Radical, racist signs featured at 9/12 march on DC — and one vindicating my birther-denier link


Last month I noted “The top 5 ways the ‘birthers’ are like the deniers.”  The above sign, from the 9/12 Project DC march on Washington, is worth those thousand words.  Yesterday, countless right-wing protesters were in DC, inspired by uber-extremist Glenn Beck and organized by Republican lobbyists.  Tasteless wingnut signs, like ‘Bury Obamacare with Kennedy’, were the norm.  Think Progress attended the rally and has much, much more in this repost:

This morning on ABC’s Good Morning America, Sen. Jim DeMint (R-SC) embraced the protesters at today’s 9/12 March in Washington, DC, saying that he was “glad they’re here to take back their country.” He characterized the attendees as nonpartisan, adding that “it’s not about President Obama. It’s not about the Democrats.” Several other Republican lawmakers, including Reps. Tom Price (GA), Mike Pence (IN), Marsha Blackburn (T), and Phil Gingrey (GA) planned to attend and speak at the event.

Members of ThinkProgress attended today’s march and the signs carried by these protesters were hardly nonpartisan “” and were often racist, radical portrayals of Obama, despite DeMint’s claim. Some examples of what we saw:




In an interview with the Washington Independent, DeMint claimed that the attendees at the march were “a cross-section of the population.” When it was pointed out to him that almost everyone there was white, DeMint simply said, “It’s probably just the time and organization and the media that promoted it.”

Mark McKinnon, a former adviser to Sen. John McCain’s (R-AZ) presidential campaign, has warned conservatives from embracing events like the 9/12 March. “It’s bad for Republicans because in the absence of any real leadership, the freaks fill the void and define the party,” McKinnon said.

Other signs showed Obama as a “Democratic Socialism” and called him a “bloodsucking…alien.” More offensive signs here and here and here.
At the march, DeMint repeated his Waterloo remarks, announcing to the crowd, “Ladies and Gentlemen: Welcome to Waterloo!” He claimed that the health care debate is “a critical battle for the heart and soul of America, and for freedom itself.”
DeMint told Fox News that today’s attendees were “informed” and “outraged.” “I’ve never been so proud to be an American,” he said.


79 Responses to Radical, racist signs featured at 9/12 march on DC — and one vindicating my birther-denier link

  1. Mickey says:

    Why are Politicians even speaking at tea partys? Why did only Republicans speak, is it just a Republican thing?
    Marsha Blackburn is my Congressman.
    She is no conservative.
    See her unconstitutional votes at :

  2. Nancy says:

    It’s sad that these demonstrators are so proud of their ignorance. The politicians who are fanning these flames should be ashamed….they’re destroying this country.

  3. ecostew says:

    The Rs not speaking out against the demonstrators should also be ashamed!

  4. Rick Covert says:

    The Confederate flag says it all. The Republicans have become a party of an ever shrinking group of shrill Neo-Confederates. Enjoy your, at least, 20 year status as a minority party Republicans.

  5. terry says:

    boy i wish i would of voted for clinton in fact i was better off with bush. he makes me wish i was a republican.

  6. Eclipse says:

    There is nothing radical about in any of the pictures above. Social liberalism is a disease and has to be eradicated. Whoever the nut job is who wrote this fictional article obviously suffers greatly from this disease. The Obama Death Care plan does not cover treatment for this disease. Just take a pill and put yourself out of your misery!

  7. Eclipse says:

    Outlaw social liberalism!

  8. Leif says:

    “Never underestimate the power of stupid people in a large crowd.” Don’t recall the source but worth remembering.

  9. BBHY says:

    Those promoting the protests are all about tax cuts for the rich, corporate power over all else, elimination of the middle class and oppression for everyone else.

    Those participating are clueless of the promoters motives and simply responding to the crude, anger inciting rhetoric of the promoters.

    Unfortunately we’ve seen this movie before, and the ending was never a good one.

  10. Greg Robie says:

    The use of the freedom riders concept (shown in a picture in the Think Progress article) is quite Orwellian. It says much . . . ironically, about liberals. Had progressives/liberals lived consistent with the values they professed this double speak would not be as easy to morally engage in. But why practice a moral ethic when you can get the same moral feeling by professing it (whining about it)? If it feels good, do it, isn’t that our creed?

    James Simon Kunen, who wrote _The Strawberry Statement_, noted, about 20 years ago in an interview in “Time Magazine,” that all he wanted was a house in the suburbs with a picket fence and two weeks vacation at the Jersey shore. In reflection, he was overwhelmed with how much hard work that took. And this was his experience/perception as our culture and economy rose “freely” to the level of unsustainability it has; as we, like Yurtle the Turtle, have built our perch higher and higher.

    Using Lord Stern’s figure of a 90% reduction in carbon emissions being needed, and inversing the statistics, this hard work of achieving a middle class lifestyle occurred during the period of time that we were also on the privileged side of a 1250% discrepancy in equitable distribution of any so-called right to pollute—assuming liberals mean what they say about moral behavior being about equality.

    The Right is right/moral in its dislike of current liberalism/progressivism . . . and as Jonathan Haidt noted in his presentation on morality at the New Yorker 2012 Conference, we don’t get i . . . and we need to.

  11. Jeremiah says:

    It’s fine to be protesting big government spending. I have no issue with that.

    However, were these people also asking, “how are we gonna pay for it?!?!” when we decided to invade Iraq?

    Curious that starting a war is money well spent (no matter the final bill), but taking care of our own citizens suddenly becomes a budgetary issue.

  12. BIGH2O says: are dead on.

  13. BIGH2O says: are dead on.
    Rick Covert..If the progressives have not completely changed our history in school books, read and make yourself familiar with the Civil War. It might enlighten you.

  14. Gail says:

    Glenn Greenwald has an interesting article about the history of the right wing, which is that it has pretty much always made hysterical attacks. However as one commenter pointed out when, Clinton was in office there wasn’t a run on guns and ammo, and protesters didn’t show up at his speeches toting rifles.

  15. Deborah says:

    9/12 March on DC is just the beginning. We will not go away, and you can call us all the nasty names you want.
    This is not about Bush or Obama, Republican or Democrat, black, brown, green or white, young or old, rich or poor, Christian, Jew or atheist, this is about liberty and the constructs that our founding fathers put in place to make America what has always been, a free country.
    The fact that MSM is practically ignoring what very well could have been the largest gathering of people in history will not deter us, but only makes us more determined to continue.
    Can you hear us now Obama?

  16. Bob Wallace says:

    I think we’re watching the death throes of white male supremacy. And I’m making that statement from the perspective of a white male, born in Alabama in the first half of the previous century, and who grew up in Tennessee.

    When I entered adulthood in the early 1960s I automatically was pushed to the head of the line ahead of all women and all non-whites. Even ahead of many whites who happened to be from the edges of Europe or who were Catholic.

    Now, while things have not totally changed, a white male generally has to compete with everyone. Nothing says this more than a black man occupying the White House and women taking prominent “old white guy” positions around him.

    A second female Secretary of State. Two women on the Supreme Court at the same time. A woman as Speaker of the House. Women governors, senators, representatives, heads of other major countries, CEOs, ….

    It’s clear that the government glass ceiling has been broken. White guys no longer have those jobs reserved for them.

    From what I see from the baggers, they aren’t intellectual giants. They don’t make thoughtful, insightful speeches but shout slogans. When asked they don’t seem to be able to explain their positions in any depth, just spout talking points. They shout “fascist” and “socialist”, but they don’t seem to know the meaning of what the words they use.

    I think what I’m seeing is the anger (and fear) of a group of people who have lost their position of privilege. They now are starting to understand that when that next job up the ladder opens, they won’t automatically get it because they are the white guy in line. But they will have to compete with everyone in line and many of the non-white guys and many of the women are likely more capable than they are.

    These people are going to shout and sputter for a few more years, but without offering anything that takes the country forward their movement will die out like did Lester Maddox and his pickax handle.

    Look at their members. There aren’t many young people in those groups, they are mainly middle aged and older folks. These are people who are moving into retirement, even already in retirement. They are not the people who will shape this country, but the people who will watch it pass by from their recliners. The younger people who will take this country forward aren’t buying their crap.

  17. Jeremiah says:

    “Deborah says:
    September 13, 2009 at 12:19 pm

    9/12 March on DC is just the beginning. We will not go away, and you can call us all the nasty names you want.”

    I hate to break it to you Deborah, but you’ve already gone away. The “movement” made front bill coverage on most major websites for about half of yesterday before it was knocked down to the 3rd or 4th story.

    A lot of people didn’t vote for Obama. Those people have the right to get in the streets and make some noise. But the difference between you, Deborah, and Obama, is that he, not you, has been given the mandate to lead the country. And that is just what he’s doing.

  18. ZS says:

    The fact that MSM is practically ignoring what very well could have been the largest gathering of people in history will not deter us, but only makes us more determined to continue.

    The number of people who attended President Obama’s Inauguration outnumbered the number of teabaggers (nice name btw) on 9-12 by at least ten-fold. The fact that someone told you that the yesterday’s teabagger protest was the largest gathering of people in HISTORY, and you actually believed it, and repeated it, speaks volumes.

  19. Robert says:

    Where did this crowd of noise & nonsense makers come from. Must be part of that astroturf T club dreaming about taking away the Green Ground we are fighting for. They are looser and time and Global Warming will prove it. They buy science fiction and forget science fact. Good Luck to them and their RNC orchestrated lost cause.

  20. ZS says:

    There is nothing radical about in any of the pictures above. Social liberalism is a disease and has to be eradicated.

    I’m pretty sure anyone that can put these two sentences in a row as something other than a total joke has little credibility to speak on what is radical and what is not.

  21. ZS says:

    If the progressives have not completely changed our history in school books, read and make yourself familiar with the Civil War. It might enlighten you.

    BIGH20, speaking for myself, I’m DYING to be enlightened about this. Please, I implore you.

  22. Petro says:

    Methinks you should moderate the comments. There are ample sites available to take home the point of view of rebunazis, if anyone is sick enough for that.

    [JR: I do 99% of the time, but it’s worth seeing what we’re up against from time to time.]

  23. Dano says:

    Did Rush or Hannity mention CP during one of their spew-fests? Is that why the tea-bagging ignorami showed up in force today?



  24. DG says:

    I think they must be doing searches for references to the post and flooding the message boards, not really understanding the subtleties of dedicated readership.

    Thanks though Joe for reposting this. I wouldn’t have come across Think Progress’s post and the photographs otherwise.

  25. TomG says:

    Those who seem to think that Social Liberalism is a diease and should be eradicated had best learn what social conditions were like before it existed.
    Or would you prefer to return to 7 day work weeks, child labour, no pensions, poor houses, slavery, indenture, no rights for women…the list goes on and on.
    Before Social Liberalism existed these people in the pictures would not even have the right to protest.
    The United States Bill of Rights is in my humble opinion, the oldest example of Social Liberalism.
    Is this what you want to destroy?

  26. Robert says:

    TRUTH, the first casualty of logic spent,
    shows man’s nature can be devious bent!

    The signs prove who they are; radical lost crazies that care not a wit for respect or truth. Dano said it right; their vile spew-fest is a characteristic of poisoned minds that will bear watching. They’ll make no points on Joe’s Blog. They believe in science fiction and abhor science fact. They are from that fringe group i call Clown Beck’s ‘T’ Bagers. We know it to be just a proxy of the RNC. The real authority on all this silly but entertaining noise is today’s article in Think Progress. It nails the subject down, so go read it and check out the links!

  27. BIGH2O says:

    Jeremiah…just where is o leading us to?

  28. Mike#22 says:

    Max Blumenthal’s new book “Republican Gomorrah” was featured on Fresh Air last week. I haven’t read it yet (sigh, more work), but the interview is worth a listen for those of us trying to figure out where these old white right wing evangelicals are coming from. Denialism, creationism, racism–fertile ground for all this and more.

    This excerpt from Blumenthal’s website gives and idea of what the book is about:

    “Over the last year, award-winning journalist and videographer Max Blumenthal has been behind some of the most sensational (and funniest) exposes of Republican machinations. Whether it was his revelation that Sarah Palin was “anointed” by a Kenyan priest famous for casting out witches, or his confronting Republican congressional leaders and John McCain’s family at the GOP convention about the party’s opposition to sex education (and hence, the rise in teen pregnancies like that of Palin’s daughter), or his expose of the eccentric multimillionaire theocrat behind California’s Prop 8 anti-gay marriage initaive, Blumenthal has become one of the most important and most constantly cited journalists on how fringe movements are becoming the Republican Party mainstream.

    Republican Gomorrah is a bestiary of dysfunction, scandal and sordidmess from the dark heart of the forces that now have a leash on the party. It shows how those forces are the ones that establishment Republicans-like John McCain-have to bow to if they have any hope of running for President. It shows that Sarah Palin was the logical choice of a party in the control of theocrats. But more that just an expose, Republican Gomorrah shows that many of the movement’s leading figures have more in common than just the power they command within conservative ranks. Their personal lives have been stained by crisis and scandal: depression, mental illness, extra-marital affairs, struggles with homosexual urges, heavy medication, addiction to pornography, serial domestic abuse, and even murder. Inspired by the work of psychologists Erich Fromm, who asserted that the fear of freedom propels anxiety-ridden people into authoritarian settings, Blumenthal explains in a compelling narrative how a culture of personal crisis has defined the radical right, transforming the nature of the Republican Party for the next generation and setting the stage for the future of American politics.”

  29. BIGH2O says:

    Bob Wallace,

    You say you are a white male, but you refer to white males as ‘they”.

  30. BIGH2O says:

    One more note here in case there are those who do not understand what is going on with people across this country. It is about CORRUPTION.The corruption crosses both parties. It infects and spreads. It has a stranglehold in D.C.

  31. Bob Wallace says:

    Bigwater – you mean here?

    “I think what I’m seeing is the anger (and fear) of a group of people who have lost their position of privilege. They now are starting to understand that when that next job up the ladder opens, they won’t automatically get it because they are the white guy in line”

    “They” is referring to the angry white male teabaggers.

    I understood that my position of power was ebbing long ago when I was leaving graduate school and looking for my first university faculty position. I was not allowed to apply for an opening at UC Santa Cruz as it was reserved for a female applicant back in the days of affirmative action. At first that upset me. But it also caused me to stop and think about the unearned privilege that my gender and race had gifted me.

    I’m a white male. But not part of the “they”.

  32. ZS says:

    This is a bewildering preview of the national “debate” that will inevitably take place in a few month when the climate/energy bill becomes the number one priority.

    Take a look at this set of photos from the 9-12 teabagger protest:

    and try to figure out how in the world you’re supposed to debate with this nonsense.

    IMG_1500 by NineTwelvePhotos.

    [JR: I pulled in the picture with one accurate line “We are ALL Joe Wilson….” Yes, they are all dead wrong and boorish.]

  33. ecostew says:

    The media must do objective investigative research/reporting.

  34. paulm says:

    Back lash for a black president.

    Could this detract from the fact civilization is coming to an end before the end of the century. Or will the down turn feed it?

  35. Bob Wallace says:

    Bigwater –

    Jeremiah hasn’t answered your question – “Jeremiah…just where is o leading us to?”, so let me try.

    I think (and hope) he is leading us out of the Bush wilderness. What is the “Bush wilderness” you ask?

    Give this article a read. It starts with…

    “Thursday’s annual Census Bureau report on income, poverty and access to health care-the Bureau’s principal report card on the well-being of average Americans-closes the books on the economic record of George W. Bush.

    It’s not a record many Republicans are likely to point to with pride.”

    Now, if you’re part of the richest 1%, if you count Gates, Buffett and Ellison among your peers, then I can see you disliking President Obama’s direction.

    However, if you’re part of the other 99% of us then you must be getting tired of sharing an ever decreasing slice of the pie as the guys on the top snatch up more and more.

    Please set aside your built up anger toward “the others” and spend some time thinking through what might be best for you. For you personally, not for a few politicians or radio/TV people.

    You aren’t going to “get your country back” in terms of white guys getting to make all the decisions again. Live with it. We’re all in this together, white, black, male, female, ….

    Now, think about what either you or your employer pays for medical insurance, how much the premiums have been going up.

    Think how that insurance could be jerked out from under you if you loose your job or exceed your annual/lifetime expenditure cap.

    Think about life after personal bankruptcy. It happens to guys like you and me.

    Think about how your kids and grandkids are getting priced out of a good education. Or coming out of school with so much debt that they essentially have to sell themselves in to servitude to the highest bidder instead of following their dreams.

    Think about how our environment is being degraded and how horrible life will likely be for our children, grandchildren and great-grandchildren if we don’t get things turned around.

    This isn’t about socialism, fascism, or any other ism. It’s about getting our country back on track so that we can have a decent life and a secure as possible future. It’s about a nation of individuals working together to fix problems.

  36. Jeff Huggins says:


    Sorry to keep coming back to this point — but I think it’s a vitally important one.

    Do the media (MSM and others) understand their role in fueling this, enabling it, encouraging it, making it “larger than life”, and so forth? Do they understand that the misinformation that they often carry, and even more often “let pass”, is a huge part of the problem? Do they really “get it”, that their choices have HUGE repercussions?

    Pretty soon, if they don’t, we may arrive at the point where the most just thing to do would be to put the most misinformed and angry persons in a big room along with Rupert Murdoch, Bill Keller, and two dozen other media leaders, and then toss away the key until those media leaders figure out how to convey some basic matters, honestly, to the public — that is, if the media leaders themselves “get it”. Of course, I’m speaking figuratively here. I don’t suggest locking anyone up. But, you get the point. The media are letting society down. Big-time. Period. When do we call them out in a way that will actually change their status quo approaches for the better?


  37. J.K. says:

    Those who couldn’t make it welcomed them into D.C.

  38. BIGH2O says:

    Bob Wallace…I am from L.A. Why are you referring to people in Washington yesterday as ‘white male teabaggers? I observed other races. It is about truly calling for transparency. It is a call for accountability, no matter who. I am for neither party at this point, but am tired of lies, cover-ups and bulls..t!!!
    When America was being flooded with immigrants, it was an amazing thing that this was a country who could live beside each other in mansions and shacks like never before. It was a chance to expand if you had the drive. Who had ever heard of it? Sure, there was clashes, but still the opportunity was there.I have come from an underdog class and could be angry if I chose to be.I am not….I am driven.

    Thank you for explaining “they” . I am not ‘they”. I am “WE”

  39. nextronone says:

    There really wasn’t as many people there as reported they didn’t even reach to the end of the mall from what I saw on fox. During the Inauguration of Obama the mall was packed and there was still thousands standing outside of the mall. I’m sorry but there just isn’t that many people protesting at these tea parties. You can’t turn a mole hill into a mountain. More people came out for the anti-war rallies during the Bush administration than these tea party rallies.If there were as many people as reported I think the Approval rating of Obama would be much lower but it still is at 51%. Meaning more than half of the country supports him. These rallies are just a way for the GOP to reorganize their party after a major loss. Democrats did it during the Bush years and now the GOP is doing it. It’s nothing new.

  40. BIGH2O says:

    Paulm..why make this racist? That bird no longer flies.It is old…old…old.Come up with something different that has beef.

  41. Hey Joe, you seriously reeled in the loonies and the whack-jobs with this one.

    I realize you’ve other things to do, but you should consider creating a simple relational database “scrap book” for some of these comments (here and in other “lively” threads) rating them according to degrees of unhinged, factually challenged, inadvertently funny, worst grammar & spelling, etc.

    [JR: Guess someone linked to me. Can’t find it, though.]

  42. From Peru says:

    All you conservatives should be ASHAMED of yourselves!


    . Remember a bit of history:

    1)1952: Republican president Einsenhouer in mate with the British collapsing Empire ordered the CIA to crush the progressive and democratic government of Mossadeq, with the (totally false)excuse that that government was oriented to Communism. The CIA then helped the Shah to do a military coup d’etat that restored the abolute monarchy. The new regime crush every political opposition, specially the secular, left-wing one.while the left-wing opposition was being crushed by the brutal Savak Secret Police, the Islamic opposition, built on the profound belief of the population, was harder to suppress.

    With Iran now completely assimilated inside American Empire , the Shah was then induced to do a “white revolution” intended to “modernize” from the above(in a very despotic way) the Iranian society to prevent any possible Soviet influence to the peasants and workers. The move was a boomerang:the religious Islamic establishment was outraged by the secular reforms and without the left-wing, secular opposition, it become the main center of opposition.

    1979) The Iranian regime collapsed under a wave of strikes and demonstrations of millions of Iranians against the government. The Shah escaped and after a plebiscite, the country was declared an Islamic Republic. Furious demonstrators then taken hostage the American inside the Tehran Embassy.

    Islamic Extemism was officially born.The situation severely weakened the Jimmy Carter goverment. The Conservatives accused him of weakness, but History clearly shows that this disaster was a result of Republican Imperialist policy decades after. Typical conservative behaviour: create a time bomb and when it finally explodes , blame a Liberal government.

    1979(again): the weakened Carter government under the influence of conservative advicers, decided to give aid to Islamic extremists in Afghanistan and Pakistan to create problems to the new Communist Afghan government. The Soviets falled in the trap,and invaded Afghanistan in late Deccember 1979 to help the Afghan government, harassed by the Islamic US-AIDED TERRORISTS.

    1980): The ultra-conservative Ronald Reagan won the elections. This president did everything he can to turn Islamic Terrorism in a global menace. He ,all we remember, sell weapons to Iran (yes, while in Tehran the US hostages were still captive) to finance the right-wing Nicaraguan guerrilla , the “Contras” , against the Communist government that ended decades of pro-US Somoza dictatorship, preventing the poor Centro-American state to have peace after decades of a brutal civil war.

    Not satisfied with that, he aided the Saddam Hussein dictatorship in Iraq with weapeons (yes, the infamous weapons of mass destruction) to begin a brutal war with Iran, where chemical and biological weapons were used against the Iranian People, and also to the Shiite Iraquis. The (indireclty CIA created , as explained above) meanwhile was funding Islamic extremism in Lebanon and Palestine. This neefast influnce will, decades after, turn the National Liberation Palestinian movement into an Islamist one.

    And finally the Big One: THE AFGHAN TERRORISTS GET MASSIVE AID FORM CIA(among them was an oscure son of an multimillionary Arab family, a guy alled Osama Bin Laden), turning them into a powerful mess of Islamist warlords,that finally induced the Soviets to withdraw. When finally the USSR collapsed after decades of oligarchic Stalinist corruption and misgovernment, the CIA began cutting the aid to them. When the Communist Afghan Government finally fell in 1992, a civil war between Islamist warlords began.

    1990s ) : The Republican president Bush(father)invaded Iraq (to detroy their ex-ally, now turned against US Oil Empire). Whit this, the CIA-funded islamist groups finally turned agaist America. In the drought and civil war devastated countries of Afghanistan , Somalia and Sudan, the Osama Terrorist net began constructing the basis of Al-Qaeda. They finally found refuge in Afghanistan when an even more extemist group, the Talibans, defeated the Warlords and founded an evedn worse Islamic State. Al Qaeda began attacking US consulates in Kenya and Tanzania.

    11-September 2001: the FORMER US ALLIES MURDERED 3000 PEOPLE IN THE WORLD TRADE CENTER. The Bush governmet used the attacks to justify the invasion of Afghanistan and Iraq. Al Qaeda began his activities in Iraq after the US invasion. 2 MILLION PEOPLE MURDERED THERE IN THOSE TRAGIC YEARS.

    So , conservatives, SHUT UP!


  43. Bob Wallace says:

    Bigwater – do you have any actual numbers? I don’t and I would be more comfortable if we had something other than the odd observation.

    Now, lacking numbers, from what I’ve heard from a couple of people who showed up for a while to have a look at the crowd is that there were essentially no Asians, no Hispanics, and only a spattering of African Americans. Certainly not even 1% AAs and the proportion of AAs should be around 14%.

    I think if you look through the pictures you will make the same observations.

    A fair number of women, but no way to know how many showed up on their own as opposed to accompanying their male partners. A breakdown of ‘come alone’ females vs. males would be most interesting.

    Let’s try to not portray this movement as something it isn’t. This is largely about racism. Racism and the loss of white male privilege. The signs are in your face. This is the collapse of the Southern strategy being played out in front of us.

  44. BIGH2O says:

    Gary..who are you referring to as loonies and whack jobs?

  45. Bob Wallace says:

    Jeff –

    “Do the media (MSM and others) understand their role in fueling this, enabling it, encouraging it, making it “larger than life”, and so forth? Do they understand that the misinformation that they often carry, and even more often “let pass”, is a huge part of the problem? Do they really “get it”, that their choices have HUGE repercussions?”

    I don’t think [‘furthering the better’ is part of MSM’s agenda. Their agenda is more about making money and, in the case of newspapers, staying in business.

    It’s all about market share therefore, ‘if it bleeds, it leads’.

    And I would expect that newspapers are pressured by an aging readership to become more conservative. Liberals and progressive don’t seem to get a lot of their news from newspapers or radio/TV, they are more internet people, I suspect.

    Then you have to add in the changes in ownership of so much of MSM. Don’t look for news outlets that are owned by large corporations to help when it come to climate change or anything else that would take profits away from the major players and spend it elsewhere.

  46. From Peru says:

    Something I missed. The Democratic governmnents have one big fault:


    That(not the “weakness” that the conservatives attack) was the ruin of Carter, and the reason for which the Clinton government was mediocre: being too weak to get rid of conservative advicers and lobbysts. Carter give the firsst aid to the Afghan Islamists, Clinton bombed Iraq and Yugoslavia.

    Obama MUST PUT A CLEAR END TO US IMPERIALISM. That is, actions like:

    1)Evacuate completely the Guantanamo base and return it to the Cuban governmet. End the US embargo against Cuba.
    2)Denounce past US Imperialism and apologize with the worls for the CRIMES committed by previous governments. Make clear that the Conservatives- Imperialist-Big Oil created the Islamic Terrorist Monster.
    3)End the proyect for sending military to Colombia. This has sparked violent (even if probably injustificate)protests in the Region.End herbicide-based coca crop erradication. Instead, aid Colombia(and Peru*)to decarbonize their economies. Kerosene, gasoline and fuel oil are the most important chemicals for the production of cocaine.

    These(specially the first two, the third is for fight drug traffic, another burning emnber in South America )are necessary for the world to begin to restore confidence for the US. Only with these actitudes, withdrawl from Iraq and the efforts in Afghanistan will be seen as a way trying to repare the harm done to the World.

    To do these, the Conservative WAR CRIMES must be publicy denounced. Only with a hard rethoric can these @#€$$$$$@#&(**) be stoped from continuing detroying the US and the World.

    Obama, the World had our hopes on you!

    Defeat the reactionary entities, return the People control of their lives!

    (*) PERU, MY COUNTRY, IS NOW THE WORLD 1st PRODUCTOR OF COCAINE. Kerosene, an oil derivative, is necessary to produce it. The Valley of Apurimac and Ene Rivers (abbreviated VRAE) in the middle of high elrvation reainforest , is where this killer drug is produced.This area is controlled by Drug Trafficants and the Maoist armed guerrilla bands(former “Communist Party of Peru-Shining Path” armed bands, now renamed “Communist Party of Peru-Marxist-Leninist-Maoist”) funded by the Drug Mafia.

    (**)contrary to Conservatives, I put do not wrote explicit bad language

  47. From Peru says:

    JR: What do “snip” means?

    Maybe I was a bit too harsh?

    Well, history is history. I apologize if I was too energetic, but I really think these people really need to have the crude truth put in front of their face.

    If perhaps wasn’t clear (forgive me if this is not the case) , I wasn’t referring to any 9-11 conspiracy theories.

    Now I posted a second comment, about some solutions to the climate of violence created in those tragic years. There is also a note about my country.

    My compliments to your blog. Greetings,

    From Peru

    [JR: “Snip” means you went too far. That said, just because I don’t “snip” something doesn’t mean I agree with it — which should be painfully clear from many of the comments on this thread. I don’t agree with all of your critiques, but it’s certainly worth noting that your views are certainly not uncommon.]

  48. From Peru says:

    Oh,well. Forgive me again.

    Anyway, what do you think about the little review of world history in the first comment and my hopes explained in the second (and the note about the tragic cocaine story of my country)?

  49. From Peru says:

    For any interested:

    My views are based in reports like the documentary “Cold War: The Soldiers of God”(about the Afghan Wars) ,that can be found posted in youtube, and others like the docs. based in the book “All the Shah Men”(abou CIA involvement in Iran),and ,of course, the tragic news from Iraq and Afghanistan.

  50. John McCormick says:

    Deborah @ #15

    “We will not go away, and you can call us all the nasty names you want.”

    Thank you for being there and not going away, Deborah. I will call you an irrelevant third party. And, that is all you folks will ever be.

    And, take those libertarians with you when you go over the edge.

  51. Jeff Huggins says:

    Hi Bob (Comment 46) . . .

    Thanks for your comment. Yes, of course, I understand the weighty pressures that result in the way these things are currently done. I just went for a walk to get coffee, and along the way I saw the cover of today’s San Jose Mercury News. The prominent lead article (or commentary in this case) was something like, “We Need to Talk”. It was from the paper to the readership, about the paper’s struggle and need for readership. Times are “not good” in the newspaper business.

    And I reflected on the other situation I’m trying to wrestle with: Despite the fact that ExxonMobil confuses and misleads and provides a very small part of the “story” to the public VIA The New York Times itself, and despite what ExxonMobil is saying in some areas and isn’t doing in vital areas, when it comes to the energy and climate matters, The New York Times doesn’t even peep. The New York Times turns a blind eye, and it’s probably one of the biggest blind eyes ever turned in the history of journalism anywhere, at any time.

    And of course, ExxonMobil is a huge advertiser in The New York Times. It is a “symbiotic” relationship of sorts that works great for ExxonMobil, works “desperately”, in the short term, for the Times, at great expense to its own credibility and (I would think) self-respect, and works terribly relative to the genuine public good. Simple as that. Any analysis of The Times itself over the last 18 months will confirm the pattern.

    So, I understand your point. And I don’t disagree with the pressures. BUT, here’s my thought . . .

    “Systems” and companies and “the media” are made up of people, with names. To differing degrees, individual people in a system/company might “see” the problem, might be enabling it, might be going along with it, might be leading it, and so forth. Some might be gently trying to address it. But for the most part, people participate with the system and enable it and facilitate it. (Here, I’m talking about some of the problematic ways of the media.)

    But, when specific people with specific names are mentioned, asked “why”, asked concrete and real questions, pushed (with reasoning and words) for answers . . . . and when specific responsibility is placed on specific people for real choices of their own, involved in enabling the system, then things can begin to change. Often, diffuse “systems” and patterns can continue in part because responsibility is seen to be diffuse and because individuals aren’t questioned. What do YOU think? What can YOU do? Why didn’t YOU do that? And so forth. Systems are made up of individual people. And individual people can and do change, especially when the light is on them and their own judgment is at stake.

    That’s why we need to go beyond “the media will always be that way” and “it’s just the way the system works”. At this point, we need to name names. We need to ask real people concrete questions. Bill Keller. Rupert Murdoch. Rex Tillerson. Even Andy Revkin. And so forth.

    Many people will only take substantial action to help (dramatically) improve the system itself (here I’m talking about the media) when the light is shined on them, when they are asked excellent questions, and when their own judgment and credibility are at stake. In some cases, A LOT of light is required, and very good questions, and much persistence.

    So, I guess what I’m trying to say is this: I understand and agree with the pressures and patterns you mention. But, I don’t think we can afford to just accept the media status-quo. The MSM and newspapers are still too important to ignore, and they can (hopefully) be improved. But, to help prompt the needed improvement in responsible and fact-based ways, and in civil ways, there comes a time when one must focus on key individuals in key roles to give them a chance to show, and explain, and justify what they are and aren’t doing in their own roles to either dramatically improve things or to facilitate the ongoing problem.

    That’s my thought. I’d much rather be at the beach, of course. But, it seems to me that the present problems call for this sort of attention.

    Cheers, and Be Well!


  52. Dano says:

    John McCormick,

    I don’t think the libertarians want to be associated with these dim-bulb crazies.

    As for the rest: stop feeding the trolls. They’ll go back to RedState amen choir soon. Who cares what they think – they don’t carry the majority, despite their noise.



  53. Mike#22 says:

    GOOGLE “Climate Progress Free Republic”

    Might be a few Freepers visiting.

    To: From Peru

    Many in this country are aware of how our government has acted in protecting our (imaginary?) middle east interests. The USA can shift its position. Soon?

  54. Savannah says:

    An American can be Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Green Party, or any other political group and still be for the constitution. The Constitution is what built this country from the ground up. With all of the political, technological, and social advancement that has come about because of this document, why would we want to deny these basic rights now? We have rights that we want to be recognized! No where in the constitution does it state that the government has any right to regulate our health care in ANY way…nor marriage, nor drugs, nor many other things that the government has taken upon itself. That’s all we’re saying. Every kind of person gathered there….children, adults, men, women, old people… everyone. Black, white, Latino, Chinese, Brazilian, Bolivian, Cuban, Puerto Ricans….everyone. People flew in from every state and even other countries! This was the largest gathering of Americans in HISTORY…roughly 3.5 MILLION people gathered (according to sources within capital park police)! There were thousands upon thousands of protest signs stating views on taxes and health care and government spending and many other topics. Don’t let yourself see only what you want to see, take in the big picture!
    Do some research on Democratic Socialism…it’s not offensive, it’s true.

  55. Frank says:

    Um I don’t see any raciest signs there. It’s not because he is black. It is because it will bankrupt the economy. Where exactly does the money for this come from?

  56. Gail says:

    Frank, get real, most of it is racial bigotry. In a comment earlier, I posted a sign from that demonstration, saying Obama is a lyin’ African and comparing him to an African Lion in a zoo. The whole birth certificate imbroglio is all about delegitimatizing Obama as a “real” American. And then there’s the whine about how to “take our country back”…from whom? The democratically elected administration? Oh, wait…

    Did you care where the money would come from when we illegally with no justification invaded Iraq? And did you happen to notice the economy went bankrupt under the BUSH administration? Hmmmm?

    And have you troubled to notice that insuring every American to obtain preventative health care will LOWER overall costs from having people wait until their condition is catastrophic and expensive? Or that a huge percentage of our current health care bill is thanks to bureaucratic insurance company paperwork, not medical procedures and treatment?

    Or that the US is number one, not in healthcare, but in military expenditures and prison populations?

    It’s possible your complaints about government have some relevance. But try to target the real culprits – corporate (profit motivated) interests.

  57. paulm says:

    The gov is not trying to regulate health care. Its trying to provide health insurance for a larger part of community.

    Savannah, do you understand insurance? You have been bumbuzled by the insurance industry. Have you asked yourself how those executives are able to pay themselves big bonuses? Where is that money coming from?

  58. Hmpf says:

    >Um I don’t see any raciest signs there.

    I agree, nothing particularly racy there, and certainly nothing that deserves a superlative.

    (Yes, I know, Dont’t Feed the Trolls. SCNR.)

  59. Bob Wallace says:

    Frank – I bet you thought that was a picture of the British Union Jack, eh?

    And where will the money come from? I’m not sure what money you’re asking about. If it’s the money for the “public option” the money will come from the people who pay the premiums to get the coverage, just as with other insurance programs.

    The public option is a government run insurance company, just like Blue Cross is a privately run insurance company. Neither will receive tax money.

    Just like Fex Ex, UPS, and the US Post Office which all run off of their earned revenues and zero tax money.

    Bigwater – in an attempt to be objective I did a search for 9/12 pictures and looked at a few hundred. In one set of ~240 in which the woman taking the pictures (self described teabagger) stood on the sidewalk and just shot the crowd walking by I saw one black man, one woman who might have been Asian, and one young black woman vendor selling buttons to the crowd. And several hundreds of white people.

    Another pro-9/12 site specifically requested shots of minorities taken at the event. There was one shot of a black couple and one shot of three black kids wearing event t-shirts sitting on a sidewalk.

    I saw no other people whom I could identify as non-white.

    The black couple in the one shot didn’t really look happy to be there. Perhaps he lost a bet and this was the payoff. And the shirts on the kids looked freshly put on. As if someone had handed them the shirts so that they could take a picture.

    You’re free to dismiss the previous paragraph as subjective, which I fully agree it is.

  60. caerbannog says:

    Who cares what they think…

    Uhhh… Dano, I hate to nitpick your posts here, but those folks *don’t* think! ;)

  61. Movements go to these sort of crazy extremes when they are about to collapse.

  62. paulm says:

    The world does not need a carbon tax. It needs a comprehensive approach to resource depletion and pollution. This is basically an environment tax which would be used to manage sustainable use of finite resources, including our atmosphere.

    Better world: Tax carbon and give the money to the people

    CONSIDER this injustice. Governments tax labour and profit, the engines of prosperity, while pollution and the depletion of resources – arguably the greatest threats to our economic well-being – remain largely untouched. So while we’re thinking about how to rebuild our broken economies, here’s a plea for a new cornerstone: a universal carbon tax.

  63. Rick says:

    It’s clear from the comments here that the people the United States have achieved peace, harmony and unity of purpose – all thanks to Obama. It should be a breeze now to add another 191 nations in Copenhagen and shortly thereafter solve the climate and probably cure cancer at the same time – plus everybody gets a flying car I bet.

  64. ecostew says:

    Unfortunately – it is a racist/anti-progressive response to the last election. No facts, no peer-reviewed science, and instigated by just say no corporate profit interests/Rs – most unfortunate as they send their grand-kids/our future generations to H&HW. It’s very interesting that many of the protesters are trashing their well-being now and as they age into Medicare at 65.

  65. Wonhyo says:

    Denialism and the Birther movement, while a minority, are having mainstream impact, thanks to the failings of (Republican) elected officials and the media. This is a fringe movement. The appropriate, civilized response from elected officials and the media, is to treat them as such. Instead, we have Republican Senators and Representatives actively or passively affirming this fringe movement. We have the media failing to call out their baseless claims. While climate change is the ultimate challenge for humankind, the Denialist/Birther movement may present more immediate challenges.

  66. greg says:

    I guess you would be more sympathetic to the marchers if they had smashed windows, set fires, threw rocks, and clashed with police, like the left wing protesters do.

    Those protest signs you highlight are pretty typical of protest signs on the left, just substitute Bush’s picture with 0bama’s on some of them, and change the names on others.

    You’re really reaching here, and just goes to show just how pathetic the left has become. Can’t wait for 2010 to get here.

  67. pete best says:

    The USA will ever thus have this issue much like the one of religion to. For some historic reason a lot of the USA appears to be living in happy ignorance and the reality of their country hidden by their government I would summise.

    Oh well, generation to generation the problems and political issues are always the same.

  68. Martin Vermeer says:

    This is just too good not to share. Celebrate stupidity!

  69. Nancy says:

    Thanks, Martin!

  70. paulm says:

    great link Martin

  71. BurkeVA says:

    This past Saturday, my wife and I spent the day participating in the Tea Party March on DC, what turned out to be one of the most rewarding and inspiring days we have ever spent. We began the day at 715a by boarding the DC Metro at the Springfield, VA station, which is the last or first stop on line, depending upon your perspective. Quite surprisingly, nearly every seat on the subway was taken in Springfield. At Van Dorn St, the second stop, it was already standing room only, and there were still 10 stations before arriving at our DC destination.

    It was like a party on the subway, nearly everyone wearing some kind of patriotic clothing and many carrying signs of all kinds. Mothers with baby carriages, just a remarkable cross section of folks, people from all over the country. As it turned out, there were attendees from every state, including Hawaii and Alaska.

    We arrived at the Federal Triangle station and walked a couple of blocks to Independence Square, located at 14th and Pennsylvania Ave, just two blocks from The White House. The square was already brimming with excited people, kind of like a 4th of July Celebration. The March did not begin until 11a, so we spent 3 hours working our way through the crowd, meeting folks from all over and just admiring the excitement, patriotism, creativity and positive attitudes of every one we saw. As I said, the March did not begin until 11a. By the time the first group reached the Capitol, thousands still remained in Independence Square! We have heard estimates of the number of attendees across a wide spectrum, including the “official” estimate of 60,000. Well, I didn’t count anyone, but let me say this. I attended the Sarah Palin rally in Fairfax, VA, at which 25,000 attended, so I know what 25,000 looks like. Let me say categorically that there were many, many times 25,000 people at the March. As I left, I asked several DC police officers what they thought the number was, and they responded at least 200,000. I personally believe the number was at least 500,000 and would not be surprised to learn it was much larger than that. The British press is reporting that more people attended the March than attended President Obama’s inauguration. The National Park’ office reported the March was the largest event EVER held in DC.

    And what a great crowd. Not one report of any kind of disturbance. Very little litter. We literally stood packed close together for hours listening to speaker after speaker and watching protest sign after sign. Although a very small few of the signs bordered on tasteless, most were very clever and revealed the great frustrations of the people attending the March, frustrations with the completely out of control spending of our federal government. This was NOT an anti-Obama March, although certainly most in attendance were opposed to Obama. It was not an anti-public option healthcare March, although most in attendance were opposed to the public option. This was an anti-spending March, with Republicans and Conservatives AND Democrats and Liberals. I saw more than a few anti-Bush signs. The famous sign with Obama as the Joker which appeared in many reports about the March had Bush as the Joker on the opposite side of the sign. This crowd was opposed to ALL of the excessive spending and warned ALL politicians that they will suffer at the polls if they continue to support the excessive spending.

    When combined with the hundreds of other Tea Party meetings around the country on Saturday, the one overwhelming feeling for me was that I am not alone in my frustration and concern about the terrible path that our federal government is now leading us down. I heard a close Obama advisor this morning say that the Marchers were wrong and not important and would not influence Administration policies. I feel comfortable saying that any politician who ignores what happened on Saturday does so at his or her own risk. There is a great movement taking place in our country, and the impact of that movement may change this country forever.

    Please don’t let up. Keep the pressure on congress and the president. Ours is a free and moral country founded upon a capitalistic system. We cannot allow that to ever change.

  72. Bob Wallace says:

    “As I left, I asked several DC police officers what they thought the number was, and they responded at least 200,000. I personally believe the number was at least 500,000 and would not be surprised to learn it was much larger than that. The British press is reporting that more people attended the March than attended President Obama’s inauguration. The National Park’ office reported the March was the largest event EVER held in DC.

    Here’s the problem, Burke.

    When you make outrageous statements such as there being 200,000, 500,000, more than 1.8 million on the mall on Saturday it makes everything else you say totally untrustworthy.

    Take credit for the official estimate of 75k. That’s not bad for a minor event. U2 pulled about that same number at a concert over the weekend and football stadiums attracted similar numbers.

  73. Mike#22 says:


    Keep in mind that under Reagan, the national debt tripled. Hundreds of billions of dollars went to goofy projects like Star Wars. We are paying the interest on that federal debt today–and we have nothing to show for it except some lame interceptors that don’t work.

    Under Clinton, national debt was going down.

    Under Bush 2, national debt rose incredibly, and we are nowhere near done with paying for bad decisions Bush made. For example, the Iraq War of Choice will cost at least 3 trillion alone. That is $10,000 out of everyone’s pocket.

    Today, we have a responsible, educated President working to fix this debt thing once again. Please take the time to learn the facts.

    From what I have seen of Fox you will not learn anything useful there. Try this:


  74. lgcarey says:

    #20 Martin Vermeer – Thanks, Martin, great link! If logic isn’t working, maybe satire will. What I want to know, if the U.S. is ranked #37 in health care – how many industrialized nations could be any lower?

  75. Craig says:

    Gail, I think you’re the one who needs to get real my friend. And please stop being a race pimp. Any time someone wants to talk about the issues the American people are having with Obama as a president, there are always individuals like yourself who pretend everyone who doesn’t agree with your way of thinking is a racist.

    Your tyrannical use of racism as a political lightning rod designed to silence those who don’t agree with you doesn’t work anymore. We’re mad because Obama promised that no lobbyists would have a place in his White House (he’s hired nothing but lobbyists), that he would sign no signing statements (he’s signed 7 so far), that we would get out of Iraq (he sends 10s of thousands more to Afghan), proposes we give more power to the Fed Reserve, etc. etc.

    We’re just sick of it, okay. If you love Obama so much, I don’t know what it is that you despise so much about Bush, Obama is just continuing everything Bush was implementing.

  76. drlease says:

    Like Burke, I attended this March. I am sure that someone will conduct a study to get an “official” count for the 9/12 March. All I know is that having served as police officer I know a little about crowd counts and this crowd was huge. We had taken up a place around the fountain by the Grant Memorial and there were 60,000 people in just that area. That did not count the area up to the Capitol steps nor the crowd behind, which stretched back down Pennsylvania Ave. for 10 blocks. I am pretty sure that 1MM would be a conservative estimate. The point is that those of us that were there know what we saw. Better yet, for everyone that showed up on 9/12 I would guess there are 20 who would have liked to have come.

  77. Mike#22 says:

    Pete Piringer, public affairs officer for the D.C. Fire and Emergency Department, said the local government no longer provides official crowd estimates because they can become politicized. But the day of the rally, Piringer unofficially told one reporter that he thought between 60,000 and 75,000 people had shown up.

    “It was in no way an official estimate,” he said.

    We asked Piringer whether there were enough protesters to fill the National Mall, as depicted in the photograph.

    “It was an impressive crowd,” he said. But after marching down Pennsylvania Avenue to the Capitol, the crowd “only filled the Capitol grounds, maybe up to Third Street,” he said.