Feingold asks Obama to announce a timetable for withdrawal from Afghanistan.
Feingold asks Obama to announce a timetable for withdrawal from Afghanistan.
With polls showing that the war in Afghanistan is becoming increasingly unpopular, members of Congress have begun to express skepticism about the administration’s strategy there. Military officials believe that Gen. Stanley McChrystal, the top US commander in Afghanistan, may ask for as many as 20,000 additional troops. ABC News reports today that Sen. Russ Feingold (D-WI) has called on President Obama to announce a timetable for withdrawal from Afghanistan:
Sen. Russ Feingold, D-WI, called on President Obama to announce a timetable for withdrawal of American troops from Afghanistan. “This is a strategy that is not likely to succeed,” Sen. Feingold said about the troop buildup in Afghanistan. [...]
“I think it is time we start discussing a flexible timetable so that people around the world can see when we are going to bring our troops out,” said Feingold. “Showing the people there and here that we have a sense about when it is time to leave is one of the best things we can do,” he added.
In breaking with the Administration’s strategy, Feingold joins many progressives who worry that a military escalation in Afghanistan will only lead to “further destabilization” in the region. A CNN poll recently found that nearly three quarters of self-identified Democrats now oppose the war there.
Topic Cloud
ArchivesBlog Roll
Feingold is true presidential material, an articulate and thoughtful progressive.
August 24th, 2009 at 3:53 pmIf Obama continues to throw more resources into the Afghanistan mess, and at the same time, surrenders to the Regressives on health care, there is a good chance that the Democrats will lose the House and also have their lead in the Senate reduced by 6-8 seats. And then Obama will be a real toothless tiger for the next 2 years.
The irony is that he would become a toothless tiger only if he didn’t use his teeth when he had them!
August 24th, 2009 at 3:59 pmDo what Bush 41 should have done prior to ‘W’s conception…withdraw!
August 24th, 2009 at 4:00 pmI agree Feingold is a very good man… let’s hope President Obama will listen. We will never win that war or the people of that region. I think we have done our fair share and given enought of our blood. Time to move out…
August 24th, 2009 at 4:00 pmConservatives, take note. Democrats do not march like mindless robots lock-step with their “fearless leader”. Unlike repubs, Democrats think for themselves. Or, as Will Rogers famously said, “I don’t belong to any organized political party. I’m a Democrat.”
August 24th, 2009 at 4:07 pmIrishpapa says:
I agree Feingold is a very good man… let’s hope President Obama will listen. We will never win that war or the people of that region. I think we have done our fair share and given enought of our blood. Time to move out…
August 24th, 2009 at 4:00 pm
____________
We don’t need to win the war, but we do need to leave Afghanistan stable and self-sufficient. I don’t mind more troops and more civilians going in to Afghanistan if it will stop indiscriminate bombing of Afghan civilians. And as long as we have a timetable and some concrete goals and metrics for success.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:07 pmOMG….i am REEEEEEALLY starting to like Feingold.
still don’t trust him 100% though.
KUCINICH 2012
August 24th, 2009 at 4:08 pmI have been waiting to hear these words and finally we can end the Cheney/Bush cultural imperialism.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:10 pmI am not convinced that we need to either (1) increase troops or (2) announce a withdrawal timetable. I continue to believe that our primary objectives in that area is to clean out the unregulated mountainous area along the Afghan-Pakistan border, assist in stabilizing the Afghan government and initiate development efforts that will be sustainable after our departure.
Our presence is as much about Pakistan as it is about Afghanistan. They are both under threat. The real wild-card in this region is Iran. Our departure should be made as soon as we are confident that these countries are sufficiently capable of self-defense that they can withstand continued aggression from Iran. This should clearly be done sooner than later but I am not sure we can put a date on it right now.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:11 pmI am hopeful that President Obama has finally gotten the real message about bipartisanship.
The repiggies will not give an inch, nor will they acknowledge their errors.
The President needs to forcefully repudiate the repiggie policies of the past.
History has shown the Afghan region to be particularly treacherous for outsiders.
It would be far less costly to post a much larger financial reward, and perhaps some U.S. real estate ownership, for the capture of leading Taliban and Al-Qaeda operatives who are known to have had roles in the bombings of the World Trade Center or U.S. sites.
Far too much American, Iraqi, Afghan, Pakistani and European blood has been shed for the Bush/Cheney testosterone-booster wars.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:11 pmI wonder if there is a way to impeach Harry Reid and replace him with someone with integrity (and testosterone) like Russ Feingold? Wow…Think of what it would be like to have a Senate Majority Leader again who was a leader.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:15 pmThe Russians had no chance in the 80`s and we have no in the 21 st century, this is a War we will never win unless we nuke it and that I don`t want.Pouring billions into it will be Obama`s Vietnam and we cannot afford it.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:24 pmUnfortunately, there is no “win” in Afghanistan. If there was we would have done so already. Just like the Russians, British, and others (Alexander the Great), we will not win.
Sorry guys, it’s not happening. The sooner we get out of there the better. A soldier in a town next to mine was just awarded the Medal of Honor for his service in Afghanistan.
I’m sure it’s some solace to his family, but I think they’d rather have their son back.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:25 pmNo one has ever won in Afghanistan and no one ever will.
Being there for even a minute longer only gets more troops killed nothing more…
…oh, except for the drain of our treasury…there is that.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:25 pmAs a Wisconsonite, I am very proud of the job that Russ Feingold is doing! America could use more progressive minds like his at the highest levels of leadership.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:27 pmEven the Mongol hordes couldn’t conquer Afghanistan…
…and they were neighbors!
August 24th, 2009 at 4:29 pmWait, we gotta “stay the course” in Iraq which had nothing to do with 9/11, but the country that actually attacked us we should bail on early?
The one lesson that we did learn from Iraq, from Shinseki’s original warning that higher troop levels would be necessary (which got him fired), to “the surge” (Bush’s brand name of executing Shinseki’s plan five years late) is that if you don’t have enough people to do the job, it’ll take forever. If you put in enough people, you can get the job done, and then you can go home. This should apply to Afghanistan as well.
And as for the “the British and Russians got their asses kicked in Afghanistan” thing, the simple solution to that is to not go in underestimating them and overestimating yourself. Fight smarter, not harder. I have confidence in the Obama administration to be able to do that.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:30 pmtom says:
Our presence is as much about Pakistan as it is about Afghanistan. They are both under threat. The real wild-card in this region is Iran. Our departure should be made as soon as we are confident that these countries are sufficiently capable of self-defense that they can withstand continued aggression from Iran. This should clearly be done sooner than later but I am not sure we can put a date on it right now.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:11 pm
_______________
“Aggression from Iran?”
Are you nuts?
Iran has absolutely nothing to do with Afghanistan/Pakistan, except to side with us in wanting to prevent a radical Sunni theocracy from taking root in either of their neighbors. Al-Qa’ida considers the “Shi’a Dogs” of Iran a more reprehensible enemy than the United States, and it was Iran who helped us target the Taliban back in 2001.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:30 pmThis comment has been voted down. Click to read.
Feingold is true presidential material, an articulate and thoughtful progressive.
– - He would have run by now if he was interested. Either Feingold’s ego doesn’t need to be sated by a presidential run, he has something in his past he’d rather not have exposed, or he’s just content serving as Senator, flying under the radar and acting as a voice of reason for the country.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:35 pmElBruce says:
The one lesson that we did learn from Iraq, from Shinseki’s original warning that higher troop levels would be necessary (which got him fired), to “the surge” (Bush’s brand name of executing Shinseki’s plan five years late) is that if you don’t have enough people to do the job, it’ll take forever. If you put in enough people, you can get the job done, and then you can go home.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:30 pm
______________
Well, it helps the “surge” strategy if all the cities and provinces have been ethnically cleansed, much of the population has fled the country, and one major faction in the civil war decides to give up fighting so their leader can stufy to become an Imam.
I do hope the administration is not seriously looking at the “surge” as a success story. Arming warlords and creating lots of little Afghan militias is NOT the way to get us out of Afghanistan.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:35 pmIt turns out that it is actually well understood within the military and us embassy in Afghanistan, that we are funding the Taliban with all of foreign assistance.
“Virtually every major project includes a healthy cut for the insurgents.”
“‘Everyone knows this is going on,’ said one U.S. Embassy official, speaking privately.”
http://blogs.reuters.com/global/2009/08/13/who-is-funding-the-afghan-taliban-you-dont-want-to-know/
I will ask Obama, the same thing I asked Bush… how many more of my friends need to die for this pointless crap?
We need to leave now.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:38 pmSlappyMORON says:
Why are you still here. It wont work. Find some self resepect. Begging us to pity you is a useless endeavor. Your post will go straight to the sewer where it belongs as anyone who sees you nick KNOWS the only thing you do is beg us to pity you and votes you out. No one reads your begging anymore it is embarassing. We KNOW you are stupid and pathetic. We KNOW you think you are clever. You are stupid. You are pitiful. You beg us and beg us until we get pity fatigue. You will get no more pity from us. You need to feed your addiction somewhere else.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:40 pmElBruce,
Your post seems to say you think we’ve accomplished our goals in Iraq. Though we succeded later than we should have because we didn’t have enough troops.
First, I’d say no matter how many troops you have if you don’t have a plan you’ll never win.
Second, the more troops the better. If either of these were wars of necessity (which I don’t believe they were) then we should have established a draft.
Third, what did we win in Iraq? Increased Iranian influence perhaps. What do we stand to “win” in Afghanistan?
Very perplexing isn’t it.
I, for one, don’t really care if Iran has more of an influence there.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:44 pmWe should be building schools, roads, hospitals, etc. instead of killing indiscriminately in the hopes the Taliban will cower in fear and wither away. It won’t happen. Building and creating brings forth hope and cooperation. Killing and destroying breeds fear and anger and unfortunately, retaliation.
If all we’re trying to do is to eliminate a crazed religious sect then we can save a lot of money and lives because we have plenty of those here.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:47 pmIt’s amazing how some people don’t realize that if we break it, we have an obligation to fix it. We broke a lot of shiite in the Middle East and now we have a moral and national security imperitive to try and fix it or at least defuse the situation.
Whining about spilt milk and how many towels and mops it’s going to take doesn’t really mean spit if you’re weren’t there trying to stop the arrogant little two year old named Dubya from throwing the milk on the floor in the first place.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:48 pmBill Maher makes this point.
Why do we think that terrorists like Al Qaeda NEED a country????
Those often run videos of Al Qaeda training camps…with the monkey bars are a Joke. Home grown militias are running through the same kinds of Obstacles in the Back Woods of America
Most of the tactical planning for 911 was done in Hamburg Germany…a NATO ALLY.
Toasterhead is right..Iran would be an ally AGAINST the Taliban…so is Pakistan. We need to be thinking about aiding them to keep AlQaeda on the run….and getting out gracefully before we join a Long and Sorry list of Failed Invaders.
August 24th, 2009 at 4:52 pmdebbi…..this is not about ME. Please try to get past ol slappy and focus on the issue at hand which Obama and HIS growing war. I’m sure you are rich and have health care a new car a new house and all the food you could ever eat and thats fine but some of us here voted for hope and change in which we were promised health care and a whole bunch of other things…..well…..WHERE ARE THEY?
August 24th, 2009 at 5:01 pmSlappyMORON. I stopped reading your posts long ago. I got tired of being embarassed FOR you since you lack the dignity and self respect to be embarassed for yourself. Every post from you was the same begging us to pity you for being so stupid and pathetic. I just vote you down and slap you around becuse your ignorant posts are never worth anything else. You are a stupid punkass troll and a waste of precious oxygen
August 24th, 2009 at 5:05 pmRaynman,
I’ll give you a mop, now go clean up. Easy isn’t it.
It’s equally amazing to me that a bunch of shi*heads in the Bush admin. brought this war upon us when bin Ladin was OFFERED to us.
What a crock. Why don’t you go with your fellow Bush supporters over to Afghanistan and start the work that will lead to success.
You can take Blackwater with you. Although, be warned, they enjoy killing brown people for fun.
Please let us know when you finished, we’ll send a plane over to pick you up. In the meantime, no INNOCENT american blood needs to be spilled for Bush’s crimes against humanity.
August 24th, 2009 at 5:05 pmWay to go, Russ.
Anyone who thinks US Combat troops in any foreign country (particularly Muslim) have any chance at being a stabilizing force should back away from the kool aid and drink more water.
The only way we can ‘win in Iraq or Afghanistan is to kill every one of their citizens and open real estate offices.
August 24th, 2009 at 5:14 pmdebbi…ummmmm riiiight. The ONLY reason you come here is to read my posts. I do this thankless job to keep you in front of your screen as long as I can so you are not out in society bothering people and causing trouble…..it seems to be working.
August 24th, 2009 at 5:20 pmSlappyMoron begging and snivelling again. I am here when I am here no matter WHAT you do MORON. When I see your ignorant posts signed with your pathetic nick I just take a bit of time to slap you around because you are ignorant. You are a punk, you deserve it, and I WANT to. I got tired of being embarassed for you. Your constant begging is so pathetic and humiliating for everyone involved. You serve NO purpose. You are too pathetic to even be an object lesson
August 24th, 2009 at 5:26 pmIf we get health care…..and when it runs out of money I will wright a letter of recommendation for debbi to be the head “plug puller” for all the sick people not worth Obamacare. With all the hate he garners he is just the man for the job.
August 24th, 2009 at 5:37 pmThe situation in Afghanistan/Pakistan/Iraq/India/Iraq/Turkey is an extremely complicated one.
India and Pakistan are extreme enemies because of the Kashmir issue.
Pakistan is a refuge for Al Qaeda and Taliban fighting in Afghanistan.
Al Qaeda and the Taliban would like nothing more then to take over the Pakistani nuclear arsenal which places the government of Pakistan under threat. This obliges that government to accept support and arms from the United States and in kind obliges the US to act in self defense.
The Pakistani people hate the US because of the Kashmir situation and US support of India. This forces the government of Pakistan to conceal military aid from the US.
Iran and Al Qaeda are at odds because of differences between Persian and Arabic peoples.
Iran’s Shiite population is fearful of a new Sunni resurgence in Iraq.
Iraq’s Sunni population is fearful of continued Shiite control of Iraq.
Then you bring up the Kurds who want an autonomous region in Iraq which brings Turkey into the fray.
The whole situation is a powder keg with no common link. Clip one fuse and six others will still be burning down.
These is only a fraction of what is going on in the region. It took Europe only seven centuries to reach a resolve for the common good. These people have been at it for more then 4 thousand years and have changed the rules along the way.
August 24th, 2009 at 5:39 pmSlappyMoron still thinks he is clever while everyone else recognizes he is just stupid and pathetic begging us to pity him once AGAIN. No self respect, no dignity. All begging all the times. THIS time with a couple of lies to spice up his usual megadose of stupid. It is a waste of electrons SlappyMORON. No more pity for you. Your posts are destined for the sewer where they belong
August 24th, 2009 at 5:40 pmWaltTheMan says:
In a nutshell. India and Pakistan is really the Hindu/ Islam thing and THAT dates ONLY back to the British occupation. They had few problems in India before the British began fomenting the religious prejudices to use the old divide to rule strategem. Sure the Taliban would LOVE to get the nuclear arsenal but the Pakistani army is 700,000 strong and the Taliban cant seriously threaten it. The underlying problem is the sinister Pakistani intellgence branch which USES the Taliban and tries to keep their government from causing too much trouble with them. No doubt the Kashmir problem is at the root of the conflict. That is a tough problem and I dont see a solution to it on the horizon
August 24th, 2009 at 5:48 pmLBJ had Vietnam, escalating a war that couldn’t be won.
Obama has Afghanistan escalating a war that can’t be won.
The USA doesn’t have the patience or mindset to win a guerrilla war. We are not nasty and mean enough to do what it takes. No front lines. Unseen battlefields. Hit and run. The media would kill the military with negative reporting if we did what is necessary to have any hope of victory.
History says Afghanistan and Vietnam fighters have the patience to fight forever. The USA doesn’t have that patience.
Time table? A few thousand more body bags need to be sent home before Obama starts thinking seriously about a time table.
In less than 40 years, our great government forgot the lessons of Vietnam. Those that don’t learn from history are doomed to replay it.
August 24th, 2009 at 6:13 pmWhen President Obama took over as Commander in Chief, he asked the Pentagon brass what was the end game for Afghanistan. The answer: “We don’t have one.”
Senator Feingold is asking the same question in public, this time directed at the Obama administration. Open-ended commitments of military force without a clear strategic objective are stupid, and people get killed for no reason.
August 24th, 2009 at 6:15 pmED,
August 24th, 2009 at 6:21 pmI only wanted to expose the current situation. If I wanted to take India back to Alexander’s invasion into that region and settlements in the fertile triangle and around the Black and Aral Seas, I could have spelled out the history of Eurasia into the 4th millennium BC.
And that’s 6000 years!
August 24th, 2009 at 6:24 pmHow do we fight in Afghanistan? Well, we probably can’t win. But the enemy can’t win either. But we can be a major pain in the butt forever by using are newest and greatest weapon. The weapon is so fantastic that we can fight from a command post at an Air Force base in Nevada. We don’t need many troops on the ground. It is the ultimate guerrilla fighter. What is it? See below.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125107420171052683.html
August 24th, 2009 at 6:33 pmWe don’t need a war: just kill bin Laden.
August 24th, 2009 at 6:57 pmWe don’t need a “victory” in Afghanistan — as in Iraq, what would that mean?
Regarding 9/11/01, the attackers were primarily from Saudi Arabia – granted, many were trained in Afghanistan under the Taliban – but did the government of the country of Afghanistan declare war on the USA?
If the USA is found to have international terrorists training on our soil, is our entire nation to be held responsible?
I suppose the rationale is that in order to retaliate (seek justice) for the 9/11 attack, but following that thought, shouldn’t that also include Saudi Arabia? Have we had significant help from the Saudis?
Personally, I’d like to see a kind of saving-face retreat and leave Afghanistan to their own destiny. Those who would like to destroy us won’t disappear even if we “win” in Afghanistan – so let’s start the process to withdraw, keeping as much self-respect as possible, and come home.
August 24th, 2009 at 6:59 pmIn 1947, Bendix Radio won the contract for developing a carrier approach radar system for the Navy. A Bendix team of engineers was sent to observe carrier landings off of Hawaii (The carrier was the USS Hornet – second edition).
August 24th, 2009 at 7:05 pmAfter about three days, they hobbled together a ten tube add-on that was centered on the carrier’s radar system and the sea to air radios. The system relied on inputs from the radar which were transmitted to the pilot radio on the plane. The squeals varied in frequency according to the diversion from an ideal flight path on landing. They went through about 300 landings before a pilot agreed to land blind-folded. He made it.
After that there were about 40 successive successful blind landings using the system.
The point is – you can not change people to trust technology until someone dares to risk it.
I tell ya, sometimes I just want to kiss Feingold on the mouth.
August 24th, 2009 at 7:26 pmWhen do you deploy?
August 24th, 2009 at 7:27 pmThe whole thing comes down to this. The Us has no business telling any other country on the planet how to run their country. No more than the USSR did, Imperial Britain, China Rome or the Mongols or any other country. We can’t even follow our own Constitution.
If the US stands as a nation that upholds its laws and supports its people, every other nation on the planet has the same right. We don’t want Muslim extremists terrorizing our country? We best quit terrorizing theirs.
August 24th, 2009 at 7:36 pmObama’s statements on Afghanistan have already said that this is not a place where we can have an outright win. He said that we need to use “other means” including diplomacy and co-opting Al Queda in the region. The Taliban and Al Queda are two distinct groups. It will be easier for Afghanistan and Pakistan to come to agreements with the more moderate Taliban. That is what Obama is pressing Afghanistan and Pakistan to do. He does not want an open ended commitment to stay there because he knows it is unwinnable.
August 24th, 2009 at 7:37 pmThe only reason for US troops to be in a foreign country is world war. Anything else is imperialism.
August 24th, 2009 at 7:39 pmWaltTheMan says:
Yeah. So could I. Ancient history is one of my passions. I understand you were being succinct which is why I said I agree in a nutshell except the India Pakistan conflict itself is NOT an ancient one it goes really only back to the British occupation. It isnt racial it is religious and those two religions THERE had no realy problems with each other before the British. It does bring up a good point that Iran, being settled by those ancient Aryans are NOT part of this dynamic and have always felt surrounded by enemies since racial politics is so huge in the middle east. As for the rest of your post I completely agree.
One of the great questions about this time for me is. The Harrapa civilization. As ancient as or nearly so as the Sumerians. Was it Aryan or Dravidian and destroyed by an early Aryan invasion. If it were the latter then it, interestingly takes the whole racial warfare thing right back to the beggining of our current civilization
August 24th, 2009 at 7:42 pmLet’s try an experiment! If we bring home all of the troops from Afghanistan and Iraq, lets see if those countries just collapse.
Just like they told us that if the US withdrew from Vietnam the world would end.
August 24th, 2009 at 7:47 pmThe world didn’t end when the USA left Southeast Asia. They were a non-contagious enemy that would not invade and harm U.S. soil. What did happen was Cambodia fell apart when the Pol Pot madness started the “killing fields”. Millions of humans were exterminated.
August 24th, 2009 at 7:54 pmMillions of humans were exterminated.
And this makes the thousands of Iraqis who have died feel better how? Tell me, kws, does death feel better when it comes from the US action?
August 24th, 2009 at 7:59 pmAnd, the US was fighting to preserve South Vietnam’s democracy. Is that how you spell Cambodia?
August 24th, 2009 at 8:01 pmThe thing is every country has to follow its own path. If it is brutal and ugly, it is still their path. The US should be a beacon, not a hammer.
August 24th, 2009 at 8:03 pmHoodathunk says:
And, the US was fighting to preserve South Vietnam’s democracy. Is that how you spell Cambodia?
I suggest you read the history of the Vietnam War and the results for Southeast Asia. You need to be educated, badly.
August 24th, 2009 at 8:16 pmGood luck and good night. Jeez.
kwsventures says:
Yeah and how much help did the Kmer Rouge have in taking power by the US bombing Cambodia into a moonscape and killing upwards of half a million Cambodians?
http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/stories/cambodia/tl02.html
On March 18, 1969, American B-52s began carpet-bombing eastern Cambodia. “Operation Breakfast” was the first course in a four-year bombing campaign that drew Cambodia headlong into the Vietnam War. The Nixon Administration kept the bombings secret from Congress for several months, insisting they were directed against legitimate Vietnamese and Khmer Rouge targets. However, the raids exacted an enormous cost from the Cambodian people: the US dropped 540,000 tons of bombs , killing anywhere from 150,000 to 500,000 civilians.
Sihanouk’s support boosted the Khmer Rouge’s popularity among rural Cambodians. But some observers have argued that the devastating American bombing also helped fuel the Khmer Rouge’s growth. Former New York Times correspondent Sydney Schanberg said the Khmer Rouge “… would point… at the bombs falling from B-52s as something they had to oppose if they were going to have freedom. And it became a recruiting tool until they grew to a fierce, indefatigable guerrilla army.”
And what ended the genocidal Kmer riegn? Thats right it was an INVASION BY VIETNAM.
http://www.genocidewatch.org/cambodiaproject.html
Voice of Justice: 30 Years of Impunity Has to Stop Now with Greater Accountability at the KRT
By Theary C. SENG
Phnom Penh
7 January 2009
Thirty years ago today, Vietnam?s invasion of Cambodia liberated us from the bloody rule of the Khmer Rouge which took the lives of 2 million Cambodians, including those of my parents and other relatives.
So if you had a point. I certainly dont know what it was. If you were trying to say us LEAVING Vietnam was the reason for the Kmer Rouge taking Cambodia and comitting genocide that would be patently ridiculous
August 24th, 2009 at 8:16 pmWe had ZERO interest in S Vietnamese democracy. We disallowed the mass based parties in Vietnam for our sham elections. We deposed and had killed Diem. We STOPPED the reunification elections called for by the 54 Geneva accord because according to Eisenhower. Ho Chi Minh would have won by 80% of the vote. Any talk about the US protecting Vietnamese democracy is laughable.
August 24th, 2009 at 8:20 pmkwsventures .
Who do you think actually went into Cambodia, and put an END to the Murderous Reign of Pol Pot and the Khmer Rouge???
The North Viet Namese Army…that’s who. And after we left, they started military skirmishes with Chinese troops.
Dominoes fighting with Dominoes???
The US Blew it when it sided with the Colonial France, against the Nationalistic Ho Chi Minh…who was quoting Thomas Jefferson in his Futile Effort to Get America to Support him…and not the French.
I recommend you read the “March of Folly” by Barbara Tuchman.
August 24th, 2009 at 8:20 pmBadger says:
I suggest Political Economy of Human Rights by Chomsky
August 24th, 2009 at 8:23 pmThanks for the tip, Eugene. I like Chomsky, but haven’t read that one.
Sorry …I made the same point you did…but it drives me crazy when Rightwingers offer Cambodia as an example of how we should blindly stay stuck in a Quagmire.
The genocide in Cambodia was, IMHO, the result of Kissinger and Carpet Bombing…not our leaving Viet Nam.
August 24th, 2009 at 8:30 pmNo problem. Cant be made too often. Repitition is the native language of those who reside on Planet Wingnut anyway. It is two volumes before the before and after the end of the war and it covers ALL of South east Asia. Laos, Cambodia, AND Vietnam
August 24th, 2009 at 8:32 pmI guess Russ wants to be known for something other than how to finance election campaigns. I thought Russ was waterskiing with the Tommy Bartlett show. Seriously,we are borrowing for War II,fighting in the same country that broke the Soviet Union. Wall Street can’t sell derivatives in Kabul. We already owe the Red Chinese trillions and the traders that are the only people making money are going to have to account for their upside down accounts soon. Where is the money going to come from for health care reform. Russ is on the ball after all.
August 24th, 2009 at 9:12 pmRuss is a true liberal, cut and run.
August 24th, 2009 at 11:40 pmHi conservative guy
August 25th, 2009 at 12:01 amAren’tyou the king of dump and run? Pussies bum me out…
Conservative guy is a true as$hole troll, poops and runs.
August 25th, 2009 at 12:01 am.
That time table is six years too late!
.
August 25th, 2009 at 12:54 amJane,
August 25th, 2009 at 12:55 amHe’s a turd blossom.
It turds…
… It’s got the runs.
conservaTROLL
You are a typical cowardly conservative. Selfish and ignorant. Why havent you killed yourself yet. You are so stupid you can never be anything but a burden to decent people so do the right thing and go suck on a tailpipe
August 25th, 2009 at 1:16 amdebbi……you are quite the key board jockey.
“Why haven’t you killed yourself yet.”
“You are so stupid you can never be anything but a burden to decent people so do the right thing and go suck on a tailpipe.”
I do not know where you hide during the day but in the real world around normal people you would have passed long ago. In the real world of the elite ruling class among commies and Marxists around the world and empires long past where you wish you were and think you deserve to be because of you superior intellect you would have vanished years ago. I know, I know….this is like your video games….you kill all the bad guys and end up the hero and when its all over you yell and you mother gets you an ice cream for being such a good boy.
August 25th, 2009 at 2:08 amSlappyMORON
I dont do video games always found them boring. You dont KNOW anything except that you CRAVE our pity. That is why you beg us for it every day. You come prancing in here singing the same tune. You croon at us that we should look at how stupid and pathetic you are. Please you beg us to give you some more pity. I would have been ok during most time periods just like, and for the same reason I do very well right now and you would have been the village idiot/begger, just like you are now. The thing is the board is different all your posts go directly to the sewer. You KNOW why. Everyone is tired of you begging all the time your lack of dignity is embarassing. Since are too pathetic to be embarassed for yourself since self respect is a foriegn concept to you WE are embarassed for you. It is uncomfortable like seeing that old guy talking to himself and pushing his dirty cup at you a few times too often. You are so pitiful. How do you stand yourself?
August 25th, 2009 at 3:25 amoh my god, I agree with Elbruce 100%.
August 25th, 2009 at 8:27 amA real progressive – not a fake one like the wiretapping war-mongering Republican in disguise -Obama.
Let us take Obama’s advice and look forward and not back. Fiengold for our next President.
August 25th, 2009 at 10:07 amRuss Feingold , one of 2 senators rumored to have even read the Patriot act and the only one to have lived to tell about it .
August 25th, 2009 at 12:10 pmRuss is a bright spot in an other wise dark landscape .Thank you Russ Feingold !
It’s all over…………..
http://www.lakelandtimes.com/print.asp?SectionID=9&SubSectionID=9&ArticleID=10027
August 25th, 2009 at 2:10 pmmsims2 says:
oh my god, I agree with Elbruce 100%.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Hey it had to happen eventually. Dont despair. We will be at each others throats again soon enough
August 25th, 2009 at 6:00 pmSlappyBastinado says:
No its not buy you are stupid
August 25th, 2009 at 6:01 pmvery thanks for article!
August 30th, 2009 at 9:16 am