NYT’s Lichtblau: Bush Torture Program And CIA Tape Destruction ‘Could Lead To Criminal Action’
NYT’s Lichtblau: Bush Torture Program And CIA Tape Destruction ‘Could Lead To Criminal Action’
ABC News recently revealed that President Bush’s most senior advisers convened in 2002 and approved the use of harsh interrogation tactics. Days later, Bush told ABC he “approved” of the tactics.
Questions have been raised as to whether senior officials, including Bush, could be prosecuted for approving torture. ThinkProgress discussed the issue with The New York Times’ Eric Lichtblau and Jeffrey Rosen, law professor at George Washington University. Lichtblau won the Pullitzer Prize for his December 2005 story breaking the news that Bush was illegally spying on Americans after 9/11. As legal affairs editor of The New Republic, Rosen is considered “the nation’s most widely read and influential legal commentator.”
Discussing the potential for criminal prosecution against senior advisers, Lichtblau argued that a more probable scenario is that low-level officers who executed the interrogation orders face prosecution:
I certainly don’t think it’s likely that you would see international war crimes or, even in a Democratic administration, criminal prosecutions. … I think more likely, if you’re looking at criminal action, the more likely scenario is against the low level case officers who may have actually been carrying out interrogations and using severe interrogation tactics bordering on torture. … If that could be established or of course we have now the destruction of the CIA tapes, and that cover-up could very well lead to, conceivably, I should say, lead to criminal action if it were found that that were done to withhold evidence from the courts or 9/11 Commission.
Rosen came to similar conclusions, but urged Congress to more strongly assert its constitutional oversight role to “haul” Vice President Cheney and chief of Staff David Addington to testify:
Congressional oversight, congressional hearings, censure, political pressure. … The time is ticking away, and they have the ability to haul these people up and ask Cheney and Addington what they were thinking when they endorsed these programs. That’s the appropriate remedy — not some hope of criminal prosecution.
Watch it:
Observing Congress’s aggressive and effective oversight during the U.S. Attorney scandal, Rosen argued that the ongoing debate over FISA and surveillance is lacking similar oversight, as Congress has not firmly drawn the line in the sand:
When it comes to oversight of FISA, both to refining the law in ways that would protect liberty and security and also holding Addington and Cheney accountable for having arguably broken it, they have not done so. … By contrast, Democrats are pretty undecided about exactly where the line should be on FISA and in fact many of them seem inclined to give the Administration far more than many in the civil liberties community think is appropriate.
Lichtblau has published a book, Bush’s Law: The Remaking Of American Justice, which details the development of the administration’s warrantless wiretapping program and the White House’s attempts to thwart Lichtblau along the way. Read an excerpt here.
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32 Responses to “NYT’s Lichtblau: Bush Torture Program And CIA Tape Destruction ‘Could Lead To Criminal Action’”
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"Rosen came to similar conclusions, but urged Congress to more strongly assert its constitutional oversight role to “haul” Vice President Cheney and chief of Staff David Addington to testify"
Right...THAT ain't gonna happen.
April 17th, 2008 at 3:22 pmRosen came to similar conclusions, but urged Congress to more strongly assert its constitutional oversight role to “haul” Vice President Cheney and chief of Staff David Addington to testify:
And how exactly are they going to do this? The Bush Crime Family ignores subpoenas, refuses to release documents and refuses to testify. Then we have the Republican activist judges who let them get away with it.
I think that the Democrats need to keep hammering away at them, but they know they won't get anywhere. The only thing they can do is to embarrass the Republicans by showing how obstructionist they are.
Then, when Obama takes office, I hope he goes after them with a vengeance.
April 17th, 2008 at 3:23 pmBut it's already 2008, and this all happened in 2002. Is there a statute of limitations on shitting on the Constitution?
April 17th, 2008 at 3:24 pmHey Congress, I know you're busy what with all the athletes on steroids and all but do you think you could maybe get the ball rolling on this.
April 17th, 2008 at 3:27 pmBush Torture Program And CIA Tape Destruction ‘Could Lead To Criminal Action'
- - To aptly borrow from FISA, AS IF.
April 17th, 2008 at 3:29 pm"I think more likely, if you’re looking at criminal action, the more likely scenario is against the low level case officers who may have actually been carrying out interrogations"
That's like putting the car in prison because the owner did some drinking and driving.
April 17th, 2008 at 3:32 pmRosen says "war crimes are not a good way of adjudicating political and even legal questions that are close to the line."
I wonder if those subjected to these "techniques" believe they are "close to the line?"
April 17th, 2008 at 3:34 pmLet The Hague determine war crime status.
How about inherent contempt for Cheney, Rice, Gonzales and Addington? That would be appropriate, well within congressional powers and give us a 2 pronged pitchfork to ram up their tired, fat, white old asses.
April 17th, 2008 at 3:40 pm"COULD?"
what fu*king planet is this?
April 17th, 2008 at 3:41 pmthe Nazis also left behind damning documents of their guilt which was later used against them in the Nuremberg war crimes tribunal.
History DOES repeat itself
April 17th, 2008 at 3:42 pmNYT Breaking News: "Standing outside in a rainstorm could lead to getting wet."
April 17th, 2008 at 3:43 pmWhat about the mental "torture" WE (the American people) have had to suffer from listening to the lies and wingnut propoganda from these incompetent f***s and criminals for the last 8 years?
Rot in Hell Bush, Cheney, et. al - and say "hi" to Reagan for me when you get there.
April 17th, 2008 at 3:44 pmtoasterhead; there are NO statute of limitations on war crimes.
April 17th, 2008 at 3:44 pm#6 robertoroberto Says:
That’s like putting the car in prison because the owner did some drinking and driving.
Those guys were following orders. I agree with you. That isn't right.
April 17th, 2008 at 3:45 pmWhile I sincerely hope that Congress wakes up and realises that they have Duties Mandated by the Constitution, I'm not holding out much hope. Its a nice fantasy but, considering Congress' track record, I'm not holding my breath. Hopefully the next administration/DOJ will actually Do Something, but until then...
April 17th, 2008 at 3:47 pmImpeach Cheney and Bush and Save the Constitution!
Abu Ben Hussein Leporello.
How long should I hold my breath for this time guys?
April 17th, 2008 at 3:49 pmI strongly disagree with Eric and Jeffery. They are basically saying that Bush and Cheney can order anyone to do anything and they will not be prosecuted.
CRIMINAL ATTEMPT ( FACILITATION - SOLICITATION - CONSPIRACY)
April 17th, 2008 at 3:57 pmI think Bush and Cheney fall under all three of these. They facilitated and solicited our armed forces and congress. The Conspiracy was that they lied to the American People and Congress. How in the world could they not be held accountable?
Apparently most of Washington agrees with Nixon: If the president does it, it's not illegal. I guess criminal prosecutions for torture and even murder would make the Beltway folks feel bad, like something unpleasant had happened in their little village, and also it wouldn't look nice to the rest of the world.
April 17th, 2008 at 4:11 pmrr @ 3:32;
April 17th, 2008 at 4:13 pmthe "I was just following orders" excuse will not wash. see: Nuremberg war crimes trials.
If government were to do what is right, I would be surprised. These people are WAR CRIMINALS, they have tortured people that we in the past has put others to death for. Why are they not held to the same standard? Why does congress let these WAR CRIMINALS off the hook for their crimes? These WAR CRIMINALS belong in jail for the rest of their lives.
IMPEACH BUSH/CHENEY/AND COMPANY
April 17th, 2008 at 4:28 pmWAR CRIME Trials '09
Could lead to criminal action...?
Only in my wet, wetter, wettest dreams. *sigh*
April 17th, 2008 at 4:29 pmThe International Criminal Court in the Hague has direct responsibility for prosecuting war crimes, but even more relevant in this situation, crimes against humanity. Since the U.S. has refused to join the ICC and has enjoined "allies" to agree not to cooperate with any ICC actions, their hands may be tied at this time. However, IF the U.S. joins the ICC in 2009, but our national courts were unable to investigate because of continuing refusal to release information (and don't count on the CIA or Pentagon cooperating), then the Hague would have appropriate jurisdiction. Here's the info about crimes against humanity and crimes against peace which matche the crimes we're discussing because they ARE systematic.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_against_peace
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_against_humanity
April 17th, 2008 at 4:45 pmMaybe someone can help me out with the legality issue. If Bush pardons everyone in his administration before leaving office and the Hague brings indictments, would any US government agency have authority to arrest them and agree to extradition. If the answer is no, how would the Hague enforce their indictment?
April 17th, 2008 at 5:10 pmCould it be? Will they be held on criminal charges?
April 17th, 2008 at 5:40 pmIf so, it sure won't happen in the next year -- Obama will begin an investigation, because as a Constitutional professor, he doesn't need anyone to point out the crime -- it will come down to whether the House and/or the DoJ under Obama can find it politically advantageous to do so.
It may depend on just how much weight Obama has in his first year or two, and that may be determined by the percentage of his win in November, and how many more are brought in on his coattails.
"Bush Torture Program And CIA Tape Destruction ‘Could Lead To Criminal Action’”
You betcha it could. And cold fusion could lead to free energy. Just about as soon...
April 17th, 2008 at 5:52 pmThen, when Obama takes office, I hope he goes after them with a vengeance./i>
If, indeed, Obama is 'elected,' I'll bet dollars to donut holes that even as soon as his inaugural address he lymns the hymn of Lethe: forgive and forget; we must move on; no need to look backwards; bind up the nation; look ahead...
April 17th, 2008 at 5:56 pmnone of these guys have any stomach to go after a predecessor cuz it might set a precedent when it comes to them...
.
Humm...
The actions of the Reigning President and Vice Decider are being debated as to the extent of criminality to be pressed...
The President and VP are criminals, but to what extent... and Congress does nothing...
The President and VP are criminal... and Congress does NOTHING... except make excuses...
"...without mental reservation or a purpose of evasion..." THEY ALL AFFIRMED TO THIS MUCH yet they do not act so...
And Americans...? Well, what you don't care to know, you don't have to be bothered with.
IMPEACH BUSH for BLOWING the JOB!
.
April 17th, 2008 at 9:58 pmWith all due respect to the professor, I disagree. Bush and this administration should be held accountable for their WAR CRIMES. And I think, it wouldn't be a 'show trial'. The matter is far too serious to be a 'show'. Clinton's inpeachment thing was a 'show'. War Crimes is not seen by anyone who is educated and civilized as a 'media''show' thing. They commited WAR CRIMES. They should be held accountable. ...and I was under the impression that "The American Way" was through Freedom, Equality and JUSTICE!!!!!! ...I don't know... Does the USA want to regain respect????
April 18th, 2008 at 12:14 amAren't they worried about their image?????
April 18th, 2008 at 12:16 amYou could ask practically anyone in this country, in the world even, "Do you feel that the President and/or Vice President have commited crimes" and whether they be Democrat, Republican, part of the news media, congressional scholars, lawyers, judges or just the man on the street they would all say resoundingly, "YES!". Even Republicans would imply as much with a wink and a nod. It seems as though oue representatives on the Hill are THE ONLY ONES turning a blind eye and refusing to admit as much to the public.
April 18th, 2008 at 9:34 amJUST WHO IN THE F#CK DO THEY THINK THEY ARE FOOLING? As a proud American I am so embarrased and disgusted by these criminals but still cling to the hope that accountability is still possible at some point after Jan. 09.
Max-1: IMPEACH BUSH for BLOWING the JOB!
April 18th, 2008 at 7:01 pmThis is so great! LOL!!!! Very good indeed! You made my day!
And how exactly are they going to do this? The Bush Crime Family ignores subpoenas, refuses to release documents and refuses to testify. Then we have the Republican activist judges who let them get away with it.
I think that the Democrats need to keep hammering away at them, but they know they won’t get anywhere. The only thing they can do is to embarrass the asus a4 battery,asus a32-f3 battery Republicans by showing how obstructionist they are.
October 15th, 2008 at 7:58 am