Former Bush Speechwriter: CIA Torturers Are ‘American Heroes’
Former Bush Speechwriter: CIA Torturers Are ‘American Heroes’
Last week, former Bush speechwriter Marc Thiessen penned a vitriolic op-ed in the Washington Post, arguing that if there is another terror attack, “Americans will hold Obama responsible.” Greg Sargent noted that on the same day, Thiessen called President Obama “the most dangerous man ever to occupy the Oval Office.”
Today, in an interview on WAMU’s Diane Rehm Show, Thiessen again lashed out at Obama, this time for Obama’s executive order closing Guantanamo. “I think this is the most dangerous decision that any president has made within 48 hours of his inauguration,” he said, saying that torture is “singularly responsible” for stopping attacks on the U.S. Thiessen listed a long chain of events that were all allegedly sourced to the torture of Abu Zubaydah:
THIESSEN: The CIA developed these alternative interrogation techniques, and all of a sudden he started talking. Zubaydah’s information led us to Ramsey bin al Shibh, who was was one of the 9/11 hijackers. Together, they gave us the information that led the capture of KSM. Then, KSM gave us information about another al Qaeda operative, Majid Khan, who was in CIA custody. He told us that Majid Khan had been tasked to give $50,000 to an operative named Zubair, who was developing plots with a Southeast Asian group called JI.
Later, Thiessen bristled in response to a conversation about investigating Bush administration officials for torture. Bush’s torturers, he said, are really “American heroes”:
THIESSEN: They’re not torturers. They’re heroes. … And the thought that we’re sitting here discussing whether these people should be prosecuted or investigated is just outrageous. These people are American heroes who saved lives and stopped the next Sept. 11.
Listen here:
Zubaydah’s torture is a textbook example of why coercive interrogations do not work. Zubaydah was reportedly driven mentally insane from his torture, and Canadians tossed out evidence from the CIA’s interrogations of Zubaydah. In fact, from Zubaydah’s interrogations, the U.S. gleaned false information about links between al Qaeda and Saddam Hussein.
In calling Bush’s torturers “heroes,” Thiessen is echoing Bill Kristol, who suggested in November that the “CIA agents who waterboarded Khalid Sheikh Mohammad” receive the Presidential Medal of Freedom.
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former Bush speechwriter Marc Thiessen… arguing that if there is another terror attack, “Americans will hold Obama responsible.”
– - Yep, the same way you GOP’ers held Bush responsible for 9/11.
Oh, wait…
January 26th, 2009 at 5:33 pmThey’re not heroes in any America I’ve ever heard of.
.
And if you’re saying they’re heroes for torturing, then they must be torturers. I mean just logically, you can’t have it both ways.
January 26th, 2009 at 5:36 pmTHIESSEN:”These people are American heroes who saved lives and stopped the next Sept. 11″
If you at least had the competence to read the warnings of the first one there would have been no need to stop the “next Sept.11th”
The effin nerve of some people, and the sheep will agree.
Idiots
RIP
January 26th, 2009 at 5:36 pmSGT Stephen R. Sherman
C CO 1-5 IN (STRYKER)
KIA 3 Feb 2005
Mosul, Iraq
And then after his radio appearance, Marc Thiessen enjoyed pulling the wings off of flies. I vote Thiessen get waterboarded and then have him on a follow-up appearance on Diane Rhiem. Wonder if he would be so absolute in his views. Methinks not.
January 26th, 2009 at 5:39 pmIf Thiessen was ever subjected to torture, he’d be singing a different song. Do we know if Thiessen ever served in the military?
January 26th, 2009 at 5:40 pmFourteen Defining Characteristics of Fascism
# 2. Disdain for the importance of human rights.
The regimes themselves viewed human rights as of little value and a hindrance to realizing the objectives of the ruling elite. Through clever use of propaganda, the population was brought to accept these human rights abuses by marginalizing, even demonizing, those being targeted. When abuse was egregious, the tactic was to use secrecy, denial, and disinformation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVVa1IvHdKc
January 26th, 2009 at 5:45 pmTorturers are NOT heroes they are soulless thugs. This includes Bush and Darth Cheney.
January 26th, 2009 at 5:46 pmWhat an evil, twisted little freak. Someone shut him the hell up.
January 26th, 2009 at 5:47 pmI find it interesting that this Major General, this MI General, and this seasoned interrogator, all disagree with the right-wing talking points. Why is it that the only people who support this type of behavior are the ones who have never set foot in a room with a detainee who is being questioned? All of the guys with experience seem to agree that torture doesn’t work and actually does more bad than good.
January 26th, 2009 at 5:47 pmCome here Marc Thiessen, I want to be your hero.
January 26th, 2009 at 5:48 pmI listened to this interview, and the guy was hysterical in this particular segment. His comments and condescension toward the other guests who disagreed with him clearly revealed his impenetrable biases. Yet another bad apple from the Bush barrel; let us all continue to marginalize their voices in favor of the rational and informed.
January 26th, 2009 at 5:48 pmMoonElf Says:
If Thiessen was ever subjected to torture, he’d be singing a different song. Do we know if Thiessen ever served in the military?
No, he’s a pure chickenhawk. Speechwriting and shilling is all he’s ever done with his life, though he attend the Naval War College as a civilian.
January 26th, 2009 at 5:49 pmThese people are American heroes who saved lives and stopped the next Sept. 11.
You mean in 2002 we went from Sept. 10 straight to Sept. 12? Funny, I don’t remember that.
January 26th, 2009 at 5:50 pmWhen was that next Sept 11 supposed to be?
In chicago, with that band of lunatics blowing up the sears tower?
those pitiful immigrants in new jersey suborned by the FBI into tragic games in the woods?
c’mon. when the phuck was it supposed to be?
January 26th, 2009 at 5:50 pmInterrogator who Located Zarqawi Rips U.S. Torture Policy
January 26th, 2009 at 5:50 pmHeros that stopped the next 911? That’s rediculous. My dog stopped the next Sept. 11., and a Dam good job it’s done the last eight years.
January 26th, 2009 at 5:51 pmHere’s what Abu Zubaydah told interrogaters…oddly it’s not mentioned by Mr. Thiessen:
He named two other Saudi princes, and also the chief of Pakistan’s air force, as his major contacts. Moreover, he stunned his interrogators, by charging that two of the men, the King’s nephew, and the Pakistani Air Force chief, knew a major terror operation was planned for America on 9/11.
It would be nice to further investigate the men named by Zubaydah, but that is not possible. All four identified by Zubaydah are now dead. As for the three Saudi princes, the King’s 43-year-old nephew, Prince Ahmed, died of either a heart attack or blood clot, depending on which report you believe, after having liposuction in Riyadh’s top hospital; the second, 41-year-old Prince Sultan bin Faisal bin Turki al-Saud, died the following day in a one car accident, on his way to the funeral of Prince Ahmed; and one week later, the third Saudi prince named by Zubaydah, 25-year-old Prince Fahd bin Turki bin Saud al-Kabir, died, according to the Saudi Royal Court, “of thirst.” The head of Pakistan’s Air Force, Mushaf Ali Mir, was the last to go. He died, together with his wife and fifteen of his top aides, when his plane blew up — suspected as sabotage — in February 2003. Pakistan’s investigation of the explosion — if one was even done — has never been made public.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/12/7/183319/766
January 26th, 2009 at 5:51 pmIsn’t it funny that these people say that torture has kept us from another attack but can’t give us even one example of how that happened.
On the other hand, it’s pretty obvious that for every person we tortured we probably made another 1,000 terrorists. For every innocent person killed in Iraq probably made another 5 terrorists.
We will be done as a country if we start making heroes out of people who torture.
January 26th, 2009 at 5:52 pmWhat an evil, twisted little freak. Someone shut him the hell up.
January 26th, 2009 at 5:47 pm
Who, Diane Rehm? Oh, gawd yes. She’s dreadful.
Oh, wait: you said ‘him?’ Oh well…
January 26th, 2009 at 5:52 pmHe admires people who pull the wings off flies and blowup frogs also.
January 26th, 2009 at 5:53 pmI guess on the next Sept. 11.
January 26th, 2009 at 5:57 pmI am starting to believe we have two types of Americans – Those who honor and support the rule of law, and then those Americans such as Thiessen who honor lawbreaking and violating our international obligations.
Tell me again, why is Thiessen NOT a traitor to our country? Why is Limbaugh allowed to go free after his traitorous remarks about wanting the country to fail? Does the right side only get worked up when sexual relations between a consenting man and woman has taken place – and not the destruction of our country?
January 26th, 2009 at 5:58 pmYep, and Nazi torturers are German heroes. Thiessen is a freaking tool!
January 26th, 2009 at 5:59 pmThis Thiessen’s moral standards aren’t much different than the “terrorists” he’s railing against. Good American’s are above the use of torture…this guy isn’t a good American, not even close.
January 26th, 2009 at 5:59 pmtokin librul Says:
I think it was the guy who was going to take down the Brooklyn bridge with a blowtorch
January 26th, 2009 at 6:00 pmThis is an article from a seasoned interrogator who claims that torture not only doesn’t work, it is also used by Al-Qaeda as a recruitment tool.
“I was the most senior interrogator in Iraq during the worst of the civil war and my team played by the rules, followed Geneva Conventions, and, get this, accomplished our mission. We did it without resorting to torture or using enhanced interrogation methods (which is just a technical three word description for the word torture).”
…
“The foreign fighters consistently cited Abu Ghraib as their number one reason for deciding to come to Iraq and it is al Qaeda’s best recruitment tool. You heard that correctly. Abu Ghraib is al Qaeda’s “Army of One” commercial. No, they didn’t come because they drank the Caliphate Kool Aid. They came because, and you’ll get this if you’ve ever watched Band of Brothers, they fight for the guy next to them, just like us, who just got tortured, shamed, and humiliated.”
January 26th, 2009 at 6:01 pmFormer Bush Speechwriter: CIA Torturers Are ‘American Heroes’»
– - I can’t wait for the CIA action heroes collection. (waterboard, shackles and bamboo chutes not included.)
January 26th, 2009 at 6:03 pmGlezz,
How many combat tours have you served? Ever been shot at? Ever had buddies KIA?
If so, you wouldn’t be talking out of your arse.
January 26th, 2009 at 6:04 pmIf there is a terrorist attack during his watch I will hold Obama responsible. It is his duty to protect the citizens of this nation.
However, I also hold Bush responsible for the terrorist attacks which took place during his tenure as President. He allowed these attacks to happen, resulting in much loss of American lives. He failed to bring those who perpetrated the attacks to justice, after seven years of trying. And, he used the attacks to justify wrong headed policies and even to start a war with a country that was completely uninvolved.
So, yes, we should hold Obama accountable for his national security record, but we should Bush accountable to the same standards.
January 26th, 2009 at 6:04 pmglezzery Says:
Those poor terrorists! More victims of the evil Bush Administration.
Poor you? Hell, you voted for the guy.
January 26th, 2009 at 6:08 pmWell, the idea is not new.
The British Crown used to name “Sir” to people who happened to be sea captains and used to murder, rape, burn, loot and enslave millions of people in India, China, South America, etc.
January 26th, 2009 at 6:09 pmAmerican Heroes are now commit Torture/Rape/Murder of innocent mwn/woman/children. That’s just how low this Country has gone under the Bush Administration. I felt bad for the Jews in Israel who remember the Holocaust only to see Israel/Bush Policy of mass murder. The Israel soldiers watched and cheer the burning to death of a 4 year old little girl as one of the fire bombs hit her house. When a reporter asked the soldier about why the soldiers said the child was Hamas and all Palestine people should died. Now the evidence against the Gitmo detainees is found to be fake and most made up by the US, Americans can look in the mirror at the real Axis of Evil George W. Bush and Dick Cheney with full support of the Republican Party.
January 26th, 2009 at 6:10 pmupside99 Says:
Glezz,
How many combat tours have you served? Ever been shot at? Ever had buddies KIA?
You’re free to pull up his service record from Milton Bradley.
January 26th, 2009 at 6:14 pmThose poor terrorists! More victims of the evil Bush Administration.
Actually, it doesnt matter if they are terrorists or not. There are international laws that the US admin were trying to circumvent by naming as “enemy combatant” to the people kept in Gitmo.
I know the whole notion of habeas corpus will sound strange to you, but it is a inherent right of every person, according to US law.
Going a little farther, why the US has a military base in Cuba but Cubans have not one on US soil? As far as I know, US invaded Cuba, at least 3 times. My guess is that Cuba should be vigilant of US govts.
I know, I know, the whole notion of justice is somewhat blurry.
January 26th, 2009 at 6:14 pmglezzery:
January 26th, 2009 at 6:15 pmWere you afraid of the Stan worshippers back in the day?
fletc3her Says:
If there is a terrorist attack during his watch I will hold Obama responsible.
I will only hold him responsible if he knew about it and did NOTHING TO STOP IT.
The rules are in place and if someone misses something, it is not Obama’s fault.
January 26th, 2009 at 6:15 pmWell I suppose I may have been frightened by dudes named Stan as well. Anyway let’s try again…
glezzery,
January 26th, 2009 at 6:16 pmWere you afraid of all the Satan Worshippers back in the day?
glezzery,
January 26th, 2009 at 6:18 pmDo you have any idea how much King George and the loyalists feared and cursed those terrorists f ucking up their perspective of what those colonies where supposed to be about?
OT, but important. Raw Story has the following ‘breaking news’…
http://rawstory.com/news/2008/CONYERS_SUBPOENAS_KARL_ROVE_0126.html
Karl Rove might be in trouble….
January 26th, 2009 at 6:19 pmIf there is a terrorist attack during his watch I will hold Obama responsible. It is his duty to protect the citizens of this nation.
Literally, that’s not quite true. He swore an oath to protect and defend the Constitution. It’s not his DUTY, though it may be among the many responsibilities of the office.,
January 26th, 2009 at 6:20 pmReal American Heroes… does this mean there’s going to be a new G.I.Joe figure, the “Interrogator?”
.
bilbobaggins Says:
Isn’t it funny that these people say that torture has kept us from another attack but can’t give us even one example of how that happened.
We all know how the Bush administration works, everything is political. If they had stopped another major attempt, FAUX News would be talking about it day and night. They’d be constantly bringing it up every possible way they could. They’d be shouting about it from the rooftops.
There would be no reason to keep a thwarted plot classified. In every other country in the world that has dealt with terrorist attacks, informing the populace of thwarted attacks is important, because it makes another instance of that type of attack less likely to succeed in the future.
.
glezzery Says:
Yup! American Heroes!
Those poor terrorists! More victims of the evil Bush Administration.
None of the people tortured have been shown to be terrorists. The Bush administration just says they are. They said that about a lot of people they’ve already released, too. Even if they weren’t evil, the fact that they’re so often utterly incompetent should be reason enough not to let them harm anyone they “think” is a terrorist.
You’d be singing a much different tune if you had been one of the people picked up at random and turned over to the U.S. military for a bounty with no proof whatsoever that you’d done anything wrong, then subject to years of psychological and physical torture.
.
fletc3her Says:
If there is a terrorist attack during his watch I will hold Obama responsible. It is his duty to protect the citizens of this nation..
Sure, but not at the cost of the Constitution. However, I take your point. If everybody here is going to claim that international partnerships, police work, increased intelligence and information sharing will work better, then they should actually work better. If not, then they’ve got some ’splainin to do. Fair enough.
January 26th, 2009 at 6:22 pmStratRat Says:
Karl Rove might be in trouble….
rut row….pig boy is in trouble.
January 26th, 2009 at 6:24 pmNext Marc Thiessen will saying that Dr. Mengele is a great humanitarian.
January 26th, 2009 at 6:27 pmI heard a clip earlier today of Gonzo criticizing Eric Holder for calling waterboarding torture. Hmmm. Here:
Still a moron and toady.
January 26th, 2009 at 6:29 pmC’mon, KKKarl – time for you to SQUEAL!!!!
January 26th, 2009 at 6:32 pmThis is the only bio I could find on Marc Thiessen in a rapid search.
http://www.linkedin.com/in/marcthiessen
January 26th, 2009 at 6:38 pmglezzery Says:
Yup! American Heroes!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Well glezzy you are certainly an American Moron.
Those poor terrorists! More victims of the evil Bush Administration.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
When were they convicted in a court of law as terrorists? Did I miss that or did they become guilty of that crime because Bush said so and that is good enough for fascists like YOU? My GOD you are ignorant
January 26th, 2009 at 6:52 pmdbadass Says:
glezzery:
Were you afraid of the Stan worshippers back in the day?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Of COURSE he was. As a member cell in good standing of the Limborg Hivemind he is always dutifully afraid of what he is TOLD to be afraid of. higher brain function just isnt an option for glezzy
January 26th, 2009 at 6:56 pmgummitch Says:
I heard a clip earlier today of Gonzo criticizing Eric Holder for calling waterboarding torture. Hmmm. Here:
“I don’t know what Mr. Holder did or didn’t know in making that statement,” Mr. Gonzales told National Public Radio. “And I think that one needs to be careful in making a blanket pronouncement like that, if you don’t have all the information, because of the effect it may have, again, on the morale and the dedication of intelligence officials and lawyers throughout the administration.”
Seriously? We should be so concerned about the MORALE of the intelligence team than the MORAL foundation of torturing? Amazing.
If these people are so proud of their “service”, then they should be willing to take the punishment that comes with performing service that is against the law.
January 26th, 2009 at 6:59 pmSo will the GOP nominate Jack Bauer for a medal?
It’ll be interesting to see how Bauer will accept the award in D.C. if Kiefer Sutherland is in Hollywood at the same time.
January 26th, 2009 at 7:17 pmTHIESSEN: The CIA developed these alternative interrogation techniques, and all of a sudden he started talking. Zubaydah’s information led us to Ramsey bin al Shibh, who was was one of the 9/11 hijackers.
Really? Because I thought all the hijackers died in the attacks. Or was this one the many “20th hijackers” they claimed to have caught?
January 26th, 2009 at 7:17 pmWayne A. Schneider Says:
THIESSEN: The CIA developed these alternative interrogation techniques, and all of a sudden he started talking. Zubaydah’s information led us to Ramsey bin al Shibh, who was was one of the 9/11 hijackers.
Really? Because I thought all the hijackers died in the attacks. Or was this one the many “20th hijackers” they claimed to have caught?
They couldn’t put those guys up for trial when the strategy to get the info for the “20th hijacker” in question resembled a twisted version of a bidding game from the contestant’s row of the Price is Right.
I hear Dick Cheney liked playing the role of Bob Barker though.
January 26th, 2009 at 7:28 pmThank YOU for showing that FASCISTS like you should never be let anywhere NEAR the levers of power. First if you have to torture someone to save me, let me die, for what good is it to save my life at the cost of my soul? And THAT is what we are talking about AMERICA’S SOUL, are we the kind of people who TORTURE people? Apparantly YOU would like to be but I dont want America to be seen that way and I dont want America to BE that way. Doing the right thing isnt always easy, it NEVER comes without cost COWARDS dont want to pay the cost of doing what is right. I do. Honor, Integrity these are gifts that people and countries give themselves and they are expensive, if they were easy they would be easy and no great satisfaction or nobility would be associated with them. YOU would deprive our great country of those gifts because you are a coward. Thiessen is an embarassment to all decent Americans
January 26th, 2009 at 7:30 pmOne has first to have earned the title & respect of “Hero” to know what a hero is. You sir are no hero.
January 26th, 2009 at 7:34 pmI have noticed the the troll called Glezzery likes to comment on every thread about torture – and he consistently supports the use of torture – while attempting to shame those that stand behind the rule and spirit of the law. I have come to the conclusion that he is a sadist and very likely becomes sexually stimulated as he fantasizes about torture.
January 26th, 2009 at 7:38 pmLeftside Annie Says:
“C’mon, KKKarl – time for you to SQUEAL!!!!”
And how right you are….
January 26th, 2009 at 7:41 pmOn Monday, House Judiciary Committee Chairman John Conyers (D-MI) issued a subpoena to Karl Rove, requiring him to testify regarding his role in the Bush Administration’s politicization of the Department of Justice, including the US Attorney firings and the prosecution of former Alabama Governor Don Siegelman. The subpoena calls for Rove to appear at deposition on Monday, February 2, 2009.
What’s funny is that you guys think that Glezzery is actually gonna read the comments.
He’s just like a vagrant dog, comes here, leaves his crap, and goes away.
January 26th, 2009 at 7:57 pmWhy do we have to keep talking about this. Torture is the habitual practice of cowards not heroes. The Republicans have become the genetic equivalent of the Dark Ages nobility and believe that everything they do is mandated from God.
January 26th, 2009 at 8:00 pmtbone Says:
Seriously? We should be so concerned about the MORALE of the intelligence team than the MORAL foundation of torturing? Amazing.
I find a lot of Bush administration policy seems to be based on uninformed speculation about what people will be “emboldened” or “disemboldened” by this or that decision. Nothing to do with actually getting results or what the law is, just making up crap about which people they want to make happy or sad.
.
tbone Says:
If these people are so proud of their “service”, then they should be willing to take the punishment that comes with performing service that is against the law.
Jack Bauer testified to the Senate that he was willing to accept the full legal consequences for his actions. So, “case closed.”
January 26th, 2009 at 8:15 pmIs this the same CIA that did not foresee the collapse of the Soviet Union, the Taliban filling the vacuum left in Afghanistan, Osama attacking in the U.S., that the 10 billion we gave Musharraf might as well have been spent on scratch tickets?
My heroes.
January 26th, 2009 at 8:19 pmAlright , the last time a bush and a thiessen were hocked up they also attempted to overthrow the government of the United States. Fritz Theissen and Prescot Bush and the union banking corporation did business with the nazi’s and were involved in an attempted coup which was foiled by General Schmedly Butler.
January 26th, 2009 at 8:26 pmHere fox news if you can believe it , on the union banking corporation.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,100474,00.html
and this about an article from the BBC
http://aftermathnews.wordpress.com/2007/07/25/bbc-bushs-grandfather-planned-fascist-coup-in-america/
Funny coincidence .
WHere do they get these people from ?
January 26th, 2009 at 8:35 pmElBruce Says:
Jack Bauer testified to the Senate that he was willing to accept the full legal consequences for his actions. So, “case closed.”
When exactly is this show on anyway? I want to watch it so that I can anticipate the next round of Repub. talking points.
January 26th, 2009 at 8:36 pmHell, glazedover is still afraid of the kid who dunked his head in the swimming pool when he was 13 years old.
January 26th, 2009 at 9:00 pmdrick23 Says:
A racist, bigot AND ignorant. Got the con trifecta going I see. Well moron go back to your sewer and revel in how stupid you are. The adults here better things to do than listen to the tantrums of a retarded monkey like you
January 26th, 2009 at 9:03 pmnow this is entertaining bush family history ,
January 26th, 2009 at 9:18 pmhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUe2730GBfs
LOL .
Marc Thiessen will never in his life be humping it on patrol in some God-forsaken country somewhere. The name doesn’t matter. So he’s never going to have the experience of being captured and becoming a prisoner of war. Never being a prisoner of war, he’s never, ever going to confront the consequences of his venal stupidity, that is undergoing torture at the hands of another country, which previously would not have dared to do so until idiots like Marc Thiessen destroyed our example and the international prohibitions against this criminal conduct. But we will, our children will. Thanks, Marc.
January 26th, 2009 at 9:43 pmget it right im not the monkey obama is.
January 26th, 2009 at 9:45 pm—
Are you the one whose genetic fitness precludes you from securing any social standing and by extension matings?
I guess that makes the SS German heros.
January 26th, 2009 at 9:48 pmRepublican heros? Yes. Normal people? No.
January 26th, 2009 at 9:48 pmwhat has always struck as strange about the “ticking bomb” scenario is that no one sees the other option.Your a cop, an m.p.something like that,suppose, after some misgiving, you decide you must torture a suspect, the threat is real the clock is ticking and the info isn’t going to come anyway other way. or so it seems.it sucks. you do it anyway. then,you turn self into the nearest federal court. then,it wouldn’t be just the rule of law standing.
January 26th, 2009 at 9:53 pmdrick23 Says:
You are a liar. I mean when you say you think. You dont THINK, you repeat, thinking is far above your capabilities. You havent got the requisite equipment, by which I mean a functional cerebral cortex. How could it be racist? I have no way of knowing what color you are, I only know how STUPID you are and you are much stupider than a mere retarded child. You are clearly a racist moron. Anyone can see that.
January 26th, 2009 at 10:00 pmcontendre Says:
January 26th, 2009 at 10:02 pmThe truth is even under the ticking bomb scenario why wouldnt he just LIE? You STOP torturing him since you have no way of knowing if its true until you check it out. While you are checking the bomb goes off. His job is done. There is no rational appology for torture. The rightwing just learned everything they know about foriegn policy from watching old John Wayne movie and masterbating to Red Dawn
drick23 Says:
whats wrong with a little water boarding?
____________
Nothing, I suppose, if you don’t mind being in the same class w/ the Khmer Rouge, the Nazis, the Imperial Japanese, and the Inquisition.
High school dropout by any chance?
January 26th, 2009 at 10:13 pmcontendre Says:
what has always struck as strange about the “ticking bomb” scenario is that no one sees the other option.
____________
Every acknowledged expert who talks about this says the same thing…
The only place the “ticking bomb” scenario ever happens is in movies and on “24″.
January 26th, 2009 at 10:15 pmThese Jack Bauer lovers always try to justify the use of torture when there’s a “ticking time bomb scenario.” The problem is that torture has been used (Bush admitting waterboarding KSM, which is a confession to a war crime) and yet there were never any “ticking time bombs”. Therefore, the entire justification for using torture was never met. Besides being a war crime, it makes the use of torture against KSM morally reprehensible and sadistic.
January 26th, 2009 at 10:36 pmDirk, oops sorry drick
January 26th, 2009 at 10:42 pmTorture doesn’t work
I think he does protest toooooooo much!
January 27th, 2009 at 12:08 amBush speechwriter Marc Thiessen should be front and center in any investigation into torture; it appears his fervor speaks volumes. It should be an interesting read.
Torture works about as well as taking a crap in the punch bowl. A bit of temporary relief, but it is humiliating, smells bad and pretty much ruins the party.
January 27th, 2009 at 12:56 amdrick23 Says:
January 27th, 2009 at 2:22 am‘
Spoken like the ignorant soulless punk you are. Rightwing morons like you are BRAINLESS, soulless, hearless and completely without decency
The Republic of Stupidity Says:
contendre Says:
what has always struck as strange about the “ticking bomb” scenario is that no one sees the other option.
____________
Every acknowledged expert who talks about this says the same thing…
The only place the “ticking bomb” scenario ever happens is in movies and on “24?.
The Republicans sure were silent when the ticking time-bomb scenarios came up in the 1960’s in the James Bond movies like Thunderball and You Only Live Twice and then again in the 1980’s in the Thunderball remake, Never Say Never Again. Then again in WarGames. Then again in every superhero comic book known to mankind. Dennis Hopper sure made the ticking time-bomb scenario a nightmare for commuters in the early 1990’s…etc, etc.
But with 24, I just guess the Republicans think it is safe to watch the liberal network TV cabal again after all these years. They can only watch so many Andy Griffith Show, Dean Martin celebrity roasts and Lawrence Welk DVD’s over and over again.
January 27th, 2009 at 3:02 amdrick23 Says:
“whats wrong with a little water boarding?”
Hmm, let’s start with the little problem of breaking about four treaties that the US signed stating that we would never torture and if it did happen, we would prosecute. Let’s follow with the minor inconvenience of the legal uselessness of confessions obtained through this technique. They are inadmissible as evidence in court. Followed closely by the widely reported fact that waterboarding DOES NOT lead to legitimate intel. And then there is that other minor inconvenience…that the fact that we have used this technique has been a great recruiting tool for our enemies. Gee, I can’t come up with ONE positive thing to come from from the use of this extreme act of lawlessness. Oh yeah, it DID give the Bush Administration plenty of excuses to raise the National Security Threat Level, which helped attention away from whatever WH scandal that was about to dominate the news cycle at the time. Hmm, was that really a POSITIVE thing for America or just for the WH/neocons???
January 27th, 2009 at 9:00 amAnswer to terror trolls #4:
If torturing and raping the suspects naked children in front of his eyes works, why not use it?
January 27th, 2009 at 9:14 amAmerican lives might be at stake!
dick23, besides the fact that it’s immoral, illegal, and just plain wrong, there probably isn’t much wrong with torture “if it saves us.” The problem is that it not only
January 27th, 2009 at 10:40 amdoesn’t save us, it incites more hatred and violence against us.
Thanks to our heroic torturers, the Justice Department that covered for them, and the Congress that refused to impeach anybody, many millions more people around the world hate America.
Even our friends and allies wonder what happened to this country’s commitment to justice and human rights.
January 27th, 2009 at 11:10 amdrick23 Says:
sounds like you are the racist. get it right im not the monkey obama is.
That’s funny right there, I don’t care who you are…
Republican talking point memo tactic: if they call you racist, call them racist for calling you racist. Unfortunately drick screwed it up by tacking a racist statement on to the end of it, which is awesome.
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contendre Says:
you do it anyway. then,you turn self into the nearest federal court. then,it wouldn’t be just the rule of law standing.
Sure. Setting aside how ineffective torture is – especially in a “ticking bomb” scenario, and setting aside that those scenarios never happen, if you believe it’s the right thing to do regardless of the law, then you should submit to the legal penalty for doing it. No Republican is actually willing to do that, or allow it to be done to their sadistic heroes.
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drick23 Says:
thumbs up for tortue if it saves us.
What if it doesn’t? Where does your thumb go then? Back in your mouth?
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drick23 Says:
whats wrong with a little water boarding?
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It’s bad.
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drick23 Says:
i guess all the left are neutered.
If by that term you mean “have moral standards and values,” then yes. Of course the villian always claims that the hero’s morality is a form of weakness, shortly before the villian dias.
By the way, what would you call somebody who’s so cowardly he’d have others commit evil acts in his name rather than take a hypothetically slightly higher risk of dying for his country?
January 27th, 2009 at 11:25 amI served in Vietnam ‘66-’67 as a scout with the 25th Inf. Div. Before going to Nam I was stationed in Hawaii, where my Div. was considered the only jungle trained outfit in the Army at that time. We were trained to resist certain torture techniques like the infamous Chinese water torture chest where you were placed in a bamboo box standing up arms at your side so you could not move them. Then they would drip water on your head drip by drip with mosquitoes biting at you and you couldn’t move to scratch. You could only move your head. Drip by drip by drip, until your head felt like it was going to explode, and you were going crazy. Would this Thiesenn ass-hole think that this was not torture if it were done to him? And that the people who were doing it were heroes? Probably yes, but these people who only pay lip service to things that they have no concept of, and have not served their country in the armed services, will always think this way. And any of you people who think that torture saves lives, when the opposite has been proven to be true are just plain uninformed morons.
January 27th, 2009 at 2:54 pm