Major Media Headlines Pretend That Latest Polls Show Obama’s Policies Are Unpopular
Major Media Headlines Pretend That Latest Polls Show Obama’s Policies Are Unpopular
Today, two new national polls were released, one by the New York Times and CBS, the other by the Wall Street Journal and NBC. News headlines quickly settled on a theme: The polls showed that President Obama’s policies were suddenly unpopular:
“Sticker Shock — Obama still popular; his policies, not so much” [ABC's The Note]
“Polls find rising concern with Obama on key issues” [Reuters]
“Polls Show Declining Support For Obama Decisions” [U.S. News & World Report's Political Bulletin]
“Obama’s popularity: Problems testing it” [Chicago Tribune's The Swamp]
“Is ‘Smooth Sailing’ Over for Obama?” [Washington Post]
The headlines have little to no relation to the actual data in the polls, both of which found broad approval for Obama’s foreign policy and economic agendas. From the New York Times/CBS poll:
5. Do you approve or disapprove of the way Barack Obama is handling the economy? 57% approve, 35% disapprove
8. Do you approve or disapprove of the way Barack Obama is handling the threat of terrorism? 57% approve, 27% disapprove
16. So far, do you think Barack Obama’s policies have made the economy better, made the economy worse or haven’t his policies had any effect on the economy yet? 32% say better, 15% say worse
And from the Wall Street Journal/NBC poll:
4b. Do you generally approve or disapprove of the job that Barack Obama is doing in handling the economy? 51% approve, 38% disapprove
4c. Do you generally approve or disapprove of the job that Barack Obama is doing in handling foreign policy? 54% approve , 36% disapprove
9. Which ONE of the following statements best describes your feelings toward Barack Obama?
Like personally and approve most policies…………… 48%
Like personally but disapprove of many policies ……27%12. And how confident are you that Barack Obama has the right set of goals and policies to improve the economy––extremely confident, quite confident, only somewhat confident, or not at all confident?
Extremely confident………………………. 20%
Quite confident …………………………. 26%
Only somewhat confident ………………….. 24%
Not at all confident …………………….. 29%
Similarly, 68 percent agree with Obama’s view that Guantanamo detainees should be charged with a crime or released back to their home countries, as opposed to only 24 percent who think they should be detained indefinitely. As Glenn Greenwald notes, “The view that detainees should be charged with crimes or released is often depicted as the fringe ‘Far Left’ view. Like so many views that are similarly depicted, it is — in reality — the overwhelming consensus view among Americans.”
Perhaps the most bizarre headline came from USA Today’s blog, The VAL: “Poll: Obama down, cousin Cheney up.” The poll cited showed that 60 percent of Americans have a favorable view of Obama. By contrast, only 27 percent viewed Cheney favorably — while 30 percent viewed him “very negatively.”
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Our vaunted dems leadershi(t) has plain given up
Rolling over for Wall Street like a belly-rubbed pup
Cowering to republicans, the torture brownshirts
“We’re helpless” say dems, to advance, to assert
Kissing corporate ass for the corporate buck
While the American public is out of luck
Candidate Obama promised change and hope
But as president delivered little more than, “Nope!”
“I’m Keeping the war, denying rule of law,”
Constitution still shredded like so much cole slaw
“I’m mimicking bush, detainees still confined,
‘Transparency’ was promised, but I’ve changed my mind.”
“Who needs to prosecute bush’s war crimes?
That’s so ‘yesterday,’ just think ‘future times.’”
Real change, it appears will have to wait longer
While the violations stack up, just as wrong and wronger
It will take real Progressives to finally speak out
Make the milquetoast government fear the People’s clout
When that day arrives, the one so much craved
June 18th, 2009 at 12:48 pmI hope there’s some America left to be saved.
Good thing we’ve got Faux News as an “opposition channel”, what with all these radical far left news sources sugar-coating everything to make the President look good.
June 18th, 2009 at 12:49 pmThe MSM is owned by what -six individuals who are Conservative.
June 18th, 2009 at 12:53 pmThe only poll that really natters is held in November of 2012.
June 18th, 2009 at 12:56 pmThis president of Hope has done nothing but disappoint me on nearly every front. Can someone please explain all the differences from the last administration?
June 18th, 2009 at 12:57 pmThese “analysts” should look up the concept “regression toward the mean”. Cheney, with his cellar numbers, had nowhere to go but up in polls. President Obama, with his astronomical approval level, had nowhere to go but down. The difference from then to now is not a difference that makes a difference.
June 18th, 2009 at 12:57 pmI’m still happy that I didn’t vote for McCain/Palin, as most intelligent people are.
I never expected Obama to spend his first term dealing with pet liberal issues.
Once the economy is righted, the invasion of Iraq has ended, and the closing of Gitmo is complete, he can get on to dealing with other things.
Be patient. It took 30 years of right wingers to get us this far off course, it’ll take a few years to get back on track.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:00 pmJust another Thursday….Who are the polster’s calling.? I’ve never been called…They must have a small group of hand picked sleeper’s they continue to call over and over knowing the answers wanted in advance…
What’s the point any way, once in all these political runners are for big business and against us..Crap, I give up..Time to look else where for a new party that thinks like I do…There are no dem’s or reps anymore, with the exception of a hand full theres nothing but pigs back in DC feeding on our blood sweat and tear’s…P. B. & J
June 18th, 2009 at 1:00 pmLiberal media, yeah, right…
….just another stupid propaganda talking point by the scum sucking neo-pigs.
Let’s see what not-connected-to-realitycheck & American Dumbass spin on this thread…I’m sure it will be something intelligent and thoughtful.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:01 pmWell there you go. It’s that damn “liberal media” for you.
In the WSJ poll, this one confuses me:
To ensure that we have a representative sample, would you please tell me whether you are from a Hispanic
or Spanish-speaking background?
Yes, Hispanic……………………………….. 11 [148]
No, not Hispanic …………………………… 89
Not sure/refused………………………….
Why is whether or not they are Hispanic important whereas other races are not?
June 18th, 2009 at 1:01 pmhttp://www.gallup.com/poll/120770/obama-rated-highest-as-person-lowest-deficit-spending.aspx
While 67% of Americans view President Barack Obama favorably, his overall job approval rating and his ratings on specific areas are less positive. At the low end of the spectrum, only 45% of Americans approve of Obama’s handling of federal spending, and 46% of his handling of the federal budget deficit.
As noted, Americans are more positive in their opinions of Obama as a person than they are when asked to rate his job performance, as well as how he has handled a series of specific issues or policy areas. Because there are different levels of “don’t knows” in response to the list, the accompanying table displays an approval-to-disapproval ratio for each dimension.
His overall job approval rating is 61% in this poll and every category asked gave him a lower rating.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:02 pmThanks Thinkprogress. I reached the same conclusion after digging into the details myself and it was really bugging me that everyone fell for the horsesheit headline. Your story was the first that I found ANYWHERE that called Bullsheit on the poll headlines.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:02 pmThe headlines are comparing him to an impossible standard and then reporting failure. The fact is, his policies are popular, according to their own polling data. Maybe not as popular as one would wish, but certainly enough to face no significant challenges to implementation.
Paper tigers everywhere…
June 18th, 2009 at 1:02 pmThe ruling class has spoken. Obama is to be limited to one term, and during that time everything he tries to do will be obstructed for as long as possible.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:04 pmWOW
You mean the lying liars that told us chimpy “won” the 2000 election, that bin laden was behind 9/11, that Iraq had wmd, Sadam was a threat to the US, that the economy was “strong”, that dur chimpfurher was re-elected in 2004…
These people are not telling the truth now?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!
Amazing news flashes coming out of Think Progress this morning.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:04 pmOnly rubes like ToiletM would fall for this phony poll crap
June 18th, 2009 at 1:05 pmAmen Ranting Tommy!!!
When I’ve been called for polls, the questions have been so skewed that they weren’t worth answering.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:06 pm7. RantingTommy Says: Once the economy is righted, the invasion of Iraq has ended, and the closing of Gitmo is complete, he can get on to dealing with other things.
Can I get a bag of whatever you’re smoking, RT? Apparently it really obliterates reality…
I guess the tooth fairy brought it?
June 18th, 2009 at 1:09 pmRanting Tommy ,
June 18th, 2009 at 1:10 pmI was amenning comment no. 7
Here’s another good one from the WSJ poll:
14. Recently there has been some discussion about areas in which the federal role, such as taking an ownership stake in General Motors, limiting levels executives can receive, and the role the government would play in a new health does this concern you––a great deal, quite a bit, just some, or very little?
They ask three questions in one expecting to get a real answer.
Another thing that irritated me about this poll is that it asked what they thought of Nancy Pelosi, but no mention of Republic leaders.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:10 pmThis one in the WSJ should really worry the Republics:
34a. In any health care proposal, how important do you feel it is to give people a choice of both a public plan administered by the federal government and a private plan for their health insurance––extremely important, quite important, not that important, or not at all important?
June 18th, 2009 at 1:10 pmExtremely important ……………………… 41
Quite important …………………………….. 35
Not that important…………………………. 12
Not at all important ……………………….. 8
Not sure …………………………………….. 4
RantingTommy Says:
——————————————————————————–
Only rubes like ToiletM would fall for this phony poll crap
Look at polling data from Gallup, which thinkprogress obviously trusts, http://thinkprogress.org/2009/06/17/gallup-health-insurance/
Wonder why this poll was not talked about in this article, could it be that it did not fit their agenda?
June 18th, 2009 at 1:11 pmI applaud the Obama Adminastration for staying the course with his agenda. And it is still damn good that Obama still has a high approval rating.
Everyone knows that the GOP is blocking everything!!!
=========
Exit Stage Left Says:
This president of Hope has done nothing but disappoint me on nearly every front. Can someone please explain all the differences from the last administration?
What issue has Obama disappointed you on?
June 18th, 2009 at 1:12 pmAnd these mental midgets wonder why newspaper subscriptions and TV viewership are dropping like Dumbya’s popularity rating in 2008…
I’ll get my news from the not-so mainstream media, thank you very much…
June 18th, 2009 at 1:12 pmI have to say the thing that amazes me most about all these polls is how much support President Obama has considering the mess he inherited and the relentless assault on him from the day he was elected. Imagine what his support numbers would be like today if he had not inherited all the problems he has and if the right was not assaulting him on a daily basis.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:13 pmNice work on this posting, Ali, thank you!
I am not sure which one of these I find more humorous today:
1. The MSM making-up this theme that Obama is less & less popular even though the data they use disputes that opinion
or
2. Obama’s policies are not polling as high as his approval.
Why I find #2 funny is because his approval is so high there is NO WAY the policy questions would ever poll as high!
June 18th, 2009 at 1:13 pmDon’t forget OFnF on the trolls
June 18th, 2009 at 1:14 pmJohnM says: His overall job approval rating is 61% in this poll and every category asked gave him a lower rating.
So? This is not an unusual result for any poll or test. Accumulative data is always more statistically sound than the subdata.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:14 pmI know Obama’s policies may be perceived by the media now to being unpopular.. Even if the GOP is blocking everything he is trying to pass, that doesn’t give them a reason to send hate e-mails.. Check this report I just watched…
http://www.newsy.com/videos/e_hatred
June 18th, 2009 at 1:14 pmThese polls are absolute bullshyte!
June 18th, 2009 at 1:14 pmsorry hanshiro, here in reality, things don’t move as fast as you think they should
but thanks for your “concern”
June 18th, 2009 at 1:15 pmOk, so it looks like the Republics are not gaining any ground and are still losing ground.
Generally speaking, do you think of yourself as a Democrat, a Republican, an independent, or something
else?
Strong Democrat………………………… 21
Not very strong Democrat ……………….. 10
Independent/lean Democrat……………….. 10
Strictly independent …………………… 18
Independent/lean Republican ……………… 9
Not very strong Republican……………….. 7
Strong Republican ……………………… 14
Other (VOL)…………………………….. 7
Not sure……………………………….. 4
Once again only 21% of Americans call themselves Republics and only 14% call them selves strong Republics. That tells me that they stand to lose 7% of their members if they don’t do something soon.
RIP GOP
June 18th, 2009 at 1:17 pmThe “media” is nothing but a business.. They will use
ANYTHING that will gain attention.. Even the lowly
fly.. An insect! Last night’s news used at least
one minute discussing the KILLING (of a fly) BY THE
PRESIDENT.. So horrible a crime that even PETA
begged the President never to do it again!
So it follows that if they get that excited about
a fly (IT WAS FUNNY!), then they will use any silly
poll to make the news more interesting (YAWN)..
I’m just surprised I haven’t heard the CONS yelling
June 18th, 2009 at 1:17 pmfor impeachment. After all, Bush never was caught
killing flies.. Maybe humans in his illegal war, but
not flies!
The trolls are often gleefully claiming that President Obama’s job approval ratings are nosediving, and now I see that major media have jumped on that bandwagon.
I was curious about this, so I checked out how Obama is trending in polls…
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/president_obama_job_approval-1044.html
The approval line appears to have peaked in the 65% range within the month after inauguration, and has settled in the low sixties since then. The disapproval rating took a dramatic upswing in the month after inauguration, but has stabilized in the low thirties. There hasn’t been any appreciable change in either line since March.
So why are the media crying doom and gloom for Obama? Hey, if you had a non-story, how would you spin it to get attention? Remember, the media are neither left nor right (with the exception of Fox News) — they are all about ratings.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:18 pmHow about NOT prosecuting the criminals of the bush cabal, ending rendition, prosecuting torturers, pushing for single-payer healthcare…blah blah blah
June 18th, 2009 at 1:18 pmWhen President Obama killed the fly I wish he had said “I’ve been telling the American people that I would be tough on terrorists”. If you can’t take the wind out of the sail, then take the sail out of the wind.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:19 pmThank you to hanshiro the antlion, (comment #1) for your fine poetry. The Republican right-wing corporate media takes every single opportunity to slime and smear President Obama. It’s too bad for them that the so-called “leadership” is squawking around, aimlessly sputtering their collective and individual stupidity.
Poor CNN, forced to broadcast the “unverified” truth from Iran. Now at least, after seeing the heroic humanity from the street protests against Mullah dictatorship and election rigging, we, the USA, will not be able to contuct any bombing attacks on Iran in the future. Neither will the Zionist imperialist Israelis. Too bad, guys, you missed your chance to “bomb, bomb, bomb Iran” as the old Senator McBlunder sang last year.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:19 pmor…ending the wars….i forgot about ending the wars of corporate profiteering….
June 18th, 2009 at 1:19 pmThe Wall Street Journal is a CONservative RAG and
June 18th, 2009 at 1:22 pmit’s political views so far from middle-of-the-road
that they’re driving in the right hand ditch!
PatrioticLiberalChristianMantisReligiosa Says:
——————————————————————————–
JohnM says: His overall job approval rating is 61% in this poll and every category asked gave him a lower rating.
So? This is not an unusual result for any poll or test. Accumulative data is always more statistically sound than the subdata.
The same people were asked this question as his overall approval rating. There should be areas higher than his approval rating, but they are not which shows that people like Obama more than the job he is doing. This is the opposite of what Clinton had during the whole Lewinski thing. He had high approval in individual categories but a lower overall approval rating.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:24 pm31.RantingTommy Says: sorry hanshiro, here in reality, things don’t move as fast as you think they should but thanks for your “concern”
(via Greenwald:)
Yes, please explain how this is anything but pure bush.
There’s more:
Yes, please explain just how this is moving at all rather than bald dismissal. This should be entertaining watching you duck these two of several examples I can produce…
June 18th, 2009 at 1:26 pmJohnM Says:
Wonder why this poll was not talked about in this article, could it be that it did not fit their agenda?
Could it be that Gallup is not a newspaper, idiot?
June 18th, 2009 at 1:26 pmWell Bill Maher, Keith Olbermann and Rahcel Maddow whining all the time is not helping.
Keith Olbermann yesterday, in particular seem to take great joy in that fact the President Obama numbers have slightly gone done.
Who needs the Press and The Al Qaeda Republican when you have Whining Democrats likes these.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:28 pmI don’t like how he’s handled the Bush crimes, nor how he’s adopted so many Bush policies, for instance WH visitor logs.
I don’t like the post partisan shtick at all.
He’s failing in the things that matter most to me.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:32 pmJohnM Says:
His overall job approval rating is 61% in this poll and every category asked gave him a lower rating.
And Gallup is the only poll that is legitimate to the right. That’s because its polls are consistently skewed to the right. Ask yourself why Gallup never releases that actual poll, showing the questions and how they were answered. All other polling outfits release the actual poll. The other problem with Gallup polls is that they are black and white. They don’t allow for shades of gray like many other polling outfits do. For Gallup it’s either favor or not favor.
Finally, another reason why Gallup doesn’t release their raw data is because they have been caught in the past over polling Republics. If they are polling 35% Republics and 35% Democrats the poll is going to be skewed right because only 20% or so people in this country call themselves Republics.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:33 pmWhat is the percentage of Americans who want to keep pay more and more for their health insurance as outlined in the GOP proposal?
June 18th, 2009 at 1:33 pmhere in reality, we realize that the ship of state is large and must be turned slowly lest she capsize
June 18th, 2009 at 1:34 pmHere’s a dose of reality for Ranting Tommy: (scroll down after clicking the link:)
How is this not vintage bush double-talk bullsh¡t?? You want to clue in, Tommy. Really.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:34 pmhilarious that the only polls they can compare Obama to are other polls about Obama
even with the mainstream corporate media gunning for Obama 24/7, his approval ratings have remained high, just not quite as high as his previous approval rating
too funny
June 18th, 2009 at 1:36 pmGosh – Must be because “major media” is run by billionaire dickheads desperately striving to maintain their gilded status quo.
F them.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:36 pmI’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again.
The first thing that you do when you fall into a hole is GET OUT OF THE HOLE! Anything else is just spinning your wheels to no great effect.
Once you’re out of the hole, then you start moving in the direction you want to go.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:36 pmJohnM Says:
RantingTommy Says:
——————————————————————————–
Only rubes like ToiletM would fall for this phony poll crap
Look at polling data from Gallup, which thinkprogress obviously trusts, http://thinkprogress.org/2009/06/17/gallup-health-insurance/
Wonder why this poll was not talked about in this article, could it be that it did not fit their agenda?
What the hell are you talking about? The poll you linked there says that the 58% of the people have faith in Obama to do the right thing as far as healthcare goes. Firstly, it wasn’t included in this article because this article was about two polls that were recently released and have been covered in the media (the very first paragraph mentions this, so it would smart for you to actually read the damn thing beforeyou start in with your oblivious comments). Secondly, would you care to explain how 58% having confidence the President’s policy is a) not a majority, and b) interpreted as a bad thing for the President. I’m really curious how you would arrive at what you said, when the numbers you yourself pointed to show positive numbers for the President. Basically, I’m calling you out for being stupid. I think you thought no one would bother to look at the link, because everyone here knows that you don’t have a clue in hell what you’re talking about the vast majority of the time. Guess what? You thought wrong. That’s what I hope went down, anyway, because I’d like to think that you’re not a total idiot, but you keep giving me evidence that you might be.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:36 pmhanshiro the concern troll will not convince me that I should have voted for McCain, no matter how much he whines
June 18th, 2009 at 1:37 pmmisscoleopteramolly Says:
So why are the media crying doom and gloom for Obama? Hey, if you had a non-story, how would you spin it to get attention? Remember, the media are neither left nor right (with the exception of Fox News) — they are all about ratings.
Because the media is in love with Obama. Didn’t you get that message?
June 18th, 2009 at 1:37 pmtp=mouthpiece for the obama administration.
The headlines have little to no relation to the actual data
Oh, the irony!
June 18th, 2009 at 1:39 pmExit Stage Left,
The problem isn’t Obama, it’s the old, old farts still in congress.
It took 8 phucking miserable years to get America to this point and it just amazes me that people want to see Obama undo 8 years within 6 months?
Maybe, you can tell the rueful party of “no” to stop holding up all or any parts of Obama’s agenda.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:40 pmAmerican Patriot Says:
tp=mouthpiece for the obama administration.
The headlines have little to no relation to the actual data
Oh, the irony!
June 18th, 2009 at 1:42 pm==========
the von Brunn virus is back with nothing as usual but wrong misguided information oh, the irony!
48.RantingTommy Says: here in reality, we realize that the ship of state is large and must be turned slowly lest she capsize
Next time, just type, “I got nuthin’.” At least it’s more honest.
You kinda fold into worthless bromides when faced with real ugly truth, huh Tommy?
RantingTommy Says: hanshiro the concern troll will not convince me that I should have voted for McCain, no matter how much he whines
…or reverts to sophism and distortion to avoid confronting your cherished illusions. You’re a fraud, tommeh; and a coward.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:43 pmJohnM Says:
…which shows that people like Obama more than the job he is doing.
I don’t dispute that. He hasn’t fixed everything in five months, but there are still a lot of fluff pieces about him and his family.
.
ADAY Says:
Well Bill Maher, Keith Olbermann and Rahcel Maddow whining all the time is not helping.
Sure it is.
There’s an old story from FDR that comes to mind – a group came to him urging action on a particular political thing. He replied, “I agree with you, I want to do it, now make me do it.”
Holding Obama’s feet to the fire gives him ammunition to implement progressive policies. He can hardly put something on the table if doing so makes him the most liberal voice on the matter. That is he could, but it would probably fail in that case.
The right wing is going to lean on Obama constantly from the right. If we aren’t leaning just as heavily from the left, his mandate will topple.
Just cheering him on and agreeing with everything he does (and doesn’t do) might bump his overall numbers, but it doesn’t help him to actually get anything done.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:43 pmi see hanshiro has sunk to personal attacks because I don’t fall for his concern trolling
poor little guy
here in reality, we think in more than zeroes and ones. we can understand that Obama can be not perfect and not totally evil, but somewhere in between
maybe hanshiro got his hopes up during the election and based his view of Obama on the right wing biased media attacks on him, claiming he was some uber-liberal
here in reality we know he isn’t
June 18th, 2009 at 1:47 pmAmerican Patriot=mouthpiece against the Obama administration.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:47 pm60. ElBruce Says: The right wing is going to lean on Obama constantly from the right. If we aren’t leaning just as heavily from the left, his mandate will topple.
Just cheering him on and agreeing with everything he does (and doesn’t do) might bump his overall numbers, but it doesn’t help him to actually get anything done.
Exactly. Nor is it prudent, ever, to tolerate bush-era policy for one second longer, and as Obama has claimed, he can multitask.
RantingTommeh would rather sit on his hands and prove his undying ostrich-like faith.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:49 pmsounds like it’s time for OFnF on hanshiro the concern troll
he’s let his anger cloud his “mind”
or he’s just another right winger trying to foment a split
poor little guy. it must be sad to go through life as a binary thinker
June 18th, 2009 at 1:51 pmThere goes that librul media responding to FAUX accusing them of being in the tank for Obama. It is ridiculous.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:53 pm61.RantingTommy Says: here in reality, we think in more than zeroes and ones. we can understand that Obama can be not perfect and not totally evil, but somewhere in between
Your ‘reality’ includes preemptive, permanent detention without trial, continued NSA spying without oversight, no bush war crimes prosecution and denial of rights by perpetuating DOMA and DADT, meanwhile arabic and Farsi fluent language speakers are continually dismissed, endangering our security, for their sexual preference.
You’re an uninformed coward, tommeh.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:55 pmIf the wingnuts will admit that it was the failed policies of the republican party and the Bush Crime Family that got us here, I will admit that Obama hasn’t fixed it all in five months. Deal?
June 18th, 2009 at 1:55 pmPresident Obama is a bright guy. Possibly the best possible person to lead the country at this moment in history.
But, he is in an unenviable position. A can’t win position.
President’s step up to the plate, probably mostly due to ego, but also because they want to do right.
When they get in office, they get demonized as criminals, buffoons, anti-christs, etc.
But, they do step up to the plate. They are trying to work for the American people.
But, trying to please a group of people as massive and diverse as the American people is difficult; make that impossible.
Maybe the answer is to lower the expectation.
Obama can’t be all things to all people.
Can’t we trust that he is doing the best job that can. Can’t we remember that we decided that he was the best that we had to choose from at the time?
Additionally, maybe the problem is not our leadership? Maybe the problem is the centralization of government.
America is a vast place. A vast place with widely varying agendas.
As we have ceded more and more responsibility to the federal government, we have sown the seeds of our discontent.
The federal government has obvious roles to play. But, the reality is that people from different states have different issues. A one-size fits all platform has it’s benefits; but encounters difficultly in maintaining general support.
People in Oklahoma have different priorities than people in Oregon. Trying to satisfy the divergent interests with a universal set of rules may be contributing to the overall dissatisfaction with our leadership.
Maybe we should direct the decision making back towards the state and local governments.
There is a strong argument that people closer to the issues can better resolve them. In any event, the dissatisfied can turn their ire to their local and state governments, and not have their unrealistic expectations dashed by our national leaders.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:55 pmpoor little hanshiro the concern troll, trying to turn progressives against Obama
so transparent
so silly
so sad
poor little guy
probably got beat up a lot in school, until the girls got bored with his crying
June 18th, 2009 at 1:57 pmget over it, hanshiro, McCain lost, deal with it
June 18th, 2009 at 1:58 pm——————————————————————————–
smidget Says:
——————————————————————————–
JohnM Says:
RantingTommy Says:
——————————————————————————–
Only rubes like ToiletM would fall for this phony poll crap
Look at polling data from Gallup, which thinkprogress obviously trusts, http://thinkprogress.org/2009/06/17/gallup-health-insurance/
Wonder why this poll was not talked about in this article, could it be that it did not fit their agenda?
What the hell are you talking about? The poll you linked there says that the 58% of the people have faith in Obama to do the right thing as far as healthcare goes. Firstly, it wasn’t included in this article because this article was about two polls that were recently released and have been covered in the media (the very first paragraph mentions this, so it would smart for you to actually read the damn thing beforeyou start in with your oblivious comments). Secondly, would you care to explain how 58% having confidence the President’s policy is a) not a majority, and b) interpreted as a bad thing for the President. I’m really curious how you would arrive at what you said, when the numbers you yourself pointed to show positive numbers for the President. Basically, I’m calling you out for being stupid. I think you thought no one would bother to look at the link, because everyone here knows that you don’t have a clue in hell what you’re talking about the vast majority of the time. Guess what? You thought wrong. That’s what I hope went down, anyway, because I’d like to think that you’re not a total idiot, but you keep giving me evidence that you might be.
Nobody said that the majority does not approve. You clearly cannot pay attention. The point is that none of the areas questioned have an approval rating as high as his overall approval rating. That is the point the media is making and what I am making.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:58 pmObama should stop trying to be bipartisan. The Wingnuts never learned to play or work with others. It is part of their makeup. Obama should have Holder prosecute one of the members of the Crime Family for war crimes and the playing field will change drastically. No more Mr. Nice Guy.
June 18th, 2009 at 1:59 pmJohnM Says: The same people were asked this question as his overall approval rating. There should be areas higher than his approval rating, but they are not which shows that people like Obama more than the job he is doing.
Again, this just proves that you do not understand data collection and statistics. Of the, say, thousand people polled many could rate Obama lower on issues A, B, C, and D. The same people would NOT be giving him lower ratings on the exact same issues. Some would give lower ratings on A and B, others on A and D, still others on A and C, still others on just C, and so on. Then, they all could give him higher ratings on overall job approval. Just because a person might object to his policies or, just as likely his priority about a particular policy, does not mean that they disapprove of his overall job.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:00 pmTommy, you obviously have real life experience, whereas, some troll must be way too young to have any wisdom at all.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:00 pmReminds me of adolescents who think they can fix the world , but have never really been out in it.
remember OFnF on ToiletM
he’s oblivious to facts and allergic to accuracy
June 18th, 2009 at 2:01 pmit just amazes me that people want to see Obama undo 8 years within 6 months?
Things are actually worse.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:01 pmLet’s do a little thought experiment: there are five people in America – me, RantingTommy, hanshiro, JohnM and American Puppykiller. So one day Obama’s approval rating comes in at 40% (me and Tommy). Alarmed, his political strategists look at what they could do to increase it to 60% or better. Me and Tommy like him OK and cut him a lot of slack as it is; we’re safe votes. Pleasing JohnM would involve becoming a total neocon and actively fighting against everything he’s ever campaigned on. Pleasing American Patriot would require taking a gun to his own head. But if he goes left, he might be able to make hanshiro happy.
By holding out on him somewhat, liberals can give him political room to maneuver by doing what we presume he wants to do anyways and reward him for it with even more political capital.
Let’s not do the “hail the perfect leader” thing the R’s did for the last eight years. It’s powerful when they all march in lockstep, but it’s fragile too. Hence their current situation.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:02 pmwell granny, I just recognize when someone is just spewing hate and not taking an intellectual look at a problem
June 18th, 2009 at 2:02 pmReminds me of adolescents who think they can fix the world , but have never really been out in it.
Much like our potus?
June 18th, 2009 at 2:02 pm——————————————————————————–
Bilbo Hussein Baggins Says:
——————————————————————————–
JohnM Says:
His overall job approval rating is 61% in this poll and every category asked gave him a lower rating.
And Gallup is the only poll that is legitimate to the right. That’s because its polls are consistently skewed to the right. Ask yourself why Gallup never releases that actual poll, showing the questions and how they were answered. All other polling outfits release the actual poll. The other problem with Gallup polls is that they are black and white. They don’t allow for shades of gray like many other polling outfits do. For Gallup it’s either favor or not favor.
Thinkprogress links gallup polls all the time, they did so just yesterday.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:02 pmObama’s favorable rating is now slightly higher than that of his immediate predecessor, George W. Bush, at the same point in his first year. Bush had a 65% favorable rating in April 2001 and a 62% favorable rating in June of that year. By June of Bill Clinton’s first year in office (1993), his favorable rating had fallen to 48%.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:02 pmdon’t try to reason with ToiletM, it’s a troll and it is only here to disrupt
June 18th, 2009 at 2:02 pmJohnM Says:
They only agree with polls that sing their tune. They even agree with rasmussen when he happens to post a poll that they agree with. Any other time it’s just a “right wing poll.”
June 18th, 2009 at 2:03 pmamericanPee, your right, for you rightwing tin foil hat crowd, things are worse. You lost.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:04 pmThings are actually worse. -=APee=-
Well duh. The recession started in 2007. Iraq war in 2003 Afghan before that. Pakistan started destabilizing because of the middle east wars. The same people run Iran today. Nothing has changed there other than people are tiring of Ahmadinejad.
If they are getting worse its because of things set in motion years ago. Recall that Bush Sr didnt go into Baghdad because he and Scowcroft believed it would destabilize the area.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:07 pmAnd really, thats exactly what the Cheney-cons wanted..to fight a war on three fronts at the same time, to create a clash of the civilizations.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:08 pmI wasn’t a fan of daddy bush, but he had more brains in his little finger, then baby bush had in his whole body.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:09 pmangels81/socky Says:
Things are actually better for me. I buy real estate. I was talking about the unemployment rate and stuff olbermahn won’t talk about since his boy was placed in the white house.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:10 pmwatchdog Says: Gallup: Majority Disapprove of Obamas Actions in GM Bankruptcy
On December 19, 2008, President Bush used his executive authority to declare that TARP funds may be spent on any program he personally deems necessary to avert the financial crisis, and declared Section 102 to be nonbinding. This has allowed President Bush to extend the use of TARP funds to support the auto industry, a move supported by the United Auto Workers.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:12 pmNo, JohnM, the point you are making is that you have zero understanding of statistics.
You have proved it over and over and over and over and over and over and over again.
You clearly don’t know what you’re talking about, make the ridiculous assertion that somehow a poll that is compeltely unrelated to the polls being discussed in this article are ignored by ThinkProgress because they “don’t fit the agenda” while linking to a story ON TP about that poll, and can’t seem to figure out that 58% support on a policy does, in fact, support the TP “agenda” – that Obama has public support on healthcare.
What about any of this are so stupid that you can’t understand? I mean, honestly. Did you actually think that little comment was clever? It wasn’t. It proved you precisely dick about pretty much everything.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:12 pm70. RantingTommy Says: get over it, hanshiro, McCain lost, deal with it
Tommeh, you have to introduce fallacy into this, otherwise you’d have to address sourced and valid concerns. You cannot do it.
Because you cannot do it, you create a strawman behind which you take cover rather than answer the very real and documented policies that Obama is instituting and perpetuating.
You’re folding under the nasty reality that your abiding blind faith is misplaced, you cannot answer any of the points I’ve raised from credible sources, and you can only retreat to empty distortion.
I’d rather be informed…than be you.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:12 pmLord, the Kerkos are ignorant of facts.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:12 pmamericanPee, sure you do, we believe you. But you know that real estate bought on a monopoly board doesn’t count, no matter what mommy say’s.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:13 pmFifty Years of Math 1957 – 2007 (in the USA ) Last week I purchased a burger at Burger King for $1.58. The counter girl took my $2 and I was digging for my change when I pulled 8 cents from my pocket and gave it to her. She stood there, holding the nickel and 3 pennies, while looking at the screen on her register. I sensed her discomfort and tried to tell her to just give me two quarters, but she hailed the manager for help. While he tried to explain the transaction to her, she stood there and cried. Why do I tell you this? Because of the evolution in teaching math since the 1950s: 1. Teaching Math In 1950s A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is 4/5 of the price. What is his profit ? 2. Teaching Math In 1960s A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is 4/5 of the price, or $80. What is his profit? 3. Teaching Math In 1970s A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is $80. Did he make a profit? 4. Teaching Math In 1980s A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is $80 and his profit is $20. Your assignment: Underline the number 20. 5.. Teaching Math In 1990s A logger cuts down a beautiful forest because he is selfish and inconsiderate and cares nothing for the habitat of animals or the preservation of our woodlands. He does this so he can make a profit of $20. What do you think of this way of making a living? Topic for class participation after answering the question: How did the birds and squirrels feel as the logger cut down their homes? (There are no wrong answers, and if you feel like crying, it’s ok. ) 6. Teaching Math In 2009 Un hachero vende una carretada de maderapara $100. El costo de la producciones es $80. Cuanto dinero ha hecho.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:13 pmYou clearly don’t know what you’re talking about,
Rinse, repeat.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:14 pmI was talking about the unemployment rate and stuff olbermahn won’t talk about since his boy was placed in the white house.
There were only 3 million jobs created during the previous admin. The recession [read job loss] began in 2007.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:17 pm6. Teaching Math In 2009 Un hachero vende una carretada de maderapara $100. El costo de la producciones es $80. Cuanto dinero ha hecho.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:17 pmSays the cap quack.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:18 pmhanshiro, you should get informed and grow up
once you have some real world experience, get back to us
you concern trolls crack me up
June 18th, 2009 at 2:19 pmYeah, AP, we all got that spam email, too.
Posting chain emails doesn’t make you intelligent, you know. Nor does it make a point.
Yeah, people can’t make change anymore. It bugs me, too. If you have a problem with it, take it up with the Republicans, as it’s been THEM in power for 30 years.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:19 pmamericanPee, showing your racism again I see.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:19 pmActually I don’t agree with any of these polls whether they show what I think or not. I support the President but I also have issues with the polls that show him favorably. They’re horribly flawed.
It’s near impossible to get an actual demographic sample truly representative of the American population for one. Two, the questions are usually biased or put in a way where you aren’t given the option to be neutral. I also rarely see any of the information I would use to peer review a study in order to confirm it being accurate as possible. You can only take any poll with a grain of salt.
Tommy, OFnF on :) I’m with you on this one.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:21 pmrhf, AP has to plagiarize his racism
I mean, if a troll is gonna be a racist bigot, it should at least be an ORIGINAL racist bigot
June 18th, 2009 at 2:22 pmThe courts handle bankruptcy. You know, one of the three branches of our government?
June 18th, 2009 at 2:23 pmrhf
I don’t think plagerism is a crime, per se, but you are correct. If you post something without proper citation, as if you had written it yourself, that is clearly plagerism.
But isn’t that how we know that AP is actually CFP in disguise? He used to do that all the time, too. I like that the trolls are so stupid that don’t even bother to change their style when they change their name. It just makes it easier to catch them.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:23 pmBut isn’t that how we know that AP is actually CFP in disguise? He used to do that all the time, too. I like that the trolls are so stupid that don’t even bother to change their style when they change their name. It just makes it
easier to catch them.
IDK I think it’s OS. The one line phrases meant to be witty and fail miserably smack of OS. C4P at least tries sometimes, I’ll give him that even though I can’t seem to get it through his head that DADT needs to be handled by Congress. I so do miss debunking his posts by using his own research… where is he?! :(
June 18th, 2009 at 2:26 pmok, I gotta head out to the studio
you guys have fun bashing AP, ToiletM, hanshiro, and the other right wing trolls
I gotta go make the music
peace
June 18th, 2009 at 2:26 pmWhere’s dbadass when he’s needed. I don’t feel like arguing with a child that has been left behind.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:27 pmby Mark Silva
A war of sorts is being waged on the cable-news front, if perhaps a one-sided war – and the president has helped fuel the newest conflagration in that rivalry between FOX News and MSNBC.
President Barack Obama, granting interview access to all sorts of television news outlets lately, has steered clear of FOX – “Faux News, FOX Noise” and worse, as MSNBC’s Keith Olbermann calls it, suggesting last night that even the words News Channel are laughable in the context of cable-land’s most popular news channel.
FOX, for its part, prefers not to engage in any public war with MSBNC — turning the other cheek each night as Olbermann or others attack the competition on-air.
But now Obama has been engaged. Obama had time for other business-network interviewing this week in the midst of his rollout of new financial regulations – notably CNBC – but he is “scared” of FOX’s Neil Cavuto, FOX’s Greta Van Susteren suggested last night. “Yes,” said FOX’s newly acquired Tucker Carlson, he is.
Obama’s own words have helped stir the FOX pot.
How’s olbermahns “boycott” coming? Did it even last one day?
June 18th, 2009 at 2:27 pmIgmo. If you would have kept your eight cents you would have gotten back 42 cents meaning you would have 50 cents either way.
2.00 – 1.58 = 42 + 8 = 50
June 18th, 2009 at 2:28 pmJesus, what do you do AP go around giving people who make min wage a hard time just for the heck of it?
June 18th, 2009 at 2:28 pmkdgamergirl
I so do miss debunking his posts by using his own research… where is he?! :(
There’s more evidence that AP is CFP. CFP has been strangely absent since AP arrived. That doesn’t mean it’s not also OS, though. I have a theory that all the trolls are actually only 2 or 3 operating under different aliases, possibly occupying the same basement. I mean, have you ever seen the two of them in the same place at the same time? :)
Ditto on the debunking with his own research. You have to love a troll that does the work for you.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:29 pmHow’s olbermahns “boycott” coming?
How’s the “Permanent Republican Majority” coming?
June 18th, 2009 at 2:31 pmsmidget Says:
Anyone who disagrees is OS.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:31 pmWow guys I think we hurt AP’s feelings… he actually put an author this time.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:32 pmWhy would anyone be ’scared’ of FOX. Pfffttt. Immature schoolyard rational to get Obama to go on FOX.
I am surprised that they have ‘double triple dared’ him.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:32 pm*have not ‘double triple dared’
June 18th, 2009 at 2:33 pmsmidget Says:
——————————————————————————–
kdgamergirl
I so do miss debunking his posts by using his own research… where is he?! :(
There’s more evidence that AP is CFP. CFP has been strangely absent since AP arrived. That doesn’t mean it’s not also OS, though. I have a theory that all the trolls are actually only 2 or 3 operating under different aliases, possibly occupying the same basement. I mean, have you ever seen the two of them in the same place at the same time? :)
You know that wouldn’t surprise me. They also never deny it when we call them by one of their other sockpuppets either.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:34 pmLord, FOX isnt even News, Cavuto never discusses business. Hannitys mentor was Newt Gingrich. Bushs brain has escaped and found a job at a republican pawn shop.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:35 pmI like that the trolls are so stupid that don’t even bother to change their style when they change their name.
You sound experienced at trolling and using socks. Not that it wasn’t obvious, already.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:37 pmI didn’t say that, thank you very much. Disagreement is welcome. Stupidity, on the other hand, is not.
But if two or three posters all have the exact same writing style AND the exact same opinions, it lends evidence that it’s actually the same person.
Perhaps the next time you have to change your screen name, you’ll at least attempt to avoid some of the trademarks of your other personas. Then it could be much longer before we figure it out and send you packing off for yet another identity.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:37 pmLord, FOX isnt even News,Ding! Cavuto never discusses business.Ding! Hannitys mentor was Newt Gingrich.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:38 pmNot experienced AT trolling, idiot, experienced WITH trolling.
I’ve been exposed to plenty of basement dwellers like you. You’re all the same, so it doesn’t take much effort to figure out the patterns. Oh, sorry about that. I shouldn’t have started talking about concepts so far outside your intellectual reach. I’ll give you a minute to process, make sure there’s no more smoke coming out of your ears, and try to find a comeback to plagerize.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:39 pmAmerican Patriot Says: Ding Ding
Its Ding Dong, Ding Dong
June 18th, 2009 at 2:39 pmAmerican Patriot Says: Lord, Ding Dong FOX isnt even News, Ding Dong Cavuto never discusses business. Ding Dong Hannitys mentor was Ding Dong Newt Gingrich.
Fixed Your Transmission
YVW!
June 18th, 2009 at 2:42 pmsmidget Says:
——————————————————————————–
No, JohnM, the point you are making is that you have zero understanding of statistics.
You have proved it over and over and over and over and over and over and over again.
You clearly don’t know what you’re talking about, make the ridiculous assertion that somehow a poll that is compeltely unrelated to the polls being discussed in this article are ignored by ThinkProgress because they “don’t fit the agenda” while linking to a story ON TP about that poll, and can’t seem to figure out that 58% support on a policy does, in fact, support the TP “agenda” – that Obama has public support on healthcare.
What about any of this are so stupid that you can’t understand? I mean, honestly. Did you actually think that little comment was clever? It wasn’t. It proved you precisely dick about pretty much everything.
It was my mistake on the poll from the health care, as I meant to say why did they not use gallup on this posting? Not necessarily the healthcare one. Overall, they cherrypick when they use gallup as they did for healthcare and then use other polls when gallup conflicts with their agenda.
June 18th, 2009 at 2:58 pmMajor Media Headlines Pretend That Latest Polls Show Obama’s Policies Are Unpopular
keeping that well poisoned…
June 18th, 2009 at 3:02 pm“I never expected Obama to spend his first term dealing with pet liberal issues.
Once the economy is righted, the invasion of Iraq has ended, and the closing of Gitmo is complete, he can get on to dealing with other things.”
Once the economy is fixed? I’m not wingnut but let’s be real about this. Spending trillions of tax dollars to re-inflate the bubble is not exactly a long term fix. It does provide some economic lubrication, especially when the fed fund rate is effectively zero. Soon enough, the bond market will start to demand a risk premium as the fear of our overwhelming debt load makes the once unthinkable, the possibility of a US default, at least thinkable. It’s happening already. look at commodity prices or any other dollar denominated asset. Inflation is coming and with it, higher interest rates, more lay offs, and more downward pressure on economic activity. This idea that Obama has somehow “solved” the problem needs to be put to rest. The banks that were too big to fail are still too big to fail. The toxic assets on the books of the large financial institutions are still toxic and still on their books. Obama has a plan to overhaul financial oversight. That’s all well and good but he has shown a real lack of political courage and passing real reform will require real courage. Take detainee photos, gay rights, AIG bonuses, Gitmo, tribunals, and card check, on issue after issue, Obama has talked tough until he’s faced with opposition, then, he runs in the opposite direction of the fight. One suspects he will not lead but be led on the finer points of regulatory reform.
I am completely aware that criticism of Obama isn’t what the kewl kidz are doing these days but if you examine his actions, not his rhetoric, the results may surprise you.
June 18th, 2009 at 3:03 pmOverall, they (tp) cherrypick
Bingo!
June 18th, 2009 at 3:22 pmJohnM
This article was specifically about two polls that were released and the media’s reaction to them.
It has nothing to do with the content of the polls outside of the media’s misrepresentation of what was in them.
Thus you continue to prove that you don’t know shit about anything. Read the effin article, dude.
June 18th, 2009 at 3:28 pmMajor Media Headlines Pretend That Latest Polls Show Obama’s Policies Are Unpopular
Let US not forget what the MSM stands for:
Major Media is also invested in health care insurance, big Pharma, MIC, and uses the party of NO as their mouth piece.
As the health care battle goes on, we will see more LIES,manipulations and BS from the Major Media.
June 18th, 2009 at 3:29 pmSide note:
Is there anyone over the age of 2 that isn’t experienced using socks? I admit that I never realized utilizing socks was so complicated that experience was required, but I imagine it’s a fairly prolific skillset.
June 18th, 2009 at 3:31 pmRantingTommy Says:
well granny, I just recognize when someone is just spewing hate and not taking an intellectual look at a problem
OK, you waste vertical space on lefties spewing hate. How about I lock you in a room to fight with hanshiro, EugeneDebs and republicanshatefacts and we’ll see how enjoyable you find that exercise.
.
smidget Says:
I don’t think plagerism is a crime, per se, but you are correct. If you post something without proper citation, as if you had written it yourself, that is clearly plagerism.
I don’t care whether it’s a crime, it’s a waste of my damn time. If I wanted to read that, I’d go read that. I’m here to discuss the post at top. If AP wanted to add some explanation how his copypasta was relevant to the discussion, that would constitute at least an attempt to have one.
As it is, it’s like trying to discuss politics with a golden retriever holding an Ann Coulter book in its mouth.
June 18th, 2009 at 3:32 pmThis Obami is bankrupting our country, and we’d better start telling him no more. That nutcase Pelosi who accused the CIA of lying to Congress needs to be investigated. People–we have to take back our country from these crooks.
June 18th, 2009 at 3:33 pmElBruce Says:
As it is, it’s like trying to discuss politics with a golden retriever holding an Ann Coulter book in its mouth.
That made me laugh. It deserved reposted.
June 18th, 2009 at 3:41 pmIs it just me, or does anyone else find it stunningly racist when someone refers to our President as “Obami”?
I really try not to throw around the racism thing very often, because everyone is a little racist, and political correctness damn near killed decent comedy. But this kind of thing makes even me step back and go “Wow. Really? Wow.”
June 18th, 2009 at 3:44 pmLet’s look at the facts. Just 5 months ago the consensus was that this recession would drag on until spring 2010. Now those same people are saying they expect the resession to end this summer. That is a huge improvement. It also means that less stimulus spending will be necessary and that tax revenues will come in above forecasts. Bottom line, the deficit will come in well below the $1.8 trillion forecast not long ago. That is a remarkable record on the economy.
June 18th, 2009 at 3:47 pmElBruce Says:
As it is, it’s like trying to discuss politics with a golden retriever holding an Ann Coulter book in its mouth.
PLEASE post this again when our troll, watchdog, is around!
June 18th, 2009 at 3:48 pmTake detainee photos, gay rights, AIG bonuses, Gitmo, tribunals, and card check, on issue after issue, Obama has talked tough until he’s faced with opposition, then, he runs in the opposite direction of the fight. One suspects he will not lead but be led on the finer points of regulatory reform.
detainee photos: sorry but I’m with the President on this one despite how much people disagree. It’s one thing to use them in court as evidence but to plaster pictures of people being raped and abused for all to see is inconsiderate to the victims. We don’t do it to rape victims in the US so the detainess who have been abused should have a say in this.
Gay Rights: his memorandam yesterday was all he could legally do with DOMA. I don’t make any excuses for the language the justice department used but these are issues for Congress. Congress needs to address and change laws. Obama was not elected Legislature in Chief. I don’t get why people cannot understand how DADT and a repeal would work.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036677/#31416031
AIG Bonuses: what could he have done legally?
GITMO: being closed… blame Congress for the delays and scaring Americans into believing terrorists would be released in the US. I’m not happy with the prospect of prolonged detention and something else needs to be done.
Tribunals: there is nothing wrong with tribunals when done properly. They had no rights under Bush and that was the problem. Many of them will be getting trials here in the US. Again, not perfect and needs to be dealt with but none of it will happen over night.
Card Checks: I’ll stay away from this one as I’m not well versed on the issue.
He’s made decisions I don’t agree with. Difference is some of us do something about it other than whine on a blog (not saying you do). There are plenty of avenues to voice concerns and calling people names and accusing them of being uninformed simply because they don’t agree with you anger is counterproductive and childish. Given time I’m sure these things will be dealt with in a practical and productive manner.
It’s been 5 months, it took more than eight years to cause this distruction. Obama even said give him time. Choosing what you want to hear from him doesn’t make anyone right.
June 18th, 2009 at 3:59 pmblah I can’t type today… your* and destruction* at my last post.
June 18th, 2009 at 4:01 pmranus69:
June 18th, 2009 at 4:13 pmSince Obama has shown neither the desire or willingness to prosecute torture/war crimes, the republics don’t have to say NO. In the case of torture, Obama is saying it for them. And THAT is unacceptable to me.
Baloney Says:
This Obami is bankrupting our country, and we’d better start telling him no more.
1. It’s “Obama.” If you can’t say his name, you’ve got no business talking about him.
2. Hate to break it to you, but Bush bankrupted the country already. Here’s a comparitive chart.
.
Baloney Says:
That nutcase Pelosi who accused the CIA of lying to Congress needs to be investigated.
Specifically, she accused the CIA of lying about what they said to her face. Were you in the room? No? So who’s the nutcase here?
Also – separation of powers – can’t investigate a Congressperson for disagreeing with an executive agency. Hell, for that matter you can’t investigate anyone just for disagreeing with an executive agency. Are you really saying that no one can accuse the CIA of lying or they should be sent to jail? Really? Because that’s not how my country (America) works. Read the Constitution sometime.
.
Baloney Says:
People–we have to take back our country from these crooks.
Are you calling for an armed revolution? I certainly hope you are.
.
Gay Rights: his memorandam yesterday was all he could legally do with DOMA. I don’t make any excuses for the language the justice department used…
I do. The cited portion pointed out that there are already instances where states don’t recognize other states’ marriages. In some states you can marry your first cousin; in others you can’t. Some different states have different ages of consent. As it stands, states don’t recognize certain marriages from other states due to such differences. Gay marriage would be a similar difference. That looks like a pretty good legal argument to me. But it got characterized as “comparing gay marriage to incest and pedophilia.”
June 18th, 2009 at 4:30 pmTP and this post got a nice mention on Thom Hartman’s show today on Air America…
June 18th, 2009 at 4:50 pmKDgamergirl says:
“Let’s look at the facts. Just 5 months ago the consensus was that this recession would drag on until spring 2010. Now those same people are saying they expect the resession to end this summer. That is a huge improvement. It also means that less stimulus spending will be necessary and that tax revenues will come in above forecasts. Bottom line, the deficit will come in well below the $1.8 trillion forecast not long ago. That is a remarkable record on the economy.”
With all due respect, these are assumptions not facts. The recession may end this summer, I can’t argue the unknown, but it would be a remarkable turnaround in the span of a few short weeks. We’re in the middle of June. What is being touted as good news on the economy should really be described at less bad news. Unemployment is stablizing but is doing so at a very high rate. Mortgage foreclosures continue at historic levels, credit card defaults are up, home prices continue to fall, non farm payrolls continue to shrink. All of these indicators continue to trend down, albeit some at a slower trajectory. Only in a fantasy world is this a “remarkable record on the economy”.
June 18th, 2009 at 4:51 pmKdgamergirl,
“detainee photos: sorry but I’m with the President on this one despite how much people disagree.”
Were you with the president when he promised to release the photos? Because that’s what he said he would do until Glen Beck and the republican noise machine attacked him for putting our soldiers at risk.
“Gay Rights: his memorandam yesterday was all he could legally do with DOMA”
He could end “don’t ask/don’t tell” with a simple stroke of his pen if he had the will or the guts to fight.
“AIG Bonuses: what could he have done legally?
Again, he went on the TV to say how outraged he was and how he was going to to do everything in his power to stop them. That was until he learned Giethner and his team were well aware of these bonuses months before they became public. It’s also interesting that he and his treasury department were so deeply concerned about not superceding contracts but a few short weeks later, had no problem ripping up bondholder contracts to award the lions share of GM’s equity to the UAW.
“GITMO: being closed… blame Congress for the delays”
I’ll believe it when it actually happens. Again, his history when facing conflict is to run in the opposite direction. Let’s see what happens.
“Tribunals: there is nothing wrong with tribunals when done properly”
Obama’s tribunals are exactly the same as under Bush. Only the language has changed.
“Card Checks:”
Trust me, he’s paid lip service to this issue but has not lifted a finger to pass it.
“There are plenty of avenues to voice concerns and calling people names and accusing them of being uninformed simply because they don’t agree with you anger is counterproductive and childish.”
I’m not sure I know what you mean. I called no one any names and, after reading what I posted two or three times I don’t see it as angry or childish. I’m just saying that the economy is far from out of the woods and that Obama hasn’t stood his ground and fought for a position very often.
June 18th, 2009 at 5:14 pmI think we need to distinguish between Obama election campagn policies and the Obama administration policies.
Obama the senator promised a transparent administration returning the White House to the people. President Obama doesn’t want anyone to know who he is meeting with just like Bush.
My guess is those that approved of the transparency policy still do but don’t approve of the covert meeting policy.
Obama the senator was going to do away with Don’t ask, Don’t tell. President Obama hasn’t.
My guess is those that approved of the campaign policy probably don’t approve of the administration policy.
Obama the senator was going to reform Washington and remove the greasy mitts of a corporate stranglehold from our representatives. President Obama hasn’t said a word about lobbyist reform.
Obama the senator also indicated he would be in favor of campaign finance reform. Obama the President hasn’t said a word about it.
Hartmann has a large list of things Obama has become a disappointment over. You would have to really not be paying attention to actually ask someone to name something Obama has done to disappoint them.
Obama’s numbers will fall. Not because the goofy Republicans will have anything to do with it(Schultz), but because he will do it to himself by dodging an opportunity to actually improve the lives of hundreds of million of Americans by actually going after what he knows is wrong when he claimed he would. He is an eloquent speaker, but that says nothing about his real character.
June 18th, 2009 at 5:22 pmSorry, post 159. I attributed a quote to dmgamergirl that belonged to DallasNE. My apologies.
June 18th, 2009 at 5:24 pmExit Stage Left Says:
ranus69:
Since Obama has shown neither the desire or willingness to prosecute torture/war crimes, the republics don’t have to say NO. In the case of torture, Obama is saying it for them. And THAT is unacceptable to me.
=========
Obama did leave the door open for prosecution which is starting to happen now. What did you expect for Obama to come into office locking up the whole entire Bush regime? I would as most would have loved to see that but in reality and not the “alternative reality” things just don’t happen like that.
It’s only been 6 months and to early to judge at this point.
June 18th, 2009 at 5:35 pmLeftside Annie Says:
——————————————————————————–
TP and this post got a nice mention on Thom Hartman’s show today on Air America…
Too bad nobody was listening!
June 18th, 2009 at 6:22 pmKdgamergirl,
“detainee photos: sorry but I’m with the President on this one despite how much people disagree.”
Were you with the president when he promised to release the photos? Because that’s what he said he would do until Glen Beck and the republican noise machine attacked him for putting our soldiers at risk.
Actually no I did not agree with their release then and I still don’t. I’ve been raped. I know what it feels like and the shame that goes with it. Unless you’ve personally experienced it you cannot possibly know how the thought of having photos out feels. I’m also objecting as a veteran.
“Gay Rights: his memorandam yesterday was all he could legally do with DOMA”
He could end “don’t ask/don’t tell” with a simple stroke of his pen if he had the will or the guts to fight.
Yes and say he did it would then be ILLEGAL for gays to serve. There are underlying laws that need to dealt with that that is for Congress. The only thing he can do is stop them case by case that would be time consuming. Again, I lived under the UCMJ, I know very well how it works.
This is not the Bush administration. I don’t want the President to override any law he sees fit. Congress should be dealing with that.
“AIG Bonuses: what could he have done legally?
Again, he went on the TV to say how outraged he was and how he was going to to do everything in his power to stop them. That was until he learned Giethner and his team were well aware of these bonuses months before they became public. It’s also interesting that he and his treasury department were so deeply concerned about not superceding contracts but a few short weeks later, had no problem ripping up bondholder contracts to award the lions share of GM’s equity to the UAW.
He was outraged and they did what they could legally. He didn’t know what was going on and when he did, he did what he could.
“GITMO: being closed… blame Congress for the delays”
I’ll believe it when it actually happens. Again, his history when facing conflict is to run in the opposite direction. Let’s see what happens.
Already an executive order making it closed by a certain date. If Congress decides to fund the closing and the detainees are dealt with we have no reason to believe it won’t be closed.
“Tribunals: there is nothing wrong with tribunals when done properly”
Obama’s tribunals are exactly the same as under Bush. Only the language has changed.
let’s see they can’t have evidence gained by means of torture used against them. They get a choice when choosing an attorney… again, I was in the military I’m quite aware of how tribunals work and the differences in them now.
“There are plenty of avenues to voice concerns and calling people names and accusing them of being uninformed simply because they don’t agree with you anger is counterproductive and childish.”
I’m not sure I know what you mean. I called no one any names and, after reading what I posted two or three times I don’t see it as angry or childish. I’m just saying that the economy is far from out of the woods and that Obama hasn’t stood his ground and fought for a position very often.
I apologize if you thought I meant you here. I thought I mentioned that I didn’t but again I’m sorry if we had a misunderstanding. I was more referring to people who love to whine and complain but don’t do anything beyond that. We have means to contact the administration and our representatives and instead of using those means, people tend to complain to others who can’t do anything.
My main point is and has always been, the man has had the Presidency for five months. That is not nearly enough time to say he’s broken promises or should have every little thing done. Any reasonable person knows that cleaning this mess up with take time and some things won’t change right away.
June 18th, 2009 at 6:42 pmranus69 Says:
——————————————————————————–
Exit Stage Left Says:
ranus69:
Since Obama has shown neither the desire or willingness to prosecute torture/war crimes, the republics don’t have to say NO. In the case of torture, Obama is saying it for them. And THAT is unacceptable to me.
=========
Obama did leave the door open for prosecution which is starting to happen now. What did you expect for Obama to come into office locking up the whole entire Bush regime? I would as most would have loved to see that but in reality and not the “alternative reality” things just don’t happen like that.
It’s only been 6 months and to early to judge at this point.
He’s also made it clear that expects Congress to do its job and deal with this properly. Diane Feinstein is investigating what she can. I’ve been in contact with her office several times on the matter and her committee will need time.
June 18th, 2009 at 6:46 pmnynick Says:
Sorry, post 159. I attributed a quote to dmgamergirl that belonged to DallasNE. My apologies.
No worries. I apologize again for the misunderstanding between our posts :)
June 18th, 2009 at 6:54 pmFox News (which Obama pettishly declined to name) is indeed a big megaphone — big and getting bigger. And that’s no accident. As I’ve written before, Fox is big because it speaks to an audience that doesn’t feel its concerns represented elsewhere on TV (and, yes, because Roger Ailes is a pro at producing slick, loud, button-pressing programming in general). For Obama to turn his back on that audience because he doesn’t feel like he gets a fair shake from Fox would be a mistake. He all but acknowledged that himself during the campaign, when he finally granted an interview to Bill O’Reilly after being hounded for months.
http://www.dailyfinance.com/2009/06/18/obama-takes-on-fox-news-loses/
June 18th, 2009 at 6:55 pmI suspect that the reason his ratings are as high as they are is because a lot of the people polled get their news from the internet. If broadcast news was really liberal, or even objective journalism, then he would probably have higher ratings, IMO.
June 18th, 2009 at 7:32 pmBody Odor’s polls are going to continue to fall…and they will be lower then Carters where…prior to him being escorted out of office by the Great American President Reagan. What is really funny is that there will be such a backlash against him…Pelosi and Dingy Harry…that the DemocRATs will be totally out of power by 2012.
Enjoy the time while you have it…you are over playing your hands and the Moderates are finally waking up!
June 18th, 2009 at 7:40 pmkdgamergirl,
About “don’t ask/don’t tell”…
“Yes and say he did it would then be ILLEGAL for gays to serve.”
That’s simply not true. This was a Clinton policy, it did not require any congressional approval. The president, using his constitutional powers as commander and chief of the US military, can allow gays to serve openly in the military if he so chooses. The military may not like it, congress may not like it, wingnuts and the anti-gay community may not like it but that’s a political problem, not a legal or constitutional problem. The policy was created by executive order and could be undone the same way.
About military tribunals:
“let’s see they can’t have evidence gained by means of torture used against them. They get a choice when choosing an attorney… again, I was in the military I’m quite aware of how tribunals work and the differences in them now.”
First off, Obama promised to end the tribunals. He has gone back on that promise and now says he needs more time to study the issue. He has promised some basic reforms such as limits on hearsay evidence and exclusion of statements obtained by means of torture but there is no real policy in place at the present time. What is in place now, is very similar to what was done under the previous president.
http://www.usnews.com/articles/news/obama/2009/05/15/obama-restarts-bush-era-military-tribunals.html
About those AIG bonuses:
“He was outraged and they did what they could legally. He didn’t know what was going on and when he did, he did what he could.”
Sorry but that just doesn’t pass the smell test. We were in the middle of the biggest financial meltdown since the great depression. His Treasury Secretary was bailing out the banks, how could he not have known and if he didn’t know, isn’t that the least bit troubling to you? I mean, when this story broke, don’t you think he picked up the phone and called Giethner? If Timmeh lied to him, don’t you think that is in and of itself a major problem? What else isn’t he telling the truth about? If Giethner didn’t lie to him, Obama’s feigned outrage has to be seen as at least dishonest.
About the detainee photos, I can’t begin to know what you’ve experienced but that’s rather beside the point. My point isn’t the photos, I agree we probably shouldn’t release them to the global media. What bothers me is his pattern. He said he would release them, he got pushback from the right, he caved. This is the same pattern we’ve seen time and again from him both during the campaign and during his first few months in office. He was going to filibuster FISA but instead voted for it, promising to fix it when he got into office. Since then, his administration has gone to court to support continued use of the powers he complained about during the campaign. He has a penchant for saying whatever the audience in front of him wants to hear. If the audience changes, so does the policy.
June 18th, 2009 at 7:47 pmReality Check Said,
Based on what exactly? Maybe in a wingnut fantasy wet dream, but the reality is that in 2010 and 2012 the Republican Party will be further reduced in power. That’s the reality check.
You wingnuts really need your own comedy channel cause you come up with some really funny shiz. Oh wait, Fox News serves as the wingnut comedy channel, I forgot.
June 18th, 2009 at 8:56 pm90 Un-American Traitor said,
Olberman’s “boy” was placed in the white house? Correct me if I am wrong, but referring to a black man as “boy” is quite racist.
It’s really great when wingnut racism is exposed for the world to see.
June 18th, 2009 at 9:04 pm149 Baloney said,
June 18th, 2009 at 9:06 pmWe have voted the crooks out of power, and we will never again allow them to regain power. Now all we need to do is put them behind bars.
About “don’t ask/don’t tell”…
“Yes and say he did it would then be ILLEGAL for gays to serve.”
That’s simply not true. This was a Clinton policy, it did not require any congressional approval. The president, using his constitutional powers as commander and chief of the US military, can allow gays to serve openly in the military if he so chooses. The military may not like it, congress may not like it, wingnuts and the anti-gay community may not like it but that’s a political problem, not a legal or constitutional problem. The policy was created by executive order and could be undone the same way.
Not under the UCMJ. It doesn’t work the same way as civilian law. Before the enactment of DADT it was illegal to be gay and serve in the military. What DADT did was may it “okay” so long as you don’t say anything. There are underlying laws that forbid being gay in the military w/o DADT. President Obama only has the ability to stop reservist discharges on a case by case basis in a time of national emergency. To make a real lasting solution, Congress needs to amend the UCMJ otherwise the next President can just repeal the order.
About military tribunals:
“let’s see they can’t have evidence gained by means of torture used against them. They get a choice when choosing an attorney… again, I was in the military I’m quite aware of how tribunals work and the differences in them now.”
First off, Obama promised to end the tribunals. He has gone back on that promise and now says he needs more time to study the issue. He has promised some basic reforms such as limits on hearsay evidence and exclusion of statements obtained by means of torture but there is no real policy in place at the present time. What is in place now, is very similar to what was done under the previous president.
What’s wrong with him having more time to study the issue? I’m glad he isn’t just blazing ahead and doing everything without thought like Bush did. When tribunals are done right there is nothing wrong with them. I worked with some JAGs, YNs and LNs when I was being discharged and I’m quite aware of what’s happened in tribunals.
About those AIG bonuses:
“He was outraged and they did what they could legally. He didn’t know what was going on and when he did, he did what he could.”
Sorry but that just doesn’t pass the smell test. We were in the middle of the biggest financial meltdown since the great depression. His Treasury Secretary was bailing out the banks, how could he not have known and if he didn’t know, isn’t that the least bit troubling to you? I mean, when this story broke, don’t you think he picked up the phone and called Giethner? If Timmeh lied to him, don’t you think that is in and of itself a major problem? What else isn’t he telling the truth about? If Giethner didn’t lie to him, Obama’s feigned outrage has to be seen as at least dishonest.
No it didn’t sit well with me that he didn’t know but that’s between him and his Secretary. His outrage worked. They got the bonuses back.
About the detainee photos, I can’t begin to know what you’ve experienced but that’s rather beside the point. My point isn’t the photos, I agree we probably shouldn’t release them to the global media. What bothers me is his pattern. He said he would release them, he got pushback from the right, he caved. This is the same pattern we’ve seen time and again from him both during the campaign and during his first few months in office. He was going to filibuster FISA but instead voted for it, promising to fix it when he got into office. Since then, his administration has gone to court to support continued use of the powers he complained about during the campaign. He has a penchant for saying whatever the audience in front of him wants to hear. If the audience changes, so does the policy.
My understanding was after careful consideration and advice from commanders in the military, he decided not to release them. He’s allowed to change his mind, especially after hearing opposing opinions on the issue. I think he made the right decision. The detainees have been abused enough without their ordeal being plastered on TV and in the papers for all to see. I’m satisfied with the President’s explanation.
As a psychologist I also look at the culture of the men that were abused. Men are supposed to be strong and to have endured what they has to be incredibly shameful culturally in addition to the shame already attached. I wish people would consider that rather then the cries for “justice”.
He’s going to make decisions we don’t like. He’ll change his mind when we don’t want him to. I’ve always thought him to be a practical man who will listen to people even when it’s something he doesn’t want to hear. Things probably look a whole lot differently now that he’s President versus on the campaign trail. It’s easy to make promises before you know what you’re getting into. We don’t know what he knows.
Call me blind but I actually trust him. Being a psychologist I’ve learned to read people very well over my years of study and I don’t think he’s doing anything he does to upset people but rather what he thinks is best as opposed to Bush who I saw to be a puppet to Cheney’s warmongering greed.
That being said, I do see your side to the argument and I’m afraid we probably won’t agree with each other but that’s okay. I’m glad we were able to discuss this in a mature manner. Thank you :)
June 18th, 2009 at 10:00 pmand when all is finally over…as a military man…if you are a queer…fine…just don’t let us know!
Homo
June 18th, 2009 at 11:42 pmRealityCheck Says:
and when all is finally over…as a military man…if you are a queer…fine…just don’t let us know!
Homo
Funny, I don’t recall anyone asking you what you think about someone being gay. By the way, did you finally realize you use socialized health care yet?
Bitter old man (see I can do it too)
June 18th, 2009 at 11:44 pmNo need to bother with RC rhf :) He’s a disgrace to the uniform. Bigots and racists don’t deserve to represent this country.
June 19th, 2009 at 1:51 amRealityCheck Says:
Homo
…and?
June 19th, 2009 at 2:33 amFifty Years of Math 1957 – 2007 (in the USA ) Last week I purchased a burger at Burger King for $1.58. The counter girl took my $2 and I was digging for my change when I pulled 8 cents from my pocket and gave it to her. She stood there, holding the nickel and 3 pennies, while looking at the screen on her register. I sensed her discomfort and tried to tell her to just give me two quarters, but she hailed the manager for help. While he tried to explain the transaction to her, she stood there and cried. Why do I tell you this? Because of the evolution in teaching math since the 1950s: 1. Teaching Math In 1950s A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is 4/5 of the price. What is his profit ? 2. Teaching Math In 1960s A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is 4/5 of the price, or $80. What is his profit? 3. Teaching Math In 1970s A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is $80. Did he make a profit? 4. Teaching Math In 1980s A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is $80 and his profit is $20. Your assignment: Underline the number 20. 5.. Teaching Math In 1990s A logger cuts down a beautiful forest because he is selfish and inconsiderate and cares nothing for the habitat of animals or the preservation of our woodlands. He does this so he can make a profit of $20. What do you think of this way of making a living? Topic for class participation after answering the question: How did the birds and squirrels feel as the logger cut down their homes? (There are no wrong answers, and if you feel like crying, it’s ok. ) 6. Teaching Math In 2009 Un hachero vende una carretada de maderapara $100. El costo de la producciones es $80. Cuanto dinero ha hecho.
Teaching should cater to the students’ needs, not the needs of close-minded knee-jerk reactionaries who feel the need to find scapegoats for their own problems…You know I’m sick and tired of people like you SCAPEGOATING teachers who do a helluva more useful and needed job than some Wall Street ELITIST crook. I’m sick and tired of people like you who feel the need to demonize teachers and blame them for the problems that our schools face. Your drivel shows you know NOTHING about the education system. Before you spout out your ignorance and bigotry, why don’t you actually see what’s happening in the classroom, instead of relying on your nativist, wingnut, paranoid fantasies? Is that joke supposed to be funny? How come conservatives always feel the need to find humor only through “jokes” that play on stereotypes and our inner racism?
June 19th, 2009 at 7:07 amI’m positive a hamburger at Burger King is about 89 cents, last I checked, as I used to work at a BK. Either they purchased something like a double burger, or this is completely false.
June 19th, 2009 at 12:40 pmThank you..
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