Pennsylvania state lawmaker: Veterans who support climate change legislation are ‘traitors.’
Pennsylvania state lawmaker: Veterans who support climate change legislation are ‘traitors.’
A coalition of Iraq and Afghanistan veterans, under the name Operation Free, is on a 21-state bus tour to alert the public about the dangers of global warming and its threat to national security. Upon hearing about the group’s visit to Pennsylvania, State Rep. Daryl Metcalfe (R) blasted the veterans as “traitors” and compared them to Benedict Arnold:
“As a veteran, I believe that any veteran lending their name, to promote the leftist propaganda of global warming and climate change, in an effort to control more of the wealth created in our economy, through cap and tax type policies, all in the name of national security, is a traitor to the oath he or she took to defend the Constitution of our great nation!” Mr. Metcalfe’s email reads. “Remember Benedict Arnold before giving credibility to a veteran who uses their service as a means to promote a leftist agenda. Drill Baby Drill!!!”
Rep. Metcalfe, who served in the U.S. Army from 1980-84, today defended the remarks, saying that “if the type of policies that an individual promotes undermines the Constitution and the law of the land in our country, then they are not patriots.”
Global warming is inextricably linked to national security, with the potential to “aggravate existing problems such as poverty, social tensions, environmental degradation, ineffectual leadership and weak political institutions” around the world, which “could increase the pool of potential recruits into terrorist activity.” In the past, Metcalfe has refused to support Domestic Violence Awareness month in Pennsylvania because the resolution referenced domestic abuse suffered by men, which Metcalfe interpreted as part of a “homosexual agenda.” He also opposed a vote to “honor the 60th anniversary of a Muslim group in the state, because ‘Muslims don’t recognize Jesus Christ as God.’”
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Jon Powers wrote an excellent article on this here.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:16 pmGod damn. Can’t the Repugs find anyone who is a sensible Human Being? Everywhere we look, these extremists are defining the Repug Party. The Repug Party is becoming the Party of the un-hinged.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:16 pmWhat a horror!
CONTACT him here and tell him he is a disgrace to America.
http://repmetcalfe.com/?sectionid=75§iontree=75
or
E-mail: dmetcalf@pahousegop.com
District Offices
Cranberry Township Municipal Building
2525 Rochester Road
Suite 201
Cranberry Township, PA, 16066
Phone: (724) 772-3110
Fax: (724) 772-2922
Hours: Monday – Friday 9am – 4:30pm
Middlesex Township
1165 Pittsburgh Road
Route 8
Valencia, PA 16059
Phone: 724-898-1500
Fax: 724-898-1606
Hours: Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday & Friday 9am to 4:30pm
Thursday 10am to 4:30pm
Capitol Office
October 20th, 2009 at 5:18 pm47 East Wing
PO Box 202012
Harrisburg, PA 17120-2012
Telephone: (717) 783-1707
Fax: (717) 787-4771
How is it possible that this guy has a job anywhere?
October 20th, 2009 at 5:18 pmAh yes, anyone who uses “Free”, “Freedom” or “Patriot(s)” in their coalition name is super-ultra-credible.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:19 pmWhy is it so hard to run against this kind of Republican? Anyone should be able to beat him without saying a word about what they support, but just list all the crap he says and no patriotic American would vote for him.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:20 pmIt would be interesting to find out exactly what Daryl(!) Metcalf actually did in the Army in 1980 – 1984….
There is this:
October 20th, 2009 at 5:21 pmShaking Hands with Saddam Hussein: The U.S. Tilts toward Iraq, 1980-1984 …
I’m, sadly, relieved that someone can sound more shrill than Crazy Shelly(InsaneR-Mn.). But please, Pennsylvania, keep this treasure to yourself instead of unleashing another Bachmann on the House as my beloved Minnesota did.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:22 pmApparently Daryl Metcalfe has been already a victim of climate change.. he must have spent a long time under the hole in the ozone, it broiled his nuerons, what a complete moron.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:22 pm“Rep. Metcalfe, who served in the U.S. Army from 1980-84, today defended the remarks, saying that “if the type of policies that an individual promotes undermines the Constitution and the law of the land in our country, then they are not patriots.”
I would like to ask Rep. Metcalfe if he thinks Vice Admiral Dennis McGinn or Republican Senator John Warner are not patriots. They testified to the US Senate Committee on Environment and Public Works about the threat that climate change poses to our national security.
The Pentagon will include a climate section in the Quadrennial Defense Review due in February and the State Department will include climate change in its new Quadrennial Diplomacy and Development Review.
• In 2008, a National Intelligence Assessment from the National Intelligence Council said “global climate change will have wide-ranging implications for US national security interests over the next 20 years.” Senate Testimony of Dr. Thomas Fingar, June 28, 2008
• In fall 2009, the CIA announced plans to launch a center on climate change to examine the security risks of environmental issues.
• In 2007, 11 retired flag officers released a report that argued that “Projected climate change poses a serious threat to America’s national security” and “climate change acts as a threat multiplier for instability in some of the most volatile regions of the world.” CNA, National Security and the Threat of Climate Change, 2007
• According to former Senator John Warner (R-VA), a veteran and former Secretary of the Navy, “Leading military, intelligence, and security experts have publicly spoken out that if left unchecked, global warming could increase instability and lead to conflict in already fragile regions of the world. If we ignore these facts, we do so at the peril of our national security and increase the risk to those in uniform who serve our nation.”
October 20th, 2009 at 5:22 pm“The fact that a person acted pursuant to order of his Government or of a superior does not relieve him from responsibility under international law, provided a moral choice was in fact possible to him.”
-Nuremberg Principle IV -
Sounds like these proud veterans are fulfilling their responsibility to make a moral choice and speaking their mind.
It appears Rep. Metcalfe has no moral compass with which to guide him….
October 20th, 2009 at 5:22 pmand to think this wanker served before the Army lowered its standards……
wow.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:23 pmNow the Pentagon tells Bush: climate change will destroy us· Secret report warns of rioting and nuclear war
· Britain will be ‘Siberian’ in less than 20 years
· Threat to the world is greater than terrorism
by Mark Townsend and Paul Harris in New York
The Observer, Sunday 22 February 2004
A secret report, suppressed by US defence chiefs and obtained by The Observer, warns that major European cities will be sunk beneath rising seas as Britain is plunged into a ‘Siberian’ climate by 2020. Nuclear conflict, mega-droughts, famine and widespread rioting will erupt across the world.
The document predicts that abrupt climate change could bring the planet to the edge of anarchy as countries develop a nuclear threat to defend and secure dwindling food, water and energy supplies. The threat to global stability vastly eclipses that of terrorism, say the few experts privy to its contents.
‘Disruption and conflict will be endemic features of life,’ concludes the Pentagon analysis. ‘Once again, warfare would define human life.’
The findings will prove humiliating to the Bush administration, which has repeatedly denied that climate change even exists. Experts said that they will also make unsettling reading for a President who has insisted national defence is a priority.
The report was commissioned by influential Pentagon defence adviser Andrew Marshall, who has held considerable sway on US military thinking over the past three decades. He was the man behind a sweeping recent review aimed at transforming the American military under Defence Secretary Donald Rumsfeld.
Climate change ’should be elevated beyond a scientific debate to a US national security concern’, say the authors, Peter Schwartz, CIA consultant and former head of planning at Royal Dutch/Shell Group, and Doug Randall of the California-based Global Business Network.
An imminent scenario of catastrophic climate change is ‘plausible and would challenge United States national security in ways that should be considered immediately’, they conclude.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:23 pmiRi says:
re:“A coalition of Iraq and Afghanistan veterans, under the name Operation Free.”
I’ll take your bet, cowpie. I’ve been on their bus. I gave them gas money. They are true patriots of this nation.
Rep. Metcalf has no idea what he’s blowing out his azz.
Neither do you.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:25 pmDefending the Constitution includes a tolerance for ideas that you disagree with. If that isn’t one of the primary lessons to take away from the First Amendment, I don’t know what is.
Lately, the people who scream the most about “the Constitution” seem to be those who are the most ignorant about it — and have undoubtedly never read it.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:26 pmThis comment has been voted down. Click to read.
Traitoritis. n. (Or treasonosis.) Disorder afflicting right-wingers, wherein they just start calling everybody and his brother a traitor. More at nazitis.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:27 pmOh good, you are back iRi, you have some unfinished business.
iRi, you claimed here that maddow defends the indefensible. You further claimed here that global warming and socialized medicine are indefensible.
iRi, please explain why global warming and socialized medicine are indefensible.
To me, indefensible means things that cannot be defended like the torture of American prisoners, or genocide. I personally don’t equate a global warming hoax, assuming it is a hoax, with torture and genocide. I also don’t equate socialized medicine, which includes programs like Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid, with things like torture and genocide.
Why is your definition of what behavior cannot be defended so different from mine? Oh, wait, I know the answer to that one.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:29 pmRecently, Marine Corps Commandant Gen. James T. Conway commissioned an energy audit in Afghanistan in an effort to determine how US Marines could be more energy efficient. DARPA, the US defense research agency, has been developing solar powered systems for the military, to reduce the need for a constant supply line of fuel and batteries. The Center for a New American Security (CNAS) also runs a Natural Security blog.
So, according to Rep. Metcalf, the Pentagon, CNAS, and the Commandant of the Marine Corps are not patriots.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:29 pmYou’re on with that bet, iRi. And I dare you to tell that to their faces.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:29 pmiri,
October 20th, 2009 at 5:30 pmWere the makers of the study I mentioned above homosexual? If you are concerned with disasters like hurricanes, flooding, forest fires, famines—then you must be homosexual??? What kind of nonsense reasoning is that?
Metcalf was in the Army for 4 years. He has a lot of chutzpah calling other veterans traitors, some of which have served a lot longer than Metcalf. This sort of tactic is McCarthyism. It is disgusting to think that Metcalf considers a political disagreement the equivalent of being a traitor. I hope the people in Pennsylvania have enough sense to toss this joker.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:31 pmiRi
you really don’t deserve your American citizenship.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:31 pmMetcalfe has betrayed the Constitution and the loyal veterans who served their country–he should be ridden out of town on a rail after tarring and feathering.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:31 pmDo I understand this Repub dolt correctly? According to him, if you want to save the world, you are a “traitor”. Is he (Metcalf- (R)) mentally ill, incompetent, or just plain stupid? Are all Repubs mentally ill, incompetent, or just plain stupid? Can they prove otherwise? We’re waiting for proof that Repubs care, understand, are not stupid. Um….we’re still waiting. ….. still waiting…….. uh, yes, still waiting— any intelligent Repubs out there?? — um…. still waiting….
October 20th, 2009 at 5:32 pmWhat a bunch of suckers.
Remember this whackadoo? He was Bush’s biggest online sucker. Where’s Osama, by the way? I thought you guys were going to smoke him out dead or alive.
Snerk!
October 20th, 2009 at 5:32 pmiRighti,
So, you disagree with DOD, the CIA, NSA, and the Pentagon? You don’t think climate change is a threat to national security? I was at the Operation Free event in DC. We had former Admirals, Generals, and Senator John Warner speak. They all disagreed with you.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:32 pmHas he been dipping into the Agent Orange?
October 20th, 2009 at 5:32 pmto protect us against disasters is treasonous and you want us hanged?? Just how insane are you??
October 20th, 2009 at 5:32 pm29 – yes, yes, yes,yes, no, and no.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:33 pmiRi says:
I ain’t ascared of a bunch of pansies.
But muslims scare him senseless.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:33 pmSince when is it “unpatriotic” to want to do something to either stop or fix the damage we have done to our Earth by dumping tons of pollutants into our air daily. Do they really think that we can pollute our air the way we do and it will have NO affect on the earth and it’s climate. If they do think that, I propose we start pumping those pollutants into their houses.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:33 pmYou forgot every scientific body of national or international standing in your enemies list, stupid troll. Of course, only 6% of scientists now call themselves Republicans. I guess that smart people have fled the sinking ship that was the GOP. There ain’t no future in it.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:33 pmTune in later when iRi goes after Isaac Newton for defending the indefensible when he talks about gravity.
According to iRi, the apple that fell on Sir Isaac’s head was nothing but a left wing plant
October 20th, 2009 at 5:34 pmactually, the military is socialism and their medical care is socialism
October 20th, 2009 at 5:35 pmWhile I support the Congressman’s first amendment right of free speech, I completely disagree with his position. I think it would be in his best interest to review what really constitutes a “traitor” and a veteran believing in “global warming” or “climate change” does not come close to that mark.
Hopefully, the people in his district review these types of remarks when they visit the polls in 2010.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:36 pmR is for RACIST
You ignorant, RACIST, moronic pile of dogshit. Just go kill yourself. The world will stink just that much more becaue of your presence in it. Go. Do the right thing.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:36 pmiRi@23 flagged for a death threat
October 20th, 2009 at 5:36 pmState Rep. Daryl Metcalfe (R) is dumber than an overflowing septic tank.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:36 pmI sometimes wonder if trolls like iRi are planted here by Thinkprogress. Republicans can’t really be that stupid.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:37 pmiri, was reported for a threat.(23)
October 20th, 2009 at 5:38 pmYou, buddy, are a loser.
tony and lido
iRi says:
You’re on with that bet, iRi. And I dare you to tell that to their faces.
I ain’t ascared of a bunch of pansies.
You know, it’s so easy to say that sort of crock on line. My guess is that you’d be shopping for new underwear after these “pansies” put you through the wringer they would have to go through in the army.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:38 pmWhy does Rep. Metcalf hate our soldiers?
October 20th, 2009 at 5:39 pmMuslims don’t recognize Jesus as God?
Neither do Christians, by tradition.
Metcalfe’s God is GI Joe tree-hating Jeezus?
October 20th, 2009 at 5:39 pmWho was his Sunday school teacher, Jim Inhofe?
iRi says:
I ain’t ascared of a bunch of pansies.
I got here a bit late. This guy’s a parody, right?
October 20th, 2009 at 5:40 pmiRi says:
There’s a big difference between an energy audit and stealing my money in some BS cap and trade of carbon credit scam.
You would rather die grasping your dollars than have a safe world for your descendants. You’re either very very selfish, very stupid, or you will never have kids of your own so you don’t give a 5hit about the future of the world.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:40 pmiRi says:
Defending the Constitution includes a tolerance for ideas that you disagree with. If that isn’t one of the primary lessons to take away from the First Amendment, I don’t know what is.
Have all the treasonous ideas you want but once you start puting them in practice you’re fair game for the rope. Just my opinion of course.
Thanks for proving my point. You clearly have no idea what’s actually in the Constitution.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:41 pmiRi,
Please explain why global warming is indefensible.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:41 pmBut those global worming guys are either lying about their service or homo. No two ways about it.
I’m confused. I think he’s now talking about someone having sex (”worming”), with the entire planet. Or does “global worming” have some other significance? I know it’s not a typo, because he’s done it more than once.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:42 pmPlease explain why global warming is indefensible.
He’s right. Global worming IS indefensible.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:43 pmiRcowpie has a string theory, but he can’t keep it straight, and then gets it all balled up.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:44 pmAh yes — the usual definition of “traitor” by these birdbrains. To them, it means “anybody who doesn’t agree with me.”
Throw it on the pile of other words and phrases so cheapened by the right they have become meaningless: “freedom”, “liberty”, “family values”, “socialism”, “government takeover”, etc.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:45 pmAs a VietNam veteran, let me say to this chairborn ranger.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:45 pmUP YOURS!
His MOS was probably a 71G20, awards and decorations clerk.
Did you know that there was no continental worming here in North America until the Europeans brought them over?
October 20th, 2009 at 5:46 pmBut this in no way detracts from how incredibly stupid those men are.
So, no butt sex for anyone? What will I tell my girlfriend? She seems to enjoy it.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:46 pmiRi,
You equated global warming to torture and genocide, crimes that are, in your words, “indefensible”.
Please explain how the alleged global warming hoax is as indefensible as torture and genocide.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:47 pmIf the ice is getting thicker and the weather is getting colder when they all said the opposite would happen what makes you think I need to explain to you why global worming is indefensible?
Here’s a clue: it’s spelled WARMING, you poor sod.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:48 pmThis comment has been voted down. Click to read.
Hi iRi:
October 20th, 2009 at 5:50 pmYou are a fake and I despise fakes. If you want attention I am happy to provide you lame ass. Come on pretender let’s talk.
Keith says:
(iRi says:)
“I got here a bit late. This guy’s a parody, right?”
iRi, aka IRightI, is a blast from the past. It has not been around TP for I’m guessing almost 2 years…
That’s about the average sentence in Texas for the 3rd or 4th DWI.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:50 pmIf the ice is getting thicker and the weather is getting colder when they all said the opposite would happen what makes you think I need to explain to you why global worming is indefensible?
Hint number 2: there is methane frozen withing the ice. Ice melts, methane enters atmosphere, trapping even more heat. Ice may refreeze, but heat trapping methane is already in atmosphere, making the problem worse.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:52 pmPA State Rep Metcalfe is from the “cling to their guns and jesus” part of Pennsylvania not too far from the Ohio border. Republicans will always win this district because the voters from this district are under-educated. The PA State Legislators should censor Metcalfe or at least ask for a public apology.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:52 pmFrom Wikpedia: “…and he attended Kansas State University while serving in the United States Army at Fort Riley in Kansas. He later was stationed in Germany. His experience in the Army included duty as an air defense radar and I.F.F. (identification friend or foe) systems repair specialist…”
And he has credibility on military stuff and climate change, how?
October 20th, 2009 at 5:52 pmf yourself iRi
you move along.
people who continually hang around where they’re not wanted have a deep and serious form of social retardation, and should be seeking help – not making their bad problem even worse.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:53 pm“In a report, they say global warming poses a serious threat to national security, as the US could be drawn into wars over water and other conflicts.
They appear to criticise President George W Bush’s refusal to join an international treaty to cut emissions.
Among the 11 authors are ex-Army chief of staff Gordon Sullivan and Mr Bush’s ex-Mid-East peace envoy Anthony Zinni.”
October 20th, 2009 at 5:53 pmIs man making the Earth warmer with CO2 emissions and if so, how much?
Strawman argument. See my last post.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:54 pmWow.
How do these idiots keep getting people to vote for them?
October 20th, 2009 at 5:54 pmIs the sun in meathead’s eyes or is that something genetic?
October 20th, 2009 at 5:55 pmHe also opposed a vote to “honor the 60th anniversary of a Muslim group in the state, because ‘Muslims don’t recognize Jesus Christ as God.’”
_____________________________________________________________
Well, guess what, Metcalfe? Jews don’t either. Neither do Hindus. Or just about any other religion of the world except for Christianity.
If you had opposed a vote to honor a religious group for any reason because you wanted to keep church and state separate, that would be one thing. But your indication that you would honor a Christian group but not a Muslim group because of your own personal beliefs just paints you as a bigoted assh*le.
You might want to know that Muslims treat Jesus with far more reverence than any other non-Christian religion. Jesus is regarded as one of the greatest prophets, and Muslims always say “peace be upon him” when they speak his name. The Virgin Mary is mentioned more times in the Qu’ran than she is in the Bible. In fact, Jesus and Mary get their own surah in the Qu’ran (similar to a book of the Bible). And Muslims believe that Jesus will return again at the end times.
But learning a little bit about Islam would disturb your hateful viewpoint, wouldn’t it?
October 20th, 2009 at 5:55 pmIt would seem treasonous in the eyes of any god
October 20th, 2009 at 5:55 pmto deliberately destroy one of the earth’s ecosystems for profit.
iRi says:
There is no global warming Levi. The “torture” didn’t kill or maim anyone Levi, and in my book if you’re not killing and maiming you are simply not torturing.
Torture killed someone. There. Unless you can bring Manadel al-Jamadi back to life, torture HAS killed someone.
We’ll gladly accept your apologies for being mistaken.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:56 pm“Veterans who support climate change legislation are ‘traitors.’”?
This guy is insane does he include include Bush Sr. in his hate?
If he thinks that about veterans what does he think about not Veteran supporters of climate change legislation?
For me this is the first time I’ve heard anyone refer to veterans as traitors for taking a stance on a non military issue is this not the case for anyone else?
October 20th, 2009 at 5:56 pmAww. iRi got kicked out. One less troll. Bye bye iRi!
October 20th, 2009 at 5:57 pmnoseeum,
October 20th, 2009 at 5:58 pmTexas has laws against drinking and driving?? Thought they were opposed to government regulation!
jagman, please visit this site
http://www.realclimate.org/
then come back and refute just one of their statements with facts.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:59 pmShit and just when I was looking forward to pummelling that lame ass.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:59 pmdbadass says:
“Is the sun in meathead’s eyes or is that something genetic?”
You may refer to Cat’srFlyfishin’s post #62 which is absolutely correct.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:01 pmDon’t leave the Interstate when driving through this neighborhood.
Just when I think you can’t find a Republican more bizzare than the last one you prove me wrong once again. This kook, however, will be hard to top. He tops it off with this gem.
Christians don’t recognize Jesus Christ as God either. Wait, maybe there is some fringe sect that believes this but it is news to real Christians.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:01 pm
The report issued by the UN in 2007 (I think that was the year) is flawed in many ways and the science is “shaky”, at best.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:01 pm— perhaps it would be helpful to your case to identify these many ways in which it is flawed and just what is “shaky” at best. I would suggest that a little bit about your training in the sciences might help as well.
Thanks
This comment has been voted down. Click to read.
Luis Chapulin M says:
Aww. iRi got kicked out. One less troll. Bye bye iRi!
If so it was because he was flagged for blatant racism and homophobia.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:04 pmall I posed was a question –
October 20th, 2009 at 6:04 pm—
No you announced that international research was flawed and “shaky” which is clearly more than just posing a questions…
noseeum says: Don’t leave the Interstate when driving through this neighborhood.
Like in the “Wrong Turn” movies?
October 20th, 2009 at 6:05 pmThis is my e-mail to this “man”:
It is thoroughly disgusting that you label veterans who disagree with you about climate change as “unpatriotic” and “traitors”. These veterans have fought for the right of ALL Americans to voice their opinions, not to tow some line that you expect. Seeking legislation to manage climate change is not against anything in the US Constitution and, therefore, these veterans are not violating their oath to this document. It is apparent, however, that they are working against your personal constitution. Perhaps you should just drink a large dose of that pink liquid medication to take care of your constitution so that you quit dirtying your fellow Americans and veterans.
Gotta go
October 20th, 2009 at 6:05 pm“begging the question” is another rhetorically empty device jagman,
or have you not reached that section in your rhetoric class yet this fall?
this is just “strawman week”, right?
(sheesh – give a guy a hammer and suddenly the whole world’s a nail)
October 20th, 2009 at 6:06 pmKeith says:
October 20th, 2009 at 6:06 pm“Texas has laws against drinking and driving?? Thought they were opposed to government regulation!”
They don’t like rules and regulations, but they do like the law enforcement jobs.
And when Uncle Clayton is the sheriff, and Cousin Betty is the court clerk, it’s hard to get away with too much.
So could Operation Free tell me exactly when soldiers all held the same opinion ? And aren’t they implying, by insisting that anyone who has ever been in the military holds the same opinion, that the military is a form of brainwashing ?
And above all, where do they get off saying that anyone who honorably served the country is a traitor because of their political views !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
October 20th, 2009 at 6:08 pmAs a Veteran I say all Vets that join or are repblicans are traitors………….So there
October 20th, 2009 at 6:13 pmHe as probably REMF
October 20th, 2009 at 6:15 pmNicely put, tom… in addition, the thrust of jagman’s post @16 would seem to concern ad Hominem attacks and not straw men… and yet jagman inserts wiki’s definition of a strawman argument… confusing.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:16 pmdbadass – go here, read this:
http://www.heartland.org/publications/…/PDFs/NIPCC%20Final.pdf
October 20th, 2009 at 6:16 pmMapleStreet says,
I hope you were being sarcastic. If not, re-read the post again and get to us.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:16 pmjagoff1017 says: The “hockey stick” chart was proved to be completely false and the limited number of “peer reviews” for the report does not garner a lot of support.
http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/full/306/5702/1686
Of 928 papers written on climate change, none said it was not man-made:
October 20th, 2009 at 6:17 pm“This analysis shows that scientists publishing in the peer-reviewed literature agree with IPCC, the National Academy of Sciences, and the public statements of their professional societies. Politicians, economists, journalists, and others may have the impression of confusion, disagreement, or discord among climate scientists, but that impression is incorrect.”
jagman1017 says:
You’re link doesn’t work. Try again.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:18 pmMetcalfe and his kind do not believe in anything but the bible. They are nationalists, biblical capitalists, revisionists, dominionists all waiting for the end of the world. The more climate change, war, and destruction the better. It’s all god’s design, and the rest of us deserve what we get. The Congress, Pentagon State Dept. and Justice are loaded with these nuts.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:18 pmThat doesn’t go anywhere. Besides I don’t need to. I am trained in the sciences especially oceanography and I have seen more than enough data to allow me to make an informed decision.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:19 pmThis comment has been voted down. Click to read.
Heartland Institute, jagman?
October 20th, 2009 at 6:19 pm
As a veteran I call any wingnut who claims that only idiots are veterans bullsh*t! Use the GI Bill and get some education, go use the counseling and get over your hate and turn off that propaganda FAUX.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:20 pmblue53 says:
Like a bumper sticker I saw one says:
“Jesus saves. The rest of you take damage.”
October 20th, 2009 at 6:20 pmThis comment has been voted down. Click to read.
500 scientists working for the oil and coal industry? Who funds Heartland?
October 20th, 2009 at 6:22 pmReconsidered by who jagman?
October 20th, 2009 at 6:22 pmOh Shit. That was Heartland crap? Don’t even bother trying to fix the link that shit is so so discredited.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:22 pmI think Heartland was funded at one time by Exxon/Mobile. One of the worst climate denying companies on the planet.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:24 pmdbadass – google this: Climate Change Reconsidered
—jagman
October 20th, 2009 at 6:26 pmLet’s not waste time. It is a big world. I can find all sorts of weird shit if I look. Flat earth, no lunar landing. Aliens probing anuses, it still doesn’t change the reality that the US military, the UN, NASA, numerous congressional committees, the international science community, the insurance industry, indigenous peoples throughout the world, and countless think tanks, and on and on think otherwise. How do you explain this?
You’re concerned about ’special interests’ affecting the global climate change debate but linking to the Heartland Institute, jagman?
Really?
October 20th, 2009 at 6:26 pmjagman,
you’re no more correct now then you were then,
and i don’t expect you to improve.
i have no patience for faux-intellectual fops such as yourself,
and will not hesitate to rip you a new one every time you show up here.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:27 pmIt’s not the first time IRI has been booted off TP. He used to pollute this place with similar crap a few years ago.
Good riddance.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:30 pmMr. Metcalfe is deluded. Global warming is a reality from which there is no escape.
Things may not have changed much in Pennsylvania. There are locations and regions where there may not be much discernable change, but the overall trend is warming, worldwide.
Climate doesn’t distinguish between political parties and economic theories and practices of governance. But our emmissions do have an effect, and most of them serve to increase warming. Without our emmissions burden in the atmosphere would we still see warming? Maybe, maybe not, but that is irrelevant. Our emmissions are the only part of global warming that we have a handle on, the only component in the problem that we can deal with immediately and effectively.
Mr. Metcalfe should STFU and crawl back under his rock. He won’t be any safer there than the rest of us, but at least he won’t be unnecessarily obstructive there. Witless boob. (Apologies to Hooters everywhere. snark)
October 20th, 2009 at 6:31 pmThis comment has been voted down. Click to read.
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Heartland_Institute
Although Heartland calls itself “a genuinely independent source of research and commentary,” its has been a frequent ally of, and funded by, the tobacco industry.
Roy E. Marden, a former member of Heartland’s board of directors, was until May 2003 the manager of industry affairs for the Philip Morris (PM) tobacco company, where his responsibilities included lobbying and “managing company responses to key public policy issues,” which he accomplishes by “directing corporate involvement with industry, business, trade, and public policy organizations and determining philanthropic support thereto.” In a May 1991 document prepared for PM, Marden listed Heartland’s “rapid response network” as a “potential spokesperson” among the “portfolio of organizations” that the company had cultivated to support its interests.[16]
While Heartland once disclosed its major supporters, it now refuses to publicly disclose who its corporate and foundation funders are.
Greenpeace’s ExxonSecrets website lists Heartland as having received $676,500 (unadjusted for inflation) from ExxonMobil between 1998 and 2006
October 20th, 2009 at 6:34 pmhead down to the jr. high, jag,
i’ll bet your william kristol impression would really impress some of the students there.
here you’re just another in a long, long line of fringe ideologues, bent on proving the unprovable to an audience that doesn’t want to see you on the stage.
go find friends – it’s way better than pissing off strangers.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:35 pmYahoo Search
Climate change considered = 94,900,000
Climate change reconsidered = 4,350,000.
Sort of interesting but what does it really mean
Well we could start with Richard Littlemore but I think that was already mentioned and selectively ignored.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:37 pmThis comment has been voted down. Click to read.
Um…Which post Jagman? Besides, That report has been completly discredited. You have as much claim to legitimacy as the Repiggies have to power.
Which isn’t much.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:39 pmHeartland Institute has received $676,500 from ExxonMobil since 1998.
1997
$unknown Mobil Corporation
Source: Heartland material, present at 3/16/97 conference
1998
$30,000 ExxonMobil Corporate Giving
Source: Exxon Education Foundation Dimensions 1998 report
2000
$115,000 ExxonMobil Foundation
Climate Change
Source: ExxonMobil Foundation 2000 IRS 990
2001
$90,000 ExxonMobil Foundation
Source: ExxonMobil 2001 Worldwide Giving Report
2002
$15,000 ExxonMobil Foundation
Source: ExxonMobil 2002 Worldwide Giving Report
2003
$7,500 ExxonMobil Corporate Giving
19th Aniversary Benefit Dinner
Source: ExxonMobil 2003 Worldwide Giving Report
2003
$85,000 ExxonMobil Foundation
General Operating Support
Source: ExxonMobil 2003 Worldwide Giving Report
2004
$10,000 Exxon Corporation
Climate Change Activities
Source: ExxonMobil 2004 Worldwide Giving Report
2004
$15,000 ExxonMobil Foundation
Climate Change Efforts
Source: ExxonMobil 2004 Worldwide Giving Report
2004
$75,000 ExxonMobil Foundation
General Operating Support
Source: ExxonMobil 2004 Worldwide Giving Report
2005
$29,000 ExxonMobil Foundation
Source: ExxonMobil 2005 Worldwide Giving Report
2005
$90,000 ExxonMobil Corporate Giving
Source: ExxonMobil 2005 Worldwide Giving Report
2006
$90,000 ExxonMobil Corporate Giving
General Operating Support
Source: ExxonMobil 2006 Worldwide Giving Report
2006
$10,000 ExxonMobil Corporate Giving
Anniversary benefit dinner
Source: ExxonMobil 2006 Worldwide Giving Report
2006
October 20th, 2009 at 6:40 pm$15,000 ExxonMobil Corporate Giving
general operating support
Source: ExxonMobil 2006 Worldwide Giving Report
jagman1017 says:
Jim Wolf350 – go back and review post #17 – Attacking Exxon/Mobile instead of the report is, again, posing a strawman and attacking it…
Dbadass – discredited by whom?
You could start here.
You should read it all but for the moment just skip down to this:
October 20th, 2009 at 6:42 pm
jagman1017
October 20th, 2009 at 6:43 pm—
Are you a creationist by any chance because they tend to try and use the same approach. Rather than prove their case they send all their energies trying to disprove the other. I notice you have avoided responding to any of the questions posed to you why is that? Why do you believe NASA and the US military disagree with you and Heartland?
jagman1017 says:
Your post concerns ad Hominem attacks, not straw men.
see: Before we get started, let’s make the point that attacking the individual and not his “point” does not a argument make: Let’s review
Yes, let’s: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem
For an example of a ’straw man’ see your post at #58 wherein you argue that since the climate has been warming and cooling for centuries and since we do not know PRECISELY how much man has influenced these trends there is little point in linking man made emissions to climate change… No one disputes that the climate has changed or that we do not know exactly how much we are effecting it… that doesn’t mean there isn’t strong scientific consensus for the position that we ARE effecting it.
See how this works?
October 20th, 2009 at 6:45 pmGreat job getting rid of iRi people. Now the only troll is so stupid he’s referencing Heartland. Pathetic.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:49 pmHey Jag, why don’t you go read your bible and leave the adults alone.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:51 pmYeah, at some point iIrationali was going to blow a fuse. He needs to be careful. Rants like that can draw the attention of the authorities. Which I hope it does in his case.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:52 pmjag – you couldn’t climb inside a squirrel’s head,
so don’t pretend to “go Lecter” on me…
it’ll only drag you down further in everyone else’s eyes.
but thanks for demonstrating why children shouldn’t play with ideology.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:53 pmjagman1017
October 20th, 2009 at 6:55 pmSo what’s the word? Is NASA loaded up with naive rubes? Come on man make your case.
The only way the “hockey stick graph” has been debunked is if one throws out the aberrant high of 1998. And that would make it worse. The simple fact is that, including this summer’s data which is still incomplete, 9 of the hottest years ever recorded have fallen in the last twelve years. So, you see, the hockey stick is still relevant.
One can argue about what could/should be done or what one is willing to invest in green technology but, there is no rational dissent about global warming and man’s role in it.
Think that global warming isn’t happening or is unrelated to human emissions? Provide a single example of a scientific body with national or international standing that stands in dissent of the consensus. One? No?
How about a truly independent researcher with a, peer reviewed, alternate theory? One? One who doesn’t work for the energy industry, an evangelical anti-science blog, the GOP?
I won’t hold my breath waiting for examples.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:57 pmOT
October 20th, 2009 at 7:00 pmHi pete:
I didn’t get anything of interest the other day. Assuming good sea conditions I hope to venture about 30 miles offshore this weekend. I’ll get back to you about the catch and the wildlife.
jagman1017
October 20th, 2009 at 7:03 pmThere is no reason to scamper away. Perhaps you might just acknowledge that you were unaware of Heartlands big oil connections or that you somehow hadn’t considered that NASA employs scientists or that maybe indigenous peoples do have a handle on observable events around them. Well I suppose that NW passage will allow you to buy plastic shit you don’t need at an even cheaper price…
jaggman: “Attacking Exxon/Mobile instead of the report is, again, posing a strawman and attacking it…
Dbadass – discredited by whom?”
I notice you pretended not to see the two posts that give legitimate consensus on the scientific community as opposed to your industry-sponsored “studies” or “reports.” Maybe you’re too young to remember “The Tobacco Institute,” which for years in the 50’s and 60’s published “studies” and “reports” refuting the widely held medical view that tobacco smoking led to lung cancer. These “studies” were published by doctors and scientists. We now know that long after the industry knew full well that cigarettes caused cancer, they were paying these doctors and scientists to publish “studies” questioning that or even refuting it.
October 20th, 2009 at 7:06 pmdbadass: “Well I suppose that NW passage will allow you to buy plastic shit you don’t need at an even cheaper price…”
With things like that happening, you really have to wonder about the motivation or even the sanity of people who are still trying to argue against scientific consensus.
October 20th, 2009 at 7:12 pmNinerFan
October 20th, 2009 at 7:16 pm—
I am still cracking up about the D-bag in front of me at a convenience store a month or so back b itching about gas prices while buying a FIJI water. It was all I could do to hole back the “Hey meathead you are buying water in a petroleum based container that was shipped half way around the planet”. It was almost as amusing as the yokel announcing that the “Noble” peace prize is supposed to be awarded to someone who is “noble” at my corner bar. Yahoos make my life worth living.
NinerFan: I don’t wonder about their sanity any more. No sane person would devote so much time to aggravating others. The sad part is that shame is absent along with sanity so one has to get them banned to shut them up until they trot out the next sock-puppet.
October 20th, 2009 at 7:17 pmNASA is just using a strawman argument.
i’ve got to run down to the pizzeria and pick up a strawman argument,
but I’d better stop and put more strawman argument in my car so i don’t run out on the way home to my strawman argument.
October 20th, 2009 at 7:21 pmHe looks like Glenn Beck’s younger brother.
October 20th, 2009 at 7:54 pmProtecting your country and your planet makes you a traitor?Is it a requirement that you have to be an idiot to be a xtian, or is it just coincidence?
October 20th, 2009 at 7:55 pmMy guess, jwmuiyaai , is that this moron’s ignorance extends to Christianity as well. He may attend a church with a crucifixion scene but he doesn’t seem to have quite grasped the message.
October 20th, 2009 at 8:01 pmLooks like R has been raptured. Good riddence to the ignorant racist piece of garbage
October 20th, 2009 at 8:26 pmJagman as someone else has pointed out you apparantly dont know the difference between ad hominem or litterally at the man or to the man from a strawman. They are not the same thing. It does help if at least sometimes you have some dim idea what you are talking about. Your logical fallacy is trying to show that because something has happened before without being CAUSED by man that means man cannot POSSIBLY cause the same thing now. This is very stupid. It is the equivalent of saying since people die without being murdered it is impossible to murder anyone. You really arent very good at this
October 20th, 2009 at 8:29 pmbecause the resolution referenced domestic abuse suffered by men, which Metcalfe interpreted as part of a “homosexual agenda.”
October 20th, 2009 at 8:31 pm—-
This part sort of amuses me as well.
You gotta love the drill baby drill blast. Last time I checked no more refineries were built but gas prices have certainly come down from their high. How does this dip explain that? Heres a clue congressman, and this will be true even in Pa. speculators drove up the price of oil, NOT supply.
October 20th, 2009 at 8:48 pmI heard earlier where our refineries were running at 80% capacity and demand is down.
October 20th, 2009 at 9:05 pmI want to be quoted on this one: The idiot is a moron and a coward. Say it to my face fatboy! You are a coward and I liar, you low life scum. It’s stupid people like the ones in your district that are trying to destroy the Constitution by elected a dumbasz jerk like you. You have nothing to say, so you attack your opponents by calling them names. I know you are a coward because, no real veteran would ever insult a fellow veteran without cause. I insulted you because you are a dumbasz plain and simple. Remember stupid, you will have to face these very same veteran when you run for reelection. Oh, you’ll win because your voters are stupid too.
October 20th, 2009 at 10:37 pmIt takes all kinds. As a Veteran, I find it disgraceful that a Congressman would call other Veterans traitors. Then again, the (R) after his name explains it all. Forget this lowlife. He will never comprehend how reprehensible his statement is. I have to wonder how the people who voted for him can look at themselves in the mirror.
October 21st, 2009 at 12:30 amjackoff1017 says:
What??? You haven’t killed yourself yet?
Try Windex next time.
October 21st, 2009 at 12:41 amLiberalVoter says:
It takes all kinds. As a Veteran, I find it disgraceful that a Congressman would call other Veterans traitors. Then again, the (R) after his name explains it all. Forget this lowlife. He will never comprehend how reprehensible his statement is. I have to wonder how the people who voted for him can look at themselves in the mirror.
At least (hopefully) he loses votes among the veterans after his comments dishonoring our veterans.
October 21st, 2009 at 12:43 amEugeneDebs says:
Looks like R has been raptured. Good riddence to the ignorant racist piece of garbage
Guaranteed the troll will be back under another sock puppet. Maybe not if TP turns his IP and post over to authorities for his death threat.
I hope for the latter.
Beat downs in prison for him.
October 21st, 2009 at 12:46 am@ 10. Chris LeJeune says: “Rep. Metcalfe, who served in the U.S. Army from 1980-84, … I would like to ask Rep. Metcalfe if he thinks Vice Admiral Dennis McGinn or Republican Senator John Warner are not patriots. … former Senator John Warner (R-VA), a (Navy) veteran and former Secretary of the Navy, October 20th, 2009 at 5:22 pm
I hate to be the bearer of bad tidings, Chris, but doggie vets like Metcalfe generally pay no attention to vets from the Honorable Order of the Dixie Cup, even if the swabbie vet is actually a brass hat rather than a dixie cup.
Apart from that, Metcalfe is just another ignorant redneck Christianist who has fallen among politicians and is intent on making everyone do it his way or hitting the highway. He’s a petty tyrant with no tolerance for anything he doesn’t understand or approve of in advance.
October 21st, 2009 at 1:19 am.
Dear Rep. Daryl Metcalfe (R),
… But TORTURE isn’t?
.
October 21st, 2009 at 1:31 am@ 89. PissedOffVeteran says: He as probably REMF October 20th, 2009 at 6:15 pm
Just watch it, POV. We vets of the Honorable Order of the Dixie Cup are about as REMF as it gets, if you’re thinking in traditional land formation order of battle terms, but even we’re not as stupid as this Metcalfe doofus.
October 21st, 2009 at 1:32 am.
Heil (R)epublicanism!
.
October 21st, 2009 at 1:48 amState Rep. Daryl Metcalfe (R-Ku Klux Klan) reminds me of the Republicans who spit on returning Vietnam Veterans who protested against the war.
October 21st, 2009 at 3:13 amYeah, this whole “You fly under this banner or you’re this” shtick isn’t a bright idea. Maybe just for the premise that, oh…I don’t know, soldiers can have principles and don’t have to obey water cooler dicktators. Yeah, I took a liberty at the end of that last sentence.
Just because one holds a public office, doesn’t mean you are MacArthur. But if one wants to go down like him, free country!
October 21st, 2009 at 3:41 amAs a proud US Navy veteran (1984-88), proud Democrat, and proud Pennsylvania native, I find this clown’s stance to be utterly abhorrent.
October 21st, 2009 at 7:37 amAs a veteran, I believe that any veteran lending their name, to slam veterans as promoting leftist propaganda because their cause involves global warming and climate change is a shameless, shameless traitor and fake populist.
Hang, baby, hang!
October 21st, 2009 at 8:56 amThe belief in catastrophic warming is a faith appraoching religious zeal.
October 21st, 2009 at 12:02 pmMetcalfe represents a northern suburb of Pittsburgh called Cranberry. It has a relatively large republican base and the community is made up of fast growing housing plans, chain stores and restaurants.The population includes many who have come to Pittsburgh from elsewhere. They like their comfortable lives and apparently have low expectations about the rationality of their chosen Representative.In the pantheon of off the wall republicans, Metcalfe is trying to make a name for himself the way Steve King did in Iowa. Hate and venom works for some of these folks. Lets hope that the Stepford like citizenry of Cranberry develops a conscience and acts responsibly to remove the embarrassment that Metcalfe brings home to them.
October 21st, 2009 at 3:54 pmThis moron has a Facebook account that he personally checks. Heres his link: http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/profile.php?id=100000288558328&v=wall
Have fun and enjoy!!!!
October 21st, 2009 at 8:00 pmWho wants to be the first person to tell this guy ” I told you so” after someone in his family is struck by lightning because if an increase in thunderstorms during the summer? I used to not really believe in this also, but after seeing some of the stormiest weather here in Northern Virginia for the past two summers, I’m starting to rethink my origional view on global warming and climate change ( it doesn’t help that the rest of my family is/are climate change deniers and repubs….THE HORRORS!!!).
October 23rd, 2009 at 11:38 am