NBC’s Engel: Permanent Bases Would Technically Be Iraqi With U.S. ‘Tenants’ As ‘A Face Saving Device’
NBC’s Engel: Permanent Bases Would Technically Be Iraqi With U.S. ‘Tenants’ As ‘A Face Saving Device’
On Thursday, the UK Independent’s Patrick Cockburn reported on “a secret deal being negotiated in Baghdad” that “would perpetuate the American military occupation of Iraq indefinitely.” According to Cockburn, the deal result in American soldiers being stationed on permanent bases in Iraq:
Iraqi officials fear that the accord, under which US troops would occupy permanent bases, conduct military operations, arrest Iraqis and enjoy immunity from Iraqi law, will destabilise Iraq’s position in the Middle East and lay the basis for unending conflict in their country.
On the same day, NPR’s Diane Rehm asked NBC News Middle East correspondent Richard Engel about the report. Engel said that as part of “a face saving device,” the bases would technically be Iraqi and “U.S. troops would reside on them as tenants”:
ENGEL: That’s the question, is it permanent bases or is it not, and the details of this have not been published. The U.S. and Iraqi officials I’ve spoken to say they would not be U.S. permanent bases in Iraq, they would be Iraqi bases and that U.S. troops would reside on them as tenants and may even have to pay some sort of nominal rent, so there would be a face saving device. What’s also trying to be worked out is what’s the exact U.S. mission. Would they be able to conduct independent operations without the advice and consultation of the Iraqi government and that has been a point of contention.
Listen here:
After Cockburn’s report was released, U.S. Ambassador to Iraq, Ryan Crocker, tried to quash talk of permanent U.S. bases, telling reporters that “it is not going to be forever.” But Crocker also spoke of a situation that could comport with Engel’s “face saving” description, claiming that “there isn’t going to be an agreement that infringes on Iraqi sovereignty.”
Transcript:
REHM: Here’s an email from James asking about an article published today in the Independent in UK by Patrick Coburn and it’s entitled, Revealed: Secret Plan To Keep Iraq Under U.S. Control. Do you know about this?ENGEL: I don’t know the article, but I know Patrick Cockburn, he’s a friend and a fine reporter. Is this, I’ll take a look at the article.
REHM: Just published today and our communicator in Raleigh says, “why has this not received more attention?”
ENGEL: I know what he’s talking about. This is the strategic long term agreement that is being negotiated between Iraq and the United States. This is a deal that is supposed to be, and we have reported it, I think NBC News was the first to report this, it was, it is a long term strategic alliance that is being hammered out, mostly in secret in Baghdad. And that has many, many Iraqis concerned, it has some U.S. officials concerned as well. The U.S. negotiators that I’ve spoken to who are involved in this insist that it is not a treaty, that it will not commit large numbers of U.S. forces to Iraq for a long time, but it does clarify what the role of U.S. forces will be for a long period going forward.
REHM: I.E.
ENGEL: That’s the question, is it permanent bases or is it not, and the details of this have not been published. The U.S. and Iraqi officials I’ve spoken to say they would not be U.S. permanent bases in Iraq, they would be Iraqi bases and that U.S. troops would reside on them as tenets and may even have to pay some sort of nominal rent, so there would be a face saving device. What’s also trying to be worked out is what’s the exact U.S. mission. Would they be able to conduct independent operations without the advice and consultation of the Iraqi government and that has been a point of contention.
DOZIER: I know a member of Crocker’s team has been working on this for about a year behind the scenes. And one of the major sticking points is what law will apply to U.S. troops, how much will they be able to do on their own, how much will they have to…they want of course the rights that they have right now, to stage their own missions, their own raids, without getting anybody’s say so, just informing, “We’re headed off, we’re going to do this.” The Iraqis are pushing for approval of everything and also that Iraqi law would apply to soldiers, Marines who conduct violent acts.
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Anything to polish Bush’s turd of a legacy.
June 7th, 2008 at 3:16 pm…I think that’s “tenant”…
…not “tenet”….
June 7th, 2008 at 3:17 pmTenants, not tenets.
A tenant is a person or an organization that lives or works on property he or it does not own.
A tenet is a doctrine, opinion, or principle a person or organization accepts as true.
June 7th, 2008 at 3:18 pmYou guys beat me to it.
To be fair, considering how often and rapidly this site updates, it is remarkably typo-free.
June 7th, 2008 at 3:21 pmGDumbya will like that “tenet” idea; he’s always a sucker for a doctrine, opinion or principle.
June 7th, 2008 at 3:22 pmWITH THE AMERICAN TAXPAYERS FOOTING THE BILL
Hey man – We are broke and the bastards are BORROWING the money to pay for this and handing our gandchildren the bill
June 7th, 2008 at 3:26 pmHow much is his FACE worth?
NOT a penny to me!
June 7th, 2008 at 3:27 pmlet me get this straight. We are building permanent military facilities, in areas which are unsecured, to U.S. specifications and at our cost. But, those permanent bases won’t be technically ours which would require explicit Congressional approval. Then, for however long we are “tenants” we will have to pay for the privilege of occupying hostile foreign territory.
What’s not to love?sarc/off
June 7th, 2008 at 3:35 pmBut But……. the oil was going to pay for all this!
June 7th, 2008 at 3:35 pmthose bases ARE an affront to Iraq’s sovereignty…then again, we have a so-called commander guy who doesn’t even know what that word means…
June 7th, 2008 at 3:36 pmSounds like a real stupid desperate attempt for an over privileged frat-boy who has always gotten his way and never had to bear any responsibility for his actions to get his way.
June 7th, 2008 at 3:36 pmThe illegitimate Bush regime signs some bogus paperwork with its puppet regime in Baghdad: these “agreements” have no legal standing in international law since they were made under the duress of the illegal criminal occupation of Iraq by the imperial Bush regime. Not worth the paper they were written on. The puppet regime in Iraq, which has virtually no popular support and exists only due to the presence of some 300,000 armed foreign occupiers from the USofA. As soon as we start withdrawing in 2009, this puppet regime will collapse and then the Iraqi people will be running Iraq. Imagine that!
June 7th, 2008 at 3:37 pmthe journalist’s name is COCKBURN - Not coburn – though it is pronounced that way – Patrick Cockburn.
His brother produces Counterpunch, a good site to visit.
June 7th, 2008 at 3:44 pmYikes!
Another subprime mortgage backed by the US dollar.
June 7th, 2008 at 3:47 pmThe 104 acre American Embassy in Baghdad is permanent and will be used accordingly, just some more BS from the President.
June 7th, 2008 at 3:49 pmI’m worried what happens inside Iraq if Bush manage to push this illegal treaty through. Bet all hell will break loose
June 7th, 2008 at 3:51 pmI hear that if they do not agree to this, then they don’t get any of their $40 Billion that the US is holding.
June 7th, 2008 at 3:52 pmI just love the supposition of “Iraqi sovereignty.” There is no Iraq anymore, just a bunch of tribes loosely tied in groups, each with its own militia and martial influence. Then there’s the small matter of U.S. occupation immune to local law.
June 7th, 2008 at 4:05 pmThat rational worked really well in Saudi Arabia, just ask Osama bin Laden and the Saudi royal family. The fig leaf may satisfy the corrupt Iraqi government, though not al Sadr orIran and its factors in Iraq.
June 7th, 2008 at 4:16 pmThis just gives Obama even more ammunition against this administration and John McCain. They just keep digging the hole deeper and deeper.
By putting permanent bases there, is only going to further destabilize the area. Using blackmail to get is even worse. The Iraqi’s will not tolerate this, they have lost too much already. It would be a constant reminder, like our embassy, of everything they have lost. The only “face saving” they should be doing is withdrawing so that they can heal and start to rebuild their lives.
If and when they start construction of these bases is only going to put our soldiers in further danger. This insult will be too much for the Iraqi’s to bare. The military better prepare for serious retaliation before this project even gets off the ground.
June 7th, 2008 at 4:21 pmIf the US is going to pay rent to the Iraqis, then their relationship will become one of a business transaction: an extension of Bush’s world of privatization. In which case, instead of housing our soldiers on foreign soil, let them be the Blackwater and other mercenaries. What transpires between the natives and the paid occupiers will no longer be any concern to us citizens and taxpayers. Mission accomplished.
June 7th, 2008 at 4:26 pm[A]s part of “a face saving device,” the bases would technically be Iraqi and “U.S. troops would reside on them as tenants”…
Ah, yes — just like Guantánamo is technically Cuban.
June 7th, 2008 at 4:30 pmOn the same day, NPR’s Diane Rehm asked NBC News Middle East correspondent Richard Engel about the report. Engel said that as part of “a face saving device,” the bases would technically be Iraqi and “U.S. troops would reside on them as tenants.”
And this is supposed to fool who? That’s the problem with believing your own BS, you end up assuming everyone else does too.
http://progressiveworldreview.com
June 7th, 2008 at 4:38 pmIts Patrick COCKBURN not COBURN. Journalist and talk show host on Air America Laura Flanders is his niece.
June 7th, 2008 at 4:40 pmWhatever reasons are, or were, given for the occupation of Iraq, it’s a lose/lose situation for all but Bush/Cheney and those who profit from and support this fiasco. It’s horrifying to think of it this way, but the occupation appears to be little but a CYA exercise. As long as the occupation continues, this criminal administration, its legislative backers, and those who voted for them can claim it is somehow valid. There’s no chance that the puppet media and the country will call the invasion and occupation of Iraq a disastrous mistake until the US withdraws.
June 7th, 2008 at 4:43 pmTenet is a former ineffectual CIA Director.
With the “nominal rent angle”, this is already being positioned as not only a “face saving device” but also a cost saving one (compared to the current situation). This from the folks who said this war would “pay for itself.” No mention as to how they expect to keep our troops safe on these “Iraqi bases” when we have a hard enough time keeping them safe on US bases in Iraq.
-AF
June 7th, 2008 at 4:48 pmAndrew Sullivan Is A Fraud
Translation:
June 7th, 2008 at 4:54 pmThey haven’t stolen quite enough money yet and would like nothing better than to continue stealing from the U.S. taxpayer indefinitely, while using that stolen money to fund the control of another country and their oil supply that they have illegally invaded. And of course to subsequently invade neighboring countries.
Let’s not confuse an Embassy with Military Bases…rented or otherwise.
An Embassy houses ambassadors…who have political immunity(Iranian Revolution notwithstanding). They can be recalled (kicked out) but they can’t be prosecuted .
Military Bases are something else…and whether soldiers can be prosecuted for violating Iraqi Laws is what is at issue. We have similar problems where US Bases exist…in Okinawa, for example, where an unfortunate Rape case caused an international incident with Japan.
Iran, and their Shiite allies are decidedly opposed to permanent bases. I believe Maliki will travel to Terhan soon, to discuss this matter.
Iraq’s Sunni Neighbors believe that the Maliki Govt. is under Iranian influence. They have refused to forgive Iraqi debt for this very reason.
The Bush administration is trying to solve this dilemma with their “face saving device”. Iran ain’t buying it. We’ll see what the Maliki Govt. does about it.
June 7th, 2008 at 4:59 pmOh make no doubt about it. Iraq IS a permanent thing. We’ll be there killing and maiming Iraqi citizens till the end of time. Thank you Dictator Bush.
JT
June 7th, 2008 at 5:02 pmThink your ISP is Watching?
What you say is true in the traditional sense. But an “embassy” this large is more of a walled fortress inside the invaded country, and as such, can house military, para-military, CIA, mercenaries, oil executives. Oh….. and a few embassy personnel, just to keep it on the up and up.
June 7th, 2008 at 5:06 pmI agree upside99.
Looks suspicious to me too.
June 7th, 2008 at 5:10 pmLumpyDunky Says:
Think your ISP is Watching?
How about you stop spamming.
Your “ISP watching” and “spying” claims cannot be fixed with your anonymizer, because when you connect on your isp you are assigned an ip address from them and they can packet trace you all day, if they have a reason to. The only way to keep your ISP from seeing what you do is by not ever connecting, dumbass.
So stop your false advertising and spamming.
June 7th, 2008 at 5:24 pmJust to flesh out the list, upside, it’s also the refuge of first resort for the pupp.. I mean freely elected government of Iraq. That’s where the pupp… I mean freely elected government will hide when the people of Iraq decide to deal with America’s pupp… I mean Iraq’s freely elected government according to their performance. I would be very surprised if Al-Maliki doesn’t have a nice villa just down in Paraguay.
June 7th, 2008 at 5:25 pmLumpyDunky,
June 7th, 2008 at 5:51 pmHow ya doing? Wanna quit with the lame shit or do we have to talk?
the 7th – 12th century was the golden age of Islam with Baghdad a centrepiece of its power. How low these Arabs have become to allow the infidel americans to occupy their ancient and historical land and destroy its culture.
Lawrence of Arabia kicked the ottomans out of arabia. However, we are waiting for a latter-day Lawrence to kick the yanks out of the middle-east entirely as Bin_laden espouses. Of course, the arabs are too cowardly to take up arms and rid themselves of a tyrant let alone recognize this fact.
June 7th, 2008 at 6:17 pmAre we in a tenent relationship? And does the tenent owe master bush some ill conceived justice department decision?
June 7th, 2008 at 6:20 pmWhere are the legs for the prosecutor? Buried in the athorney scandal?
So..IF they are going to be Iraq bases, the Iraq’s should PAY FOR THEM COMPLETELY .. THEN we could pay rent (right)…
These ass-clowns (Crocker being the biggest LIAR among them) are trying to spin this so it looks like we are there at the request of the bushie puppets AND we pay rent AND we’ll leave whenever they want us to AND on..on..on….
WHAT CRAP! OUT NOW!!
June 7th, 2008 at 6:57 pmJust in case anyone missed it. He had an article about how the Iraqis really feel.
http://www.juancole.com/2008/06/demonstrations-speeches-against.html
June 7th, 2008 at 7:31 pmI just found this interesting solution to the problem at:
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/6/7/195141/4543/996/531914
It would be an incredibly bold and effective move for Obama to come out now, before this thing gets through the Iraqi parliament, and state the following:
“President Bush is currently attempting to bypass the congressional authority over the ratification of foreign treaties in order to make permanent an unwanted occupation of the country of Iraq. Unwanted by Iraqis and unwanted by a majority of Americans. Therefore I will, on my first day of office, unsign any ‘Status of Forces’ agreement for Iraq that includes any demand for the continued presence of American forces in the country of Iraq. Any such agreement is a de facto treaty, and as such must be submitted to the United States Congress for ratification.”
June 7th, 2008 at 9:10 pmCut off the freakin’ funds!
June 7th, 2008 at 9:30 pmAin’t that a hoot. Tenants who will kill you if you try to evict them!
June 7th, 2008 at 10:20 pmIt won’t take but a month for them to be arrears in the rent…
June 7th, 2008 at 10:36 pmThis sounds a lot like what happened in Cuba following the Spanish-American War. Ever hear of Gitmo?
June 8th, 2008 at 12:18 amAll the above comments are rather snarky. Where is the protest? Why is not everyone demanding answers to how this could be happening? We are becoming an empty society…just us and our keyboards. Let’s color the text messages in supercilious snark; and the smaller the screen the better. Any correlation between the text color and the Homeland Security terrorist warnings?
June 8th, 2008 at 12:22 amIf your neighbor and his kids comes over, kicks the door open, destroys your furniture, shoots your dog, peels your cat and rolls it in salt, gang rapes your daughter, THEN moves his son and his college buddies into your upstairs master suite, makes your wife cook and clean – BUT pays you $35 a month RENT . . . do you REALLY have anything to complain about????
June 8th, 2008 at 12:26 amUPdate:
TEHRAN, Iran – Iraq’s prime minister sought to ease Iranian fears over a proposed security deal with the U.S. Sunday, saying his government will NOT ALLOW Iraq to become a launching pad for an attack on its neighbor.
The only conceivable way that Iraq could make this assurance, is to get the US to agree NOT to conduct independent operations without the advice and consultation of the Iraqi government, and that has been a point of contention.( Note that the word PERMISSION is avoided)
Al-Maliki’s government has always been an ally of Tehran, and the Shiite and KURDISH parties that dominate it have long-standing close ties with the Iranian leadership.
Sounds like a real DILEMMA.
June 8th, 2008 at 8:08 amJust until the Rapture.
June 8th, 2008 at 9:25 amThe permanent bases aren’t really permanent, they are just building to house our troops for 100 years.
June 8th, 2008 at 10:58 amJust a hint : Before you export democracy, try having it at home…
then, procecute your so called leaders as the war criminals they are…
McCAIN’S KILLING FLOOR
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f4QKfDdJ3ns
OBAMA & HILLARY’S KILLING FLOOR
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=scNLxSleuec
then, get to the hearth of the matter…
HIGHEST BIDDER
http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=MmhL8bjL9vc
“The tyrant, who in order to hold his power, suppresses every superiority, does away with good men, forbids education and light, controls every movement of the citizens and, keeping them under a perpetual servitude, wants them to grow accustomed to baseness and cowardice, has his spies everywhere to listen to what is said in the meetings, and spreads dissension and calumny among the citizens and impoverishes them, is obliged to make war in order to keep his subjects occupied and impose on them permanent need of a chief.” – Aristotle
June 9th, 2008 at 8:48 amWhite Noise, check your inbox…
June 11th, 2008 at 9:39 amBadger Says:
Let’s not confuse an Embassy with Military Bases…rented or otherwise.
An Embassy houses ambassadors
Tell that to the KGB…
June 17th, 2008 at 12:51 pm