Corker And Alexander Place Hold On Aviation Funding Bill To Prevent FedEx Drivers From Unionizing
Corker And Alexander Place Hold On Aviation Funding Bill To Prevent FedEx Drivers From Unionizing
Sen. Bob Corker (R-TN)
The RLA poses larger barriers to organizing than the NLRA, which has enabled FedEx to prevent its drivers from collectively bargaining. So the company has invested a lot of time and effort into blocking the change, including characterizing it as a “bailout” for UPS.
And FedEx has an ally in Sen. Bob Corker (R-TN), who is preventing the FAA reauthorization from moving in the Senate, until he receives assurance that the change in labor law won’t occur:
Corker’s action extends a years-long fight in Washington between the mostly non-union FedEx and its unionized rival United Parcel Service Inc. over how workers at both companies should be treated under U.S. labor laws. “We are supportive of the Senate FAA bill, but we have placed a hold until we can be assured that the controversial FedEx provision will not be included in the final legislation,” Laura Lefler Herzog, a spokeswoman for Corker, a Republican, said today in an e-mailed statement.
The Senate’s version of the FAA bill doesn’t actually include the change, but Corker wants to ensure that it isn’t added when the Senate bill is reconciled with the House version. Sen. Lamar Alexander (R-TN) has also expressed his disapproval of the legislation. Both of these senators are invested in this issue because FedEx has its headquarters in Memphis, Tennessee.
While Corker, Alexander, and FedEx itself characterize the change as “singling out” FedEx, all it would do is level the playing field between FedEx and other shipping companies when it comes to unionizing. FedEx CEO Fed Smith — “who raised more than $100,000 for 2008 Republican presidential nominee John McCain and was George W. Bush’s fraternity brother” — has said that “I don’t intend to recognize any unions at Federal Express,” and the company successfully lobbied Congress in 1996 to keep its RLA status.
Not only does FedEx prevent unionization by keeping its status as an RLA-covered company, but it also systematically misclassifies its drivers as contractors (instead of full employees) so that they can’t organize. As American Rights at Work has pointed out, “by classifying nearly 15,000 drivers as independent contractors rather than employees, FedEx Ground lowers its labor costs by avoiding payroll taxes and benefits.” Its drivers are responsible for fuel and maintenance of the trucks, and are not provided with paid vacation or sick leave.
UPS spokesman Malcolm Berkley said that the change should be made because “we believe all drivers in the country, who are doing the same job, should be treated by the same law. To us, it is literally that simple.” But Corker’s obstruction is preventing that from happening.
Cross-posted on The Wonk Room.
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That picture shows Corker giving the size of his endowment.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:08 pmControversial?
Yeah, God forbid we have the same rules for businesses that provide the same service… that’s going to FAR!!!
March 8th, 2010 at 12:08 pmCorker And Alexander Place Hold On Aviation Funding Bill To Prevent FedEx Drivers From Unionizing
BASTARDS!!!
March 8th, 2010 at 12:09 pmAnd this shocks anybody? These are Repugs. They hate the working stiff. Tom Delay also thinks we are a bunch of lazy freeloaders too. How anyone can vote Republican is beyond me…
March 8th, 2010 at 12:10 pmCan somebody explain to me how the Republican Party is still able to attract anyone to their party?
They are anti-union
March 8th, 2010 at 12:11 pmThey publish a fund raising puplication playing on fears of the mindless masses or the ego’s of the rich
They (Delay)say Americans are unemplyed because they want to be.
They are prejediced towards Hispanics and blacks
They haven’t done a damn thing for the average American since Eisenhower.
And FedEx has an ally in Sen. Bob Corker (R-TN)
– - Corker should Cast Away his relationship with FedEx.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:12 pmCaption – My brain is this big.
Alternate – My wee wee is this big.
Republicans, harming Americans just for the fun of it.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:12 pmThis is a good example of both #9 and #10 on the list of fourteen defining characteristics of fascism.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:12 pm
The argument in favour of unions is the argument in favour of government intervention and regulation: if business instinctively offered the best possible working environment for its employees and focused on community and people rather than a sheer motivation towards profits…we wouldn’t need unions or regulation.
Since they absolutely don’t…we absolutely do. No legislator should be allowed to speak out against unionization if they’ve never worked a blue-collar job.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:14 pmevangenital says:
——————————————————————————–
That picture shows Corker giving the size of his endowment.
His wife confirmed this the other night!
March 8th, 2010 at 12:16 pmevangenital says:
Why are GOOPers forever getting their pictures taken making THAT gesture?
Didn’t TP have a picture of Chinless Mitch up recently doing pretty much the same thing?
Oh yeah…
and Mitch seems to think HIS is even smaller, from the expression on his face… and then there’s the constant use of the phrase, “Shoved down our throats…”
March 8th, 2010 at 12:18 pmtexasrick says:
I know that’s a typo in there – puplication… but I like it… I think you might have coined a new, and very appropriate, word…
March 8th, 2010 at 12:20 pmAnd FedEx is held up as the reason the post office needs to be privatized. Do you think your mail carrier should pay for his own gas and truck maintenance– With no vacation or sick pay? I guess the regressives will not be happy until we are all making lower that minimum wage, have no benefits, and are dying because we don’t have health care. Perhaps that is there plan for saving the planet—just let us all die off.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:21 pmDo these Rethuglican asshats EVER stop stomping on the neck of the little guy in this country? No one who is middle or lower class (financially speaking) should EVER vote for these thugs. These criminals have spent their lives denying a decent living to ordinary Americans–and convincing them to vote against their own best interests by screaming, “GUNS, GAYS, GOD!!!”
March 8th, 2010 at 12:22 pmI guess the regressives will not be happy until we are all making lower that minimum wage, have no benefits, and are dying because we don’t have health care.
Bingo! You just explained the campaign strategy of the Rethuglican Party past, present, and future.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:24 pmBecause FedEx wants to keep the “bailout” given to them, by starting as an airfreight company, before they added the trucks. I don’t understand why the law doesn’t apply equally to FedEx and UPS ground employees, under NLRA, and equally to FedEx and UPS air employees, under NLRA. If they want their employees covered by the Railway Labor Act, put the freight on a bloody train!
March 8th, 2010 at 12:25 pmpuplication
Oh, you mean published by DOGS? (with apologies to canines)
March 8th, 2010 at 12:25 pmAs long as the Republican Party exist, the American working Class will never go forward.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:26 pmO/T, but…
Oooooooops… this is interesting…
From Crooks and Liars…
Geez… is Von Rumsfeld in trouble?
March 8th, 2010 at 12:27 pmThis is from the FedEx Weebsite. I hope everybody reads it carefully.
The RLA status of FedEx Express has been continually reaffirmed by courts and federal agencies. The Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals decided in 1991 that FedEx is exactly the kind of integrated system that Congress intended to be covered by the Railway Labor Act – the Supreme Court declined to even hear the case because the ruling was so clear.
In Federal Express Corporation vs. California Public Utilities Commission (936 F.2d 1075, 1078 9th Cir. 1991), the court wrote:
“Federal Express is exactly the kind of an expedited all-cargo service that Congress specified and the kind of integrated transportation system that was federally desired. Because it is an integrated system, it is a hybrid, an air carrier employing trucks. Those trucks do not destroy its status as an air carrier. They are an essential part of the all-cargo air service that Federal Express innovatively developed to meet the demands of an increasingly interlinked nation.”
In 1996, Congress also reaffirmed that FedEx Express employees were classified properly under the RLA. Every court or agency that has looked at the issue has ruled that FedEx Express belongs under the RLA. That is why UPS and the Teamsters are now putting so much time, money and effort into changing the RLA itself.
Like UPS, FedEx Ground and FedEx Freight are covered by the National Labor Relations Act (NLRA). The FedEx Express integrated air and ground network differentiates it from FedEx Ground and FedEx Freight. The fact that FedEx Express is a separate and distinct network for air shipments is what separates FedEx Express from UPS.
The people that will be hurt by unionizing FedEx will be the people that use it with increased fees.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:29 pmRepublicans won’t stop until we have child labor again.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:30 pmThis comment has been voted down. Click to read.
It’s one thing for Republicans,
like Corker or Alexander, to bend
over backwards to protect FedEx from
unionization, but the real outrage
is that the supposedly progressive
Democrat, Steve Cohen, Harold Ford, Jr.’s
successor from Memphis, is also opposing
the legislative change that would make
unionization at FedEx easier.
One thing’s for sure: Fred Smith didn’t get where he is
March 8th, 2010 at 12:33 pmby not knowing where to spread his
money.
From what I understand all FedEx drivers are treated as independent contractors. They have to purchase their own commercial auto insurance, etc.
It is the only deliver service like this.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:33 pmOr unionize.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:35 pmbothWrong says:
From what I understand all FedEx drivers are treated as independent contractors.
No, they are not all independent contractors… some are, some aren’t.
But one wonders why you feel that exploiting this loophole somehow entitles FedEx to another loophole in legislation?
March 8th, 2010 at 12:36 pmThis comment has been voted down. Click to read.
It’s so odd that you would say the above after saying this:
You just don’t even get it when you don’t make sense do you?
March 8th, 2010 at 12:37 pmcompetition in the free market is supposed to keep that under control according to you…..
You can’t have it both ways.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:38 pm@22 voted down and flagged as a troll.
OP VDTT+ Vote Down The Trolls and flagged for trolling.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:39 pmYanno, Jmoney, J$, Jmunny is it? Money isnt happiness and this ‘theory’ of yours that somehow money in relation to unions causes it is bizarro and is derived from nothing other than one persons opinion. Sure you have a right to your opinion but please dont state it as some kind of fact it makes one seem oh I dont the word…twisted.. [ spins hand 180dg in air like Laurel & Hardy ]
March 8th, 2010 at 12:39 pmYeah. Since when it is unacceptable for people to band together in order to demand greater pay and benefits? Again; money uber alles, at the expense of the customer and the expense of the employee.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:39 pmSometimes I wonder if the repug just sit around all weekend and think of the most stupid things they can come up with for the upcoming week – it’s getting more bizarre every week.
Slightly off-topic, but in the same vein – did anyone see Tom Delay’s comment where he basically said that people are unemployed because they want to be? Why do repugs hate the vast majority of people in this country !!
March 8th, 2010 at 12:41 pmI mean, people are well within their rights to dislike the unions, but to actively attempting to ban people from unionizing is downright cruel.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:41 pmBut, once again, after a person is born, the Republicans don’t give a d@mn about them.
This comment has been voted down. Click to read.
jmunny says: And watch the price go right up for customers, smart decision.
Yanno, for all the hand wringing I witness about unions [representation] Its really odd that so many dont connect lobbyists [representation] with health insurance and the absurd premium increases.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:42 pm#19 TRoS,
Shhh…
… No one’s supposed to know.
.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:43 pmScrew these “holds” and “blocks” on legislation . . . bring it to the floor and see if they have the votes to uphold that block. This crap is getting waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay outta hand. If the Senate has to stay in session 24/7 for weeks, frankly, I don’t care, this logjam has got to be broken, for the good of the country (the Democratic Party, it’s got more problems than just this).
March 8th, 2010 at 12:43 pm#20. The people that will be hurt by unionizing FedEx will be the people that use it with increased fees.
If this is from the FedEx website, I’d expect nothing else. Uh, the people using the USPS Priority Mail and UPS shipping don’t seem “hurt” by higher fees. Go figure.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:44 pmThis comment has been voted down. Click to read.
I guess to the mentally challenged it does.
in a nutshell you said they did a great job and were pleasant, indicating that they loved their jobs.
Next sentence you said that if they are not happy(because they want a union) that they can pack their bags and hit the road.
Now if that makes sense, you lay it out for me ok?
March 8th, 2010 at 12:46 pmMatter of fact, I have had fewer negative experiences with UPS & the USPS combined than I have had with FedEx. To be honest, the differences in the prices are fairly minuscule.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:47 pmSo then when a person working in a firm signs a contract with a company is that the government forcing the company to sign?
Your problem seems to be mostly that you don’t understand business and contracts.
In other words, you just operate on hatred of working class.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:48 pmThis comment has been voted down. Click to read.
As usual jmunny is lying. The service from FedEx got so bad that my company now deals exclusively with UPS.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:48 pmAs I understand personifying a corporation makes it as ONE person. The way these senators act, I gather due to monetary influence, and champion the one while disregarding the many constituents whose taxpayers dollars pay the elected representatives salary, is undemocratic.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:48 pmWhen comparing the service and quality of FedEx compared to UPS there is no contest. FedEx simply does a better job. The packages arrive quicker, the rates are better and the drivers are more pleasant to deal with.
Wow, you really pulled that out of your butt! I use both services on a regular basis for a client and UPS is usually the better choice for their needs and is usually how everything goes out the door. You obviously do very little shipping.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:49 pmI’m quite familiar with the sham corporations use called ‘independent contractors’.
It’s as misused as the sham of antitrust for health insurers.
Or, in this case, RLA vs NLRA.
Independent contractors agree to provide a service or product to whom they’re contracting with. If drivers come to work to operate and drive trucks, deliver product, communicate with customers they are employees.
FedEx should merge with UPS and call themselves Fed-Ups
March 8th, 2010 at 12:50 pm@43
Nobody is forcing anybody. The FedEx works should have the right to unionize, like all other workers in the private sector, especially those that are in certain industries. Nobody is forcing FedEx to unionize; they should let their workers decide. Unfortunately, the workers are not being given that opportunity.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:50 pmForcing a company to unionize and in turn increasing their salary expense (more than the market dictates)is not the free market.
Bull, no one is forcing them to unionize.
The Government is actually stepping in to PREVENT unionization.
Collective bargaining is PART of the free market, dufus.
Grow up and learn.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:51 pmThis comment has been voted down. Click to read.
Jmunny, the TEA partiers are biting their toenails off about representation. Senators are supposed to represent the constituents in their respective state, yes? And how is creating legislation, thru lobbyist representation. to keep a group of people from representation free market?
March 8th, 2010 at 12:52 pmdid anyone see Tom Delay’s comment where he basically said that people are unemployed because they want to be?
Meanwhile, Indicted Felon Tommy Delay lives on a government-funded (read “taxpayer dollars) pension and benefits because he once served in Congress. His ass should be in jail, like the rest of the Bush dynasty deserves.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:52 pmJmunny, thats what unions do, they represent the workers and represent them in company meetings and WRITE a contract. Dolt.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:53 pmWe need a law for senate and congress no more vaction days, or sick days no time to run for office, pay for medical insurance,if you miss work you do not get paid, also you work 330 days a year or loose pay, everbody else has to work everday they should be the same,and taxpayers, should vote if they get a raise in pay in state elections. I cant stand thses rotten REPUCKS>
March 8th, 2010 at 12:54 pmPerhaps the trolls should unionize.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:54 pmIn a contract both parties have bargaining power.
Exactly.
The Government is not FORCING the company to do anything… they are allowing the workers to collectively bargain their contract.
Thanks for coming on board!
March 8th, 2010 at 12:54 pmhttp://www.consumerreports.org/cro/money/shopping/shopping-tips/fedex-vs-ups-vs-the-postal-service/overview/package-delivery-services-ov.htm
http://www.comcast.net/slideshow/finance-businessrivals/ups-vs-fedex/
Note that both USPS and UPS are actually, FACTUALLY, superior to FedEx.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:54 pmUSPS is cheaper than UPS & FedEx for overnight deliveries. UPS is more successful than FedEx, both in actual revenue, market growth and image.
So how is unionizing hurting UPS/USPS again?
The simple fact is, it hasn’t. Nor will it hurt FedEx.
@57
Well, when an individual signs a contract with a corporation, more often than not they are actually giving up legal rights to protect the company’s @ss while, at the same time, getting nothing from the company in return. Except employment, which is not noted in the contract and not in any way guaranteed while the company gets what it wants usually indefinitely.
March 8th, 2010 at 12:57 pmContracts are often a one-sided affair.
The exception is collective bargaining/unions which give the workers some leverage that they do not have in any other way.
jmunny says:
Last time, I checked, Fed-Ex wasn’t forced to deliberately deliver bulk mail at a loss for the sake of big business either…
March 8th, 2010 at 12:57 pmI find these anti-unionization folks kind of ridiculous. To be honest, if you want a truly “free market,” that would mean returning to the turn of the twentieth century. But these people don’t realize that regulation and unionization has allowed them to grow up without having to begin working in a factory at age 7, or being owned by the corporation for life, or being able to die without their family receiving any sort of benefits, often for wages that wouldn’t buy anything, even adjusted for inflation.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:02 pmThe simple fact is that unions have made working in America virtually tolerable, but definitely much safer. While I may not agree with everything the unions do, I can definitely say that they allow me to earn a living wage and have insurance.
Time to stop using FedEx and support the USPS.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:02 pmThis is why people are angry at Congress. Corker and Alexander think they can use the hold without any scrutiny by the media. This should get a lot of coverage just like the jobs bill last week. Republicans are painting themselves into the corner of being depicted as obstructionists. And we should oblige them by giving coverage to this type of conduct. Let’s hope the Dems make waves about this.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:03 pmThat would be assuming that I ever use FedEx. I hate getting packages from them. They’re certainly the most difficult company to deal with, in my area at least, and I’m normally better off getting items through the USPS with as much runaround FedEx gives me. For less money, too.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:03 pmHere is another group of people who suppressed unions.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:06 pmFrom the above post:
During the presidential campaign, Palin discussed how her and husband Todd had “gone though periods of our life here with paying out-of-pocket for health coverage until Todd and I both landed a couple of good union jobs.
Wow. Union’s are terrible, aren’t they…
/sarc
March 8th, 2010 at 1:15 pmCall in Sarah Palin so she can tell her fellow repugniscum of the benefits of unionization!!
March 8th, 2010 at 1:18 pmAfter all, she and her husband Todd were out of insurance and out of health care until they got union jobs!!
I won’t be using FedEx anymore. I had no idea how they treated their employees.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:21 pmDoes it matter that the USPS shows billion dollar loses every quarter?
Does it matter to you that the USPS is a Constitutionally mandated role of Government?
March 8th, 2010 at 1:22 pmZooey, Mother Superior, Church of Perpetual Whoopie says:
I won’t be using FedEx anymore….
But then you are hurting the people who work for FedEx instead of the management.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:24 pmSome of the blame for the continued success of the American Fascist Party rests with the proletariat themselves. Union households in Ohio didn’t turn out as they were expected to for Kerry in ‘04 and Bush was re-elected despite the comment from his top economic advisor that outsourcing (to China)was good for the American economy. Scott Brown could not have elected without the support of union households. Some, not all, of the proletariat prefer the candidate who promotes gun rights over union rights.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:24 pmpags2 says:
But then you are hurting the people who work for FedEx instead of the management.
Suggestions?
March 8th, 2010 at 1:30 pmWhy do republicans hate the American worker?
March 8th, 2010 at 1:31 pmdoolindalton says:
Unions screwed themselves when they abandoned the Dem party to support Nixon. The unions got crapped on by the Republicans and then the unions came back to the Dems. Most of the unions are unable to command a lot of voters and have lost a lot of influence.
PS. The unions are very strong in Chicago and I am not aware of any other city where hold a lot of influence. Anti-union sentiment is almost non-existent in the city and Cook County. The rest of the surrounding area is mostly Republican and anti-union but they don’t advertise it because a lot of construction work is union.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:32 pmHeh. If I *wanted* to be unemployed – I would have QUIT my job (rather than being laid off).
Why isn’t Tom Delay in prison dancing for his life?
March 8th, 2010 at 1:33 pmphenry says:
Note that both USPS and UPS are actually, FACTUALLY, superior to FedEx. USPS is cheaper than UPS & FedEx for overnight deliveries. UPS is more successful than FedEx, both in actual revenue, market growth and image.
So how is unionizing hurting UPS/USPS again?
The simple fact is, it hasn’t. Nor will it hurt FedEx.
____________________________________________________
Does it matter that the USPS shows billion dollar loses every quarter?
First of all, don’t make claims unless you are also going to substantiate them.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:34 pmSecond of all, the USPS isn’t a private entity, is constitutionally mandated and has faced significant cuts in the amount of mail it delivers which cannot support itself now. The USPS has posted profits before, quite a few times. Without the ability to cut back on certain points of its expenditures doesn’t help.
Yet, in spite of its refusal to raise rates, which you bet FedEx would do in a heartbeat, it still is cheaper and better.
All of that is beside the point, since it is not competing directly in the free market.
So, go ahead and ignore that a unionized shop (UPS) outperforms FedEx.
Your arguments still hold no water.
Zooey, Mother Superior, Church of Perpetual Whoopie says:
pags2 says:
But then you are hurting the people who work for FedEx instead of the management.
Suggestions?
Write your representatives about the bill and make sure FedEx gets a copy. Buy stock in FedEx and exercise your rights as a stockholder to speak at the shareholders meetings. If I think of more I will post.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:34 pmOh, in addition, I still stand by my statement that the USPS provides better service at lower cost, which is factually correct.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:36 pmpags2 says:
Write your representatives about the bill and make sure FedEx gets a copy. Buy stock in FedEx and exercise your rights as a stockholder to speak at the shareholders meetings. If I think of more I will post.
My Congress people are useless Repiggies and Blue Dogs, but I can write them — AGAIN. I don’t do the stock market anymore, so that’s out.
Thanks.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:40 pmTheVeritableBuddhist says:
Oh, in addition, I still stand by my statement that the USPS provides better service at lower cost, which is factually correct.
I’m going to check it out. Thanks, TVB.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:41 pmSure thing, Ms. Zooey. I use the USPS whenever I can. Even if they were to stop Saturday delivery, which I understand. They are cheap, efficient and excellent.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:43 pmZooey, Mother Superior, Church of Perpetual Whoopie says:
In order to speak at a shareholder meeting you only need one share. You just need to find out where the meetings are held and see if it is close by. If you can’t attend you can still present letters to management. A boycott would not be successful because there are too many companies that rely on FedEx.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:46 pmapparently my post is held in moderation. Here it is sans swearing:
Ironically I was listening to this when I came accross this thread. Thought you’d all enjoy his insight. It rang true fourty years ago and still does today-
As soon as your born they make you feel small,
By giving you no time instead of it all,
Till the pain is so big you feel nothing at all,
A working class hero is something to be,
A working class hero is something to be.
They hurt you at home and they hit you at school,
They hate you if you’re clever and they despise a fool,
Till you’re so fu(king crazy you can’t follow their rules,
A working class hero is something to be,
A working class hero is something to be.
When they’ve tortured and scared you for twenty odd years,
Then they expect you to pick a career,
When you can’t really function you’re so full of fear,
A working class hero is something to be,
A working class hero is something to be.
Keep you doped with religion and sex and TV,
And you think you’re so clever and classless and free,
But you’re still fu(king peasents as far as I can see,
A working class hero is something to be,
A working class hero is something to be.
There’s room at the top they are telling you still,
But first you must learn how to smile as you kill,
If you want to be like the folks on the hill,
A working class hero is something to be.
A working class hero is something to be.
If you want to be a hero well just follow me,
If you want to be a hero well just follow me.
“Working Class Hero”
lyrics by John Lennon
p.s. Happy International Women’s Day ladies!
March 8th, 2010 at 1:52 pmunions force? You’re piss ignorant of the process honey.
contract negotiations. Read, learn, think.
Stop saying things just because you want to support one side.
No company has to sign the contract. They do it because it is the economic postitive in the situation, just like when they sign a contract with an individual.
March 8th, 2010 at 1:57 pmI do most of my shopping online and almost nothing come FedEx. I don’t get to pick the delivery company and always choose the cheapest so obviously FedEx, contrary to the lies the troll tells, is not the cheapest. I’ve even had things delivered UPS and the post office delivered the very next day. I have received many notices that they will not receive deliveries sent FedEx because of their practices so what is FedEx really gaining except bigger paychecks for the bigwigs?
March 8th, 2010 at 2:06 pmActually what people should do who have Democratic legislators is to request that the federal government never use FedEx for deliveries, EVER.
March 8th, 2010 at 2:08 pmThere is no point in arguing with a troll who earns a nickle a comment about labor affairs. Sitting there eating generic cheeseballs and store brand cola that his mother pays for he is no expert on the real world.
March 8th, 2010 at 2:10 pmI feel better providing the facts and calling him a liar.
March 8th, 2010 at 2:13 pmFred ♪♫♪ says:
No company has to sign the contract. They do it because it is the economic postitive in the situation, just like when they sign a contract with an individual.
That is not quite true. Under NLRB law, when a certain number of people vote in favor of a union, the company must engage in collective bargaining. The contract they negotiate must be signed. Of course, the company can refuse to negotiate but that opens them up to NLRB sanctions as well as a strike. The company may be hard pressed to find scabs to bring in. A state can only provide protection with the National Guard for a limited time. And that costs money that may be passed on to the company.
March 8th, 2010 at 2:13 pmguess you never heard of “right to work” states. They can have a union man working right next to a non-union man and eventually, guess who gets eliminated?
The can always also shut the plant down for a time and re-open with non-union workers.
There are many ways for companies to get around the fragile nlrb, trust me.
They have the choice of entering into collective bargaining. They are not forced to do so.
March 8th, 2010 at 2:20 pmjmuny
You constantly show how ignorant you are. It is blatantly STUPID to say they do a better job because they ARENT union. We are sorry you are too stupid to make a decent living and are jealous of union workers who make a good wage. That is YOUR burden to bear and being a petulant PUNK and wanting everyone to suffer like you is pitiful.
March 8th, 2010 at 2:21 pmIf it was not for unions most jobs in industery would be paying a lot less per hour, it was unions who set the pace at these non union jobs. Everbody should be allowed to join unions, its republicans have always against them for there rich business buddys. I call them the republican communist party because that what they act like. VOTE them all out of office lets take our country back, there a few dems that need to go to like blanch. there repucks acting like dems.
March 8th, 2010 at 2:22 pmjmuny ONLY cares about how much money a company has to pay its workers. He DOESNT care about actual human beings and how much better their lives would be with more money to support their families. He DOESNT care about the huge bonuses paid to high officials. He doesnt care about the economy which benifits from middle class people having money to spend. Jmuny is another selfish Mammon worshipper, brainwashed and stupid. Spewing out what he was TOLD to think by corporate propaganda. Jmuny is pathetic. In his world families should suffer for that higher profit margin.
March 8th, 2010 at 2:24 pmFred ♪♫♪ says:
guess you never heard of “right to work” states. They can have a union man working right next to a non-union man and eventually, guess who gets eliminated?
The can always also shut the plant down for a time and re-open with non-union workers.
I am fully aware of right to work states. Nonunion workers must contribute an amount equal to the dues because they benefit from the collective contract. These workers just don’t have union membership. As far as a strike, I stand by my previous comments about scabs. The National Guard is not going to stay forever.
March 8th, 2010 at 2:29 pmpags, I respect you a great deal but this is just not true.
non-union workers contribute nothing. That is the whole point of a right to work state.
I am a retired union pipefitter in Okla. I know this to be a fact.
March 8th, 2010 at 2:33 pmhttp://www.nrtw.org/your-rights-3-minutes
Employees covered by state Right to Work laws can not lawfully be required to pay any union fees to keep their jobs. But state Right to Work laws do not protect railway and airline employees and employees of private-sector contractors on some federal properties.
If a law or bargaining agreement permits it, employees can be forced to pay certain union fees. If you don’t join the union, or resign from membership, and notify the union that you don’t want to pay full dues, the required fee must be limited to the union’s proven costs of collective bargaining activities. This fee may not lawfully include things like political expenses.
March 8th, 2010 at 2:40 pmThat doesn’t cover a lot of work obviously.
It’s similar to a prevailing wage law that is also based on union wages whether the employees on the government project are union or not.
March 8th, 2010 at 2:44 pmThe nonunion members still have to pay an amount almost equal to the dues. They do not get a free ride with the collective agreement. However, they lose health and pension benefits from the union. The other exceptions are not relevant.
March 8th, 2010 at 2:47 pmOnly on a government funded project, you said this yourself.
The bottom line is that companies are not at a disadvantage in negotiations with labor and haven’t been since raygun.
How else do you explain the decline of the number of union workers while wages and benifits have actually dropped?
March 8th, 2010 at 2:52 pmNo tax money is used by the post office.
March 8th, 2010 at 2:54 pmAnd yet, phenry, you failed to address the meat of my argument, which is that, despite USPS’s losses, they provide better service cheaper. And that, in terms of private-sector-only companies, UPS, a union company consistently performs better than FedEx, with comparable rates even.
March 8th, 2010 at 2:58 pmSee, for those of who who aren’t familiar with rhetoric, what he is doing is avoiding the issue because he has no arguments against it. I have countered your argument with fact, and you have not done likewise.
Once you can come up with a cogent argument, feel free to do so. I am out of this thread. So many other trolls to ignore.
Cheers!
Fred, ignore him. He’s trying to draw us off into a separate argument. The fact remains that FedEx will not be hurt by unionizing; all FedEx is doing is attempting to carve a bigger slice of the pie for itself at the cost of the consumer and employee, which is all phenry is arguing for.
March 8th, 2010 at 2:59 pmAre you denying that the USPS has consistently showed loses or are you making excuses for those loses? That’s well documented.
How does their rates compare with private companies? Higher? Lower? (I already know, but it’s fun rubbing their noses in it.)
March 8th, 2010 at 2:59 pmphenry says:
Are you in favor of removing a Constitutionally mandated Government function?
Article 1, Section 8 calls for the establishment of a Post Office… aren’t you guys ‘Originalists?’
March 8th, 2010 at 3:00 pmIt’s a damn shame we can’t have all the trolls go back to working 84 hrs. a week at 50 cents an hour with no health benefits, paid time off, or workers’ comp. That’s what they seem to want to return us to.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:01 pmOh, and no overtime pay either.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:02 pmPlane and simple: DON’T USE FED EX!
March 8th, 2010 at 3:02 pm2) government agencies just can not compete with the private sector.
So let’s privatize the Centers for Disease Control. I’m sure they would never put profit above public safety.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:03 pmCorker is a joke
March 8th, 2010 at 3:06 pmFred ♪♫♪ says:
pags2 says:
The nonunion members still have to pay an amount almost equal to the dues.
Only on a government funded project, you said this yourself.
That is not true. It applies to all states and is not restricted to government projects. See my link.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:07 pmLiar:
Carrier is quick to point out that the USPS is not supported by tax money and is expected to compete and turn a profit, just like any other business.
http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/consumerawareness/a/uspsabout.htm
March 8th, 2010 at 3:07 pm
The USPS receives taxpayer money annually.
0 Tax dollars received for operating the Postal Service
http://www.usps.com/communications/newsroom/postalfacts.htm
Oops.
Hey, U.S. Constitution: Article 1, Section 8… do you like it?
I do.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:07 pmIf the USPS continues to post billions in loses and the government can not fix the problem, then yes. The Constitution could be amended, right?
Ahh,
glad you feel that way… very reasonable.
http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/abstract/282/5/447
Are you ready to start discussing amending the Second Amendment?
Great!
March 8th, 2010 at 3:10 pmpags2, from your link
5.If a law or bargaining agreement permits it, employees can be forced to pay certain union fees. If you don’t join the union, or resign from membership, and notify the union that you don’t want to pay full dues, the required fee must be limited to the union’s proven costs of collective bargaining activities. This fee may not lawfully include things like political expenses.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:10 pmpags2, again, I lived this. I know something about this issue or I wouldn’t press someone as intelligent as you.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:11 pmFred ♪♫♪ says:
I can assure you that every collective agreement has a clause that covers the nonunion workers.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:12 pmpags2, from a link on the website you linked to:
Question: Can I be required to be a union member or pay dues to a union?
Answer: You may not be required to be a union member. But, if you do not work in a Right to Work state, you may be required to pay union fees.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:14 pmState law or no if you have MY job you are in MY union. You can opt out of paying dues ONLY by paying a similiar amount to pay for the services the union provides
March 8th, 2010 at 3:14 pmOnly in right to work states. And it just protects them as if they were members without any dues or fees and they cannot vote or be reprimanded by the union.
In none right to work states every contractor on a construction site must be either union or non-union. No mixing.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:17 pmPags if you are a conductor for my or any other class 1 railroad you ARE in a union PERIOD
March 8th, 2010 at 3:17 pmI work in Arizona a right to work state. If you hire out here for my job you JOIN ONE OF THE UNIONS THAT REPRESENT US. 95% are UTU
March 8th, 2010 at 3:18 pmFred ♪♫♪ says:
When the nonunion person is paying fees, they are for the costs of collective bargaining. This is not considered union dues. I know because my father was a union truck driver and because I had to work with unions on some insurance claims. You are not reading the rules together.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:19 pmthe problem with right to work states is that crafts can be either union or non-union and that leads to problems.
If I’m a pipefitter and I have a job 100 feet off the ground, who do I want building that scaffold? Union or non-union.
In right to work states you have no say.
In non-right to work states there is a pre-job meeting with all union reps for all crafts and the company. If it’s a union job.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:21 pmFred
Interstate union contracts supercede state law. What you describe CAN happen but it doesnt always happen. Arizona can not stop the people who have my job from HAVING to be in the union. They have a choice. Either they join the union or get another job
March 8th, 2010 at 3:23 pmOk, I give up. You win. All my real life experience was a figment of my imagination and I’m completely wrong.
Sorry I challenged you.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:26 pmFred ♪♫♪ says:
In a right to work state you can have union and nonunion employees working side by side. The nonunion members can do anything the union workers do; they are just not a union member. When a contract calls for union workers in a right to work state, the nonunion members can help build the scaffolding. I dealt with a lot of scaffold cases because Illinois used to have a scaffolding act but that was repealed in the 1990’s. The contract is not read literally, but means using companies with union workers.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:27 pmBanks, GM, Chrysler, etc. what’s the difference honey?
March 8th, 2010 at 3:27 pmThe Bill of Rights indicate that those rights could never be abridged by government.
No, they don’t… in fact, any or all may be approved or not by the Legislatures of the States (right there in the preamble to them…) Have you read them?
March 8th, 2010 at 3:32 pmYou go ahead and read the text of the 21rst Amendment, phenry… what’s that one do?
March 8th, 2010 at 3:34 pmDo you really think that postal service is a “right” on par with the first ten amendments?
The POSTAL SERVICE is provided for in the ACTUAL ORIGINAL CONSTITUTION as a Congressional power and duty…
Yeah, they are on a par with one another… I wouldn’t call the postal service a ‘right’ exactly but BOTH are part of the Constitution.
Get it?
March 8th, 2010 at 3:39 pmYou wanna make an amendment to privatize the post office to ’save’ money.
I wanna change the gun laws to save money.
Explain how that is ‘apples and oranges’ phenry?
‘Cause I think you’re full of road apples.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:42 pmphenry says:
no tax money used in usps since 1970 read the links honey.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:47 pmphenry says:
I have serious doubts that the post office can be privatized or outsourced since it is mentioned in the Constitution. No doubt some companies are salivating at the idea of taking it over since there is no competition for most regular nonbusiness mail. The USPS has repeatedly taken steps to fix the problems. However, they are competing against email because major corporations are using email rather than regular mail. This includes customers of the companies. My insurance company allowed private customers access to various things.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:51 pmIsn’t he the Senator from Toyota?
I remember him grilling the UAW rep and claiming they were paid too much during the bailout talks for the auto industry and lying about their pay then. He’s a creep, he thinks workers don’t deserve benefits, he’s typical.
What I never understood, he’s going to vote against it anyway, it’s not like Fed-Ex will leave TN. what’s he got to lose except? Absolutely nothing. I understand Reps fighting for their constituents (big business) but going to the wall kicking and screaming I just don’t get.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:55 pmAnd people are injured for many reasons. You should outlaw cars while youre at it.
But we’re talking about the cost/benefit to the Government losses here… Cars have a benefit.
Handguns? Not as much…
March 8th, 2010 at 4:02 pmphenry says:
I don’t think its necessarily a bad thing to amend the constitution to take this burden off the federal government, especially if they are at such a disadvantage.
I disagree. Congress should deal with the problem. A private mail company would end up like the health insurance companies. They would have a monopoly and rates would go sky high.
March 8th, 2010 at 4:09 pmI’m talking about a government agency losing billions every quarter and you’re talking about the costs of medical care associated with handgun injuries (not sure how that is the government’s responsibility anyway).
Well, you could read the study on the costs I gave you… hey, there’s an idea.
March 8th, 2010 at 4:10 pmP.S. the Post Office has many uses, not least of which is mailing letters.
March 8th, 2010 at 4:11 pmphenry says:
In truth, I think that the purpose of the Second Amendment is clear but has been perverted… but I just like yanking your chain because of your preposterous post office privatization plan…
March 8th, 2010 at 4:14 pmThe Post Office has been mechanized and jobs reduced. They have reached a limit to productivity and efficiency. The Post Office is not a business. That leaves hikes in prices and reduced delivery. They could hike the postal rates for junk and bulk mail, but that would not be enough. When you reduce delivery you lose even more businesses.
March 8th, 2010 at 4:16 pmphenry says:
Fine, we agree then.
Hey, to return to the actual topic of conversation… do you think its fair for FedEx to continue to operate under a different set of rules and regulations?
I don’t.
March 8th, 2010 at 4:18 pmThis is just another example. That’s why I’m wary whenever regulation is discussed.
Great!
‘Cause what they’re discussing is LESS regulation! Thanks for coming on board! Call Corker and let him know you disapprove…
March 8th, 2010 at 4:27 pmAnd if a plane falls out of the sky – whose fault is it now ?
Not to mention that the aviation industry is said to be running on empty. There is a need to overhaul the traffic system to take advantage of modern navigation while planes are still flying on a system developed for morse code transmissions.
March 8th, 2010 at 4:37 pmOH…OF…COURSE…
I was steaming mad, AGAIN, today, after NPR ran the usual snark-fest with Cokey Roberts and Steve Inskeep (taking shots at the Dems)…AND THEN, followed it up with an ever so glowing story on, yes you can guess, CORKER!
Makes me SO mad!
March 8th, 2010 at 6:30 pmFedex has no list of addresses which refuse deliveries. I will no longer accept deliveries from FedEx. I paid them the courtesy of informing them of that, but the CSR said their was no way for her to accept the information. I certainly will be letting on-line companies know any time I balk at ordering because they offer no choice other the FedEx.
March 8th, 2010 at 7:43 pmOf course, when conservatives talk about rights, they mean “white-guy rights.”
Republicans and their ilk love to prattle on about rights. But it’s only the rights that are important to white males–mostly the right to badmouth people and the “right” to brandish guns.
In winger utopia, white-guy aşk şiirleri rights will be inviolable. But there will be no privacy, especially in sexual matters. Gays will be çiçek constantly watched; women will be forced to have babies; and people will be allowed to criticize only Democrat Presidents.
March 9th, 2010 at 7:35 amWhy don’t they like unions?
March 9th, 2010 at 8:53 amPlease don’t tell me Harry Reid just caved on this issue to spite labor again,as an employee of Fedex I switched parties in hopes the Dems would help pass this change and now I’m reading Harry Reid just promised Corker the senate won’t include this and push the house to take it out,we had them in a corner and he is caving!I am so distraught because I really thought this was going to happen only to see the democrats back down again!
March 10th, 2010 at 8:53 pm