Frank Luntz: It doesn’t matter what Obama’s health care plan says, we’ll still call it ‘government takeover.’
Frank Luntz: It doesn’t matter what Obama’s health care plan says, we’ll still call it ‘government takeover.’
In an interview with the New York Times, GOP wordsmith Frank Luntz — who recently penned a health care messaging memo instructing Republicans to attack President Obama’s health reform efforts by criticizing the deficiencies in foreign health care systems — concedes that Republicans will label Obama’s reform effort a “government takeover” of health care, regardless of the actual proposal:
Is it a correct description of the president’s plans for reform?
We don’t know what he is proposing. We want to avoid “a Washington takeover.”But that’s not at issue. What the Democrats want is for everyone to be able to choose between their old, private health-insurance plan and an all-new, public health-insurance option.
I’m not a policy person. I’m a language person.
Indeed, “rather than challenging the tenets of American reform proposals, Luntz establishes a straw man argument against a non-existent health plan.” As Democratic strategist Paul Begala observes in a recent retort to the Luntz memo, “Because they know they cannot win the argument honestly, Republicans are resorting to mendacity.”
Cross-posted on The Wonk Room.
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If this country is to move forward on health care then we can no longer tolerate the spin meisters from the reichwing like Frank Duntz or the RePugniScum Party as currently constituted.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:05 pmoilforillegals Says:
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Bacause that’s exactly what it will be. How’s that 700 bil workin, obama? What’s that, it’s still sittin in the bank?
May 26th, 2009 at 8:04 pm
How’d that garbage 8 year Bush presidency work out for you and the country , tool ?
May 26th, 2009 at 8:06 pmThey don’t have any “policy people.” They’ve geared themselves to run 100% on “language” since 2004, when all were hailing Rove as a genius and they had managed to get rid of the estate tax simply by calling it a “death tax.”
So now, when they need desperately ideas, all they have is different words for things. It just doesn’t work on us anymore.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:07 pmI call it out of business for the health care insurance industry.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:07 pmI hope you’ll excuse us if we fail to accept your obviously well-informed analysis at face value.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:07 pmoilforillegals Says:
How’s that 700 bil workin, obama? What’s that, it’s still sittin in the bank?
What? Are your referring to the bailout? It’s my understanding that about half of it has been spent at present. Go Google it or something.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:09 pmNo matter what you call it Frankie, you are still an asshat for the thugs in the rethuglican party. You represent all that is wrong with this great nation. We need the government to take over health care to put the crooks who have destroyed it out of business. Understand?
May 26th, 2009 at 8:11 pmoilforillegals Says:
ralph the wonder locust Says
Nce retort.
***
you make it easy,
you old wordsmith, you!
:)
May 26th, 2009 at 8:13 pmNice retort.
–
–
… not really.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:15 pmYou know what would be funny – Obama should submit the McCain plan (aka “blow it all to hell”) and let them call it a government takeover for about a day, then yank that and submit his real plan.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:16 pmOFI,
May 26th, 2009 at 8:21 pmMay you always be blessed with good health.
Frank Luntz: It doesn’t matter what Obama’s health care plan says, we’ll still call it ‘government takeover.’
Yeah Frank , we know ; we know it doesn’t matter to the 18%’ers.
You and the GOP can shit on a plate and call it a souffle’ by topping it with whip cream ; it doesn’t mean that the rest of America is going to believe that ………..
May 26th, 2009 at 8:21 pmMost agree we need single payer or a public health care system.
But somehow we need to get through the bought and paid for Congress, by the health insurance industry, in order to pass this.
Let us not forget it was sen.Baucus, one of the largest acceptors of funds from the health insurance industry, chairman of the finance committee and a dem,that did not allow the single payer group a seat at the table during health care reform talks. In fact he twice arrested a single payer group, composed of hysicians and nurses.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:22 pmFrank Luntz was the last guy picked, even as ammunition, in the crap fight so many times he revels in his role as major domo for the worst elements in this country. But this time Frank it won’t work and I’ll give you 6 million unemployed reasons why. Everyone with a job gets up and wonders if its’ me next and that is a bigger fear than your dirty rotten spin machine, Frank.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:23 pmoldgranny Says:
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OFI,
May you always be blessed with good health.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:21 pm
Because it’s blatantly apparent they weren’t blessed with intelligence or honesty …………
May 26th, 2009 at 8:23 pmevery good parent, teacher, manager, etc, knows that you give choices…
so here, the choices are simple, and should be offered as such:
you have “government takeover” – you know, “We the People” government…
or you have “corporate takover” – you know, enrich the anonymous CEO…
May 26th, 2009 at 8:24 pmIt’s fun to watch Eric Cantor’s lips move while Frank Luntz’s hand is up his butt.
Americans are literally sick and tired of the GNOP wordplay tricks, but that won’t stop the spinmeisters and propogandists from doing all they can to protect for-profit health [access prevention] plans!
PEACE
May 26th, 2009 at 8:24 pmIs OilyIllegal the next iteration of piss soaked Archie? Or is ignorance simply spreading at an accelerated rate?
PEACE
May 26th, 2009 at 8:28 pmThe great Republican way – if you can’t beat them LIE on them!
May 26th, 2009 at 8:37 pmOFI = Troll Jay
May 26th, 2009 at 8:39 pmJust flag the Azzhat
I think you nailed it, spencers mom.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:39 pmRepugs have a liberal bias? That explains all their claims of the MSM being Librol.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:40 pmI’m not a policy person. I’m a language person.
And not even a good one at that, to boot.
Republicans like Luntz have a hard time understanding that, no matter how you describe it, the sky will still be blue.
It’s no wonder Republicans seem so disconnected from reality.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:43 pmhad enough Says:
I call it out of business for the health care insurance industry
Nice video, and it’s the truth. Insurance companies are evil.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:45 pmoldgranny Says:
OFI,
May you always be blessed with good health.
That is an excellent response to wingnuts regarding health care. Thanks, I’m going to have to start using that.
.
had enough Says:
Most agree we need single payer or a public health care system.
But somehow we need to get through the bought and paid for Congress, by the health insurance industry, in order to pass this.
I just pray that by the time it gets through the Congressional sausage-making process it doesn’t end up intentionally obfuscated like the Medicare drug thing did. Obama’s going to have to ride herd on them to keep the R’s from sneaking in tons of red tape and confusion (”look, government doesn’t work!”) to the bill.
.
linkwray Says:
I’ll give you 6 million unemployed reasons why. Everyone with a job gets up and wonders if its’ me next and that is a bigger fear than your dirty rotten spin machine, Frank.
Hear, hear. Here’s the argument to be made to the “heartland” conservatives: why the hell is it up to business to pay for health care? That just makes no sense. Anyone who has worked in any business, large or small, must notice that H.R. benefit management takes up an exorbitant amount of overhead. Nearly every labor dispute over the last fifteen years has been due to the spiking cost of health care. Why wouldn’t any “pro-business” constituency want to take providing health care off of the back of business, wether it’s the “mom ‘n pop” small businessman or the largest megacorporation? It affects every single industry that we have. Health care is not their job. They shouldn’t be forced to provide it.
In conclusion: single payer is pro-business. Opposing it is anti-business.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:51 pmI’m not a policy person. I’m a language person.
What in the hell does that mean ?
You aren’t a language person , you moron ; you’re a tool who tries to deceive Americans into (erroneously)believing what the garbage GOP is trying to push , by playing mindless little word games ………
What a snake.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:52 pmFor a word person, he sure did deliver some off-the-cuff comments that damage the right’s cause. I’m sure republicans are steaming, wondering how this guy could be so reckless with his words.
May 26th, 2009 at 8:52 pmoilforillegals Says:
Bacause that’s exactly what it will be.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
So no matter WHAT it is that is exactly what it will be? You do understand that you are incredibly stupid dont you?
May 26th, 2009 at 8:52 pmThe GOPers are such terribly stupid liars that they’ve got to hire a “wordsmith” to help them sell their lies – it’s just too hilarious!! Trolls like ‘oilspill’ ought to be ashamed of themselves. I wouldn’t dare leave comments on a progressive blog if I belonged to the GOP.
GOP = Dead elephant walking! AHAHAHAHA!
May 26th, 2009 at 8:54 pmSo Luntz is perfectly prepared to LIE and he wont wait to see if its a good plan or a bad plan. LYING is just what he does. A LIAR is just who he is. Yeah not really that suprising
May 26th, 2009 at 8:55 pmSo, why not use their terms in our response?
Like an ad with SWAT types doing a ‘government takeover’ where uninsured and sick hostages are freed an endless waiting room where they are locked in by Blue Cross/Aetna thugs. Once freed, the hostages get to choose any number of valid options – including a public plan.
May 26th, 2009 at 9:01 pmBut look at Paul Begala’s soundbyte (hate it or not, we operate on soundbytes) “…(they) resort to mendacity”. Who’s the moron, Luntz for getting his message (like it or not) across in blunt simple language, or Begala for using the word “mendacity”. 95% of the people hearing that will miss his point entirely. Jesus these Dems are their own worst enemy.
May 26th, 2009 at 9:01 pmLuntz has been entrusted to make sure facts stop having that darn liberal bias that has so damaged the Republican cause as of late…
May 26th, 2009 at 9:02 pmMcMetal,
May 26th, 2009 at 9:03 pmPlease don’t insult snakes.
Snakes eat vermin. They maintain the balance of nature.
I’m not a policy person. I’m a language person.
Actually, from here, you look pretty much like an a**hole to me.
If telling yourself that you’re a “language” person instead of relying on heavy narcotics to sleep at night, have at it. Won’t change your basic a-holeyness, of course.
May 26th, 2009 at 9:04 pmoldgranny Says:
McMetal,
Please don’t insult snakes.
Snakes eat vermin. They maintain the balance of nature.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
You make a good point
May 26th, 2009 at 9:07 pm“I’m not a policy person. I’m a language person.”
What a repugnant, smarmy copout — as though there was a way to describe a policy without uderstanding it. Anyone who listens to this childish game will know that Luntz’s goal is to lie — and not because he doesn’t understand the policy (or lack thereof) that he’s promoting. It’s because he does understand it.
May 26th, 2009 at 9:10 pmIf campaign finance reform would become law, those in congress would not have to chose between:
* voting for special interest to get the funds to run again in the next election and hope the voters do not notice.
* vote for the people’s interest and screw the special interest groups.
Until we get campaign reform, I hold no hope for congress passing a single payer health care program…. and until this gets passed, corporate America will own US.
May 26th, 2009 at 9:21 pmrepublicans are a bunch of scarecrows, goblins! Glad i wasn’t born a puglican.
May 26th, 2009 at 9:25 pm…
oilforillegals Says:
joecan’tthink, nothing as usual
..
o the mountains you will climb
once you lean to use the spacebar.
:)
good luck.
:\
May 26th, 2009 at 9:31 pmFrank Luntz dissected
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=If9EWDB_zK4
F-U Frank Luntz.
May 26th, 2009 at 9:34 pmIt goes without saying that 15 years of further degradation to the health care system and access to care since the last failure to reform health care has solidified public opinion in three places:
(1) People no longer want their premiums paying for advertising and influencing the fundamental political process that should be separate from private interests (i.e., buying off congressmen and women);
(2) The few whose well-linked wallets can easily cover the $900+ premiums or costs entirely out of pocket should not decide the “right” health care system for millions of others who don’t have the same means; and
(3) People don’t mind Washington fixing health insurance when corporate headquarters can’t do any better. In all likelihood, Washington can do much better. Removing the profit motive WORKS.
May 26th, 2009 at 9:50 pmklittle32 Says:
For a word person, he sure did deliver some off-the-cuff comments that damage the right’s cause. I’m sure republicans are steaming, wondering how this guy could be so reckless with his words.
Basically his job is to run different phrases by focus groups, record the ones that they like best (or that make them the most angrey, depending) and then recommend that term or phrase to the GOP pols to repeat endlessly. It’s the Rove system: nobody actually has to think.
Works great when you’re running against a Dukakis, Gore or Kerry who think they can sway the masses with high-minded, heavily detailed precise policy descriptions. Doesn’t work at all when you’re up against anybody who understands the human spirit and how to communicate directly to it.
.
Lost in Tarnation Says:
“I’m not a policy person. I’m a language person.”
What a repugnant, smarmy copout — as though there was a way to describe a policy without uderstanding it.
They do it all the time. The most classic example is to refer to the estate tax as the “death tax” and make it sound eeeevil. Totally works. Right up until people start realizing what you’re doing and stop letting you do it to them, as they did starting last year.
May 26th, 2009 at 9:52 pmdoughy pantload strikes again.
May 26th, 2009 at 10:16 pmThis clown is such an obnoxious ahole.
I was wondering what happened to him?
wondered too soon.
Instead of government takeover call it government rescue
May 26th, 2009 at 10:16 pmYour an Orwellian double talker
May 26th, 2009 at 10:23 pmI understand the need for growth, but what we have today, welfare capitalism, go bankrupt intentionally capitalism, no bid government capitalism and revolving door capitalism..all designed to feed off the public trough are not competitive capitalism.
Its more like piracy.
May 26th, 2009 at 10:28 pm…
johnny dollar you sure have changed your tune,
it’s amazing!
:)
:)
May 26th, 2009 at 10:31 pmFrank Luntz is dangerous for America. Frank Luntz does not believe that voters should think, he believes that they should pick their candidates based on emotion. Here’s what he said about emotion.
This is from an informative interview with Frank Luntz by Frontline. Frank Luntz believes in convincing people that when they picked their candidates based on emotion, they’re going to make better choices because they’ll feel better about their choices. If it feels good, vote for it. Strangely enough, the Republicans support this hedonistic approach to politics.
May 26th, 2009 at 10:31 pmXisithrus Says:
I understand the need for growth, but what we have today, welfare capitalism, go bankrupt intentionally capitalism, no bid government capitalism and revolving door capitalism..all designed to feed off the public trough are not competitive capitalism.
Its more like piracy.
Sounds a hell of a lot like the worst aspects of socialism/communism…
May 26th, 2009 at 10:33 pmI’m not a policy person. I’m a language person.
Translation: I have no idea what the hell I’m talking about, but I’m a fine bullshit artist, and I have no problem lying.
Perfect policy crafter for the GNOP.
PEACE
May 26th, 2009 at 10:45 pmIs it a correct description of the president’s plans for reform?
We don’t know what he is proposing. We want to avoid “a Washington takeover.” Whatever that turns out to mean.
But that’s not at issue. What the Democrats want is for everyone to be able to choose between their old, private health-insurance plan and an all-new, public health-insurance option.
Look at me. Seriosuly, scroll up and look at my face. Do I give a crap? I’m a pudgy redheaded dork who couldn’t get laid at a “lay Frank Luntz now” convention. My only shot at teh vagoo is being able to afford a Lexus, and that means that I have to get Republicans elected.
Here’s what we do: whatever Obama’s plan is, we say it’s a government takeover of health care, and then bring out that awesome video of the alien motherships from “Independence day,” except we totally make it clear that the aliens are liberal/socialists and they’re taking over the White House’s health care policy. Then, BOOM! they blow the crap out of everything. I want 90 year old ladies crapping their Depends over this. Gap-toothed trailer park morons named Cletus run out weilding shotguns to vote against it. The usual drill. And then I nail a fatty $100K bonus from Karl Rove. Then I go get laid. You think getting a decent hooker on the down-low is easy in a post-Spitzer world? You’re kidding yourself. Look at my face – A guy like me requires a sweet ride and to be able to name-drop RNC fatcats in order to get some at all. Dig?
I’m out – I got a 7pm focus group on whether calling property taxes a “hatred tax” will get us to where we can kill it in subcommittee next year. Or maybe “slaughter tax.” Whatever.
Peace, yo!
May 26th, 2009 at 10:54 pmNot much, if any, different from monarchy/oligarchy
May 26th, 2009 at 11:07 pmFrank helps figure out what triggers reptilian responses. Then the repugs build their strategy on it.
May 26th, 2009 at 11:30 pmHow ’bout this for wordsmithing;
INVEST in Universal Single Payer Health Care, it lasts a lifetime!
or
Why waste your money on Sickness & Injury Medical Insurance when you can INVEST in Universal Health Care that lasts a lifetime!
May 26th, 2009 at 11:33 pmOnce again, the GOP demonstrates that they never let reality get in the way of their rhetoric.
May 26th, 2009 at 11:52 pmSo, excuse me, but who is this asshat in the hipster sneakers? Why are we giving him airtime?
I mean, yes, let’s know what the bogus Repub talking points are, but why give this shameless snake oil man even 15 seconds of his 15 minutes of ‘fame’?
May 27th, 2009 at 12:04 amOf course Republicans support this approach. What’s their alternative? Trying to convince voters rationally to vote for them? We know how that always works out for Republicans.
Emotion is the only chance they’ve got, and they know it.
May 27th, 2009 at 12:06 amSnowman Says:
So, excuse me, but who is this asshat in the hipster sneakers? Why are we giving him airtime?
I mean, yes, let’s know what the bogus Repub talking points are, but why give this shameless snake oil man even 15 seconds of his 15 minutes of ‘fame’?
Sunlight is an excellent disinfectant.
.
ralph the wonder locust Says:
Emotion is the only chance they’ve got, and they know it.
Yeah, but they suck at that too these days.
May 27th, 2009 at 12:08 amThere’s 3 arguments the Repubs use about health care:
1) it will yield horrible results.
2) It’s wrong because it’s socialism.
3) You’re going to destroy the health insurance companies!
For which the American public has these answers:
1) Let’s try it. If it turns out badly, we’ll fix it.
2) We’re interested in what works, not labels.
3) You see this tiny little violin?
the first argument is completely dishonest. The second is religious dogma, and the third is simply defense of one’s masters.
The wingnuts are not scared that the project will be a disaster; they’re afraid it will be a success. They’re afraid that people will like it and it will become another third rail they can’t touch.
hey invoke the free market, but they do it like Aynn Rand: mutualism is spiritually evil, and saps our racial will.
It’s nonsense: the free market works its positive effect very simply: if there is a sufficient demand, there will be a market incentive to meet that demand. Furthermore, competition will lower the price.
Now, faced with the health care system in which a colossal demand is not being met–and prices, rather than going down, are skyrocketing, a normal observer would say, something’s wrong with the market mechanism. But these John Galt folks say no, the demand is bad and wrong, the product of mutualist thinking.
This is the inverse of logical. What they’re saying is that if the free market doesn’t supply it, it’s no good.
And ultimately it’s #3. I could have some respect for someone who says we should have a free-market health care system–where, for example, all insurance was banned and health care providers had to charge market rates or be out of business. But no: it always comes down to using Randian purity arguments to defend the current big guys. It’s pretty transparent and pretty disgusting.
We just want what works.
May 27th, 2009 at 12:40 amI’ve said this before: I’m perfectly happy having gone to a private university, buying goods from private companies, not having government run entertainment or computers or barber shops or shoe stores or groceries.
It’s only the broken parts that we want fixed.
We Americans have tons of money for our wars for profits but no money for the sick and needy
Christianity died on the cross
You have to smile at the hypocrisy in America
Capitalism is doing its thing and self-destructing right before our eyes and very few in the world understand this simple axiom:
With communism man exploits man with capitalism it is the other way around
Spiritual law demands they both self destruct
How few in the world will understand that simple statement
May 27th, 2009 at 1:28 ampbeeg Says:
It’s nonsense: the free market works its positive effect very simply: if there is a sufficient demand, there will be a market incentive to meet that demand. Furthermore, competition will lower the price.
This is an important point, and applies to all economics: the “invisible hand” automatically matches supply to demand. Therefore, manipulating supply is working “against the grain.” If you want to make a change in the economy, you must manipulate demand. Any policies that affect supply directly (ex: war on drugs) are doomed to fail.
And yet on issue, after issue, wingnuts fall in line on the “supply side” of things. The problem isn’t that they’re just wrong about everything, it’s that they’re also incorrect.
They can accuse us of “elitism” all they want, but this John Galt crap is elitism to the infiniteith power. The notion that we owe our everything to a handful of superhumans (the rich) is so retarded that merely spelling it out is sufficient to completely debunk it.
May 27th, 2009 at 1:45 amThere is only a couple of reasons someone like Frank Luntz could take the stance and opposition to health care reform. One of which is that he has health care, can afford it, and hasn’t been denied even if he can pay. The other is that the money he procures from his opposition is greater to him than the nation’s uninsured.
If only Luntz would have to live without health care as many Americans are forced to for many reasons. You think he might have a different perspective of his opposition to health care reform if the pay was minimum wage? If he could not procure an insurance policy for himself for lack of cash or pre existing conditions? I’m sure Frank Luntz would hold to those same principals he espouses for his pay check, if the pay check was minimum wage.
May 27th, 2009 at 2:27 am“You’re damned right it’s a government take-over. Since the for-profit health care providers came along health care costs have skyrocketed to the point where most Americans can no longer afford to see a doctor for routine check ups. That kind of mismanagement and irresponsibility require the government to step and bring some sanity back to the system.
You’ve had your day in the sun. Now it’s time to close your yap and let us take care of business.”
May 27th, 2009 at 2:28 amWe Americans have tons of money for our wars for profits but no money for the sick and needy Christianity died on the cross web tasarımı l Tabldot Yemek l yüz estetiği
May 27th, 2009 at 5:19 amHon That man is dressed like a clown. ‘Nuff said on the veracity of his opinion.
May 27th, 2009 at 6:44 amhe’s a carpet bagger and deserves the fate of all carpet baggers.
banishment.
May 27th, 2009 at 8:13 amFrank Luntz and the rest of the GOP are so dishonest when it comes to this argument about health care reform. I can deal with Democrats like Sen. Max Baucus selling their souls to the health insurance lobby, but the GOP, who have no solutions, except to obstruct with their lies and spinmeistering is a much bigger problem. There can never be real honest to goodness health care reform without the benefit if a good honest debate.
May 27th, 2009 at 8:51 amAmerica’s healthcare system is the ultimate “Pay to Play” – if you don’t pay, you don’t get access!
Sure, you can look in the window, but don’t leave a nose print or the fine folks who maintain the facility will have to hire more people to wash the windows and add security to keep future nose prints to a minimum. And of course that will raise their rates by 30+ percent!
PEACE
May 27th, 2009 at 9:04 amLuntz, Kristol and every other conservative strategist know the same simple truth. If Democrats pass significant healthcare reform, It means a permanent shift to the political left in the United States, and the Republican Party as we know it would be gone forever.
May 27th, 2009 at 9:35 amWhy can’t the republicans ever argue something on the merits and facts…..instead they always resort to deception, lies and fears…..
May 27th, 2009 at 10:28 ammedicare, social security, and how health care for all….the conservatives are always on the wrong side, just look at the history.
Personally, I have no problem with the government taking over the Health Insurance industry. It needs to be taken over, restructured and made more affordable. The insurance companies have failed the American people and should be held accountable.
May 27th, 2009 at 10:59 amWould you give credibility to any putz dressed like Luntz?
Single payer, Governemnt plan. Go over to Kos and read the post about Health Insurance industry CEO compensation. You’ll understand where your premiums are going while you are being denied coverage for care.Watch Michael Moore’s “Sicko”. F*%# all these guys and their Republican cheerleaders. They’re scum. You too, Ben Nelson.
May 27th, 2009 at 11:16 amSophist.
May 27th, 2009 at 11:34 amLuntz is another excrement that needs a one way trip to N. Korea and let him WORDSMITH his way out of that paradise.
May 27th, 2009 at 2:01 pmI hate this sleazebag Luntz. His appearance is a lie in and of itself. I don’t feel you can trust someone who wears a toupee. Oh, excuse me, I mean sports a cranial prosthesis.
I think it’s quite telling about his lack of personal confidence and his inclination to lie about even the smallest things.
May 27th, 2009 at 2:18 pmThank you…
seslisohbet seslichat sesli sohbet sesli chat
May 27th, 2009 at 9:38 pmLuntz is a charter member of the club for people from whom you should not buy a car. Or buy anything else including what he says.
May 28th, 2009 at 9:10 am