Pawlenty Rips McCain’s Use Of Joe The Plumber: ‘Throwing Out A Symbol Is Not Enough’
Pawlenty Rips McCain’s Use Of Joe The Plumber: ‘Throwing Out A Symbol Is Not Enough’
During the last weeks of the campaign, “Joe the Plumber” made a splash as Sen. John McCain’s (R-AZ) most famous surrogate. “Joe’s the man!” McCain said. Yglesias refers to Joe Wurzelbacher as the campaign’s “most annoying legacy.”
Interviewed on NPR today, however, Gov. Tim Pawlenty (R-MN) — a former top McCain surrogate and VP contender — criticized how McCain relied on Joe the Plumber as a “symbol” with no sustance behind it. Pawlenty said that simply “throwing out” the “icon” of Joe the Plumber, as McCain did, was “not enough”:
MONTAGNE: Well it, certainly, during this past election, made an attempt to reach out, I would think, to that group, with the now famous character, really, Joe the Plumber. How would you see that happening if the attempt has been made and it didn’t — didn’t really work.
PAWLENTY: Well, I don’t think the attempt was made very well. I think just because you bring up the name Joe the Plumber — while people view that as a symbol — but what does that mean, in terms of what Republicans can do to make my health care more affordable, my — filling up my car more affordable? I think just throwing out a symbol or an icon is not enough.
Sure enough, hours later, in her first press conference since Tuesday’s election, Gov. Sarah Palin enthusiastically brought up Joe the Plumber. “Folks like Joe the Plumber, yes, who spoke for so many,” she said. “People who he was speaking for felt kinda comforted.” Palin then also reminisced about Tito the Builder. Watch it:
While Pawlenty criticized the use of Wurzelbacher today, he enthusiastically referenced Joe the Plumber during the campaign as a means to criticize Sen. Barack Obama (D-IL).
When the Obama campaign criticized McCain’s use of Joe the Plumber, Palin responded with anger. “Why the heck are you going after Joe The Plumber? … He wants to be something else. Why is that so wrong?” We await Palin’s condemnation of Pawlenty.
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When the Obama campaign criticized McCain’s use of Joe the Plumber, Palin responded with anger. “Why the heck are you going after Joe The Plumber? … He wants to be something else. Why is that so wrong?” We await Palin’s condemnation of Pawlenty.
I believe the Republican Primary will begin right around Christmas of 2010….a bit of a wait, but it will happen.
November 13th, 2008 at 8:56 pmKeltoi, so who might be the GOP contenders do you think?
November 13th, 2008 at 9:00 pm5th Estate Says:
——————————————————————————–
Keltoi, so who might be the GOP contenders do you think?
November 13th, 2008 at 9:00 pm
Britney Spears and Joe the (Non) Plumber ; as they have established that they are as intelligent and truthful as the this year’s GOP presidential ticket ………
November 13th, 2008 at 9:05 pmPALIN / WURZELBACHER 2012!!!1!
That’s going to be so awesome…
November 13th, 2008 at 9:06 pmRepublicans want to weigh the pros and cons of Joe the wife beating plumber while the economy goes down the toilet and our people are suffering and dying in Iraq and Afghanistan. They have no solutions and most of our problems are products of their blind allegiance to their bizarre ideology.
November 13th, 2008 at 9:09 pmLet’s talk about 2012 when the time comes. I’m tired of this plain crap. I want to focus on the issues we face starting next year. Talking about Palin will resolve nothing. Let’s discuss reviving the economy.
November 13th, 2008 at 9:10 pm5th Estate Says:
Keltoi, so who might be the GOP contenders do you think?
Wow…nine days later. We are junkies, aren’t we?
A lot depends on how Obama does. If he is vulnerable, that will change things as far as who wants in. Based on ‘08, I don’t think too many people will want to take him on, but again, we’ll see how the 2010 midterm goes.
Pawlenty has that look in his eyes – he is a contender. Crist in Florida has to be considered just because of Florida. Jindal is a cypher to me…a very efficient technocrat….can’t get a bead on him.
Then there is the old guard: Romney, Huckabee, maybe even Gingrich. Of those three, Romney is probably in the best spot, he has the “I told you so” factor in place.
As far as Palin goes, if she wants it, she’d have to dominate the debates, dazzle on the stump, display a grasp on the issues that she clearly lacked in 08. I think it is possible she could do these things, but she has a lot of work to do to get some gravitas back in the tank.
November 13th, 2008 at 9:11 pmbtruthful at 6: TOTAL AGREEMENT.
I think we are collectively suffering from what amputees call phantom pain; the limb is gone, but you can still feel it hurting.
We are suffering phantom Cam-paign. Hopefully it fades soon and we can indeed talk about things happening now instead of things 2 to 4 years in the future.
November 13th, 2008 at 9:14 pmKeltoi at Night Says:
——————————————————————————–
As far as Palin goes, if she wants it, she’d have to dominate the debates, dazzle on the stump, display a grasp on the issues that she clearly lacked in 08. I think it is possible she could do these things, but she has a lot of work to do to get some gravitas back in the tank.
November 13th, 2008 at 9:11 pm
Leave it to a GOP backing suckhole to believe and claim it’s within the realm of possibility that one of the biggest imbeciles on the planet is suddenly going to finally grasp at age 48 what she doesn’t know at age 44 , and should have already known being a politician vying for the 2nd highest office in the land just last week ……..
November 13th, 2008 at 9:20 pmJoe The Plumber symbolizes all the people on a median income who have been fooled/brain-washed into thinking Republicans will be better for them than Democrats. There is no way in hell he was anywhere near purchasing a business that makes over $250K per year profit. He could not even afford to pay the $1100 he owed.
November 13th, 2008 at 9:24 pmListening to this I was struck nearly dumb by the lusty applause and cheers throughout.
November 13th, 2008 at 9:27 pmPalin, as usual, lacks understanding of the facts: not Joe. Not plumber. Not taxpayer. Learn it, Sarah.
November 13th, 2008 at 9:31 pmMCMetal Britney Spears and Joe the (Non) Plumber (GOP 2010 Primary Contenders)
Nice thought!
But I wager Not-Joe the Plumber’s Ass-istant will do a few commentaries in the right wing media just for old times sake, but no political role for him.
Assuming Sarah Palin learns nothing over the next two years ( near certainty) I can definitely see her running in the primaries and the more pragmatic GOP establishment is just going to have to deal with it.
I think they’ll be looking to Governors as candidates– a normally safe bet but how the next 2 years play out economically is going to be key for both parties and the GOP is going to have to be as careful about their performance as the minority in Congress and how that reflects.
After all whoever runs the House, they both get actually get judged together.
The GOP tried to paint the Dem-run 109th as “do-nothing” and pointed to low approval ratings but I think plenty of people saw that the GOP were as obstructionist as the Dems were spineless, but as it were the Dems did little good whilst the Repubs did harm. I think that was evident long before the financial crisis burst.
In a way the GOP may actually have to help the Dems, to help themselves–quite the dilemma!
November 13th, 2008 at 9:35 pmI agree with Pawlenty that throwing out a symbol is not enough.
In fairness to the McCain campaign, however, that was pretty much all they had to work with.
November 13th, 2008 at 9:44 pmcircular firing squad RELOAD!!
November 13th, 2008 at 9:44 pmWhy are we still talking about Sarah Palin?
November 13th, 2008 at 9:48 pmKetloi: Wow…nine days later. We are junkies, aren’t we?
Umm, you brought it up Keltoi: “I believe the Republican Primary will begin right around Christmas of 2010…” whilst the Republicans are still trying to figure out what went wrong and what to do next. The nest four years are a big deal for both sides because the mess the US is in can’t be sufficiently reversed in just four years and if the Dems and Obama don;t make progress, for whatever reason, the Repubs might then get themselves in the hot seat in 2013 and then THEY will face their continued legacy from 2001-2009.
November 13th, 2008 at 9:50 pmPawlenty Rips McCain’s Use Of Joe The Plumber: ‘Throwing Out A Symbol Is Not Enough’»
– - That’s a real hoot coming from Tim I-never-met-a-metaphor-I-couldn’t-over-use-to-death Pawlenty.
November 13th, 2008 at 9:50 pmwithout joe the plumber
where would plumbing be?
*
i shudder to think.
^
November 13th, 2008 at 9:51 pm5th Estate Says:
Ketloi: Wow…nine days later. We are junkies, aren’t we?
Umm, you brought it up Keltoi: “I believe the Republican Primary will begin right around Christmas of 2010…”
The Thread brought it up. And you are a junkie, 5th, don’t be coy.
In a way, TP is facing the same problem Colbert and Stewart are. The audience doesn’t want to hear Obama made fun of, the audience here doesn’t want to hear him criticized. How TP handles the next 4 years will also be very interesting.
November 13th, 2008 at 9:56 pmUmm, isnt the election over?
November 13th, 2008 at 9:59 pmbtruthful… baxterJ…
November 13th, 2008 at 9:59 pmfair enough–enough with the Schadenfreude!
Care to pick a tangible issue we can discuss? I’m game.
Keltoi at Night Says:
In a way, TP is facing the same problem Colbert and Stewart are. The audience doesn’t want to hear Obama made fun of, the audience here doesn’t want to hear him criticized. How TP handles the next 4 years will also be very interesting.
Not just TP. Here, why not make an actual contribution?
November 13th, 2008 at 9:59 pmJust heard, from supposedly local sources, on WGN News, Chicago: Hillary leads short list for Secretary of State.
November 13th, 2008 at 10:05 pmKeltoi at Night Says:
5th Estate Says:
Ketloi: Wow…nine days later. We are junkies, aren’t we?
Umm, you brought it up Keltoi: “I believe the Republican Primary will begin right around Christmas of 2010…”
The Thread brought it up. And you are a junkie, 5th, don’t be coy.
In a way, TP is facing the same problem Colbert and Stewart are. The audience doesn’t want to hear Obama made fun of, the audience here doesn’t want to hear him criticized. How TP handles the next 4 years will also be very interesting.
*
how you handle your
manhood would be
much more interesting.
*
good luck.
:)
November 13th, 2008 at 10:06 pmThat would be governor Tim Pawlenty who vetoed funds for bridge construction. Don’t be fooled. They are all crooks, they hate Americans, and they want a depression that only benefits the CEO class. We either deny them a future or we live with these idiots forever. Looks like we will once again allow them to go on and on and on, no matter how many $700 billion they steal from our treasury.
November 13th, 2008 at 10:19 pmi like margaret carlson’s way – she calls him “J the P“, promising never again to mention the name on keith’s show…
November 13th, 2008 at 10:21 pmKeltoi: Wow…nine days later. We are junkies, aren’t we?
MeL Umm, you brought it up Keltoi: “I believe the Republican Primary will begin right around Christmas of 2010…”
KeltoiL “The Thread brought it up. And you are a junkie, 5th, don’t be coy.”
The thread post doesn’t mention 2010 or primaries. It’s tenses are in the past and the present. It’s subject is the differences of opinion and contradictory positions and reversals between Palin/McCain and Pawlenty regarding Joe the Plumber, pre- and post-election and it poses the question at the end of whether Palin will criticize fellow Republican Governor Pawlenty for his remarks latest remarks about the symbolism and use of ‘Joe the Plumber’ as a ‘personal attack’ as she had criticized the Obama campaign as indulging in a ‘personal attack’ when he [Wurzelbacher] misrepresented his own situation to challenge Obama’s proposed tax policies as detrimental to him and by implication detrimental to many in his economic strata when IN FACT he would benefit from them and would IN FACT benefit less from McCain;s policies.
And despite these FACTS he was and is still used by McCain/Palin as a political prop and symbol when Pawlenty now recognizes their use of him as being a shallow gimmick–and actually representative of the current GOP problem of pitching manufactured, fake symbols to the public instead of rational policies in order to get elected.
THAT is what the thread is about.
November 13th, 2008 at 10:22 pmYOU brought up 2010 and the primaries and I merely asked you who might run, as YOU brought the subject up.
Keltoi at Night Says:
In a way, TP is facing the same problem Colbert and Stewart are. The audience doesn’t want to hear Obama made fun of, the audience here doesn’t want to hear him criticized. How TP handles the next 4 years will also be very interesting.
May I direct your attention to the upper right-hand portion of your screen, near the top of the sidebar.
“What We’re Fighting For:
Social and Economic Justice, Healthy Communities, Global Leadership, A Secure America
What We’re Fighting Against:
Corrupt Establishment, Incompetent Establishment, Braindead Media, Radical Right-Wing Agenda”
Now, we still don’t have Social and Economic Justice and Healthy Communities all across America yet, so there’s still plenty of work to do there. Global Leadership is something that TP will be watching for, and after being advised by CAP CEO John Podesta, I’m sure that President Obama will know that he’s going to be held to his promises to restore America’s leadership position in the world. It can be done. As for a Secure America, I’d feel more secure if the current Chairman of the Senate Homeland Security and Government Oversight Committee were replaced.
As for Corrupt Establishment and Incompetent Establishment, do not be surprised if someone ends up resigning from the administration (because it does happen to all of them) because of something amplified by this website. Braindead Media? As long as Right-Wing Hate Talk Radio is out there, parroting the words of their Friends at Fox “News” Channel, there will be some braindead media on which to keep a watchful eye. And the radical Right-Wing is still out there, with their Agenda, and we need the fine people at TP to alert us to their activities.
ThinkProgress isn’t going anywhere for a while. You can relax now.
November 13th, 2008 at 10:29 pmguess that’s how it works with the bots… repeat the line…
but saying it doesn’t make it true…
“It’s like they take pride in being ignorant.”
November 13th, 2008 at 10:33 pmWhere were Pawlenty’s concerns during the campaign? He needed to voice his principles while the fake plumber was being used by a desperate campaign.
http://www.sunstateactivist.org/ssablog/
November 13th, 2008 at 10:37 pmoh! about the LIEberman -
RACHEL GETS IT RIGHT TONIGHT! MUST SEE!
November 13th, 2008 at 10:47 pmJoe the Unlicensed Faux Plumber was as big a flop as the NotReadyForPrimeTimeGovernorfromOutsideTheContinentalUnitesStates.
November 13th, 2008 at 10:51 pmUnitesStates? Fingers, fat…
November 13th, 2008 at 10:53 pmIsn’t anybody ever going to ask Joe if he drove to the interview? Does he really have an Ohio driver’s license? Still? Yet?
November 13th, 2008 at 10:53 pmhi RUC
November 13th, 2008 at 10:55 pmHI there RUC!
November 13th, 2008 at 10:57 pmoops
November 13th, 2008 at 10:58 pmWhen the Obama campaign criticized McCain’s use of Joe the Plumber, Palin responded with anger. “Why the heck are you going after Joe The Plumber? … He wants to be something else.
Maybe he wants to be Joe the licensed plumber.
November 13th, 2008 at 11:10 pmPalin then also reminisced about Tito the Builder.
Oh yeah, she really liked Tito The Angry Builder. Scary guy. Todd wouldn’t dare interfere while Tito and Sarah are going at it.
November 13th, 2008 at 11:16 pmI wonder: “Todd,do you think people are laughing with me or AT me?”….”TODD!…I ASKED YOU A QUESTION!”…
November 13th, 2008 at 11:28 pmhi shoeless…
I worked in the construction and renovation biz a long while in NYC and I never met a Tito the Builder.
November 13th, 2008 at 11:29 pmIt really honest to god was usually “Bob”.
Marble? Italians
Electricians? Americans
Rough Carpenters? Irish
Sheetrockers? Poles/Hungarians
Wallpaper? Czechs
Spacklers? Greeks
Plumbers? Irish/Hispanic/Estonians
HVAC? Hispanic
Freight Elevator Operators? Bosnians
Demo-donkeys? Haitians/Jamaicans
Oh shit. I had sort of forgotten about old SamJoe the plumber’s gopher. Thanks…
November 13th, 2008 at 11:41 pmWhen the Obama campaign criticized McCain’s use of Joe the Plumber, Palin responded with anger. “Why the heck are you going after Joe The Plumber? … He wants to be something else. Why is that so wrong?”
If you dare to peek, this shows a little of the mindset of, for lack of a more polite term, “these people”, the Republicans that adore Sarah Palin so much. The Obama campaign criticizes the use of “Joe” the “Plumber”, and Palin sees it as an attack, not on their tactics, but on their tool, the alleged Joe the alleged Plumber. She does not understand what they are criticizing. How could she possibly be able to understand what to do in a national crisis? And why do “these people” love her so much? Why do they think she’s right? Are they just as vacuous as she?
November 13th, 2008 at 11:57 pmI’m off…until tomorrow.
November 13th, 2008 at 11:59 pmJoe the Plumber and Joe the liarman can both take a flying leap for all I care. Neither have anything of substance or use to offer.
November 14th, 2008 at 12:09 amwell SamJoe does offer an amusing meathead to goof on…
November 14th, 2008 at 12:11 amEven Joe the Plumber can’t stop the overflow of sewage coming out of the Rush’s dribbling mouth
November 14th, 2008 at 12:14 amSpeaking of guys named Joe…
Just say no to Joe. Lieberman that is…
November 14th, 2008 at 12:15 amWell, it looks like Pawlenty is positioning himself as the centrist Republican leader. It’s probably a good move on his part because he is the only one there. The rest all seem to be falling off the far right cliff.
November 14th, 2008 at 12:17 amIf Pawlenty does end up being the nominee for the next Republican Convention, will he be introduced as “the next President of the United States, Tim Palin”?
November 14th, 2008 at 12:23 am#Keltoi at Night Says:
In a way, TP is facing the same problem Colbert and Stewart are. The audience doesn’t want to hear Obama made fun of, the audience here doesn’t want to hear him criticized. How TP handles the next 4 years will also be very interesting.
You know, you really are an a$$, a right wing a$$ to boot. In case you haven’t noticed, we on the left are not in the least afraid to criticize our leaders when they are letting us down.
But, we also will not sit still and listen to our President Elect be criticized for things people think or assume he will do. And that’s pretty much what has been happening the last week. Friggin Limbaugh is calling our recession the “Obama Recession”.
If Obama does things that make us angry we will speak up and let him know how we feel. Most of us have already done so with this wanting to forgive Holy Joe.
If he were to ever do any of the things that your King George has done, we will make sure that he is not allowed another term, unlike you lemmings who could clearly see the mess Bush had made of this country and elected him back to do more damage.
November 14th, 2008 at 12:24 amThey’ll all use Joe the Plumber when its convenient for them or criticize use of Joe the Plumber when its not.
November 14th, 2008 at 1:21 amCheck out the following funny Palin McCain parody with reference to Joe the Plumber
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yv9bvrN1QMU
mcchimpy had nothing of substance during the last presidential debate. Up pops the plant called “joe the plumber.” A freakin plant by the dirty repugs.
The repugs can’t run on their platform because, invasion, greed, stealing, murder, torture, secret government, lying and mayhem aren’t winning topics. But these are what the repugs cherish so deeply. The democratic process is a joke to them.
I hope the repugs keep their myopic view of the world. They won’t win another presidential election under the repug name ever again.
November 14th, 2008 at 2:39 amWho is naive enough to believe President Obama can reverse 30 years of repugs’ rule in four years?
All I know is, that the US will be a much much better in four years.
President Obama emphasized that it will take all of us to turn this around. I don’t expect to fail.
Do you?
November 14th, 2008 at 2:58 amEh, excuse me, but I don’t think a guy who says he makes $250,000 a year can present himself as an “Joe Six-Pack Plumber.” That’s three to four times what the average family makes, not the Average Joe.
I think that foolish “life is tough” sthick from a guy making $250k a year backfired. What was Joe whining about? I think he looked pathetic and was willingly and cheerfully/glumfully used (paid, I’m sure) by the McCain campaign.
Joe the Plumber? He looked more like Joe the long-range, improved MLISS-Anti Missle system salesman from Raytheon.
November 14th, 2008 at 3:32 amI’ve been asleep for the last two weeks, has Joe the (so called) Plumber been added to John McCain’s Cabinet yet? LOL
AIO
November 14th, 2008 at 5:07 amrepublicanSScareme, Joe the Plumber earned $40,000 a year. He claimed that in the near future he hoped to own a business making over $250,000 per year profit. It was BullShit.
November 14th, 2008 at 5:08 amAIO, you need to look through TP’s older entries. You’ll be surprized.
November 14th, 2008 at 5:17 am;)
AIO
November 14th, 2008 at 5:22 amAs we all know, the Right suffer from the delusion that they are the “real” Americans…when in fact they are a creepy minority with an agenda alien to that of normal citizens.
Bogus though he may be, Joe the Plumber is clearly an important part of this desperate fantasy. Humiliated in another election, the Right are withdrawing deeper into their delusional Bizarro World. I weep for the poor bastards.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aypMFARJW84
November 14th, 2008 at 5:39 amPerry logan Says:
I weep for the poor bastards.
I don’t.
AIO
November 14th, 2008 at 5:44 am“Palin then also reminisced about Tito the Builder.”
November 14th, 2008 at 5:48 amDue to the lack of need for cheap labor in the building market caused by disasterous republican economic policies, Tito the builder has been deported.
>The audience doesn’t want to
> hear Obama made fun of
No, thats not really it, so much as there is much, much less mockable about obama than there is about mouthbreathing white-trash like palin and faux white-trash anti-intellectuals like bush….lets face it, its hard to listen to these people speak for more than 5 minutes without the objective mind questioning whether these people have a 3 digit IQ. McCain is old and spaced out, mentally about the same level as Palin or Bush. Dick Cheney, while likely substantially smarter, is uber-creepy, says incredibly deluded things (”last throes”, “greeted with flowers”, etc and doesnt seem like the type of person you’d want to leave your children alone with. Baraks so used to having his every word scrutizized and put under a microscrope that he chooses his words very carefully. And he’s got the brainpower to choose his words (and actions) very carefully as well.
If you have some ideas about good jokes to make about Obama, please, do share them with us…its not we dont want to hear jokes about him, its just that hes not nearly as comical, or comically sinister, as the cast of characters who used to be running the show.. heck, even dick cheneys wife ran with the “cheney =evil overlord” joke by giving stewart a figure of darth vader when he was interviewing her..
November 14th, 2008 at 7:22 amJoe the Plumber. Sounds like a movie that Larry Flynt would make.
November 14th, 2008 at 7:28 amJoe the Plumber was no plumber. Joe the Plumber is a con man. Joe the Plumber is no more a symbol of middle class America than James Dobson is a representative of ecumenical faith.
November 14th, 2008 at 7:30 am“symbol” with no sustance behind it
That’s the American way – bright, shiny, new objects of no lasting value, having no importance other than amusement and distraction and supposed instant gratification.
November 14th, 2008 at 7:42 amjurassicpork Says: “Sounds like a movie that Larry Flynt would make.”
I’m already hearing a car dealer radio ad using Palin’s voice; doncha know, buy heck and buy golly….
November 14th, 2008 at 8:01 amLooks like the GOP Primary already started for 2012 race between Sarah and Pawlenty…
Pawlenty seems to be a realist questioning Joe the Plumber story, but Joe the Plumber story is more liked by a propagandist like Sarah Palin.
Joe does not have and probably never had 2 million dollars to buy a plumbing business that give him a 1/4 million profit,but Sarah wants to milk the story to the last drop.
Pawlenty stopped short of calling the whole thing is a lie,he said ‘Throwing out a symbol is not enough’.
Pawlenty seems not to like this style of campaigning,but Sarah loves it.
Sarah in fact is still dwelling on Bill Ayers story.
My own guess is Sarah will not make it thru the first 3 primaries on her own in 2012 race,because next time around the room will be crowded with many GOP President hopefuls and wannabees.
November 14th, 2008 at 8:08 amJoe who?
November 14th, 2008 at 8:10 amTarazan Says:
Pawlenty seems not to like this style of campaigning,but Sarah loves it.
Sarah in fact is still dwelling on Bill Ayers story.
November 14th, 2008 at 8:08 am
_______
Perhaps she’ll want to listen to Democracy Now today – Amy Goodman is interviewing Bill Ayers, so we can finally hear the REAL story about this “terrorist.”
November 14th, 2008 at 8:11 amalphainfinityomega Says:
“… has Joe the (so called) Plumber been added to John McCain’s Cabinet yet?”
He’s still working underneath the sink.
November 14th, 2008 at 8:23 amI just watched Tito the Builder for the first time on U-Tube.
November 14th, 2008 at 8:31 amPretty funny. At least Tito had the sense to wear dark glasses, something Joe never thought about.
In a previous era, give Tito a cigar, a cap with a red star on the front and he’d make a good comrade.
(Sam)Joe the (Notta) Plumber did, indeed, speak for a lot of people. Thank goodness not a majority of American voters, but a lot of people. Those would be the people who could admit, in public, that Obama’s policies would more directly benefit them, but still were too stupid to pull the level on the Democrat. It’s the equivalent of smoking – it’s written right on the pack what the tobacco will do to your lungs and heart and life, and there’s plenty of proof as to how your health will improve if you stop smoking, and yet smokers keep right on smoking. Same with Republicans. They just can’t stop voting for Republicans and don’t like being reminded that it’s stupid to vote for Republicans.
Let us continue to remember history, so that we don’t dare repeat it.
November 14th, 2008 at 1:27 pm