Huckabee Faults Obama For Not Having The Convictions Of Segregationist Jesse Helms
Huckabee Faults Obama For Not Having The Convictions Of Segregationist Jesse Helms
Yesterday, former Arkansas governor Mike Huckabee appeared on Fox News’s Hannity and Colmes to talk about Sen. Barack Obama’s (D-IL) lack of “convictions.” Huckabee held up the late conservative senator Jesse Helms as an example of someone Obama should aspire to be:
HUCKABEE: Well, Americans have consistently rejected the George McGoverns and the Michael Dukakises, the people who clearly and unapologetically are out there on the left — the Walter Mondales who said, I’m going to raise your taxes.
So when liberals are honest about being liberals, they get beat. I think it’s a situation — you know, you had the little clip of Jesse Helms at the opening of the show, and I’m thinking, what a contrast. The thing that many of us loved and admired about Jesse Helms was that, here was a guy, he didn’t care what you thought about his view, but you were going to always know where he stood because he stood for something and he stood clearly.
I think we’re not seeing that in Barack Obama especially in relationship — to his position on the war.
Watch it:
Conservatives have held a love fest for Helms since his death, holding him up as a “courageous champion” (Mitch McConell), “conservative icon” (Bob Dole), and guilty of nothing more than “victory-making political incorrectness” (National Review). Both Huckabee and Hannity conveniently leave out any mention of what Helms’s convictions were, because they would have then been in the uncomfortable position of defending racism and segregation.
Helms once called Martin Luther King, Jr. a “sex pervert” and a “Communist” and staged a filibuster against making his birthday a federal holiday. He fought against funding AIDS research because he said the disease resulted from “unnatural” and “disgusting” homosexual behavior. He also waged vicious campaigns exploiting racial tensions. One ad he helped create demagogued, “White people, wake up before it is too late. Do you want Negroes working beside you, your wife and your daughters, in your mills and factories?”
It’s unsettling that Huckabee thinks Obama should take his cues from a man who believed that “[c]rime rates and irresponsibility among Negroes are a fact of life.”
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I personally don’t think theres one think that I “loved and admired” about Jesse Helms.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:07 pmhere’s the OTHER part of that story:
I think we’re not seeing that in Barack Obama especially in relationship — to his position on the war. -the HUCKSTER
that false meme that obama has changed his position…
repeat the lie enough times…
July 8th, 2008 at 12:08 pmHmmm. It sounds to me like Huckabee wants Obama to be more like George Bush a la Stephen Colbert:
July 8th, 2008 at 12:09 pm
Oh, right. Obama should aspire to be a racist bigot like Jesse Helms…?
Now I’ve heard everything.
Jebus. Mike Huckabee is as stupid as a friggin’ bag of hair.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:11 pmI guess if you translate Huckles’ blather into “I wish Obama would go as far out on a hate mongering limb as Jesse Helms so we could beat him” the comment sort of sounds like it was made by someone who isn’t a complete imbecile. Otherwise, the concept of comparing a hard core racist who never had to run outside of North Carolina to presidential candidates from two and three decades ago just reminds you that this guy was too weird even for the Republican base.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:12 pmOh, jeebus H. Keee-rist on a crutch!
Regressives make such a damn fuss over “knowing where someone stands” to the point that they prefer someone “who clearly stands for something” even if that something is ugly, destructive or dangerous.
The flip side is, because they don’t do nuance, they think that any position with some subtlety or sophistication — anything short of “white – good/ black – bad” is not “clear” enough to be trusted.
So they go with the racist they know rather than the liberal they can’t understand.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:13 pmI wish Mike Huckabee would accept that his 15 minutes of fame ended in March, and just go away.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:14 pmmcsame’s
choice for
vice president.
*
oh lord
hear my prayer.
:)
good luck.
*
July 8th, 2008 at 12:15 pmI have tried at every point to seek God’s wisdom on the decisions I made, and I made it my business to speak up on behalf of the things God tells us are important to Him. (Jesse Helms quote)
Whatever happened to love they neighbor? And You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor? I guess he skipped over the Ten Commandments not noteworthy enough.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:16 pmhe didn’t care what you thought about his view, but you were going to always know where he stood
Sounds to me like the obnoxious boor who is trying to foist his opinion on everyone – or at least voice his opinion so vociferously that he doesn’t let anyone else voice dissent.
But really, if Obama were to have the convictions of Jesse Helms he’d have to stand on the steps and block himself from going to school.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:17 pmThis is unfortunate when you consider that Huckabee was one of the few conservatives who chose to defend Jeremiah Wright after that whole debacle.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:18 pmMy wife was probably correct in her assumption that Huckabee was only protecting Wright in the hopes that no one would dig up any dirt on HIS sermons.
And now that the smoke is clear, he can go back to being a GOP hack.
Conservatives are synonomous with racists and bigots. Their ideals are so intertwined that ‘it goes without saying’. It’s not so much ‘conveniently leaving out’, it’s more a given that bigotry and racism are ‘conservative’ and so those convictions need no comment.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:18 pmIt’s easy to have “convictions” when you’re as simpleminded as Jesse Helms. Just look at Bush.
http://progressiveworldreview.com
July 8th, 2008 at 12:25 pmHere’s YOUR guy Daryll, didn’t that invisible magical god that is in YOUR head told you he was gonna be president.
Coo-coo, coo-coo, coo-coo.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:26 pmThe Huckster’s politically tone-deaf. This rhetoric will boomerang with a vengeance, and McCain’s not nimble enough to get out of the way.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:27 pmHitler was unwavering in his convictions…so wasn’t Charles Manson. So isn’t GW Bush.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:31 pmSeriously… the irony that Republicans would ask a black man to be more like a racist just can’t be a coincidence. I am convinced this type of behavior is an disgusting, intentional, insider Republican joke , and a talking point to boot.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:32 pmkaty notes the implied flip-flop meme…
…and the other meme here is that Obama isn’t “honest” (about being ‘liberal’) and therefore can’t be trusted, he’s not telling the truth and then it’s off to the races with the “secret Muslim” crap again.
The Reppublican playbook must have been turned into a digitial file because the original paper version would have to be illegible by now through over-use and age.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:32 pmand mcBUSH has the advantage of a fawning media who are sure to ignore ALL of his various and opposing “convictions”…
July 8th, 2008 at 12:34 pmThe sad thing is that Jesse Helms was re-elected term after term. The constituency approved of his message.
The whole of the current congress can’t say the same.
http://rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/mood_of_america/congressional_performance/congressional_performance
Congressional approval ratings fall to single digits for the first time ever.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:35 pmDidn’t Pastor Hagee already do this?
July 8th, 2008 at 12:36 pmI don’t think the big story here is Huckabee’s praise for Helms, it’s Huckabee’s attempt to paint Obama as a flip-flopper — a man with no convictions.
Obama HAS convictions. Although I admit I’m rather disappointed he hasn’t stood strong on his convictions regarding telecom immunity, it’s pretty obvious that he has been staying on message for the most part while McFlippityflop has been flapping whichever way the wind is blowing.
Huckabee is correct when he says that Helms had convictions he stood by regardless of what anyone thought. Helms’ mindset was rusted solidly in place, with no flexibility whatsoever — the opposite extreme — and just as bad as the other end of the scale; somebody who bends constantly with the special interests.
What we really need in our leader is a captain of a ship. Someone who can chart the most sensible course and stick to it, steer the ship without allowing the first class passengers to dictate how it’s steered, yet wise enough to alter course when conditions change. The “solid convictions” guys would sail right into a hurricane without wavering. This isn’t exactly admirable. Nor is allowing the highest-paying passengers to take the wheel.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:37 pmHUCKABEE: The thing that many of us loved and admired about Adolf Hitler was that, here was a guy, he didn’t care what you thought about his view, but you were going to always know where he stood because he stood for something and he stood clearly.
I think we’re not seeing that in the Jews.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:38 pmThe Republicans would LOVE IT if they could get Obama to play the role of the self-loathing black man.
It ain’t gonna happen.
Maybe they should call Daryll…
July 8th, 2008 at 12:38 pmLet me get this straight…the Huckster wants Obama to more racist so everyone ‘knows where he stands’?
WTF?
Jesse Helms is to Obama what Bush is to Ben Franklin.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:38 pmunbelievable Says:
I wish Mike Huckabee would accept that his 15 minutes of fame ended in March, and just go away.
Yes, Huck-a-bible also needs to accept that the South lost the Civil War.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:41 pmto be fair:
huck is referring
to “consumer driven”
racism which is entirely
different than the “goverment
mandated” racism
helms embraced.
&
good luck.
*
July 8th, 2008 at 12:42 pmWell, that’ll happen when you’ve got a party in nominal control whose partisans are willing to criticize them, and their leaders ignore vital issues. You’ve got minority partisans eager to criticize, and then you’ve got majority partisans open-minded enough to recognize when their people aren’t doing the job.
On the other hand, when you’ve got a president of a certain party known for its hive-mind character, you’re never gonna get much below 30% approval, unless that president is a REAL disaster.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:43 pmAlejandro Says:
Dr. Hussein Matt Says:
If Hitler were a republican, I bet the modern day GOPigs would find a way to defend him.
Didn’t Pastor Hagee already do this?
Pat Buchanan certainly did!
July 8th, 2008 at 12:44 pmhttp://www.realchange.org/hitler.htm
Let’s face it; simplicity is a virtue, especially when crafting a message.
Complexity is more difficult to assess.
The problem with Republicans is that they see simplicity as a primary virtue, embracing it even when it is counter-productive.
As H. L. Mencken said:
“For every complex question, there is an answer that is clear, simple and wrong.”
July 8th, 2008 at 12:47 pmas far as Obama’s “position on the war” the only thing that has changed is his rhetoric about the continued occupation of Iraq, which is now much the same as Clinton’s (for which she was raked over the coals by a number of noisy Obama supporters during the caucus races.)
But to my knowledge Obama never talked about a “precipitous withdrawal” (GOP trademark)he’s just expressing a more appropriate level of caution as until he’s President he really has no firm idea how a withdrawal will be accomplished, when, how long it will take and so on.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:51 pmBoth politically and practically this is smart and sensible thinking, rational and responsible and I’m pleased he’s not making any definitive public statements or predictions, nor is he being tempted to exploit the majority public desire for withdrawal for its emotional appeal. This is a good thing.
When these goobers go on Fox, and escape the reality based world, our choice in this election becomes so much clearer. AS a minister and a presidential candidate, Huckabee is showing his true colors–shame on him.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:51 pmAnyone who doesn’t think Obama is shifting his Iraq position from what he ran on during the primary should read this snippet from an Army Times interview:
Getting U.S. combat troops out of Iraq is a key Obama goal, and one where he said he is misunderstood. His campaign materials say Obama would begin withdrawing combat troops from Iraq, one or two brigades a month, as soon as he takes office. But he added in the interview that the start of the withdrawal also depends on the security conditions on the ground.
Obama said he wants to reduce combat troops, leaving forces to continue training Iraqi police and military officers, providing security for U.S. officials and facilities and for counterterrorism operations. Exactly when and how quickly this would happen depends on the situation in the field, he said, acknowledging that military commanders on the ground would play a key role in recommending what steps to take.
Obama said he would not order any “precipitous” withdrawal of combat forces. Instead, he said, his policy is that “we should be as careful getting out of Iraq as we were careless in getting in.”
“I have always said that as commander in chief, I would seek the advice and counsel of our generals,” Obama said. But, in the end, “it is the job of commander in chief to set the strategy.”
How is any of that different from what Hillary said? Actually, I think it is good Obama is shifting his position, consulting commanders and assessing the situation on the ground is infinitely better than setting a firm time table without regard to what is actually happening. It just isn’t what he said he’d do when he needed to run to Hillary’s Left.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:52 pmralph: The problem with Republicans is that they see simplicity as a primary virtue, embracing it even when it is counter-productive.
Very perspicacious!
I’m thinking of petitioning to change the Democratic Party symbol from a donkey to a llama.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:56 pmSuuurrreeee. Just what we need: more racism in politics.
July 8th, 2008 at 12:57 pmKeltoi Says:
How is any of that different from what Hillary said? Actually, I think it is good Obama is shifting his position, consulting commanders and assessing the situation on the ground is infinitely better than setting a firm time table without regard to what is actually happening. It just isn’t what he said he’d do when he needed to run to Hillary’s Left.
Odd. I don’t recall him running to Hillary’s Left on the subject of withdrawal. I do recall him making a point of the fact that he had been opposed to the Iraq invasion from the beginning, and Clinton never did apologize for getting that wrong. But withdrawal? Maybe you’d like to provide some examples of him running to her “left”.
July 8th, 2008 at 1:00 pmIf you are an SOB when you are alive, You are an SOB when you are dead!!!!! Goodbye Jessie and good riddance!
July 8th, 2008 at 1:01 pmKeltoi:
Since the Iraqi government is still pushing for a hard withdrawl timetable, don’t you think it will soon be a moot point, politically? If Bush accedes to their wishes before leaving office, to make it easier on McCain politically, how is this still an issue? And if Bush decides to ride it out, and let McCain deal with the political consequences in the run up to the election, how is this damaging to Obama?
July 8th, 2008 at 1:03 pm.
… The thing that many of us loved and admired about Martin Luther King Jr. was that, here was a guy, he didn’t care what you thought about his view, but you were going to always know where he stood because he stood for something and he stood clearly.
I think we’re not seeing that in Mike Huckabee.
Mike, back at you.
.
July 8th, 2008 at 1:05 pmJ-J: unlike Ralph Nader who has been been a constant, unwavering Progressive.
July 8th, 2008 at 1:05 pmUmmm, who willingly took Republican money to finance his last hopeless ‘principled’ run at office.
As ‘progressive’ Nader has made ZERO progress in the last what, 40 years?
Kucinich would be my choice as an example of a progressive–and he’s in office so he can actually exercise some influence.
We have an opinion piece at TheZoo today by Europeanview, entitled “Why I think Obama will be a good President (But I am wary, too)”
Give it read!
July 8th, 2008 at 1:11 pmTo quote Oabama he has said “we should be as careful leaving Iraq as we were careless in getting into Iraq”. Sounds like the Huckster is a RACIST to me.To idolize people like Helms only tells me that the Reich is as racist as ever and will always be that way.Why on earth would any self-respecting Black American be a Reich Winger ??????????
July 8th, 2008 at 1:13 pmthe man’s name is huck
huck huckabee.
and he’s a jesus man.
*
huck congratulates the canadians.
:)
July 8th, 2008 at 1:20 pm5th Estate, I am humbled.
But then we llamas are a humble bunch.
July 8th, 2008 at 1:21 pmjabberjaw, why did you abandon the Carly Fiorina “consumer-driven health care” thread? Several of us had points we hoped to discuss with you.
July 8th, 2008 at 1:29 pmHuckabee thinks that Obama should have convictions like Jesse Helms. I guess that would mean that all men should have convictions like good ole Jesse, including me. Ok, what convictions shall we adopt? How about being bigoted and hateful. Ok, sounds good… do we get to choose who we are going to be bigoted against and hate? Wow, I like how easy it is under Huckabees plan of action. Let’s see, as a white man, I choose to hate bigoted white ex-preachers who pardon sexual offenders. Man this is great! I wonder who else I can use my Jesse Values on.
July 8th, 2008 at 1:31 pmHuckabee painting Obama as a flip flopper is fine. Its just that he has compared Obama with the wrong man, Jesse Helms.
Seeing Huckabee in effect kissing up to the racist legacy of Jesse Helms is quite sickening.
In lieu of Jesse Helms racist/bigot past, I suspect some civil rights organizations may take the opening that Huckabee has just presented to them.
It reminds me of Trent Lott’s statements with another previously racist senator…Strom Thurmond.
Very similar indeed. The only difference is that the language is more subtle now than in the past.
July 8th, 2008 at 1:34 pmNever occured to Huck to give advice like ” standing for something clearly” to McFlipFlop instead?
July 8th, 2008 at 1:36 pmHow can someone from the party running McPander Bear deride the “lack of conviction” in another?
And Keltoi, I think if you examine Obama’s statements on the occupation of Iraq, you will find that he has consistently said he would depend on military experts to plan and execute the withdrawal and has insisted, at least, since the first time I heard him speak that there would be no “precipitous withdrawal”. I completely fail to see how he has changed his position. Largely, I believe, because the change in position is the invention of the Reichwing.
July 8th, 2008 at 1:37 pmbarfly Says:
——————————————————————————–
Keltoi:
Since the Iraqi government is still pushing for a hard withdrawl timetable, don’t you think it will soon be a moot point, politically? If Bush accedes to their wishes before leaving office, to make it easier on McCain politically, how is this still an issue? And if Bush decides to ride it out, and let McCain deal with the political consequences in the run up to the election, how is this damaging to Obama?
You misunderstand; this is a good move for Obama politically. The only small problem is that it is a tacit admission that the surge has worked, security in Iraq has approved, and it may cost him the support of the Code Pink types. But it will WIN him the support of moderates and independents, so it is very smart politics and also good policy.
July 8th, 2008 at 1:43 pmJesse Helms was a great guy because he believed in his convictions.
Joe McCarthy was a great American who only wanted to defend America from communists.
According to Pat Buchanan, WWII was an unnecessary war; Hitler was misunderstood.
According to George W. Bush, we went to Iraq to protect America, find WMDs, etc.
Where do these guys come from? I mean, what reality do these guys live in. I know they can’t be from the America I live in.
How long must up be down, how much longer does 1984(Orwell) have to be the 21st Century?
July 8th, 2008 at 1:48 pmAgain Keltoi, please identify the change in position. I really don’t recall Obama ever saying he would withdraw regardless of events.
This whole thing is a strawman. The GOP/media falsely assigned him a position of precipitous withdrawal and then, the first time he made a statement which contradicted the strawman, they jumped on him for “changing” a position he never held. It was directed squarely at Obama supporters and may even cost him a few votes. But, it remains inaccurate to claim he changed his position.
July 8th, 2008 at 1:52 pmHelms should have had more convictions.
For his racist attitude and obstruction of legislation aimed at southern racists.
That’s about it.
July 8th, 2008 at 1:54 pmTo Pete and Gummitch regarding Obama’s “switch”.
During the campaign, Hillary was the hawk, Kucinich the dove, and Obama was in the middle. He DID say he would begin withdrawing troops from Iraq “one or two brigades a month, as soon as he takes office.” Now, “the start of the withdrawal also depends on the security conditions on the ground.” This is a contradiction. If at least one Brigade has not received orders to leave Iraq within the first month of Obama’s presidency, he has altered his position.
Basically, he has granted himself wiggle room to deploy a Friedman unit if he finds security conditions aren’t right before ordering the withdraw to begin. This is no different from Bush, McCain or Hillary from a substantive point of view. I think this is a good thing, but again, the far left is going to be rather peeved, methinks.
July 8th, 2008 at 1:55 pmAlejandro Says
July 8th, 2008 at 12:35 pm
The sad thing is that Jesse Helms was re-elected term after term. The constituency approved of his message.
The whole of the current congress can’t say the same.
Congressional approval ratings fall to single digits for the first time ever.
_____________________________________________________
You raise a couple of interesting points, but you’re packaging them in a rather distorted way. Let me offer a different perspective:
1. “The constituency approved of his message.”
Helms was elected to the Senate five times by the citizens of North Carolina, it’s true. However, NOT ONE of his victories was a landslide. His margin of victory was in the single digits each time. So yeah — about 51% to 54% of North Carolina voters (depending on the year) “approved” of his message.
2. “The whole of the current congress can’t say the same.”
No, Congress as a “whole” isn’t getting rave reviews from anyone these days. However, if you polled people about THEIR OWN Representative and two Senators, you would get a lot of people who “approve of (the) message” of their own guys. Which is why their guys keep getting re-elected.
My point is this — you appear to be trying to suggest that Jesse Helms was more popular and more “approved” than Congress is today. Not true. While a slim majority of North Carolinians were re-electing Helms to the Senate, Helms’ popularity with the rest of the country was practically in the toilet (except for a thin band of rabid conservatives who thought the way he did).
Furthermore, you can’t compare approval of a single person with approval of an entity containing many people. Congress almost always polls less than 50%, even when times are good — just because most of us will always find something or somebody in that body to hate. And right now, Republicans disapprove of Congress because there’s a razor-thin majority of Democrats, and Democrats disapprove of Congress because they aren’t accomplishing what we elected them to do due to GOP obstructionism (we will remedy that in November).
July 8th, 2008 at 1:55 pmThis whole ‘move to the center’ crap is just that.
Obama has explained the flag pin nonsense, the abortion charge is horse manure, his position is still that a medical need still must be attested to by an attending physician as to the mental problem of the pregnant woman.
His Iraq stance is the same, with a rational statement that he’s going to listen to his commanders on the ground after he gives them their new mission to extricate.
The FISA deal is the only place where he’s jumping is the new FISA bill. Any news on the Senate debate? Amendments?
July 8th, 2008 at 1:57 pmYou misunderstand; this is a good move for Obama politically. The only small problem is that it is a tacit admission that the surge has worked, security in Iraq has approved, and it may cost him the support of the Code Pink types. But it will WIN him the support of moderates and independents, so it is very smart politics and also good policy.
Yup, I must misunderstand; since there has been no political progress, bombs just went off in Baghdad, and al-Maliki still wants a hard date for withdrawl, Obama’s sensible qualifier must be a flip flop, right?
Your premise is wobbling, badly.
July 8th, 2008 at 1:58 pm“Huckabee Faults Obama For Not Having The Convictions Of Segregationist Jesse Helms”
Oh, the convictions of Jesse Helms? These?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosewood_massacre
Rosewood was a small community of nearly 350 people, mostly black, in Levy County in central Florida, USA. Today, it is remembered for the Rosewood Massacre of January 1923, in which over several days, white mobs attacked and killed blacks, and burned most of the buildings in the town.
On January 1, 1923, in Sumner, a 22-year-old married white woman named Fannie Taylor claimed a black man had knocked on her door in the morning and then attacked her. Her official report stated he beat her about the face, but did not rape her. Other sources (and rumor) claimed that she was both raped and robbed.
Nine-year-old Lee Ruth Davis, a black resident of Rosewood, later reported that Mrs. Taylor had been visited by a white man employed by the Seaboard Air Line Railway. Davis’ grandmother was Sarah Carrier, who did Mrs. Taylor’s washing and ironing once a week. Carrier and Davis’ young cousin, who was helping her deliver laundry, witnessed the white man enter the Taylor house and leave some time before noon. Other African Americans also contended Mrs. Taylor had a white lover.
Officially, six blacks and two whites were the recorded death toll of the first week of January 1923. Historians, however, disagree about this number. Some survivors claimed to have seen or heard about more victims, up to 16 or 18, but these have not been verified. Many survivors fled in different directions to other cities, a few changed their names from fear that whites would track them down, and none ever lived again in Rosewood.[13]
Good old times, indeed. A moral standing to preserve.
July 8th, 2008 at 1:58 pmNo shit scotty.
Pass me some tin foil so I can make another hat, the one I have is aging.
Crooked, crook’s crooks.
And who says mcchimpy is ahead in any poll for anything that has a positive outcome?
mcchimpy is eating dustcakes. The turduken.
July 8th, 2008 at 2:12 pmStill not with you Keltoi. I think that Sen. Obama has always made it clear that events would influence, if not dictate, any withdrawal. He may indeed have SAID “one or two brigades as soon as he takes office” but I’m certain that I haven’t heard him say that he would pull out troops arbitrarily. And it’s always seemed clear to me that current events might change any plans.
July 8th, 2008 at 2:17 pmbarfly Says:
Yup, I must misunderstand; since there has been no political progress, bombs just went off in Baghdad, and al-Maliki still wants a hard date for withdrawl, Obama’s sensible qualifier must be a flip flop, right?
Your premise is wobbling, badly.
There has been some political progress, bombs will go off in Bagdhad for the forseeable future no matter who is President or how many troops we have in country, and al-Maliki’s desire for a hard date withdrawal is a negotiating position, we will see what really turns out. See my post at 57 regarding the substance of his change in position.
Look, everybody, come to grips with the fact that politicians play to the base of the party during the primary and move to the center during the general. Obama is a politician. Last night, O’Reilly had the national spokeswoman for Code Pink on and she said that this move of Obama’s would make her group take a second look at Nader. Code Pink is the furthest thing from the Right Wing possible, so this is not a conspiracy. It is simple politics.
July 8th, 2008 at 2:24 pmNow Keltoi is worried about how Code Pink will vote. Priceless.
July 8th, 2008 at 2:27 pm…and TripleKick chimes in with the requisite 50-year-old “Gotcha!”
At least brush off the dust next time you bring that one in here, TK. We’re trying to keep the place hypoallergenic.
July 8th, 2008 at 2:38 pmHAHAHAHAHA
Is this dummy…no you’re kidding…repug logic…and hickabilly is dumber than ever. Another repug nominee. he’s almost as dumb as chimpy and mcchimp.
This shit isn’t funny.
July 8th, 2008 at 2:39 pmLast month’s US casualties were up from the previous month and have been higher over the last three months than the previous three. Iraqi civilian casualties have gone up, I believe, since March. Has the surge reached its peak? Are the gains reversing?
And the point I’m trying make, Keltoi, is that few people outside the Rush Limbaugh bubble ever thought Sen. Obama was a “leftist”. His ultra-liberal label was invented by the Rheichwingers to scare the sheeple. Now, they are trying to get mileage out of a nonexistent “betrayal” of that invented allegiance.
It’s a classic strawman and it’s obvious. Plus, I doubt he’s ever been the first choice for the Code Pink contingent. Though I do think that Obama’s appeal to moderates is what will really crush McPander Bear. At the rate he’s going all that will be left is the most radical element of the rightwing, and he’s even managing to tick off a few religious zealots.
In light of this, I agree that Sen Obama should take advantage of that appeal. I just don’t think he’s changed his position on this issue to exploit that appeal. In fact, I don’t think he’s changed position at all.
July 8th, 2008 at 2:47 pmSpare me on the comment from Rev. Huckabuck. As you can see, Rev. Huckabuck is working hard for the Fox News bucks. Pass the collection plate please…
July 8th, 2008 at 2:52 pmTrippleKick Says:
That’s ok, maybe Obama will have the convictions and fortitude of Democrat Senator Robert Byrd, formely of the KKK.
July 8th, 2008 at 2:24 pm Recommend (0) | Report Abuse
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Senator_Byrd
When running for the United States House of Representatives in 1952, he announced “After about a year, I became disinterested, quit paying my dues, and dropped my membership in the organization. During the nine years that have followed, I have never been interested in the Klan.”
In 1997, he told an interviewer he would encourage young people to become involved in politics, but to “Be sure you avoid the Ku Klux Klan. Don’t get that albatross around your neck. Once you’ve made that mistake, you inhibit your operations in the political arena.”[10] In his latest autobiography, Byrd explained that he was a member because he “was sorely afflicted with tunnel vision—a jejune and immature outlook—seeing only what I wanted to see because I thought the Klan could provide an outlet for my talents and ambitions.”[11] Byrd also said, in 2005,
I know now I was wrong. Intolerance had no place in America. I apologized a thousand times… and I don’t mind apologizing over and over again. I can’t erase what happened
Curiously, I can’t find the same repentance in the biography of Jesse Helms:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesse_Helms
Only a consistent standing with segregation issues.
July 8th, 2008 at 2:56 pmKeltoi – as recently as last night, Rachel Maddow played cuts from one of the very first Democratic Presidential debates, and Obama’s answer to the question about withdrawal of troops from Iraq was very nearly WORD FOR WORD as his statement the other day.
You Republicans are just too gullible. Do some research before you say things that make you look foolish, OK?
This whole “run to the right” is BS made up by the MSM – who are too freaking lazy to corroborate/fact-check their own stories.
July 8th, 2008 at 2:59 pm5th Estate Says:
as far as Obama’s “position on the war” the only thing that has changed is his rhetoric about the continued occupation of Iraq, which is now much the same as Clinton’s (for which she was raked over the coals by a number of noisy Obama supporters during the caucus races.)
5th, I’m surprised at you for buying this right wing talking point. If you were to go back to a debate in February, what Obama says today about getting us out of Iraq is identical to what he said back then. I saw several instances last night on Countdown where Obama said exactly the same thing he is being raked over the coals about today. He is not changing his position, people just weren’t paying attention before. Shame on you for perpetuating this myth.
July 8th, 2008 at 2:59 pmpete Says:
Last month’s US casualties were up from the previous month and have been higher over the last three months than the previous three. Iraqi civilian casualties have gone up, I believe, since March. Has the surge reached its peak? Are the gains reversing?
I don’t think your numbers are accurate, and US casualties ARE one thing that can be kept track of
http://icasualties.org/oif/
and so far, 8 days into July, there have been 2 confirmed US military deaths, I hope this trend continues.
And the point I’m trying make, Keltoi, is that few people outside the Rush Limbaugh bubble ever thought Sen. Obama was a “leftist”. His ultra-liberal label was invented by the Rheichwingers to scare the sheeple. Now, they are trying to get mileage out of a nonexistent “betrayal” of that invented allegiance.
Okay, fine, but what that means is that there is no discernable difference between McCain and Obama on Iraq from a substantive policy standpoint, and that helps Obama. It is also deliberate.
In light of this, I agree that Sen Obama should take advantage of that appeal. I just don’t think he’s changed his position on this issue to exploit that appeal. In fact, I don’t think he’s changed position at all.
Well then, we can both be happy in our support of him. You can think he never changed his position and has always been a pragmatist about Iraq, and I can think he has shifted to a less ideological position now that he has the nomination and it is possible Iraq may become more stable with a continued US prescence.
July 8th, 2008 at 2:59 pmI would like to ask our pet troll a question. Are you afraid of Barack Obama because he’s:
July 8th, 2008 at 3:00 pm1.too white?
2.too black?
3.unamerican?
4.atheist?
5.Muslim?
6.radical Christian?
7.coffee hating?
8.b-ball playing?
9.oj drinking?
10.elitist?
11.foreigner?
12.apostate?
13.product of a broken home?
14.too inexperienced?
15.corrupt veteran of corrupt Chicago corrupt political machine?
16.racist?
17.anti-Semitic?
18.Antichrist?
19.demon?
20.most librul senator?
21.Marxist?
22.communist?
23.socialist?
24.Leninist?
25.terrorist?
And DrippleDick, the Pope used to be a Nazi.
What’s your point?
July 8th, 2008 at 3:01 pm73 – Bilbo, well said. I saw the same clips.
Obama’s stance then is WORD FOR WORD what it is now.
July 8th, 2008 at 3:02 pmWell, Spaniard, you know how it is with the Right. To reconsider past mistakes and learn from them is “weakness”.
I think they find comfort in “consistency” regardless of circumstances or outcomes. It seems pretty well in line with the need for an authoritarian “daddy” figure to be in charge.
July 8th, 2008 at 3:04 pmLeftside Annie Says:
73 – Bilbo, well said. I saw the same clips.
Obama’s stance then is WORD FOR WORD what it is now.
Hi Annie – aren’t you loving having Rachael subbing for Keith! I sure do hope that someone would give her a show some day. She would be so much better than the insipid David Gregory. I’m just not sure that the MSM is quite ready for a gay woman to host a show that addresses politics. Talk shows, great…shows with some substance, not so much.
July 8th, 2008 at 3:06 pmLeftside Annie Says:
——————————————————————————–
Keltoi – as recently as last night, Rachel Maddow played cuts from one of the very first Democratic Presidential debates, and Obama’s answer to the question about withdrawal of troops from Iraq was very nearly WORD FOR WORD as his statement the other day.
You Republicans are just too gullible. Do some research before you say things that make you look foolish, OK?
This whole “run to the right” is BS made up by the MSM – who are too freaking lazy to corroborate/fact-check their own stories.
And I am sure Rachel Maddow worked real hard to dig up Obama soundbites that did reflect a shift, right Annie? You are calling me gullible?
And did you miss my post about the Code Pink folks being upset about O shifting? He is going to take some heat from the Left over this but he realizes there are more voters in the center than on the fringe so it is a price he is willing to pay. And it is a bargain for him, too.
July 8th, 2008 at 3:09 pmIt’s really bizarre: Obama makes a significant flip-flop–two if you count his faith-based programs. And he gets attacked–but on something he didn’t flip-flop on.
But I guess they had the flyers all printed up and everything–and don’t want to draw attention to FISA.
As for Jesse, I had this vision:
July 8th, 2008 at 3:10 pmJesse reaches the Pearly Gates, and is greeted with a hug and a warm handclasp by a smiling Martin Luther King Jr., and spends the rest of eternity thinking he’s in hell.
pbg Says:
As for Jesse, I had this vision:
Jesse reaches the Pearly Gates, and is greeted with a hug and a warm handclasp by a smiling Martin Luther King Jr., and spends the rest of eternity thinking he’s in hell.
Now THAT would be Divine justice, indeed!
July 8th, 2008 at 3:22 pmjabberjaw Says:
Huckabee may have gone after it with a bad example, but to question Obama’s convictions (as Miss Molly has above) is fair game as Obama has been moving towards the middle, abandoning the left and pandering to the right — unlike Ralph Nader who has been been a constant, unwavering Progressive.
Keep on believing and spewing repug nonsense. I think you used every repug talking point(less). ralph is a nutter.
July 8th, 2008 at 3:23 pmCheck your own figures Keltoi. June had more than May. April through June had more than Jan through March. April was the highest since 9/07. And the numbers for our troops are roughly proportionate to civilian deaths.
If our occupation is to remain open ended I think one would have to say that the last 90 days have highlighted the peak of the surge and its failure to achieve its goal of increased stability.
Point two: Please Keltoi, don’t be disingenuous. “No discernible difference”? Must I contrast “100 years”, “stay the course” and “bomb, bomb, Iran” with “I will demand an ordered withdrawal”? And McPander Bear has never been a moderate. He’s a con man.
A Master of the bait and switch. Always whining about how much his party fears his maverick spirit, then votes the party line 95% of the time. Initiating, supporting, and sponsoring “unpopular” bills then voting against them. And this isn’t just about Iraq, or even campaign politics. It’s his pattern from his first days in office. It’s is MO.
The reason his own party hates him isn’t, most likely, his politics. It’s because they know him one on one. I’ve never met him but I’m willing to bet he’s a first class jackass.
July 8th, 2008 at 3:23 pmKeltoi, for the love of God – aren’t OBAMA’s OWN words enough for you?
It was videotape of one of the earliest debates. What more do you need?
What is your problem, Keltoi? Are you just unable to accept that Obama has been very consistent with very nearly every single position he has ever held?
Why? I’ll bet you think he’s a secret Muslim too.
*eyeroll*
July 8th, 2008 at 3:32 pmAnd just for the record. When I said “our pet troll” I was referring to tribbleprick, not Keltoi. I’m pretty sure that Keltoi is human even when we disagree and meant no offense.
July 8th, 2008 at 3:35 pmI didn’t mention that, Keltoi, because I know that there are stupid people of EVERY persuasion.
Republicans don’t have a 100% lock on stupid. Almost – but not quite.
There are going to be frothers who are going to be pissed that they can’t get Obama to do *exactly* what they want when they want him to do it.
I consider Code Pink to be at the far end of the bell curve of Democratic voters, Keltoi; they’re hardly mainstream.
And that’s an issue…why? There are Repukes who hate McCain because they think he’s a liberal. So what? What on earth does that have to do with anything?
July 8th, 2008 at 3:35 pmAnd Bilbo? I LOVE Rachel Maddow. She’s not only easy on the eyes, but wicked smart and damned funny, too.
~A
July 8th, 2008 at 3:38 pmAll republicans say this: “No matter how hateful and disgusting this guy is, you GOTTA admire him for standing up for something.”
Bullshit. Let’s say that I hate republican christo-fascists. I wish them ill. I wish them death and damnation. Just as they do gays.
You gotta respect me for hatred and bigotry? What the hell?
These people are morally bereft.
July 8th, 2008 at 3:40 pmjabberjaw Says:
Huckabee may have gone after it with a bad example, but to question Obama’s convictions (as Miss Molly has above) is fair game as Obama has been moving towards the middle, abandoning the left and pandering to the right — unlike Ralph Nader who has been been a constant, unwavering Progressive.
Come on now, there are plenty of gay people in all professions. I don’t care if they are gay, straight or bisexual. I don’t want to know about their sexual expertise.
nader and his “white guilt” (circa 1950) is a nutter. he may be progressive but he hasn’t caught up with the 21st century.
July 8th, 2008 at 3:47 pmLeftside Annie Says:
——————————————————————————–
Keltoi, for the love of God – aren’t OBAMA’s OWN words enough for you?
It was videotape of one of the earliest debates. What more do you need?
One set of words occasionally contradict another, especially when leaving the mouth of a politician. Please, read my post at 57 regarding his own words and tell me where my logic is breaking down.
What is your problem, Keltoi? Are you just unable to accept that Obama has been very consistent with very nearly every single position he has ever held?
FISA anyone? Government funded faith based programs? Sorry, couldn’t help it, and I am okay with both these moves anyway.
Why? I’ll bet you think he’s a secret Muslim too.
*eyeroll*
Oh, Pshaw, Annie, you know me better than that and what you do know gives you plenty of valid reasons to get mad at me, no need to make it up.
*troll shrug*
July 8th, 2008 at 3:47 pmpete Says:
And just for the record. When I said “our pet troll” I was referring to tribbleprick, not Keltoi. I’m pretty sure that Keltoi is human even when we disagree and meant no offense.
NO – I AM A TROLL, BLAST IT!
But I don’t take Troll comments personally, my species of Troll can do nuance.
July 8th, 2008 at 3:50 pmhickabilly: we loves helms ’caused he was a racist and didn’t give a damn. Yuck, yuck. he’s one of them good old boys. Yep he could tell a hellava colored joke.
July 8th, 2008 at 3:53 pmThe first step is identifying the problem.
July 8th, 2008 at 3:54 pmpete Says:
I wasn’t sure which months you were putting together for your numbers, pete. But the violence comes in waves based on offensives being launched, etc. The spikes in casualties correspond to crackdowns in Basra and Sadr City. Again, I hope like heck July finishes as quietly as it began.
Also, yes, there is a huge difference in their rhetoric, though the “bomb Iran” comment was black humor in front of former pilots and the hundred years comment was taken totally out of context. But it is true, McCain is more bellicose. Still, I think the difference between what they would do as Prez is pretty narrow.
July 8th, 2008 at 3:56 pmLeftside Annie Says:
I consider Code Pink to be at the far end of the bell curve of Democratic voters, Keltoi; they’re hardly mainstream.
Wow! I didn’t think you acknowledged there was anyone to your Left, Leftside! I learn something new every time we chat.
And that’s an issue…why? There are Repukes who hate McCain because they think he’s a liberal. So what? What on earth does that have to do with anything?
It goes to the point of whether Obama has shifted his Iraq policy. The popular Progressive myth being propagated is that it is a Right wing smear; if Code Pink says the same thing, it obviously isn’t the Right alone who is putting it out there.
July 8th, 2008 at 4:00 pmLet’s give it in context, then shall we?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vf7HYoh9YMM
In response to a questioner who mentioned President bush saying we could be in Iraq for fifty years, McCain clearly offered “make it a hundred”.
The disinigenuous context he then thumb-tacked on was “like Korea” and “as long as our soldiers aren’t under attack”.
Well, Iraq ain’t Korea. And our soldiers ARE under attack. THAT is your “context” Keltoi. Don’t pull that standard “out of context” crap. You’re better than that.
July 8th, 2008 at 4:05 pmralph the wonder llama Says:
Evil Spaniard Says:
Curiously, I can’t find the same repentance in the biography of Jesse Helms:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesse_Helms
Only a consistent standing with segregation issues.
Well, Spaniard, you know how it is with the Right. To reconsider past mistakes and learn from them is “weakness”.
I think they find comfort in “consistency” regardless of circumstances or outcomes. It seems pretty well in line with the need for an authoritarian “daddy” figure to be in charge.
Basically repugs are idiots. chimpy is the king of idiot city.
July 8th, 2008 at 4:07 pmralph the wonder llama Says:
——————————————————————————–
Keltoi Says:
the hundred years comment was taken totally out of context.
Let’s give it in context, then shall we?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vf7HYoh9YMM
In response to a questioner who mentioned President bush saying we could be in Iraq for fifty years, McCain clearly offered “make it a hundred”.
The disinigenuous context he then thumb-tacked on was “like Korea” and “as long as our soldiers aren’t under attack”.
Well, Iraq ain’t Korea. And our soldiers ARE under attack. THAT is your “context” Keltoi. Don’t pull that standard “out of context” crap. You’re better than that.
We’ll just have to disagree then, Ralph. If Iraq were to calm down like Korea, then I think the American public would be okay with a continued prescence there. That is what McCain was saying. He never said we could continue as we are for 100 years.
You are correct that Iraq is not Korea; the goal is to make it that way.
July 8th, 2008 at 4:13 pmThere has been some political progress, bombs will go off in Bagdhad for the forseeable future no matter who is President or how many troops we have in country, and al-Maliki’s desire for a hard date withdrawal is a negotiating position, we will see what really turns out. See my post at 57 regarding the substance of his change in position.
In other words, you haven’t refuted any of my points. There has been negative political progress, and you know it. Trying to spin it away is just… desperate. I’ve already read what you’ve posted, and it’s unconvincing as a flip-flop, given the bad, and deteriorating political environment in Iraq. For every bit of pro-bush Iraq propaganda you post, I can counter, with a little bit of truth.
July 8th, 2008 at 4:23 pmLeftside Annie Says:
I didn’t mention that, Keltoi, because I know that there are stupid people of EVERY persuasion.
Republicans don’t have a 100% lock on stupid. Almost – but not quite.
There are going to be frothers who are going to be pissed that they can’t get Obama to do *exactly* what they want when they want him to do it.
I consider Code Pink to be at the far end of the bell curve of Democratic voters, Keltoi; they’re hardly mainstream.
And that’s an issue…why? There are Repukes who hate McCain because they think he’s a liberal. So what? What on earth does that have to do with anything?
Wow. chimpy and the repugs chose mcchimpy because he was Gores running mate? This makes him librul?
Very interesting
July 8th, 2008 at 4:25 pmYou are correct that Iraq is not Korea; the goal is to make it that way.
Fantasies. Facts on the ground don’t support this rosy scenario, and won’t, any time in the near (10 year) future.
July 8th, 2008 at 4:26 pmbarfly Says:
In other words, you haven’t refuted any of my points. There has been negative political progress, and you know it. Trying to spin it away is just… desperate. I’ve already read what you’ve posted, and it’s unconvincing as a flip-flop, given the bad, and deteriorating political environment in Iraq. For every bit of pro-bush Iraq propaganda you post, I can counter, with a little bit of truth.
This whole paragraph amounts to “Nuh-Uh!” You refute none of my points either, you just say they are wrong.
Explain: How is the political environment in Iraq deteriorating? It was utter chaos for the last several years – how could it have gotten worse? Maliki has gained a lot of respect in the last few months for cracking down on the JAM and now by standing up to the US regarding the SOF negotiations. How is that bad?
July 8th, 2008 at 4:30 pmbarfly Says:
——————————————————————————–
You are correct that Iraq is not Korea; the goal is to make it that way.
Fantasies. Facts on the ground don’t support this rosy scenario, and won’t, any time in the near (10 year) future.
The fantasy is to think that Obama is going to pull all our troops out in two terms, let alone one.
If the Iraqi parliament passes a resolution demanding we leave, then we will go. But they will only do that when they are totally convinced their collective necks are safe, and while they are getting there they aren’t there yet.
Just so we are clear, barfly, I am not for perpetual occupation. Once the ISF is really trained up with a solid corps of non-coms and junior officers that have bought into the US system of loyatlty to the constitution over sect or leader, then there will be no point in our troops staying in country. We have plenty of air bases in the Gulf to take care of any regional threats, we have no need for boots on the ground in Iraq in perpetuity if they don’t want us there.
July 8th, 2008 at 4:39 pmKeltoi: there’s a whole lot you don’t know about me. Obviously you consider me to be some wild-eyed, tree-hugging ultra-liberal Socialist moonbat ( that’s what I read in your comment, anyway), but you’re dead wrong.
In reality, I’m fairly centrist if you take each individual issue, so please, don’t think you know me – because you don’t.
All of us here have values that are in tune with the MAJORITY of Americans, taken issue-by-issue – without that scary “librul” label slapped on. I can back up this assertion with poll after poll: Abortion. Gun control. Taxes. Social security. You name it.
Only the 24/7/365 nonstop propaganda from the fascist reichwing mouthpieces like Hannity, Rush, O’Reilly et. al would have you believe otherwise. They speak for less than ONE QUARTER of Americans, Keltoi. Don’t you get that?
Obama – unlike Bush – will be the president for ALL AMERICANS. Bush only pandered to his sycophantic, leg-humping base.
I don’t have too much of a problem with the faith-based stuff – as Obama has promised to keep the proselytizing out of it. The thing is, the right doesn’t have a monopoly on Christianity any more, Keltoi.
More and more evangelicals are coming round to share the point of view that being a good steward to the Earth is part of being a good Christian. Furthermore, they are also coming back to the fundamental tenet of Christianity that instructs us to care for the poor, the sick, the hungry, etc.
Same thing with gays and lesbians. The MAJORITY of Americans believe that gays should be allowed to marry, serve openly in the military, not be discriminated against, etc. The reich is wrong on this – as they are on so many other things, which is why the GOP in it’s present Bush-regime incarnation is rapidly becoming extinct.
You were probably only being snarky, Keltoi, but I’m sick and tired of being portrayed as a fringie and a lunatic and a America-hating terrorist — when I’m every bit as mainstream America (if not more) than you are.
July 8th, 2008 at 4:41 pmOh, and by the way, Keltoi – 75% of the American people now agree with ME, i.e., that we should get OUT of Iraq.
Just sayin’.
July 8th, 2008 at 4:43 pmNK is calm? HAHAHAHA
July 8th, 2008 at 4:45 pmWhy do the Koreans tolerate us? Because we protect them from China and dramatically increase their GDP. We turned them from a third world country into an economic power.
The Iraqis, on the other hand, have already been overrun by us and have immense natural wealth we are trying to steal. Before our invasion they were a modern country. And, despite a despotic ruler and foreign sanctions, their standard of living was relatively high. We destroyed all that was once good about Iraq and are impeding it’s recovery by trying to rebuild it in our image and at taxpayer expense.
The Iraqis understand something you seem to miss. Namely that, to Iraq, the United States represents the same Imperial force that we protected Korea from. And the majority like us less than whatever religious/tribal rivals they may have.
We can’t offer security. They’re already conquered.
We can’t offer economic prosperity. We are stealing their wealth.
Iraq had not been invaded by a foreign power until WE invaded. We can’t offer Iraq what we offered Korea unless we withdraw.
We are not the conquerors of S Korea. We are their partners and protectors. And any assumption that has the Iraqi people forgetting that we ARE the conquerors of Iraq is based on ignorance of history and human nature. When it comes right down to it, they will most assuredly kick us out eventually. Just like they have with every foreign invader since civilization was invented. I hope they accomplish that with little additional death on either side.
July 8th, 2008 at 4:46 pmJust so we are clear, barfly, I am not for perpetual occupation. Once the ISF is really trained up with a solid corps of non-coms and junior officers that have bought into the US system of loyatlty to the constitution over sect or leader, then there will be no point in our troops staying in country. We have plenty of air bases in the Gulf to take care of any regional threats, we have no need for boots on the ground in Iraq in perpetuity if they don’t want us there.
July 8th, 2008 at 4:39 pm
Have you lost it Keltoi? These people INVENTED CIVILIZATION. To them we are unclean, primitive, half-baked savages like every group of invaders in history. These people can name every family ancestor since before written language was invented. And you think we can impose our experimental concept of personal freedoms and national loyalties on them?
That would boarder on delusional.
July 8th, 2008 at 4:56 pmWhatever, dippleprick. You’re wrong about Pope Ratty, but hey, you’re wrong about everything else…so what else is new?
July 8th, 2008 at 4:58 pmMore bat-scat from tribbleprick? The issue is that Sen. Obama is being smeared for a policy change he didn’t make. And your boy McPander Bear has managed to directly contradict virtually every statement he’s made throughout his entire career while getting glad-handed by the “Librul Media”.
July 8th, 2008 at 5:02 pmWWAAAAAApublicans make stupid, racists statements such as these, then sit there with their thumbs up their butts wondering why they can seem to court black voters.
July 8th, 2008 at 5:06 pm“The thing that many of us loved and admired about Jesse Helms was that, here was a guy, he didn’t care what you thought about his views”
Funny that, I hear Hitler was averse to negative feedback too. Notice how the farther out to the edges of the ideological spectrum you look, the more hard-line those folks’ positions seem to be?
Thanks for the input Huck, your opinions are noted, with amusement.
July 8th, 2008 at 5:12 pmLeftside Annie Says:
You were probably only being snarky, Keltoi, but I’m sick and tired of being portrayed as a fringie and a lunatic and a America-hating terrorist — when I’m every bit as mainstream America (if not more) than you are.
I apologize, my friend, I did not mean to offend.
I do feel like I know you a bit. And you often ascribe to me beliefs or positions that I simply don’t hold – Republican, Bush supporter, whatever.
Snark has a way of cutting too deep at times. I don’t think you are a moonbat. I think you are extremely passionate about your beliefs and at times you really blast people who you could just as easily ignore. There is – occasionally – a stridency to your tone that perhaps make you seem more radical than you are.
But again, apologies if I mischaracterized you, you are one of my favorite adversaries.
July 8th, 2008 at 5:13 pmStill trying to figure out how to transform Iraq (A country we invaded.) into S. Korea (A country we delivered from invasion.). Purple fingers? Gated communities? $25 a week and all the ammo and C4 you can carry?
July 8th, 2008 at 5:24 pmYour clarvoiance is amazing. You can’t seem to see that the people who Obama is running against is taking us down a dark, deep hole and yet you can see clearly somehow that Obama, who is the anti what we have now, is going to do something much worse….please explain what that might be.
The corner is being turned and you just don’t get it.
July 8th, 2008 at 5:25 pmI’m just sick of having notoriously evil people shoved down my throat as great Americans and treated with respectability.
helms was evil. So was Oliver north…a traitor. So was Ronald raygun, a corporate shill just as bush is.
I am sick of people like bill buckley et al being treated as if they were reasonable people operating in a democracy and that they represent what is best for our country.
The real, great Americans are villified by these people. People like FDR, Martin Luther King, JFK, etc.
Don’t try to tell me helms or the bug man from texas are great men, they are not.
July 8th, 2008 at 5:34 pmIt’s amazing is it not, Fred? How they can pass off utter bat-scat as “opinion” or, even worse, policy. I mean, the Huckster is barely human on many levels, but, praise for monsters is pretty dang low.
July 8th, 2008 at 5:46 pmHi Pete,
Yes, I don’t understand how they can look at the last 8 years…..the dow is almost exactly where it was when bush took office, war, insurance crisis, katrina, etc. and imagine anything worse. How could anyone do worse?
But still, they have misgivings……gimme a break.
July 8th, 2008 at 5:51 pmWell Fred. It must all be the “librul’s” fault. Just ask this guy (If you can stomach three minutes of Bill0’s bloviating).
http://www.crooksandliars.com/2008/07/08/bill-o%E2%80%99reilly-says-it%E2%80%99s-all-liberal-policies-that-have-destroyed-americas-economy/
July 8th, 2008 at 6:01 pmI seem to remember Huckabee being rejected by the American people.
July 8th, 2008 at 9:01 pmYeah, I believe the last time I checked Huckabee lost the nomination an didn’t make it as far as Senator Obama. The American people are going to vote for a lot ‘liberals’ this fall. The ‘Conservatives’, are doomed. Huckabee’s party is doomed and Huckabee’s party has got us in this big, big, mess.
July 9th, 2008 at 7:04 pmHannity had asked Huckabee about Obama’s reoccurring flip flops. Huckabee was just saying that whether you agreed with Helms or not, you had to appreciate that he was a man who stood by his convictions. He did not flip flop depending on which way the political winds were blowing. And you have to admit, Obama has flip flopped a lot recently as he is trying to move to the center to attract more independent and republican voters.
July 10th, 2008 at 12:42 am