Protests At Cardin Town Hall Feature AFP Booth, ‘Death Panel’ Warnings, And Obama-Hitler Signs
Protests At Cardin Town Hall Feature AFP Booth, ‘Death Panel’ Warnings, And Obama-Hitler Signs
EDITOR’S NOTE: Over the coming month, ThinkProgress will be traveling to town hall events across the country to report on what we’re seeing on the ground. This is the first of what we hope will be many eyewitness reports. If you’re attending town halls in your area or see any interesting coverage of them, please email us and let us know.
Despite the raucous crowds that many Democratic lawmakers have been facing in recent weeks, Sen. Ben Cardin (D-MD) decided to go ahead with his town hall meeting at 7:00 p.m. at Towson University yesterday. The venue could hold only 500 people, and by 5:30, the event was completely filled (even though doors weren’t supposed to open until 6:00). Hundreds of other hopeful attendees were shut out.
ThinkProgress attended the protests at Towson, which were loud and crowded hours before the event. Picketers were holding signs reading “Health Care Not Death Care” and “Illegal Immigrants Love Obama Care.” “Public option is no option,” “Cardin come outside,” and “Obama does not care” were popular chants by the anti-reform protesters. Although picketers with signs were supposed to be restricted to the sidewalks along the main street, people soon moved their way up the hill toward the building venue, where shouting matches between pro- and anti-reform crowds broke out. Watch it:
The town hall protest was a hotbed for right-wing myths. We overheard at least one person yelling out, “Obama’s not even a citizen!” On health care, ThinkProgress spoke with several people who believed that Sarah Palin was right to warn about President Obama’s “death panels” and a government system would allow people to die while waiting for care. Watch it:
Many of the protesters had heard about the town hall meeting on local radio station WBAL. Another woman with whom ThinkProgress spoke said that she was an active member of tea party organizations, which were promoting the event, and another woman said that she gets “all of my news from Fox News” and had heard about the town hall on the local Fox station.
Only two groups had exhibition tables set up outside the event: Lyndon LaRouche supporters and the lobbyist-funded Americans for Prosperity (AFP). When ThinkProgress asked an AFP worker whether the group helped organize the protests, he replied, “Yes.” He said that the protesters were “part of our crowd.” Another AFP staff member said that they had encouraged their members to come to the event, but didn’t formally bus people in. On its website, AFP Maryland had been telling its members to ask “tough questions” but “participate in [a] respectful manner.”
Some photos of the AFP booth and other protest signs (including some comparing Democrats to the Nazis):
During the actual town hall meeting, Cardin was reportedly “booed and jeered repeatedly throughout his 25-minute presentation and the question-and-answer period.” At one point, four police officers had to stand in front of the stage. Watch video of the event here.
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WOW…..he spelled all those big words correctly.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:30 amLooks like a WhiteWing rally in every sense.
I wonder if the AFP worker who was honest about their sponsorship will be reprimanded. Can’t have the truth getting out there, now can we?
PEACE
August 11th, 2009 at 10:32 amI would like to believe that having a Holocaust survivor present to explain what real tyranny and Nazism is like would prove enlightening to these lunatics, but I’d be hoping for too much.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:34 amThe one constant through all of this madness is that the ratings at Faux “News” haven’t faltered – that and Rush remains a big fat idiot.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:34 amThese are people who cannot stand it that Obama won the election. They are mad because 8 years of Republican rule is done. They are hurting themselves, and do not even realize it. Their hate consumes them. I support a strong public option on health care. We need some competition. Right now too many people lack insurance. Too many people who have insurance have to fight with the big insurers to have their health care needs met. The insurance industry just gets richer, and we all suffer.
Why these people don’t get it is unknown to me. Educate yourselves! Don’t depend on Fox News as your only source of information. Stop the hate, and look for solutions to our COMMON problems.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:35 amIf not for misinformation, these morons would have no information at all.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:35 amWhere do the Republicans find so many overweight, balding, middle-aged white men who feel sorry for themselves?
August 11th, 2009 at 10:36 amIt looks like the grassroots movement of enlistment to the new american nazi party.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:36 amTros,
August 11th, 2009 at 10:37 ambecause they can’t get laid.
Death Panels are funny but not dead baby juice funny…
August 11th, 2009 at 10:38 amWell, shiiiite, rich…
They can’t even find it to use it.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:38 amLove the woman in the 2nd video claiming that her dog would get better healthcare than she would should reform pass. Hmm, I was under the impression that pet owners pay for their pet’s healthcare. So, using her logic, she would rather pay for better healthcare for her pet than for herself.
One thing is certain – her dog isn’t as stupid and gullible as she is.
PEACE
August 11th, 2009 at 10:38 amAnd the section of the health bill they say creates the “death panels’ was inserted by a REPUBLICAN – Isakson, from Georgia.
These people are too stupid for words.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:39 amAbsolutely GO VT! It is such a nice place…
August 11th, 2009 at 10:40 amAll this has happened before. All this will happen again.
Its what makes me think we are on the precipice of some honest to goodness change for the better. What we are seeing and hearing, painful as it is, is the sound of elites losing a tiny bit of power.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:43 amwell at lease the guy with the DNC sign spell Democratic right and not Democrat nazi committed.
Guessing thats one of the high school grads on tour with the rest of the group to help make the signs.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:43 amI’m gonna say all this Nazi talk is the direct result of people like Limbaugh and Beck saying this crap on their nationally broadcast shows.
The big fools say it first and then the little idiots feel empowered to follow suite.
Thanks Rush and Glenn… you’ve truly elevated the level of public discourse in this country.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:43 amI’d be very curious to find out how these people are defending their viewpoints when confronted with contradictory (i.e., accurate) information. do they just retreat and and say that anything that Rush/Glenn/Lou/Sarah says must be true? Are they at all reachable?
August 11th, 2009 at 10:44 amThe protesters say they want choice. The health bill allows payment to a counselor to assist a person in deciding the level of treatment they want in end of life or catastrophic circumstances (a living will). By paying for this consultation, people will be able to think through their choices and have those choices legally documented. This is not a “death panel”. It is promoting choice. And, yes, as TROS notes, it was a provision put up as an amendment by a Republican. It was a good addition, included in a bipartisan manner. Only the lies are partisan.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:45 amLove the guy in the black and white shirt in video #1 at about :16 in. Raises his arms to hold up his “No Union Goons” sign, and his big, fat, hairy, pasty white gut is hanging down over his belt for all the world to see.
Now there’s a future drain on our Medicare system.
PEACE
August 11th, 2009 at 10:45 amI realize I’m just wasting my breath here, but I’d like to ask these protesters to elaborate on a few things:
1. In what way (or ways) is Barack Obama like Adolph Hitler? Do you have specifics? Or do you just use the comparison because Hitler is a rather inflammatory figure?
2. Why do you think a public option is “no option”? When McDonald’s started offering Angus Third Pounders, did that mean they were doing away with the Big Mac? What have you been told that leads you to believe you won’t have a choice? And who told you that?
3. Why do you think health care will be more rationed under a public option than it is with private insurers now? Why do you believe the government is going to kill off our elderly? And who told you that? Can you describe, in your own words, what a “death panel” is and how it supposedly works? Or is it just a buzzword you fling around randomly? Why do you believe there will be “death panels”?
4. Were you this afraid of Medicare when it got started back in the 1960s? Are you afraid of Medicare now?
I don’t expect to get any real answers. Even our local trolls will respond only with cut-and-paste propaganda or links to wingnut sites.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:47 amThis is the result of FOX and the AM hate-mongers yelling fire in a crowded theater. Kinda makes you re-think the merits of freedom of speech.
And the white-hot rage from people who should be fishing or something with their grandkids make me think that maybe the made-up “death panel” has merit.
Kidding, of course. I think.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:48 amOlbermann had a ’special comment’ section last night.
He didn’t mince words. I was captured by his words & message.
If just half of our media could opine on this like Keith, we’d be getting somewhere.
They won’t. They’re too chickenshit to tell the truth.
I’d like to believe what Sandoz76 @ 15 is saying. I really would. But I don’t trust the corporate powers & mealy mouthed WTF TV people for a holy minute. They have an agenda of disruption, obfuscation & distortion, regardless of truth.
Therein lies the problem…
August 11th, 2009 at 10:49 amThese people are bused in to these events. There is no health care town hall event planned for Reading, PA, however, there is a busload of “screamers” staying at the Crown Hotel right outside of Reading, PA. My guess is these “screamers” are on their way to a town hall planned by Specter in the next county. Locals don’t need to say in hotels.
I’m wondering how many of these screamers are hired from an employment agency. The Republicans can never get enough help at the polls on election day so they hire people from an employment agency to cover the polls for them. What these Repubs don’t realize is that most of the people that are hired are Democrats.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:50 amWhen did we start withholding comments here at TP?
August 11th, 2009 at 10:51 amIf government single payer systems have a death panels(lol), why is it that these countries have a higher life expectancy than Americans??? Anybody ever thought to ask that question to a republican????
I watch this debate and laugh….How is it that so many Americas are stupid?????
As if the US would go against human rights…oh wait…never mind.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:54 amYea, this is just like opposition to health care reform of the 90s. They’re probably recycling the signs since Obama looks just like Hitler and Clinton. Ds being compared to Nazis, just like the 90s when refoorm meant a total change in gov’t and life and people ‘just want their country back’. Yea, exactly the same…except for one thing.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:54 amYou have a point here… this is beginning to get as nasty as those that opposed civil rights for everyone during the ’60’s. After all, these are the very kind of people that killed civil rights workers and Martin Luther King Jr. They are so angry that a black person, someone that they don’t consider to be a full person, is now sitting in what they perceive as their white’s only house.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:55 amIs there ANYTHING that Faux tells these people that they will NOT believe?
August 11th, 2009 at 10:56 amWhen these people shout that they want their country back, they are saying they want the black person out of the white house.
August 11th, 2009 at 10:59 amWhat is the truth behind the “death panels”?
http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/2009/08/10/why-does-johnny-isakson-want-to-kill-sarah-palins-baby/
Not quite what we have been hearing previously, eh.
This is damaging on two fronts. The obvious one that this is actually a Republican rider to the health care bill. The not so obvious one is that this is actually a Republican rider so it shoots down the claim that Republicans are not being allowed to have input on this bill. While we knew that was untrue, here is the proof to back it up.
I am willing to wager, however, that this new information will not shut up either Glenn Beck or Rush Limbaugh on this issue. Watch!
August 11th, 2009 at 11:02 amTeabaggers love health insurance companies and the obscene profits they rake in by denying coverage, denying care, and stealing.
Republicans support health insurance companies over the American people.
August 11th, 2009 at 11:02 amThese people are mind-less sheep. They honestly believe they are in he majority? Poll after poll shows Americans want reform. Just look at these people! They will cling to anything, no matter how illogical it is because our President is a black man. That is what it comes down too. Where were they when Bush and his cabal pissed our surplus away? Or the Drug Plan that Conservatives openly mocks? Or ‘The no child left behind’ Act. These people are being used by Big Business and they too dumb (or racist) to know it.
August 11th, 2009 at 11:03 amProtests At Cardin Town Hall Feature AFP Booth, ‘Death Panel’ Warnings, And Obama-Hitler Signs
– - I’m feeling awfully twitchy about Obama hosting a town hall meeting this morning. Security must be far better than in other meetings.
August 11th, 2009 at 11:05 amthose poor simpletons must have felt like strangers in a strange land considering the event took place at a center for higher education.
August 11th, 2009 at 11:05 amCongratulations, Think Progress!
Just watch out for the courageous Billdo ambushers.
;-)
August 11th, 2009 at 11:07 amThese people belong in a zoo or a asylum. They are so illogical, it’s embarrassing. I would be embarassed to be seen in their company. And look how old most of them are. Where are the young people? The minorities. Holy White Bread, Bat Man!
August 11th, 2009 at 11:10 amIt is in inherent in the Conservative psyche that a;; knowledge and ‘wisdom’ comes from an overarching authority. Any knowledge or wisdom that is contrary to the accepted authority’s teachings is automatically anathema.
Conservatives NEED to be told what to think and what to do.
They don;t actually read the Bible, the rely on preachers to read it for them, and interpret it for them.
(I’ve found that TP regulars are fare more knowledgeable about the Bible than Bible-thumping trolls like the infamous Darryl )
They don’t try to divine God’s will by themselves, they need that will divined and defined by other authority figures.
The NEED authority in their lives and the more absolute, the better, so they easily accept anyone who claims authority—especially those who claim God’s authority. Note the Republican reliance on God as an essential for electoral succeeds. Note also “The Family’s” screed that absolute power (as exercised by Stalin, Pol Pot, Hitler etc) is actually Divine.
They are afraid to think for themselves, incapable of challenging the authority they have accepted.
The Christian religion, as preached for 2,000 years, demands devotion to authority or else suffer terrible consequences.
(Note that the concept of Hell is non-existent in the Old Testament, presumably because in the good old days God handed out the punishments in real-time, not in a New testament afterlife).
When their chosen authority is challenged, it is inherently the challenge of evil, ergo no matter how prosaic the challenge–for example a public health care option versus the status quo of private health insurance (that they have been told by their leaders a billion times is “the best health care system in the world” )—that challenge must be evil and can ONLY be described by them using the symbolism of evil.
Thus, Obama is the Antichrist, Democrats are Nazis, the public health care option is actually murder.
August 11th, 2009 at 11:14 amThese are the lunatics who are in control of our destiny for the past 8 years and see the result. No wonder Bush had 27% strong support in all the polls during his presidency.
August 11th, 2009 at 11:14 amWe should be comparing pictures of these people to see how many of them appear at other events. I’m telling you, they are busing them around the country.
August 11th, 2009 at 11:16 amWhat… no Watchpup on this thread?
Time to form a pool… how long until that fool shows up here…
Lay down your money, folks…
August 11th, 2009 at 11:18 amI think these guys should just cancel these meetings. MSM is so busy trying to make these wackos ‘Mainstream’ or ‘Average Citizens’ by conveniently leaving the buses that bring these people to these ‘Meetings’ in the backround (I haven’t seen any, but I know they are there). This is the biggest fraud I have seen in a long time. MSM isn’t even debunking Palin’s ‘Death Panel’ claim. This makes me sick.
August 11th, 2009 at 11:21 amEgads. I can’t wait for health care to be done so the lobbyists can move on to a new issue.
August 11th, 2009 at 11:23 amThese LOSERS have been seething since November 4, 2008 at approx. 8:30 P.M. (EDT), ‘whadda we gonna do’??
Good job, SICKOS . .
Note to the LOSERS: A LIVING WILL supersedes both family and/or physicians’ wishes. YOU are the person who directs how your health care provider will treat you should you be unable to make your own medical decisions!!!
Say out LOUD: I WILL SIGN A LIVING WILL [again]
LIVING WILL
August 11th, 2009 at 11:24 amLIVING WILL
LIVING WILL
Towson, Md is where I grew up. I’m ashamed.
August 11th, 2009 at 11:25 amThe Feds need to start looking into some of rallies, there is starting to be too much ‘nazi’ stuff showing up and this is NOT good.
August 11th, 2009 at 11:27 amWake up America, are you going to let a hand full of these wing nuts destroy OUR country with their lies?
There is a certain population of the country that likes to be scared. Fox news feeds that population fear like it is pablum. They will believe anything they are told if it addresses the people’s own selfish interests.
What they don’t understand is that we are paying for the uninsured anyway. And the Death Panel? The people without health care have their own death panel because they end up waiting too long to see a doctor until it is too late. Why not focus on preventative medicine? It’s cheaper than in the long run.
It’s like that old oil filter commercial: “you can pay me now (for a little oil filter), or you can pay me later (for a heart transplant/cancer care/diabetes treatment/etc.).
August 11th, 2009 at 11:31 amJohn Barringer, my sister used to live in Towson (this was about 30 years ago.) I remember that her neighbors were a nice mixed-race couple with two beautiful children, but my sister said that a lot of the people in the neighborhood wouldn’t even talk to the couple.
August 11th, 2009 at 11:31 amWhy hasn’t Home Land Security done it’s job? These people have been getting death threats. Jesus, some as*hole left a gun at a Democrats meeting! Rememeber when the Righties called Dems and Libs wimps because they objected to the loss of our indivdual freedoms, and NOW they claim their right to ‘Free Speech’ is being disrupted? These jerks want it both ways! Righties had no problem when Protesters of the Iraq War were tossed in jail, or if you had a friggin T-shirt that had anti-Bush mottos were getting thrown out of Repug gatherings. WTF?
August 11th, 2009 at 11:32 amAmanda Terkel: When these people decry “socialism” can’t you ask them what they think “socialism” is?
Or simply ask them if they like their neighborhood police, fire dept. and post offices. How about the roads that got them to the rallies; do they like them? All socialist programs….
Half those people couldn’t tell you what socialism even means.
August 11th, 2009 at 11:37 amA man packing heat is at a school at a N.H. School! Unreal! Here the Pres. is flying in, and this SOB is carrying? I have a Permit, and I would NEVER, EVER has the balls to do that! WTF???
August 11th, 2009 at 11:37 amhttp://www.cnn.com/tony:
Is health care a fundamental American right, regardless of a person’s ability to pay?
August 11th, 2009 at 11:42 amYes 81%
No 19%
if he had any balls, he wouldn’t need the gun (and he wouldn’t be a right winger)
August 11th, 2009 at 11:43 amJane,
I heard someone in 2007 liberal California say blacks and whites should not marry!!
I grew up in Virginia in the 50’s and 60’s, so I saw a lot of racism. Heck, there was awful racism in New York City, Boston, Chicago, etc. The type of people who would kill anyone attempting to register Blacks to vote—-those people are still around. They are just more sophisticated now. They made our voting machines.
August 11th, 2009 at 11:49 amfrom TPM:
MSNBC just aired footage of the crowd gathering at the Obama town hall meeting on health care that’s supposed to start later today in New Hampshire and pointed out one man in a group holding protest signs with a gun in a holster on his hip. Apparently not a law officer, but a civilian.
Whatever the concealed carry laws in New Hampshire, you have to figure guns not allowed at a presidential event. Right?
August 11th, 2009 at 11:49 am5th estate (#38) is dead on.
Study concludes that conservatism can be explained psychologically as a set of neuroses rooted in “fear and aggression, dogmatism and the intolerance of ambiguity”.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2003/aug/13/usa.redbox
Also:
From psychologicalscience.org:
– Over 7000 kids had taken IQ tests at age ten; sorting out the bright kids from the duller.
– These kids were tracked and interviewed repeatedly for two decades.
Results:
20 years later, the smartest kids:
– turned into the most broad-minded and progressive adults; more tolerant of other races; more supportive of working mothers
In general, the sharpest kids:
August 11th, 2009 at 11:50 am– came to embrace much less traditional moral values
– were much more apt to challenge authority
– were also much less cynical as adults; more trusting that the political system can do good.
only 9% of scientists are Republican…
only 6% call themselves Conservative…
Now – the first Righty to step up and bash Scientists is more than welcome to hand in all their tech products, and health care, and STFU and live in a box under a bridge.
August 11th, 2009 at 11:58 am1 hour before the advanced team will be on him like flies on sheit!
August 11th, 2009 at 12:00 pmGee, I hope the secret service doesn’t have to wound any of these [cough, cough] protesters . .
I’d be a shame . .
August 11th, 2009 at 12:05 pmThe Conservative authority complex also explains why. as a survey recently showed, the more ‘Christian; a person is, the more likely they are to condone torture, because their leaders have condoned it ( because those being tortured deserve it because they are evil otherwise they wouldn’t be tortured by their leaders).
Preachers offer a choice to their congregants; worship God or be tortured in hell forever. They pretend this choice is a manifestation of “free will”–which is of course a ‘gift’ from God. In fact it is of course coercion. As Eddie Izzard put it, “Cake or Death? Cake? Okay, here’s some cake.”
Conservative politicians and the Conservative media offer the same kind of choices when it comes to policies, in the same Manichean fashion:
Health care reform =death for old people
Immigration reform = robbery, rape and murder
Cash for Clunkers = totalitarian socialism or Nazism
Conservatives are brought-up with this kind equation as a life-encompassing universal rule because the anchor in their lives from day one is the authority of the ‘Christian’ church and the indoctrination from their preachers who describe the ‘truth’ of their very existence in these diametric terms.
Conservatives are home-schooling proponents NOT because public education may be a crap-shoot when it comes to quality, but because their children may be exposed to things that are anathema to the ‘Christian’ world view–of it sin;t in the Bible ( as far as they know), then it must be evil.
The authority fetish, and their determined sequestration from “the Other” makes them easily manipulable and easy to motivate and organize. This is how they succeed politically, despite their policy incompetence. They don’t challenge each other on the best way or the best solution, as liberals do,they just demand ONE way and ONE solution to everything, because their authority figures tell them that their is ONLY ONE WAY–and that is God’s way and the way of anyone who claims to speak for God.
This also explains why attempts at ‘bipartisanship’ fail–the GOP simply doesn’t work that way any more (not since Reagan).
In the primaries Obama and Clinton were very evenly matched but I went with Clinton because of her personal experience with GOP AND in particular because I found Obama too religious.
It would appear since then that Obama isn’t as religious as I feared BUT I’m afraid he’s sufficiently ‘informed’ by his religion to believe he has something in common with the Religious Right that dominates the GOP, and perhaps THAT notion engenders his desire for bipartisanship and reconciliation as much as any humanistic philosophy.
If so it’s a huge misjudgment. I think Obama is an actual Christian in the proper sense of the word. The right sneeringly describes him as the liberals’ “Messiah” (and certainly some seemed to regard him as such) but the similarities don’t end with the adoration of his disciples.
The “messiah” you will remember preached conciliation and respect and care for one’s fellow man, but in so doing he challenged the status quo who called him a false prophet and a blasphemer and he was crucified for his efforts.
August 11th, 2009 at 12:08 pmrastaman says:
WOW…..he spelled all those big words correctly.
Someone showed him how to use a dictionary.
These neanderturds are the most ignorant of our society…
….makes you proud to be an American.
August 11th, 2009 at 12:09 pmAfter enduring 8 years of Bushit warrantless surveillance on peaceful protestors and dissenters–who were right about the issues–I can’t help but wonder why these goons, who are clearly showing their violent intentions aren’t in free speech zones a mile away from the town hall meetings, or why they aren’t immediately being tossed out like the Denver 3 were. These people get away with $hit that we on the left were never allowed to even get close to during the Bush Reich…
:|
August 11th, 2009 at 12:10 pmJohn Barringer says: Towson, Md is where I grew up. I’m ashamed.
Don’t feel so bad. You left didn’t you? :D
August 11th, 2009 at 12:10 pmeyeswideopen1 says:
mary lacewing says:
MSNBC just said the guy has the legal right to carry his gun as long as he is on private property (the front lawn of a CHURCH). He is a little ways away from the town hall and will not be let inside the building. Sheeesh! Only in America.
August 11th, 2009 at 12:11 pm5th estate- you ROCK
August 11th, 2009 at 12:15 pmThese teabagging wingnut protestors like the guy with the nazi sign are a clear example of what happens thru inbreeding and homeschooling. Frightening.
August 11th, 2009 at 12:16 pmI hope Obama trots out a thousand riot police just before he arrives. Arrest anyone that does not comply immediately with whatever the riot police tell them to do.
August 11th, 2009 at 12:36 pmSandoz76 says: 5th estate- you ROCK
oh ‘pshaw’! :D I just have a highly developed sense of self importance, that’s all.
August 11th, 2009 at 12:37 pmI agree with Sandoz — 5th Estate totally rocks!
August 11th, 2009 at 12:48 pmLets see now. The Media, and conservatives raise all kinds of hell when a pair of videos comparing Bush to Hitler were submitted to Move On. Yet when Obama and Democrats in general are likend to Hitler and the Nazi Party the media just yawns and the Whackjobs on the right egg it on.
August 11th, 2009 at 12:51 pmCare to explain the dichotomy to me Trolls?
Scratch a Republican and underneath you’ll find an ignorant thug.
August 11th, 2009 at 12:52 pmI’m pretty sure that old guy who was pissing and moaning about being promised free healthcare for life actually does have free healthcare for life. My dad is on Medicare and Tricare for Life is the supplemental, and he doesn’t pay a dime for for his healthcare.
And then the old crank protester has the nerve to b!tch about socialism!? Ha!
August 11th, 2009 at 12:53 pmYou forgot to add selfish…
:]
August 11th, 2009 at 12:54 pmIf we cling to the false left-right paradigm and blindly believe the lies, such as National Socialism is the opposite of Fabian Socialism, then we are doomed as a free people.
Let us never forget the admonition of Lord Acton: Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely.
It was the mandatory health care system that came into effect in Germany in January 1884 that served as the platform for Hitler’s Hospitals, leading from there to a eugenics program, and on down the road to Auschwitz. Those who have studied this entire program know that this is not an exaggeration.
The point is this: Without the compulsory health care system already in place before Hitler came to power, the Nazis would have had a very difficult time carrying out this part of their agenda.
August 11th, 2009 at 12:56 pmAmanda,
I would like to see a bit more footage of the counter-protesters. I know sanity isn’t nearly as interesting as those whacked in the head goofball teabaggers, but I think it’s important to show that they are not the only ones speaking up.
Thanks, and good luck at the townhall events!
August 11th, 2009 at 12:57 pmWhen will we outlaw the Republican Party as a criminal organization?
August 11th, 2009 at 12:58 pmThese people embarrass our country. I’m embarrassed to say I’m an American when I watch those videos. Seriously, is that what we are now? It’s disgraceful. Most of those people have no clue what they’re even opposing… none whatsoever.
August 11th, 2009 at 12:58 pmrepublicanSScareme says:
August 11th, 2009 at 1:00 pmHard to outlaw stupidity.
To know the criminals in both parties all you need to do is see who is for auditing the Federal Resereve and the evil which is against it.
For the press to try and convince us that this a Republican versus Democrat issue, they have little or no respect for the intelligence of the average American. We are bankrupt as a nation and people are sick of being taxed without represntation. When the majority of the people were against Bush’s War in Iraq, we went ahead with it anyway.
92% of the people were against Bush’s bailouts and it happened anyway.
Where is the representation? I wish we elected Kucinich.
August 11th, 2009 at 1:04 pmpoor little LL, trying to spread the lies that scare him so much
what a little pansy
August 11th, 2009 at 1:04 pmhilarious how LL and Jack always show up at the exact same time
August 11th, 2009 at 1:07 pmLiberalLinebacker
Wow, do you ever come down for a while. I mean no matter how badly you think you need those drugs you really should take a day or two off from them occationally.
By your reasoning the nazi’s are rising world wide.
August 11th, 2009 at 1:09 pmIt’s almost as if they were punching a clock and starting a days work isn’t it?
August 11th, 2009 at 1:10 pmGood point Liberal Linebacker! This was also a hallmark of Leninism. Why bring the word evil into the debate on government health care? The mass murderer and Bolshevik leader of communist Russia Lenin said that socialized medicine was the keystone in the arch of the socialist state.
Yet Hitler had the same agenda. Totalitarianism in essence needs to be placed on one side of the spectrum with Anarchy on the other wing, as the complete opposite.
A Constitutional Republic is in the middle. I fear our fiscal policy and foreign policy failures has many Americans not trusting more big government. Obama needs to pull in the reigns and undo the Big Bush governemnt remnants before he can embark on a Socialist venture. It is not going to fly with Americans and people here instead of uniting the people, they divide. Stereotyping Republicans as Republicans stereotype Democrats.
This is hardly what a Liberal does. In fact it is the opposite of Liberalism.
August 11th, 2009 at 1:10 pmPunching the clock with one hand while giving each other a handjob with the other
August 11th, 2009 at 1:11 pmCats r Flyfishn says:
These people are bused in to these events. There is no health care town hall event planned for Reading, PA, however, there is a busload of “screamers” staying at the Crown Hotel right outside of Reading, PA. My guess is these “screamers” are on their way to a town hall planned by Specter in the next county. Locals don’t need to say in hotels.
And this is why participation in town hall events should be limited to people who live in the district. I don’t understand why these Democrats aren’t doing this. It is perfectly justifiable to say that you want to know what your constituents think, not bussed and paid protesters.
August 11th, 2009 at 1:15 pmgood point liberal linebacker
good point back at you jack the fake liberal.
You guys in the same basement?
Nice to see you trying to define something that you don’t understand and trying to win a battle that you have already lost…..heh.
August 11th, 2009 at 1:16 pmI can’t comment about everything written here, I have a job which is far too demanding on my time. I like much of what liberal linebacker writes, although not everything.
We can not dissociate the concept of Liberty, Privacy and Freedom of Speech from the Liberal platform. If we do this only Libertarians and Constitutional Party members will fight for these issues and they are in the minority.
The Republican Party has certainly gone over to the dark side with exception of a few good men like Ron Paul. I’ve been to a “town hall meeting” and nearly everyone there hated GW Bush and Dick Cheney. It was hardly what you would call a Republican venture.
August 11th, 2009 at 1:20 pmlol, he calls ron paul a good man and claims to be a liberal
ron paul opposes social security and medicare
how does that square with being a liberal?
(hint: it doesn’t)
August 11th, 2009 at 1:23 pmThis comment has been voted down. Click to read.
jack sees brown shirts under his bed
August 11th, 2009 at 1:26 pmI love when liberallinebacker comes in to a chat and stirs things up.
I finally had a chance to read this proposal and what I do find disturbing is the section about the government’s coming into homes and usurping parental rights over child care. It’s in sections 440 and 1904 of the House bill (Page 838), under the heading “home visitation programs for families with young children and families expecting children.” The programs would educate parents on child behavior and parenting skills. According to the bill government agents, “well-trained and competent staff,” would “provide parents with knowledge of age-appropriate child development in cognitive, language, social, emotional, and motor domains … modeling, consulting, and coaching on parenting practices.
Instead of poor people getting health care, let’s spend our money to have someone barge into our homes and tell us how to raise our children! This is not what the Democratic Party has ever stood for in my lifetime.
Are they serious?
Jack may be a little bit paranoid of the Republican Party, in some ways I don’t blame him. I don’t like what I am reading and I don’t like the mandatory nature of the bill and what it implies.
This is not an alternative to private insurance. This is ram it down your throat totalitarianism.
August 11th, 2009 at 1:41 pmHello Ranting Tommy,
To call Ron Paul the only good man in the Republican Party, is not exactly a ringing endorsement of said party. Many people consider him a Libertarian with sound economic principles and the staunchest supporter of the US Constitution.
I oppose social security too. Imagine that? A black man who has been a Democratic Party member for 30 years. What is the world coming to?
Ron Paul has more strengths than weaknesses. He is an honest man. He does not represent the mainstream views of the Neoconservatives that have taken over the Republican Party.
August 11th, 2009 at 1:47 pmmike, you should work on those reading comprehension skills
it does not say what you claim it says
August 11th, 2009 at 1:48 pmsorry mike, but ron paul is NOT a decent man. he is a political opportunist with ideas that are not good for the country
August 11th, 2009 at 1:49 pmMany also consider him to be a corporate shill who would trash the constitution too. I’m one of those.
August 11th, 2009 at 1:51 pmInteresting Jack at #79 slams Bush and people here have voted it down. There must be closet Bush fans at this blog. I voted him up. I agree with what he said about Bush.
August 11th, 2009 at 1:52 pmjacks a troll.
August 11th, 2009 at 1:54 pmjack was voted down for sockpuppetteering
get with the program
August 11th, 2009 at 1:55 pmRon Paul a corporate shill? Surely you jest. You may as well say black is white.
August 11th, 2009 at 1:56 pm“Nothing is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.” – Martin Luther King, Jr.
August 11th, 2009 at 1:56 pmyou should flip back and forth between Fox news and any other station carrying Obama’s Town Hall — Every other station is letting Obama speak. Fox is interrupting with panel discussions and breakaways to other town halls where other people are spreading myths… simply astounding.
August 11th, 2009 at 1:57 pmThis statement alone makes it clear to all of us that you have no idea what is in the bill.
You are only reapeating what someone told you was in the bill.
That someone is a corportation that is profiting from the current failed health care system and doesn’t want it changed.
They would have to get a real job like the rest of us.
August 11th, 2009 at 1:58 pmhttp://www.seslichatli.com/?tag=on-sevisme-teknikleri
August 11th, 2009 at 2:00 pmWell, according to LL, Jack, and Mike:
Every developed country in the world is Nazi, Stalinist, Leninist, and Fascist. Funny, I travel a lot and read a lot and I never noticed that!
BTW, Germany’s healthcare comes in about #3 in the world. Netherlands is #1. USA about 30th. Even the Lou Dobbs Show was saying how good the Dutch got it. $3527 per capita compared to our $7290 per capita. Dutch spend 9.8% of GDP on healthcare. We spend 16%. And we got 47 million with nothing. Every Dutch citizen has their own doctor. Source: Lou Dobbs Show.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:01 pmI had to look up sock puppeteering. Directly from the source of all knowledge, known as Wikipedia, I know the sarcasm is thick.
“A sock puppet is an alternative account used for fraudulent, disruptive, or otherwise deceptive purposes that violate or circumvent the enforcement of Wikipedia policies.”
How was that statement sockpuppeteering?
August 11th, 2009 at 2:02 pmTo the man known as Fred:
I read the entire bill. I like much of the bill. I dislike much of the bill. Why is there so much extremism here?
I believe in Socialized medicine, but would prefer private medicine competing alongside and national program where you can “opt out” or “opt in”.
I don’t like a few things I read and I am entitled to my opinion. Many European countries have socialized medicine without the big-brotherism. England is a bad example. Scandinavian countries are good examples.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:06 pmMeant “every other developed country in the world”.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:06 pmif it has to be explained to you, you won’t get it
August 11th, 2009 at 2:07 pmMikeua26 says:
“…. would prefer private medicine competing alongside and national program where you can “opt out” or “opt in”.
Which is exactly what Obama proposes. Do you know the meaning of the word “OPTION”?
August 11th, 2009 at 2:10 pmTo Keith,
I travel extensively also. If the Netherlands program is working so well, why do we need to deviate so greatly from that program?
I don’t think you would want to partake of the Germany health care program in 1941. Now things are a slightly different over there, wouldn’t you agree? I’m also happy that I am not a Russian citizen for reasons that go beyond their health care system.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:11 pmTo the man known as Mikeua26,
You are as phony as a $3 bill. Nobody thinks and talks like you. You need a writer. You just don’t have the skill.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:15 pmKeith it appears to be mandatory to me. Show me where I am wrong, this is important to me because my lecture next Tuesday is about this proposal and the economic implications.
If money is deducted from your paycheck for this program and choose not to partake and go with a private insurance company, that is not “opting out”.
Is it truly optional? Granted no one will force you to go to the government doctor, but will they tax you for it anyway, even if you decline use of the service?
August 11th, 2009 at 2:15 pmIF the Dutch system is working so well????? Being ranked #1 in the world is not good enough for you, but #30 is fine???? Your madeup character does not make any sense! No, cretin, I would not like 1941 Germany. And Russia is not communist. They have an Al Capone-style capitalism. Why am I even talking to you?
August 11th, 2009 at 2:18 pm#112 I printed out your comment and posted it on my wall. I’ve written three books on Macroeconomics. The proceeds from these books paid for my house in France, (great socialized medicine there).
Oddly enough, I purchased this home without using three dollar bills. Thank you for making my day.
Your comment is sure to make even the most grumpy of my colleagues smile.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:20 pmI don’t know mike. Why are you an extremist. This was your statement which in no way describes the bill in any way shape or form and yet you lay it out there as if it were fact. It is not. It is a lie:
August 11th, 2009 at 2:21 pm
There will be no government doctor!!!!!! Where in the hell are you getting your info? Rumors? There will be SOME government paperwork instead of totally private paperwork. Think Medicare. There are no Medicare doctors, are there? I do not believe you are giving a lecture anywhere. Maybe your basement.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:22 pmWhere does it say you will be taxed oh writer of many lies and books full of lies.
Even if it did you moron, you get taxed for things you don’t use all the time. Health insurance premiums are a tax but they aren’t being used for the good of the consumer are they?
You don’t drive on I-35 very often probably but your tax dollars help pay for it.
Your high horse has a broken leg.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:25 pmThis comment has been voted down. Click to read.
You think France has a GREAT system and you think what Obama is proposing is like Lenin???? Your character is tooo nonsensical.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:28 pmFred, shame on you. It is OK to say you think Obama’s plan is just peachy keen, but let’s not be deceivers.
There is no option. This plan is going to be rammed down our throats. There is no “opt out”. Only the very wealthy will be able to afford private doctors.
The middle class will never be able to pay for private health insurance and socialized medicine at the same time. They will be forced to accept the socialized plan.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:30 pmNo, I am not insinuating that. If you cannot comprehend my extremely plain talk, then give it up. You are 2 billion brain cells away from wring a book on Macroeconomics.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:32 pmI don’t think what Obama is proposing is like Lenin. I never wrote that. Do you think that? I stated very specifically two elements of Obama’s plan which I did not like. Neither had anything to do with Lenin or any other dead totalitarian dictator.
Keith, why do you insist on talking to me? You must like it.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:33 pmmike, just because you are shaking in your boots afraid, it doesn’t mean that the rest of us will fall for your fear mongering BS
we know better and we aren’t right wing cowards
give it up
August 11th, 2009 at 2:33 pmwriting
August 11th, 2009 at 2:34 pmOk professor, which is it, the government cannot efficiently run a program or it will be so good that private companies cannot compete?
August 11th, 2009 at 2:35 pmnow you’re just lying.
YOUR WORDS:
August 11th, 2009 at 2:35 pm
Keith at #114 you insinuated that while the Netherlands was #1, I was satisfied with the status quo and satisfied with the US being at #30.
I am very unhappy with the status quo. I also do not like a few elements in Obama’s plan. I would embrace a system identical to that of the Netherlands. Now let’s see if we get it. Obama’s plan isn’t close.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:37 pmIf the state can come into your home (forcibly) and tell you how to raise your children and force you to pay for this privilege, what do you call it?
That isn’t ram it down your throat big-brotherism. How did you escape Jonestown? Were you immune to the Kool Aid?
August 11th, 2009 at 2:39 pmwow, that would be
of course, that isn’t in the bill, so your question is bogus
try reading it again, this time with your eyes open, rather than letting the radio tell you what they want you to think it says
August 11th, 2009 at 2:40 pmI’m tired of you very Statist, unliberal people. Another time perhaps when there are more people here with common sense, open mindedness and a tad more reading comprehension.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:41 pmObama’s plan? Where is Obama’s plan? What you are talking about is a democratic plan that the right has done their best to render useless.
The bad parts belong to the right or it might resemble the Netherlands plan.
You know for a guy who says he is an elite member of society and a professor who has been published you sound a lot like any run of the mill right wing kook on the street.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:42 pmIt is in the bill my friend. I read it. Why don’t you read it?
August 11th, 2009 at 2:42 pmOh… I know why, because you spend all your free time on blogs, you simply haven’t the time.
right wingers lie. it’s what they do
August 11th, 2009 at 2:43 pmA man with a real education wouldn’t cry and run when the facts make you look foolish. He would stay and try to find common ground and change his tactic to try to get his point across.
You come across as a phony. Buh bye.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:44 pmAnd he’s black and has been a member of the Democratic Party for thirty years and he has a mansion in France and is giving a Macroeconomics lecture next Tuesday. Can I buy your three books at Amazon?
August 11th, 2009 at 2:49 pmtoo funny
mike makes an erroneous claim about the contents of the bill, gets busted for it, then claims that WE have reading comprehension problems
mike is either a liar or a fool
August 11th, 2009 at 2:50 pmmaybe both
Additionally we can be pretty sure he is no professor or author either.
August 11th, 2009 at 2:53 pm“I believe in Socialized medicine, but would prefer private medicine competing alongside and national program where you can “opt out” or “opt in”.”
Why would someone who believes in Socialized medicine prefer something else? Or does ‘believe’ have a different definition for a wealthy macroeconomist?
August 11th, 2009 at 3:15 pmBefore anymore of you liberals start ranting about the people protesting the health care bill, can you please read it? Is that hard to do?
I keep forgetting that most of you were educated in the public school system. That could be another good reason to not support the health care bill.
August 11th, 2009 at 3:28 pm“I keep forgetting that most of you were educated in the public school system.”
I didn’t know that we all had bios on TP. They must have mine wrong, I went to Catholic schools all my life. TP, can you fix my bio? ;)
August 11th, 2009 at 3:41 pmBefore anymore of you liberals start ranting about the people protesting the health care bill, can you please read it? Is that hard to do?
What specific parts of the House Bill do you object to, blclem?
I would love to discuss it with you.
August 11th, 2009 at 3:50 pmwhen there are more people here with common sense, open mindedness and a tad more reading comprehension.
August 11th, 2009 at 3:59 pm–
would that be “people like me”
Mikeua26 says:
Keith it appears to be mandatory to me. Show me where I am wrong, this is important to me because my lecture next Tuesday is about this proposal and the economic implications.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2009/jul/22/ibdeditorialscom/private-health-insurance-page-16-house-bill/
Time to change that lecture…
August 11th, 2009 at 3:59 pmI finally had a chance to read this proposal and what I do find disturbing is the section about the government’s coming into homes and usurping parental rights over child care. It’s in sections 440 and 1904 of the House bill (Page 838), under the heading “home visitation programs for families with young children and families expecting children.”
You don’t read very well, apparently.
This provides States the opportunity to apply for Federal Grants for these types of programs… it is not mandatory.
Incidently, when my son was born we received two home visits from a nurse in the weeks after returning home through a program just like this. It was not to tell us we were ‘bad parents’ or ‘tell us how to raise our son’ but rather to help us and answer questions… hardly the ominous sign you make it out to be, is it?
August 11th, 2009 at 4:08 pmI have to wonder who is rolling over in his grave more—Orwell or Hitler?
August 11th, 2009 at 5:02 pmblclem says:
I am sure you forget a lot of things. Fortunatly many of them were stupid propaganda and not related to reality. So WHICH bill MORON? There isnt ONE BILL there are several competing versions of a healthcare bill. Wherever you were educated it left you too stupid to be taken seriously
August 11th, 2009 at 5:08 pmTrolls could be getting their bs from the Liberty Counsel:
http://www.lc.org/media/9980/attachments/healthcare_overview_obama_072909.pdf
10 page “overview”
August 11th, 2009 at 5:09 pmpage 7 asks Compulsory Abortions?
page 10 asks if tracking devices will be placed in patients!
dozens of them for the koolaid-drinkers
He could be attending Liberty U.
August 11th, 2009 at 5:10 pmblclem says:
——————————————————————————–
Before anymore of you liberals start ranting about the people protesting the health care bill, can you please read it? Is that hard to do?
I keep forgetting that most of you were educated in the public school system. That could be another good reason to not support the health care bill.
You forget alot, that’s the problem with repugs like yourself, no sense of history and willing to doom yourself. Stay away and let the adults fix this country moron.
August 11th, 2009 at 5:48 pmblclem says:
Before anymore of you liberals start ranting about the people protesting the health care bill, can you please read it? Is that hard to do?
I keep forgetting that most of you were educated in the public school system. That could be another good reason to not support the health care bill.
You know, teachers HATE it when you read Cliff Notes or in your case GOP talking points…Let me give you a hint, reading an email a page long is not the same as reading a bill from Congress…
August 12th, 2009 at 3:25 pmvery thanks fory
August 12th, 2009 at 4:27 pm