Dean on Wall Street compensation: Americans don’t understand rewarding people who did ‘a crappy job.’
Dean on Wall Street compensation: Americans don’t understand rewarding people who did ‘a crappy job.’
During his inaugural appearance on CNBC’s Squawk Box this morning as a paid commentator, Howard Dean told the CNBC regulars that he believed they were misreading the public’s reaction to Wall Street excess. Dean said that rather than resenting the wealth of Wall Street as a matter of course, Americans simply believe that “you shouldn’t get rewarded…for doing a crappy job”:
DEAN: I think you guys are looking at this the wrong way. I don’t think people resent Wall Street because they’re making millions of dollars. Everybody wants to be rich in this country. I think people resent Wall Street for making millions of dollars while the folks who are reading the newspaper are out of work. You shouldn’t get rewarded in a capitalist system for doing a crappy job. That’s what the issue is.
Squawk Box co-host Joe Kernen said that the hiring of Dean was meant to “balance” their recent hiring of former Bush administration spokesperson Tony Fratto. Watch it:
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WTF one nutcase at a time please
March 23rd, 2009 at 12:36 pmDon’t understand why he doesn’t yet have a position on the Obama Administration. Talk about an excellent communicator who gets it…
March 23rd, 2009 at 12:39 pmYou can be sure as hell that if I did a crappy job I wouldn`t be geting any kind of bonus, I would be FIRED.
March 23rd, 2009 at 12:40 pmDo a good job, get rewarded for doing that job.
Do a bad job, get rewarded for doing that job.
WAIT A SECOND… isn’t that Socialism? I always thought that Capitalism was based on the belief that you were paid based on the job that you’ve done (I know, simplistic, but still)…. so if I manage a company into bankruptcy… why should I think I deserve compensation, much less bonuses, for that job?
March 23rd, 2009 at 12:42 pmRight. We don’t. In our reality, one gets rewarded for doing a good job, rewarded more for doing a great job, and people who do a crappy job get fired.
In the Wall Street snow-globe, the reality is that if you do a crappy job, you get rewarded because this will somehow motivate you to do a better job. And for some mysterious reason, people are afraid that you will take your crappy skills and go elsewhere (like this is a bad thing), so it’s important to give you gobs of money to get you to stay. Because even if you DO get fired for doing a crappy job, some other firm will jump at the chance to hire you because of your “experience”.
What’s interesting about this issue is that both Democrats and Republicans in our reality fence are united in their belief that crappy jobs shouldn’t go unrewarded. How many of the red-staters at the lower end of the economic scale — the ones who have been steadfast in their support of conservative policies — have supported the “right” of these incompetents to their bonuses? Not too many.
Have we heard from Joe the Plumber on this? Since he fancies himself a future business mogul, I thought he might have an opinion.
March 23rd, 2009 at 12:44 pmYep, Dean is right. Here in the heartland, you do a terrible job, and you get fired. No bonus, and no unemployment. This is how it works for us, why doesn’t this work for them?
March 23rd, 2009 at 12:51 pm1) One student receives A’s and B’s on his report card. This could be due to diligence or perhaps a natural talent.
2) One student receives F’s on his report card, even though he tried really hard and put effort into it.
3) One student receives F’s on his report card, a result from putting no effort at all into it.
The question is…which of these students deserves rewarding?
In the case of #1, it is likely obvious if a rule was put into place: do well and honest work, and you get rewarded. In the case of #3, the result is also likely. No allowance until you show some effort.
#2 may be the situation the companies are in. All of this effort in a sick economy is not resulting in results. So should this student get allowance just for effort?
March 23rd, 2009 at 12:53 pmUnbelievable #2 in answer to you question, Rahm Emanuel…Seemes there is bad blood there and he has the President ear and total support so we don’t get this good man (Dean) to work in the administration…Blessings
March 23rd, 2009 at 12:54 pmDamn. Howard Dean is the most underutilized resource in American political life.
He’s smart, he’s effective, and he’s the kind of a speaker –especially on TV — that Democrats desperately need. He speaks plainly, and sometimes ruffles feathers, but people know where he stands and he makes the case with compelling language.
March 23rd, 2009 at 12:56 pmDean on Wall Street compensation: Americans don’t understand rewarding people who did ‘a crappy job.’
Which is why everyone is scratching their heads over FOX still being on the air….
During the last eight years, rewarding a crappy job used to be known as, “getting the medal of freedom.”
March 23rd, 2009 at 12:56 pmAnyone see the Dateline 1st installment of the INSIDE THE FINANCIAL FIASCO last night? If this show makes the case for their fraud so clear, why aren’t the authorities perpwalking these folks down Wall Street?
Give them their bonuses and send the bastards to jail and give them huge fines for the fraud they’ve perpetrated on this country and me personally. They certainly won’t get much enjoyment out of those ill-gotten gains.
March 23rd, 2009 at 12:57 pmIt’s only socialism when it applies to the proles.
March 23rd, 2009 at 12:57 pmEver so slightly O/T: Treasury Secretary Tim Geithner’s new Rube Goldberg plan to fix the problem of subprime mortgage loans and bad (unpaid) credit card debt will reward the greedy reckless banks who created these problems in the first place. Problems created by corporate greed will not be solved by more corporate gree, Mr. Geithner. Let’s create instead, some not-for-private-profit national banks, state banks and local credit unions.
March 23rd, 2009 at 12:59 pmWhen are they going to start talking about all the taxpayer money we wasted on Halliburton and KBR!!!!!
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:00 pmBla my post was meant to be in this thread
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:00 pmSo the best they could do wasn’t good enough.
This is the real world. You’re not supposed to get rewarded just for playing.
THAT is what is plssing everybody off.
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:05 pmLeaders got big bonuses for sending 2 million jobs to China. Their pay is 400 times that of the average worker.
If leverage can reset, CEO salaries should do likewise. Pay for performance is crappy management theory. It causes CEO’s to undertake risky strategies and produce poor quality goods/services, otherwise known as crap.
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:06 pmOT -Leahy’s Truth Commission Petition
http://bushtruthcommission.com/
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:07 pmKlatuu Says:
If the government can mandate a minimum wage why not a maximum wage? We should have some serious and harsh caps on what an individual earns.
This is such a landmine to consider. Success is the foundation on which capitalism is built. I think there needs to be a lot more in place in terms of limits before this can be seriously considered. We shouldn’t be punishing the legit companies for something the illegitimate companies are doing.
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:08 pmThe next round of CEO bonuses may be driven by dumping health insurance benefit costs to the employee. Recall, many recently cut 401k matches (long after freezing defined benefit pension plans).
The same creep is coming to health care coverage. One only need to listen to the U.S. Chamber of Commerce/Business Roundtable lingo on health reform.
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:09 pmIt is about time somebody said the obvious. The regulars on CNBC frequently don’t know what they are talking about so it takes an outsider to point out the obvious. Dean’s tone was exactly right as well.
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:11 pmOne man’s “crappy” is another man’s performance goals. These bonuses were based on the corporate goals of selling products, with no stipulation on whether or not those were good products. For eleven months of 2008, the employees who received these bonuses were doing the job that they were hired and told to do. For the twelth month, they became employees of the US government because they were successful in selling the products, which were “crappy”. The corporate leaders who established the bonus criteria should be paying the bonuses out of their salaries. And now, we, as owner, should set the compensation packages for all the employees, with targeted reductions for those on the top of the corporate ladder.
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:21 pm#5
I think a bigger part of the picture is that if they fire these people they will blow the whistle since these people were implementing company policy. The policy was the major part of the problem rather than those gleefully implementing that bad policy. For the same money they were receiving they would have gleefully implemented a good policy. It makes them scoundrels rather than incompetent.
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:21 pmThat clears that up and Dean is correct. If any worker didn’t do his/her job they would be fired, but it seems Wall Street gives you a pat on the back and a big raise for doing a poor job. As Wall Street then comes to the US Treasury to ask for more money to play with.
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:23 pmPurple State:
#2 may be the situation the companies are in. All of this effort in a sick economy is not resulting in results. So should this student get allowance just for effort?
No. This isn’t remedial math and the grades of a particular student don’t carry the responsibility that comes with playing around with large sums of OTHER PEOPLE’S money. This is a weak analogy that totally downplays the severity of what actually has happened on Wall Street.
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:23 pmDean may have been a better choice than Geitner (sp)…At least Dean wasen’t in bed with all the AIG boy’s and to my knoledge he has alway’s paid his taxe’s in a timely manner..Dean is one doctor that has a grip on all ill’s…..Just saying…Blessings
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:28 pmtake it to them, sir…
we expect no less than total honesty and blunt reality…
do that the best you can – and we all know YOU can do it best -
as long as you have that soapbox, that exposure…
thank you, dr. dean!
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:34 pmI like Howard Dean – he certainly ‘gets it’! It really aggravates me when rich people say we’re just jealous of their wealth and “hating” on them. They completely miss the point.
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:37 pmStop bailing these con-men out. Let the zombies die.
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:38 pmUntil MANY of you stop looking at bonuses as a reward for good work, you will not understand this issue. You are arguing emotions not facts.
A retention bonus was assigned for work performend. Not a performance bonus. Many companies, particularly those doing poorly offer bonuses to people to stay around through the fire. These guys did exactly that and got paid for it.
Until you stop whining you sound a lot more like Republicans than progressives. By all means fight the contracts, but don’t whine abou the people who followed through in paying them once they were legal documents.
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:52 pmWhy Wall Street doesn’t get it is truly a mystery to me.
I don’t care how rich they are, or who are their friends — that they don’t understand the public outrage is incomprehensible.
And those companies continue to flaunt their wealth despite the current outrage!
BTW, what is happening to all the corporations who have set up P.O. boxes in the Cayman Islands and other places where they can skip having to pay any tax to the US Govt. Are they among those getting bailouts?
March 23rd, 2009 at 2:06 pmOr do we need to “out” them to the public and let them share the rage?
Guys like the Wall Street execs who have failed so spectacularly do not believe the Proles (you and me) have the insight, or intelligence, or whatever, to determine whether they’ve been doing a “good” job. Jump, you cowards!!!
March 23rd, 2009 at 2:33 pmIronic, coming from someone who has been rewarded for doing a crappy job, no?
March 23rd, 2009 at 1:49 pm
Which crappy job wuzzat, dillweed? the 50-State Strategy?
March 23rd, 2009 at 2:35 pmIt’s not populist anger, but a rational response to America’s pitiful leadership the last decade and a half.
http://stateofthedivision.blogspot.com/2009/03/populist-charge-is-rational-opposition.html
March 23rd, 2009 at 2:40 pmDing. Ding. Ding. Dean’s the smartest guy in class today.
March 23rd, 2009 at 4:00 pmI remember from many years ago – Dogbert says to Dilbert that the secret of success is to fail miserably. The bigger the failure, the more people will remember the magnitude of the project.
It ain’t funny anymore.
March 23rd, 2009 at 4:46 pmKlatuu Says:
If the government can mandate a minimum wage why not a maximum wage? We should have some serious and harsh caps on what an individual earns.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
You do get that you are incredibly stupid dont you? I mean even without a functional brainpan you ought to be able to tell just how ignorant you are it is evident to everyone else. WE GAVE THEM MONEY. WE GET TO SAY HOW THEY USE IT. IF THEY DONT LIKE IT THEY DONT HAVE TO TAKE THE MONEY. You insufferable MORON. The government CAN put people in prison for twenty years for running red lights since they put them in prison for twenty years for murder. Doesnt mean they will. What an ignorant putz you are.
March 23rd, 2009 at 4:50 pmPurple State Says:
And no one is discussing doing that. This cap is ONLY for those companies that take the bailout money. If they dont like it they can give back the money.
March 23rd, 2009 at 4:52 pmAh, yes. Being the motivating force, and the organizing individual behind the major push towards the 50-State Strategy…the very strategy that turned many states blue, and elected the President of these United States, is doing ‘a crappy job’. On the other hand, bankrupting your company, then begging for taxpayer handouts, then wasting those handouts on kickbacks and foolhardy compensation for a failure to perform, that is SUCCESS! Doublespeak, much?
Oh, were you referring to being railroaded by the media for an enthusiastic scream? Yes, railroaded, what with the multitudes of screams he was responding to that are present on the unaltered audio being edited out and presented as though he were alone in his enthusiasm, and was screaming for no good bloody reason. That kind of media-based malfeasance? That’s not failing, that’s being politically sunk by manipulative, substance-less propaganda.
March 23rd, 2009 at 8:05 pmI remember this. However, I think some of the Kos folks have it dead to rights. This isn’t like Dogbert, this is like Irv the accounting program designer. Make a program with such enormous depths of spaghetti logic, that the company is convinced to maintain you no matter how screwed up the program makes things, since only you have a remote chance of fixing any of the problems. In this case, Wall Street, et al, have contrived an economic model so convoluted, with money disappearing into so many holes at once, that the so-called experts who concocted this scam in the first place are being retained by these companies/industries, because they are theoretically (and ONLY theoretically) the only people who understand how the whole bleedin’ mess works.
The answer is to restructure everything in the economic sector that is insolvent, fire EVERYONE involved at the levels in which they were actually creating the situation to begin with, and start over from scratch with whoever is left that is still solvent, combined with a nationally-backed infrastructure to simplify all of the crap, and flat-out eliminate all of the toxic bull****. Let these idiots fold, let them stomp their feet as though they are “experts”, and see if they can find jobs in their chosen field after being given, essentially, the Scarlet Letter, marked as one of the imbeciles and/or dirty thieves who egregiously damaged the financial sector of this country, and the world for that matter.
March 23rd, 2009 at 8:13 pmWho cares what an idiot like Howard Dean has to say about anything? Maybe the three dozen people who actually watch CNBC.
March 23rd, 2009 at 9:18 pmIf you want to help the poor – the “losers” – you’re a socialist. Losers get fired for f-ing up at work, can’t pay their mortgages, whatever. But if you’re a white-collar criminal (and not even a very good one) you are somehow entitled to bonuses for retrograde progress (i.e. failure). Dean is exactly right – especially in light of the fact that taxpayers are footing the bill. The Right – not to be confused with The Correct – always likes to point out how the top earners pay a dispropotionate amount of tax. I agree, but not in the way they may think. They pay a disproportionately low amount of tax compared with what they produce and what they receive for it. If you – yes YOU, because AIG execs don’t read TP – performed as they do and did, you’d get fired, not a bonus. Class warfare? No.
These people have no class.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:07 amI don’t know why nobody notices there would be no problem of bonuses if people doing crappy job wouldn’t be shielded from natural consequences of doing crappy job by government bailout. AIG should have fallen, crappy execs should be in an unemployment line with the rest of us instead of gouging on taxpayers money. To all you deluded folks that cry for government control: we need less government not more. Government balooned under Bush, current crisis is an outgrowth of Bush’s government meddling into markets, and now it’s sliding ever faster into socialist malaise. No matter what are Obama’s good intentions, the more government control the more inept and illogical system becomes. An escapee from behind an Iron Curtain, I dread what I see.
March 24th, 2009 at 4:09 am