Hagel: A Defense Of The Surge That ‘Dismisses’ Over ‘900 Dead Americans’ Is Wrong
Hagel: A Defense Of The Surge That ‘Dismisses’ Over ‘900 Dead Americans’ Is Wrong
Earlier this week, Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) said he “will be glad to stake my campaign on the fact that [the surge] has succeeded,” effectively shackling himself to President Bush’s Iraq policy. Previously, McCain has insisted that the level of American casualties is the “key” metric by which to measure to the surge’s success:
The surge is succeeding and the key to it is not American presence, it’s American casualties and by any measure, we are succeeding and the political process is succeeding.
On ABC’s This Week with George Stephanopolous today, Sen. Chuck Hagel (R-NE) bluntly disagreed with McCain’s assessment of the surge’s success, saying it’s wrong to “dismiss” over “900 dead Americans since the surge” began as “success”:
We have lost over 900 dead Americans since the surge. Now if you want to dismiss that as ’success’ that would be your interpretation.
Watch it:
McCain frequently dismisses questions about his claim that he wouldn’t mind if U.S. troops were in Iraq for “a hundred years” by insisting that “the point is American casualties.” Yet, as Hagel points out, in repeatedly insisting that the surge is a success, McCain downplays the fact that American soldiers are still dying in Iraq on a regular basis.
As of today, the Pentagon has confirmed the deaths of 3,991 U.S. soldiers in Iraq since the start of the war. Four more reported casualties are awaiting confirmation.
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45 Responses to “Hagel: A Defense Of The Surge That ‘Dismisses’ Over ‘900 Dead Americans’ Is Wrong”
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What about 700,000 Iraqi Dead with ::
WHOOPS !!! NO WMD FOUND ??
What About THAT ??
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:03 pmMcCain is quick to condemn the Government for his time as a POW in Nam. Yet he is ready to commit those that are in the military now to a hundred years of the same fate. He is a typical corporate sycophant that will do and say anything to assure the continued greed of corporate Anerica- Just another Bush with eyes, and I's, a little farther apart. He may not be as dumb but he isn't amy smarter.
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:07 pmHagel is a rare bird....a republic that still has a shred of sense and honor.
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:11 pmSo, in essence, Hagel is saying the "surge" is not a success.
It's been obvious for many of us for while now that this military misadventure as a whole is an enormous blunder, but it's really interesting to hear this assessment of the "surge" coming from a Republican -a senator, no less.
Perhaps the kool-aid is wearing off.
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:20 pm=/ Youtube took it down. Oh well, my greatest fear is that America will make war with a country like Iran to eradicate a radical islamist group like Al Qaeda... Oh wait, isn't that the reason for the Iraq war now?
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:20 pmI may not agree with many of Hagel's positions, but he does seem to have some sense of decency and honor. Something that McCain has long since pissed away.
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:21 pmHagel: another one of Rush "the drug addict hippcrite who accepted help from the ACLU to keep his criminal activity secret" Limbaugh's "phony soldiers"
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:23 pmOne of the very few politicians in the Republican party that is not a talking head for the White House or RNC.
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:30 pmIts Sunday.. I wonder if the trolls are going to have a delayed reponse to this one because their cognitive dissonance wont allow them to articultate a response to criticism from within thier own ranks.. either that, or they are busy listening to their preachers spewing hate and telling them that its their relgious duty to make sure we kick start armagddon. I have no doubt that Jesus would hurl these false christians from his temple if where around today..
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:34 pmHagel's not right on much, but at least he isn't happy to pi$$ on the graves our our dead vets for political gain like the rest of the GOP.
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:36 pm.....and the Green Zone got heavily mortared yesterday.
The Surge as a success is only propaganda.
_AIO_
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:40 pmThe surge also has significantly weakened the US' ability to respond to another crisis and is sapping the long term health of our ground forces--for what specific objectives? Can anyone name them?
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:42 pmTo most cons, this has been their successful video game release.
Iraq War: The Surge is Working! (Released in January 2007)
Iraq War Trilogy: The Next 100 Years (Planned for 2009)
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:42 pmFor a Republican, Hagel continues to be logical.
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:43 pmUnfortunately, those who run the party today have thrown logic and reason away and replaced it with partisanship and ideology.
McCain belongs to those who run the party today - he's thrown credibility and integrity to the four winds in favor of the party.
By McCains logic the US can just resort to airstrikes. Thats the way to keep your own causalties down.
Look at Israel latest attack on Gaza. Airstrikes and artillery kept Israelis causalities to a minimumum, I think 2 Israeli soldiers died during 4 days. Of course 120 Palestinians died, half of them innocent civilians, many of them children but who cares right?
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:43 pmalphainfinityomega
They want those who come home intact to have their 'war stories' to push against libruls for the next 40 years, while ignoring those who come home in a body bag, or with shattered limbs, PTSD and other injuries.
Republicans believe it's a "personal responsibility" for that soldier to come home unharmed.
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:47 pmHagel is a rare bird….a republic that still has a shred of sense and honor.
Occasionally. But for the most part he is a true Bush Republican.
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:51 pmGeorge Stephanopolous has become a Republican tool.
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:54 pmMcCain has insisted that the level of American casualties is the “key” metric by which to measure to the surge’s success:
NOT!
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:59 pmThey want those who come home...
McWars Says:
I don't think the give a flip if a soldier comes home or not.
Busch/Cheney and now Sen.(as in senile senior moment) McCain are bankrupting America to get rid of social programs; and for a double dip they are enriching themselves.
It's all one big conflict of interest.
_AIO_
March 23rd, 2008 at 1:02 pmAt least on this particular issue, Hagel has retained a sense of integrity and credibility. Too bad more of the neopublicrats don't have the same courage to stand up and say "No more."
No more, is, in fact, what We, the People voted for in 2006.
March 23rd, 2008 at 1:11 pmVote for McBush!
March 23rd, 2008 at 1:14 pmUSA RIP!
this pretty much sums it up about McWar :
http://www.antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=12240
(from Antiwar.com -- Justin Raimondo) --
March 23rd, 2008 at 1:17 pmAll the Democrats have to do to defeat the distorted evils of John Sidney McCain, III is expose the TRUTH. FACTS have a very ILLUMINATING impact on those who choose to LIE. You can't defeat an HONEST man by exposing the TRUTH. But the TRUTH will certainly destroy a DISHONEST one.
March 23rd, 2008 at 1:21 pmI've posted this quote before. This is what the right wants you to read over and over. This is the blank check they want to be handed, made out to Iraq and their private companies, for the next 100 years:
Like the war, hate the war, believe in it or not, America is now in Iraq, and we must win.
-- Danielle Pletka, American Enterprise Institute.
March 23rd, 2008 at 1:23 pmPeriod 1: Mar 20, 2003----Sept 6, 2004 (approx. 18 months) total: 1,002
Period 2: Sept 7, 2004----Oct 26, 2005 (approx 13 months) total: 2,000
Period 3: Oct 27, 2005----Dec 31 2006 (approx 13 months) total: 3,000
Period 4: Jan 1, 2006---Mar 23, 2007 (approx 15 months) total: 3,995 (official= 3,991)
Average death rate per period (1000 / months ):
Period 1 = 55 per month.
Period 2 = 76 per month
Period 3 = 76 per month
Period 4 = 66 per month (995 / 15 months)
Calendar year average (4000 / 5 years) = 800 per year or 66 per month.
The Period 4 (“Surge”) average death rate dropped by 13% compared to Period 2 and 3.
The Period 4 average death rate is still 20 % HIGHER than Period 1, and is THE SAME as the 5-year average death rate per calendar-month.
And that’s supposed to be “progress”?
March 23rd, 2008 at 1:25 pmHagel and Specter = Congressional Concern Trolls.
March 23rd, 2008 at 1:36 pmGuido said Hagel consistantly votes against his own ideas and his big mouth. He is a buffer.
Thats is not true. Check out his votes on the war, also on Gitmo, torture, etc. He is a conservative on many issues, but a decent and couragous man. His positions on the war and his big mouth as you put it, have resulted in plenty of backstabbing and insults from his own side. I think he deserves better.
By the way, what's a buffer?
March 23rd, 2008 at 1:44 pmWhat's with Stephanopolous these days? He is a Democrat basher with the rest of them.
March 23rd, 2008 at 1:50 pmStephanopolous was part of the political consulting class that has no loyalties to anyone other than themselves and whoever is paying them at the time. WHo was he? A spokesman! What do they do? What they are told. He's vapid.
March 23rd, 2008 at 2:13 pmDistilled down to its simplest form, this is a classic argument between a pilot—who generally stands off in relative safety high in the air or aboard a carrier or on a landing field—versus an infantry officer, or other combat arms member, who engages the enemy on the ground.
McCain's unfortunate shoot-down, capture and confinement are due mostly to his inability to avoid a surface to air missile, and bad luck. Those on the ground cannot fall as far, but don't have the luxury of engagement at a distance as do those in the Air Force or Navy. Short of literally 'ducking a bullet,' they are face to face in comparatively close proximity to an opposing force. It only makes sense that McCain's observations would parallel those of his colleagues who seem themselves as indispensable and heroic participants in combat, while Hagel would view the situation as ground commander and combatant.
March 23rd, 2008 at 4:21 pmIt's not only Republicans who do not add the loss of loss life to the cost of US policy. Albright said that the high death of Iraqi children was "worth it" to make the embargo work. Maybe some day Americans will apologize to the Iraqi people, because the Iraqis have paid for the errors of the bad US policies as much as for the Iraqi leadership.
March 23rd, 2008 at 4:52 pmMeanwhile, Cream Cruiser posts another fallacy.
The topic is the surge, and what Hagel said - "We have lost over 900 dead Americans since the surge. Now if you want to dismiss that as ’success’ that would be your interpretation."
The topic is NOT "what Iraqis think of the invasion".
Amazing... you've figured out how to be wrong even before you're wrong.
On the other hand, we're absolutely clear on what YOU'RE willing to swallow.
March 23rd, 2008 at 5:26 pmDreamCrusher Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 4:55 pm
Meanwhile, 50% of Iraqis think it was the right thing to do to invade their country. A sentiment that would be hard for many to swallow around here.
Not true at all, liar. Congratulations on losing three wars, though, and thanks for 9/11.
March 23rd, 2008 at 5:26 pm"Has the violence gone up or down boys and girls? Are more or fewer American soldiers being killed now than a year ago?"
the violence across the country is up, and the number of American soldiers killed remains the same. You are an idiot.
March 23rd, 2008 at 5:27 pmMichael Lafferty Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 4:21 pm
mcCain crashed several panes, and caused the deaths of 140 crew members on a carrier that he accidentally blew up. this is not "bad luck", it is monumental incompetence, covered up by his admiral daddy.
March 23rd, 2008 at 5:29 pmCreamSucker's having a "surge" of his own, as he climaxes over more deaths in iraq.
March 23rd, 2008 at 5:34 pmhttp://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17687430/
updated 8:27 a.m. PT, Mon., March. 19, 2007
Poll: Iraqis pessimistic about war’s outcome
4 years on, fewer than 20 percent have confidence in coalition, survey finds...
WASHINGTON - The optimism that helped sustain Iraqis during the first few years of the war has dissolved into widespread fear, anger and distress amid unrelenting violence, a survey found.
________
http://www.angus-reid.com/polls/view/14282
Angus Reid Global Monitor : Polls & Research
Iraqis Say They Were Better Off Under Hussein
January 03, 2007
Abstract: (Angus Reid Global Monitor) - Many adults in Iraq believe the coalition effort has been negative, according to a poll by the Iraq Centre for Research and Strategic Studies and the Gulf Research Center. 90 per cent of respondents think the situation in their country was better before the U.S.-led invasion.
______________
Of course, this begs the question... did they poll any of the millions of displaced Iraqis? And then, there's all the dead ones... they can't take a poll, can they?
March 23rd, 2008 at 5:34 pmDreamCrusher Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 4:55 pm
Meanwhile, 50% of Iraqis think it was the right thing to do to invade their country. A sentiment that would be hard for many to swallow around here.
If you want to declare this as truth, then you should post your sources...the poll and the DATE that this was done. Back up your declaration with FACTS!!
March 23rd, 2008 at 5:55 pmYes, please do DreamCrusher.
And it's good to see some sensible Republicans still exist in Congress. I just hope they'll be ten times as vocal during the general eletion... Something tells me the dems will need em to counter the Rovian fearmongering and utter BS that has consumed the Republican party.
March 23rd, 2008 at 6:58 pmToday the tally of American's killed hit 4,000. That does not include 6 soldiers not comfirmed dead from months and years ago and 4 more that are missing in action and in all liklihood dead. American's killed in February and March will exceed the number killed in December and January, showing a gradual increase in American dead. March will represent the 4th straight month for increases in the number of Iraqi's killed. It wouldn't take many days like today for that number to shoot back up over 1,000 for the month. Some peace that is. And a strange new way to define success.
March 24th, 2008 at 12:09 amThese guys really don`t care about our soldiers and their families much less the rest of America, these guys just do not care. These guys have bought the media off to propagandize their sick and twisted neocon values.
March 24th, 2008 at 1:37 amHagel pointed to a recent Gallup poll showing that 81% of the American public did not like the direction America was headed, Hagel called for a new consensus within the next administration and emphasized the need for a bi-partisan coalition no matter who takes the White House.
Is the Iraq war winnable?
http://www.youpolls.com/details.asp?pid=1939
.
March 24th, 2008 at 9:38 amTime has come to drop the "U.S" before the words death toll a make a real tally of the dead are US lives more valuable that iraqi??according to heir Bush ALL life is precious even that which is only a few cells wide...so lets start by saying "nearly a million dead in "liberation" of Iraq and the number is sure to rise as we continue to spread "Freedom" and "Democracy" throughout the middle east.... nearly 1,000,000 dead....SO? says Heir Cheney and why should he care this has cost him and his Nothing ,nada zip if fact they all stand to hand off this mess RICHER that when it started!!??? Fat ,Fishing and collecting $ " $50,000" "Speaking Fees and being consultants for the new generation of war profiteers ..:think Blackwater.....There is only one solution...Bring Out the Guillotine and start some heads rolling down Pennsylvania Ave....Forget the "peaceful transfer of power " these people no nothing of peace they are in the business of killing and only understand the language of violence ..Weathermen where are you now???
March 24th, 2008 at 10:53 amJohnny McMaverick is going loose come november, armed with the facts progressives need to take the lead and tell america about this guy and his policy. His war policy,his fearmongering and the fact he cannot get a grip on the Iraq, Iran, Shia and Sunni situation should explain everything. Do not forget his tax the working man so he can lower corporate taxes for his buddies.Finally a re-puke getting right, Mr. Hagel is going catch hell for speaking out against oldman johnny.
March 25th, 2008 at 9:44 am