Matthew Hoh: ‘I Firmly Believe That We Are Taking Part In A Civil War’ In Afghanistan
Matthew Hoh: ‘I Firmly Believe That We Are Taking Part In A Civil War’ In Afghanistan
Last week, former Marine captain and State Department employee Matthew Hoh made headlines when he went public with his resignation from the administration over his opposition to the continuation of the war in Afghanistan. In a four-page letter he sent to the State Department, he explained his resignation by writing that the U.S. presence in Afghanistan serves to “bolster a failing state, while encouraging an ideology and system of government unknown and unwanted by [the Afghan] people.”
This past Sunday, CNN’s Fareed Zakaria interviewed Hoh about his views on the war. During one segment of the interview, Zakaria asked Hoh why he feels the U.S. should begin to draw down its troops from the country. Hoh replied that he doesn’t see the Afghan conflict as one between the U.S. and the Taliban, but rather as a 35-year long “civil war” between rural Pashtuns “who want to be left alone” and an urban government the U.S. is backing:
HOH: I firmly believe that we are taking part in a civil war. We are on the same side of the civil war that the Soviets intervened on.
ZAKARIA: So, you have a divide among the Pashtuns. There’s the urban middle class. And Karzai, presumably, who is a Pashtun, comes from this urban middle class.
HOH: Correct.
ZAKARIA: Many of them left the country after the — during the years of the civil war. And the ones who have stayed to fight, who fought the Soviet Union and who are now fighting us, are the rural, mountain tribe Pashtuns who resent the central government and its intrusions.
HOH: Who want to be left alone.
Watch it:
Hoh also told Zakaria that he thinks keeping 60,000 troops in Afghanistan is detrimental to U.S. security. “Occupying a location only provides justification and only lends credence to the goals of that organization,” he said. “It only inspires young Muslim men to defend their culture against an occupying army, which is what we are.”
When the CNN host asked Hoh why he was speaking out, the former State Department employee cited support from two groups: Afghan Americans and U.S. soldiers serving in Afghanistan. “I’ve had a lot of Afghan-Americans contact me and say, ‘Matt, you get it,’” Hoh told Zakaria. “I’ve gotten many e-mails from guys [serving] in Afghanistan…men and women who are saying, ‘Matt, thanks for doing this.’”
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. . .and like Iraq, neither side wants any “help” from us or anyone else.
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:01 pmIt is a civil war, and the U.S. would be better served by removing our armed forces.
If the sole reason for being there to get Bin Laden, then the U.S. should take a fraction of the cost of this war, perhaps several billion, and offer it as a bounty
for the arrest of Bin Laden, Al-Zawahiri and the other big dogs in Al-Qaeda.
It’s been eight long years, and what exactly has been accomplished?
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:04 pmWe should pull out now. The election was a farce. The Taliban controls the country. The Presidents brother is a drug dealer ON the CIA payroll, the major export is herion… Is there anything that is going right? No. Bush dropped the ball, and dumped it in Obama’s lap. I look at it this way, if Alexander the Great couldn’t do it, How do we think we will be successful?
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:06 pmHello, is there anyone there? Random are you lurking out there?
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:16 pmSmedley Butler , another Marine , had it right , War’s A Racket . Way to go Captain Hoh , it didn’t take you 40 years to figure it out like it did Smedley .
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:22 pmBreaking…. It is rumored that Liberman WON’T filibuster. Apparently Blanche Lincoln and Bill Nelson won’t join him. We shall see….
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:24 pmMatthew Hoh: ‘I Firmly Believe That We Are Taking Part In A Civil War’ In Afghanistan
– - Me: ‘I Firmly Believe That We Are Taking Part In A Civil War’ In the United States.
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:26 pmWake up and support the troops, President Obama.
Bring them home. Alive.
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:32 pmThe wars have been a cool source of economic growth for us. Why would we want to stop them now?
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:33 pmWait , didn’t this guy serve in IRAQ ?
Where were his terrific moral and ethical stances then ???????
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:33 pmSometimes it takes a little “live and learn,” MCMetal.
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:36 pmZooey, I agree with you. Like Iraq, Afghanistan is a disaster. Just another fiasco to add to Bush’s legacy. But the Repugs and Righties will call this Obama’s failure. So the rewriting of history will start, yet again.
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:39 pmBring the troops home. Leave already.
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:41 pmWhat measures if any should be taken to address the drug trade in Afghanistan?
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:43 pmThe fact that Iraq was in the midst of a civil war wasn’t cause for the US military to leave there, so…
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:46 pmd@14, What can we do? I heard on ‘HardBall’ if we burn the crops, the Taliban will become more powerful because they stockpiled their crops. If we get rid of the poppy fields, they will just make more money. It is a no win situation. This really sucks. They incompetence of the Bush years screwed us all.
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:47 pmI’ve always wondered why we can’t purchase the opium for legit pharmacological uses and destroy the surplus. Turn it into a legit cash crop.
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:54 pmHeh! It might even make a perfectly good biofuel. And the fumes might just make rush hour a pleasure!
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:56 pm/rimshot
Before we are to pull out of any conflict, we need to consider first and foremost what this would mean for Darryl’s livelihood.
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:58 pmAny hesitance to go to war is being Weak on Defense ™.
November 2nd, 2009 at 10:01 pmpete@17, That would be the LOGICAL thing to do. After, all we live in a country whose ‘War on Drugs’ has been a complete expensive disaster. Billions of our dollars were spent on what? We have the highest incarceration rate in the world, we treat drug offenders the same as violent criminals and our young people not only have easy acess to illegal drugs, but they are abusing prescription drugs as well.
November 2nd, 2009 at 10:01 pmWhy leave people alone when you can bomb the f ucking f uck out of them?
November 2nd, 2009 at 10:09 pmpete:
November 2nd, 2009 at 10:10 pmRemember when kids were collecting pennies to Free Willy and buy rainforests? What if the school children of the world united to buy up all of the opium?
Afghanistan is the graveyard of armies. It has been so for nearly a millenium. Why would it change just because we sent American troops to play “Whack-A-Mole” with the locals?
Bring OUR troops home!
“Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it.”
November 2nd, 2009 at 10:11 pmGeorge Santayana
Should the NSA leave the teenyboppers alone in their plotting to attack America during late night phone conversations using morse code like “Um, like” and “Totalaaay!” and “He’s sooo hot!” (referring to Bin Laden).
I don’t think so. I need a government that keeps me safe.
November 2nd, 2009 at 10:13 pmIn the United States, the Pashtuns would be called “Libertarians” i.e. ultra-conservative conservatives.
Imagine a civil war between conservatives and the rest of the country.
Actually, it’s not too hard to imagine. Republican talking heads have been calling for just such a civil war for months now. Someone should tell them to be careful what they wish for….
November 2nd, 2009 at 10:14 pmI’m an Armchair Ho.
Goodnight, libs.
November 2nd, 2009 at 10:15 pmActually, it’s not too hard to imagine. Republican talking heads have been calling for just such a civil war for months now. Someone should tell them to be careful what they wish for….
I nominate Lt. Gen. Boykin for appointment to the rank of general with assignment as commanding general, neoconfederate forces.
Who will be your general? Bring it on.
November 2nd, 2009 at 10:17 pmWow. It’s lonely in here.
November 2nd, 2009 at 10:24 pmZooey says:
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Sometimes it takes a little “live and learn,” MCMetal.
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:36 pm
Bet ya’ that’s of very litle comfort to Iraqi civilians he may have killed ; or their family members……
November 2nd, 2009 at 10:28 pmMCMetal says:
Zooey says:
I really don’t like “attacking” my friends on the left side but I must question your knowledge of the Armed Forces and how they operate. I am sure you could not have served. If you had, then you would know that Officers and Enlisted members of the military cannot express these “moral and ethical stances” when they are serving in the Uniform.
The Uniformed Code of Military Justice (UCMJ) specifically includes criminal charges against a service member for various UCMJ offenses that have been levied for verbal and written statements or public displays of political speech.
I don’t believe that you would want our citizens who “wear the uniform” to be “marching in protest” when they are engaged in ensuring that we continue to enjoy the liberties that were won with the loss of many lives in the past.
Please accept the fact that Mr. Hoh has spoken out now with the knowledge he acquired as an Officer in the U. S. Marine Corps serving in combat. His past experiences make him a much more believable expert as opposed to those loons on the right who have NEVER served but are the first to beat the drums that lead us to war.
November 2nd, 2009 at 10:29 pmLook, our veterans and military deserve our respect. My Father and Granfather both served in the military. When our country is in danger, they accept the call without question.
November 2nd, 2009 at 10:36 pmlcdrrek says:
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November 2nd, 2009 at 10:29 pm
Hoh is speaking out against our involvement in Afghanistan , which I am not altogether for , either ; yet , he has no qualms over our continued presence in Iraq , which he himself took part in , and which was way more unnecessary and galactically more stupid to begin with…..
That makes absolutely zero sense , and his resignation seems a bit odd and debatable …………
BTW , I never suggested that Hoh protest while in uniform ….
November 2nd, 2009 at 11:14 pmpete says:
I’ve always wondered why we can’t purchase the opium for legit pharmacological uses
I’ve always wondered the same thing. The synthetic substitutes that the drug companies tout as less addictive never are, and the few times I’ve needed to take them have always made me nauseous.
November 2nd, 2009 at 11:21 pmIs that what we’re doing?
I find it odd that republicans can do all kinds of immoral things in uniform. Retired and not.
November 2nd, 2009 at 11:26 pmSorry for the off topic but…
It looks like FAUX is going all out for their party on election eve. They aren’t even pretending anymore.
http://mediamatters.org/research/200911020052
November 2nd, 2009 at 11:45 pmike said it all in 1961
few americans listened
wars for profits for the few
wars are used to stimulate the economy
it is the american way
any good manager knows if you dont spend your budget you lose it
industrial military must have wars
it is called making a profit
capitalism is not about people but profits
americans will learn this axiom the hard way
when the middle class is gone
and we have obtained third world status
happy holidays and support our troops
the same cry used during the nam war
history repeating itself
even the germans yelled support our troops
stood in the streets and cheered hitler
hey that worked out well for the germans
November 2nd, 2009 at 11:54 pmlcdrrek says:
November 2nd, 2009 at 10:29 pm
No, I never served. But I don’t think that precludes me from forming the opinion that Mr Hoh has learned something from his life experiences — in the military and in civilian life.
My comment was about Mr Hoh NOW, not in regard to his time in the military, since obviously I have no idea what he felt or did back then.
November 3rd, 2009 at 12:02 amPresident Obama should start getting the rest of the Dems on the same page as far as the issue of leaving the Middle East.
Obama is going to receive massive criticism from the gNOpigs regardless of his actions in Afghanistan and Iraq.
We saw it already, the Dick still thinks he can call the shots.
He doesn’t, but he can open his pie hole and then have the Fox gNOpig Propaganda Network regurgitate attacks 24/7.
Time to get the Dems on the same page and bring the troops home.
November 3rd, 2009 at 12:07 amI think the Afghans are basicly held hostage by a political party and the militant powers that be..
I think our reasons for being there are debatable.
I do believe the Taliban is as insane as they’re portrayed.
I don’t know that it helps us being there.
I don’t know that the best idea is to simply leave.. but It seems in Iraq we declared victory after leaving.. or is my memory failing me? We sent a large portion of troops home – and then started calling it a victory?
Maybe the key to victory is just stopping hitting the other guy?
I really think it’s a tough choice.. and a bad situation.
November 3rd, 2009 at 12:59 amGrayson told the audience that he’s been to 175 countries and that he has come to the conclusion that the best foreign policy is to “leave people alone,” echoing Hoh’s comments on Afghanistan:
Let’s try that for a change. Grayson in 2016.
November 3rd, 2009 at 1:07 amThe most troubling thing is.. as I listen to Hoh’s words.. I have trouble figuring out whether or not our army is fighting the right guys..
The government is corrupt.. shouldn’t we be assisting the tribal groups trying to overthrow them – if helping anyone? Who is it the Taliban is assisting.. the Karzai government.. or the people? Last I heard they seem to be helping both –
I think it’s all a confusing mess.
November 3rd, 2009 at 1:22 amOk I know he wasn’t cleared for any TS positions. No dutiful solider would blab like this idiot.
From Hoh’s mouth:
Why were you whacking people Hoh? What was your purpose? Which people were you wacking. Did you cum?
Then in his written resignation he talks about what’s wrong with Afghans. Dig this:
WTF is he? Is he a general? Does he get his marching orders from the Commander-in-Chief, President Obama? He’s a roaming time bomb and is off balance. He doesn’t deserve to be in the Military. Oh I see he used the thesaurus when he is writing, it’s no problem. But when he talks he sound like an idiot.
Hoh is a fakeass 9/11 attention grabber ho.
What was chimpy’s purpose for starting a war that he knew he wasn’t going to finish? Why did chimpy forget about bin Laden and chose to make a U-turn and murder a head of state, Hussein? chimpy used fear? Why didn’t Hoh question chimpy’s motive and purpose?
You are a punk hoh.
Also Dr. Austin is a jerk.
November 3rd, 2009 at 1:40 amSometimes we need to to talking about war and just watch a hot video. Check out the video on this link:
http://americaspeaksink.com/2009/11/debra-lafave-gets-justice/
November 3rd, 2009 at 6:32 amWe need to bring the troops home from Afghanistan, where our mission is now pretty murky. Originally we were after bin Laden, but he’s probably either in Pakistan or dead. And even W said at one point he didn’t much care about bin Laden. I’m in favor of removing our troops from Iraq, too. Too much borrowed money spent on two wars with dubious goals except perhaps one of enriching government contractors. President Obama, please bring these troops home!
November 3rd, 2009 at 7:30 amWasn’t Iraq & the Afghan war always a civil war inside an illegal occupation thanks to George Bush? How many times did we liberals scream this? Seriously…
November 3rd, 2009 at 7:46 amLet’s not forget that Ronnie Reagan the Leader of the Conservative Movement LOVED THE AFGHAN TALIBAN BACK IN THE DAY:
http://nikhasnan.files.wordpress.com/2007/12/c12820-32.jpg
And if Doug Hoffman wins his tiny little race today in upstate New York, expect the conservatives across this country to hit the streets shooting off their rifles like Saddam Hussein (another conservative!) would! See?
November 3rd, 2009 at 7:48 amIt seems to me that Obama is in a no win box. When Bush decided to take out Iraq, he upset the balance of power in the middle east. He forgot about Afghanistan for seven years and let the Taliban regroup and take control over large parts of the country. Now Obama is stuck with an ever widening war that encompasses Pakistan.
I think the questions Obama is asking is…If we pullout of Afghanistan, what happens to Pakistan? Do we take the chance that the Taliban types and terrorists get hold of Pakistan’s nukes, and what then? Would that draw India (which also has nukes) into an ever widening war? What would Iran do?
As much as I would like to see all the troops come home, I’m afraid its just not that easy. We broke the balance of power’s that kept a lot of this in check, and Obama is stuck trying to figure out how to keep this from becoming a war over nukes, which is the real prize for the Taliban and terrorists.
November 3rd, 2009 at 8:15 amI don’t see where the last surge in Afghanistan has done any good so I don’t see where another doubling down would change things other than putting more soldiers in harms way. Besides, I see Gen. McChrystal stepping over the line by inserting himself into the policy discussion over America’s proper role in that conflict then going public. Nowhere is McChrystal discussing exit strategy. It is just more “clear, hold, build” except it still leaves us mired down in “clear”. After 8 long years we should be wrapping up “build” and getting out. Ironic that this utopian goal of the military only leads in the direction of death and destruction.
November 3rd, 2009 at 8:18 amWe have a central government trying to gain control over the country, and a large rural population that doesn’t want to have anything to do with it. It sounds to me that they need a weaker form of government to give the “insurgents” more control over their parts of the country. A smart politician would know how to form a coalition that will have the power to remove the Taliban from the country. But right now it seems that the Taliban is the one with the effective coalition. I think Afghanistan needs someone a whole lot better than Kharzi.
I’d rather that we leave, but I’ll leave the decision to our President. The least I ask for him is to give us a full account for why we’re there and what we hope to accomplish and an empirical approach: Once they realize whatever they are trying to do isn’t working they should pull out. I don’t want any rhetorical BS either like “they hate our freedom” or any nonsense like that. This long strategic review has increased our expectations of the result of this review. It better be good. If this is all for show it will be readily apparent to everyone.
November 3rd, 2009 at 10:02 amPresident Obama just rigged and stole his first election: the Presidency of Afghanistan. We have zero legitimate business in Afghanistan, Iraq, Iran or Pakistan. We need to get out of Afghanistan and Iraq. We need to stop murdering Pakistanis with our drones and missiles. We need to leave Iran alone.
November 3rd, 2009 at 12:42 pmFrom the post;
“HOH: I firmly believe that we are taking part in a civil war.”
There is no such thing as a “civil” war; this isn’t a balloon bonk or a pillow fight. But the premise is correct; we’re supporting the side we think we understand, but don’t; the urban class represented by Karzai et al, against the clan and village rural class, as misrepresented by the Taliban.
From earlier reportage, it would seem that the only other faction in the country is the ‘warlord’ faction, which misrepresents both urban and rural classes, is corrupt, and is partly behind Karzai but willing to shift to supporting the Taliban, especially if there’s a nice big payoff and it looks like that’s the winning side.
Is there any way we can get into a more malignant mess in Afghanistan? I suppose we can send more troops.
Doing something to improve the situation in our favor is going to be very difficult. Producing, in effect, a nationalist faction where none exists has never been easy, and the Karzai government doesn’t provide a very good foundation in this case.
November 3rd, 2009 at 12:55 pmBut our government can’t leave others alone. They might have something the U.S.(corporations)want.
November 3rd, 2009 at 4:09 pmWar is too profitable. If we aren’t blowing sh1t up, where’s the demand for more bombs?
November 3rd, 2009 at 5:30 pmWe’ve been talking about the health care costs for months now, but a military appropriations bill was recently passed and it’s price tag dwarfs the amount of money we’d spend on HELPING OUR OWN PEOPLE.
Heard anyone gripe about that? I think not.
My friends, I think it’s safe to say that America may be too fu(ked up to save.
555
November 4th, 2009 at 1:25 pm111
November 4th, 2009 at 1:32 pm“We” may be taking part in a civil war in Afghanistan, but our interaction as such is only a by-product of “our” actual intentions there. I doubt many readers here will have the patience to analyze this U.S. Government document from 1998, but for those who do, the answer to the Afghanistan question will become clear:
November 4th, 2009 at 1:54 pm
For some reason, the link I posted in my comment (number 58) did not appear. Here it is:
COMMITTEE ON INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS – 1998
November 4th, 2009 at 1:56 pm