Rep. Hoekstra: Only I’m Allowed To Accuse The CIA Of Lying
Rep. Hoekstra: Only I’m Allowed To Accuse The CIA Of Lying
In recent days, conservatives have been on a media blitz accusing Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) of lying last week when she said that she believed she had been “misled” by the CIA during intelligence briefings regarding the use of torture. Last night on Fox News’s On The Record, Rep. Pete Hoekstra (R-MI) continued this blitz, arguing that Pelosi did not want to “take accountability and responsibility for the actions that she took in 2002, 2003″ and is instead simply “blaming the CIA.”
When host Greta Van Sustern pointed out that “CIA has not been perfect” in recent years, Hoekstra explained that in his view it is okay to criticize the agency’s performance, but it is another thing to accuse the CIA of having misled Congress:
HOEKSTRA: I think you do go back and you break it into two different issues. One is the performance, how well, they’re doing their job. The second is whether they have misled or lied to Congress, two very, very different issues.
Watch it:
Yesterday on CNN’s American Morning, Hoekstra made similar remarks, referring to Pelosi’s claims as “outrageous accusations.” He also appeared last night on CNN’s Lou Dobbs Tonight and this morning on talk radio with Bill Bennett and Laura Ingraham.
Hoekstra’s repeated objections to Pelosi accusing the CIA of having lied to Congress is quite odd given the fact that he’s made nearly identical claims on multiple occasions. As Marcy Wheeler first noted, Hoekstra wrote a letter to President Bush in 2006 accusing the intelligence community of withholding information on their activities from Congress. “I have learned of some alleged Intelligence Community activities about which our committee has not been briefed,” Hoekstra wrote. He said that he believed the Bush administration’s failure to fully brief his committee could constitute “a violation of law“:
Similarly, in 2007, Hoekstra described a closed-door briefing by representatives from the intelligence community (including CIA) on the National Intelligence Estimate of Iran’s nuclear capability, saying that the members “didn’t find [the briefers] forthcoming.” More recently, in November 2008, Hoekstra concluded that the CIA “may have been lying or concealing part of the truth” in testimony to Congress regarding a 2001 incident in which the CIA mistakenly killed an American citizen in Peru. “We cannot have an intelligence community that covers up what it does and then lies to Congress,” Hoekstra said of the incident.
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Is Hoekey’s middle name Janus?
May 19th, 2009 at 3:51 pmOopsie. Of course Republicans are noted for both short memories and being unaware of recent technological advancements that record both words and pictures.
May 19th, 2009 at 3:53 pmThat’s right, keep putting up Pelosi as the straw man to obscure the fact that the United States, under Bush, illegally tortured people.
Only real idiots *cough* trolls *cough* will focus on Pelosi rather than on the fundamental facts of this issue.
May 19th, 2009 at 3:53 pmWhat about IOKIYAR do you not understand?
When a gooper says it, it is the right thing to say. When a dem says it, it is political blasphemy.
May 19th, 2009 at 3:54 pmI fell into the trap that the Rethugs set in trying to hold Pelosi accountable, not realizing that they had set her up to take the fall and for that I apologize…
but I won’t apologize for seeing this as another exercise of IOKIYAR…These conservative hypocrites including our trolls lambasted the CIA when they tried to debunk the lie about Al Qaeda and Iraq being bosom-buddies, but now they suddenly become the defenders of that “downtrodden” agency?
May 19th, 2009 at 3:58 pmSo, just like the authoritarian ‘daddy state’ GOP, Hoekstra is griping about the very same thing he did in the past? I guess he figures the lazy citizenry and the bought and paid for MSM will not notice the contradiction?
The CIA are paid liars and they have been pushed around by President Cheney for a long time. moles are surely burrowed into the department, and I read the CIA may stop investigating threats to the US if we look into the legailty of torture and the CIA’s role in it. Now that’s some ‘Country First’, huh? Fire them all, start over from scratch. Bush ruined every corner of this government.
May 19th, 2009 at 3:59 pmThis is an excellent piece of reporting! You’ve said it all. I hope the Dems start hammering Hoekstra &/or profusing thanking him for repeatedly supporting Speaker Pelosi’s assertions.
The Constant Weader at http://www.RealityChex.com
May 19th, 2009 at 4:00 pmFine. If these people want to build a nice pyre for the witch burning of Pelosi, have at it boys.
Of course, you do realize that the cordwood needed is the people who generated the nastiness you are accusing her of hiding…right?
May 19th, 2009 at 4:01 pmShorter Peter Hoekstra: IOKIYR.
May 19th, 2009 at 4:11 pmIf only I had thought of this defense in high school!
“well, yes, teacher, I was smoking in the boys room, but nancy knew about it and didn’t tattle, so ignore my crime and focus on her!”
And right wingers wonder why they only appeal to 1/5th of the country.
May 19th, 2009 at 4:11 pmThis sounds a hell of a lot more like:
“if we go down, we’re taking you with us”
let’s see if Pelosi calls their bluff
May 19th, 2009 at 4:13 pmRantingTommy Says:
This sounds a hell of a lot more like:
“if we go down, we’re taking you with us”
You mean, taking down the people in Congress who owe their allegiance to who ever keeps them in power?
Lets rock and roll.
May 19th, 2009 at 4:18 pmTwo words come to mind: George Tenet
May 19th, 2009 at 4:19 pmI also recall that many politicos and pundits denied the Iran nuke report by 16 intelligence agencies.
May 19th, 2009 at 4:21 pmThe Hive Mind of the Republic Fascist Party means never having to tell the truth.
Fcuk the Republic Fascist Party
May 19th, 2009 at 4:23 pmNow that the Senate has called for the NIE, the first marker has gone down, in the form of a report released this week by the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence chairman Peter Hoekstra. Disguised as a technical review of “gaps” in knowledge, the report tosses together speculations on the array of Iranian enrichment facilities, charges of its deceptions on these programs, notes on Iran’s missile development efforts with extraneous material -Tom Paine
May 19th, 2009 at 4:25 pmNeedless to say, the 9/11 “Truth” Movement people are repeating and amplifying the attacks on Pelosi.
After having spent the last eight years lying through their teeth about Republicans, the Truthers are now busily lying through their teeth about Democrats.
May 19th, 2009 at 4:29 pmNo, it’s a case of not seeing the forest for the trees. Repubs are so submersed, surrounded, engulfed, saturated with their own lies that they can’t see them. That’s why it’s ‘obvious’ to them that Pelosi is lying, while they can’t see that it’s all interconnected. The accusation would fall flat if all the other trees weren’t holding it up.
May 19th, 2009 at 4:30 pmDecember 6, 2007: Limbaugh Says Iran NIE a Product of ‘Sabotage’
Seems Limbaugh is lying about the CIA, saying it is misleading him.
May 19th, 2009 at 4:31 pmjosquen Says:
THANK YOU
May 19th, 2009 at 4:10 pm
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May 19th, 2009 at 4:31 pmSo where is the media….why is there no mention of Hoekstra’s allegations to show that Pelosi is merely pointing out that the breifers are not getting the job done. End of story.
May 19th, 2009 at 4:33 pmi know it’s just semantics, and i haven’t read any transcripts, but did nancy ever say, from HER mouth, “the CIA lied”…?
or, did the media latch onto the question, “are you saying the CIA lied to you?” and she answered “yes, they mislead the congress”…?
just curious…
May 19th, 2009 at 4:33 pm3.raynman Says: That’s right, keep putting up Pelosi as the straw man to obscure the fact that the United States, under Bush, illegally tortured people.
Here’s an idea: Prosecute bush officials and dump Pelosi in the bargain. Appoint Kucinich.
Anyone else want to push the bogus canards that Pelosi was “helpless” or wasn’t aware of the practice? Please?
May 19th, 2009 at 4:33 pmOkay, lets get to the brass tacks here. I bet if people were to google those that denied the NIE we would find many that thought they were being misled.
May 19th, 2009 at 4:33 pmThe so-called media doesnt do to good with “facts”, so dont expect this to be reported.
RIP
May 19th, 2009 at 4:34 pmSGT Stephen R. Sherman
C CO 1-5 IN (STRYKER)
KIA 3 Feb 2005
Mosul, Iraq
Here is the link to my post with Pelosi’s quote acknowledging her awareness of waterboarding.
May 19th, 2009 at 4:35 pmGee, Zelikow knew, why wouldnt others?
May 19th, 2009 at 4:35 pmWhy Dick Cheney didnt believe the CIA when it came to Iraq…did he think he was being misled? Why did he prefer alternative intelligence from Feith?
May 19th, 2009 at 4:37 pmSam Seder: Nancy Pelosi’s Authority
A small humorous clip from breakroomlive.com
May 19th, 2009 at 4:39 pmFrom Hanshiro’s link:
A Democratic source acknowledged yesterday that it is almost certain that Pelosi would have learned about the use of waterboarding from Sheehy. Pelosi herself acknowledged in a December 2007 statement that she was aware that Harman had learned of the waterboarding and had objected in a letter to the CIA’s top counsel.
I’d like a little more corroboration, than “almost certain,” when dealing with unnamed sources.
May 19th, 2009 at 4:40 pm30. Xisithrus Says: Why did he prefer alternative intelligence from Feith?
“Intelligence” and “Feith” most certainly do not belong in the same sentence…
May 19th, 2009 at 4:40 pm32. barfly Says: I’d like a little more corroboration, than “almost certain,” when dealing with unnamed sources.
That’s why I posted Pelosi herself admitting she was aware of Haraman’s letter and the reason. What more do you need than Pelosi’s own quote?
Is there a comprehension problem here?
May 19th, 2009 at 4:44 pmProud Says:
Really grasping for anything you can find now. Libs are pathetic, ole’ nancy lied and got caught, she needs to deal with it and either admit she lied or resign. Your constant whining that well this or that republican did something bad is rally sad. You are the party in power why not try governing instead of pointing fingers.
LMAO, you clown.
Your conservative buddies ransacked this country and drove it into the shitter. You’re whining now about the Speaker of the House, when the BIG lies came from the White House and Bush and Cheney and Rummy and all those ultimately incompetent bastards and you’re offended now? Get real. Your conservative heroes are lying sacks of shite who dreamed up a war and dreamed up torture as a means of obtaining knowingly false intelligence to launch an illegal war.
But Proud, I know you won’t have the stones to go toe to toe with anybody here based on facts, so I’ll stoop to your level.
Go Cheney yourself
May 19th, 2009 at 4:47 pmStratRat Says:
[...] I read the CIA may stop investigating threats to the US if we look into the legailty of torture and the CIA’s role in it. Now that’s some ‘Country First’, huh? Fire them all, start over from scratch. …
well, i have seen, though it’s been awhile, some TV commercials recruiting for the CIA… thought it was weird then…
May 19th, 2009 at 4:48 pmmakes sense now… as long as the requirements are at a very high bar…
Gosh, I love the Internet.
May 19th, 2009 at 4:56 pmIt boils down to this: We Progressives on this board are unworthy of pushing and perpetuating a fallacy.
Time and again I watch posters do their best to deflect an attack on “one of ours” by saying things like, “Why focus on Pelosi (red herring, etc.) When bush killed the WORLD! (Exaggeration added for effect.)
This is a f-a-l-l-a-c-y.
The attempt to redirect blame or culpability by citing the hypocrisy of, for example, republicans barking for Pelosi’s head, or perhaps some other poster you’ve deemed a troll, is called a “Tu Quoque” Fallacy (with some ad-hom mixed in…).
The fact is, Pelosi ‘took impeachment off the table.’ Didn’t begin investigations, didn’t call attention to the circumstances, hell didn’t do squat but keep her head down and give bush everything he wanted!
People died because of it. People were tortured to death.
Now Nancy is paddling like hell for her political life, willing to lie, divert and muddy the waters, with the help of the complicit media, to claim she was “helpless” (this is patently false!) or that she “didn’t know” (Her own quote blows that flimsy cover.)
Nancy is a coward who stood in the way of exposing the bush torture machine and, as far as I’m concerned, shares accountability in allowing such a disgrace to continue unchecked.
Pelosi needs to go; I don’t care who else is saying so. She betrayed the Constitution, her oath of office, countless treaties and the American people.
May 19th, 2009 at 5:04 pmAfter rolling in the canine feces all over your mom’s basement floor, please shower and get a clean change of close before coming back and stinking the place up, Obviously Shallow.
May 19th, 2009 at 5:05 pmProudMoron
Ah the babbling incoherence of ProudMorons first ignorant post of the thread. The stupid is strong. The ignorance and brainwashing quite pronounced. A typically worthless and stupid post by him. I am sure he is TRYING for the gold of stupidest most brainwashed troll but the competition is strong. He of course cannot refute anything IN the post. He doesnt even try. He knows he is far too stupid for actual cognitive function. So he spews his stupid in every directiong like a skunk or like the punkass troll he is. Far too stupid to actually contribute to the conversation just insulting us and trying to be annoying. How can he live with himself KNOWING that for the rest of his sad and pathetic life he is going to be this stupid and pathetic? How does he not just break down and cry at the thought that he is who he is? Ah the mysteries of ignorant punkass troll morons
May 19th, 2009 at 5:17 pmOS Says
OS is going to keep being a pathetically ignorant troll. No brain, no self respect, no ATTEMPT at relevance just pathetic and ignorant trolling with a side of proudly parading his stupidity
May 19th, 2009 at 5:20 pmOstentatiously STUPID says
Nothing anyone with a normal IQ could possibly care about. In other words his normal troll post. Look over there or anywhere but the TOPIC somewhere a dem is doing something bad. It is page two of the ignorant troll handbook. Just go kill yourself moron. There isnt enough oxygen for worthless punks like you
May 19th, 2009 at 5:22 pm’bout damn time…
Dems try to buck up Pelosi
msnbc.com – ?26 minutes ago?
Earlier today, NBC’s Luke Russert reported that House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer went out of his way to stand by House Speaker Nancy Pelosi in her back-and-forth with the CIA.
CIA to Obey: Our records ain’t perfect Politico
Democrats back Pelosi amid waterboarding controversy CNN
Talk Radio News Service – New York Daily News – FOXNews – USA Today
all 3,183 news articles »
http://news.google.com/news/more?pz=1&ncl=dYT3E74uJe81VFMPZxFDUu_1RbmuM&topic=h
(whoo! that alice stewart is a delusional puppy, not?)
May 19th, 2009 at 5:25 pmCIA to Obey: Our records ain’t perfect
A CIA spokesman is NOT pushing back on House Appropriations czar David Obey’s charge that its docket of Congressional briefings inaccurately reported that an Obey aide had attended a classified meeting on interrogations.
CIA spokesman Paul Gimigliano didn’t address the veracity of Obey’s claim — only that the agency’s records are, essentially, subjective and not culled from recordings or detailed transcripts.
He also admits to “different recollections” on the briefing, which was the gist of Pelosi’s claim — before she said she had been “misled.”
Gimigliano: “While CIA’s information has Mr. Juola attending briefings on September 19, 2006 and October 11, 2007, there are different recollections of these events, which Mr. Obey’s letter describes. As the agency has pointed out more than once, its list—compiled in response to congressional requests—reflects the records it has. These are notes, memos, and recollections, not transcripts and recordings.”
Panetta has made this point himself, albeit not as explicitly — a nuance largely overlooked by Pelosi’s GOP critics.
Panetta has said the CIA document was “truthful” to the recollections of CIA officers — but hasn’t vouched for those recollections.
http://www.politico.com/blogs/glennthrush/0509/CIA_to_Obey_Our_records_aint_perfect.html
May 19th, 2009 at 5:27 pmyer jumpin’ the gun there…
May 19th, 2009 at 5:32 pmthey just want to see a plan first… duh.
ObviouslyStupid
I dont care about TROLLS you igrnorant pile of dogshite. I dont care about people who KNOW they are too stupid to contribute to the conversation so they come here specifically to FUKC with us so I like to slap them around and laugh at them for being so utterly and completely stupid
May 19th, 2009 at 5:43 pmThe CIA Should have briefed Nancy Pelosi over the phone.
Then, at least we could read the NSA Wiretaps… to see who is telling the truth.
May 19th, 2009 at 5:57 pmThis whole dustup is to lying what the Super Bowl is to football.
May 19th, 2009 at 6:44 pmIt’s not “What did Pelosi know and when did she know it?”
It’s “What did Bush do and when did he do it?”
Don’t let the right wing continue to frame the debate. They are framing it in such a way that Bush and Cheney are blameless.
May 19th, 2009 at 7:04 pm54.Wayne Ant Schneider Says: It’s not “What did Pelosi know and when did she know it?”
It’s “What did Bush do and when did he do it?”
It’s both! I don’t want someone in power who knowingly and quietly stands by and does nothing about illegal torture any more than I want the torturers themselves.
Clean house!
May 19th, 2009 at 7:30 pmProud Says:
——————————————————————————–
Really grasping for anything you can find now. Libs are pathetic, ole’ nancy lied and got caught, she needs to deal with it and either admit she lied or resign. Your constant whining that well this or that republican did something bad is rally sad. You are the party in power why not try governing instead of pointing fingers.
#############################################################
PROUD,
May 19th, 2009 at 7:39 pmOne inescapable fact I can put in the Republican’s lap. Cheney/Bush left one big pile of dogshite on the floor and Obama and company are stuck cleaning it up. You Republicans own this mess, not Pelosi. This is too obvious to ignore.
Republicans screwed up royally.
You have to remember his audience. He’s thinking the rubes that will parrot this and echo it across the RW “echo chambers” won’t know this … or they are too stoopid to care….
Cheers,
May 19th, 2009 at 8:02 pmI grew up in this guy’s district. He’s someone who equates the Republican Party with Christianity, i.e., Republicans are ALWAYS right simply because they’re Republicans, and Democrats are NOT Christians who must be consistently opposed.
He’s a putz.
May 19th, 2009 at 8:48 pmOS Says:
I am not a hypocrite at ALL but you are a complete and TOTAL moron not just much but totally, completely and all the time. You should just go kill yourself. Nothing else anyone as stupid as you can possibly do to aid the advancement of mankind
May 19th, 2009 at 10:32 pmThe CIA is the sleaziest organization on the planet, and their history is full of assassinations, coups against democratically elected officials, and downright conspiracies. In fact, look at history, and see some of the people who started the agency in 1947.
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB146/index.htm
May 19th, 2009 at 10:34 pmHoekstra has gone way further than that. Why aren’t the destroyed CIA torture/interrogation tapes mentioned? On that subject, Hoekstra accused the CIA of lying about briefing him. I don’t know why nobody brings this up.
NY Times 12/07/07
In his statement, General Hayden said leaders of Congressional oversight committees had been fully briefed about the existence of the tapes and told in advance of the decision to destroy them. But the two top members of the House Intelligence Committee in 2005 said Thursday that they had not been notified in advance of the decision to destroy the tapes.
A spokesman for Representative Peter Hoekstra, Republican of Michigan, who was the committee’s chairman between 2004 and 2006, said that Mr. Hoekstra was “never briefed or advised that these tapes existed, or that they were going to be destroyed.”
The spokesman, Jamal Ware, also said that Mr. Hoekstra “absolutely believes that the full committee should have been informed and consulted before the C.I.A. did anything with the tapes.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/07/washington/07intel.html?_r=1
Hoekstra and others are making the case that its outrageous to say the CIA lied. But in Hoekstra’s case, he did the same thing, and on the same subject of receiving briefings, with briefings related to torture.
And how can the GOP claim that the CIA is so honest about what occurred concerning torture, when we know the CIA destroyed the interrogation tapes? We also know those tapes were requested by the 9/11 Commission and weren’t provided.
So the CIA lied and the GOP called them liars. Why the different standards now?
May 19th, 2009 at 10:38 pmProud Says:
Really grasping for anything you can find now. Libs are pathetic, ole’ nancy lied and got caught, she needs to deal with it and either admit she lied or resign. Your constant whining that well this or that republican did something bad is rally sad. You are the party in power why not try governing instead of pointing fingers.
GRASPING for straws is what the GOP is trying to do, pinning this on Pelosi…Way to project, my man…feel proud yet? We are talking about what happened under a Republican administration that approved of these torture methods and yet you would love to pass on the buck to the Democrats…Way to show off the party of personal responsibility…
May 20th, 2009 at 1:30 am