Card: Health Care Is A ‘Want,’ Not A ‘Need’ — ‘Don’t Have The Government Fund It’
Card: Health Care Is A ‘Want,’ Not A ‘Need’ — ‘Don’t Have The Government Fund It’
During the White House’s health care summit yesterday, President Obama said that “there are those who say we should defer health care reform once again” because they claim “that at a time of economic crisis, we simply can’t afford to fix our health care system as well.” “If we want to create jobs and rebuild our economy and get our federal budget under control, then we have to address the crushing costs of health care this year in this administration,” Obama said of such criticisms.
But while Obama was making the case that health care reform is both “a moral imperative” and “a fiscal imperative,” former Bush chief of staff Andrew Card was arguing on Fox News that reform needs to wait. “We have got a huge crisis in our economy, and I think we have got to solve that problem first,” said Card.
Asked by Neil Cavuto if the health care summit was “a waste of time,” Card responded that instead of working on health care, Obama should “establish a needs commission and fund that which the economy needs, not what everybody wants”:
CAVUTO: What would you do? What would you do? I mean, would you say, Mr. President, I know you are passionate about health care; now is not the time to do it; this thing at the White House now going on now, a waste of time? What?
CARD: I would establish a needs commission and fund that which the economy needs, not what everybody wants.
Let people work hard for their wants, but don’t have the government fund it. Let them fund the needs and restore the economy to a sense of what the appropriate level of risk is.
Watch it:
Card’s argument echoes Rep. Zach Wamp’s (R-TN) claim that health care is “a privilege,” not “a right” for all Americans. But as ThinkProgress noted yesterday, healthcare for Americans cannot — from an economic or a humanitarian standpoint — be viewed as a “privilege” or a simple “want.”
Despite what Card claims, the economic crisis shouldn’t delay health care reform. In fact, it demands reform. As a New America Foundation study has found, “the economic and social impact of inaction” on health care “is high and it will only rise over time.”
Transcript:
CAVUTO: Andrew, you know, at this White House summit on health care, they just applauded Ted Kennedy, of course, the patriarch, if you will, for health care reform in this country.But the president has had a lot of these kind of summits for long, forward-looking problems, health care chief among them. Is he mixing the message here? Is he trying to do too much too soon?
CARD: Well, I think he is trying to do it all. And I don’t fault him for wanting to do it all. It is just that the country does not know what they’re buying right now. And that is because we have got a huge crisis in our economy, and I think we have got to solve that problem first. This is not about wants. It’s about needs.
(CROSSTALK)
CAVUTO: What would you do? What would you do? I mean, would you say, Mr. President, I know you are passionate about health care; now is not the time to do it; this thing at the White House now going on now, a waste of time? What?
CARD: I would establish a needs commission and fund that which the economy needs, not what everybody wants.
Let people work hard for their wants, but don’t have the government fund it. Let them fund the needs and restore the economy to a sense of what the appropriate level of risk is. I think we do — we have gone beyond discovering what the appropriate level of risk is.
If we don’t fund risk, we are not going to grow the economy, so we have got to find out what that level of risk is, rather than just taking everybody’s wants and piling into some spending bill and funding everybody’s wants. That is just the wrong way to go.
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Looks like the full court press by the pharmas and the insurance corporations to stop access to health care for all is just getting warmed up…
…what’s next? Universal health care helps the terrorists? (you think I’m kidding…)
March 6th, 2009 at 3:36 pmIt is my fervent hope that if/when Card wants/needs health care, he does NOT get any, goes for Wamp too.
March 6th, 2009 at 3:37 pmThe next theme song at the Republican National Convention:
“If I Only had a Heart”
March 6th, 2009 at 3:37 pm“A want?”
What if I want life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness?
March 6th, 2009 at 3:38 pmYes, and in a time of crisis Andy Card couldn’t rescue sick hospital and nursing home patients in a drowned New Orleans.
“Rescue is not a right, it’s a privilege. And no you can’t have my or Frances Townsend’s Katrina e-mails.”–Andy the Card
March 6th, 2009 at 3:39 pmCard wants a “needs commission and fund that which the economy needs, not what everybody wants.”
Translation: Corporations need lower income taxes, zero capital gains, and shifting the cost of employee health insurance to workers.
The race to the lowest global common denominator on taxes and worker pay/benefits is on. Andy’s Repugnicants and Blue Dog Damnocrats plan to deliver.
March 6th, 2009 at 3:41 pmFox can only get Bush’s butler on to talk???
Who’s supposed to care what Bush’s butler thinks of healthcare?
March 6th, 2009 at 3:42 pmSo that is the Republican answer to the rising costs to health care????
Brilliant!!!!
Why don’t they just shut up.
March 6th, 2009 at 3:44 pmwhy would anyone listen to andy card? isn’t rush in charge now?
March 6th, 2009 at 3:44 pmAndy, the Constitution states, “…promote the general welfare…”
March 6th, 2009 at 3:44 pmNot a want, a right.
Let’s face it… We are not going to have national healthcare or for that fact any helath care reform. There is no way that the rich insurenc companies and drug makers ar going to allow any reform. They have every Republican and most of the Democratic party in the pockets.
Giving Americans the option of buying medical coverage through the government — an idea put forth by President Barack Obama — is a potential deal breaker for some Republicans and insurance companies whose support would ease the way for a health care overhaul.
March 6th, 2009 at 3:46 pmFertilized egg gets full rights of citizenship, regardless of what it does to a mother’s health. Mother’s health is a mere “want” not a need.
The poor and unemployed may want to be healthy, but unless you can afford it, you’ll just have to suffer and die. And this, from the Party of “Family Values.”
March 6th, 2009 at 3:47 pmFrom my jay slap fight in the Wamp thread:
http://www.nchc.org/facts/cost.shtml
Weird how Universal health care costs less than our circus, huh Mr. Card?
March 6th, 2009 at 3:48 pmbody odor says:
I DO work in health care.
STFU DIPSHIT!
March 6th, 2009 at 3:49 pmWho cares what this idiot thinks? He worked for the fool that got our country into the mess it’s in today.
It’s like asking the Captain of the Titantic what course to steer.
March 6th, 2009 at 3:50 pmPerfect! Let’s ask a leader of the last 8 years of a failed administration what they would do. ROFL!
BTW, more of the “too much too soon” theme now on full display from the right wing nuttery, MSM & GOP!
March 6th, 2009 at 3:50 pmThat’s going to play real well with tens of thousands entering the unemployment lines every day.
http://www.pufferfishblog.com/
March 6th, 2009 at 3:51 pmAnother charm offensive for Limbaugh:
From the Ministry of DaFcukIsWrongWithThesePeople?
March 6th, 2009 at 3:51 pmThis from the anti-abortion Pro Life crowd. You must be born, but after that..your on your own.
March 6th, 2009 at 3:52 pmhysterical exaggeration, Mr. Obomber.
like, really hysterical.
March 6th, 2009 at 3:53 pm@barack obomber Says:
…it can’t be free…lets just make everything government funded…free broadband, food, clothes, cable gas cars tvs shoes !!!
______
Precisely where in the federal policy debate are the proposals to make health care (putting aside the rest of your red herrings) “free”?
Linky?
The adult discussion is all about how too make it more accessible and more effective at a lower net cost.
March 6th, 2009 at 3:53 pm.
My tooth hurts and eating pains me…
… I want it fixed and need to eat!
.
March 6th, 2009 at 3:54 pmOk, I’ll just tell my grandfather that he doesn’t need those diabetes medications, and tell my grandmother that she doesn’t really need that chemo for her rapidly metastasisizing (sp?) breast cancer. I’ll get right on that.
March 6th, 2009 at 3:55 pm.
What a card…
… That Andy is.
.
March 6th, 2009 at 3:55 pmHey Card, you were there on 9/11 whispering into the president’s ear.
And now with three 9/11’s happening every year with 18,000 Americans dying without health care, you say “Don’t fund it”
But it was okay to spend 1,000,000 million dollars in Iraq. How many people could have been given health care with the money your president’s administration spent blowing holes in the Iraqi sands?
Stupid, stupid, stupid…….
March 6th, 2009 at 3:56 pmAnd if these scumbags did not have healthcare they would be screaming to high heaven for the government to fix it.
FTR (fcuk the republicans)
March 6th, 2009 at 3:57 pmWell if El Rushbo keeps packing on the pounds, he’s bound to stroke out or drop of a heart attack. So, the poll is: would it be better for Rush to drop dead? Or live the rest of his life in bed, unable to talk or move, but still be conscious enough to know what is going on?
March 6th, 2009 at 3:59 pm@barack obomber Says:
everything can’t be free.
______
Again, where is that being proposed by the Obama administration? Links, Oh Wise One?
March 6th, 2009 at 4:00 pmbarack obomber Says:
everything can’t be free.
No one’s talking about it being free… we’re talking about providing insurance for ALL Americans, like other industrialized nations. Something that will help citizens (who will be healthier and happier), doctors and hospitals(who will no longer have to fight insurance companies and cover indignant patients costs) and businesses.(who will not see their balance sheets destroyed by out of control health care costs)
And that’s something I’d be willing to pay for with my taxes… the only ones who believe in ‘free ponies’ and ‘magic invisible hands’ are you Conservatives…
March 6th, 2009 at 4:00 pmDontcha love these sh@t for brains spin specialists for the most corrupt and inept administration ever giving us advice on what we need? Card and Flieisher both should go to jail along with Bush, Rove, and Gonzales and gang. They are pathetic failures who should just stfu and stay quiet.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:00 pmThis whole debate is incredibly surreal. What do people need more than basic medical care? They need food, water, and basic shelter of course. But, is our goal to compete with a third world nation or to continue the standard of living we’ve come to expect in this country? It is shameful that in the only superpower in the world anyone should go without essential medical care.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:00 pm12. barack obomber Says: it is obvious that none of you work in heathcare. working in the pharma industry free health care sucks. lets see your industry be forced to not make a profit and how you like it. people have jobs because health costs money. it can’t be free. this “progress” attitude leads to long waiting lines crappy care, and more lazy people living off the system…heehaw…heehaw…
Soo the quality of US health care ranks #37, while France is #1.
Please explain….
March 6th, 2009 at 4:01 pmWhen these these loud-mouthed oafs are willing to give up their health benefits, paid for by the people, then they might deserve to voice their selfish opinions.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:02 pmGiving Americans the option of buying medical coverage through the government — an idea put forth by President Barack Obama — is a potential deal breaker for some Republicans and insurance companies whose support would ease the way for a health care overhaul.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:02 pmWell, I don’t know as I see health care as a “right”, but I certainly don’t view it as a “privilege”. It is certainly a “need” more than a “want”.
As to right/privilege, I think it’s neither. What it is, much like roads, police, firefighting, mail delivery, food safety and so many other things, is something of such general utility and importance to society that its universality can only be questioned by the most extreme radicals. It is one of those things that any normal, healthy and mature post-industrial society sees as such a benefit to its members, all of them, that it is farcical to imagine withholding it from anyone.
Unfortunately, it seems that we are not members of a normal, healthy and mature post-industrial society, as we are raised to believe. The above forementioned radicals have wormed their way into places of disproportionate influence, and would have us revert to truly prehistoric societal norms. They would happily discard all that mankind has learned over the last hundred thousand years, and have their golden rule, “I Grabbed It! It’s Mine! I’ll Kill You!” tower above any other consideration.
Time to get rid of the radicals. They have shown themselves, time and again, to be incapable of governing for the general good, or even playing well with others. A greater and greater majority of the American people realize this. There is no more reason to let them drive policy in any significant way.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:05 pmDoes Andrew Card have ANY influence on how this gets legislated? Does he get to vote on it ? Debate it on the House floor? Is he testifying to Congress about it?
March 6th, 2009 at 4:05 pmTHEN WHY ARE WE PAYING ATTENTION TO WHAT HE SAYS???
HE IS IRRELEVANT !!!!
COProgressive,
My question has always been…
… How could they stay at Emma E. Booker Elementary school on September 11, 2001 for over 30 minutes when America was under attack? One would think the S.S. would have rushed the president away from a public location where just days before, press notices were made about the president’s arrival.
More so, how did the S.S. know that Bush WAS in a secure location by remaining at Emma E. Booker Elementary school on September 11, 2001?
What? They didn’t want to frighten the children?
Is this why they propped them up, mixed in with adults, as his background when announcing that “AMERICA IS UNDER ATTACK”…
… For the effect?
.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:06 pmbarack obomber Says:
——————————————————————————–
it is obvious that none of you work in heathcare. working in the pharma industry free health care sucks. lets see your industry be forced to not make a profit and how you like it. people have jobs because health costs money. it can’t be free. this “progress” attitude leads to long waiting lines crappy care, and more lazy people living off the system.
lets just make everything government funded. lets take your job and have it free for all.
=============================================================
I am one of the 4.4 million who lost a position in the past six months. I have a prescription that I take daily as preventative measure. It Costs me $450 each time I get it re-filled wich is cheaper than COBRA. I have discussed this with the Pharma company who sympathizes with me but is trying to reagain their R&D costs while they can.
As far as free, what do you GOP morons call no bid contracts for useless, unlawful, and immoral wars for oil? That is okay but helping the US citizens with something that every one of will need at some point in time is out of the question for you. Goes to prove why your party is led by a couple of college flunk outs who spew hate on the radio dial. Your party is dead. You had your chance and failed. I am flagging you as abusive and ignorant.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:09 pmB.O.
1) I, like Uncle Ho, WORK in the health care field.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:12 pm2) If everyone has access to health care, then EVERYONE can get their prescriptions filled, which would increase big pharma’s revenue. Who’s going to purchase those extra meds? Why pharmacies, of course. And are pharmacies going to get a discount from big pharma? Of course not.
3) You stink, you mucking foron!
So it’s a privilege?
So what about the cops? What about firefighters?
Are those privileges too?
I don’t remember anyone being charged for a cop to respond to a rape call and getting told, that will be $2,500.00 per incident. What about getting robbed? How much should they charge us to respond to a robbery?
What you don’t have police insurance?
How about firefighter insurance?
House burning down? Could have been a precondition such as old wiring. Firemen don’t cover that. Be glad, if your house is up to code and no pre-conditions, then we’ll be glad to put your house fire out for a nominal charge of $7,500.00 but you have to have proof of firefighters insurance.
F U C K – R E P U B L I C A N S !
March 6th, 2009 at 4:15 pmb.o.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:15 pmYou obviously know not what you speak of.
I’ve got 45 minutes left before I depart my office.
Shall we dance?
@justme Says:
Well, I don’t know as I see health care as a “right”, but I certainly don’t view it as a “privilege”. It is certainly a “need” more than a “want”.
________
During the debates, McSame called it a “privilege,” and Obama called it a “right.”
Obama was correct. As a matter of settled law, it is in fact a “right.” But, a right of last resort. You first have to spend down to abject penury to avail yourself of the right.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:15 pmbomber troll — the issue here is the burdensome cost of health care to individuals and businesses. There is no such thing as free health care, what’s at issue is how to stop the cost overruns and how to divide the costs.
I could change my progressive views to conservative in 20 years (which I won’t), but one thing is certain: I will never take up the view that health care should be for-profit. You will never convince me that it’s ok for hospitals to dump people out on the street.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:15 pmBuckarooBanzai Says:
Andy, the Constitution states, “…promote the general welfare…”
Not a want, a right.
And don’t forget our rights to “life, liberty…”. Without adequate health care many people in this country are deprived of their right to live.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:19 pmbarack obomber Says:
It is very amusing and ironic tat your lifeline , George Soros, is provideing your very paychecks from his profiteering in the stock market and corporations. Its very simple stop those and you are gone.
I don’t think SO-SO-SO-SOROS!! has much to worry about, but do you really think that if offering government insurance causes private insurers some heartbreak, that we’re going to lose sleep at night for dismantling the scam-artist segment of our economy?
March 6th, 2009 at 4:20 pm33. fletc3her Says: This whole debate is incredibly surreal. What do people need more than basic medical care? They need food, water, and basic shelter of course. But, is our goal to compete with a third world nation or to continue the standard of living we’ve come to expect in this country? It is shameful that in the only superpower in the world anyone should go without essential medical care.
There is another aspect here that has been consistently overlooked.
Allegiance.
If America leaves their citizens twisting in the wind, treating them with royal contempt and generally regarding them as an inconvenience, from whence does loyalty sustain?
If the government, who fully expects to be protected by her citizens, stands by while they’re ground into mucilage in the feeding frenzy marketplace, with no available recourse, why then would the abused citizens want to rescue/defend an accomplice in their oppression?
I’d much sooner defend a government that values her citizens by enabling a health care structure that doesn’t allow and rely on cutthroat corporations burning through client’s lives to facilitate staggering profits. A government that cares about my health will gain respect and allegiance in return. Such a government will stand far longer by not fostering bureaucratic ennui.
A government that values their citizens’ health will cultivate the devotion of a Nation to work to defend and perpetuate such a beneficial governing structure.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:23 pmb.o.’s just a-whoopin’ on them there straw fellers.
“hey maw! lookie here how ah-kin whoop me a straw feller!!”
“enough now!, hunni! – paw’s gonna git mighty riled when he finds feed scattered all hither and yon! – you git in here now and wash up fer yer home-schoolin’ time!”
March 6th, 2009 at 4:23 pmCO Progressive,
March 6th, 2009 at 4:23 pmI agree with you, but your figures are not quite right. It is 38,000 Americans dying every year because they don’t have heath care. That is a 9/11 every month in the loss of life. I expect that number to rise dramatically since unemployment rates are increasing so rapidly. I got the figure 38,000 from the PBS documentary Critical Condition. Additionally, the PBS article Basic facts about the uninsured” points out that a majority of the uninsured are actually minorities and we all know how much Republicancers care about minorities.
And Barack Obomber, you might want to lay off eating the lead paint chips.
Yeah Skittles,
March 6th, 2009 at 4:23 pmbecause we as a nation did so well during the heat wave of 1995 in Chicago, killing over 700
Hello?
March 6th, 2009 at 4:26 pmb.o.?
Let’s go!
We have a system that says that if you have a heart problem, you can’t get insurance for it.
We have a system that, if you are too poor to get health insurance, you get charged as much as TEN TIMES what someone with insurance gets charged.
We have a system where a standard non-experimental operation costs as much as an Ivy-league education.
We have a system that has as policy refusing payment for treatments and delays in payment for no justifiable reason, and with no recourse.
A liberal is a conservative who has had to deal with the health care system.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:26 pmAllow me to make another point.
We put all these potential doctors through all these tax-payer funded medical schools, only for them to be fed to the big-money psyche. I think Wayne (Schneider) made a point the other day, that if you’re into the most human profession of all only to make boatloads of money, you shouldn’t be anywhere near patients.
Besides, I can recall glancing over government job postings offering 200k+ for physicians and researchers. That’s a very good salary at any rate.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:27 pmgeez nettles, you’re right. we’ve probably already got way better than we should ever have hoped for in the first place. we shouldn’t even pause to compare – it’s just futile.
“#1 means #1, and we are #1, and have the ball cap to prove it, and that’s all we need.”
March 6th, 2009 at 4:27 pmbarack obomber Says:
it is obvious that none of you work in heathcare. working in the pharma industry free health care sucks. lets see your industry be forced to not make a profit and how you like it. people have jobs because health costs money. it can’t be free. this “progress” attitude leads to long waiting lines crappy care, and more lazy people living off the system.
You haven’t a clue what you are talking about. How do you have any experience in “free health care”. Do you live in Canada?
And what about a universal health care system would stop people from making a profit and from people having jobs? Also, I don’t believe that anyone is proposing that a universal health care plan be free. I believe the notion is to charge people what they can afford to pay. I don’t have a problem with that. As a matter of fact I would be happy to pay more than someone else as long as everyone has health care.
It makes me very sad that we live in a country that has so little respect and caring for its citizens. By saying that health care is a privilege and not a right, you are really saying that living is a privilege and not a right because many people die each day for lack of health care.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:28 pmWe will now find out how many of our congress are actually sucking on the health insurance company teat because the only ones to really benefit by not going to a single payer health care system are the health insurance companies. A manufacturer would actually benefit from single payer health care because he would not have to add in the cost of health insurance to the price of their products. Hence a more competitively priced product.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:28 pmArchie B Says:
DRxJ
How much oxy do you dole out in a day?
Okay, I’m curious. Why?
March 6th, 2009 at 4:31 pmIn all seriousness, I don’t see how the French heat wave situation is at all an indictment of the health care system. To my memory, most of those deaths were due to eldery people living on their own in a setting without air conditioning. If they were in homes or were under the care of a health care professional, then yes, that would be an indictment.
Correct me if I am wrong.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:31 pmcoming directly to you from the same scumbags who believe having a child is not a “choice” then vote against healthcare for children.
we need to consider the source for most of the sheeyat repukies say on faux
March 6th, 2009 at 4:31 pmPlease contract a nasty form of cancer, lose your health insurance and see if you need or want medical care…Yerk
March 6th, 2009 at 4:33 pmDRxJ Says:
Archie B Says:
DRxJ
How much oxy do you dole out in a day?
Okay, I’m curious. Why?
ooohhh let me field this one: because he’s doctor shopping like the leader of the repukie party tub-o-lard. hillbilly heroin addicts can go far in the repukie party and archie wants in
March 6th, 2009 at 4:33 pm50. Nettles Says: Hanshiro- A little “Devils Advocate” here:
France may be ranked #1 overall, but I seem to remember France’s elderly dropping like hot rocks a couple of summers ago.
If the world’s #1 nationalized health service can’t see their elderly through a heat-wave, what can we expect from nationalized health care here?
Extremely misleading argument nettles. This has little to do with their health care system and everything to do with an extraordinary event: a heat wave that was visited on an area that maintained very mild summers.
That any health care system would be caught up short is a consequence of unexpected events. Can you say ‘Katrina?’ To blame the #1 system for the resultant deaths in an extraordinary heatwave is disingenuous. Further, a variety of factors contributed to the crisis. The health care system was not the sticking point.
Please make better arguments, Nettles.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:34 pmThe free-marketeers still haven’t explained why drug-importation (negotiating) from Canada is a bad thing. I remember their selected excuse was that it would be unsafe or that it would overburden the FDA. That’s laughable — for eight-years, the right-wingers had been weakening the FDA.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:34 pmwags, that was the point of my link from 1995.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:34 pmSkittles was lambasting France, yet failed to look into his own backyard.
And for the record, both were a result of negligence for the elderly, the immobile, the bedridden.
What does health care have to do with people dying of heat in thier homes. I guess you think those people died in the hospital……figures, dumbass.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:35 pmarch and bo,
no stem cell
cures for you!
*
bye, trolls.
:)
March 6th, 2009 at 4:36 pmSkarecro@44:
March 6th, 2009 at 4:37 pmOriginally, firefighting was done on that basis: you can still see in museums fire medallions that people would put on their houses to identify which for-profit company was to take care of which house.
That system was responsible for the frequency of disastrous fires in American cities in the 19th century. It was a disaster.
nettles,
you too.
:)
March 6th, 2009 at 4:37 pmArchie B,
March 6th, 2009 at 4:37 pmFantasize much?
Normally, when one is “banging”, one is not usually conversing about job descriptions.
Just sayin…
Archie B Says:
Just curious. I banged a np the other night and we talked about her work a little bit. She said she mostly dealt with people seeking drugs all day long and the most sought after drug was oxy. She said it’s on back order most of the time. I couldn’t believe what she was telling me!
Does anybody know what this troll is babbling about and how it remotely defends for-profit “health” care.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:39 pmDRxJ,
March 6th, 2009 at 4:39 pmmaybe she was looking to score some oxy in an effort to make archie more bearable. just a thought.
This all looks like the gop is once again on the wrong side. Americans want this and most are seeing the result of the last attempt by the gop to stop it..
more gop circular firing squads. Make sure they have live ammo.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:39 pmI have Republicans and Libertarians in my family, and I’ve become much mellower and accepting since the Reagan years. But every time I hear crap like this, I get madder and madder.
Perhaps that’s their strategy, believing that rage prevents coherent action. But I’m getting much, much closer to thinking “eat the rich.”
March 6th, 2009 at 4:40 pmSo fox&friends brings on Andy Card to coment on health care and the economy.
Wasn’t Joe the dumber available ?
March 6th, 2009 at 4:41 pmAnd Archie B,
just for future reference, nurse practitioners and physician assistants CAN NOT prescribe schedule 2 narcotics (OxyContin), only physicians with a controlled substance license.
To help you with your stories later.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:41 pmUsing Andy Card’s lingo that health care is a want and not a right:
Does Richard Scott’s group need to change their name from “Conservatives for Patients’ Rights” to:
Conservative for Patients’ Wants
March 6th, 2009 at 4:41 pmnp….a normal palm? as opposed to your usual?
March 6th, 2009 at 4:42 pmFred says:
np….a normal palm? as opposed to your usual?
LOL!
March 6th, 2009 at 4:44 pmYes, for Archie, using his left hand is like cheating!
Let’s take away the “nationalization” of health care for a moment trolls. (That isn’t my first option, by the way). The main issue is INSURANCE. Why do we have so many people uninsured? Why are premiums/deductibles/copays so high? Is there a systemic factor? Why do insurance companies charge fees to doctors offices and hospitals just to be able to file claims? Why should the ability to receive good health care linked to employment/unemployment? Many questions here.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:44 pmArchie B Says:
DRxJ Says:
Nice diversion.
*
jealous?
**
March 6th, 2009 at 4:48 pmPoor archie, his only sexual encounters are those he makes up in his little brain and cares to share on a public forum.
Gotta suck to be that pathetic.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:49 pmagain, judging from this convesation, seems like archie’s trying to score some oxy. fess up archie, are you tub-o-lard’s limbaugh’s new maid?
March 6th, 2009 at 4:49 pmStop banging the neoprene plastics Arch, they recalled most of them, as they give you incurable rashes.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:50 pmArchie BHead Says:
DRxJ Says:
Nice diversion.
Thank you.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:50 pmCare to discuss the topic, or would you like more info for your Oxy addiction?
Oh, and stop conversing with them, people will think you’re nutz.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:50 pmYou can’t divert from nothingness. You can only make fun of it.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:50 pmFor Shame Mr. Barker. Andrew Card is NOT “Bush’s butler” as you so classlessly put it. He’s more of a “Gentleman’s Gentleman” (no actual gentlemen were harmed by the sarcasm of this post).
March 6th, 2009 at 4:51 pmCard? Suit? Republican toady? “My house on the shore depends on me being a suck up” Card?
Maybe there is something good on TV.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:51 pmArchie B Says:
You’re wrong. Nice diversion, though. Must not be too proud of all the oxy you dole out……
*
oxy,
that’s limbaugh
drug of choice, isn’t it?
and viagra – for his kibbles
‘n bits and all boy caribbean vacations.
*
have fun arch.
don’t forget your sun screen!
:)
March 6th, 2009 at 4:51 pm“Card: Health Care Is A ‘Want,’ Not A ‘Need’ — ‘Don’t Have The Government Fund It’”
Andrew Card is an idiot. First, Card blast Obama’s dress code in the White House and now he is getting to lecture the American people about healthcare being a want and not a need? And this is coming out of a mouth of a moron who was brought and paid for by Bush who gave him a cushy job after Bush left office. Card is certainly earning his money.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:52 pmArchie B Says:
California
* General authority to prescribe is evidenced by inclusion on the prescription of the prescriber’s title and state-issued Rx #
* All prescriptions must show collaborating physician’s name
* Authority to prescribe controlled substances includes Schedule II-V as specified in collaborative practice agreement
Debunking lawyers on one thread and debunking dr’s on another. Jeeez!
*
memorized?
**
you dittohead druggies!
:)
March 6th, 2009 at 4:53 pmThe other side is, Andy, when the cyst and or licking there of, gets to be painful, don’t run to the ER. They are supposed to help you but it is real difficult when they are laughing so hard.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:54 pmarchie are you tom delady the exterminator dude who USED to be majority whip? with all the debugging you’re doing, just wondering.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:55 pmOn another board that Ive frequented for over four years there’s a freaking LIBERTARIAN that wants single payer now. (and he is no LINO)
Pretty much all reasonable people agree that the current system is completely broken and hurting the economy.
March 6th, 2009 at 4:56 pmArchie B Says:
they recalled most of them, as they give you incurable rashes.
—————–
TMI, buddy.
*
tmi?
*
arch, a recent graduate
of the joey buttafuoco
school of texting.
**
bff’s?
:)
March 6th, 2009 at 4:56 pmFrom Archie BHead’s own unlinked source:
All prescriptions must show collaborating physician’s name
Must show physician’s name, NOT the nurse practitioners name.
Debunked DENIED!
March 6th, 2009 at 4:56 pmarchie,
March 6th, 2009 at 5:00 pmyou’ve been handed your ass on a silver platter with a carrot shoved in your sphincter on this issue. give it up before you look really pathetic.
Well, in Archie BHead “polishing his bishop” defense, I am stating Michigan Law, and am not privy to the other states.
That being said, I am bummed that less than an hour ago, I issued a challenge, and no antagonist could respond (well, without the Oxy diversion).
Too bad, the topic is one I feel I excel at.
Oh well, always hope for next week.
Later all!
March 6th, 2009 at 5:01 pmDRxJ, especially when the nurse is a blow up neoprene doll.
March 6th, 2009 at 5:01 pmThe only thing you have debunked is the theory that all humans think…
March 6th, 2009 at 5:02 pmOh Oh Oh! Pick me! What was the challenge? Im feeling argumentative as hell!
(stuck at the office and might miss watchmen =( )
March 6th, 2009 at 5:03 pmBut let me guess, Andrew Card has health care for life because he was in the fed gov, right??? And we the taxpayers are paying for his health care, right????? Plus he’s just another flithy rich Repug that doesn’t need the ’socialist’ health care that he gets (and probably his family too) because we pay for it. Yet the greedy bastard does not want all citizens to have health care.
The problem with these people is they feel the are above everyone else. They think they deserve health care and ‘pensions’ and all of it but average hard working citizens don’t. They are the ‘elite’ that they are always trying to accuse others of being. They think they are royalty.
It’s too bad that the greedy fat bastards have always been in control of this country -from day one. Nothing has changed.
March 6th, 2009 at 5:09 pmThey own the media
They own the gov
They own our carcasses -we are still slave labor -just barely making it while these a-holes have multiple houses and never work an honest day in their lives!
These right wing morons cry about how everybody will have to pay more if taxes are raised on business. Well my business doesn’t have to pay any taxes because my health insurance bills are so high I’ll never make a profit. And I can’t afford to hire the two more people who’d help earn a profit because I’d have to pay for their insurance and can’t afford it.
These idiots can’t figure out that everything they buy and every service they use has health insurance costs in it. No matter how slow business is you still have to pay for health insurance. They’re so worried about paying higher taxes but in the meantime they’re paying much more for everything else they buy.
March 6th, 2009 at 5:09 pmCard: Health Care Is A ‘Want,’ Not A ‘Need’ — ‘Don’t Have The Government Fund It’
Tell that to the families of 18,000 to 40,000 who lost a loved one each year because of no access to health care.
‘Don’t Have The Government Fund It’??????
aren’t they wishing the funds are not there….?
We could find the funds if we dumped all the for profit insurance co and paid premiums directly to medicare.
We could find more funds if we did not pay over 50% of our tax money to the pentagon. No other country but US does this.
March 6th, 2009 at 5:11 pmIf President Obama spends all of our taxpayer dollars to help America and Americans then there won’t have any money left to pay for wars in the Middle East for Israel. That sounds good to me.
March 6th, 2009 at 5:21 pmjust another nincompoop rebublican who doesn’t understand that health care, along with education, is not a privledge, but a right that we all should have.
March 6th, 2009 at 5:21 pmWhat are you babbling about. Controlled substances in California require a triplicate subscription form numbered and reviewed by the state. They make you fill out a form for cold medicine and still won’t let you buy more than two at a time. You’re an idiot.
March 6th, 2009 at 5:29 pmThat’s good because both of you are idiots. A nurse practitioner wouldn’t be able to even dispense a controlled substance if somebody else wrote the perscription. You’re an idiot.
March 6th, 2009 at 5:33 pmSure Nettles, it wasn’t the heat that killed them in France it was the health care.
March 6th, 2009 at 5:34 pmMy wife is a RN/NP here in California for Kaiser Hospital in San Jose.
Guess what DIPSHIT? She cannot write prescriptions.
Shayne, she can despense them however.
March 6th, 2009 at 5:38 pmAll of Card’s ass-clanging buddies, lobbyists and drooling hangers-on came out of the wood work on this one…Card should be paying attention to the two top layers of scum on Chimpys pig farm pond instead of bothering us with his NeoNut crap….
Go away..You’re DONE…
March 6th, 2009 at 5:41 pmWhenever someone makes statements which are divisive, regressive, racist, or just plain hateful, they always seem to be on Fox.
March 6th, 2009 at 5:41 pmObviously, Card and Wamp don’t know what it’s like to live without health insurance or what it’s like to be under insured. These guys are way out of touch with reality. I wonder which drug and insurance companies are paying them for making their objections known?
March 6th, 2009 at 5:46 pmDRxJ Says:
Well, in Archie BHead
It’s not BHead, it’s Archie Blowsgoats…LOL
March 6th, 2009 at 5:46 pmI know RNs can but I didn’t think NPs were necessarily RNs.
March 6th, 2009 at 5:48 pmIt is a fact of life (to date). The US is where you go to die. The Country that has the greatest resources for research, the most advanced hospital system in the world and the highest fatality rate for those admitted.
Can anyone say Yeah?
March 6th, 2009 at 5:50 pmWho wants the privilege of a terrible disease?
Leave it to repugs, the rich are the only ones allowed to get sick.
March 6th, 2009 at 5:50 pmHave you ever heard of Medicare? The Federal government already HEAVILY subsidizes the health care of the elderly. In a free market, no for profit insurer would touch most of them.
If medicare covered everybody, sure your medicare tax would go up, BUT YOU WOULDN’T HAVE TO PAY A HEALTH PREMIUM. Also, we’d be able to pay doctors a MUCH better fee schedule.
March 6th, 2009 at 5:56 pmArchie still hangs out with Jugheads it seems.
March 6th, 2009 at 5:59 pmShayne,
March 6th, 2009 at 6:08 pmI stand corrected. My wife just got her NP certification. She has not yet submitted her forms to allow her to write prescriptions.
NP’s begin as RN’s. You can become an RN after the proper training usually 2 years with an associates degree. Another 2 years of training netted her a Masters and NP certification.
So that should put the question to rest. At least here in California (Differs from state to state)NP can prescribe level II drugs. My apologies to Archie for calling him a dipshit, still a dumbass though ;-)
oh, this is rich. Card is such a tool.
March 6th, 2009 at 6:38 pmCard will change his tune when the bill for his manboob reduction job comes due
March 6th, 2009 at 6:43 pm118. Nettles Says:
@ #67 Hanshiro: I stand by my point. 15 thousand elderly die of heat-related causes in a nation of 60-some million(?). Correlate those number’s to America (about 6 times the size of France, no?), that’s 90 thousand elderly deaths in a summer. DR &J says that these death were blamed on “negligence of the elderly, the bedridden, etc”.
Doesn’t matter if you stand by calling precipitation ‘God’s tears,’ it doesn’t transform an errant conclusion into a viable cause/effect precis. You ahven’t presented any case for direct or indirect causation. In other words, you got bupkis.
Elaborating on comparative stats also doesn’t add weight to your contention, it actually fuels the inherent weakness of you position when you have to fill out a bad, unsupported premise with superfluous jibba-jabba.
My question: Will it not be the job of our National Health Service (sounds very UK)to do just that? Care for the elderly and the bedridden?
This incredibly fallacious assertion over the French heatwave is tantamount to claiming that anyone who dies as a result of an extraordinary and anomalous event is directly attributable to the negligence of a hospital or health system. This is nothing short of asinine, particularly when your post does not reflect the numerous and overriding facts or establish any causation whatsoever.
Obviously, to cling to such a weak averment, you have some stake in discouraging Universal health care, or is it the superiority of the French model that annoys you so much that you are compelled to resort to what is known as a ‘fallacy of necessity?’ And additionally charging “cum hoc ergo propter hoc” (Latin for “with this, therefore because of this”)
I could make as ‘compelling’ a case to claim that since we lose millions of acres, property and lives to forest fires every year, the fire department obviously needs to be dismantled and privatized. After all, aren’t they supposed to protect us from fire? Isn’t that an indictment of the fire department when people die?
Nettles, your case is without a shred of merit. Standing by such a comic assertion without proving (or in this case the ability to prove) any direct causation just makes you a loiterer.
March 6th, 2009 at 7:00 pmCard is pissed that he and the rest of the Bush Crime Family may be going to jail soon, for war crimes.
March 6th, 2009 at 7:00 pmAndy Card and all the other republicans who think health care is not a necessity for Americans should do their part and save the system — drop dead!!
March 6th, 2009 at 7:03 pmSeems Archie is still playing with Jughead
March 6th, 2009 at 7:04 pm143. Archie B Says: You’re either one or the other, not both. A NP is one step from a doctor. A RN is much lower.
This is not correct. An NP is between an RN and a doctor. The next step up from RN is NP.
I asked an RN.
March 6th, 2009 at 7:11 pmArchie B Says:
You’re either one or the other, not both. A NP is one step from a doctor. A RN is much lower.
Bzzzt.
That’s from the Oregon State Board of Nursing.
March 6th, 2009 at 7:23 pmHealth care is a “want”, not a need?
:|
I wonder what his position is on breathing?
March 6th, 2009 at 7:37 pmWell, I want health care. And I need health care.
I guess Card must have pretty good insurance.
March 6th, 2009 at 7:40 pmBloviating imbecile Andy Card is at it again! He knows absolutely nothing about health care but injects his bullshit just the same.
March 6th, 2009 at 7:44 pmArchie B Says:
You’re either one or the other, not both. A NP is one step from a doctor. A RN is much lower.
You can’t actually read, can you?
Nurse practitioners are Registered Nurses with specialized graduate (Masters) level study within the specific scopes of practice for which they are licensed.
What part of “Nurse practitioners are Registered Nurses” is stumping you, exactly?
March 6th, 2009 at 7:46 pmI guess I just “want” to live, I don’t necessarily “need” to live. Because lack of health care is a life or death situation for many in this country.
March 6th, 2009 at 7:54 pmCard is not only ignorant and stupid, he is evil.
March 6th, 2009 at 8:08 pmAs a member of chimpy’s cabinet, Andy would have received the best care our tax dollars provide, at the best hospitals, from the best doctors. I thank him for his frankness and honesty, because he could not have laid out the bankruptcy and perversity of the republican position more clearly for the American people. “I’ve got mine, fcuk you!” is the anthem of civilizational collapse, not growth. America’s watching, Andy.
March 6th, 2009 at 8:30 pmVoice from the past,
March 6th, 2009 at 10:09 pm.
.
cryptic obscurantism doesn’t make one mysterious,
.
.
.
it just cloaks an inability
.
.
to substantively add
.
.
to the dialogue.
By God he’s right! If they want government health care, let ‘em join the military! A healthy empire will bring healthy bodies.
March 6th, 2009 at 10:27 pmGeez. I have to be honest.
March 6th, 2009 at 11:15 pm.
..
but speaking in the third
is one thing….
..
.
.
but this really isn’t my format…
.
.
.
.
March 6th, 2009 at 11:16 pm.
.
Still when in Rome…
Wow. They can’t even change their words, these conservatives… I heard DAvid Brooks saying the exact same talking points today on the radio…
March 6th, 2009 at 11:25 pmOh, and rachel.
STFU!
Thank you.
March 6th, 2009 at 11:28 pmIf I may, before this thread gets taken over by an irrelevant poster.
Upon research (and yes, I’m at work), it appears that California would allow Nurse Practitioners to write prescriptions for Schedule II narcotics if they passed a specialized continuing educational course.
So, being that there are 49 other states, and assuming that our antagonist Archie BHead lived in California, it’s possible that he could have “banged” a “np”, although she would have to be certified. My bull$hit radar tells me differently, however. More than likely, he knows a friend who has a sister who knows a doctor who dated a nurse who once knew a nurse practitioner who once prescribed OxyContin!
Oh, I see b.o. conveniently arrived 3 hours and 45 minutes after I said I’d be departing.
March 6th, 2009 at 11:28 pmNot so fast, little one! I will challenge you another time, another post, if you got the balls!
Speech. context.
Spellcheck.
March 6th, 2009 at 11:28 pmOH, and rachel.
March 6th, 2009 at 11:30 pmShut the FCK up!
Whoah!
March 6th, 2009 at 11:31 pmTime warping is cool when you’re working at 11:27 at night!
The GOP regards all of life’s basic necessities as “privileges” that only people of status deserve. If they had their way, the poor and disenfranchised would be denied food and oxygen as well.
March 6th, 2009 at 11:43 pm188 ROX
March 6th, 2009 at 11:55 pmBilbo Hussein Baggins Says:
I guess I just “want” to live, I don’t necessarily “need” to live. Because lack of health care is a life or death situation for many in this country.
March 6th, 2009 at 7:54 pm
TP, I highly recommend this as the ‘featured comment.’ What a simple, succinct summary of what’s so wrong with die-hard conservatives.
Nicely done, Bilbo!
March 7th, 2009 at 1:59 amIt is CORRECT that healthcare is NOT a right.
I read no where in the Constitution of the United States that healthcare is a right. The Constitution is NOT subject to interpretation, no matter what all your slimy lawyer friends tell you.
Obama’s plan will never pass. Too expensive. The solution is to user the private sector to build coverage groups. I am not willing to pay for your healthcare. I already do, in increased costs because uncovered ppl use the emergency room for every sneeze and sniffle. If you are educated, instead of wasting time saving the world, go get a job with a company that provides coverage and benefits. Simple.
March 7th, 2009 at 2:46 amre: orange
King Arthur said it best in Monty Python and the Holy Grail..
“What an eccentric performance.”
March 7th, 2009 at 3:47 amHealthcare, anywhere in the world, should be driven by altruism, not capitalism. If you became a doctor just to make a lot of money for yourself, then I don’t care how good you are or how sick I am, I do not want you near me.
Healthcare should not be a for-profit industry, subject to the whims and desires of the elite few who makes millions of dollars off the sick and dying.
March 7th, 2009 at 3:50 amIf Obama’s “healthcare reform” means HMO mandates and NOT a single payer national health plan, then Card is correct, we don’t NEED it.
March 7th, 2009 at 9:18 amUnfortunately Obama caved in to the insurance lobby this past Thursday and officially has rejected ANY national single payer plan outright. More HMOs folks. Hold onto to you ankles ‘cuz you’ll be FORCED to buy their policies.
Unfortunately one of the biggest problems with nationalized health care in the US is that we have way too many people with personality disorders, who would overuse/abuse the system. I’m talking about the people who didn’t get their emotional/nurturing needs met when being raised, and consequently use the healthcare system to get those emotional/nurturing attention needs met. The people who are constantly going to the Dr. or ER, constantly seeking medical attention, constantly coming up with somatic complaints, and needing some sort of surgery every couple of years. You know who they are. I think the US has more mentally ill people per capita than any other developed nation. We are sick.
March 7th, 2009 at 10:04 amOne of the things Card did during the Bush administration was help corporations get rid of their ergonomic programs. He’s a premier scumbag. I don’t believe a word he says about anything. He’s a pawn in the corporate gutter like all the rest.
March 7th, 2009 at 12:30 pmWatching the fools who were part and parcel to the worst, most corrupt, and inept administration in recent history take it upon themselves to try to tell others what to do, say, and how to act, is ridiculous. This ass clown should find a job that keeps him out of public sight. He is as big a disgrace as his boss W was. These sentiments go to all the rest of the crime family. They should STFU and sit down and allow the grown ups to TRY to clean up the mess they left.
March 7th, 2009 at 1:41 pmIt totally boggles my mind. Why do they ask these Bush people anything?? They have NO CREDENTIALS!!!! They are responsible for the mess we’re in right now! Would you ask the captain of the Titanic for tips on boating safety? Perhaps if you wanted to know how NOT to do something.
March 7th, 2009 at 1:58 pmIf the Republicans in Congress really believe that Americans are not entitled to health insurance, then let’s remove the health care benefits of ALL the Republicans in Congress. After all, if health care is not a need, then the Republican Congress doesn’t need health care.
March 7th, 2009 at 4:37 pmFontsdeleon – yes, Card is at the top of the list of scum right along with Rove and Cheney.
March 7th, 2009 at 4:40 pmThe race to the lowest global common denominator on taxes and worker pay/benefits is on. Andy’s Repugnicants and Blue Dog Damnocrats plan to deliver.
March 7th, 2009 at 5:41 pmorange Says:
Orange is incredibly stupid, no reading. Too ignorant. You really are the stupidest piece of garbage I have ever run across. The depth of your stupidity is astonishing. Do you take stupid pills? Do you have any self respect at all? Are you proud of being so stupid? Have the decency to be embarassed by your ignorance.
March 7th, 2009 at 6:27 pmHgeStelrFn Says:
WOW you really are stupid.
It is CORRECT that healthcare is NOT a right.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
That isnt up to him or YOU to decide. We will decide that democratically and since more than two thirds of Americans WASNT universal healthcare I think you will lose that argument eventually.
I read no where in the Constitution of the United States that healthcare is a right.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Did you read about highways or Police in the Constitution? Does that mean we shouldnt have them? Dont you see how stupid that argument is? What about the promote the General wellfare in the preamble? That certainly could be interpreted as providing healthcare.
The Constitution is NOT subject to interpretation, no matter what all your slimy lawyer friends tell you.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
This may be the single stupidest thing ever written in the English language. OF COURSE it is intepretive. That is why it was written in broad language instead of specifics so it would be a flexible document that gave broad principles that could evolve as society evolved. You really have no idea what you are talking about do you? Why do you think the Supreme Court was written as a brach of government when its main DUTY is to interpret the constitution? Why have they made decisions that were later overturned like Brown vs Board of Education? Do you just regurgitate the idiocy you were programmed to believe like this without spending one second thinking about it? This last statement is so outrageously wrong no one with two functioning braincells to rub together could possibly take it seriously
March 7th, 2009 at 6:35 pmHgeStelrFn Says:
It is CORRECT that healthcare is NOT a right.
March 7th, 2009 at 2:46 am
In other words, you’ve got coverage.
March 7th, 2009 at 8:00 pmThis from a F^c&in@ @sshat who said you don’t roll out new products in August, re; the iraq war pitch?
Who gives a flopping, flying F^c$ what this crapshoot Card says?
Hey Card, go get me some cheeseburgers! That’s about all you’re good for.
March 8th, 2009 at 1:58 pmCard should wrap his head around the fact that health care is not a privilege; it’s a right.
But that’s too much to expect from this guy, part of a crew that had a hard on for violating people’s right.
I wonder what Card would say if he had no health care?
March 8th, 2009 at 2:01 pm