McCain on the other hand, reportedly, sought the endorsement (aggressively, for over a year) of Pastor Hagee, without regard to his well publicized reputation for “hate speech” and calls for an active role in precipitating the end of life as we know it, Armageddon.

I’ve been reading about Pastor Hagee, in horror, for many years. There’s no context which mitigates the vileness of his message. He’s a dangerous fanatic toshiba satellite p30 battery,toshiba satellite p35 battery who is doing everything he can to cause “Jesus to take him home” before he dies of a coronary and has to take a dirt nap.

> Robert F. Kennedy Jr.
> “For They That Sow the Wind Shall Reap the
> Whirlwind”
> Posted August 29, 2005 | 06:03 PM (EST)
>
>
> As Hurricane Katrina dismantles Mississippi’s Gulf
> Coast, it’s worth recalling the central role that
> Mississippi Governor Haley Barbour played in
> derailing the Kyoto Protocol and kiboshing President Bush’s
> iron-clad campaign promise to regulate CO2.
>
> In 1998, Republican icon Pat Robertson warned that
> hurricanes were likely to hit communities that
> offended God. Perhaps it was Barbour’s memo that
> caused Katrina, at the last moment, to spare New
> Orleans and save its worst flailings for the
> Mississippi coast. [UPDATE: Alas, the reprieve for
> New Orleans was only temporary. But Haley Barbour still
> has much to answer for.]
>
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-f-kennedy-jr/for-they-that-sow-the-_b_6396.html#c
>

BTW Daryll, it makes no sense, none whatsoever, to use the threat of hell or scriptures to try to argue with us heathens. Oh and I need a professional opinion – can I live in sin and repent just before I die to get to your heaven? Isn’t that the way for me to optimize my fun? It seems to be consistent with so many of the radical right I meet. In case you are so nuts you can’t tell it, that was sarcasm; I don’t believe in your heaven or hell. And one more question, how is your idea that God punishes us in this world for our sins supported by the story about Jesus saving a hooker from being stoned by the Pharisees? It seems highly unlikely she had repented at that time.

Now for your “holier than thou” determination that this event was the hand of your mystical god; consider this: the city of New Orleans was indeed recently destroyed by hurricane Katrina. At least a thousand people died, tens of thousands lost all their earthly possessions, and over a million were displaced. It is safe to say that almost every person living in New Orleans at the moment Katrina struck believed in an omnipotent, omniscient, and compassionate God. But what was God doing while a hurricane laid waste to their city? Surely He heard the prayers of those elderly christian men and women who fled the rising waters for the safety of their attics, only to be slowly drowned there. These were people of faith. These were good men and women who had prayed throughout their lives. He heard them, didn’t he? Or did he not, because mirages are just that….mirages.

Fortunately, there are those of us who don’t marinate in religious fiction who have the courage to admit the obvious: these poor people spent their lives in the company of an imaginary friend.

So keep spouting your idiotic spin, Hagee. Only fools and con artists like yourself can do anything and everything possible to negate scientific facts with religious fiction. Unbelievably, certain simpletons will continue believe your BS. Now that’s heresy.

Hagee, in context, is about as remarkable as a French Marxist. His particular brand of religion has been an undercurrent in American life since the very earliest days. You know how you guys rag on the Right for “pants wetting” re terrorism? That’s about how we see your reaction to Hagee, because he’s no threat to anybody — he rubs his hands in anticipation of being able to gloat when God does the Bad Guys (by his definition) in, but does not call for any human agency to punish the wicked.

But that’s all minor. Discussion of theology and/or “hate speech” (same thing, really) is beside the point. This is a political tactic, and it won’t work. The best proof of that is right here: McCain, challenged, mumbles something noncommital, and everybody goes on to the next thing. You guys are in full-court, hazmat-suit, red-lights-and-siren damage control mode, and sounding more frantic by the day. You ought to be able to gain a Clew just from your own desperation.

Hagee and his followers are going to vote for somebody. That’s a given. John McCain figures it might as well be him as anybody else, and shifts around like (surprise!) a politician to get those votes. After all, the Democrats have the “Kill Whitey!” demographic sewed up, and smirk in assumed virtue for having accomplished that. He might as well try for the opposite side, especially since it’s substantially more numerous. You, on the other hand, are trying to marginalize those people, and your tactic there is to try to manipulate things so that McCain offends Hagee & Co. as badly as you have, with the idea in mind that they’ll either go away entirely or reject him as they have you. McCain must repudiate Hagee! No, that’s not forceful enough! It’s got to be absolute!

In the first place, McCain isn’t nearly that stupid. He’s a Navy fighter pilot, which says a lot if you know the genre, but just short of imbecilic? You wish. (No, I’m not a McCain admirer. If the Democrats had anybody credible you’d probably get my vote.) In the second place, and more important, the cries of he must repudiate are at best an equal and opposite insult to the people involved, and more usually tend to drive them farther away from you. And in the third place, everything you do in that direction invariably and inevitably points back at Wright, no matter how loudly you shout “Look! Over there! No, not there, fool, over there!

It’s particularly telling that you don’t find the views of an explicitly racist, America-hating, rabble-rousing demagogue “offensive, racist, or unamerican”, and more indicative that you’re trying to spin a typical, “I’m sorry you’re so sensitive as to take offense” nonapology into a “thoughtful, eloquent, speech”. Careful of the bearings, there. RPMs that high need special lubrication.

As for the mythical “moderates” — I think you must be talking about the people who don’t pay attention. To the extent they matter, which won’t be until September at the earliest, I personally don’t think this will affect them much. Prediction is hard, especially about the future, so I suppose I could be wrong — but remember: Hagee doesn’t threaten anybody, and in fact goes to great lengths to avoid threats (if you understand the nuance); Wright & Co. are explicity calling for “wall, oppressors, some assembly required.” There is a difference, and it ain’t nearly as subtle as you try to make it.

Regards,
Ric

Obama has a relationship with Rev. Wright and his church. Apparently, Rev. Wright is well respected by those who have heard him preach. Yet, many have labeled him a racist, and worse, for no other reason than 3 youtube clips, with no context, and recognition of the work of, prominent if controversial, African American activists. Personally, I checked out the unedited versions and found nothing offensive, racist, or unamerican, in the “offensive” sermons; when they are viewed in context.(BTW, the “chickens coming home to roost” rant? Was inspired by the words of a [gasp!] white Ambassador, who’s name escapes me.)

When faced with, what I consider, a contrived controversy? Sen. Obama delivered a thoughtful, eloquent, speech that revealed his depth of knowledge, wisdom, and political savvy.

McCain on the other hand, reportedly, sought the endorsement (aggressively, for over a year) of Pastor Hagee, without regard to his well publicized reputation for “hate speech” and calls for an active role in precipitating the end of life as we know it, Armageddon.

I’ve been reading about Pastor Hagee, in horror, for many years. There’s no context which mitigates the vileness of his message. He’s a dangerous fanatic who is doing everything he can to cause “Jesus to take him home” before he dies of a coronary and has to take a dirt nap.

In order to land this endorsement McCain had to abandon his long-term antipathy to the “religious right”. And why did McCain seek this nutjob out and abandon his principles? For a few thousand Texas voters. And how did McCain deal with this, what I consider, serious violation of his stated principles? Denial, followed by a half-assed “I regret if he said anything anti-anyone”. McCain’s sell out to these hateful creatures may be the biggest tragedy of this campaign. Rather than telling the most odious members of his party to take a hike, damaging their grip on the GOP, he has embraced and validated them.

So? I think that McCain loses “preachergate” hands down. He put off a lot of moderates and I think this move may be as damaging as any in a campaign where he has sold his principles to all comers.

It doesn’t work. It won’t work, because it can’t work, because the assumption upon which it’s based is false.

John Hagee is a whackjob. He votes. He votes Republican, and that’s what frosts your butt — people like Hagee used to vote Democratic, straight ticket, and they don’t any more.

But at the very worst, Hagee isn’t an activist. He’s gonna spout his bullshit, and plan on sitting by and smirking when God smacks people, but he isn’t planning on going out and beating up on anybody. He thinks God is gonna come down hard on the Jews for rejecting the Messiah — but he isn’t advocating beating up on Jews, and in fact contributes big bucks to the support of Israel.

You aren’t gonna find any mainstream rightist who doesn’t think Hagee’s a whackjob. In fact, you’ll find very few Republicans of any philosophy who don’t think Hagee’s a whackjob, and who aren’t willing to say that to anyone who’s listening. Yes, you’ll find similar whackjobs, some of them vocal, who will defend him — but none of them is John McCain, and none of them are high up in Republican politics, and they aren’t gonna get there.

Hagee’s church is a thousand miles from either Washington or Phoenix. John McCain never attended that church, did not get married in that church, did not send his children to be taught by that church, and did not ask Hagee to be a primary campaign advisor. He most especially did not seek out Hagee or his church, or select a house specifically because of its propinquity.

Jeremiah Wright is just as big a whackjob, and it takes maybe ten seconds of listening to him to make that as obvious as sunrise. But unlike Hagee, Wright is an activist who advocates beating up on people, and has friends, associates, mentors, and followers who not only advocate beating up on their enemies, but strongly promote the idea. And again unlike Hagee, Wright’s party is full of people who promote or apologize for him, and commit themselves to dumbass tactics like this “essay” to try to take the heat off.

It won’t work, because Barack Obama did seek out Wright. Obama attended that church regularly, gave substantial contributions to it, was married there, sent his children there to be taught, wrote a whole book based on that church’s philosophy and theology, and deliberately moved to a residence where it would be convenient for him to do all those things.

And at the end of the day, after all the fulminations on all the lefty websites and all the hitpiece interviews and smarmy speeches on NPR, Hagee will still be a distasteful nutcase with no visible influence on the candidate he endorses, and Wright will still be a barely-short-of-murderous nutcase whose influence on the candidate he endorses is not only visible, it is cited with pride by the candidate.

Tough shit. Next time, check this crap out before you try to anoint the New Messiah, rather than being inspired by the hopeychanginess and setting yourself up for this kind of bitter disappointment. The time to find the skeletons in the closet is before you flip the house.

Regards,
Ric

Never mind rational ………..
April 23rd, 2008 at 8:17 pm

Touche!

It all depends on how we define “religious people”. I have found that most who identify themselves as “religious” are not fanatical. These are the good folks who attend church as a social event, or to stay in Grandma’s will, without buying the whole concept of a present, extant, and active God. They don’t all trade in hate and hypocrisy.

Now when one deals with the stereotypical “fundie”, like Daryll, there’s no reason or honesty to appeal to. All one can do is keep an eye on them, keep them away from kids, and shout down their BS with utter contempt.

April 23rd, 2008 at 6:36 pm

How many religious people do you know that are really honest ?

Never mind rational ………..

Well, not really, not according to my imaginary friend, Winky. He kinda likes it.

Winky kinda wantsa write a big book, but he missed out on the Iron Age. Can anyone help him out?

They legislate and judiciate based upon being influenced by their religious beliefs and the Bible ; not a good mix ……
April 23rd, 2008 at 6:12 pm

I don’t go quite that far. My definition of “rational and honest” does not necessarily eliminate all “religious people”. But, I have no tolerance for theocracy. And I struggle with violent thoughts when I see a fat-ass preacher with a Rolex and a $2,000.00 suit. You know, the ones with a Bible in one hand and the other hand in someone’s pocket? Grrrr.

And if Huckabee, or any other Minister, were elected President? I would be on the first plane out. People who have actually devoted their professional life to a myth are just not reliable in my eyes.

April 23rd, 2008 at 6:07 pm

Which is why I continue to insist that religious people should be immediately/automatically be disqualified from EVER running for office or be allowed to sit behind a bench ; the crap that they are “strict Constitutionalists” is just GOP rhetorical bullshit.

They legislate and judiciate based upon being influenced by their religious beliefs and the Bible ; not a good mix ……

He doesn’t understand that the law of the land here in the US is indeed the Constitution and not his beloved Bible ; and I’m pretty sure the one sponsor and the 44 other moronic co-sponsors feel similarly to his idiotic stance………
April 23rd, 2008 at 5:56 pm

And that may be the overriding tragedy of our times. Our government has become self-serving and “We The People” seem to believe that the Constitution is there to protect us. Unfortunately it is We who must protect, and enforce, the Constitution through our votes. It’s a pretty dang good Constitution and is worthy of our protection.

Now? We rational, honest, people need to remove the irrational, dishonest, people in our government. We have a great opportunity to get our nation back on track. It really is too bad “the 28%ers” vote as a block. They remain a formidable danger.