Forgetting His Vote To Allow Waterboarding, McCain Says ‘We Could Never Torture Anyone’
Forgetting His Vote To Allow Waterboarding, McCain Says ‘We Could Never Torture Anyone’
In February, Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) voted against a bill banning the CIA from waterboarding and using other torture tactics in their interrogations. When the bill passed, McCain urged Bush to veto it, which he did.
In an interview with Newsweek published today, McCain defended his position, insisting that the CIA plays “a special role” in defending the U.S. and thus should be allowed to use harsh interrogation tactics such as waterboarding:
NEWSWEEK: On torture, why should the CIA be treated differently from the armed services regarding the use of harsh interrogation tactics?
MCCAIN: Because they play a special role in the United States of America and our ability to combat terrorists. But we have made it very clear that there is nothing they can do that would violate the Geneva Conventions, the Detainee Treatment Act, which prohibits torture. We could never torture anyone, but some people misconstrue that who don’t understand what the Detainee Treatment Act and the Geneva Conventions are all about.
McCain’s vote against the waterboarding ban did make one thing clear: that he condones torture. With Bush’s veto, waterboarding remains a distinct option for the CIA:
Still, waterboarding remains in the CIA’s tool kit. The technique can be used, but it requires the consent of the attorney general and president on a case-by-case basis. Bush wants to keep that option open.
“I cannot sign into law a bill that would prevent me, and future presidents, from authorizing the CIA to conduct a separate, lawful intelligence program, and from taking all lawful actions necessary to protect Americans from attack,” Bush said in a statement.
McCain is either clueless or ignorant about the fact that his vote allows the CIA to waterboard detainees. And as Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-SC), one of McCain’s chief surrogates, has said about waterboarding, “I don’t think you have to have a lot of knowledge about the law to understand this technique violates Geneva Convention common article three, the War Crimes statutes, and many other statutes that are in place.”
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71 Responses to “Forgetting His Vote To Allow Waterboarding, McCain Says ‘We Could Never Torture Anyone’”
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McNumbNuts: "My friends, we could never torture but -- thanks to my brilliant vote -- if we ever do torture, at least it won't be against the law."
July 28th, 2008 at 4:15 pmWhen you're senile, every day is a completely new day and everything is new to you. you have no memory... Why worry about what you said yesterday or the day before or six months ago, since you can't remember it anyway. Just babble on...
McSenile will be replaced before the GOP nominating convention. Get ready for McMormon.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:16 pmIt's time for politicians to STFU and send a case to the Supreme Court and the ICC, even though America is not a signatory.
Legislators and Executives don't decide final legality, courts do.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:18 pmobamaismymessiah Says:
"Unfortunately, as we all know, the bill went much, much further than that."
Why don't you elucidate for us EXACTLY what the bill prohibited and provide a credible link to support your claims since, this is not the first time you have made this claim under your 45,982 different names yet have NEVER been able to back it up.
Thanks in advance
July 28th, 2008 at 4:19 pmBozo the Neoclown took the words right out of my mouth.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:24 pmHe still didn't answer, did he?
pitiful
July 28th, 2008 at 4:28 pmMcSame is completely off the tracks. The guy stands for nothing longer than one sentence.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:29 pmHow is it that the staff of McInsane's campaign don't throw up their hands and walk out? What ate they taking to immunize them against the massive overdoses of stupidity and lunacy? I'm quite serious in asking this? I'm in total agreement with #3, Oval12345678 in believing that this will be the excuse to replace McMadman with someone who at least seems saner. Considering this series of performances, that won't be too hard to do.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:30 pmImpeach Pelosi, Cheney and Bush and Save the Constitution!
let's go. Which parts? Don't be such a pussy. Obama doesn't seem like a pussy, why should you not wanna be more like your messiah and less like a pussy. Which parts where just too much for McCain. The kinds of tortures that caused him to sign the confession?
July 28th, 2008 at 4:30 pmAll this talk of torture is torture!!!
It's not as though I was so naive to think that it wasn't going on, but, now it's as though torture is considered okay!
Oh, excuse me, Enhanced Interrogation Techniques...
So much for the high road.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:30 pmNope. He didn't.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:30 pmobamaismymessiah Says:
"Bozo, don’t you know how to look up legislative history? Sheesh."
:::::::shrugging shoulders::::::::
Meh, guess it's as I expected. You can't provide any facts, just regurgitate the happy horseshit Dildo O'Lielly or Rush Limpballs fed you.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:32 pmMcCain is either clueless or ignorant about the fact that his vote allows the CIA to waterboard detainees.
Ah, but this administration already redefined torture so that it wouldn't include waterboarding
See how easy it is to ignore inconvenient facts by simply giving new meaning to old terms?
Remember: "Oceania has always been at war with Eurasia"
July 28th, 2008 at 4:32 pmFrom the article you cited obamaismymessiah
"This was a vote on applying the standards of the field manual to CIA personnel."
The Army manual specifically bars waterboarding and seven other tactics: forcing a detainee to be naked, perform sexual acts or pose sexually; placing hoods or sacks over the head of a detainee; beatings, electric shock, burns or other forms of physical pain; threatening detainees with dogs; the use of temperature extremes to cause physical trauma; mock executions; and depriving detainees of necessary food, water or medical care."
Yes, I can see how these are good things... try reading the entire article, tardboy, to prevent you shooting yourself in the foot resulting in you looking even more ridiculous than you normally do
July 28th, 2008 at 4:36 pmJim Wilke Says:
Why is TP bringing this up 4 months later? Slow news day?
Here- let me help, Jim.
So today he said, 'we could never torture' but four months ago, when he had the chance to put his vote where his mouth is, he didn't.
That's what makes it news today.
Considering Glenn's show this morning was mostly on how seeing 'Mama Mia' makes you less of a man I feel TP was right to focus on this story instead...
July 28th, 2008 at 4:36 pmWhat is the statute of limitations for pointing out McSame's duplicity?
The bar seems to be getting lower and lower....
July 28th, 2008 at 4:37 pmHOW can the republicans let this continue? I would not be surprised if they force him out via medical issues. He is an absolute embarrassment and even the "normal" Republican voter is not fooled. Unbelievable.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:39 pmThe only reason that Bush, McCain, etc. can repeat that nonsense about "we don't torture," is that they've redefined what torture is. Well, a rose by any other name is still a rose, and torture....no matter what you want to call it...is still torture. In addition, those activities which perhaps have not risen "quite" to the level of what any civilized country would define as torture, are still violations of the Convention against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment. The U.S. ratified this treaty in 1994.
http://www.unhchr.ch/html/menu3/b/h_cat39.htm
July 28th, 2008 at 4:39 pmJM, the crypt keeper, must be undead. It might explain some of the flip flopping.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:40 pmbelac said:
Considering Glenn’s show this morning was mostly on how seeing ‘Mama Mia’ makes you less of a man I feel TP was right to focus on this story instead…
I bet Glen has a lovely falsetto singing voice!
July 28th, 2008 at 4:40 pmobamaismymessiah Says:
Try reading this, Bozo.
In other words, you can't really explain what the "much, much further" was, you can only point to an article in the hopes that someone else can explain it. And you'll continue to make the same vacuous claim over and over without ever really understanding the issue -- all that matters is sucking up to neocons.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:41 pmOkay are we gonna get that list of the things that went "much much" further or not?
If torture works McCain told the truth!
July 28th, 2008 at 4:44 pmShame on McCain. When he was tortured he lied to his captors in order to stop them from torturing him. The false information he gave up was used for propaganda purposes against the U.S.. The legal semantics game of whether or not waterboarding is torture is absolute BS and McCain, of all people, knows that. This is an area that I truly believe McCain acted disgracefully in. This alone should be reason for him to never again claim he cares about our soldiers who fall into the hands of our enemies. He has insured that they will be tortured.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:44 pmobamaismymessiah
"This was a vote on applying the standards of the field manual to CIA personnel.”
The Army manual specifically bars waterboarding and seven other tactics:
BUT WAIT, THEY ARE NAMED:The Army manual specifically bars waterboarding and seven other tactics: forcing a detainee to be naked, perform sexual acts or pose sexually; placing hoods or sacks over the head of a detainee; beatings, electric shock, burns or other forms of physical pain; threatening detainees with dogs; the use of temperature extremes to cause physical trauma; mock executions; and depriving detainees of necessary food, water or medical care.”
Now, explain to me that whole "much, mcuh more" happy horseshit you're trying to spread if the army field manual speciafically bans seven and the bill was to get the CIA to adhere to the army field manual.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:44 pm“I cannot sign into law a bill that would prevent me, and future presidents, from authorizing the CIA to conduct a separate, lawful intelligence program, and from taking all lawful actions necessary to protect Americans from attack,” Bush said in a statement.
If the CIA were going to protect Americans from attack Mr. Bush, they would start by keeping a very close eye on you and your administration.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:44 pmAccording to Time Magazine? Is that who you turn to for source? Low Information Voter here folks...
Brain dead and compliant to the GOP, just what they need.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:46 pmobamaismymessiah Says:
why don't you try explaining your empty claim of "much, much more" instead of changing the topic?
July 28th, 2008 at 4:47 pmJim Wilke: Why is TP bringing this up 4 months later? Slow news day?
Because "In an interview with Newsweek published today, McCain defended his position" and McCain is running for President largely based on his war experiences---most of which involved him being tortured himself, you idiot!
You should stick to what you can understand---the vast complexities of NASCAR racing.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:47 pmI am with Bozo the Neoclown @31.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:48 pmLet's go or assume yet another Pussy for Life title
I swear, I hate these people; these disgusting warmongering, torturing bullies who love to inflict suffering on someone who's chained to a chair. My God, how sick can you get???
And McSadist? Shame on you. There is no excuse for this sickening Faustian bargain you have made with the devil.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:48 pmobamaismymessiah i think it's pretty specific when the article YOU cited states the army field manual specifically forbids seven acts considered toprture which are then named.
Please, for the record do you find any of the seven that were listed torture and which ones consititute the empty "much much more" staement you continuously make yet, never seem to be able to back up.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:49 pmobamaismymessiah Says:
Too bad TP won’t start a thread on Obama flip-flops. I’m ready to go with the top 20 (hint: #1 is FISA). I wouldn’t want to go off topic against Obama the Messiah though.
Then go start one. With all of Obama's flip-flops, seems to me you could cite them all on a matchbook cover, and still have room left over. Why are you here? Did your mom let you use the computer until the re-runs of Sponge Bob begin?
Why are you here?
July 28th, 2008 at 4:49 pmobamaismymessiah what is holding you up? What conditions went "much much" too far?
You can't answer can you? Sucks to get called out so easily doesn't it?
July 28th, 2008 at 4:50 pmI didn't know anyone could make Bush seem somewhat intelligent. McDopey needs to drop out. Please let Romney be the alternative... We don't need a another retard in office of the Presidency.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:50 pmpoor obamaismymessiah ran upstairs from the basement to cry on mommy's lap about being totally owned by me. pretty sad seeing a 40 year old man crying like that.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:52 pmDo any of these people realize that they can pass whatever bills they want to pass but that these bills are only legal here in the United States? Don't they worry that if they leave the country that they can be picked up, arrested and put on trial for war crimes?
What the hell is wrong with these people?
July 28th, 2008 at 4:53 pmY'know, Bozo, speaking personally, when another poster challenges me to support my post, I generally think it's pretty weak to simply post a link and expect them to read it and glean what I want to highlight.
If I've got a good, strong argument, I'll explain what I mean, post a quote from the source, THEN give the link.
When people insist on giving the bare minimum of information,or simply repeat what they've aid before, and ask you to read a linked article, and then criticize you for not reading it the same way they did... well, I think that's just weak-ass troll-like behavior.
What do you think?
July 28th, 2008 at 4:55 pmpretty sad seeing a 40 year old man crying like that.
The right side is filled with tough talking nobodies. They spew unfactual screeds all day long, and wonder why even fox news rates Bush at a 27% aproval.
Everyone seems to agree the GOP is toast, but here you have the Obama haters out in full force, showing everyone they are as dimwitted as we thought. Rave on, losers!!!
July 28th, 2008 at 4:55 pmHey, kids, here's an idea -- once Grampy McPantsload is defeated in November and the new administration is in place in January, let's lock up Dumbya, Darth Cheney and Grampy together in Gitmo and non-torture them with waterboarding all at the same time! Imagine all the fun you and your friends can have with that! And all of the useful information we'd get from that non-torture procedure designed to protect America from its enemies (read: the Executive Branch for the last 7 years)!
Of course, with our luck, Grampy McInsane would crumble under this non-torture and spill his guts, selling out America to save his thin and yellowed skin.
Oh wait -- he's already done that??? Damn traitor -- why does Grampy McSame hate America? Is it because he's jealous of our freedom?
July 28th, 2008 at 4:56 pmStratrat: Why are you [ob...messiah) here?
I think it's for the 'McCain Points'. I think mccainismydaddy is shooting for the McCain Aces sticker with the Mig-29 formation on it.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:58 pmwell ralph, I find when trolls make continuous claims such as that nitwit does under it's 46,098 different names (interestingly enough, the moron isn't smart enough to reword it under the different names) and can't back it up, it makes it real easy for me to hand them their ass. they start googling, then post the first three articles they pull up without reading them. Makes it real easy for me. I scan the articles, produce direct quotes from their articles proving them wrong then watch them slither away.
July 28th, 2008 at 5:01 pmobamaismymessiah Says:
"It obviously discusses much more than the one short paragraph you have chosen from the newspapers and magazines I PROVIDED FOR YOU BUT FAILED TO READ."
There, i fixed for you, you clown.
July 28th, 2008 at 5:02 pmWhy so cryptic?
Why can't you offer a single substantive explanation for what "much, much further" means?
July 28th, 2008 at 5:04 pmMy friends, it's only torture if it's done to U.S. Navy Flyboys by those G** Da** Gooks.
If it's done by the CIA to scary brown people, it's keeping the country safe!
July 28th, 2008 at 5:05 pmAnd ho would you suggest they accomplish that, with an obstructionist Senate minority setting records for blocking legislation, and a President who thinks of himself as above the law?
(And by the way, I think if you'll check the RNC Troll Style Manual, it's properly termed "the democrat congress".)
July 28th, 2008 at 5:06 pmRalph, the assclown fails to understand in the ENTIRE 177 page document known as the army field manual only 7 things are considered torture which, were listed in the article IT provided for me.
July 28th, 2008 at 5:06 pmobamaismymessiah still waiting troll, what do you consider "much much more"?
July 28th, 2008 at 5:11 pmAnd unfortunately, it seems you have never learned the meaning of the word "debate", since in all of your multiple incarnations you strive to simply introduce dissent for the sake of amusing yourself.
In a real debate, one who made the claim as we all know, the bill went much, much further than that, when challenged, would have explained how it went "much, much further". You did not. You introduced links that were supposed to support your claim, but as Bozo pointed out, did no such thing. Or at least, if they did, you failed to explain how.
You're just here for attention and disruption. Why that gets your rocks off, I don't know. Must have something to do with your upbringing, or your level of emotional maturity.
July 28th, 2008 at 5:14 pmWell, cabbinbagger, it's like this... when every single Republican troll uses the same improper construction for the same talking point, time after time for month upon month, you start to recognize a pattern.
It's an assumption, sure. But I think it's based on some pretty solid evidence.
July 28th, 2008 at 5:16 pmBozo The Neoclown Says:
There, i fixed for you, you clown.
I have to admit, Bozo, this bothers me. You called the buffoon a "clown", which seems like a pejorative. Yet you are a clown yourself. And "clown" certainly implies a deliberate effort rather than simply being a prat. I think you need to rephrase this.
Just in the interests of clowns everywhere.
July 28th, 2008 at 5:17 pmmcacainismylover: It obviously discusses much more than the one short paragraph you have chosen from the newspapers and magazines above.
Indeed it does. such as how many people should be present at an interrogation and what rank they should be and where and when they should be conducted and how many donuts are considered reasonable for the maintenance of interrogator morale...
1-7
EPWs. captured insurgents, civilian internees, other captured detained or retained persons, foreign deserters or other persons of intelligence interest:
These persons are protected by the Geneva Cpnventions for the Protection of War Victims August 12th 1949 as they relate to captured wounded and sick enemy personnel..." and so on
July 28th, 2008 at 5:21 pmobamaismymessiah Says:
Unfortunately, many of you, including TP moderators have forgotten the “We debate” part of the above mission statement. Rather than debate, they delete, censure and ban. That is not debate.
Like so many neocon trolls, you repeatedly claim to be interested in "debate" and yet only post snide comments devoid of content, or the occasional cut & paste job, or links to articles you probably haven't even read, without actually making any cogent arguments in favor of your viewpoint.
Your very screen name pretty much defines how serious you are about "debate".
July 28th, 2008 at 5:23 pmWow. That is one skimpy straw man, pal.
Didn't you just criticize Bozo for not reading the link you pasted?
And here you post a question that shows you didn't even read the article you're responding to?
First sentence, under the headline at the top of this page:
In February, Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) voted against a bill banning the CIA from waterboarding and using other torture tactics in their interrogations.
Still wanna go with that straw man? Or do you wanna find some more straw and maybe fill out the chest, give him some legs instead of those floppy empty Wal-mart jeans you got there?
July 28th, 2008 at 5:23 pmobamaismymessiah Says:
That is not all the Army Field Manual bans.
The Army Field Manual? Hell, it was prolly written by a bunch o' dang pussy libruls and commies!
July 28th, 2008 at 5:25 pmhey there, obamaistheantichrist how come you don't allow comments on your blog?
July 28th, 2008 at 5:27 pm5th Estate Says:
hey there, obamaistheantichrist how come you don’t allow comments on your blog?
Maybe because his blog is just a storefront for shirts and buttons?
July 28th, 2008 at 5:31 pmIt clearly would have banned more than waterboarding. No straw man here.
Yes, it banned TORTURE in many forms... why are you and McCain pro-TORTURE?
July 28th, 2008 at 5:33 pmobamaismymessiah Says:
That’s not my blog. It’s just a link.
And such a nice respectful link. It's obvious you are committed to real dialog.
July 28th, 2008 at 5:34 pmYes, O'messiah- I am in favor of letting the world know that the U.S. has banned torture in all its forms... so are most of the people actually serving in uniform.
July 28th, 2008 at 5:43 pmExperts say torture produces bad intel- why does the CIA need an exemption, does the CIA need more bad intel?
Experts say torture weakens our position and endangers any service members captured by the enemy- why does the CIA need an exemption, does the CIA want a weaker USA and endangered service members.
McCain says torture didn't work on him... does he now think the CIA is better at torture than the VC? Do they need more practice?
Torture is wrong, ineffective and immoral... it's as simple as that.
Oh, I see,. So when you wrote, "You and the writers/moderators at TP keep saying that the bill in question was a bill to ban waterboarding. Are you sticking with that — that the bill only dealt with waterboarding?" you weren't referring to the thread in question or to any specific comments in it. Because I'm pretty sure that I never restricted the discussion to just waterboarding (and you did direct the remark to me) and the first sentence in the actual article specifically included other torture tactics, so that kind of dispels your argument against TP.
In other words, you accused me and the TP mods of saying that the bill only dealt with waterboarding even though neither I nor the TP mods said anything like that, and then you tried to build and argument against that position -- a position you created and inaccurately attributed to us.
That is what's known as a straw man.
July 28th, 2008 at 5:44 pm#76,
You certainly aren't against tortured logic.
July 28th, 2008 at 5:45 pmralph the wonder llama Says:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
raynman Says:
He still didn’t answer, did he?
Nope. He didn’t.
July 28th, 2008 at 4:30 pm And he never will.
July 28th, 2008 at 5:53 pmJohn McCain is a morally bankrupt fake.
Born with a silver anchor in his mouth, he was admitted to Annapolis only on the basis of his pedigree. Even so, he disgraced his "My Dad is an Admiral, and so is my Granddad" by finishing near the bottom of his class by being a party animal goof-off.
He then got admitted to Aviation School when he didn't have the grades ("My Dad is an Admiral"). He was more of a born swaggler than a born pilot. But he did love his scarf and leather jacket. Somehow, John learned to fly.
Anyone can get shot down and sent to a prison camp. No carping there. But John, by his own admission, talked like a wind-up potato head, even making propaganda films for the enemy. The real heros didn't do anything like that.
John's performance in the Navy was so bad that, despite being the son and grandson of Admirals, he was never going to get past Captain.
Now he's claiming he knows how to win wars. What wars are he talking about?
John, if you weren't married to a rich woman, you'd be selling insurance and hoping you could retire when you're 75. There's something pathetic about a 71 year old tough guy.
July 28th, 2008 at 5:55 pm(sigh) I'm not sure why you need this explained to you, but here goes...
You sound like a troll, because you come here blaming Democrats for Bush's war and defending McCain for his torture flip-flop. These are positions of most trolls, and expressed in much the same language as you used.
Your rhetorical question makes it sound like I think I'm the "know it all" in identifying Republican trolls -- something i never claimed to be. Trolls are not difficult to spot, even the familiar "Concern Trolls" who show up expressing concern for the fate of liberal ideals. Most regulars can spot them with their first post. You seem to be another identifiable species -- the cynical, "both parties suck equally" troll. We've seen that type, too.
By now, even you should be able to recognize that my "Style Manual" remark was a sarcastic comment on the uniformity of message that you folks employ, implying that few if any are capable of independent thought. I know, I know, if you have to explain a joke...
July 28th, 2008 at 5:56 pmO'messiah~
July 28th, 2008 at 6:30 pmThe Army did several studies in the late 1940's and throughout the 1950's that showed that the best method of interrogation- even with fanatical Nazi's- was decent treatment and 'Oprah-like' questioning...
They also discovered that torture (i.e. waterboarding) was counter-productive and led to bad intel.
Now, please tell me what forms of interrogation you would consider effective and then list your counter-terrorism and interrogation credentials...
You have yet to respond to any pleas for you to tell us exactly what "much, much further" means in your opening comment, and you have the gall to challenge another to clarify his remarks?
Sheesh.
July 28th, 2008 at 6:32 pmOIMM..
Why don't you allow comments on your blog? Be specific.
July 28th, 2008 at 6:39 pmrather than waste the rest of our’s time with your assumptions.
Speak for your's self, clown.
July 28th, 2008 at 6:51 pmbently: Please tell me exactly what forms of interrogation you would not consider torture. Be specific.
Ever watch Law and Order? Those types of interrogation techniques are very effective.
Relentless cross-examination, mixed with a little good cop/bad cop.
It works.
July 28th, 2008 at 10:59 pmWow:
July 29th, 2008 at 1:09 amAt 4:14, the much much too far claim was made. Long time for no answer to what the hell that was suppose to mean. I think it is save to call bullshit on the poster of such nonsense.
McSenile supports the TREASONOUS policies of MURDERER Bush the COXUCKER punk TRAITOR to the USA, and as such, is ALSO a TRAITOR.
God Bless Barack Obama, our NEXT PRESIDENT!!
USA! USA!
July 30th, 2008 at 11:06 amUSA! USA!
USA! USA!
USA! USA!
USA! USA!
USA! USA!