Ashcroft Indirectly Makes An Argument For Torture Accountability
Ashcroft Indirectly Makes An Argument For Torture Accountability
Today in a New York Times op-ed, former Bush Attorney General John Ashcroft noted that because the federal government has poured billions of dollars into the nation’s financial institutions to keep them afloat, a dilemma arises over how to deal with these companies’ illegal activities: Does the Justice Department issue an indictment when such an act, as Ashcroft noted, “is often a death sentence for a corporation” and thus would undermine the federal government’s efforts to save these companies and boost the economy?
Ashcroft makes the argument that, while criminal prosecutions may not be warranted, some accountability is necessary:
The government must hold accountable any individuals who acted illegally in this financial meltdown, while preserving the viability of the companies that received bailout funds or stimulus money. Certainly, we should demand justice. But we must all remember that justice is a value, the adherence to which includes seeking the best outcome for the American people. In some cases it will be the punishing of bad actors. In other cases it may involve heavy corporate fines or operating under a carefully tailored agreement.
“[W]hatever are we to do if we discover that in the process of protecting our national security, government officials broke laws against warrantless wiretapping and against torture?” blogger Jack Balkin asks. Indeed, as Balkin noted, Ashcroft’s logic applies directly to investigating the Bush administration’s torture regime:
According to this same logic, the government should demand a full accounting of what Bush Administration officials did and it should institute new methods for monitoring and preventing abuses in the future. It should find ways to hold individuals who broke the law accountable without jeopardizing our existing national security. What the government should not do is what Attorney General Ashcroft argues against in the financial context– to sweep illegal actions under the rug or to go easy on the individuals who broke the law because they work for the federal government.
Ashcroft is unlikely to make an argument that the Bush administration’s torture program should be investigated, primarily because he participated in it. Indeed, Ashcroft was present at top-secret White House meetings beginning in 2002 to discuss the use of torture on terror suspect detainees. According to sources, all principals who attending the meetings approved.
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Come on! We all know that the US Constitution pales next to the Almighty Dollar in the eyes of the Right Wing.
It’s far more important to find out who cost these people a buck then who’s cost them their souls…..
May 5th, 2009 at 4:44 pmListening to Ashcroft talk requires the same mental positioning you must adopt when you go to see a play, a musical or a magician: you must suspend your belief that anything you are seeing or hearing is attached to reality in any way, what so ever. American politics is one of the places where the lunatic fringe is allowed to walk around free and we pay them big bucks to screw things up. I would not trust Ashcroft if he said the sky was blue.
May 5th, 2009 at 4:54 pmBut but but Clinton had sex!!
May 5th, 2009 at 4:54 pmUmmmm, John. Don’t you have a statue to drape? STFU, would you?
May 5th, 2009 at 4:55 pmYet they always say they are the best and brightest — So ihave to ask if we have the best and brightest running things how come they have managed to FUBAR things to the extent that they do?
Big Bucks..its like kryptonite!
May 5th, 2009 at 4:57 pm” . . the adherence to which includes seeking the best outcome for the American people. In some cases it will be the punishing of bad actors. In other cases it may involve heavy corporate fines or operating under a carefully tailored agreement.” [MY EMPHASIS]
There is that SAME OLD PHUCKING EXCUSE again – use ‘the American people’ so that nothing can disrupt business as usual and the same OFFENDERS CANNOT BE BOUGHT TO JUSTICE FOR TORTURE. Enough of these bast*rds using our names as the REASONING behind NOT OBEYING THE LAW OF OUR COUNTRY AND INTERNATIONAL LAW. How dare them?
May 5th, 2009 at 4:58 pmAshcroft said: “But we must all remember that justice is a value, the adherence to which includes seeking the best outcome for the American people.”
I thought Justice was blind.
May 5th, 2009 at 4:58 pmNo one is above the law, unless you work for the government.
It doesn’t quite have the same ring to it, but it does explain a great deal.
May 5th, 2009 at 5:01 pmSo, Ashcroft knows crimes were committed. Ashcroft knows what must be done. Bush, cheney, rice, and all the players on down the line should have known better and they must pay the price.
I’m thinking strip them of all titles, degrees, honors, and official designations. Fine them huge ammounts of money. Bar them from politics. Then prohibit any of them from making any more profits releated to their terms in office.
If they can’t work something like that out then what, prison? How about rehabilitation instead? Prison time just makes people worse than they already are.
May 5th, 2009 at 5:09 pmI thought lawyers were supposed to be smarter than this.
Of course, this is Ashcroft…
May 5th, 2009 at 5:09 pmTHERE SHOULD BE A MARCH ON WASHINGTON TO GET THESE PEOPLE PROSECUTED!!!!
May 5th, 2009 at 5:11 pm” . . According to these reports, he was troubled by discussions of these techniques, but did not oppose them, instead “argu[ing] that senior White House advisers should not be involved in the grim details of interrogations.”
He couldn’t very well OPPOSE the techniques since his bosses would have FIRED him on the spot for NOT BEING A TEAM PLAYER AND UNPATRIOTIC. Also ecause he KNEW these techniques were TORTURE and he was trying to cover his OWN A@@ while hoping that without KNOWLEDGE of the DETAILS he and them would be able to DENY if questions were asked. Did he think that the DETAILS of these ‘harsh techniques’ would INCRIMINATE the OVERSEERS and ORDERERS???
May 5th, 2009 at 5:13 pmThis guy, and his cohorts, wasted ten million dollars for a consensual sex circus, they dont give one whit about torture or some yes men YooByBee advisors reinterpreting the law so King with advisors could skirt accountability.
May 5th, 2009 at 5:15 pmThe only reason there is any hesitation on prosecutions in the financial institutions and the Bush administration is because all involved are rich, white, and powerful.
May 5th, 2009 at 5:15 pmApe-Man Says: #9
But, then W [and the rest of the bast*rds] would lose his taxpayer pension as well as his SS detail. Waaaaaaaah, waaaaaah! LOL!
May 5th, 2009 at 5:18 pm@14 Zooey Says:
Ya, and if that’s not the case then let them prove it. Let the investigation go all the way to the top!
There is no doubt here to give them the benefit of. They are following a script as old as the hills and everyone is watching. If they go easy on these people they will be selling out America, plain and simple.
Selling out America because America’s white collar crime bosses and government crime bosses are too big and scary for the little ol’ DOJ to tackle? Prosecute or sign america’s death certificate.
May 5th, 2009 at 5:23 pm-=Z=- Said: …rich, white, and powerful.
People giving fiat money power…Thats Crazee!
May 5th, 2009 at 5:24 pmYet noticed how his very nuanced words still place the presumption away from prosecution to a slap on the wrist, even once guilt is established.
So tell me Mr. Ashcroft, how did you rise so high in Missouri politics by coddling criminals ?
May 5th, 2009 at 5:33 pmOk, here is the original quote from the article:
“The government must hold accountable any individuals who acted illegally in this financial meltdown, while preserving the viability of the companies that received bailout funds or stimulus money. Certainly, we should demand justice. But we must all remember that justice is a value, the adherence to which includes seeking the best outcome for the American people. In some cases it will be the punishing of bad actors. In other cases it may involve heavy corporate fines or operating under a carefully tailored agreement.”
Here is how it would edited if reported by FOX:
Fox announcer: Speaking about torture prosecutions.
May 5th, 2009 at 5:36 pmAshcroft: “The government must hold accountable any individuals who acted illegally. Certainly, we should demand justice. But we must all remember that justice is a value, the adherence to which includes seeking the best outcome for the American people. In some cases it will be the punishing of bad actors.”
this just in… bush aides trying to soften torture report
Can someone please ask these torture suspects to butt out!
This isn’t the dark ages, and they won’t get away with these crimes. Everybody stop coddling bush, cheney, rice, rumsfeld, gonzales, addington, woo, bybee, to name just a few.
Lets get on with it DOJ. These suspects are very busy behind the scenes and in front of the cameras.
Next time they won’t be so careless and clumsy. Republicans claim investigation and prosecution of the bush administration would have a ‘chilling effect’ on govenment people. These people just need to know that the law will protect them and the DOJ will protect them and do it’s job fully. Guilty or not guilty, the law will protect them. This is the last chance to put this buschCo fire out, and a little chill will be well worth it. It’s only chilly at first anyway. Once the guilty partys leave the room things warm up fast.
Stupid republicans…
May 5th, 2009 at 5:47 pm“An indictment is often the death sentence for a corporation ”
Yeah right, more like a small fine and stern warning to the CEO.
“An ind
May 5th, 2009 at 5:58 pmThis is a job for: “WTF?”.
May 5th, 2009 at 9:52 pmCould someone refresh my memory for me, please? Was Ashcroft discussing the warrantless wiretapping program or the illegal torture program when he said (something like), ‘History will not look kindly at what we do here today.’ I forget which topic it was, and I know I don’t have the quote exactly right.
May 5th, 2009 at 10:11 pm“But we must all remember that justice is a value, the adherence to which includes seeking the best outcome for the American people.”
But, but, I thought that an acceptable Supreme Court Justice nominee wasn’t allowed to have empathy! Now I’m confused.
May 5th, 2009 at 10:35 pmAnytime he makes any sense, it has to be indirectly. Like all Baptists ministers on the right, he is morally and philosophically brain dead.
His party is moribund. Thank goodness.
May 6th, 2009 at 1:02 amI THANK
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ranus69, The college kids brought an end to the vietnam war by protesting. I wish the young kids, who are much smarter than we were, would do the same thing and demand that the laws be enforced. Hey Nixon, got it for wiretapping, this situation is no different. The future is yours, us republicans screwed it up royally and for that I am so sorry. Your generation needs to take action. When we had to organize, it was with mail (pony express) and landline phones. You guys have the internet,mobile phones and foresight. it should be easier.I would like to see the under 30 crowd show the world how to protest. Senator Leahy should definately support your actions. He has web site to solicit signatures for the truth commision.
May 6th, 2009 at 11:32 pm