McCain Delivers Hypocritical Attacks Against Obama On Gun Regulation
McCain Delivers Hypocritical Attacks Against Obama On Gun Regulation
This weekend, the National Rifle Association is holding its annual convention in Phoenix. The Arizona Daily Star reports that if you didn’t know any better, you would have thought it was a Republican campaign rally.
One of the speakers, RNC Chairman Michael Steele, claimed President Obama’s position in support of reinstating the assault weapons ban is “threatening to deny Americans their second amendment right.” But Steele previously held the same views on assault weapons as Obama.
Steele wasn’t the only conservative proffering hypocritical attacks. Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) told the NRA gathering that he will oppose any “separate agenda” to rein in gun-owners’ rights. Unsurprisingly, McCain didn’t discuss his 2001 position on eliminating the so-called gunshow loophole:
In 2001, Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., rattled the gun-rights lobby by collaborating with Sen. Joe Lieberman, then-D-Conn., on a bill to eliminate the so-called Brady law “loophole” that allows gun sales at shows without background checks.
“Criminals and gun traffickers have figured this out,” McCain said in a May 15, 2001, Senate floor speech announcing the ultimately unsuccessful measure. “Gun shows are the second leading source of illegal guns recovered in gun trafficking investigations. According to a recent report by Americans for Gun Safety, ‘the states that do not require background checks at gun shows are flooding the rest of the nation with crime guns.’ While 95 percent of buyers are cleared within two hours, the 5 percent who are not are 20 times more likely to be a prohibited purchaser. Background checks are an essential part of keeping guns from criminals and other prohibited individuals.”
McCain said he has “no plans” to revive his old legislation.
60,000 people are expected to attend the NRA convention this weekend, many of them rallying against what they perceive as “a growing hostility toward gun rights under the Obama administration.” “Our rights are under attack like never before, and at all levels of government,” NRA lobbyist Chris Cox said. And of course, the irrational panic induced by the NRA is helping drive the organization’s membership numbers. Watch a video compilation of some NRA members expressing their irrational fear that Obama will take away their guns:
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Oh boy, the NRA convention…
May 16th, 2009 at 6:02 pmWho’s going to channel Charleton Heston at the evening seances?
idiots!
May 16th, 2009 at 6:03 pmPhoenix?
Why don’t they just march on out of the convention center and spread out along the border, see if they can cut down on the gun running business down there…
Oh, wait, their sponsors might get mad…
nevar mynd….
May 16th, 2009 at 6:06 pmDont believe anything a lobbyist says
May 16th, 2009 at 6:13 pmChuck Norris, who else.
May 16th, 2009 at 6:15 pmSome how, in a bit of madness, Michael Steele delusionally states that the 2nd Amendment, which mentions “a well-regulated militia,” now gives people the right to own assault weapons, so that depressed people can go out and slaughter their friends, relatives, co-workers or fellow shoppers if they want to. Steele is just plain nuts!
May 16th, 2009 at 6:16 pm60,000 little bidy cry babies with guns in AZ trying to over compenstae for thier missing manhood. Sickos.
I wonder how many have clown suits hanging in their closets?
May 16th, 2009 at 6:17 pmNRA political contributions since 1990:
Democrats: $2,897,333 17%
Republiscum: $14,098,205 83%
Total $17,012,286
Nuf said!
May 16th, 2009 at 6:18 pm“Our rights are under attack like never before, and at all levels of government,” NRA lobbyist Chris Cox said.
did anyone think to ask him, “how?”… “why?”… “got proof?”…
May 16th, 2009 at 6:20 pm*facepalms* See, I don’t know what rise gun nuts get by instilling fear that “those gosh-darned libruls are hankerin’ to take me precious guns away.”
That bill against the gun-show loophole needs to be revitalized and brought back to Congress.
May 16th, 2009 at 6:21 pmThe good ol’ GOP just keeps using the tricks of fascism.
May 16th, 2009 at 6:22 pmI’m pretty sure I saw some of these bozos in the national forest a couple of weeks ago…
I came up behind two late model pickup trucks crawling along a two track, obviously “road hunting” (it’s turkey season here) The first one pulled over almost immediately, the camoflaged and sunglassed driver giving a big (rather nervous)wave as I drove around him… On the rear glass of the lead pickup is written in white grease paint: VOTE AGAINST SOCIALISM.
I thought to myself, well, at least they’re willing to vote.
It was also evidence of their general cowardice. Driving thru the forest, well armed, in big air conditioned trucks, ready to shoot any turkey who happens to run across the road in front of them. No one to see their little political statement but their fellow commandos.
May 16th, 2009 at 6:25 pmYou can bet that grease paint got wiped off at the first gas station on their way home.
i think they should show a loop of the eight year old from here in connecticut who blew his head off at a gun show with an uzi because both his parents and the gun dealer thought 8 was an appropriate age for a child to use and automatic assault weapon.
May 16th, 2009 at 6:34 pmThis is insulting. I am a gun owner and I have a permit to carry. Nobody in my family is scared that ‘Big Bad Obama’ is taking our guns away. This is just to scare up the already paranoid, ingnorant thugs otherwise known as the Republican base.
May 16th, 2009 at 6:35 pmFor a bunch of supposed tough guys, the NRA is behaving like little girls. Ooh! Ooh! Obama is going to take away my guns!
May 16th, 2009 at 6:36 pmThey believe the fearmongers at their word, as they mislead them while they are too unwilling to seek the truth.
Obama has no intention of taking away anyone’s guns and he has repeatedly said so.
The rightwing nuts will grasp any any straw to pander to a demographic.
Why don’t the supposed tough guys with guns realize they are being played for fools?
Who wins in this propaganda battle? Gun dealers.
Everyone else is a loser.
When another lunatic goes berzerk because he also believes Beck or Limbaugh or OReilly, we know who is to blame.
P.D.,
May 16th, 2009 at 6:38 pmit’s actually a method through these fear and smear mongers are increasing their sales. fear+weapons never equal anything good.
. . Steele, claimed President Obama’s position in support of reinstating the assault weapons ban is “threatening to deny Americans their second amendment right.”
What the hell is wrong with McGramps? Why is he so SCARED to stand up to these nuts at the NRA? Oh, I forgot, he is one of them and his mommy raised him to be a moma’s boy mambi-pambi anyhow! He doesn’t have the balls to stand up to anyone.
When did Obama say he was going to take away peoples guns- he never said anything like that but I guess when he said, ’some people resort to their religion and guns’ while in San Fran, they took that to mean he is against ALL guns?
But, come on, seriously what good are ASSAULT WEAPONS other than to SLAUGHTER INNOCENT MASSES and nothing could ever justify that action? How and why did these neo-cons become so paranoid and delusional? Have they always been that way? Is all this just because of the color of Obama’s skin? How can these people be so misguided? How stupid are they????
May 16th, 2009 at 6:40 pmIdiots trust the gun lobby- to create artificial shortages of guns- they trust the stupid chain emails to inform them and end up with AK-47’s they never even wanted, and stock up on ammo they’ll never shoot.
May 16th, 2009 at 6:53 pmCon-TURDS sure are ignunt.
“Our rights are under attack like never before, and at all levels of government,” NRA lobbyist Chris Cox said.
Let’s see, the D’s and Obama need to work on:
Iraq
Afghanistan
Torture
The Economy
Health Care
I don’t see gun control as an immediate need. But I’d feel a lot safer if Faux News and the WATB GOP would stop inciting their base!
May 16th, 2009 at 6:59 pmI’m sick to death of these morons.
They should all move to Texas and SECEDE already!!!!!!
Jebus. The Republic of Dumfukistan.
May 16th, 2009 at 7:01 pmThese idiots, IMHO, believe the Constitution is written thusly: “Everybody own guns.”
That is the only part of the Constitituion they know. And they know it well. They know nothing else in the Constitution. Only ‘own guns’.
May 16th, 2009 at 7:05 pmHere’s my idea:
The Consitution says “Everybody own guns”. True that.
BUT, the Constitution says NOTHING about ammo. There is nothing in the Constitution that ensures the “Right to bear ammo”…..only the “Right to bear arms”.
So…..since there is no Constitutionally guaranteed “right to bear ammo”, let’s OUTLAW AMMO!
And if we can’t outlaw ammo, let’s tax the ever-living-shit out of it – say, one bullet’s taxes would be about $1,000.00.
Would balance the Federal deficit in about one week! And render their damn guns worthless sooner or later.
Worst case scenario, the hicks couldn’t afford to buy ammo anymore and would just have to point their unloaded guns at each other and yell “BANG”!!! (That’d be a hoot to watch!)
May 16th, 2009 at 7:11 pmKey word terms of the rightwingnut: Fear, panic, afraid, threats, suspicious.
The Obama Administration has not made ONE move towards changing gun laws, yet these loons are drinking the proverbial kool aid. Why in heck do these people need so many guns?
May 16th, 2009 at 7:18 pmPhoenix radio stations have been running ads featuring Wayne LaPierre imploring people to bring their kids down to the PHX Convention Center for a weekend of “Family Fun”! And to check out all the “gear” onhand. Free entertainment to include famous country singers, country comedian!!!!!
I (sarcastically) encouraged one of my co-workers to bring her one-year old daughter to that for “Family Fun” and to let her, the daughter, ’squeeze off a few hunnert rounds from an assault rifle’ – it’d be FUN!!! Mom didn’t think that was a good idea…but she’s Canadian, so she must be a pussy.
Lastly, all visitors to the NRA show can bring their weapons to the show!!! But…the PHX Convention Center had to temporarily suspend their liquor license due to all the gun-toting visitors! Except the NRA wanted to serve alcohol in a couple of the break-out rooms. So they will collect your gun(s) at the door of the breakout room, serve you alcohol, and then when you leave the breakout room…..give back your gun(s)! When I mentioned that to the people at work, one guy just looked at me and said ’so they will take your gun, give you alcohol, and then give you back your gun???’ I said “YEAH!!!” He just walked away, shaking his head. He is a republican!
May 16th, 2009 at 7:26 pmFrom what I hear, the Constitution says you gotta own guns.
May 16th, 2009 at 7:27 pmTeleMan, good point, and with so many people losing their jobs, their houses, their health care, their life savings and
May 16th, 2009 at 7:29 pmpeace of mind, the last thing you should have is a whole bunch of semiautomatic weapons lying around.
Scottsdalian Says:
OMG! ROTFL! That’s fuggin’ crazy! Rightwingnuttia at it’s worst.
May 16th, 2009 at 7:29 pmOld man yelling at the clouds…again.
May 16th, 2009 at 7:37 pmI have been to a lot of Gun Shows, and what amazes me is the paranoia and outright racism at these events. And of course the venders who keep telling me that such a pretty lady needs protection. Yeah! Like I need a assault rifle when my .380 will suffice.
May 16th, 2009 at 7:39 pmI’ll second that, h.b. chavez
Scottsdalian, I just know you couldn’t have made that up.
May 16th, 2009 at 7:44 pmIf the constitution says everybody gets a gun shouldn’t it be unconstitutional to keep felons from owning guns. An Uzi to every convict upon release … heeeeee haw!
May 16th, 2009 at 7:52 pmHey, Doodle – you just gave me an idea! Let’s charge all these gun-nuts with Felony Stupidity…..and then tell them that since they are now convicted felons they are prohibited from owning guns!
May 16th, 2009 at 7:58 pmWe don’t have enough prison space to charge wingnuts with felony stupidity.
May 16th, 2009 at 8:03 pmJohn McCain , where do the reasonable members of your party go? Day by ady, week by week you Republicans keep moving to the fringes of the right for support, deserting the middle of the country. At this rate your corporate sponsors may have some second thoughts.
May 16th, 2009 at 8:08 pmYou better think twice before you completely open Pandora ’s Box!
Has Dick Cheney been invited to NRA to talk about that time he “had a few beers,” shot the old guy in the face, then sent his friend out to lie about it.
May 16th, 2009 at 8:10 pmI’d settle for having McCain think ONCE!
May 16th, 2009 at 8:11 pmI think the Republican Party opened Pandora’s Box a long time ago. The magic genie is out and there is no way to put it back in. Game over.
May 16th, 2009 at 8:14 pmScottsdalian Says:
——————————————————————————–
flight Says:
You better think twice before you completely open Pandora ’s Box!
I’d settle for having McCain think ONCE!
“”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"
You got a point!!!
May 16th, 2009 at 8:20 pmIf anything happens to Obama steele ought to be charged with conspiracy. The republican party is trying to get the president of the united states assassinated. The want an an unemployed wingnut to take a shot. they do, why else would they continue to whip up the loyal idiots?
May 16th, 2009 at 8:32 pmI was raised with guns, hunting, trapping, fishing etc. I serve a year in Vietnam. I have little desire to even be around guns anymore but I do not begudge anyone for wanting them. They should understand the destuction they can cause.
I wouldn’t be within five miles of one of these things because as far as I can tell, this is the right wing extremist fringe that is not screwed on very tight.
May 16th, 2009 at 8:50 pmIt’s at this point in every N.R.A. that I like to say:
The head of the NRA, Wayne LaPierre was my best friend from 1965-72. He lies about where he went to college his junior and senior years (1969-71) in order to hide his left-wing political activity and illegal drug use. He claims he went to Siena all four years, but he went to S.U.N.Y.–Albany the third and fourth years. I rode from Virginia to Albany with him in 1969.
May 16th, 2009 at 8:53 pmHe was on the Moratorium Committee which shut down SUNY-Albany in May 1970, after Kent State killings and the revelation of taking the war into Cambodia.
He totally agreed with the Chicago Eight (Abbie Hoffman, Jerry Rubin, David Dellinger, Tom Hayden, Rennie Davis, John Froines, Lee Weiner, and Bobby Seale). They were heroes to him. Tom Paxton, Arlo Guthrie, Joan Baez, Woody Guthrie, and Phil Ochs were, too.
In the summer of 1972 I went to the draft physical with him. He had a low lottery number, meaning he would definitely be drafted and sent to Nam later in the year. But he said he got a friendly family doctor to say (falsely) that he had a nervous condition, and thus got a deferment.
Contrary to what he says now, he never touched a gun before he was 24 and always said how much he hated the ‘gun nuts’. He is afraid of anyone who knew him his first 24 years.
every N.R.A. discussion
May 16th, 2009 at 8:54 pmIt seems as if Steele and McCain and many of the conservative leaders will grasp at any straw to keep their names in the news. It’s amazing that Steele is oblivious to how many people at the “convention” feel about HIM. Steele and McCain are stupidity personified. I almost hate to read/hear the next stupid thing coming out of conservative leaders’ mouths, but then I start laughing really loud. But I do feel a bit sorry for the people who hang onto their every word, not realizing they’re being lied to. Many conservatives have also infected their offspring with the same clueless, robotic, butt-sniffing behavior. One of my students recently told me that he and his father listen to Rush Limbaugh everyday, and that they agree with what he says. I really feel sorry for this young man, but I feel even better when I think about the fact that he doesn’t live with me.
May 16th, 2009 at 9:01 pmWhat scares me is a bunch of ignorant people are buying up guns and ammo in droves.
It’s only a matter of time before they start shooting them, right?
May 16th, 2009 at 9:17 pmUnless you are brave enough to steal bullets, that would make robbing a convenience store a total bust. =D
Seriously, even if Obama did or is doing anything to that extent and say this wasn’t paranoia driven sales. The chicago police require a rigorous physical/competency exam in order for even its own officers to carry an m16. What point do these half sober beer bellies just decide they have a right to a gun that can saw through a tree.
Also OT, but not sure why we cant require a training course/evaluation to get a foid card. maybe some actual instruction in accident prevention/ respect for the dynamics of the firearm would benefit these knuckleheads. and btw try bow hunting you yokel conservative p*ssies. It requires effort instead of just point and click devastation of woodland creatures. Not to mention makes it much harder for you guys to shoot each other in the face.
…steps off the soapbox…
May 16th, 2009 at 9:28 pmJames Brady worked for the most pro-gun President in the history of America, Ronald Reagan. But then Brady became the world’s #1 lobbyist for gun control after John Hinkley blew the top of his head off with a .22 caliber handgun.
May 16th, 2009 at 9:42 pmtettes Says:
It’s only a matter of time before they start shooting them, right?
________
Uh… unless I’m mistaken, some of them have been…
Sean Hannity and Glen Beck must be very pleased and proud…
May 16th, 2009 at 9:43 pmDelafield Says:
But then Brady became the world’s #1 lobbyist for gun control after John Hinkley blew the top of his head off with a .22 caliber handgun.
____________
Funny how that worked out, huh?
May 16th, 2009 at 9:45 pmKeith Says:
It’s at this point in every N.R.A. that I like to say:
The head of the NRA, Wayne LaPierre was my best friend from 1965-72. He lies about where he went to college his junior and senior years (1969-71) in order to hide his left-wing political activity and illegal drug use
If you can document this, it is your patriotic duty to do so. ASAP.
May 16th, 2009 at 9:52 pmi’m with bobwurst there, keith…
May 16th, 2009 at 10:10 pmhope you are able to shine that light… taking utmost care, of course…
these are some carazy folk!
Let’s not forget this little nugget of a report way back then:
DHS Report: After Obama’s Election, “Right-Wing Extremists May Be Gaining New Recruits”
Think Progress Link
May 16th, 2009 at 10:13 pmI really don’t see how forbidding citizens from owning the kind of gun the cop killer used to kill three policeman is infringing on their rights to bear arms. If that guy had not had an assault weapon he may have been able to kill one copy but not all three.
May 16th, 2009 at 10:16 pmThe bottom line is that the SOLE purpose of a gun is to kill.
No amount of hyperbole or blustering about Constitutional rights can change that fact.
The sole purpose of a gun is to kill. A human being or an animal.
Kill.
May 16th, 2009 at 10:43 pmBobwurst Says:
——————————————————————————–
If anything happens to Obama steele ought to be charged with conspiracy. The republican party is trying to get the president of the united states assassinated. The want an an unemployed wingnut to take a shot. they do, why else would they continue to whip up the loyal idiots?
OMG! It does make me wonder what the hell their purpose is for feeding the fringe this lie.
May 16th, 2009 at 10:46 pmSteele previously held the same views…
Thankfully he wised up!
McCain has no plans to revive his old legislation.
I am glad to see that he recognized the error in his old legislation.
May 16th, 2009 at 10:48 pmThere is currently several pieces of legislation in congress that are anti gun or “gun control” legislation. H.R 2159, H.R. 2324, H.R. 45 and their companion bills in the Senate are just a few. Although Obama is not pushing for gun control, based on his past voting record, it is fair to assume that he would sign any ant gun bill that passes his desk. Thanks to the mean and nasty NRA, and its millions of $25 paying members, these bills have little chance of going anywhere. Bills are introduced regularly. That seems like an attack on gun rights to me.
May 16th, 2009 at 11:00 pmhormiga brava chavez,
May 16th, 2009 at 11:14 pmAt the current state of the Repulican party, the fringe groups are all they’re willing to make room for. No room for reasonable people!
Stagoculus Says:
Although Obama is not pushing for gun control, based on his past voting record, it is fair to assume that he would sign any ant gun bill that passes his desk.
________
Speculation and therefore meaningless.
May 16th, 2009 at 11:27 pmThe President and Congress need to grow a spine and deal with the NRA and conservatives.
1. Institute a permanent assault weapons ban
2. Close any and all gun show loopholes
3. Register all privately owned weapons
4. Limit the amount of guns an individual can own
What’s the worst that could happen? The NRA would fund unsubstantiated attacks against the President and the Democratic party. Oh wait, they’re already doing that. They want a fight – give them one.
May 16th, 2009 at 11:42 pmflight, true indeed. Seems like their base is full of the wingnut fringe element.
Stagoculus, Steele is anything but wise and McGrampy wouldn’t dare revive his old legislation because he wants to get re-elected. These two will say whatever is convenient – no matter how wrong or evil.
May 16th, 2009 at 11:45 pmVanWinkle65 BLOG WHORE! GET OUT!
May 17th, 2009 at 12:04 amah ha… finally, the true colors come out…
May 17th, 2009 at 12:07 amIt’s hilarious how out of step the NRA is. Even though Obama has little to no plans to change gun regulations they become more and more strident in denouncing the Democrats. They feed on controversy so they make it up when there isn’t anything real.
May 17th, 2009 at 12:08 amVanWinkle65 Says:
You wingnuts fail everytime trying to associate President Obama with Osama Bin Laden. We all know that Osama Bin Laden has been paling around with the Bush Crime Family for decades. Bush Bin Lyin, Cheney Bin Lyin, the CIA Bin Lyin.
May 17th, 2009 at 12:09 amThe Republic of Hymenoptera Stupidity Says:
Speculation and therefore meaningless.
Speculation, yes meaningless, not hardly. The NRA and its honorable members know the threat that faces them is minor but that is in large part due to their actions. By taking a proactive stance and increasing their membership and therefore their lobby power and war chest money, they have the ability to stop these useless and ineffective pieces of legislation before they gain much momentum. Keep up the good fight NRA.
May 17th, 2009 at 12:15 amYes, Stago, by all means, let’s continue our annual rate of 30,000 gun-related deaths. Let’s not learn from civilized countries that have far, far less of a problem than us.[snark]
May 17th, 2009 at 12:48 amThe President and Congress need to grow a spine and deal with the NRA and conservatives.
1. Institute a permanent assault weapons ban
2. Close any and all gun show loopholes
3. Register all privately owned weapons
4. Limit the amount of guns an individual can own
What’s the worst that could happen? The NRA would fund unsubstantiated attacks against the President and the Democratic party. Oh wait, they’re already doing that. They want a fight – give them one.”
That would be great except for….
“A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.”
That damn Constitution will get you every time.
May 17th, 2009 at 1:04 amWhy don`t these RED STATE whiners go and form another confederacy so they can do what they want to do and not bother the 80 percent of us who don`t give a hoot about the Reich wing nuts…..oops that would mean they would need police,military,
May 17th, 2009 at 1:04 amFire fighters,city workers,and a whole host of gov`t yes I said gov`t policy`s and ideologies and dogma that they will all have to agree upon and then the gun fights ensue and next thing you know the Reich wing nut job Christo fascist are extinct and we on the left can live happily ever after with health care that works for everyone and a whole host of other Democratic policy`s that we all want and need to fix this mess.
Seeing as over 10,000 of those deaths are from drug and gang violence and another 17,000 are suicide I would think that these are the problem areas that need addressed. perhaps some real laws and penalties for violent crime instead of enacting laws that are impossible to enforce and ineffective in what they are trying to correct. Yeah lets try some “feel good” legislation so everyone can continue to do drugs and think that they are not contributing to the real problem. Yeah outlawing assault rifle, that are used in less than 1 percent of gun crimes, will solve all the problems. We banned so called “assault” rifles, which they are not, during the clinton administration. and did that do anything? NO, it was a useless and ineffective law. Then after that ban lapsed guess what happened to violent gun crime, it decreased. so maybe that is not the answer. Lets do something that will work and banning guns is not it.
May 17th, 2009 at 1:07 amRP,
Is the current situation really a well-regulated militia?
Where is the militia? Where is the regulation? The reason we are arguing is because you want no regulation.
The enormous Mexican drug armies get there weapons in the US. The drug armies in Colombia get their weapons in the US. An al Qaeda manual said the best place in the world to buy a large number of high-powered weapons was the US.
May 17th, 2009 at 1:13 amStago,
May 17th, 2009 at 1:16 amThey have a hell of a lot of drug violence and gang violence in Britain (and even race riots), but they do not supply them with easy access to an unlimited number of AK-47’s, you moron.
great brittain also has a much higher rate of knife murders, occupied home invasions and other non gun violent crimes than the US and their violent crime is increasing as they enact stricter gun laws while are violent crime is decreasing as we loosen our gun laws you moron. Great model to follow. lets increase our crime. STFU idiot
May 17th, 2009 at 1:21 amalso ak-47s, and ar-15s are very rarely used in crime, less than one percent in fact. so i am sure that banning those so called assault rifles will be real effective. oh yeah we already did that once and it did not work. so lets address the real problem either lock up drug and gun offenders and throw away the key or legalize drugs and regulate drugs so that it is not so profitable. problem solved.
May 17th, 2009 at 1:33 amIn the 1960’s when Britain had strict gun laws and very few guns—they would have about 100 homicides a year. This is out of a population of 60 million and included the troubles in Northern Ireland. Their homicide rate is going up because a hell of a lot more guns are coming into the country. And what is their per capita homicide rate now? One-fifth of ours? And don’t just look at one other country, look at every one in Europe, Canada and Australia.
In 1981, Los Angeles had about 1,100 homicides with a population of 3.5 million.
I won’t tell you to STFU, because even morons have free speech.
May 17th, 2009 at 1:35 amWe already have more people in jail than any other country in the world—including China which has four times the population.
May 17th, 2009 at 1:38 am(Wikipedia) homicides per 100,000:
May 17th, 2009 at 1:58 amUSA———5.80
New Zealand 2.00
France—– 1.59
Belgium—- 1.50
Australia– 1.45
England+Wales 1.37
Italy—— 1.32
Spain—— 1.14
Germany—- 0.98
Denmark—- 0.98
Netherlands 0.97
Ireland—- 0.91
Luxembourg- 0.90
Austria—- 0.81
Norway—– 0.78
Greece—– 0.76
Japan—— 0.64
all of the major cities in the US have extremely high murder rates and it is directly correlated to drug and gang violenc combined with the strictest gun laws in the US. Los Angeles, Chicago, New York and DC. Then the states with much less drug gang problems and much looser gun laws have extremely low gun violence. dont just look at one city or state. check out Montanas or Vermonts rate of gun murders. So eliminate drug/gangs therefore eliminate gun violence. Dont have to lock more people up just legalize drugs just like most of Europe lax drug laws = less violent crime. BTW You called me a moron so I retaliated with the STFU. if you keep it civilized then I keep it civilized.
May 17th, 2009 at 2:00 amStago,
May 17th, 2009 at 2:10 amChicago or DC having strict gun laws does not work—-because they do not stop everyone entering DC or Chicago from places where the gun laws are lax. Many 10-year olds can understand this concept. They have drug and gang violence in all the countries in my list. Did you notice how much lower their homicide rates are? That is empirical evidence.
Those are great statistics now where is the correlation? Great Brittian has extremely strict gun laws Netherlands has Gun registration but owning any gun that you can own in the US is just as easy and Norway has gun laws that are right in line with the US. Now take the murder rates in the eastern block countries, which also have gang/organized crime and drug cartels, such as russia latvia and poland. their murder rate per 100,000 is much higher than the US all around 13 per 100,000. and they have strict gun laws. again the correlation is with gangs not guns. BTW norway also has gun ownership rates that match the US.
May 17th, 2009 at 2:11 amso why then does montana have such a low murder rate when they have the most lax gun laws in the US? and vermont? Guns do not = violence. Bad people = Violence. Also as crime has decreased in the US over the past 15 years the greatest decreases were experienced in the states that passed concealed carry laws where as states that enacted stricter gun laws crime rates remained the same or increased such as DC and Chicago. and during those sane fifteen years crime increased in Europe. and gun ownership in the US also increased. SO I am finding quite difficult to correlate more guns especially assault rifles with more crime. The numbers show otherwise.
May 17th, 2009 at 2:21 amIt is getting late here in the eastern time zone and I have to do some Turkey hunting in the morning and sight in my new AR-15 in the afternoon, so I will have to say farewell for the night.
May 17th, 2009 at 2:24 amStago,
Your “Up is down” theories do not fit the facts, no matter the spin. What you are arguing comes under sociology and I had ten sociology courses with better than a B average at a university that was #4 in the country in sociology. I also had 8 history and 5 political science.
I could ask: Why does New Mexico have a homicide rate of 8.88, Texas 6.07, and Massachusetts 2.64? Doesn’t Mass have strict gun laws and big cities? Don’t NM and TX have lax laws?
May 17th, 2009 at 2:32 amPretty brave of you to go up against turkeys with only an AR-15.[snark]
May 17th, 2009 at 2:35 amThe causes of crime are poverty, inequality, and the sense that obeying the law does no good. Leading cause of poverty in US is being born into poverty. Those Eastern bloc countries have a great deal of poverty and inequality. They have an Al Capone style capitalism.
May 17th, 2009 at 2:46 amKeith,
“…the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.”
A well regulated militia is only possible with the ladder half of the amendment. I understand your side of the argument and absolutely sympathize with it, we just need to uphold the Constitution.
May 17th, 2009 at 2:49 amby the way, McCain is a lying sack of politician.
May 17th, 2009 at 2:53 amRP,
May 17th, 2009 at 3:05 amYou probably mean “latter”. The conservatives are also arguing against the regulation that the 2nd Amendment makes clear. These militias were necessary back then. The British burned a good part of DC in 1814. I would argue our National Guard and Reserves take the part of the well-regulated militia—-not Billy Bob, an AR-15 and two six-packs in his pickup.
McCain had some good policies in 2000. Today he is pandering so much, he doesn’t know where he is supposed to be on any issue.
May 17th, 2009 at 3:07 amSo the country with the worlds’ highest homicide rate is enslaved by those who profit from the sale of lethal weapons, and can inflame their supporters by simply suggesting the words ‘gun control,’ which they have successfully transmuted into the word ’socialism.’
Until the US enters the 21st century and disavows the ridiculous notion that killing people is a constitutional duty, because these morons claim their ‘right’ to bare arms is intractable, the country will remain committed to the idea that giving anyone the opportunity to kill is somehow the mark of a civilized society.
The NRA could not be more evil.
May 17th, 2009 at 8:29 am‘Speculation, yes meaningless, not hardly. The NRA and its honorable members know the threat that faces them is minor but that is in large part due to their actions. By taking a proactive stance and increasing their membership and therefore their lobby power and war chest money, they have the ability to stop these useless and ineffective pieces of legislation before they gain much momentum. Keep up the good fight NRA.’
The NRA doesn’t care how many Americans are slaughtered in the streets as long as the profits keep pouring in.
This is honorable to you?
May 17th, 2009 at 8:37 am‘Guns do not = violence. Bad people = Violence.’
What exactly do you think guns are designed for?
They are made to kill; that is all. Giving people a false sense of their ‘right’ to own lethal weapons, and then pretending that ‘right’ will be faithfully adhered to is insanity.
It’s the same logic the NRA trots out after one of your seemingly endless school massacres; if only MORE people had been armed, the shooting spree MIGHT have ended sooner.
Don’t deal with the issue; the insanity of NO gun control in a nation with the highest homicide rate in the world, instead deal with the paranoia, and give MORE people MORE guns.
That’s like trying so save the Titanic by steering towards a bigger iceberg.
May 17th, 2009 at 8:42 amKeith Says:
McCain…is pandering so much, he doesn’t know where he is supposed to be on any issue.
May 17th, 2009 at 3:07 am
I agree, Keith. That’s why I wrote “The Panderer” last year.
May 17th, 2009 at 8:43 amWhy, if the NRA is such a patriotic organization, is their president a Frenchman? La Pierre is a Frenchman isn’t he? The La is La Pierre though would indicate a French woman not a French man. But a man with a woman’s name may indicate some unresoleved sexual identity crisis. Strange,I think, but no stranger than the NRA itself.
May 17th, 2009 at 9:09 amaljr1947 Says:
Why, if the NRA is such a patriotic organization, is their president a Frenchman? La Pierre is a Frenchman isn’t he?</em
Yeah, I was thinking the same thing about Barrack H. Obama.
May 17th, 2009 at 9:16 amI wonder how many times you heard the phrase “cold dead hands” during this convention?
May 17th, 2009 at 11:30 amKeith Says: @84
There you go citing your qualifications as if that makes your argument any better than anyone else however I have a very similar college background in social science comprehensive which constitutes many social and history classes. You are not the only one who went to college and posted good grades. I have a 3.625 GPA. Now with your knowledge I am surprised that you ignore the obvious sociological, and demographics that directly correlate to gun violence. Those are the issues that need addressed not banning guns. And most guns are designed to kill as are mouse traps. .410 is designed for small game and upland birds a 30-30 is designed to kill deer , but some guns are designed for self defense small caliber pistols have hardly enough power to effectively kill but they are very effective at stopping an attack. every gun has a legitimate purpose including hunting,sport and recreation, and self defense. there are 250 million privately owned guns in the US and a extremely small number of those guns are used in crime, most of which is inner city gang/drug related.
May 17th, 2009 at 11:55 amRP2012 Says:
“A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.”
So RP, what “well regulated militia” do you belong to? Also, I doubt that they had assault rifles back when they wrote the constitution.
May 17th, 2009 at 5:17 pmjrfunkenstein Says:
The NRA doesn’t care how many Americans are slaughtered in the streets as long as the profits keep pouring in.
This is honorable to you?
They also don’t care how many family members are killed each year. The truth of the matter is that you are more likely to kill a member of your family, or a neighbor, than you are an intruder. And unless you spend time each week at a gun range honing your skills, you are probably more likely to be killed by the intruder than to kill the intruder.
May 17th, 2009 at 5:21 pmWhen it comes to self defense, one is better off practicing Judo or some form of martial arts. By the time you find your gun to defend yourself in the dark or by being surprised, the intruder has already pistol whipped your a$$ or shot you for that matter.
The constitution needs to be modernized because sick-minded people keep using the old ways to justify new crimes.
A lot has changed in our +200 years of history.
May 17th, 2009 at 5:37 pmYES, WE ARE GOING TO TAKE YOUR GUNS AWAY!!!!!
May 17th, 2009 at 6:19 pmStagoculus Says:
Now take the murder rates in the eastern block countries, which also have gang/organized crime and drug cartels, such as russia latvia and poland. their murder rate per 100,000 is much higher than the US all around 13 per 100,000. and they have strict gun laws. again the correlation is with gangs not guns. BTW norway also has gun ownership rates that match the US.
Stagocockulus,
You are full of shhiiittt.
May 17th, 2009 at 6:32 pmhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence
Wayne Ant Schneider,
May 17th, 2009 at 6:33 pmVery very good. You are TP’s own Weird Al Yankovich.
In the ongoing aftermath of the previous administration with the questionable abuses of certain civil liberties, the reaction of the majority of posters on this website to those abuses always leaves me amazed at how many people would just roll over and freely give away a right that was put into the founding framework of this country.
May 17th, 2009 at 7:09 pmAlecto Says: @102
Your stats are conveniently 9 years old: try some current stats and I am no longer full of shit now am I??? Try to keep up with current events alectblow!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_murder_rate
May 17th, 2009 at 7:34 pmrightwing-leftwing Says:
“The constitution needs to be modernized because sick-minded people keep using the old ways to justify new crimes.”
Really?
May 18th, 2009 at 12:07 am# 106,
Yep. That’s my opinion. It won’t happen though ….. ;)
May 18th, 2009 at 2:10 am#
#
rightwing-leftwing Says:
# 106,
Yep. That’s my opinion. It won’t happen though ….. ;)”
lol to each his own…but hell, that’s what is great about our Constitution.
May 18th, 2009 at 2:29 amçet
May 18th, 2009 at 6:29 amChat sitesi
Sohbet istanbul thank you very much.
And if the first writing of the Constitution had a peanut butter stain of the sandwitch, there would be mandatory that every american had a peanut butter sandwitch every morning.
For God’s sake! It’s a 200+ old document! Modernize it. There is no need to grant a weapon to every citizen, it’s a dangerous and backwards law.
May 18th, 2009 at 8:57 amYeah…and maybe update that whole freedom of speech and religion thing. Oh.. and the whole unreasonable search thing.
“It’s just a goddamned piece of paper!”, after all.
May 18th, 2009 at 10:22 amtoonces Says:
Yeah…and maybe update that whole freedom of speech and religion thing. Oh.. and the whole unreasonable search thing.
“It’s just a goddamned piece of paper!”, after all.
May 18th, 2009 at 10:22 am Recommend (0) | Report Abuse
Hum… hyperbole to discredit my point? You understood what I meant. Care to explain how many ammendments has had the original Constitution, and the need of them?
The time of fighting the british has been gone for a while. Dodge City only reached peace when all incoming people consigned their weapons at the sherriffs’ office.
May 18th, 2009 at 11:36 am#114, I see your point. When a law is ambiguous or can be read two ways (creates a wedge issue), it should be rewritten for clarity.
Rewriting the constitution may come back to haunt either side of the issue though since money and corruption is in politics right now. If we had clean money campaigns, I might agree 100% based on how our law makers are at that point. We just can’t trust those slippery snakes, ya know.
May 18th, 2009 at 2:09 pmEvil Spaniard – you probably know what I mean.
I don’t think it’s hyperbole to point out what’s already been done in a post 9-11 world. I was just trying to point out that if some people wish the Second Amendment updated just because they believe it’s outdated, then I guess supporters of the past administration could make the argument that other rights need to be “amended” in these ever so trying times – all in the name of “safety”.
Yes – fighting the British is a thing of the past. But, the founders of this country were concerned with the government they were creating. They were already trying to protect from the possible enemy within. That’s why they were very wary of creating a standing army. You can kick and scream all you want about it, but the second amendment was put in there to arm the people so that the government couldn’t over step its bounds.
Are you really wanting the “sheriff” to be the only one armed?
May 18th, 2009 at 6:59 pmGlad to see I’m not the only progressive who knows anything about the Second Amendment. Here are some other statistics:
I don’t know where you live, but I live in New Hampshire where not only are long rifles not registered or licensed, but neither are handguns. However, as with anywhere else, a federal background check is done to make sure you’re not a felon or an adjudicated mental “defective” (that’s how the law reads). AND, WE HAVE THE LOWEST CRIME RATES IN THE NATION:
http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/nh-lowest-nevada-highest-crime/story.aspx?guid=%7B8EA90E82-CBC9-4707-989A-21490804B30C%7D&dist=msr_1
Note that Maine and Vermont came in second and third too. Both states have are very gun friendly as well. You can even carry a loaded weapon in VT without a permit, because there is no requirement for a concealed carry permit in the state.
And do a little research on the 2nd Amendment before you start talking about it. The right to keep and bear arms was never meant to be confined to militias. We have the right to keep and bear arms so that WE CAN form a militia. The militia is not a qualifier for gun ownership, but rather gun ownership is required for free people to form militias.
Let’s just say, what if Bush declared he would remain president and declared martial law (whatever the circumstances). Let’s say he goes on to impose a tyrannical government on the people where people are taken prisoner and held without charges, and well, you fill in the blanks. Would we then ask the tyrant to supply us with some weapons so we can form a militia to overthrow it?? Doesn’t make a lick of sense, does it.
“Well Regulated” means that the militia itself is well regulated within itself, not by the federal government. If you look at the use of the phrase in other documents of the time, you’d realize this.
And, for the love of god, stop talking about gun control before you give Congress back to the Repugs at the mid-term elections! You’re going to ruin all the Progress we’ve made with this talk.
May 19th, 2009 at 7:37 am