Conservatives Falsely Assert That Green Economy Legislation Would Impose $3,100 Tax On Families
Conservatives Falsely Assert That Green Economy Legislation Would Impose $3,100 Tax On Families
Cross-posted from The Wonk Room.
Conservatives in Congress are resting their objections to effective green economy legislation on a bogus stat. Conservative leaders like Rep. John Boehner (R-OH) and Sen. Mitch McConnell (R-KY) are attacking the cap-and-trade proposal before Congress by claiming that it would “cost every American family up to $3,100 per year in higher energy prices.”
This is a deliberate lie.
They seem to be getting this number from an intentional misinterpretation of a 2007 study performed by a group of researchers at the MIT.
In an interview with PolitiFact, John Reilly, an MIT professor and one of the authors of the study, explained about this $3,100 claim:
“It’s just wrong. It’s wrong in so many ways it’s hard to begin.”” [...]
“Someone from the House Republicans had called me (March 20) and asked about this,” Reilly said. “I had explained why the estimate they had was probably incorrect and what they should do to correct it, but I think this wrong number was already floating around by that time.”
House Republicans apparently took the total revenues from the hypothetical cap and trade system that MIT analyzed and crudely divided it by the number of households in America, getting approximately $3,100 per family.
What they don’t mention, however, is that not only did John Reilly explicitly tell them that this was an inappropriate way to do this calculation, but that MIT had determined the net welfare effect on a typical family and the burden would be less than 1/40th what they claim, and wouldn’t occur until 2015.
As PolitiFact explains: “The report did include an estimate of the net cost to individuals, called the “welfare” cost. It would be $30.89 per person in 2015, or $79 per family if you use the same average household size the Republicans used of 2.56 people.” In exchange, we’d get a clean & renewable energy economy, decreased reliance on oil, and a safer climate for the world.
The reason Boehner’s methodology is totally inappropriate?
“That’s just not how economists calculate the cost of a tax proposal, Reilly said. The tax might push the price of carbon-based fuels up a bit, but other results of a cap-and-trade program, such as increased conservation and more competition from other fuel sources, would put downward pressure on prices. Moreover, consumers would get some of the tax back from the government in some form. [In this case,President Obama wants to use revenues from cap-and-trade to fund a tax cut for 95% of working families]“
When conservatives tell you you’d see your energy bills go up $3,100 every year, it’s not distortion or spin, it’s just a lie.
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When I saw Boehner’s picture, I knew this story was going to be about more GOP lies! Not only do they lack the ability to prepare a real budget or come up with new ideas to present to Americans, they continue to lie! The GOP is counting on most Americans to be as incompetent as their base supporters!
March 31st, 2009 at 8:42 pmAnd a lie goes ’round the world before truth has put on its shoes.
March 31st, 2009 at 8:45 pmI’ve already heard this on the news. Of course there is no push back from the news host.
The Republicans cherry pick phrases or words out of nearly everything. And they rarely read anything as a whole. It is the way they work. The only way. Facts seldom get in the way.
They obstruct, they lie. And they also NEVER come up with a plan on their own. And the plan they are talking about, one of the promoters says when it comes out, it will cost more than what the Democrats have in mind. But still no details.
March 31st, 2009 at 8:45 pm
March 31st, 2009 at 8:47 pm“Making it up as they go along since 1968!”
ROTFL! This pic of Beanhead Boehner is perfect! Damn crybaby!
March 31st, 2009 at 8:50 pmThe f’ing media needs to start calling these liars on their BS. Thanks to the internet the truth is beginning to show here and there, but for those folks getting their news from TV (with a couple of notable exceptions) the lies just go unchallenged and are repeated without question.
March 31st, 2009 at 8:51 pmCaption Contest;
March 31st, 2009 at 8:53 pm“Dammit Rush, you said you’d keep it out of my eyes”
How much of that 11 Trillion debt the Republlicans and the White House ran up for 8 years with the stealing and illegal invasion of Iraq going to cost the taxpaying Families? I notice how the GOP is all over Obama for helping with this recovery while they still want to give to the top 2 per cent Rich Americans. Do they need more checks for votes to the Wealthy?
March 31st, 2009 at 8:56 pmOh ya, I gonna take Republican math seriously. How many Ditto heads daes it take to operate a calculator. Somebody better tell them to change the batteries, the dam thing isn’t working right.
March 31st, 2009 at 8:58 pmAnd the worst part of all this is the GOP knows if they say it often enough Wolf Blitzer and David Gregory will treat it as gospel.
http://www.pufferfishblog.com/
March 31st, 2009 at 9:00 pm“Conservatives Falsely Assert That Green Economy Legislation Would Impose $3,100 Tax On Families”
And the pic of Boner’s cry baby cries is just priceless. This is not a surprse. Anything that Boner says and does is a lie. And he just put a nail in his own political coffin last week with that laughable 19 page and ambien like pamphlet of The Party Of No’s Starving for Recovery budgetless budget plan.
March 31st, 2009 at 9:01 pm> This is a deliberate lie.
Thanks for actually using the “L word”..more media outlets need to do it..
March 31st, 2009 at 9:01 pmdude..what genius republican decided to release thier budget on APRIL FOOLS DAY? couldnt they wait one more or one less day? is the irony of this utterly lost of them..christ..wow, if liberals were as good at conspiracies as Billow claims we are, we’d really be mopping the floor with these bufooons..
March 31st, 2009 at 9:03 pmif dems are moderately smart they need to start the mantra of republicans only idea being “tax breaks for millionaires”..
March 31st, 2009 at 9:04 pmWhy don’t the dems invite this guy to speak before congress and expose these rethugs for the liars they are.
“If you cannot convince them, confuse them” from the rethug bible
March 31st, 2009 at 9:05 pmMy lies abhor you
March 31st, 2009 at 9:06 pmCause I never laid a truth on you,
My lies abhor you
Like a million miles away from me you couldn’t see
How I abhorred you:
Our numbers, so close and yet so far away
Hey Boner,
I paid 3100.00 in Exxon/Mobil taxes in 2007 under GW Botch and your RePugniScum party!! Phuck you!!!!
You don’t give 1 sh|t about what the little guy pays, just who he’s paying.
March 31st, 2009 at 9:06 pmapparently, numbers confuse the repukies. first they parade around a “budget” without a single damn number in it and now this? one would think perhaps a remedial math class over the summer at an adult ed. center would do repukie elected officials a world of good.
March 31st, 2009 at 9:06 pmThis might be April Fools. They might show up at the podium and say “Due to the fact that someone leaked the information that our budget will cost more than the president’s, We need to rethink how we can greese the palms of the rich, so we will now unveil our new plan on Palm Sunday”.
March 31st, 2009 at 9:12 pmIt is a right wing lie that tax cuts for the wealthy will “trickle down” and make everyone else a little wealthier. The rich don’t spend their tax breaks, they save them or pass them on to their grandchildren, tax-free. Since Republicans do not believe that any tax plan that does not include tax cuts for the rich is a bad plan, it should be obvious to everyone just who they believe their constituents are. And it ain’t you and me.
Cry, Boehner, cry
March 31st, 2009 at 9:29 pmMake your mother sigh
You’re old enough to know better
But dumb enough to try
Caption Contest;
But Mr Cantor. You should have told me not to release this stupid 19 page budget with more conviction.
March 31st, 2009 at 9:33 pmThis is a well worn path. Years of Republican lying and incompetence has led to our current state of affairs. They often distort studies or simply don’t understand them. They are the masters of the half truth lie. They are concerned with power and profit for their rich friends not the average cost of living for working people.
March 31st, 2009 at 9:38 pmIt speaks volumes about how the right operates when they spew their propaganda and fear under the assumption that people have forgotten they hell they were put through under their leadership.
Just remember, THE math for the people ($3100, the new and improved baloney) was THE math against the people not even a year ago when the same working joe the right supposedly champions was paying $4.00 a gallon. (The rubes were using “supply-and-demand” as a prop at a time demand for oil was down 3% and speculators were working their magic.)
March 31st, 2009 at 9:39 pmOf course, even if the right’s math were correct, their average hardly represents the average American household — it figures in gargantuan compounds consuming a fortune in electricity.
March 31st, 2009 at 9:45 pmThank you, TP, for calling this what it is — A LIE.
March 31st, 2009 at 10:10 pmButterflies are free to fly….
March 31st, 2009 at 10:12 pmAnother TP lie. Well, pretty much every blog entry is. No surprise.
In exchange, we’d get a clean & renewable energy economy,
No we wouldn’t. Obama wants to double our windmills and solar panels. We currently get 1% of our energy from those, and he wants to double that to 2%. What about the other 98%?
decreased reliance on oil,
No we wouldn’t. Obama’s 2% plan does nothing to get us off of oil. Nada. Zilch.
and a safer climate for the world.
No we wouldn’t. We’d still be burning coal and natural gas. Cars would still be running on oil, or if electric on electricity produced from coal and natural gas plants.
Utilities in all states would be required to gradually increase the proportion of renewables to 25 percent by 2025.
Just passing a law won’t make it happen. Just in case you TPers don’t know, windmills only work about 6-8 hours a day on average and many days when energy is most needed, not at all. They break down a lot, too. Solar panels are extremely expensive and only work in direct sunlight.
March 31st, 2009 at 10:30 pmHow much are the polar bears worth?
How about folks in low lying coastal areas, how much are their homes worth?
How much to prevent millions from dying from lack of food and water due to droughts?
How much is food going to cost all of us if California becomes a dust bowl?
You see, it doesn’t matter how much it costs in $$ now, if we do nothing it’s going to cost a lot more later.
March 31st, 2009 at 10:47 pmNot a single thing backing up the trolls blather.
Another case of, “It’s true because I say so!”
March 31st, 2009 at 11:07 pmTruth and reality have never gotten in the way of a republican lie.
March 31st, 2009 at 11:09 pmBe ready to rebuke your Repub friends.
March 31st, 2009 at 11:15 pmHey, What`s another 3grand when were already paying over 100grand and counting from the Shrubs crime family,you know that silly little confrontation the Reich wing Nuts started in Iraq and Afghanistan and all of it based on lies, the Noble Lie that is.
March 31st, 2009 at 11:32 pmHey Marwick your right, Obama wants to double windmills he wants to decrease our reliance on oil,and yes we will still be burning fossil fuels for years to come. Its a start no one said its going to happen over night dipsht. Bush/Cheney didnt care about putting pollutants into our atmosphere. If Iraq wasnt sitting on an ocean of oil then that piece of shit Bush never would have invaded Iraq. Instead of watching fox noise every night try using your pc to get info about how windmills,solar panels and pretty much everything that is green will help boost our economy.
March 31st, 2009 at 11:37 pmAnother dose of talking points from the mind of Glenn Beck? Good luck with that, stupid troll.
On a more serious note, we have wasted 8 precious years doing nothing so, anything is an improvement. We can’t waste any more time.
As for the troll’s individual droppings:
1. The more we invest now, the lower the costs later. As new technologies are discovered and go into production the costs will drop while profits soar.
2. This bill doesn’t address the issue of imported oil so, the trolls observation is irrelevant. However, everything we do now will prolong our finite supply of oil.
3. Even if there is no immediate positive impact due to reduced emissions, those same new technologies will enable things like pumping water to the billion or so who will have no fresh water once the glaciers disappear. India already has a huge homegrown solar power industry that provides tech jobs for desperate people and green electric light for people who have traditionally just gone to bed when it gets dark rather than pay for candles or lamp fuel.
4. True. Passing a Bill doesn’t make technology and infrastructure magically appear. However, American industry has proven time and again that they refuse to make long term investments without a mandate. Case in point: If American businesses were committed to long term responsibility? American car makers would be producing, and selling, complete lines of cars that achieve 50+ mpg.
March 31st, 2009 at 11:41 pmOnce again, the authors who were cited to justify the GOP say, essentially, that the citation completely misrepresents their study.
What does this this say about the academic honesty ?
April 1st, 2009 at 12:23 ammarwick Says:
Another TP lie. Well, pretty much every blog entry is. No surprise.
__________
How peculiar… marwick claims “pretty much every blog entry” here is a lie…
Yet, his comment has NOTHING TO DO w/ the actual subject of the thread.
And the “points” he does post in no way rebut the topic of the thread.
Nor does he cite his source for those points, so the rest of us can figure out just what the HELL is this rabid, chattering idiot thinks he’s talking about…
Will the trolls EVER learn that silly performances like this one will NEVER do anything to improve their credibility here?
April 1st, 2009 at 12:25 ammarwick Says:
“I’m only here to prove that conservatism is a mental illness!“
Well thanks for clearing that up for us.
April 1st, 2009 at 12:42 amThe cap-and-trade isn’t a tax on every flip of the light switch to build palaces in Baghdad, it’s part of a concerted effort to evade planetary death. It would cost less than a dime a day. I really do wish these Republicans would STFU.
April 1st, 2009 at 12:49 ammarwick – I’d like to see you back up what you’re spewing with some facts.
April 1st, 2009 at 12:53 amFrom Discover May 2008:
Please. Do some research. Try some facts. Real information.
This cap-and-trade crap is … a bunch of crap. I’m all for windmills and solar panels. Build them. But they’re not going to be a significant part of America’s energy future. Instead of “alternative energy,” wind and solar should be called “supplemental energy.” They’ll add a couple of percent on windy and sunny days. Other than that, we’ll be burning coal, oil, natural gas, nuclear power, and hydro-electric power.
April 1st, 2009 at 2:28 amBogus Stats R Us.
What is a right-wing think tank but a group of people paid to cook the stats to make the right look good?
The Heritage Foundation and all the other right-wing think tanks have spent infinite amounts of money to publish infinite reams of pseudo-academic crap–all of it conclusively and irrefutably proving that the right has always been right, is always right, and always will be right about everything.
And the left is always wrong. It’s all in the well-cooked stats.
Ain’t science wonderful?
April 1st, 2009 at 5:52 ammarwick Says:
Please. Do some research. Try some facts. Real information.
This cap-and-trade crap is … a bunch of crap. I’m all for windmills and solar panels. Build them. But they’re not going to be a significant part of America’s energy future. Instead of “alternative energy,” wind and solar should be called “supplemental energy.” They’ll add a couple of percent on windy and sunny days. Other than that, we’ll be burning coal, oil, natural gas, nuclear power, and hydro-electric power.
April 1st, 2009 at 2:28 am
____________
True. The economies of scale for renewables are still small, and an all-eggs-in-one-basket solution is not going to work. Renewables do have the potential, however, to be more than just “supplemental.”
Concentrating land-based wind farms in, say, Texas, won’t generate enough power during the low-wind, high-demand periods of the summer, but you get a much better return if you distribute wind farms both onshore and offshore and connect them via an efficient grid. There’s always wind blowing somewhere – we just need the capacity to capture it. Global wind resources represent 72 TW in potential power.
April 1st, 2009 at 7:51 amTo Boehner: “Liar, Liar pants on fire!”
I’m sorry, that’s totally immature of me.
“Whiney ass titty baby!”
April 1st, 2009 at 8:00 amMARWICK
Pathetic losers don’t address the questions or issues. They just throw out more crap hoping people get intellectually lazy at having to deal the feces they spew from their orifices that mock large loose stools. The Republican base is very predictable, as your are of course.
April 1st, 2009 at 9:01 amIt’s really pathetic and disturbing that the GOP have to resort to lies to scare the American public and they expect people to trust them?
No wonder why this country is at a major crossroads domestically and globally. The more Bull Crap the GOP bullies throw outta their mouths the more ridiculous and asinine they look.
April 1st, 2009 at 9:58 amJust more lies from the losing fringes of the GOP.
April 1st, 2009 at 10:36 amWhy this surprises anyone is a mystery.
GOP = LIES and NO
What is the GOP problem???? Do they not want to see cheaper energy????? WHO ARE THEY PROTECTING…SAY IT NOW GOP????
WHO ARE YOU PROTECTING????? WHY DO YOU NOT WANT CHEAPER ENERGY???? ANSWER THAT YOU IDIOT!!!
April 1st, 2009 at 2:53 pmuse less, earn standard, spend less, this is the solution of the crisis.
April 2nd, 2009 at 4:57 amhttp://www.marmarauroloji.blogspot.com
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April 18th, 2009 at 6:16 amsac ekimi
Hello? Where is everyone now? No more fact facing? Anyone here care to apologize? Didn’t think so. Go back and sit in your high priced coffin on wheels (Prius), drink your horrible tasting organic coffee and finish your trip around the world. You’re halfway there. The truth is just getting warmed up.
April 23rd, 2009 at 2:59 pmReilly admitted he miscalculated the estimate, which ended up at $800 (not $250 that some have reported). If you factor in the higher energy costs placed on these companies, and the fact that they will put this cost back on the consumer, which they would, this would bring the number back up and over $3,100 to around $3,900.
April 23rd, 2009 at 4:27 pm