Sands: Everyone in UK agrees waterboarding ‘is torture in all circumstances.’
By on Jun 10th, 2008 at 10:30 pm
Sands: Everyone in UK agrees waterboarding ‘is torture in all circumstances.’
Testifying today before the Senate Judiciary Committee, British international law professor Philippe Sands said that waterboarding is “torture in all circumstances”:
There’s no one I can think of in the United Kingdom who would not immediately conclude that the use of waterboarding, which is creating the misperception of suffocation, is torture in all circumstances.
In his book Torture Team, released in May, Sands wrote that the “architects of torture” in the Bush administration have refused to acknowledge that they were “complicit in the commission of a crime.”
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This will all come out between now and the War Crimes trials at Den Hague.
June 10th, 2008 at 10:44 pmCan you confirm a couple other things for us?
June 10th, 2008 at 10:47 pm1. Is water wet?
2. Is the pope catholic?
If you have time, we'd like to know if a bear shits in the woods.
Of course it is. We executed war criminals for it. Before our standing in the world was destroyed by reich-wing uber-putzes.
June 10th, 2008 at 10:48 pmThis statement should be interesting to the terrorist. Yes the UK thinks torture is wrong but the United States thinks it's ok. Now when we see Americans and US soldiers tortured we only need to go to the video tape.
June 10th, 2008 at 11:16 pmThe Republican tactic of the false equivalence (intelligent design and evolution being equally valid scientific theories is a good example), no longer works.
Of course waterboarding (and/or whatever other "inhanced interrogation" techniques these criminals have used) is torture. There was never any question among reasonably prudent men.
June 10th, 2008 at 11:35 pmWell, to be fair, it still works with the wingnuts. Your point is that it no longer works with the public at large, and I think you're right.
I pray you're right.
June 10th, 2008 at 11:40 pmMarcus Aurelius Says:
Of course waterboarding (and/or whatever other “inhanced interrogation” techniques these criminals have used) is torture. There was never any question among reasonably prudent men.
Or among those that don't profit from it.
June 10th, 2008 at 11:42 pmThis is going to come back and haunt us. Innocent people will suffer because of this administrations criminal activities. The government won't be able to say they hate us for our freedoms. Their hate will come from the tortured we allowed, and from all the innocent people that were killed for money and oil. One human life is too much, and they have the blood of over a million people on their hands.
When will the human race learn to cherish life over all else? I guess when they learn that amassing wealth is pointless when so many go hungry.
June 10th, 2008 at 11:46 pmNow just wait a minute. Don't go rushing to judgement based on one academic's opinion (and after all, we don't need no experts).
If we make a decision now, we can't waterboard Bush et al. for a confession.
June 10th, 2008 at 11:47 pmStunning success propaganda of framing,
It is amazing that even those not successfully indoctrinated into believing torture is not torture are using the words of the torturers.
June 10th, 2008 at 11:54 pmWater-boarding is not a misperception of suffocation; it is suffocation. It is one of the cruelest forms of torture ever devised. It is also one of the oldest (referred to as standard French torture for centuries) and most common asphyxiation torture techniques.
Even Amy Goodman of "Democracy Now" has repeatedly referred to water-boarding as causing the "illusion of drowning". It is drowning. It’s worse than accidental drowning because it is diabolically designed to repeat (once consciousness is regained). Everyone who is against torture and wants to convince others of its evil should stop using the trivializing language of the torturers.
Peace, JK
No, Billy you fu(king idiot, it means we shouldn't TORTURE anyone.
Where do these people come from?
When's the last time you killed an animal or wet your bed? Started a fire?
A$$hole.
June 11th, 2008 at 12:28 am.
Does the bank robber have to admit the commission of a crime or does the exploded dye pack and surveillance video provide proof OF that crime?
The Administration does not have to admit anything...
Let just one song bird sing their tunes of torture.
.
June 11th, 2008 at 12:50 am#11 Billy,
June 11th, 2008 at 12:52 amTorture is inhumane.
We should treat ALL people with kindness...
... Even trolls.
This one isn't even a troll. It's a juvenile. A goblin, ghoul or whatever. And it's figured out what the buttons do on Mommy's computer, while she's at the bar, and can't help playing with it.
June 11th, 2008 at 12:59 amThe mere fact that a U.S. President would accept torture as "policy", let alone have his justice department DEFEND it, speaks volumes about the disgrace brought to 200 plus years of AMERICAN GREATNESS. In every war, every military leader treated prisoners with as much respect as the would expect for their OWN captured soldiers. Decider Guy has reduced our military to be an extension of an American Banana Third World Republic . . .
June 11th, 2008 at 1:49 amIs it really that hard to tell right from wrong? Is it really that difficult to establish certain acts that are inherently evil and crimes malum in se? We live in a world where the moral quality of many acts can be ambiguous. But there are some things that are just indisputable as being wrong. Torture is one such act.
As a former prosecutor, I have participated in murder, rape, grand theft and other trials which literally destroyed the life of the defendant. I have seen a few commit suicide after confessing their crimes and realizing the fate that awaited them. The convictions were obtained by confession in many of these cases despite the offender realizing the serious consequences of their confession. We never needed to resort to torture to obtain the information.
You can just as easily interrogate and receive information through traditional interrogation techniques with far more reliability than torture. Just ask those who interrogated the highest value Nazi prisoners of WWII. There is very little utility in torture.
Those who rail against the bleeding heart liberals who decry torture will always come back with the variant of the argument that we are being too soft, too considerate or providing too much comfort to the suspected terrorist. Therein lies the the proof of their crime against humanity (and torture is indeed a crime against humanity - we have prosecuted many from the Spanish American War through WWII and the Vietnam war for water boarding.) The real motive for their support of torture is revenge and the dehumanizing of their enemy. If you believe that simple, animal revenge against a helpless captive is justified, then you are just as bad as any terrorist that you can imagine. It is the difference between civilization and animal chaos.
June 11th, 2008 at 2:19 amJess Wonderin,
June 11th, 2008 at 3:16 amYes, it speaks VOLUMES... but even more voluminous is a body politic that defends immoral and corrupt actions... and even larger yet, is the populace that can't be bothered.
Bush adiministration,
June 11th, 2008 at 5:03 am
The US has been torturing people for decades! Since the WWII. Thousands of people were tortured and dispeared under military dictatorships in Latin America. Each and every one of this criminal dictatorships were financed and supported by the US, the most anti-democracy country in the world! Every democracy in South America were overturned and replaced by dictators who went through military training in 'The School of the Americas' in the USA. The difference now, everybody know the US does torture! War criminals! (I must stress here that I'm refering to government. Not the poeple of the US. If they knew what has been done in their name...)
June 11th, 2008 at 5:11 amGod help America...
June 11th, 2008 at 5:14 amJK Says:
Even Amy Goodman of “Democracy Now” has repeatedly referred to water-boarding as causing the “illusion of drowning”. It is drowning.
June 10th, 2008 at 11:54 pm
_____
Though I agree that we should not in any way trivialize torture, the term "illusion of drowning" is technically correct. By definition, drown means "to die or kill by immersing in liquid." Unless the subject dies, it's not actually drowning.
Waterboarding is, by definition, suffocation and asphyxiation, and we should try and use these terms together as much as possible so the message begins to sink in.
June 11th, 2008 at 7:08 amhussein toasterhead says:
Waterboarding is, by definition, suffocation and asphyxiation, and we should try and use these terms together as much as possible so the message begins to sink in.
play close attention, repukes.
June 11th, 2008 at 8:49 am@ #24, Guido sed: "Impeach/remove Scalia."
Roberts and Scalito should be the first to go, inasmuch as they lied in their confirmation hearings.
You'd have to remove Scalia with a forceps...
June 11th, 2008 at 9:03 amWaterboarding IS "Drowning."
One can drown in two table-spoons of water.
There's a couple of interesting discussions of drowning in this month's Harper's.
June 11th, 2008 at 9:07 amJinJIn:
June 11th, 2008 at 10:21 amDon't worry about your PC. Worry about me when you get into your car after dark in the abandoned parking garage.
JMOHR.
Thank you. Well said.
June 11th, 2008 at 10:49 am