2008 @ 1:21 pm
I’m sorry, I stopped reading after you wrote: “Plunger is to be taken seriously.”
could you bullet point the rest for me?
January 21st, 2008 at 1:34 pmI vote for Ace/Plunger.
He posts amazing stuff, usually in the morning, and not everyday.
Seems like he shows up about once a week on the really evil and serious stuff.
It’s much more palatable than a thousand bickering comments which say absolutely nothing.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:35 pmYeah, my favorite moment in plungerdom is when he concluded one of his rants with the assertion that the Mossad heard everything everywhere always, including your what your vet was saying. No kidding.
Comment by Keltoi at Night — January 21, 2008 @ 1:31 pm
http://news.yahoo.com/ s/ ap/ 20080121/ ap_on_re_mi_ea/ israel_spy_satellite;_ylt=AvHTWgngvK.9PR5lDAIhVpGs0NUE
The TECSAR is the first satellite of its kind developed in Israel, and ranks among the world’s most advanced space systems,” the statement said.
The satellite includes an advanced imaging system based on synthetic aperture radar, or SAR, technology, the statement said.
The development and launching cost tens of millions of dollars, the officials said. Within two weeks it will be possible to view pictures from the device, the officials said.
Israeli and Indian experts cooperated to launch the satellite with an Indian rocket from southeastern India, IAI said.
And, no, it’s no joke.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:36 pmOh, I forgot to add, I wonder how a tiny country of what? 6 million people? Can desing & pay for the launching of such a marvel of the engineering.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:40 pmThis is another “impeachable offense” against Dick Cheney. Violation of presidential records act is a criminal charge.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:40 pmComment by justasking — January 21, 2008 @ 1:36 pm
Yeah!!
JA is here to document all of our comments in his database!
While I can’t speak for Cheney at least JA knows how to preserve his comments along with everyone else’s.
Have you ever considered working for Cheney as a “documentation preservation” consultant? I know you have the credentials.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:42 pmIt’s much more palatable than a thousand bickering comments which say absolutely nothing.
Comment by Nevar
well nevar did you manage to wade through it until you found something worthy of reading about something that is actually happening right now like evil spaniards link to what is happening in the world outside of the US today….or did you miss it from all the scrolling?
please read this…all major world markets down 5-7percent….in one day
http://news.yahoo.com/ s/ ap/ 20080121/ ap_on_bi_ge/ world_markets;_ylt=AjNKVfqcz3sn4NmRijtcdj2s0NUE
January 21st, 2008 at 1:42 pmThe people are watching members of congress very, very carefully to see if they will continue their clear derelection of duty in not joining with Robert Wexler’s move toward impeachment. Any congressional member who does not sign on will find themselves out in the street when their term of office expires…..or better yet, with criminal charges against them for derelection of the duty which is mandated by their oath of office.
This lack of email activity ironically beginning at the outset of the Plame treasonous affair will become prima facie evidence in court toward Cheney’s impeachment.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:43 pmFred: The only thing left in this fascist “coup” is the total decimation of the financial markets. And, unfortunately, that’s just around the corner.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:43 pmThe trash heap of “impeachable offenses” now against Cheney and Bush are knee deep at this point. They can no longer be “sidestepped” or “shoved under the rug”. They are consuming this administration in one giant gulp!
January 21st, 2008 at 1:45 pmVeritas, I think you overestimate the American people. We’ve seen this bs going on for years; people are just used to it. There is no movement for impeachment, and that’s the only way there ever would be an impeachment.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:47 pmCongress won’t do it because it will hurt them politically. I just don’t seem impeachment happening.
There’s too little time and too little support. There’s no outrage in America.
As far as plungers spamming….please, he is not posting anything we don’t already know and if you don’t then maybe you don’t understand what the internet is for.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:48 pmHave you ever considered that you’re really ARE a dim wit?
Comment by justasking
It’s really funny that “you’re really ARE” asking that
January 21st, 2008 at 1:48 pmFred: The only thing left in this fascist “coup†is the total decimation of the financial markets. And, unfortunately, that’s just around the corner.
Comment by Veritas
what does this mean? americorp?
January 21st, 2008 at 1:51 pm~Bet you wouldn’t tell that to people who try to advertise their blogs in here. Don’t worry. I already did. That’s where you PLAGERIZED MY COMMENT.
Comment by justasking — January 21, 2008 @ 1:36 pm
And which blog is that? And posted as which sock puppet? Didn’t you claim not to be a troll?
January 21st, 2008 at 1:52 pmComment by justasking
Seriously?
Are you just a caricature of yourself?
That’s some funny sht!
January 21st, 2008 at 1:54 pmwe went through this for the last two nights with justaskin…..you must ignore.
January 21st, 2008 at 1:56 pmRun with it, Congressman Wexler.
January 21st, 2008 at 2:00 pmIt is worth recalling that then Attorney General Alberto Gonzales waited at least 12 hours and perhaps as long as four days “to officially notify the White House about the investigation and tell them to preserve any and all materials related to” the Plame affair.
For more on the magically disappearing emails on White House backup tapes, see:
January 21st, 2008 at 2:00 pm“Tales of the Tape.”
this is what justaskin was doing all night last night:
http://thinkprogress.org/2008/01/20/12009/#comments
please take a moment to read post 309 if you don’t do anything else….then decide for yourself
January 21st, 2008 at 2:01 pmI welcome all posters but Trolls.
Deliberately derailing a thread is wasting everyone’s time. Trolls can post on the Mutual Admiration Society page.
One thing not said about Plunger’s posts is the topic…I’m surprised some of you state ‘you know all that’…I didn’t know much of what Plunger has posted.
January 21st, 2008 at 2:01 pmZim, I think only Fred said he knows all the stuff plunger posts.
January 21st, 2008 at 2:02 pmI ignore it.
As a computer geek I know that if the Dems find the email administrator they will find those missing emails. Computer geeks never delete anything of value because they know that sooner or later that information will be need again - probably by the owner of the information.
Find the email server admistrator and he/she will produce the emails - I’ll betch five bucks.
January 21st, 2008 at 2:05 pmThanks, Wilco.
On Topic, even if they ‘find’ the missing e-mails, it would be held up in court long after the Bushlickers are gone.
Support Wexler’s impeachment plan!
January 21st, 2008 at 2:05 pmHardly a sniff of this in the MSM. So much for that liberal bias.
January 21st, 2008 at 2:05 pmThe fact the emails are missing is evidence enough to show obstruction of justice.
January 21st, 2008 at 2:06 pmO Fred,
Don’t act as though you’re so innocent.
I heard that you hack people’s computers for personal information.
That’s really low.
Comment by justasking
careful little one….you will cross the line….slander is illegal and prosecutable and your isp is logged…..sure you want to play with me little one?
January 21st, 2008 at 2:07 pmI think the Ahole should be Impeached….write to your congressperson at the house level and tell them u support an Investigation into Cheney….don’t write ur Senators because Pelosi and other’s will just toss it away……I think we should TOSS ALL OF THEM OUT and start over and get people in there with some BALLS
January 21st, 2008 at 2:07 pmHardly a sniff of this in the MSM. So much for that liberal bias.
Comment by hellinabucket — January 21, 2008 @ 2:05 pm
There have been some wire service articles picked up by a few papers (hmmm, wonder if they’re McClatchy?) but nothing like the sort of coverage it should be getting. More evidence of a supine “free press”.
January 21st, 2008 at 2:10 pmMore evidence of a supine “free pressâ€.
Comment by gummitch — January 21, 2008 @ 2:10 pm
Either the press is more interested in Lindsey Lohan working at a morgue (community services) or, because is bought and paid, or both, simply the disconnect of the US press with its political intricacies, and in a greater measure, in foreing world, is really a big chasm.
January 21st, 2008 at 2:12 pmCongress won’t do it because it will hurt them politically. I just don’t seem impeachment happening.
There’s too little time and too little support. There’s no outrage in America.
Comment by Wilco
I totally disagree with you. I see plenty of outrage in America. The problem is the MSM isn’t going to tell you about it. They don’t want Bush impeached so they won’t tell people about their crimes and the movement for impeachment. I also disagree that bringing articles of impeachment against Bush/Chaney would hurt the Democrats politically. I firmly believe that if they were to bring articles of impeachment we would see the approval ratings for Congress go through the roof. One very big reason for the low approval ratings is because the Democrats are doing nothing about Iraq and nothing about holding Bush & Company accountable for their crimes.
January 21st, 2008 at 2:17 pmThings weren’t entirely different early on with Watergate, except that one major newspaper continued to nag on the subject. Eventually, all the daily papers had to start paying attention (back when daily papers actually had any significance) but the story could just as easily have been buried and Nixon would have served out his second term.
It’s funny, too, because the press was certainly more than willing to jump all over Clinton and the bj.
January 21st, 2008 at 2:20 pmbilbo, I just don’t see much outrage outside of blogs.
January 21st, 2008 at 2:22 pmAnd sure, the True Left will be thrilled to see them held accountable, but when so much of this election will be dependent upon independents (yes, I know that’s per the MSM), they want to be as careful as possible.
They are politicians. Therefore, they’re not moral. Nothing is more important than the pursuit of power. When given the choice between doing what’s right and what will get them more power, you see time and again which way they go.
while you post miles of text that no one is going to read…..I mean really even the ones that say they support you don’t read all of it….anyway while you are fixated on that the world stock market is crashing…..I guiess what you have to say is more important, huh……
http://news.yahoo.com/ s/ ap/ 20080121/ ap_on_bi_ge/ world_markets;_ylt=AjNKVfqcz3sn4NmRijtcdj2s0NUE
January 21st, 2008 at 2:24 pmI mean this is happening right now. Not something that is posted on 30 different websites and has been there some of it for years…..
all major world markets down 5-7 percent……that doesn’t seem important enough to discuss?
January 21st, 2008 at 2:26 pmIs it too late to withdraw my vote for Plunger=puss?
January 21st, 2008 at 2:28 pmOK, this is plunger’s spam thread now, later all
January 21st, 2008 at 2:29 pmComment by Fred — January 21, 2008 @ 2:26 pm
Sure, it is important. But right now the thread is about Cheney’s potential obstruction of justice, which is a very serious offense if it can be proven.
Or at least that’s what the thread was originally about…
January 21st, 2008 at 2:29 pmO Fred,
Don’t act as though you’re so innocent.
I heard that you hack people’s computers for personal information.
That’s really low.
Comment by justasking
oh and plunger…the thing you called me a dick over…..I guess you don’t read everything either….you don’t consider this to be slander?
January 21st, 2008 at 2:29 pmI agree Fred, this is very serious stuff.
Can we fault the world for not believing Doofus?
January 21st, 2008 at 2:29 pmIt’s clearly obstruction.
January 21st, 2008 at 2:31 pmThis government is corrupt from top to bottom as evidenced by none of them being held accountable.
Gregor
January 21st, 2008 at 2:32 pmit was introduced in post 6 by evil spaniard and I don’t know about you guys but this is not a small thing……..did you read the article……all world markets down 5-7 percent….that’s the story of the day….the week….the month…..it could be the story of the year before it’s over if it doesn’t correct………
Comment by Fred — January 21, 2008 @ 2:32 pm
I am agreeing with you that this is not a small thing. However, even Evil Spaniard began his post with “I know this is off-topic, but…” or something like that. That is all I am saying too.
January 21st, 2008 at 2:35 pmImpeach Pelosi for obstructon of justice. This dumb beotch stands their with her fingers in her ears saying “I cant hear you”
January 21st, 2008 at 2:37 pmWhen, finally do the American people AND the gutless media AND any candidate call these clowns on BULLSHIT???
Have we lost our nerve? Do we as the people no longer get a voice?? We do get the opportunity to throw these bums out BEFORE it’s too late or is it already??
What do we do NOW to stop this??
January 21st, 2008 at 2:37 pmyou got a point or do you just want me to read it because you posted it…none of that is new or news to me…..
January 21st, 2008 at 2:44 pmOT, but - The DJIA is rock solid today. ;) That could change tomorrow when the US markets are open. Has anyone seen any info on off-market trading? I cannot see anywhere to put my investments except into the money market. Only small gains there, but no retreats.
January 21st, 2008 at 2:46 pmAsking plunger to stop has apparently caused him to issue longer diatribes. Maybe those who have a problem with plunger would serve everybody better if they’d just ignore him.
January 21st, 2008 at 2:53 pmwe went through this for the last two nights with justaskin…..
you must ignore.
Comment by Fred — January 21, 2008 @ 1:56 pm
yea… and YOU were b!tch!n about plunger…
maybe he should save it for 1-3am to add some spice in with
THOSE “discussions”… yeesh…
keep it up, plunger, as i know you will…
…
i do agree that michael?/justaskin warrants the IGNORE signal…
January 21st, 2008 at 2:53 pmit’s sure seems hard to do though… too bad…
.
yea… and YOU were b!tch!n about plunger…
maybe he should save it for 1-3am to add some spice in with
THOSE “discussionsâ€â€¦ yeesh…
keep it up, plunger, as i know you will…
…
i do agree that michael?/justaskin warrants the IGNORE signal…
it’s sure seems hard to do though… too bad…
.
Comment by katy
All you seem to contribute to the situation is to pass judgement on those of us who have been here dealing with them…..while trying to carry on….I hardly believe that you have a complete grasp of what has been going on here this weekend and I resent your statements. Try to be involved instead of just dropping by and telling us we are doing it wrong…….I seriously haven’t figured out how to handle it most of the time but I tell you this….I’m about done with this whole situation….
January 21st, 2008 at 3:01 pmMaybe we could just stop bickering amongst ourselves. I feel like I’m married again…
January 21st, 2008 at 3:05 pmMaybe we could just stop bickering amongst ourselves. I feel like I’m married again…
Comment by Zooey — January 21, 2008 @ 3:05 pm
LOL
January 21st, 2008 at 3:16 pmthe zoo-keeper’s back
and there’s gonna be trou-ble
hey la, hey la
the zookeeper’s back
…
dating myself there… always loved those girl-groups…
to the tune of “my boyfriend’s back”, for you younguns…
luv ya, zooey…
January 21st, 2008 at 3:18 pmMaybe we could just stop bickering amongst ourselves.
Comment by Zooey — January 21, 2008 @ 3:05 pm
Yes, I guess you are right.
While I feel plunger would reach a larger, more receptive audience if he was to paraphrase, I guess I am not here to criticize the length of his posts. My apolgies plunger. Post away.
January 21st, 2008 at 3:18 pmThe other day I was driving down the road with my kids. Fighting kids ensued.
justasking: He’s being mean to me!!
plunger: Listen to me Listen to me Listen to me
Mary: Fred keeps pulling out his little thing and making me LOOK!!
Me: Don’t Make Me Pull This Car Over!!
January 21st, 2008 at 3:26 pmSomeone, somewhere, has those “missing” documents. Unfortunately, that person(s) would probably have a fatal “stroke” if he/she (they) came forward while Bushco is still in power.
BTW, while I would prefer shorter excerpts, links, and a stricter adherence to the thread’s topic; I have nothing against “plunger”. One can learn a lot from his posts if one has the time, and inclination, to read them. I can’t help but respect honest passion.
January 21st, 2008 at 3:31 pmI respect “passion” ; but posting the entire contents of War and Peace like plunger does isn’t about that ……..
January 21st, 2008 at 3:45 pmPlunger, you keep on posting!
Your information has revealed something I’d like to respond to:
Re: The vice president also said: “If we are successful in Iraq, if we can stand up a good, representative government in Iraq that secures the region so that it never again becomes a threat to its neighbors or to the United States, so it’s not pursuing weapons of mass destruction, so that it’s not a safe haven for terrorists, we will have struck a major blow right at the heart of the base, if you will, the geographic base of the terrorists who have had us under assault now for many years, but most especially on 9/11.â€
Powell and Rice disagree:
In Cairo, on February 24 2001, Powell said: “He (Saddam Hussein) has not developed any significant capability with respect to weapons of mass destruction. He is unable to project conventional power against his neighbours.”
This is the very opposite of what Bush and Blair said in public.
Powell even boasted that it was the US policy of “containment” that had effectively disarmed the Iraqi dictator - again the very opposite of what Blair said time and again. On May 15 2001, Powell went further and said that Saddam Hussein had not been able to “build his military back up or to develop weapons of mass destruction” for “the last 10 years”. America, he said, had been successful in keeping him “in a box”.
Two months later, Condoleezza Rice also described a weak, divided and militarily defenceless Iraq. “Saddam does not control the northern part of the country,” she said. “We are able to keep his arms from him. His military forces have not been rebuilt.”
Source.
January 21st, 2008 at 3:48 pmI respect “passion†; but posting the entire contents of War and Peace like plunger does isn’t about that ……..
Comment by MCMetal — January 21, 2008 @ 3:45 pm
I’m not so sure. However, I might get more annoyed if I didn’t have a fast internet connection.
January 21st, 2008 at 3:51 pmI guess nobody is listening to the impeach Cheney/Bush so maybe we should start a petition to impeach Pelosi and Reid for cowardace and enabling this administration. Start with Nancy as she is a closet Republican and needs to go today!
January 21st, 2008 at 3:57 pmkaty has spoken……plunger is allowed to post war and peace if he wants too…..guess no one else is entitled to an opinion….been here recently.
January 21st, 2008 at 3:58 pmwell… that makes it easier…
i do have to defend myself, as to fred’s bit of a fit @125…
his very first comment, on the very first day fred posted…
and i remember it well… “kinda uppity for a newbie”, i thought…
Fairy duster wins…….
you have all fallen for what repugs do…again. This guy isn’t even k rove and you still play thier game….
Fairy duster has dominated the discussion.
Comment by Fred — January 2, 2008 @ 11:34 am
eh? … and it gets better…
good on ya for settling in, fred…
but, uh, practice what you preach?
…
while i’ve got your attention, something i’ve wondered over these days :
just how old of an “old man” are you?
only curious, because i do enjoy discovering commenters who
are OLDER THAN I AM… aaaaaarrrrgh!…
:-)
January 21st, 2008 at 4:24 pmkaty,
January 21st, 2008 at 4:31 pmUntil Methuselah posts, you will hold the ribbon!
I finally had time to do something today I’ve wanted to do for a long time.
I respect the research that plunger has put into his work.
He’s obviously very well read, and intelligent as hell about the research he’s done.
It’s argumentative as to whether his paste-up style is effective in reaching the audience he intends to educate.
I pasted every one of his posts into Word, and his word count was 42,270.
January 21st, 2008 at 4:31 pmThat’s a lot of material to put on a thread and expect all but the most patient to read, let alone scroll past.
But, as this is a progressive blog, I’ll give plunger (why do I keep typing plunder?) a pass. His information is now in book form, email me for a copy.
Frank M just delivered his best Cheney imitation during Cabinet meetings.
January 21st, 2008 at 4:34 pmkaty has spoken……plunger is allowed to post war and peace if he wants too…..guess no one else is entitled to an opinion….been here recently.
Comment by Fred — January 21, 2008 @ 3:58 pm
now now Fred. don’t start pouting. katy isn’t the judge and jury here.
You are entitled to your opinion too. and considering you actually keep your posts to a respectable level (and speak as if you are sane), people actually read and respond to your posts.
January 21st, 2008 at 4:36 pmComment by Frank M — January 21, 2008 @ 4:38 pm
That’s only because he is the one behind the curtain!
January 21st, 2008 at 4:42 pmWalttheman: Did he fall into a narcoleptic trance? That’s what Cheney does any time he has to sit still for more than ten minutes.
January 21st, 2008 at 4:52 pmI’m surprised we know they’re missing and that apparently a department of government might have actually done something after finding them, so they were deleted. Why didn’t they just invite them to view the e-mails in Guantanamo?
What a legacy. But, heck, Saint Ronald is all but deified for, what, cutting the top quintile’s taxes during growth and then ending with a slowdown and senility? Or is it just being the only Repulslican president they can revere since Eisenhower (who spoke out against war)?
January 21st, 2008 at 4:55 pmWalttheman: Did he fall into a narcoleptic trance? That’s what Cheney does any time he has to sit still for more than ten minutes.
Comment by Veritas — January 21, 2008 @ 4:52 pm
what would you expect from a man whose heart no longer beats
January 21st, 2008 at 4:55 pm#141: Maybe. The guy knows that most of the talk there is completely irrelevant. Comment by Frank M — January 21, 2008 @ 4:38 pm
Hey, just because YOU are irrelevant, doesn’t make EVERYTHING ELSE! It just makes YOU STUPID! ;)
January 21st, 2008 at 4:56 pmGlad to see that everyone’s revved up today! All I can say regarding the Plunger bashing is that each time he posts sequential information coupled with allusion to valuable links, the number of people participating in repartee here increases four-fold. Many of my friends only come to TP when the see that he’s posting more info. So, for whatever it’s worth, despite the fact that some of us may be regulars and claim to know it all already (myself not included), his posts provide background, insight, and credible details to the uninitiated in their quest for truth. It’s such an improvement over some of the ridiculous back and forth I so frequently observe with the known trolls and others. To me, that becomes an exercise in mental masturbation. Just check out some of the troll blabber and bashing and see how much valuable, insightful information is garnered on those threads.
Particularly today when free speech and justice for all is the theme, let’s call a truce here and unite instead of fight. It’s good for the collective soul.
January 21st, 2008 at 5:01 pmWe’ve got enough “enemies within” in the highest offices in this government and surrounding us everywhere we look; we surely don’t need any more negativity in our lives.
January 21st, 2008 at 5:04 pmAnyone surprised the emails are missing?
January 21st, 2008 at 5:27 pmit was introduced in post 6 by evil spaniard and I don’t know about you guys but this is not a small thing……..did you read the article……all world markets down 5-7 percent….that’s the story of the day….the week….the month…..it could be the story of the year before it’s over if it doesn’t correct………
Comment by Fred — January 21, 2008 @ 2:32 pm
Fred,
The Market is what I do. And the topic of this thread was about Darth Cheney’s malfeasence. So personally, I am already on top of the market situation and came here more interested in how we are going to get the public outraged enough to actually make their rep.s in washington DO something about him and the rest of this administration to restore our Constitution and our civil liberties and hold them ACCOUNTABLE.
The current market situation is going to play out just like it always does, (it’ll go down and eventually it’ll go back up.) But the current financial crises can be attributted to the crimes that this administration and their corporate cronies have committed. Repugnicant greed knows no bounds.
So, please, stop raging against plunger’s post because although they are long, they are on topic. And some even find them interesting.
If he were a troll just out to anger like “southern madam” and “O I stuck my bigfoot in my mouth” and the others, I would say have at ‘em. But I think, and I could be way off base here, that plunger’s just trying to get the info out.
Peace.
January 21st, 2008 at 5:31 pm-E
Plungers posts maybe long, but they are also informative, I take the time to read alot of them.
And I guess nobody here would be surprised that Darth Dick’s emails are missing, on their lemming christofascist followers will keep in denial of the crimes of this administration.
Bush/Cheney
Hague Trials ‘09
Buck Fush
January 21st, 2008 at 6:19 pmkaty, I may be a newbe but I still have an opinion and you have no right to judge it based on how long I have been here….
January 21st, 2008 at 6:23 pmkaty
January 21st, 2008 at 6:24 pmAs far as fairy duster….sorry I don’t measure up to your expectations….I actually have been working on that but you wouldn’t know that because you come in at the end of a thread without knowing all that leads up to what is going on and pass judgment
For the future….you will treat me with at least the respect that you show to plunger and my opinion is mine and will be allowed if anyones is….
January 21st, 2008 at 6:27 pmIf you have a suggestion as to how I might deal better, you may offer it as just that…a suggestion…
katy
January 21st, 2008 at 6:32 pmI am 57 years old.
sorry for the mult posts….it would not let me post it at one time.
January 21st, 2008 at 6:36 pmI have this great dream where Cheney’s sitting at the morning briefing table, and the alien finally comes busting out of his chest, spraying acidic green blood all over the chymp, who freaks out and jumps out the window.
Just a dream, just a dream…
January 21st, 2008 at 6:48 pmI’m sure planning to write some sternly written letters cannot be too far off.
January 21st, 2008 at 7:09 pmI say let Plunger be free to post anything he wants. He does let us uninformed souls in on whats happening. I think he is a straight up guy.
January 21st, 2008 at 7:11 pmOh great, another useless investigation headed by the do nothing Democratic Congress.
January 21st, 2008 at 7:28 pmjust a question? with all that is known today about Bush and Cheney , why impeachment has not been on the table as of yet?
I’m curious because I really do not understand, I have signed petitions for impeachment of D. Cheney and yet nothing happenes?
January 21st, 2008 at 7:38 pmFred,
January 21st, 2008 at 7:38 pmI am 68, and all of my comments have disappeared into the dust bin of time on this thread.
Plunger reminds me a lot of Randi Rhodes… That is, interesting for a couple hours, and then it gets repetitive and the signal to noise ratio goes quickly to zero. Please, Plunger, get your OWN BLOG where you can post whatever you want, get folks to pay you for your research, and let the discussion here continue without you…
January 21st, 2008 at 8:08 pmUnless and until the Democratic leaders hold this administration accountable for the obvious crimes against humanity and against the Constitution, they are in jeopardy of losing this election, no matter who wins the primaries (or who the MSM picks to win the primaries). Until we get the obscene amounts of money out of our presidential politics, the networks will only cover the “front runners.” After all, the “front runners” will be paying tens of millions to TV stations to promote their candidacies. And voters who don’t pay attention will continue to vote for only the candidates they see on the TV. And what if they are told that a vote for Edwards in a Nevada caucus will get them fired from their jobs? It has happened.
January 21st, 2008 at 8:14 pmYou know. I would be willing to bet that most of us here could sit down with a list of known scandals, and the dates, and come pretty close to predicting when various documents went missing.
These (bleep)s in office continually remind me of the teenagers who used to work for me. They actually thought that I wouldn’t be suspicious when they would “call in sick” on Halloween, homecoming, or other social event.
I think what makes me the most angry is that we’ve been had by such incompetent criminals. If only more of us had been paying attention.
January 21st, 2008 at 9:25 pmThe thing about email is it never disappears. Since 2001, perhaps earlier, the NSA has intercepted, copied and stored all internet traffic, domestic and foreign, encrypted /secure and not.
Also, while CFR is the web for our controllers, the master spiders are the Trilateral Commission and an Anglo-Zionist group that is thus far unnamed but whose American agent has been rumoured to be Shultz and who may have seized control from the weakened Rockefeller and his TLC these past 7 years. Brzezinski is advising Obama on foreign policy so he is the safe vote to throw out the Shultz neo-cons hardline fascists and bring back the soft liberal fascists (not democracy, but it’s the best you can do).
January 22nd, 2008 at 1:08 amObstruction charges can also be laid if a person alters or destroys physical evidence, even if they were under no compulsion at any time to produce such evidence.
January 22nd, 2008 at 6:49 am
I’m curious because I really do not understand, I have signed petitions for impeachment of D. Cheney and yet nothing happenes?
Comment by joiks — January 21, 2008 @ 7:38 pm
Because Pelosi and Reid have taken it off the table as if it were their sole domain. That’s really where this focus needs to go.
Replace them both! but please everyone call and write them both and urge them to do the right thing.
January 22nd, 2008 at 8:23 am