ThinkFast: March 20, 2008
ThinkFast: March 20, 2008
“As the economy sours, voters are increasingly demanding immediate government relief,” which is a problem for Sen. John McCain (R-AZ), “whose focus has been on longer-term solutions such as tax and spending cuts and free trade.” “The notion of ‘the market will straighten things out, be patient’ — that has photos of Herbert Hoover juxtaposed with it,” said pollster John Zogby.
Rep. Tom Reynolds (R-NY), a key player in covering up the Mark Foley page scandal, will reportedly announce his retirement today. Reynolds was recently the chairman of the National Republican Congressional Committee, which has come “under fire after millions of dollars went missing in an accounting scandal during Reynold’s leadership.”
The LA Times reports that “turmoil over the war has increased” inside the Pentagon, with some commanders, including Gen. Davis Petraeus, advocating continued high troop levels in Iraq. On the other side “are the military service chiefs who fear that long tours and high troop levels” will leave “the Army and Marine Corps hollowed out and weakened.”
Five years after the invasion of Iraq, military recruiters acknowledge that much of the Middle Eastern immigrant community “remains deeply suspicious of the Army.” The military “has met recruitment goals for its translator program since 2006 after falling short in the first three years of the war.” In 2006, it recruited 277 translators, but dropped to 250 in 2007.
Former U.N. weapons inspector Hans Blix writes that “responsibility for the war must rest…on what those launching it knew by March 2003.” At the time, “Unmovic inspectors had carried out some 700 inspections at 500 sites without finding prohibited weapons. The contract that George Bush held up before Congress to show that Iraq was purchasing uranium oxide was proved to be a forgery.”
A senior Bush administration official told the Politico that confusion over a long-term agreement with Iraq resulted from a sloppy Arabic translation. But, as Jonathan Schwarz reports, Arabic experts say “the available Arabic versions of the Declaration of Principles are almost exactly the same as the official English version, and are likely direct translations from it.”
U.S. and European intelligence officials said that throughout the last ten years, “U.S. spy agencies have had little luck recruiting well-placed informants” within Al-Qaeda “and are finding the upper reaches of the network tougher to penetrate than the Kremlin during the Cold War.”
Vice President Dick Cheney visited Afghanistan today, meeting with President Hamid Karzai ahead of a NATO summit in April “where Washington will urge its allies to send more troops to the war-torn country.” At the same time, Cheney declared that there had been “remarkable progress” in the country, even though 2007 was its “most violent year since 2001.”
British Prime Minister Gordon Brown said yesterday “that climate change and pandemic disease threaten international security as much as terrorism and that Britain must radically improve its defenses.” Brown met with Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) in London today.
And finally: Tuesday was a “historic day at the Supreme Court” — it marked the first time “Oscar the Grouch entered the annals of Supreme Court jurisprudence.” Justice Antonin Scalia mentioned the character in a “tart rebuke aimed at Chief Justice John Roberts.” Scalia compared Washington state’s primary system to “allowing ‘Oscar the Grouch (Sesame Street’s famed bad-taste resident of a garbage can)’ to endorse Campbell’s soup repeatedly, without allowing the soup company to disavow his statement.”
What did we miss? Let us know in the comments section.
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Hugo Chavez and the Obama/Clinton Twins
http://www.smirkingchimp.com/thread/13549
** I encourage everyone to read this provocative article regarding the recent Colombia/Ecquador/Venezuela incident…and Hillary and Barack’s reaction to it. We don’t have to imagine how either would act if the phone rang at 3am. They’ve just shown us.
March 20th, 2008 at 9:00 amHere Comes Worldwide Currency Debasement
Source: London Telegraph - Ambrose Evans Pritchard
As feared, foreign bond holders have begun to exercise a collective vote of no confidence in the devaluation policies of the US government. The Federal Reserve faces a potential veto of its rescue measures.
Asian, Mideast, and European investors stood aside at last week’s auction of 10-year US Treasury notes. “It was a disaster,” said Ray Attrill from 4castweb. “We may be close to the point where the uglier consequences of benign neglect towards the currency are revealed.”
The share of foreign buyers (”indirect bidders”) plummeted to 5.8 percent, from an average 25 percent over the last eight weeks. On the Richter Scale of unfolding dramas, this matches the death of Bear Stearns.
Rightly or wrongly, a view has taken hold that Washington is cynically debasing the coinage, hoping to export its day of reckoning through beggar-thy-neighbour policies
http://blacklistednews.com/view.asp?ID=5933
Everything the feds have done so far has given us a few good days of market news and further devalued our dollar - which many economists say is one of the most serious problems we are facing. Talk about a Cheney shotgun approach. Start shooting and hope you hit something.
March 20th, 2008 at 9:10 amGood morning, 2mil. You’re up and ready as usual to inform the TP community well. Keep up the good work.
March 20th, 2008 at 9:11 amHeads Monsanto Wins, Tails We Lose; The Genetically Modified Food Gambleby Robert Weissman
There have been few experiments as reckless, overhyped and with as little potential upside as the rapid rollout of genetically modified crops.
Last month, the International Service for the Acquisition of Agri-biotech Applications (ISAAA), a pro-biotech nonprofit, released a report highlighting the proliferation of genetically modified crops. According to ISAAA, biotech crop area grew 12 percent, or 12. 3 million hectares, to reach 114. 3 million hectares in 2007, the second highest area increase in the past five years.
For the biotech backers, this is cause to celebrate. They claim that biotech helps farmers. They say it promises to reduce hunger and poverty in developing countries.”If we are to achieve the Millennium Development Goals (MDGs) of cutting hunger and poverty in half by 2015,” says Clive James, ISAAA founder and the author the just-released report, “biotech crops must play an even bigger role in the next decade.”
In fact, existing genetically modified crops are hurting small farmers and failing to deliver increased food supply — and posing enormous, largely unknown risks to people and the planet.
http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/03/19/7769/
Anyone who has not read any of the Seeds of Destruction articles at globalresearch.ca needs to spend some time reading them. What this is doing to agriculture is devastating.
March 20th, 2008 at 9:16 amOn the other side “are the military service chiefs who fear that long tours and high troop levels” will leave “the Army and Marine Corps hollowed out and weakened.”
The military is already hollowed out and weakened. We can’t keep doing this. We can’t afford it financially and we can’t afford it militarily. Don’t any of those generals see that it is just plain wrong to use our military to occupy a country that doesn’t want us there?
March 20th, 2008 at 9:16 amI think I’ve been dreaming the last week because I swear that Hussein Obama was involved in some kind of scandal involving race and his bad judgment but, for some crazy reason, I can’t find a thing about it on this site!!!
March 20th, 2008 at 9:17 amAs the economy sours, voters are increasingly demanding immediate government relief
The best option to bring relief to main street, as of now, is to keep smoking the hopium. It’s as simple, yet powerful, as that.
March 20th, 2008 at 9:19 amCheney declared that there had been “remarkable progress” in the country, even though 2007 was its “most violent year since 2001.”
Well more death is considered progress…. to an avatar of Satan.
March 20th, 2008 at 9:20 amCheney will keep repeating “remarkable progress” until he’s frog-marched out the door. Since he’s getting his “briefings” on the subject by sitting in front of FoxSnooze all day, it’s no wonder he’s (deliberately) delusional.
March 20th, 2008 at 9:22 amAnd the beat goes on Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 9:23 amMarch 20th, 2008 at 9:16 am
Heads Monsanto Wins, Tails We Lose; The Genetically Modified Food Gambleby Robert Weissman
There have been few experiments as reckless, overhyped and with as little potential upside as the rapid rollout of genetically modified crops.
—————-
You’ve just posted the article I was going to lead with tomorrow! GM food is an issue that gets absolutely NO attention from any media, even the Progressive. I’ve said that the control of the food supply by Monsanto is just as evil, if not more, than the control of worldwide oil by multinational. The GM food issue is so SERIOUS and DANGEROUS, yet there’s no discussion at all in this country. This issue needs an “Al Gore” to put it on the map.
British Prime Minister Gordon Brown said yesterday “that climate change and pandemic disease threaten international security as much as terrorism and that Britain must radically improve its defenses.” Brown met with Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) in London today.
These threats are more of a threat to the world than terrorism. Terrorism may kill a few hundred to a thousand people. Pandemic diseases and climate change can and will kill hundreds of thousands of people. We can no longer stick our heads in the sand and pretend everything on this earth is peachy keen. You need to stop a pandemic before it starts and you need to stop permanent climate change before it is too late.
March 20th, 2008 at 9:24 amYeah, Wall Street had a rally yesterday, so all economic woes must be cured.
The fed is not representative of the heart of this country. Those with modest means, or not mega wealthy, have to shoulder “personal responsibility”, but the 1% is worthy of the grandest welfare, even if they wouldn’t starve or find their standard of living significantly decreased w/o it.
We’re seen as a joke these days.
March 20th, 2008 at 9:26 amAnd the beat goes on Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 9:16 am
Anyone who has not read any of the Seeds of Destruction articles at globalresearch.ca needs to spend some time reading them. What this is doing to agriculture is devastating.
Also seed from genetically altered stock is not reusable, farmer cannot save the seed for next years crops, making them dependent on the seed manufacturers.
I personally never buy genetically altered seed from the bio-corps for my home garden. I buy from Seeds of Change
March 20th, 2008 at 9:27 amEverything the feds have done so far has given us a few good days of market news and further devalued our dollar - which many economists say is one of the most serious problems we are facing. Talk about a Cheney shotgun approach. Start shooting and hope you hit something.
And because of the ill-will that Bush & Company have generated in the international community, I seriously doubt that they are going to step up to the plate and help us out.
Thanks Bush for destroying our economy and for destroying our standing in the world. I’m not exactly sure what the neoCONs expected they would accomplish by bankrupting our government.
March 20th, 2008 at 9:27 amgoon_golly Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 9:21 am
That’s odd for ThinkProgress to be citing Zogby as its source for McCain being in trouble when the latest Zogby poll shows McCain ahead of Obama by 6%.
In a poll taken prior to Obama’s two strong speeches this week, during the time when the pastor’s speeches were being played repeatedly on tv. Wow.
While you’re here, goon, please explain to us about Al Qaeda and access to Iraqi oil wealth — without production and sales, remember? You keep skittering away whenever the question is raised; one would think you had no answer.
March 20th, 2008 at 9:28 amThey expected Golden Parachutes, so they could comfortably sit in their gated homes and not have to watch everything crumble around them.
March 20th, 2008 at 9:30 amIraq. Iraq. Iraq.
You never hear about New Orleans anymore.
When I think back to that Made-for-TV moment when we saw the “Mission Accomplished” sign, I knew the true meaning of those words. Since day one, this administration was set out to sew constant discord in the Middle East. The mission that these PNACers have accomplished is the ever stirring of the pot in the Middle East.
Blackwater USA, Bechtel, Haliburton are all reaping in the profits. And if you are in the defense industry: big bucks all around.
Meanwhile, this great Nation is crumbling. Our economy is tanking, our spirit as a country is dwindling and our standing in the world is abyssmal.
Meanwhile back at the ranch (Crawford, perhaps?) or in Cheney’s bunker this Krazed Kabal is percolating plans for Iran. Why isn’t the mainstream media talking about Fallon’s firing.
Oh, I guess we’d rather talk about a governor’s sex life.
March 20th, 2008 at 10:19 amCheney declared that there had been “remarkable progress” in the country
I think that the appropriate response to this BS is the same as the one that Darth Cheney gave Martha Radatz when she asked him about the lack of public support for GDumbya’s dirty little avoidable war in Iraq . . . “So?”
March 20th, 2008 at 10:19 amA must see movie regarding Monstanto, GM food and all the horrors associated with it is “The Future of Food” by Debra Koons Garcia.
The Widow put some of Jerry’s money to good use.
March 20th, 2008 at 10:26 amno Sh1a ever called me n1gg3r
March 20th, 2008 at 10:32 amMcWars Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 9:26 am
Yeah, Wall Street had a rally yesterday, so all economic woes must be cured.
Thank goodness. :)
Guess what!? It snowed last night in Idaho, and it’s the first day of Spring — global climate change is cured!
March 20th, 2008 at 10:33 amWas TP down for about 30 minutes or was it just me?
March 20th, 2008 at 10:34 amWayne Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 9:27 am
And the beat goes on Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 9:16 am
Anyone who has not read any of the Seeds of Destruction articles at globalresearch.ca needs to spend some time reading them. What this is doing to agriculture is devastating.
Also seed from genetically altered stock is not reusable, farmer cannot save the seed for next years crops, making them dependent on the seed manufacturers.
I personally never buy genetically altered seed from the bio-corps for my home garden. I buy from Seeds of Change
———–
Why isn’t our food supply an issue in the Presidential race? The only candidate who I heard mention it was Dennis Kucinich. He’s been anti GM food for a LONG time.
This is about two or three multinational bio-tech companies controlling the food supply. Period.
We’re all being used as guinea pigs in a giant experiment. There’s never been sufficient testing to determine if this stuff is safe for human consumption. They’re playing mad science with the food supply that every living creature on this planet evolved on. That’s about as dangerous as it gets.
If you live in America and you’re eating anything with corn, soybean or canola just assume it’s GM.
March 20th, 2008 at 10:35 amgg is our Dana Peroxide: a clueless liar defending the mass-murdering sociopaths that have stolen our government.
March 20th, 2008 at 10:37 am#10 2mil and #13 Wayne
While globalresearch.ca ran these articles they also ran articles about the seed vault in Norway. Contributers to the vault include Rockefellers, Buffet, and Gates. Even though there are seed vaults built all over the world, their significance is obvious. By the way, thanks Calibleu for the reminder about this sinister program and what it is doing to the global food supply.
Read as many of these articles as you can. They paint a picture that will really disturb you. http://globalresearch.ca/ index.php?context=theme&themeId=24
By the way, Cali has been buying books about how to save and store your own seeds. They are also talking about turning their wonderful garden into a community garden for all of us to share.
March 20th, 2008 at 10:40 amThec*ntwhocan’t,
Instead of “your” in the #24, I think you meant “his”.
And then I totally agree.
March 20th, 2008 at 10:45 am“This [genetic engineering] is a matter far too important to be left solely in the hands of the scientific and medical communities. The belief that…science always moves forward represents a form of laissez-faire nonsense dismally reminiscent of the credo that American business if left to itself will solve everybody’s problems. Just as the success of a corporate body in making money need not set the human condition ahead, neither does every scientific advance automatically make our lives more ‘meaningful’.”
Dr. James D. Watson, co-discoverer of the double helix structure of DNA and Nobel Laureate
March 20th, 2008 at 10:47 am2MillionLightYearsToAndromeda Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 10:35 am
Why isn’t our food supply an issue in the Presidential race? The only candidate who I heard mention it was Dennis Kucinich. He’s been anti GM food for a LONG time.
Cause the agribusiness industry is extremely powerful. They’ve ruined politicians for so much as suggesting that people eat less beef. They’ve blocked labeling of GMO foods, they’ve kept minimum-wage laws from applying to farm workers, and they’ve maintained a huge subsidy regime at a time when food prices are rising globally.
The GMO issue is just one tiny part of the problems plaguing our food infrastructure. The primary issue is industrial agriculture. Over the last 100 years, we’ve built a system that is monoculture-based, fossil-fuel dependant (for fertilizers and farm equipment), soil-depleting, pesticide-dependant, watershed-destroying, slave labor-enabling, and less-nutritious than ever.
March 20th, 2008 at 10:47 amZooey Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 10:33 am
McWars Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 9:26 am
Guess what!? It snowed last night in Idaho, and it’s the first day of Spring — global climate change is cured!
Zooey? You live in Idaho? Is that possible? I guess maybe that would explain why Obama carried the state by 40 points, at least….
March 20th, 2008 at 10:48 am“The issues have simply not been addressed and I think that’s what is profoundly unsatisfactory. The fundamental problem of the way in which GM foods have been approved is that they haven’t really been tested properly at all. All that has happened is something which I would characterise as an exercise in wishful thinking.”
Dr. Erik Millstone, Sussex University, on the inadequacies of GM food testing interviewed in a Channel 4 report on the “substanial equivalence” proceedure for GM foods which the program claimed is a testing system agreed in a backroom deal between governments and companies designed to get GM products onto the market quickly and cheaply.
March 20th, 2008 at 10:48 am“Genetic modification of food is a dangerous game of ecological roulette. To take one example, I’m sure there will be a significant increase in deaths from certain types of cancer. If that is the only adverse effect we will have been lucky.
We simply cannot predict the ecological effects of genetic modification. GM forces evolution to take place in one generation rather than hundreds.
Manipulating DNA creates a new substance and it may not behave in the same ways as the origninal version. And existing tests, which only detect already-known toxins, may not reveal man-made ones.
We simply do not know what we are doing.”
- Samuel Epstein, M.D., Professor of Environmental Medicine at the University of Illinois School of Public Health and Chairman of the Cancer Prevention Coalition
March 20th, 2008 at 10:49 amAnd the beat goes on Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 10:40 am
While globalresearch.ca ran these articles they also ran articles about the seed vault in Norway. Contributers to the vault include Rockefellers, Buffet, and Gates. Even though there are seed vaults built all over the world, their significance is obvious. By the way, thanks Calibleu for the reminder about this sinister program and what it is doing to the global food supply.
I don’t see anything wrong with the seed vaults - they’re just trying to preserve threatened crops for a future in which climate change will cause mass extinction of local varieties of plants. I don’t think Buffet and Gates know anything we don’t know - they know what the climate scientists have been shouting at us for years.
March 20th, 2008 at 10:51 amKeltoi Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 10:48 am
Zooey? You live in Idaho? Is that possible?
———————————–
You didn’t know Zooey lived in Idaho? You must have missed all her posts citing her embarrassment over Larry Craig.
March 20th, 2008 at 10:51 amhussein toasterhead Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 10:47 am
2MillionLightYearsToAndromeda Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 10:35 am
Why isn’t our food supply an issue in the Presidential race? The only candidate who I heard mention it was Dennis Kucinich. He’s been anti GM food for a LONG time.
————
The GMO issue is just one tiny part of the problems plaguing our food infrastructure. The primary issue is industrial agriculture. Over the last 100 years, we’ve built a system that is monoculture-based, fossil-fuel dependant (for fertilizers and farm equipment), soil-depleting, pesticide-dependant, watershed-destroying, slave labor-enabling, and less-nutritious than ever.
————
It’s extremely complex. Agreed. The public seems to turn away from issues that are that cannot be understood in 30 seconds. Even if we had a media that would report on these agribusiness-bio-tech issues I’m not sure the public would be able to follow.
March 20th, 2008 at 10:55 am2MillionLightYearsToAndromeda Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 10:34 am
Was TP down for about 30 minutes or was it just me?
I could read TP for a while, but couldn’t comment. Seems to be ok now.
March 20th, 2008 at 10:58 am2MillionLightYearsToAndromeda Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 10:55 am
It’s extremely complex. Agreed. The public seems to turn away from issues that are that cannot be understood in 30 seconds. Even if we had a media that would report on these agribusiness-bio-tech issues I’m not sure the public would be able to follow.
Well, we don’t have to worry about that. Advertisers like Kraft and ADM and Philip Morris will never allow our media to report on these issues.
March 20th, 2008 at 10:59 amKeltoi Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 10:48 am
Zooey? You live in Idaho? Is that possible? I guess maybe that would explain why Obama carried the state by 40 points, at least….
I know it’s early, but try making some sense…
March 20th, 2008 at 11:00 ammissmolly Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 10:51 am
Keltoi Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 10:48 am
Zooey? You live in Idaho? Is that possible?
———————————–
You didn’t know Zooey lived in Idaho? You must have missed all her posts citing her embarrassment over Larry Craig.
And all this time I thought Keltoi lived for my comments. **sniff**
March 20th, 2008 at 11:01 ammissmolly Says:
You didn’t know Zooey lived in Idaho? You must have missed all her posts citing her embarrassment over Larry Craig.
Wow, no I didn’t know…you don’t have to live in Idaho to find Craig an embarassment.
Well now I owe Zooey two TP Karmic debts - I can admit I am a Troll and I can admit I live in Idaho.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:03 amZooey Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 10:58 am
2MillionLightYearsToAndromeda Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 10:34 am
Was TP down for about 30 minutes or was it just me?
I could read TP for a while, but couldn’t comment. Seems to be ok now.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:09 am—————
I thought I passed through a worm-hole. Glad I wasn’t the only one.
good_golly Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 9:21 am
FLIP
That’s odd for ThinkProgress to be citing Zogby as its source for McCain being in trouble when the latest Zogby poll shows McCain ahead of Obama by 6%.
“McCain leads 46 percent to 40 percent in a hypothetical matchup against Obama in the November presidential election, according to the poll. That is a sharp turnaround from the Reuters/Zogby poll from last month, which showed in a head-to-head matchup that Obama would beat McCain 47 percent to 40 percent.”
FLOP
Comment by good_golly — February 29, 2008 @ 2:47 pm
Pollsters also predicted that Obama would win California by double digits. That is just one recent example of why I don’t put too much weight in them.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:09 amSome of us have been maintaining the heritage seeds and stock that our granparents handed down to us….
you don’t know everything and your insulting. I flagged you for you shotgun remark.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:14 amI flagged it too, Fred, and also the one about Country Boy.
Time to send this one packing, folks. Flag away!
March 20th, 2008 at 11:17 amKeltoi Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 11:03 am
Well now I owe Zooey two TP Karmic debts - I can admit I am a Troll and I can admit I live in Idaho.
You live in Idaho?
March 20th, 2008 at 11:18 amZooey Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 11:00 am
Keltoi Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 10:48 am
Zooey? You live in Idaho? Is that possible? I guess maybe that would explain why Obama carried the state by 40 points, at least….
I know it’s early, but try making some sense…
In the Democratic primary a month or more ago, Obama buried Clinton by a huge margin. You would not expect that to happen in the state made famous by Aryan Nations. The Nazi thing was always a crock in my experience, but the redneck thing, that is for real. And yet the voters chose a Black man over a White woman - I found that impressive, thought maybe it was your influence.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:19 amAN OPEN LETTER TO HILLARY CLINTON FROM A WELLESLEY COLLEGE ALUMNA
snip..
What does this have to do with you?
You have connections to Monsanto through the Rose Law Firm where you worked and through Bill who hired Monsanto people for central food-related roles. Your Orwellian-named “Rural Americans for Hillary” was planned withTroutman Sanders, Monsanto’s lobbyists.
Genetic engineering and industrialized food and animal production all come together at the Rose Law Firm, which represents the world’s largest GE corporation (Monsanto), GE’s most controversial project (DP&L’s - now Monsanto’s - terminator genes), the world’s largest meat producer (Tyson), the world’s largest retailer and a dominant food retailer (Walmart).
http://www.care2.com/c2c/share/detail/626639
Lest we forget…some food for thought. /snark
March 20th, 2008 at 11:19 amHere’s the generally accepted definition of a recession:
Although, we are not technically in a recession, most people believe that we are either now in or will soon be in recession.
By the looks of this thread, it looks like the next on the agenda is promoting the idea of impending depression.
My question is:
Is it a little soon to be lamenting the coming depression, when we haven’t technically met the threshold for recession?
Also, while it is important to proactively consider the impact of today’s economic policy, is there any jeopardy that an excessive drumbeat of predicted economic malaise might result in a self fulfilling prophecy?
Captain Mantastic
March 20th, 2008 at 11:22 amKeltoi Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 10:48 am
Zooey? You live in Idaho?
Proof positive the concern troll hasn’t been paying attention to anything.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:28 amis there any jeopardy that an excessive drumbeat of predicted economic malaise might result in a self fulfilling prophecy?
Methinks you know absolutely nothing about how the economy works, tool.
But then again, Wingtards don’t do “reality” very well.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:30 amAlso, while it is important to proactively consider the impact of today’s economic policy, is there any jeopardy that an excessive drumbeat of predicted economic malaise might result in a self fulfilling prophecy?
Captain Mantastic
Here, let me rephrase that, to offer a case in point…
Also, while it is important to proactively consider the impact of a march to war, is there any jeopardy that an excessive drumbeat of false pretenses might result in a self fulfilling prophecy?
March 20th, 2008 at 11:30 amCaptain Mantastic
More like “Private Peon”.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:31 amCaptain/backup,
Please stay focused and at least sign your posts with the same alias you are posting under. Your slip is showing.
How many alias do you have anyway? Is one of your identities that sick fck Themanwhocan’t?
March 20th, 2008 at 11:32 amNevar Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 11:30 am
Excellent! And so true.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:33 amKeltoi Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 11:19 am
In the Democratic primary a month or more ago, Obama buried Clinton by a huge margin. You would not expect that to happen in the state made famous by Aryan Nations. The Nazi thing was always a crock in my experience, but the redneck thing, that is for real. And yet the voters chose a Black man over a White woman - I found that impressive, thought maybe it was your influence.
I know, I was at the local caucus. I only have one vote, but thanks.
In case you didn’t know, the Aryan Nation organization was driven out of Idaho when their “compound” was taken from them in a lawsuit.
Even rednecks will vote in accordance with their own interests after 8 years of Dubya.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:34 amEthanol Boondoggle
Sounds like more benefits for the big guys, while we remain totally fcuked.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:34 amSorry, here’s LINK.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:35 amthis is good.
a letter from gene kelly’s widow to modo at the times.
even the dead want nothing to do with bush.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:43 amZooey Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 11:34 am
Keltoi Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 11:19 am
I know, I was at the local caucus. I only have one vote, but thanks.
In case you didn’t know, the Aryan Nation organization was driven out of Idaho when their “compound” was taken from them in a lawsuit.
Yes, and Butler is dead, bad cess to him. I actually had the daughter of Mrs. Keenan (the lawsuit plaintiff) as a student. Can’t say I miss all the drama on 4th of July when AN used to march downtown. I am guessing you live in the Panhandle? I live in CDA.
Even rednecks will vote in accordance with their own interests after 8 years of Dubya.
Yeah! I am living proof, I guess.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:45 amAnd the beat goes on Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 11:19 am
AN OPEN LETTER TO HILLARY CLINTON FROM A WELLESLEY COLLEGE ALUMNA
snip..
What does this have to do with you?
————————
Yes, I read this piece over a month ago. If people understood the GM issue they’d know that this association of Hillary’s is FAR FAR worse and more controversial than Obama’s association with that Pastor.
This association of Hillary’s should be getting all the media attention that’s been spent on Obama.
Is there any reporter in the corporate media smart or knowledgeable enough to tell this story even if they were given the green light? I doubt it.
Heck, we’re only talking about all the food Americans eat every single meal every single day. That’s not important, is it? Lets spend all our time talking about some Pastor.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:46 amBear stearns was the first guilty of a run on the bank…..why are you talking to us about it Captain? When those people start to panic it is much like seeing the explosives techniston running isn’t it…..time to run
March 20th, 2008 at 11:46 amEven rednecks will vote in accordance with their own interests after 8 years of Dubya.
I tend to think of southerners only as rednecks from their exposure to the sun.
Further north, I prefer the term “hillbillies”.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:47 amWatch as the Republicans deniers of climate change begin to embrace it as a way to increase spending in defense/security industries. The only thing that will be too expensive for them will be decreasing carbon emissions and investing in alternative energy sources.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:55 amSounds like you missed the discussion yesterday. I’ve been banned from TP as CaptainMantastic and most of my previous posts have been deleted, lthough, I try to be respectful and I agree with many of the threads.
I don’t mind posting as either backup or CaptainMantastic or something else, as long as I’m not silenced because I disagree with some of the content here or my sincere disagreements may offend some.
Thanks for the opportunity to participate in the debate.
March 20th, 2008 at 11:55 amGood morning, all.
Darth Cheney broke my Outrage-O-Meter yesterday; do you guys know of anyone who can repair it…?
Thanx,
~A
March 20th, 2008 at 11:58 amDie for peace.
You’re right about the Ethanol. It’s pork barrel for farmers that got a lot of play out of the Iowa campaigning.
The answer is not ethanol, let’s save the corn for people to eat.
Instead of ethanol lets focus more on conservation, build more nuclear plants, pursue more responsible oil drilling and coal mining in the U.S. (to meet short-term needs) while we embark on a serious national effort to switch to better, and more environmentally friendly, alternatives.
March 20th, 2008 at 12:04 pm“McCain leads 46 percent to 40 percent in a hypothetical matchup against Obama in the November presidential election, according to the poll. That is a sharp turnaround from the Reuters/Zogby poll from last month, which showed in a head-to-head matchup that Obama would beat McCain 47 percent to 40 percent.”
This poll means nothing for three reasons.
1) It polls likely voters but doesn’t take into account that the Democrats have been outvoting the Republicans 2, 3 and sometimes four to 1. It also doesn’t take into account the number of new, young voters who are all going Democratic.
2) The people they are polling, for the most part, have no idea who John McCain is today and what he stands for. The press is giving him passes on all his mistakes and they are still promoting the idea that he is a moderate and a maverick. Once the public meets the real John McCain through Democratic advertisements, they will abandon him in large numbers.
3) The polls six months ago had Hillary beating Obama by wide margins. Need I say more?
March 20th, 2008 at 12:05 pmI flagged it too, Fred, and also the one about Country Boy.
Time to send this one packing, folks. Flag away!
Looks like it worked. Congratulations folks. Can this mean that TP is really starting to pay attention to the troll problem? If so, why is it ignoring GiGi’s spamming?
March 20th, 2008 at 12:09 pmI don’t mind posting as either backup or CaptainMantastic or something else, as long as I’m not silenced because I disagree with some of the content here or my sincere disagreements may offend some.
Thanks for the opportunity to participate in the debate.
It was silenced because it was a useless spamming offensive troll. If only TP would ban people by their IP address, trolls like this would not keep popping back up like a bunch of useless weeds.
March 20th, 2008 at 12:14 pmWhy would anyone lobby to keep everyone’s rose-tinted glasses on? Capt. - do you think optimism would’ve prevented the Depression? Doesn’t matter what the thing is called, when it leaves you broke and on the skids, it is a bad thing.
SO this Reynolds in NY makes the how-manieth R to bail??? 29? 30? 31?
March 20th, 2008 at 12:18 pmThat is too funny for words. You didn’t get banned for being respectful. And do you think the regular posters here don’t remember your persona which was anything but charming. What we can’t believe is that they let you back under a different name.
March 20th, 2008 at 12:22 pmbilbobaggins supports banning those who disagree here at Thinkprogress. But, here’s bilbo over at redstate complaining about them hypocritically banning a dissenting view. He starts in about post #20 to the end.
http://www.redstate.com/ stories/ culture/ two_cheers_for_the_hypocrites
You can obviously ban those that disagree with you. But, when you do, I suggest that you are signaling that you’re not confident enough in you positions to entertain a debate.
The progressive position on most issues is strong. Prove it by allowing people to disagree with you.
Otherwise, this place becomes only a partisan cheering section for democrats.
P.S. Bilbo. Reread you’re comments at redstate and seriously tell me you don’t feel hypocritical.
March 20th, 2008 at 12:25 pmHere’s a good clip from bilbo over at redstate:
I suggest stop with the whack-a-troll and a free exchange occur.
I spend an inordinate amount of time trying to justify being able to dissent. Nobody, including me, wants to spend time talking about it. Instead, let the debate continue, without worrying about who should or should not be allowed to participate.
March 20th, 2008 at 12:32 pmThe Captain’s not all that bad. He likes some of those righty unicorn theories, but he’ll reason along with a person, and admit to things that no other troll-types ever will.
March 20th, 2008 at 12:34 pmWell now, Capt., you’ve been here to witness what the cat drags in - and you know there is no reasoning with some of the hysterical incoherent righty types that like to come here to vandalize threads. That type of thing makes folks pretty touchy over time.
March 20th, 2008 at 12:36 pmSure Captain Mantastic you’re so respectful but you’re attacking Bilbo in the next breath. So predictable.
March 20th, 2008 at 12:40 pmtombaker,
you make a good point about optimism not preventing the depression. I agree.
But, you have to admit, there might be an argument for balance.
People make business and purchasing decisions based on what they think the future will hold. It’s possible with a competitive 24 hour news cycle that thrives on sensationalism, the barrage of dire predictions would effect those purchasing and business decisions more than they would, if the economic data wasn’t presented in a format that’s competing for ratings.
I think the economy is slowing, but depression? I think there is a disconnect between the data and the prevailing sentiment.
March 20th, 2008 at 12:46 pmhey all…
getting ready for “space invaders” for the weekend… my reading and posting of
comments will be sparce the coming days…
just wanted to say HAPPY FIRST DAY OF SPRING ! ! ! ! !
ya’ll have a good weekend and/or a happy easter celebration…
as usual, i’ll be the lone lefty at sunday’s gathering and dinner…
there are enough of us to keep any conversations away from politics…
in this case, a very good thing.
good day and days ahead! …
take care of each other.
March 20th, 2008 at 12:49 pmShayne, come on. Bilbo is probably a great guy (or gal), but you can’t go over to redstate and complain that there hypocrites for not allowing a dissenting view (they let bilbo go on, BTW) and then come back here an promote flagging opponents here.
I respect everyone here. Even bilbobaggins. But, Bilbo is suggesting you flag me because I disagree. I’m compelled to respond; wouldn’t you.
March 20th, 2008 at 12:50 pmtombaker. I also agree with you that some come here only to disrupt and distract. It’s a difficult situation and I understand the desire to weed those people out.
I only hope that people here would understand it is not my intention to disrupt the debate, but many times to offer an alternative view. I sincerely hope to become more enlightened and add to the debate, if I can.
March 20th, 2008 at 12:56 pmFurther north, I prefer the term “hillbillies”.
Recommend (0) | Report Abuse
Ever hear of “Northerbillies”?
March 20th, 2008 at 1:55 pmbackup Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 12:32 pm
I suggest stop with the whack-a-troll…
______
Give up Whack-a-Troll™? Never… NEVER!
Whack-a-Troll™… the sport of Kings!
March 20th, 2008 at 1:57 pmBilbo Hussein Baggins Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 12:14 pm
It was silenced because it was a useless spamming offensive troll.
_______
Somehow, TP would be a tamer place w/out the trolls, whether or not we care to admit that. I usually don’t flag someone until they get truly offensive, like thefoolcouldn’tspell did this morning w/ his comment about sucking on shotguns.
As far as mantastic/backup is concerned, I find him annoying but not nearly as offensive as the afore mentioned fool, or Mr P , Jake, rob roy (remember THAT one??) or so many other trolls that did manage to get themselves banned.
The flagging function is kinda fascinating, no? It seems similar to that show “Survivor” where folks get voted off by the other contestants. Some trolls (Daryll, g_g) are obnoxious as all get out yet somehow manage to stay on the the island.
I have to wonder, did TP set it up this way on purpose? They’ve basically left it up to us to decide who gets to stay and who goes. I have no doubt that some trolls have flagged me from time to time, but apparently not in large enough numbers to get me bumped. I’m sure g_g and Daryll and R_R have all been flagged, but not enough to be banished for good.
It’s kinda of a microcosm of democracy, huh? Once enough folks are offended at the same time, like thsi morning, a poster is gone. It has to reach a critical mass. Free speech is a strange and mysterious thing.
Give up Whack-a-troll™? HAH! never….
March 20th, 2008 at 2:09 pmCaptain, if you’re still around how about my post at 60? Tell me why we shouldn’t be concerned if they are behaving the way they are.
March 20th, 2008 at 2:14 pmIn it’s continued droning self defense, Captain/backup/troll has attempted to make the thread all about him/her/it. It doesn’t realize that it’s former postings under it’s old moniker also did just that and maybe that is the reason it was flagged so often. It’s strategy of feigned politeness in the hope of not being banned belies the fact that in it’s mind, it’s all about him. By simply signing today’s post with it’s former name it attempts to breed controversy and turn it all around to him.
March 20th, 2008 at 2:30 pmFLAGGED
#47 - backup Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 11:22 am
“Also, while it is important to proactively consider the impact of today’s economic policy, is there any jeopardy that an excessive drumbeat of predicted economic malaise might result in a self fulfilling prophecy?”
Probably the exact same jeopady that an illogically upbeat assessment of this same economy by Pres. Bush and his cronies will somehow magically lift the economy.
March 20th, 2008 at 2:32 pmbilbobaggins supports banning those who disagree here at Thinkprogress. But, here’s bilbo over at redstate complaining about them hypocritically banning a dissenting view. He starts in about post #20 to the end.
Did this troll get banned within an hour of posting something that went counter to the conventional wisdom here? I remember it being around for months and months.
So, did TP ban this troll for no reason other than the fact that it posted something that TP disagreed with?
There is no comparison. But it needs something to justify it’s existence. Nice try troll.
March 20th, 2008 at 2:44 pmI have no doubt that some trolls have flagged me from time to time, but apparently not in large enough numbers to get me bumped. I’m sure g_g and Daryll and R_R have all been flagged, but not enough to be banished for good.
I disagree with this. I firmly believe that all these trolls have been flagged enough to qualify to be banned. But, for some reason TP lets them stay around. And what’s the common element of these not-banned trolls? They are all capable of running a thread up into the hundreds of posts. I think that TP likes that. I think they think it makes them look successful. Maybe they are competing with the HP where threads routinely run into 400-500 posts, rarely with trolls like the ones we have here.
March 20th, 2008 at 2:48 pmSlowdown could have been avoided
A well-respected economist says the U.S. is now in a recession…and that Congress and the Federal Reserve could have stopped it.
Who could argue with someone named Laksham Achuthan????
And the best part:
(my emphasis added.)
March 20th, 2008 at 2:58 pmPatriot.
I can see why you think that. But, yesterday people were asking me why I wasn’t up front about formally posting as CaptainMantastic (implicating that I was being decietful, so I agreed to reference the mantastic moniker in future posts. That’s what I was attempting to do, not incite you. Sometimes, you can’t win.
March 20th, 2008 at 3:48 pmScalia compared Washington state’s primary system to “allowing ‘Oscar the Grouch (Sesame Street’s famed bad-taste resident of a garbage can)’ to endorse Campbell’s soup repeatedly, without allowing the soup company to disavow his statement.”
No, Antonin, it’s more like Big Bird would make a better SC justice than you.
March 20th, 2008 at 4:05 pmCome on bilbo,
I disagree with you, so I’m not human? That’s a little creepy. Maybe you should steer clear of that 70 year-old playbook. I don’t think those enabling you are doing you any favors.
BTW, you don’t want to seem to comment on the duplicity of your support of ‘the price the liberals are willing to pay to allow everyone the right to have their voice heard’ over at redstate and your hope that ‘TP would ban people by their IP address, so trolls like this would not keep popping back up like a bunch of useless weeds’.
I’m having a hard time understanding which position you are advocating.
Instead of running from the comments, step up to the plate and explain yourself. It would do your credibility some good.
March 20th, 2008 at 4:09 pmFred,
you’ve got a right to be concerned about Bear Stearns. But, like Enron (which, I admit is a slightly different situation) it is one company that has failed.
If Bear Stearns is followed by more banks, you’re point becomes more and more valid. We’ll see.
March 20th, 2008 at 4:37 pmbilbobaggins,
Everybody makes mistakes.
Since you’re having trouble finding you voice on your “everyone has the right to have their voices heard” vs. “why can’t TP do a better job banning trolls” dilemma; I thought I’d offer some alternative explanations for you to consider.
How about: “I was having a bad day, when I decided to post at redstate. It’s really a bad idea for people to be exposed to ideas that they don’t already agree with.”
Or this: “You’re right, I shouldn’t spend so much time trying to silence those that I disagree with.”
Or maybe: “My position has changed. If conservative partisans won’t listen to me, why should I listen to them?
Any of these would be far more substanitive than pretending that those with a different view aren’t real or worse yet running away from your divergent comments that are too uncomfortable to address. Unless your idea of addressing problems is by hitting the flag button.
Come on bilbo, you’ve run long enough.
March 20th, 2008 at 4:59 pmDemocrat soldier.
I agree that there is jeopardy in being overly upbeat and in being overly pessimistic. Hence, my call for balance.
March 20th, 2008 at 5:08 pmbackup Says:
March 20th, 2008 at 4:59 pm
bilbobaggins,
Everybody makes mistakes.
Let it go, Cap’n. Periodically Bilbo subjects Troll designates to the silent treatment. I always take it to mean I have won that particular point that day.
But Bilbo is a good guy, worthy of debate. He has changed my views on some thing - yours too, I suspect - but getting him to admit he is wrong is not likely.
March 20th, 2008 at 5:18 pmThanks Keltoi, you’re right. I’ll let it go.
March 20th, 2008 at 5:24 pmThe little Canadian that could (finally get a legal win against Monsanto).
Bully for you!
http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/03/19/7784/
March 21st, 2008 at 12:06 am