McCain Embraces ‘Cocktail-Napkin Economics,’ Pushes ‘Flawed,’ ‘Misleading’ And ‘Dubious’ Tax Theories
McCain Embraces ‘Cocktail-Napkin Economics,’ Pushes ‘Flawed,’ ‘Misleading’ And ‘Dubious’ Tax Theories
On ABC’s This Week today, Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) embraced ABC News anchor Charlie Gibson’s cocktail-napkin economics and claimed that “every time you cut capital gains taxes, revenues have increased”:
MCCAIN: Sen. Obama says that he doesn’t want to raise taxes over, on anybody over, making over $200,000 a year. Yet he wants to nearly double the capital gains tax, nearly double it, which a hundred million Americans have investments in. Mutual funds, 401ks, policemen, firemen, nurses, he wants to increase their taxes. And he obviously doesn’t understand the economy because history shows every time you cut capital gains taxes, revenues have increased, going back to Jack Kennedy. So, out of touch, yes.
Watch it:
For McCain, who freely admits that “the issue of economics is not something I’ve understood as well as I should,” to claim that someone else doesn’t understand the economy is rather brazen. But it’s especially audacious considering that the logic of McCain’s reading of the facts is “flawed.”
As Center for American Progress Action Fund senior fellow Robert Gordon points out, “cutting these taxes may lead to a temporary spike in revenue,” but “over the long term, the biggest owners of stock—the wealthiest Americans—will mostly save what they will save, regardless of fluctuations in the rate.” The Congressional Budget Office notes:
Rising gains receipts in response to a rate cut are most likely to occur in the short run. … Thus, even though the responsiveness of realizations to a tax cut may not be enough to produce additional receipts over a long period, it may do so over a few years. The potentially large difference between the long- and short-term sensitivity of realizations to tax rates can mislead observers into assuming a greater permanent responsiveness than actually exists.
Dean Baker, co-director of the Center for Economic and Policy Research, says “evidence that a capital gains tax cut raises revenue is rather dubious.” But it shouldn’t come as a shock that McCain would use such “dubious” rhetoric when he embraces economic theories that are “beyond the reach of economic science.”
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MacCaine is doing a pefect REPUBLICAN job: Lying and missleading about everything! If you ask him what is his mother name, he will have to check on that and get back to you until the end of the week…
April 20th, 2008 at 3:11 pmOh MacCaine MacCaince, stop sniffing Bush’s cocaine!
McStain is the very worst candidate the repigs could find, as they know full well that this election is lost before it starts.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:12 pmCheck the national polls…McCain dances on BOTH Hillary’s and Obama’s graves…
April 20th, 2008 at 3:14 pmIncome is income. The preferential treatment of cap gains and dividends is, by definition, a disprizing of income earned by toil - a slap in the face of all workers, salaried or waged.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:15 pmWhere’s Ross Perot and his voodoo stick now?
April 20th, 2008 at 3:15 pmRepublicans have been trying to put out this lie for years. And they do it because they don’t want to pay taxes so they can live freely in the country that gave them so many opportunities to make so much money. McCain, like the Republican Party, is lying.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:17 pmAnd, McCain, where’s your flag pin?
April 20th, 2008 at 3:19 pmYou’re missing the point…ALL taxes should be lower…check out the difference between Ireland & France…
April 20th, 2008 at 3:20 pmAnother “senior moment”? McCain said Obama won’t raise taxes on anyone making OVER $200,000 per year. I believe Obama was referring to people making UNDER $200,000-$250,000 per year.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:29 pmNeocon,
April 20th, 2008 at 3:30 pmThe population of Ireland is 4 million while that of France is 60 million. Is that what you wanted compared?
I don’t think Ireland and France invaded a country illegally and refused to budget for it.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:31 pmneopawn,
You’ve missed the point:
For McCain, who freely admits that “the issue of economics is not something I’ve understood as well as I should,” to claim that someone else doesn’t understand the economy is rather brazen.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:31 pmMcCain is the repuke’s sacrificial lamb. They all hate his guts, and are throwing him under the bus. he will lose by a landslide of historic proportions.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:34 pmWaltTheMan: you are sadly mistaken if you “think” that is my point…try taxation policies and economic success…
April 20th, 2008 at 3:34 pmPoor Neocon doesn’t understand dripping sarcasm.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:36 pm**eyes rolling**
freedom lover: why do the national polls have McCain beating both Hillary and Obama???
April 20th, 2008 at 3:36 pmUh-oh, Zooey, look out, your sarcasm is dripping. ;)
April 20th, 2008 at 3:37 pmZooey: why not address a legitimate point??? I recognize immature sarcasm when I see it…and I see it a lot on this site…
April 20th, 2008 at 3:38 pm401(k) withdrawals are taxed as income, not capital gains. Oh, details details.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:41 pmNeocon Says:
freedom lover: why do the national polls have McCain beating both Hillary and Obama???
April 20th, 2008 at 3:36 pm
Which polls are you referring to? Because I’ve heard exactly the opposite. Or were your numbers from a poll of likely Republican voters?
April 20th, 2008 at 3:42 pmNeocon Says:
You’re missing the point…ALL taxes should be lower…check out the difference between Ireland & France…
That’s as stupid as thinking that George Bush was capable of governing.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:43 pmMcCain’s, “circular logic” concerning the economy is staggering! Democrats have his “number”, and must point-out the sham “dog @ pony” policy he has. Straight talk, I think NOT!!!
April 20th, 2008 at 3:44 pmJohn McFossil is really doing quite a job with his face time on the tube. Every time people see him he loses their potential vote.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:44 pmRunning mcCain to lose big is the only positive thing the republicans have done for America simce Eisenhower’s farewell speech.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:45 pmfreedom lover: whose economy is expanding (Ireland’s) and whose economy is in the toilet (France’s)
April 20th, 2008 at 3:47 pm#20 Your poll is from March 5…try looking at today’s polls…
Today’s polls are the same MSM crap that has us in the mess we’re in because of the incompetence of your group of traitors. Give it up, you’re all through.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:47 pmYou’re missing the point…
No, it’s right there on top of yer head.
ALL taxes should be lower…
Simplism is not a philosophy. Tax rises or cuts must be considered in context - what’s the current rate, what’s the debt, what are the tiers and their differences, etc. For pinhead dittoboys, the ideal appears to be no taxes. But lotsa big guns. Rent a brain.
check out the difference between Ireland & France…
France is the per capita most productive country in the world. Ireland’s good times, which are beginning to be reversed, are due almost entirely to repatriation of foreign earnings and the construction boom.
PS - Irish income taxes for single filers are 21% on the first 34K Euros, 40% on the balance; IOW, Ireland taxes the wealthy at a higher rate than the U.S. Of course, they don’t have to support much of either a military-petroindustrial complex or gargantuan national debt. Also, all education and health care is free.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:48 pmNeocon Says:
freedom lover: whose economy is expanding (Ireland’s) and whose economy is in the toilet (France’s)
sure, that’s relevant. Grasp at more straws, won’t you. bush has lowered taxes on the rich every chance he has, and who’s economy is swirling the bowl? America’s.
You’re really awfully stupid.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:49 pmJane E. Schneider Says:
Uh-oh, Zooey, look out, your sarcasm is dripping. ;)
April 20th, 2008 at 3:37 pm
Again!!?
April 20th, 2008 at 3:49 pmNeocon Says:
Zooey: why not address a legitimate point??? I recognize immature sarcasm when I see it…and I see it a lot on this site…
April 20th, 2008 at 3:38 pm
You first.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:50 pm“PS - Irish income taxes for single filers are 21% on the first 34K Euros, 40% on the balance; IOW, Ireland taxes the wealthy at a higher rate than the U.S. Of course, they don’t have to support much of either a military-petroindustrial complex or gargantuan national debt. Also, all education and health care is free.”
Don’t be confusing him with facts, now. he’ll cry all the way home.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:51 pmNo, neocon, I only posted that to show you I found something that refutes what you said, and it was as meaningless then as it is today. The election isn’t being held today, so polls asking voters who they would vote for mean nothing. Absolutely nothing. Besides, these are only polls of people who were willing to answer their phones and talk to a pollster. Since these people represent a small percentage (less than 20%) of the country, their responses would not be representative of the nation as a whole. It is a common misconception that political polls have any validity. But people believe it because the media keeps trotting them out and paying Zogby and the other pollsters for more. But they won’t explain why they are flawed and unreliable as a predictor of results.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:51 pmNeocon Says:
freedom lover: the MSM is in the tank for McCain??? Are you kidding me…why not address a valid point instead of whining like a petulant brat?
I just did. Why not recognize reality instead of whining like a petulant brat? mcCain lies every time out, and is never called on it. case closed, whiner.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:52 pmALL taxes should be lower…
and all schools should be grade A, #1…
and all roads should be wide and smooth and safe…
and all bridges and should be maintained and repaired…
and all water lines and sewer lines should be repaired and replaced…
and so on and so forth…
you know - “The Common Good”…
…
young “republicans” are just too stoopid…
April 20th, 2008 at 3:53 pm.
the MSM is in the tank for McCain??
perhaps you can explain why Cindy mcCain’s millions were not factored into CNN’s overview of the candidates’ fortunes? if not, let me explain: the MSM is in the tank for McCain, even though he has no chance of winning.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:54 pmI was speaking of the corporate tax rate…you know, the rate on those evil corporations…why are they flocking to Ireland???
they’re not. Why do you insist on using lies as your currency. Oh, yes you’re a neocon-artist republican America-hater, that’s right.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:56 pmpam Says:
401(k) withdrawals are taxed as income, not capital gains. Oh, details details.
but he planted that seed… the sheeple’s reaction: oh! the outrage!
April 20th, 2008 at 3:57 pmNo explanation of why the MSM won’t treat Mccain as it does everyone else? I think 8you’re avoiding the very subject you brought up. Can’t blame you, though, it must be exhausting trying to weasel through all of your lies, neoconman.
April 20th, 2008 at 3:57 pmOur economy is in the toilet thanks to Mc100yearwar’s/herr dubyah’s economy of careless and failed tax cuts for the rich and corporations. Oops….your obtuse talking point is debunked. Next….
April 20th, 2008 at 3:58 pmPosted by pinhead: I was speaking of the corporate tax rate…
Previously posted by pinhead: ALL taxes should be lower…
April 20th, 2008 at 4:00 pmcavjam Says:
Posted by pinhead: I was speaking of the corporate tax rate…
Previously posted by pinhead: ALL taxes should be lower…
Not fair. You’re using facts again.
April 20th, 2008 at 4:03 pmMCCAIN: And he obviously doesn’t understand the economy because history shows every time you cut capital gains taxes, revenues have increased, going back to Jack Kennedy. So, out of touch, yes.
The non-partisan Congressional Budget Office (CBO) and the Joint Committee on Taxation have estimated that extending the capital gains tax cut enacted in 2003 would cost $100 billion over the next decade. The Administration’s Office of Management and Budget included a similar estimate in the President’s budget.
It doesn’t hurt the average family, it hurts the wealthiest in our country. Sorry if I don’t have alot of sympathy for them right now. I think they can afford the hit. I don’t think we can afford to lose $100 billion dollars over the next decade if we keep the current tax cut. I think Obama is right the Capital Gains Tax should be doubled, it’s about time the top 10% started paying their fair share.
April 20th, 2008 at 4:11 pmfreedom lover: whose economy is expanding (Ireland’s) and whose economy is in the toilet (France’s)
April 20th, 2008 at 3:47 pm Recommend (0)
Taking two rather random countries with different histories, vastly different population sizes and demographics, etc., and then stating that taxes are solely responsible for one having economic success and one having perceived failure is truly pathetic and sad. You obviously know nothing about econonmics, politics and I doubt trash like you even own a passport, so you have never acctually been to either country. So please let the smart people talk, your meth lab is smoking, tend to that
April 20th, 2008 at 4:42 pmbsb, it wasn’t freedom lover who said that, it was Neocon.
April 20th, 2008 at 4:47 pm#45, well stated.I am all for taken down the big dogs, your right they can afford it not the ave JOE in America.We all know Sen. McFlip-flop is all about the corporate greed and corruption that is bank rolling his campaign.Is it his elitism that has him so disconnected from the ave. American or just his politics? I have stated in the past will continue do so until the end in November, Sen. McCain is a neoconservative WARMONGER who will keep this country and the ave. American down because we are beneath him and his neocon DOGMA. His tax cuts and trade issues will continue just like dubya`s and continue to further erode our way of life as we once had before the Neoconservative Fascist took office eight long years ago.
April 20th, 2008 at 4:49 pm…because history shows every time you cut capital gains taxes, revenues have increased,…
Really? Interesting math McCain is using here. The lower the rate the more the revenue? Must be magic.
OK, so if we reduced the capital gains tax all they way down to say, 1%, then we’ll have more money than we could ever use?!?
I don’t think so. Doesn’t he know that the only thing that gets bigger the more you take out of it is a HOLE. Like the one this stupid azz logic would place us into.
This guy is delusional and is just yammering on to fill the air space.
April 20th, 2008 at 4:53 pmFrom the NY Times editorial:
Unfortunately, Mr. McCain has reversed his earlier passionate — and correct — opposition to the Bush tax cuts. He now calls for permanently extending them. He also proposes to repeal the alternative minimum tax. Those two proposals alone would reduce tax revenue by $1 trillion over four years.
This would certainly send the dollar into freefall, and the economy into depression. The dollar had been the traditional safe investment during troubled times. No longer…now the foreign investors and speculators are buying COMMODITIES. Oil, Food, Gold etc. which is why the price for these items is soaring as the dollar plummets. The Borrowing game which propped up the BUSH Economy …is about over.
April 20th, 2008 at 5:00 pmOnce again our pet troll won’t go anywhere near the topic of the thread. The issue is that McCain is unfit to be President and demonstrates his unfitness with every additional word.
Assuming we have a legal election, McCain will be defeated handily along with most of those Republicriminal legislators who have the courage to run for reelection. Of course, the seats of those who have retired, “to spend time with their families”, rather than face humiliating defeat; will go overwhelmingly to Democrats as well.
To be fair, I have lots of misgivings about the inevitable Democratic Super-majority. Concentration of power has inherent dangers. However, after the disasters of the last eight years, I think we have to risk it in hopes that some of the damage can be mitigated or undone.
In this climate McCain has taken the worst possible course. Trying to appease the neocon Reichwingers, pretending to be a fiscal/social moderate, and gleefully indulging his personal glorification of all things military; has served only to make him appear ridiculously out of touch with reality. Every time he opens his yap he produces another campaign commercial for his opponents.
April 20th, 2008 at 5:01 pmNo corporate taxes are collected in Nepal - thus Nepal should be a thriving industrial state. Unfortunately there is virtually no industry in Nepal unless you include tourism.
April 20th, 2008 at 5:07 pmNone of these idiots will do what really needs to be done: Abolish ALL income taxes and implement the Fair Tax.
April 20th, 2008 at 5:08 pmCodeZombie Says:
None of these idiots will do what really needs to be done: Abolish ALL income taxes and implement the Fair Tax.
Income tax was passed and was ratified by the correct amount of states, so it ain’t gonna happen. No one will abolish income tax.
And your so called “Fair Tax”, from what I have read about it, is not “Fair”.
April 20th, 2008 at 5:16 pmPW McSongbird
If corporations wish to be personified, and they have, then they should be taxed like a person.
April 20th, 2008 at 5:25 pmTalking about taxes whether up or down is not the issue. The issue is what the government will do with the revenues that have been collected . How much of that will be going to the welfare of the people who payed the taxes,providing better health,education,and maintaining a strong infrastructure.
April 20th, 2008 at 5:25 pmYes, tax cuts made more millionairs and some people got rich..but on the other hand we are in debt as a state now and it is unwise to reduce taxes while the sate is burdened by foreign borrowed monies with high interests paid in the billions of dollars in every day passes.
McCain never answered the question on how he is going to wage many costly preemptive wars,cut taxes , balance the budget,and fight inflation in the same time..unless he has a theory of his own in economics that nobody heard of.
When the government issues tax refunds..the government has two ways to recover the money…increase revenues,or borrow more..and it looks like politicians chose the latter,and chose to borrow more money,because it is politically safer for them.
Bush chose to send checks back..it helped him politically at his base…but the state is more in debt.
It looks like McCain is following the same path..with more wars in McCain planning..things are not going to be easier under his administration.
OT
TomDispatch has a good article worth reading
12 Answers to Questions No One Is Bothering to Ask about Iraq
http://www.tomdispatch.com/ post/ print/ 174921/ Tomgram%253A%2520%252012%2520Reasons%2520to%2520Get%2520Out%2520of%2520Iraq
April 20th, 2008 at 5:26 pmHere’s what we’ve got going with McNasty: He nearly flunked out of the Naval Academy several times so his lack of intelligence was known early on. Then he became a POW and endured torture which, undoubtedly, has left him mentally challenged - not to mention his tight “trip wire” emotional persona. Add to that a hearty dose of good old senile dementia (comes with the territory of being in his 70’s) and we’ve got a “total prescription for disaster” if this man who wishes he had a brain gets elected.
If we’re embarrassed by Bush, imagine what McNasty is capable of in terms of horrendous language and no speaking ability unless he’s totally prompted. He’s a loose cannon in terms of his personality and is trigger happy.
I’d go so far as to say that this country is “doomed” if this clown gets elected.
April 20th, 2008 at 5:42 pmIn all fairness, let’s see where this man’s assets or forte happen to lie:
Foreign Policy - War with Iraq for 100 years - tells the tale there with a “lose/lose” situation. Cripes, he can’t even get the Sunni, Shiite, and Kurds straight. Pathetic! And this is his self-proclaimed forte?????
Domestic Policy - McNasty’s domestic policy is how he treats his many servants and maids in his multi-million dollar “wife’s home”.
Economic Policy - This man doesn’t know a tax from a deficit. He’s totally out of his league when it comes to fiscal experience or knowledge.
I like that the media is finally challenging his 65 Billion tax cuts and where these “pie in the sky” numbers are coming from. His script writers went a bit overboard on this one. Not only are they totally bogus but they never bothered to “clue this moron in” on how they calculated it. Hahaha! What a total fool to begin spouting information prepared by a public relations handler without bothering to even understand it.
April 20th, 2008 at 5:47 pmTarazan:
“Talking about taxes whether up or down is not the issue. The issue is what the government will do with the revenues that have been collected . How much of that will be going to the welfare of the people who payed the taxes,providing better health,education,and maintaining a strong infrastructure.”
Quite so. Every ‘gummint’ wastes some money but not every one wastes most of it. European countries run mixed-ecnomies not “socialist” ones as Repugnants keep trying to claim. They may be catching a cold from the US right now, but they aren’t the ones coughing up blood.
April 20th, 2008 at 5:55 pmWayne said:
Oh, I know full well that it’ll never happen. I would probably have a heart attack and die if it did.
I see nothing wrong with a national sales tax. It seems much more fair and definitely simpler than the present system which has spawned an entire industry because its so ridiculously complex.
April 20th, 2008 at 5:57 pmI see nothing wrong with a national sales tax. It seems much more fair and definitely simpler than the present system which has spawned an entire industry because its so ridiculously complex.
simple does not equal fair. as usual, the rich would benefit unfairly from the “fair” tax.
April 20th, 2008 at 6:16 pmShortly after my alarm wakes me up, the sun comes up. Therefore, by refusing to set my alarm, I shall cast the world into eternal darkness.
April 20th, 2008 at 6:18 pmThis is nothing, wait until “Hanoi John” has to defend his status as the “go to guy” when the NVA needed a radio spokesman in Hanoi. Hanoi John was well taken care of, he didn’t have to eat bugs and endure daily beatings while he was a guest in the Hanoi Hilton.
His time will come.
April 20th, 2008 at 6:21 pm>You’re missing the point…ALL taxes should be lower…
Funny, are you aware Bin Laden has said exactly that same thing? Yes or no?
> Look at the polls.
Why don’t you show them to us? You said PollS, so make sure its more than one. Go ahead, but heck, regardless of what they say, polls this far out are irrelvant. According to polls 6 months ago, Hillary was supposed to tromp Obama. How did that turn out? Also, you dismiss a poll from a month ago as irrelevant because its old, but wont whatever polls you cite therefor be “irrelvant” next month?
Smart people realize there are other trends that matter, like, say, the massive amount of new democrats registering compared to the republican voter turnout and new registrations, which have both been tepid even before their contest was decided..
Also, obama has massive youth support, and most kids dont have land lines, so they never get called by pollsters.
McCain has the corporate w=h0-ore media and diebold on his side, but Obama has strength in numbers, so in my mind, its going to be a toss up..
April 20th, 2008 at 6:29 pm> This is nothing, wait until
> “Hanoi John” has to defend his status
God, they probably dont exist, but it woudl be so lovely to have recordings of the propganda Mccain made for his captors..that would sink him instantly..
April 20th, 2008 at 6:30 pmMy question about the capital gains tax is why in the hell should I pay 35% of the money I work hard for (earnings) and someone who is making money off of investments now only pay 15%. There’s something very wrong with this picture.
At one time earnings (money you earned through your own blood sweat and tears) was not considered to be income and was not taxed. What was taxed was income, current dictionary definition:
“the monetary payment received for goods or services, or from other sources, as rents or investments.”
That is why it was called the “Income Tax” and not the “Earnings Tax”. Somewhere along the line it became reversed.
April 20th, 2008 at 6:37 pmNeocon Says:
WaltTheMan: you are sadly mistaken if you “think” that is my point…try taxation policies and economic success…
I am willing to bet that in neither Ireland or France do 2% of the people control 90% of the wealth.
April 20th, 2008 at 6:40 pmChocolate Jesus Says:
… regardless of what they say, polls this far out are irrelvant.
Indeed they are not. There really is no “definitive” Democratic contender as yet. It is meaningless to run polls now as if it is one or the other. Of course, this is all the rethugs have to throw against the walls. Arguments that are gotten from the place where the sun doesn’t shine. It’s the best the pitiful trolls can do.
April 20th, 2008 at 6:45 pmNeocon Says:
#20 Your poll is from March 5…try looking at today’s polls…
Any national poll taken today means ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. The fact that John McCain can’t seem to score over 50% is worrisome to the Republicans. At this point if he was viable candidate, he should be way ahead of either Obama or Clinton. And this is because he is running unopposed right now. There is also the fact that a majority of the people in this country don’t know who John McCain is. They are still buying the “maverick” and “moderate” stitch that the MSM is handing them. Once the Democrats introduce the public to the REAL John McCain, he is going to sink rapidly.
Then, there is also the inconvenient truth that Democrats are outvoting Republicans 3-1. Polls can’t take that into their polling data in any accurate way.
So, dream on idiot troll. You are soon to become part of the irrelevant Party. The next 8 years are going to be very hard on you and your ilk.
April 20th, 2008 at 6:46 pmreedom lover Says:
I see nothing wrong with a national sales tax. It seems much more fair and definitely simpler than the present system which has spawned an entire industry because its so ridiculously complex.
There is nothing “fair” about a national sales tax. It hits the poor at a much more disproportionate rate. Let’s say the tax is 10%. Paying that 10% on things people need to survive is going to hurt a family of 4 on an income of $10,000 a year than it will hurt the same family making $100,000 a year. But, then since all you right-siders are of the mind of “I got mine so the hell with you”, I won’t waste my breath trying to convince you.
April 20th, 2008 at 6:52 pmNeocon Says:
Zooey: why not address a legitimate point??? I recognize immature sarcasm when I see it…and I see it a lot on this site…
That’s because we have learned from experience that trying to reason with your ilk is like spitting in the wind. We gave up on that a long time ago. You are undoubtedly either one of the “authoritarian” types who thinks they know it all or one of the “sheeple” (the 28%ers) who look to the authoritarian types to tell them what to think and what to believe. Either way, it’s not worth our time to try and have a dialog with you because it does no good. Either you are too authoritarian to hear a different view or you are too stupid to know that you are being lied to.
April 20th, 2008 at 6:58 pmBilbo,
It was CodeZombie, not freedom lover, that said:
I see nothing wrong with a national sales tax. It seems much more fair and definitely simpler than the present system which has spawned an entire industry because its so ridiculously complex.
Freedomlover responded with:
April 20th, 2008 at 6:59 pmsimple does not equal fair. as usual, the rich would benefit unfairly from the “fair” tax.
Bilbo,
It was CodeZombie, not freedom lover, that said:
It would help if people would learn to attribute better. If you are responding to something someone posts, be sure to post their name along with their quote. It makes things easier for those who come in later on in the game.
April 20th, 2008 at 7:15 pmBilbo Hussein Baggins Says:
It makes things easier for those who come in later on in the game.
It also really helps to use Italic to offset your reply from the one you are answering.
April 20th, 2008 at 7:25 pmI agree Merlin, Bilbo,
And they should address their remarks to a name rather than a comment number. TP still refuses to substitute admin comments in place of those removed, and it throws things off when posters only reference a comment number. Datetime stamp is best.
And while it’s important, it has nothing to do with the fact that McCain is a liar.
April 20th, 2008 at 7:38 pmAnyone who is being honest with themselves will realize that McCain has no real answers to issues– he is truly a “cocktail napkin” Repub, like so many others. He spouts all sorts of garbage, but has no real ideas of how to back them up. Each time he is confronted with real questions about his so-called issues, he has nothing to say. Nothing! For God’s sake, you out-of-touch Repubs, it’s time to realize McCain has nothing — absolutely nothing– to say to any Americans, other than the 20% Bush lovers. Be honest & toss this guy overboard. He is a bush clone & a loser. Do you really want a Bush wannabe to totally destroy the REpub party? Well, then, vote McCain, the Bush clone & Repub loser. If REpubs ever want to rebuild, they must find someone more progressive, less Bush, less Cheney. Otherwise, Repubs, kiss your A** goodbye. Frankly, you have lost the respect of the vast masjority of Americans. Bye-bye.
April 20th, 2008 at 7:54 pmAnd he obviously doesn’t understand the economy because history shows every time you cut capital gains taxes, revenues have increased, going back to Jack Kennedy. So, out of touch, yes.
This coming from the same twit whose party is responsible for continuing Reagan’s “Trickle Down Your Leg” economic disaster ……….
April 20th, 2008 at 7:55 pmI can’t wait to hear tomorrow’s version of McFlintstone’s economic plan.
April 20th, 2008 at 7:59 pmThe flat tax is the biggest economic scam to come down the republican pike in a long time.
April 20th, 2008 at 8:01 pmIt is foolish to believe that McCain is naive about economics–he is the front man for a movement powered by greed and callous indifference to the lot of the working class. His statements are prepared by experts fed by the likes of AEI and other such right wing spin shops who are pushing the same agenda that began with Reagan and has flourished under Dick Cheney and his loutish sock puppet.
April 20th, 2008 at 8:10 pm#79 McFlintstone pretty much sums up McCain in a nutshell. He’s lost in the dark ages and like the “tin man” never got a brain. I can’t believe that even a Repuke a$$clown would believe that this man is even a credible candidate.
April 20th, 2008 at 8:11 pmEverything McInsane knows about economics comes from his wife Cindy - Her megabucks is THE only reason he went after her (ahem) while still married to his first wifey-poo (adulterer, too?) How about McAdulterer? I’m still trying to find out what happened to Miss Vicky (Iseman). She’s vanished from the face of the earth. Need there be an investigation into “foul play” before long?
April 20th, 2008 at 8:13 pmGet this for “fairness” - Vicky Iseman is flying around the country all nestled up to her “hero” McNasty while Cindy’s home counting her millions. And THIS is not mainstream news??
Hello out there in the sycophantic whoring fascist media…..anyone home?
They will try to spin Rev. Wright till the cows come home which has absolutely zilch to do with Obama’s personal integriry and will repeat ad nauseum Hillary’s “sniper fire” fiction but they’re absolutely mum about McCain’s adulterous affair with this woman? WTF is going on in this country anyway?
Let’s get our beloved “fair media” to take a gander into what was going on with McCain and Vicky Iseman and then, maybe, there will be some fairness occurring.
April 20th, 2008 at 8:16 pmMost americans have lost total faith in what they hear on the news these days. In fact, most newspapers should be used as toilet paper instead - nothing but stale news there. Let’s boycott the fascist mainstream media (television and newspapers) and then we’ll see how powerful these fascists are.
April 20th, 2008 at 8:18 pmNeocon(job) = troll
‘nuf said.
April 20th, 2008 at 8:19 pmIn a “perfect” world, everyone would be a virgin until marriage, which would not occur until the mid-30’s. No one would indulge in self-gratification and the “sex act” would only occur when the husband and wife wanted to create a baby. In a “perfect” world.
In a “perfect” world, no one would be attracted to members of their own gender. Love and desire would be limited by Nature and Divine Design to those of the opposite sex. In a “perfect” world.
In a “perfect” world, there would be no taxes. Social services only aid people who choose to be poor. Aiding the poor is an obligation of people of Faith, not of the Government. In a “perfect” world
In a “perfect” world, public infrastructure would be privatized. There is nothing the government does that private industry in a free market cannot do better. In a “perfect” world.
In a “perfect” world, corporations would not be burdened with regulations. The free market should decide wages and product quality. Market forces will suffice to prevent corporations from degrading the environment. In a “perfect” world.
In a “perfect” world, everyone will be White, speak English, and be an American. There will be no more racism, no more nationalism. To be even more perfect, everyone will have blond hair, blue eyes, and be right-handed. In a “perfect” world.
In a “perfect” world, all children will be in the upper 20% in intelligence. Every child will learn every subject with ease, and will graduate from his or her private high school with honors. In a “perfect” world.
And, in a “perfect” world, everyone will be armed to the teeth with the latest military grade hardware. Just in case they come across someone less than “perfect.”
In a “perfect” world.
April 20th, 2008 at 8:20 pm#48 christopher wiwi Says:
#45, well stated.I am all for taken down the big dogs, your right they can afford it not the ave JOE in America.We all know Sen. McFlip-flop is all about the corporate greed and corruption that is bank rolling his campaign.Is it his elitism that has him so disconnected from the ave. American or just his politics?
I think it is both. When you have the kind of money they have you become diconnected from the average Joe, as you put it. His politics and who he has chosen to align himself with doesn’t help either. Let’s face it, no one in the Bush family with all the money they have amassed will ever truly have to work. McCain in his mind has chosen wisely, he has surrounded himself with people that have more money than we can even image. His second marriage is a prime example of that.
April 20th, 2008 at 8:37 pmMy mistake Christopher at #43, not #48. My bad.
April 20th, 2008 at 8:39 pmsatirev Says:
Most americans have lost total faith in what they hear on the news these days. In fact, most newspapers should be used as toilet paper instead - nothing but stale news there. Let’s boycott the fascist mainstream media (television and newspapers) and then we’ll see how powerful these fascists are.
April 20th, 2008 at 8:18 pm
How true! And the internet is rapidly growing as the public’s source of news. We really need to safeguard the internet from the same corporatists that have taken over the media.Support network neutrality.
I haven’t watched TV in years. Except an occasional ball game or interesting show. Oddly, while filling my tank here in LA at 3.73 per gallon, I found todays LA Times in the trash. So, since I cancelled my 30 year subscription a couple of years ago, I thought I would see what they were doing these days. Interestingly, in the opinion section, the only op-ed piece worth reading was something called “Bedtime Stories” in which a writer of porn talked about the porn writing business. At least there was nothing by David Brooks or Max Boot!. The LA Times continues to sink…
April 20th, 2008 at 8:52 pmBriseadh na Faire Says:
April 20th, 2008 at 8:20 pm
“In a perfect world.”
Beautiful! A more accurate description of the corporatist, “religious” wingnut view would be hard to create. Bravo! And said so well!
April 20th, 2008 at 8:57 pmhttp://www.vietnamveteransagainstjohnmccain.com/
April 20th, 2008 at 9:08 pmI noticed how both Obama and McCain can go all the way back to John Kennedy in talking about the problems of the US Economy yet don’t say a word about how President Bill Clinton balanced the US budget that hadn’t been done in 30 years. Funny how the successful things are left out if your name is Clinton. Now when Bill left office the US Treasury has a surplus but you don’t hear anyone talk about that. All we hear is how the US Treasury is at 10 Trillion dollars in just 7 years. Wonder how that happen. McCain told the truth he doesn’t know anything about Economy and why should he with a Rich wife. Obama brought a home that he couldn’t afford with an indicted friend. Now that shows how well he does with money. Most people would buy what they can afford at the time and then get a more expensive home as their income grows. Well I guess Americans don’t mine these two as both would continue the Bush policy of borrow, steal and borrow some more. China and the Middle East Leaders are more then will to give more loans to the US and buy up more shares in the US banks. Soon Americans will see the fine print on a loan is written in a foreign language then you’ll know who owns the US bank.
April 20th, 2008 at 9:44 pmShouldn’t a conservative be looking for ways to cut government revenue? after cutting spending? Why would McCain want increased revenue?
April 20th, 2008 at 10:16 pmJackie Says:
a whole lot of bull.
April 20th, 2008 at 10:22 pmfreedom lover Says:
Jackie Says:
a whole lot of bull.
April 20th, 2008 at 10:22 pm
Jackie speaks a hell of a lot more truth than we ever see from you.
April 20th, 2008 at 10:35 pmI fail to see how innuendo and lies, easily refuted with two minutes of Googling, supports a person’s political positions. And I fail to see how hating Barak, Hillary, Bill, George, or anyone else, mitigates McCain’s continually eroding grasp on current events, the economy, or the American people.
Frankly, I’ve seen nothing to justify the fears of Fox News, the religious right, and racists in general. I imagine that if one buys the label of “Atheist, Muslim, Black separatist Christian, unAmerican, gang related, smoking, coffee hating, elitist, socialist, communist, lapel pin traitor” attached to Obama; one will find some reason to hate him. But making stuff up just makes one look like an idiot.
April 20th, 2008 at 10:57 pmIs John McCain trying to get even for his years of torture by inflicting his tortured logic on the rest of the world? We would all be better off if this old fool would just lie down and take a long nap.
April 21st, 2008 at 2:07 amSo Stephanapolous bombs at the Democratic debate during the week and then has a love-in with BFF McCain on the weekend. Big surprise.
April 21st, 2008 at 9:35 am7 Years of GOP misrule in this country =
NO Border Security
NO Health Care Reform
NO Immigration Reform
NO Social Security Reform
NO Infrastructure Reform
and of course….NO OSAMA….oh wait…didn’t bush say ‘mission accomplished’???
Now of course, McCain wants to continue down this inane road of disaster with…you guessed it!! an economic plan that promises more of the same…
and you wonder why 82% of the country thinks we’re on the wrong track…
April 22nd, 2008 at 9:16 am