Comments on: Afghanistan insurgency may be spreading north.

By: kdcostak

kdcostak — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 19:38:07 +0000

hi everybody, this is my first time i have a written on Thinkprogress. well anyway i would just like to say that i find it amazing that conservatives like to trash liberals as traitors. yet they support a war that is impairing our efforts to fight terrorism elsewhere. bin laden is still on the loose and our image abroad is being damaged. i am not gonna to accuse conservatives of traitors because i think that goes to far but still this blog piece points out that conservatives have made many missteps

By: backup

backup — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 16:48:44 +0000

Kilo. I see your point that if it weren’t heroine, it would be something else.

It’s a challenging situation. I suggest that because it is so challenging (and much of the precieved threat has abated), more and more people are tiring of it. Or doubting the chances for any kind of real success.

By: backup

backup — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 14:08:34 +0000

Kilo. That’s hard to deny. The heroine was there long before America. It’s possible we overreach when we try to put America (faulty as it may be) at the center of all blame.

That being said, kawika brings up an important issue. Regardless of America’s role in heroine, it is something that fuels interests contrary to our (Americans) interest.

If we don’t deal with that source of funding, the fuel, will the conflict abate any time soon, despite our best military efforts?

By: backup

backup — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 13:58:41 +0000

kawika49.

You make good points that I hadn’t spent any time thinking about. Mahalo.

By: Doc Rock

Doc Rock — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 11:53:16 +0000

Because of Iraq, Afghanistan is a shambles–thanks to Cheney-Bush & Rummy!

By: kawika49

kawika49 — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 06:54:45 +0000

Backup, we taught the Afghani’s on how to use the heroine trade to pay for their arms needs…we set them up while they were embroiled with the Russians, while we trained them on use of our weapons and tactics…We did that.
Yet like today…we did not or do now have an exit strategy on the drug and weapons trade.
It is not a simple thing…We stuck our nose in…And hopefully, we will use history, and knowlege (rather than gut feelings) to get us out of this mess.
Aloha

By: backup

backup — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 06:41:18 +0000

kawika49.

In hindsight the effort in Iraq was misplaced. Concentrating on Afganistan would seem to have been more productive (less alienating).

I haven’t spent much time considering Heroine and it’s implications on the future of Afganistan.

Not knowing any better, I assume that Afgan’s need money. Heroine production provides that money. To counter heroine, you would either have to reduce demand for it (provide a cheaper substitute) or (more likely) offer some other means for Afgan’s to make money.

Maybe the answer is to stimulate alternative industry in the country. Americans bare a responsibility to reduce demand at home, but, it seems that stimulating their economy (to combat heroine) may be beyond our scope. I don’t know.

By: kawika49

kawika49 — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 06:26:15 +0000

Again (backup) my friend,
I wish you could convince the Admin on that…the emphasis is on Iraq. And I have yet to see meaningful, respect for the Afghani’s from our front…They have labored under harsh conditions for over 30 years. Yet we throw away lives and trasure on Iraq.
So backup…what do we do with the Heroine?

By: backup

backup — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 06:20:57 +0000

kawika49.

Your posts are reasonable. I agree we have meddled in their internal affairs. The argument could be made that we meddled in their affairs, because the organization that claimed responsibility for the attacks on our country (9/11) were being harbored within Afganistan. And we had a desire to intercede and prevent future attacks.

If you buy that premise, the meddling is not entirely unjustified.

By: kawika49

kawika49 — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 06:16:10 +0000

Profmarcus…I know from where u speak…thank you for your post…Been there done that!

By: sacopenapa

sacopenapa — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 06:06:25 +0000

Oh yeah! The dollar! How much it is worthed now??!!! Well done Bush!!!! Mission accomplished!

By: profmarcus

profmarcus — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 06:05:18 +0000

since i happen to be sitting at my desk here in kabul, afghanistan, typing this, i want to point out that there are a number of different perspectives on afghanistan, and you have presented one of them… visit here and see a few others…

And, yes, I DO take it personally

By: sacopenapa

sacopenapa — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 06:04:06 +0000

and they are being occupied by an arrogant government who so far has been completely incompetent! The USA can stay in Iraq for a 100 years, however, as an occupying force, it will never prevail. “Iraq is going to be a piece of cake”, That statement was 5 years ago! So was ‘Mission acomplished’. So was Rumsfeld say the war was going to last weeks not months, and it would cost very little. Indeed! How much you are paying for your petrol now? How is your ressecion doing? Unswer those questions and them let me know who is winning what!

By: kawika49

kawika49 — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 05:59:17 +0000

Backup, I would agree with your statement, If on the other hand, we would be comfortable with their choice of Gevernors…We have meddled in their internal politics (Chalabi and the gang)…Lord forbid that the Shiite should have afinity for Iran…Look if we’re going to have a puppet government in Iraq…Lets do it right!…Or leave it and let them do it to themselves…We tried it in Nam, didn’t work.

By: sacopenapa

sacopenapa — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 05:59:09 +0000

How cute! You really believe the USA is a power of good and pro-democracy in the world!!!! Ooooohhhhhh! How very cute! Tell me, what was the reason giving to the World about invading Iraq? WMD. There was no talking about how good Freedom or democracy is. It was WMD. Remember the WAR CRIMINAL Rice phrase? Those lies about 45min attack and mushrooms clouds? Do you? All that talk about ’spreading democracy came after the Lies about WMD fell through. Now… Lets have a look into the USA’s historical record as a ‘Democracy promoter’, shall we???? Lets have a look in South America’s military governments. who was behind them? Oh yes… the democracy promoter number one! Iraq and Afegahnistan are being occupied for OIL! Not democracy! Really really cute of you in believing in your criminal governmet!

By: backup

backup — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 05:48:12 +0000

Afegahnistan and Iraq are being occupied by an evil, greedy and incompetent imperialistic force.

If someone wants to give you the right to self determination (the right to choose your leaders); is that consistent with evil or greed?

If the occupiers were really evil and greedy, why would they want the citizens to have the power to choose the leadership?

By: sacopenapa

sacopenapa — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 05:42:04 +0000

Meanwhile, in the very very very fortified green zone: Booommm!

By: sacopenapa

sacopenapa — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 05:41:27 +0000

They are not issurgents, nor terrorists, they are FREEDOM FIGHTERS! Their country is being occupied! The fight will remain until the invader is taken care of!

By: kawika49

kawika49 — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 05:40:25 +0000

There are NGO’s who can provide HUmanitarian support…The are funded thru legitimate means!
Let us not forget what the Peace Corpse is about!

By: sacopenapa

sacopenapa — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 05:39:15 +0000

Afegahnistan and Iraq are being occupied by an evil, greedy and incompetent imperialistic force. Assassinating a puppet government is part of a legitimate fight for FREEDOM! Something the USA is lacking since after the WWII!